{"id":149084,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149084","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/7594f10b9bbee6897b52c23e977d4bf5826b98f121effac12be4303bcf228b504e2a3821e8710cc65ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"蔡適應","委員發言時間":"11:30:22 - 11:46:18","影片長度":"00:15:56","會議時間":"2024-01-09T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第10屆第8會期第1次臨時會第1次會議（事由：行政院院長提出「是否公布高端合約？是否圖利廠商及危害全民健康權益？」等相關事宜專案報告並備質詢）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":1,"title":"立法院第10屆第8會期第1次臨時會第1次會議","id":"臨時會院會-10-8-1-1","type":"院會","term":10,"sessionPeriod":8,"sessionTimes":1},"date":"2024-01-09","duration":956,"end_time":"2024-01-09T11:46:18+08:00","start_time":"2024-01-09T11:30:22+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":963,"blocks":[["蔡委員適應：（11時30分）感謝院長，請陳建仁院長就備詢台，謝謝。"],["主席：院長請。"],["陳院長建仁：蔡委員午安。"],["蔡委員適應：院長好。我剛才聽了國民黨委員的質詢，尤其最後一段非常的無厘頭，在問關於AV的事情。我跟院長講一下，最近我聽到一個笑話是說，現在只要在臺灣打AV，後面連結就是國民黨，為什麼？因為大家會想到原來上國民黨網站就可以看到關於AV的很多相關資訊。我認為離選舉剩下沒有幾天的時間，任何一個政黨應該就其國家政策提出藍圖，而不是在講什麼AV的事情，所以我覺得這真的是滑天下之大稽！","今天的重點在於整個高端解密的相關問題，我想先請教院長，我的第一問題是說，我們在這次的採購裡面，因為當時你不是擔任院長的職務，但我想你對於醫療非常瞭解，就院長所知道的，當時臺灣跟哪幾家公司有簽訂疫苗採購合約？"],["陳院長建仁：這裡面有包括COVAX、AZ、莫德納、BNT，還有高端，我們都有簽採購合約。"],["蔡委員適應：聯亞有沒有簽訂？"],["陳院長建仁：聯亞當時有參加臨床試驗……"],["蔡委員適應：所以應該也有嘛，對不對？"],["陳院長建仁：也有簽，但是簽的是補助它的臨床實驗……"],["蔡委員適應：我瞭解。"],["陳院長建仁：它到臨床實驗二期失敗。"],["蔡委員適應：部長在旁邊，我想請教一下，您當時擔任職位是……"],["薛部長瑞元：政務次長。"],["蔡委員適應：我想請教一下，這幾家簽訂合約的公司都有簽所謂的保密條款嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：有。"],["蔡委員適應：都有？"],["薛部長瑞元：有。"],["蔡委員適應：為什麼？"],["薛部長瑞元：當然啊，因為第一個是裡面有技術性資料，我們……"],["蔡委員適應：會在合約裡面，是不是？"],["薛部長瑞元：對，要簽約的時候要給我們看。"],["蔡委員適應：OK。"],["薛部長瑞元：第二個就是有關於價格跟數量以及期程的部分，它必須要做保密。"],["蔡委員適應：OK，好。所以其實大多數跟我們政府簽訂疫苗採購的合約商，基於剛才部長所講的這幾個原則，第一個是它整個生產的配方，第二個是生產提供交貨數量及交貨流程。"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["蔡委員適應：我想請教一下部長，就你的專業判斷，為什麼這幾件事情要保密起來？"],["薛部長瑞元：因為這些東西如果洩漏出去的話，第一個會妨礙它公司跟其他國家簽的價格等等這些的議價……"],["蔡委員適應：價格或是採購速度、時程嘛，對不對？"],["薛部長瑞元：對，會影響到，所以如果洩漏出去的話，比方它跟我們價格是一個，跟越南價格是一個，這就會互相去做比較，他們公司會受到一些壓力。"],["蔡委員適應：對，或者是說每個地方不同的價格，但是也有不同交貨的時程嘛！"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["蔡委員適應：這些事情其實在當下做判斷的時間是非常短暫的啦，我記得當時部長或行政院團隊在跟相關單位或者之前陳時中部長在做談判的過程當中，可能只有一、兩天的考慮時間。"],["薛部長瑞元：對，因為那個時候……"],["蔡委員適應：如果不談，廠商可能就下單給別的國家，別的國家可能用更好的價格去談了。"],["薛部長瑞元：沒有錯。"],["陳院長建仁：很緊迫。"],["薛部長瑞元：很緊迫。"],["蔡委員適應：而且在這過程當中，我們對於其他國家採購疫苗的價格能夠知悉嗎？會知道嗎？其實也困難嘛，對不對？"],["陳院長建仁：其他國家的……"],["薛部長瑞元：我們不知道。"],["陳院長建仁：我們完全不知道。"],["蔡委員適應：有困難嘛，對不對？"],["陳院長建仁：委員，我也跟你報告一下，實際上是這樣的，這個疫苗的價格是完全要看什麼時候採購，譬如說我要是first priority、top priority去採購，當然我的價格就要高嘛，等到大量量產的時候去採購，價格當然就會低，而且這些廠商也都會考慮到不同國家的需要性，按照它的Per Capita GDP的情況來決定價格，所以價格的談判會牽涉到很多很多的因素。"],["蔡委員適應：所以院長講得很好，這個東西就要讓國人都瞭解，有人說價格是不是太貴或什麼，老實講，現在買最便宜，搞不好還買一送一，對不對？如果要這樣講的話，如果今天我是部長，我就會說好，告訴各位，我來採購更便宜的價格，明天找BNT或找哪家公司來買，它絕對賣的很便宜，但是在這個時間點就沒有這樣的需求嘛！"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["蔡委員適應：所以我認為有一些在野黨委員提出的是在張冠李戴、張飛打岳飛，拿宋朝或唐朝的兩個事情來做比較，然後再苛責院長跟部長這樣不對或這樣對，這完全是莫名其妙的一件事情。剛才部長和院長講得很清楚，這些相關的合約都有保密條款，能不能請部長或院長說明一下，這些保密條款分別是幾年，我想這是民眾非常關心的，我一個一個問，你告訴我就好了，第一個，大家最關心的就是高端合約的保密條款是幾年？"],["薛部長瑞元：5年。"],["蔡委員適應：5年是從2020年還是2021年開始算？"],["薛部長瑞元：最後交貨。"],["蔡委員適應：最後交貨起算5年，所以是去年再往後算，大概2027年左右，還是2028年？"],["薛部長瑞元：差不多116年。"],["蔡委員適應：116年也就是2027年，第一個，高端是5年，AZ是幾年？"],["薛部長瑞元：AZ也是5年。"],["蔡委員適應：AZ也是5年，所以一樣是從交貨最後一天開始算5年。"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["蔡委員適應：另外，莫德納是幾年？"],["薛部長瑞元：莫德納不同意解密。"],["蔡委員適應：所以莫德納不同意解密？"],["薛部長瑞元：對，永遠不解密。"],["蔡委員適應：所以5年、6年後也是不能夠解密就對了？"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["蔡委員適應：另外就是BNT呢？"],["薛部長瑞元：BNT是10年。"],["蔡委員適應：那我覺得很奇怪了，為什麼在野黨沒有質疑BNT？我再問部長一個問題，我不曉得能不能講，這幾個疫苗的採購單價最貴的是誰？"],["薛部長瑞元：單價最貴的，比高端貴的大概是莫德納、BNT。"],["蔡委員適應：這兩個更貴，對不對？怎麼沒有人質疑BNT這麼貴，為什麼政府沒有跟它砍價？感覺這些質疑的人好像沒有人提出這個質疑。"],["薛部長瑞元：這是一個很矛盾的說法沒有錯。"],["蔡委員適應：那些人可能跟BNT有勾結，是不是這樣？我不知道，如果要質疑的話，我也會質疑啊！當時有些人在push BNT，說BNT很好，他們是不是買了BNT的股票？BNT的股票、輝瑞的股票也是可以買，美國的股票就可以買了，這樣我是不是也可以質疑，請法務部調查一下臺灣有哪些人買了輝瑞的股票？這個邏輯不通吧！部長？"],["薛部長瑞元：對，沒有錯，當時預定要買莫德納、AZ等疫苗，我們在編列預算的時候都是用一劑700元編列預算，所以700元的緣由是這樣，但是後來買到的價格當然就不是700元，每一個都不一樣。"],["蔡委員適應：當然啊！因為每個廠商提供的資訊或研發成本，不然我們就是排隊等，就像等到現在買，我想一劑不用70元，就是這個差別，所以我想這要讓國人知道，在那個非常短暫的時間點，身為一個政府官員在做這個重要決策是非常困難的，怎麼儘量能夠保衛國人的健康，在預算的可行範圍內做這樣的決策，老實講，用現在的角度來看那個時間點，我覺得是非常苛責且沒有道理的，所以我剛才才會跟部長、院長講，如果要講，我也會講現在買更便宜，但現在沒有人需要。","另外，第二個問題要請教院長和部長，就是我們國家隊的問題，院長和部長知不知道1922已經停掉了？"],["薛部長瑞元：應該還有。"],["蔡委員適應：還有嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：還有。"],["蔡委員適應：現在打1922會通嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：會。"],["蔡委員適應：現在打1922會通，確定？"],["薛部長瑞元：因為那個是叫防疫專線，不是針對COVID。"],["陳院長建仁：不是針對COVID。"],["蔡委員適應：防疫專線還留著嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：有，還留著。"],["蔡委員適應：COVID的專線還留著嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：COVID當時就是用這一個專線。"],["蔡委員適應：就是用1922，當時有擴大，對不對？"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["蔡委員適應：擴大的合約是不是結束了？"],["薛部長瑞元：應該是結束了。"],["蔡委員適應：我知道結束了，現在有多少人接電話？"],["薛部長瑞元：這可能要問一下。"],["蔡委員適應：你們說還留著，但我知道是沒有了，也就是縮編成人很少了，我想請教一下院長跟部長，我為什麼問這件事情的原因是因為最近疫情是不是又起來了？"],["薛部長瑞元：最近是有疫情起來，但是不是只有COVID。"],["陳院長建仁：對，最近在中國大陸的疫情是比較嚴重，而且發現新的病毒株JN.1。"],["蔡委員適應：JN.1更嚴重，對不對？"],["陳院長建仁：JN.1傳染的速度會比較快，但是最近我們國內採購XBB的COVID-19疫苗，實際上對它是相當的有效。"],["蔡委員適應：好，那我想請教一下院長，JN.1在臺灣目前有沒有發現案例了？有沒有？"],["陳院長建仁：目前有……"],["蔡委員適應：就是剛才院長提到的這些事情。"],["陳院長建仁：沒有擴散開來。"],["薛部長瑞元：沒有擴散開來。"],["蔡委員適應：好，那這些案例應該都不是本地而是境外移入的？"],["陳院長建仁：我們現在篩檢的話……"],["薛部長瑞元：大概沒有辦法去做確定。"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["蔡委員適應：有可能是本土的嗎？應該都是境外進來的吧？"],["陳院長建仁：對，JN.1的話應該是啦！"],["薛部長瑞元：目前我們邊境還有勸導來做篩檢，本土的……"],["蔡委員適應：對，我的意思就是想請教一下院長跟部長，因為有些國家，我也不要說是哪些國家，有些國家的疫情似乎有升溫的現象。"],["陳院長建仁：確實。"],["蔡委員適應：有這樣的升溫現象，對於這些國家來臺灣的飛機，我想請問一下院長，有沒有考慮要升高對其防疫、檢疫的等級？"],["陳院長建仁：我們目前也知道哪些國家的疫情狀況比較嚴重，所以疾病管制署已經有針對這些特定的國家，在進來的時候就會加強體溫的測量，還有加強對症狀的調查，如果有症狀或者體溫異常的時候，那我們就會勸他在機場馬上做篩檢，我們篩檢、檢驗的病原體數目有十幾種，我們目前發現，現在比較常見的、在比較高疫情的國家實際上主要是流行性感冒，還有COVID-19，但是所謂黴漿菌的那種情況，實際上我們檢驗到的並不多，政府有加強在監控相關的疫情。"],["蔡委員適應：剛才部長跟院長提到有新採購了XBB的疫苗，對不對？"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["蔡委員適應：已經開始打了沒有？"],["薛部長瑞元：有，已經開始打了。"],["蔡委員適應：是自費還是公費？"],["薛部長瑞元：公費。"],["蔡委員適應：那我建議一下，要不要未來在機場也直接設一個施打站？"],["薛部長瑞元：我們是在……"],["蔡委員適應：醫療院所嘛！對不對？"],["薛部長瑞元：在研議當中，而且我們也已經將疫苗配送……"],["蔡委員適應：我的意思是說，可不可以請院長跟部長考慮一下？因為我剛剛聽起來，似乎境外的可能比例還滿高的。打這個疫苗有沒有什麼特別的要求？"],["薛部長瑞元：跟原來打的……"],["蔡委員適應：都一樣嘛！對不對？"],["薛部長瑞元：是一樣。"],["蔡委員適應：我建議一下院長跟部長在機場設，為什麼？因為我們出國的人通常在飛機場要等一到二個小時以上，對不對？所以他們有那個時間，當天就設一個疫苗站在那邊，有很多人就會跑去打疫苗啦！比他跑去醫院打，我覺得更方便，這是第一個。第二件事情，出國回來進到臺灣的人，你跟他講可以先打一下疫苗啦！我覺得這兩件事情可以給院長跟部長考慮一下，擴大我們的施打範圍跟施打率啦！我覺得講這件事情遠比國民黨開AV的記者會還來得更重要才對啦！","好，但是在這邊我還是要拜託一下我們的院長跟部長，剛才我提到的1922防疫專線，以及第二件事情，就是地方基層醫療院所因為這件事情執行業務所衍生的費用，我要拜託院長跟部長，我覺得這是非常重要的一件事情，在過去這兩年的過程當中，我們看到1922專線確實發揮了穩定人心的功能而有其重要性，那我也遇到有打電話向行政院或衛福部在談這個事情的人，他有聊到另外一個重要的議題，就是他覺得好像行政院本身就沒有這樣一個專屬的客服電話，地方政府有1999，但是中央政府沒有啦！我知道當時有很多人關於政府的一些相關議題也都是透過1922詢問，比如說紓困等等的內容，為什麼呢？因為我遇到的這些人有跟我講，他們透過1922所詢問內容的準確度比他們打1999問地方政府來得更準，因為很多地方政府也搞不清楚狀況，就跟他說可能要問中央，什麼都推給中央就對了啦！然後好的就說是他的，不懂的時候就推給中央，就說中央宣導的不大夠，我們也不知道，你要問中央政府。每次地方政府都這樣講，我認為這個是非常不公平的一件事情，但是我認為沒關係，我們中央政府就扛起來，地方做不到，侯友宜做不到，我們來做啊！這就是我們跟他們不一樣的地方嘛！所以我建議對1922這樣一個系統的維持，是不是行政院來檢討一下，未來就做為常設性、中央政府的一個組織單位，關於紓困、疫苗等等，只要中央政府所管事務的內容，我覺得都可以讓民眾打電話來問，讓他們來瞭解，我相信對於解決民間的很多問題、民眾的質疑會很有幫助啦！否則院長、部長和我們在這邊講了老半天，如果只有1萬人看到，可能還有另外好幾百萬人沒有看到啊！他還是會對同樣的問題繼續來詢問，那他如果看到網路上不確實的言論，他就以為那是真的啊！所以我們就跟他說：不用！有問題就打1922問我們的行政院，這樣最準啊！所以我認為這是一個非常好的所謂解釋疑慮的管道，像剛才我們部長提到每個合約都有保密期限，高端最短耶！"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["蔡委員適應：他們為什麼不要質疑BNT，我也覺得很奇怪，為什麼不要質疑莫德納，對不對？所以我的意思就是說，這些事情其實就是要講給民眾知道，所以我在這邊拜託一下院長，我的第二個問題就是我們的1922專線，還有基層醫療他們的相關工作費用，我覺得要來增加，因為這幾年我們可以看得到全球化的關係，整個醫療、疫情或者病毒的蔓延是非常跨國的，而且我們事實上有時候看不到這些疫苗，等到真的已經發生事情的時候，都是透過我們的醫療單位來做協力、來處理。"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["蔡委員適應：部長，我建議這件事情要把它列為非常重要的重點，我相信醫師公會跟護理師公會還有藥師公會也有跟部長提過這個事情，好不好？這可以承諾吧！"],["薛部長瑞元：這部分當然分兩個，去（112）年在健保裡面已經有處理了。"],["蔡委員適應：對。"],["薛部長瑞元：未來的部分我們可以來研議。"],["蔡委員適應：一定要做哦！另外就是1922的部分，拜託院長想一下，要繼續擴大辦理，我覺得這對民眾來講是非常重要的一件事情。"],["陳院長建仁：好，防疫專線很重要。"],["蔡委員適應：好，謝謝。"],["薛部長瑞元：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝蔡委員。接下來請吳委員斯懷質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":86,"meet_id":"臨時會院會-10-8-1-1","speakers":["游錫堃","邱顯智","邱臣遠","曾銘宗","林俊憲","賴士葆","邱泰源","王鴻薇","蔡適應","吳斯懷","洪申翰","游毓蘭","莊瑞雄","李德維","吳玉琴","林為洲"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-01-09"],"gazette_id":"1130301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1130301_00002","1130301_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第10屆第8會期第1次臨時會第1次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n行政院院長提出「是否公布高端合約？是否圖利廠商及危害全民健康權益？」等相關事宜專案報\n告並備質詢─ 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464.923, \"text\": \"資訊或者他告訴他的研發成本或者不然就排隊等就像說等到現在買我想一季不用70塊吧就是這個差別所以我想這第一個要讓國人知道就是說在那個非常短暫的時間點做一個重要的政府官員在做決策是非常困難的\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"資\"}, {\"word\": \"訊\"}, {\"word\": \"或\", \"start\": 449.437, \"end\": 449.557, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"者\", \"start\": 449.557, \"end\": 449.637, \"score\": 0.846}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 449.637, \"end\": 449.797, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 449.797, \"end\": 450.057, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"訴\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 450.057, \"end\": 450.177, \"score\": 0.829}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 450.177, \"end\": 450.258, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"研\", \"start\": 450.258, \"end\": 450.638, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"發\"}, {\"word\": \"成\", \"start\": 450.638, \"end\": 450.818, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 450.818, \"end\": 450.978, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"或\", \"start\": 450.978, \"end\": 451.078, \"score\": 0.801}, {\"word\": \"者\", \"start\": 451.078, \"end\": 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{\"word\": \"家\", \"start\": 576.989, \"end\": 577.149, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 577.149, \"end\": 577.289, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"疫\", \"start\": 577.289, \"end\": 577.489, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 577.489, \"end\": 577.609, \"score\": 0.788}, {\"word\": \"似\", \"start\": 577.609, \"end\": 577.769, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"乎\", \"start\": 577.769, \"end\": 578.049, \"score\": 0.858}, {\"word\": \"又\", \"start\": 578.049, \"end\": 578.069, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"升\", \"start\": 578.069, \"end\": 578.17, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"溫\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 578.17, \"end\": 578.29, \"score\": 0.829}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"象\", \"start\": 578.29, \"end\": 578.31, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 600.962, \"end\": 623.188, \"text\": \"這樣的生活現象對於這些國家來台灣的飛機我想請問一下院長有沒有考慮要升高他的防疫檢疫的等級我們目前的話也是知道哪一些國家呢他的疫情的狀況比較嚴重所以呢疾病管制署呢已經針對著這些特定的國家呢進來的時候呢就會加強這個體溫的測量還有加強這個症狀的\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": 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00:00:42,004\n感謝院長能不能請我們陳建仁陳院長就備群台謝謝院長請蔡委員午安院長好我剛才聽了這個我們國民黨委員的質詢尤其最後一段非常的無裡頭啦在問關於這個AV的事情我跟院長講一下最近我聽到一個笑話跟我講說現在只要在台灣打AV後面連結就是國民黨\n\n2\n00:00:43,172 --> 00:01:10,135\n為什麼因為大家會想到說原來上國民黨網站就可以看到關於AV的很多的相關資訊我認為說選舉剩下沒有幾天的時間任何一個政黨他應該是要就他的國家政策提出藍圖出來而不是在講什麼AV的事情所以我覺得真的是這是華天下之大績啦好那今天的重點是在於我們整個高端解密的相關的問題我想先請教一下院長我的第一個問題就是說\n\n3\n00:01:11,701 --> 00:01:27,072\n我們在這一次的採購裡面我想因為當時你在那時候你不是你不是擔任院長的職務但是我想你對於醫療非常的了解就院長你得知道當時我們台灣跟哪幾家公司有簽訂了疫苗採購的合約\n\n4\n00:01:28,086 --> 00:01:55,434\n這裡面有包括了COVAVAXAZ莫德納BNT還有高端我們都有簽這個採購的這個合約聯亞有沒有簽訂聯亞當時是因為他有參加這個臨床試驗所以應該也有嘛對不對也有簽但是那個簽的就是補助他的臨床試驗到臨床試驗而其失敗部長在旁邊我想請教一下當時您當時擔任的職位是市長政務市長市長來\n\n5\n00:01:56,974 --> 00:02:12,004\n政府次長我想請教一下這幾家簽訂合約的公司對不對齁都有沒有簽所謂的保密條款有都有有為什麼當然啊因為他裡面他有一個技術性的資料會在合約裡面是不是對\n\n6\n00:02:13,530 --> 00:02:41,451\n他要簽約的時候要給我們看那第二個就是有關於價格跟這個數量以及他的期程的部分的話他必須要做保密所以其實大多數跟我們政府簽訂的疫苗採購的合約商基於的剛才就是剛才部長你講的這幾個原則第一個是他的整個生產的配方第二個就是他的生產的提供交貨的數量以及交貨的流程\n\n7\n00:02:42,182 --> 00:03:03,856\n那我想請教一下部長就你的專業來判斷為什麼這幾件事情要把它保密起來因為這些東西如果洩漏出去的話第一個就是會妨礙他公司在跟其他國家簽的那個價格等等這些的價格或者是採購的速度嘛時程嘛對不對會影響到所以\n\n8\n00:03:08,567 --> 00:03:28,343\n如果他洩露出去的話比方說他跟我們的價格是一個那跟越南的價格是一個這就互相去做比較那他們公司會受到一些壓力對或者是說每個地方不同的價格但是也有不同的交貨的時程那這些事情其實在當下\n\n9\n00:03:29,204 --> 00:03:53,544\n在做判斷的時間其實是非常短暫的就是說當時我記得部長或者我們行政院的團隊在跟相關單位在做或者之前陳時中陳部長在做談判的過程當中可能你可能只有一兩天的考慮時間你如果不談廠商可能就下單給別的國家別的國家可能就去更好的價格去談了而且在這過程當中我們對於其他國家採購疫苗的價格能夠窒息嗎\n\n10\n00:03:55,544 --> 00:04:20,645\n你會知道嗎?其實也困難我們完全不知道也困難嘛委員我也跟你報告一下啦實際上是這樣這個疫苗的價格是完全要看他什麼時候採購比如說我要是firstprioritytoppriority去採購當然我的價格就要高嘛等我到大量量產的時候的採購當然就會低而且這些廠商也都會考慮到不同的國家的需要性按照他的\n\n11\n00:04:21,087 --> 00:04:21,107\n蔡適應\n\n12\n00:04:38,231 --> 00:04:39,772\n這完全是莫名其妙的一件事情\n\n13\n00:05:08,846 --> 00:05:09,166\n最後交貨\n\n14\n00:05:32,321 --> 00:05:32,461\n末德納幾年\n\n15\n00:05:59,369 --> 00:06:23,639\n莫德納他不同意解密所以莫德納不同意解密所以5年6年後也是不能夠解密就對了對好那另外就是BNT呢BNT10年BNT10年那我就很奇怪了為什麼在野黨沒有來質疑BNT啊好那我再問部長一問這幾個東西的採購啊我不曉得不能講啊單價最貴的是誰啊\n\n16\n00:06:24,958 --> 00:06:47,740\n當價最貴的就是比高端貴的大概就是莫德納、BNT這兩個都更貴嘛對不對那怎麼沒有人質疑說BNT這麼貴為什麼政府沒有跟他砍價感覺好像這些質疑的人好像沒有人提這個質疑是不是那些人那些人可能跟BNT有勾結囉是不是這樣子我不知道啊如果要質疑的話我也會質疑啊當時有些人在\n\n17\n00:06:48,721 --> 00:07:03,258\n有當時有些人在pushBNT說BNT很好是不是他們是買BNT的股票BNT股票輝瑞也是可以買阿美國的股票就可以買了阿那這樣我是不是可以來質疑說請法務部來調查一下台灣有哪一些人去買了輝瑞的股票\n\n18\n00:07:04,999 --> 00:07:28,197\n這個邏輯不同吧部長對沒有錯那當時在預定要買莫德納等等這一些AZ的時候的話我們在編列預算的時候都是用一計700塊去編列預算的所以那個700塊的緣由是這裡但是後來買到的價格當然就不是一樣因為每個廠商提供的\n\n19\n00:07:29,437 --> 00:07:44,923\n資訊或者他告訴他的研發成本或者不然就排隊等就像說等到現在買我想一季不用70塊吧就是這個差別所以我想這第一個要讓國人知道就是說在那個非常短暫的時間點做一個重要的政府官員在做決策是非常困難的\n\n20\n00:07:46,518 --> 00:08:07,368\n怎麼樣盡量能夠保衛住國人的健康然後做這樣的決策在預算的可行範圍內我老實講用現在的角度來看那個時間點我覺得是非常苛責沒有道理所以我剛才才會跟部長院長說如果要會講我也會講說現在買更便宜但現在沒有人需要好但是另外我有第二個問題要來請教一下院長跟部長我們的國家隊的問題院長跟部長1922已經停掉了應該還有\n\n21\n00:08:16,475 --> 00:08:41,112\n還有嗎現在打1922會通嗎現在打1922會通確定因為那個是叫防疫專線不是針對COVID那防疫專線還留著嗎有還留著那COVID的專線還留著嗎COVID當時就用這一個專線就用1922嘛當時有擴大嘛對不對擴大的合約是不是結束了應該是結束了對啊我知道是結束所以現在多少人接電話\n\n22\n00:08:42,947 --> 00:08:53,295\n如果這樣我請教一下,你們說海流罩,我知道是沒有啦就說邊人很少了啦齁我為什麼問這件事情的原因是因為我想請教一下院長跟部長齁最近疫情是不是又起來了\n\n23\n00:08:54,538 --> 00:09:21,115\n最近是有疫情起來但是不是只有COVID最近在中國道路的話這個疫情是比較嚴重而且發現新的這個病毒株叫做JN1更嚴重嘛對不對那這個JN1它傳染的速度會比較快但是最近我們國內採購的XBB的這個COVID-19的疫苗實際上對它是相當的有效那我想請教一下院長\n\n24\n00:09:23,209 --> 00:09:29,792\nJ1在臺灣目前有沒有發現案例?沒有擴散開來那這些案例應該都不是本土還是境外移入的?\n\n25\n00:09:36,728 --> 00:09:38,310\n有些國家的疫情似乎又升溫的現象\n\n26\n00:10:00,962 --> 00:10:23,188\n這樣的生活現象對於這些國家來台灣的飛機我想請問一下院長有沒有考慮要升高他的防疫檢疫的等級我們目前的話也是知道哪一些國家呢他的疫情的狀況比較嚴重所以呢疾病管制署呢已經針對著這些特定的國家呢進來的時候呢就會加強這個體溫的測量還有加強這個症狀的\n\n27\n00:10:25,047 --> 00:10:25,067\n臨時會議員：蔡適應\n\n28\n00:10:45,742 --> 00:10:49,264\n因為剛才部長跟院長提到說有新採購了XBB的疫苗對不對對已經開始打了沒有有有已經開始打\n\n29\n00:11:14,204 --> 00:11:42,622\n自費還是公費公費好那我建議一下齁要不要未來在機場也直接設一個施打站我們是在醫療院所嘛對不對研議大廚阿而且我們也已經那個疫苗配送我的意思是說可不可以請院長跟部長考慮一下啦齁因為我剛剛聽起來似乎境外的可能比例還蠻高的啦齁打這個疫苗有沒有什麼特別的要求阿跟原來打的都一樣嘛對不對齁是一樣我會建議一下院長跟部長齁\n\n30\n00:11:43,786 --> 00:12:04,703\n在機場設啦為什麼齁我們出國的人通常在飛機場要等1到2個小時以上對不對有那個時間齁當天就設一個疫苗站在那邊很多人都會跑去打疫苗啦比他跑去醫院打我覺得更方便這第一個第二件事情出國回來進來台灣的人你跟他講可以先打一下疫苗啦\n\n31\n00:12:05,740 --> 00:12:34,064\n我覺得這兩件事情可以給院長跟部長考慮一下擴大我們的施打範圍跟施打率我覺得講這件事情比原比講那個什麼該國民黨開記者會AB的記者會來得更重要才對好那但是在這邊我還是要拜託一下我們的院長跟部長剛才我提到的1922的防疫專線以及第二件事情地方基層醫療院所因為這件事情執行業務衍生的費用我要拜託院長跟部長我覺得這是非常重要的一件事情\n\n32\n00:12:36,039 --> 00:12:59,831\n過去這兩年的過程當中我們看到1922的專線確實發揮了穩定人心的一個重要性那我也遇到打電話有去打電話像行政院或衛福在談的事情的人他有聊到另外一個重要議題就是說他覺得好像行政院本身就沒有一個專屬的這樣的一個客服的電話地方政府有1999但中央政府沒有\n\n33\n00:13:01,155 --> 00:13:19,353\n中央政府沒有所以我知道說當時在1922打這件事有很多人關於政府的一些相關的議題也都透過1922詢問比如說紓困等等的內容等等為什麼呢因為我遇到這些人有跟我講說他們透過1922詢問的內容的準確度比他們問1999地方政府來得更準\n\n34\n00:13:20,441 --> 00:13:40,525\n因為很多地方政府也搞不清楚狀況就跟他說你可能要問中央什麼都推給中央就對了然後好的就說是他的不懂的說推給中央就說中央宣導的不大夠我們也不知道你要問中央政府每次都跟地方政府這樣講我認為這個是非常不公平的一件事情但我認為沒關係中央政府我們就扛起來\n\n35\n00:13:41,304 --> 00:13:50,689\n等行政院院長提出:「是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．\n\n36\n00:14:04,977 --> 00:14:22,732\n我相信對於解決民間的很多問題民眾的質疑會很有幫助啦否則部長部長我們這邊講了老半天如果看的人只有一萬人看到可能還有另外的好幾百萬人沒有看到啊他還是會同樣的問題繼續來詢問那他如果看到網路上不確實的言論他就以為那是真的啊我們剛剛說不用\n\n37\n00:14:23,516 --> 00:14:41,793\n有問題打1922問我們的行政院最準啊所以我認為這是一個非常好一個所謂解釋疑慮的一個管道像剛才我們部長提到的每個合約都有保密期限高端最短欸他們為什麼不要質疑BNT啊我也覺得很奇怪為什麼不要質疑莫德納\n\n38\n00:14:42,788 --> 00:15:09,553\n對不對所以我的意思就是說這些事情其實就是要講給民眾知道所以我在這邊拜託一下院長我第二個問題就是說我們的1922專線還有第二個就是醫療基層醫療他們的相關的一個工作的費用我覺得要來增加啦因為這幾年我們可以看得到全球化的關係整個醫療或者疫情或者病毒的蔓延是非常跨國的啦而且我們事實上有時候看不到啊\n\n39\n00:15:10,086 --> 00:15:13,128\n這件事要列為非常重要的重點我相信醫師公會跟護理師公會也有跟還有藥師公會也有跟部長提過這個事情好不好\n\n40\n00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:53,608\n好謝謝蔡委員接下來請吳委員施懷質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n14949\t42004\t感謝院長能不能請我們陳建仁陳院長就備群台謝謝院長請蔡委員午安院長好我剛才聽了這個我們國民黨委員的質詢尤其最後一段非常的無裡頭啦在問關於這個AV的事情我跟院長講一下最近我聽到一個笑話跟我講說現在只要在台灣打AV後面連結就是國民黨\n43172\t70135\t為什麼因為大家會想到說原來上國民黨網站就可以看到關於AV的很多的相關資訊我認為說選舉剩下沒有幾天的時間任何一個政黨他應該是要就他的國家政策提出藍圖出來而不是在講什麼AV的事情所以我覺得真的是這是華天下之大績啦好那今天的重點是在於我們整個高端解密的相關的問題我想先請教一下院長我的第一個問題就是說\n71701\t87072\t我們在這一次的採購裡面我想因為當時你在那時候你不是你不是擔任院長的職務但是我想你對於醫療非常的了解就院長你得知道當時我們台灣跟哪幾家公司有簽訂了疫苗採購的合約\n88086\t115434\t這裡面有包括了COVAVAX AZ莫德納BNT還有高端我們都有簽這個採購的這個合約聯亞有沒有簽訂聯亞當時是因為他有參加這個臨床試驗所以應該也有嘛對不對也有簽但是那個簽的就是補助他的臨床試驗到臨床試驗而其失敗部長在旁邊我想請教一下當時您當時擔任的職位是市長政務市長市長來\n116974\t132004\t政府次長我想請教一下這幾家簽訂合約的公司對不對齁都有沒有簽所謂的保密條款有都有有為什麼當然啊因為他裡面他有一個技術性的資料會在合約裡面是不是對\n133530\t161451\t他要簽約的時候要給我們看那第二個就是有關於價格跟這個數量以及他的期程的部分的話他必須要做保密所以其實大多數跟我們政府簽訂的疫苗採購的合約商基於的剛才就是剛才部長你講的這幾個原則第一個是他的整個生產的配方第二個就是他的生產的提供交貨的數量以及交貨的流程\n162182\t183856\t那我想請教一下部長就你的專業來判斷為什麼這幾件事情要把它保密起來因為這些東西如果洩漏出去的話第一個就是會妨礙他公司在跟其他國家簽的那個價格等等這些的價格或者是採購的速度嘛 時程嘛 對不對會影響到 所以\n188567\t208343\t如果他洩露出去的話比方說他跟我們的價格是一個那跟越南的價格是一個這就互相去做比較那他們公司會受到一些壓力對 或者是說每個地方不同的價格但是也有不同的交貨的時程那這些事情其實在當下\n209204\t233544\t在做判斷的時間其實是非常短暫的就是說當時我記得部長或者我們行政院的團隊在跟相關單位在做或者之前陳時中陳部長在做談判的過程當中可能你可能只有一兩天的考慮時間你如果不談廠商可能就下單給別的國家別的國家可能就去更好的價格去談了而且在這過程當中我們對於其他國家採購疫苗的價格能夠窒息嗎\n235544\t260645\t你會知道嗎?其實也困難我們完全不知道也困難嘛委員我也跟你報告一下啦實際上是這樣這個疫苗的價格是完全要看他什麼時候採購比如說我要是first prioritytop priority去採購當然我的價格就要高嘛等我到大量量產的時候的採購當然就會低而且這些廠商也都會考慮到不同的國家的需要性按照他的\n261087\t261107\t蔡適應\n278231\t279772\t這完全是莫名其妙的一件事情\n308846\t309166\t最後交貨\n332321\t332461\t末德納幾年\n359369\t383639\t莫德納他不同意解密所以莫德納不同意解密所以5年6年後也是不能夠解密就對了對好那另外就是BNT呢BNT10年BNT10年那我就很奇怪了為什麼在野黨沒有來質疑BNT啊好那我再問部長一問這幾個東西的採購啊我不曉得不能講啊單價最貴的是誰啊\n384958\t407740\t當價最貴的就是比高端貴的大概就是莫德納、BNT這兩個都更貴嘛對不對那怎麼沒有人質疑說BNT這麼貴為什麼政府沒有跟他砍價感覺好像這些質疑的人好像沒有人提這個質疑是不是那些人那些人可能跟BNT有勾結囉是不是這樣子我不知道啊如果要質疑的話我也會質疑啊當時有些人在\n408721\t423258\t有當時有些人在pushBNT說BNT很好是不是他們是買BNT的股票BNT股票輝瑞也是可以買阿美國的股票就可以買了阿那這樣我是不是可以來質疑說請法務部來調查一下台灣有哪一些人去買了輝瑞的股票\n424999\t448197\t這個邏輯不同吧 部長對 沒有錯那當時在預定要買莫德納等等這一些AZ的時候的話我們在編列預算的時候都是用一計700塊去編列預算的所以那個700塊的緣由是這裡但是後來買到的價格當然就不是一樣因為每個廠商提供的\n449437\t464923\t資訊或者他告訴他的研發成本或者不然就排隊等就像說等到現在買我想一季不用70塊吧就是這個差別所以我想這第一個要讓國人知道就是說在那個非常短暫的時間點做一個重要的政府官員在做決策是非常困難的\n466518\t487368\t怎麼樣盡量能夠保衛住國人的健康然後做這樣的決策在預算的可行範圍內我老實講用現在的角度來看那個時間點我覺得是非常苛責沒有道理所以我剛才才會跟部長院長說如果要會講我也會講說現在買更便宜但現在沒有人需要好但是另外我有第二個問題要來請教一下院長跟部長我們的國家隊的問題院長跟部長1922已經停掉了應該還有\n496475\t521112\t還有嗎 現在打1922會通嗎現在打1922會通 確定因為那個是叫防疫專線 不是針對COVID那防疫專線還留著嗎有 還留著那COVID的專線還留著嗎COVID當時就用這一個專線就用1922嘛 當時有擴大嘛 對不對擴大的合約是不是結束了應該是結束了對啊 我知道是結束 所以現在多少人接電話\n522947\t533295\t如果這樣我請教一下,你們說海流罩,我知道是沒有啦就說邊人很少了啦齁我為什麼問這件事情的原因是因為我想請教一下院長跟部長齁最近疫情是不是又起來了\n534538\t561115\t最近是有疫情起來但是不是只有COVID最近在中國道路的話這個疫情是比較嚴重而且發現新的這個病毒株叫做JN1更嚴重嘛 對不對那這個JN1它傳染的速度會比較快但是最近我們國內採購的XBB的這個COVID-19的疫苗實際上對它是相當的有效那我想請教一下院長\n563209\t569792\tJ1在臺灣目前有沒有發現案例?沒有擴散開來那這些案例應該都不是本土還是境外移入的?\n576728\t578310\t有些國家的疫情似乎又升溫的現象\n600962\t623188\t這樣的生活現象對於這些國家來台灣的飛機我想請問一下院長有沒有考慮要升高他的防疫檢疫的等級我們目前的話也是知道哪一些國家呢他的疫情的狀況比較嚴重所以呢疾病管制署呢已經針對著這些特定的國家呢進來的時候呢就會加強這個體溫的測量還有加強這個症狀的\n625047\t625067\t臨時會議員：蔡適應\n645742\t649264\t因為剛才部長跟院長提到說有新採購了XBB的疫苗對不對對已經開始打了沒有有 有已經開始打\n674204\t702622\t自費還是公費公費好那我建議一下齁要不要未來在機場也直接設一個施打站我們是在醫療院所嘛對不對研議大廚阿而且我們也已經那個疫苗配送我的意思是說可不可以請院長跟部長考慮一下啦齁因為我剛剛聽起來似乎境外的可能比例還蠻高的啦齁打這個疫苗有沒有什麼特別的要求阿跟原來打的都一樣嘛對不對齁是一樣我會建議一下院長跟部長齁\n703786\t724703\t在機場設啦為什麼齁 我們出國的人通常在飛機場要等1到2個小時以上對不對 有那個時間齁當天就設一個疫苗站在那邊很多人都會跑去打疫苗啦比他跑去醫院打我覺得更方便 這第一個第二件事情 出國回來進來台灣的人你跟他講可以先打一下疫苗啦\n725740\t754064\t我覺得這兩件事情可以給院長跟部長考慮一下擴大我們的施打範圍跟施打率我覺得講這件事情比原比講那個什麼該國民黨開記者會AB的記者會來得更重要才對好那但是在這邊我還是要拜託一下我們的院長跟部長剛才我提到的1922的防疫專線以及第二件事情地方基層醫療院所因為這件事情執行業務衍生的費用我要拜託院長跟部長我覺得這是非常重要的一件事情\n756039\t779831\t過去這兩年的過程當中我們看到1922的專線確實發揮了穩定人心的一個重要性那我也遇到打電話有去打電話像行政院或衛福在談的事情的人他有聊到另外一個重要議題就是說他覺得好像行政院本身就沒有一個專屬的這樣的一個客服的電話地方政府有1999但中央政府沒有\n781155\t799353\t中央政府沒有所以我知道說當時在1922打這件事有很多人關於政府的一些相關的議題也都透過1922詢問比如說紓困等等的內容等等為什麼呢因為我遇到這些人有跟我講說他們透過1922詢問的內容的準確度比他們問1999地方政府來得更準\n800441\t820525\t因為很多地方政府也搞不清楚狀況就跟他說你可能要問中央什麼都推給中央就對了然後好的就說是他的不懂的說推給中央就說中央宣導的不大夠我們也不知道你要問中央政府每次都跟地方政府這樣講我認為這個是非常不公平的一件事情但我認為沒關係中央政府我們就扛起來\n821304\t830689\t等行政院院長提出:「是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．\n844977\t862732\t我相信對於解決民間的很多問題民眾的質疑會很有幫助啦否則部長部長我們這邊講了老半天如果看的人只有一萬人看到可能還有另外的好幾百萬人沒有看到啊他還是會同樣的問題繼續來詢問那他如果看到網路上不確實的言論他就以為那是真的啊我們剛剛說不用\n863516\t881793\t有問題打1922問我們的行政院最準啊所以我認為這是一個非常好一個所謂解釋疑慮的一個管道像剛才我們部長提到的每個合約都有保密期限高端最短欸他們為什麼不要質疑BNT啊我也覺得很奇怪為什麼不要質疑莫德納\n882788\t909553\t對不對 所以我的意思就是說這些事情其實就是要講給民眾知道所以我在這邊拜託一下院長我第二個問題就是說我們的1922專線還有第二個就是醫療基層醫療他們的相關的一個工作的費用我覺得要來增加啦因為這幾年我們可以看得到全球化的關係整個醫療或者疫情或者病毒的蔓延是非常跨國的啦而且我們事實上有時候看不到啊\n910086\t913128\t這件事要列為非常重要的重點我相信醫師公會跟護理師公會也有跟還有藥師公會也有跟部長提過這個事情好不好\n951960\t953608\t好 謝謝蔡委員接下來請吳委員施懷質詢\n","txt":"感謝院長能不能請我們陳建仁陳院長就備群台謝謝院長請蔡委員午安院長好我剛才聽了這個我們國民黨委員的質詢尤其最後一段非常的無裡頭啦在問關於這個AV的事情我跟院長講一下最近我聽到一個笑話跟我講說現在只要在台灣打AV後面連結就是國民黨\n為什麼因為大家會想到說原來上國民黨網站就可以看到關於AV的很多的相關資訊我認為說選舉剩下沒有幾天的時間任何一個政黨他應該是要就他的國家政策提出藍圖出來而不是在講什麼AV的事情所以我覺得真的是這是華天下之大績啦好那今天的重點是在於我們整個高端解密的相關的問題我想先請教一下院長我的第一個問題就是說\n我們在這一次的採購裡面我想因為當時你在那時候你不是你不是擔任院長的職務但是我想你對於醫療非常的了解就院長你得知道當時我們台灣跟哪幾家公司有簽訂了疫苗採購的合約\n這裡面有包括了COVAVAX AZ莫德納BNT還有高端我們都有簽這個採購的這個合約聯亞有沒有簽訂聯亞當時是因為他有參加這個臨床試驗所以應該也有嘛對不對也有簽但是那個簽的就是補助他的臨床試驗到臨床試驗而其失敗部長在旁邊我想請教一下當時您當時擔任的職位是市長政務市長市長來\n政府次長我想請教一下這幾家簽訂合約的公司對不對齁都有沒有簽所謂的保密條款有都有有為什麼當然啊因為他裡面他有一個技術性的資料會在合約裡面是不是對\n他要簽約的時候要給我們看那第二個就是有關於價格跟這個數量以及他的期程的部分的話他必須要做保密所以其實大多數跟我們政府簽訂的疫苗採購的合約商基於的剛才就是剛才部長你講的這幾個原則第一個是他的整個生產的配方第二個就是他的生產的提供交貨的數量以及交貨的流程\n那我想請教一下部長就你的專業來判斷為什麼這幾件事情要把它保密起來因為這些東西如果洩漏出去的話第一個就是會妨礙他公司在跟其他國家簽的那個價格等等這些的價格或者是採購的速度嘛 時程嘛 對不對會影響到 所以\n如果他洩露出去的話比方說他跟我們的價格是一個那跟越南的價格是一個這就互相去做比較那他們公司會受到一些壓力對 或者是說每個地方不同的價格但是也有不同的交貨的時程那這些事情其實在當下\n在做判斷的時間其實是非常短暫的就是說當時我記得部長或者我們行政院的團隊在跟相關單位在做或者之前陳時中陳部長在做談判的過程當中可能你可能只有一兩天的考慮時間你如果不談廠商可能就下單給別的國家別的國家可能就去更好的價格去談了而且在這過程當中我們對於其他國家採購疫苗的價格能夠窒息嗎\n你會知道嗎?其實也困難我們完全不知道也困難嘛委員我也跟你報告一下啦實際上是這樣這個疫苗的價格是完全要看他什麼時候採購比如說我要是first prioritytop priority去採購當然我的價格就要高嘛等我到大量量產的時候的採購當然就會低而且這些廠商也都會考慮到不同的國家的需要性按照他的\n蔡適應\n這完全是莫名其妙的一件事情\n最後交貨\n末德納幾年\n莫德納他不同意解密所以莫德納不同意解密所以5年6年後也是不能夠解密就對了對好那另外就是BNT呢BNT10年BNT10年那我就很奇怪了為什麼在野黨沒有來質疑BNT啊好那我再問部長一問這幾個東西的採購啊我不曉得不能講啊單價最貴的是誰啊\n當價最貴的就是比高端貴的大概就是莫德納、BNT這兩個都更貴嘛對不對那怎麼沒有人質疑說BNT這麼貴為什麼政府沒有跟他砍價感覺好像這些質疑的人好像沒有人提這個質疑是不是那些人那些人可能跟BNT有勾結囉是不是這樣子我不知道啊如果要質疑的話我也會質疑啊當時有些人在\n有當時有些人在pushBNT說BNT很好是不是他們是買BNT的股票BNT股票輝瑞也是可以買阿美國的股票就可以買了阿那這樣我是不是可以來質疑說請法務部來調查一下台灣有哪一些人去買了輝瑞的股票\n這個邏輯不同吧 部長對 沒有錯那當時在預定要買莫德納等等這一些AZ的時候的話我們在編列預算的時候都是用一計700塊去編列預算的所以那個700塊的緣由是這裡但是後來買到的價格當然就不是一樣因為每個廠商提供的\n資訊或者他告訴他的研發成本或者不然就排隊等就像說等到現在買我想一季不用70塊吧就是這個差別所以我想這第一個要讓國人知道就是說在那個非常短暫的時間點做一個重要的政府官員在做決策是非常困難的\n怎麼樣盡量能夠保衛住國人的健康然後做這樣的決策在預算的可行範圍內我老實講用現在的角度來看那個時間點我覺得是非常苛責沒有道理所以我剛才才會跟部長院長說如果要會講我也會講說現在買更便宜但現在沒有人需要好但是另外我有第二個問題要來請教一下院長跟部長我們的國家隊的問題院長跟部長1922已經停掉了應該還有\n還有嗎 現在打1922會通嗎現在打1922會通 確定因為那個是叫防疫專線 不是針對COVID那防疫專線還留著嗎有 還留著那COVID的專線還留著嗎COVID當時就用這一個專線就用1922嘛 當時有擴大嘛 對不對擴大的合約是不是結束了應該是結束了對啊 我知道是結束 所以現在多少人接電話\n如果這樣我請教一下,你們說海流罩,我知道是沒有啦就說邊人很少了啦齁我為什麼問這件事情的原因是因為我想請教一下院長跟部長齁最近疫情是不是又起來了\n最近是有疫情起來但是不是只有COVID最近在中國道路的話這個疫情是比較嚴重而且發現新的這個病毒株叫做JN1更嚴重嘛 對不對那這個JN1它傳染的速度會比較快但是最近我們國內採購的XBB的這個COVID-19的疫苗實際上對它是相當的有效那我想請教一下院長\nJ1在臺灣目前有沒有發現案例?沒有擴散開來那這些案例應該都不是本土還是境外移入的?\n有些國家的疫情似乎又升溫的現象\n這樣的生活現象對於這些國家來台灣的飛機我想請問一下院長有沒有考慮要升高他的防疫檢疫的等級我們目前的話也是知道哪一些國家呢他的疫情的狀況比較嚴重所以呢疾病管制署呢已經針對著這些特定的國家呢進來的時候呢就會加強這個體溫的測量還有加強這個症狀的\n臨時會議員：蔡適應\n因為剛才部長跟院長提到說有新採購了XBB的疫苗對不對對已經開始打了沒有有 有已經開始打\n自費還是公費公費好那我建議一下齁要不要未來在機場也直接設一個施打站我們是在醫療院所嘛對不對研議大廚阿而且我們也已經那個疫苗配送我的意思是說可不可以請院長跟部長考慮一下啦齁因為我剛剛聽起來似乎境外的可能比例還蠻高的啦齁打這個疫苗有沒有什麼特別的要求阿跟原來打的都一樣嘛對不對齁是一樣我會建議一下院長跟部長齁\n在機場設啦為什麼齁 我們出國的人通常在飛機場要等1到2個小時以上對不對 有那個時間齁當天就設一個疫苗站在那邊很多人都會跑去打疫苗啦比他跑去醫院打我覺得更方便 這第一個第二件事情 出國回來進來台灣的人你跟他講可以先打一下疫苗啦\n我覺得這兩件事情可以給院長跟部長考慮一下擴大我們的施打範圍跟施打率我覺得講這件事情比原比講那個什麼該國民黨開記者會AB的記者會來得更重要才對好那但是在這邊我還是要拜託一下我們的院長跟部長剛才我提到的1922的防疫專線以及第二件事情地方基層醫療院所因為這件事情執行業務衍生的費用我要拜託院長跟部長我覺得這是非常重要的一件事情\n過去這兩年的過程當中我們看到1922的專線確實發揮了穩定人心的一個重要性那我也遇到打電話有去打電話像行政院或衛福在談的事情的人他有聊到另外一個重要議題就是說他覺得好像行政院本身就沒有一個專屬的這樣的一個客服的電話地方政府有1999但中央政府沒有\n中央政府沒有所以我知道說當時在1922打這件事有很多人關於政府的一些相關的議題也都透過1922詢問比如說紓困等等的內容等等為什麼呢因為我遇到這些人有跟我講說他們透過1922詢問的內容的準確度比他們問1999地方政府來得更準\n因為很多地方政府也搞不清楚狀況就跟他說你可能要問中央什麼都推給中央就對了然後好的就說是他的不懂的說推給中央就說中央宣導的不大夠我們也不知道你要問中央政府每次都跟地方政府這樣講我認為這個是非常不公平的一件事情但我認為沒關係中央政府我們就扛起來\n等行政院院長提出:「是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．\n我相信對於解決民間的很多問題民眾的質疑會很有幫助啦否則部長部長我們這邊講了老半天如果看的人只有一萬人看到可能還有另外的好幾百萬人沒有看到啊他還是會同樣的問題繼續來詢問那他如果看到網路上不確實的言論他就以為那是真的啊我們剛剛說不用\n有問題打1922問我們的行政院最準啊所以我認為這是一個非常好一個所謂解釋疑慮的一個管道像剛才我們部長提到的每個合約都有保密期限高端最短欸他們為什麼不要質疑BNT啊我也覺得很奇怪為什麼不要質疑莫德納\n對不對 所以我的意思就是說這些事情其實就是要講給民眾知道所以我在這邊拜託一下院長我第二個問題就是說我們的1922專線還有第二個就是醫療基層醫療他們的相關的一個工作的費用我覺得要來增加啦因為這幾年我們可以看得到全球化的關係整個醫療或者疫情或者病毒的蔓延是非常跨國的啦而且我們事實上有時候看不到啊\n這件事要列為非常重要的重點我相信醫師公會跟護理師公會也有跟還有藥師公會也有跟部長提過這個事情好不好\n好 謝謝蔡委員接下來請吳委員施懷質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:14.949 --> 00:42.004\n感謝院長能不能請我們陳建仁陳院長就備群台謝謝院長請蔡委員午安院長好我剛才聽了這個我們國民黨委員的質詢尤其最後一段非常的無裡頭啦在問關於這個AV的事情我跟院長講一下最近我聽到一個笑話跟我講說現在只要在台灣打AV後面連結就是國民黨\n\n00:43.172 --> 01:10.135\n為什麼因為大家會想到說原來上國民黨網站就可以看到關於AV的很多的相關資訊我認為說選舉剩下沒有幾天的時間任何一個政黨他應該是要就他的國家政策提出藍圖出來而不是在講什麼AV的事情所以我覺得真的是這是華天下之大績啦好那今天的重點是在於我們整個高端解密的相關的問題我想先請教一下院長我的第一個問題就是說\n\n01:11.701 --> 01:27.072\n我們在這一次的採購裡面我想因為當時你在那時候你不是你不是擔任院長的職務但是我想你對於醫療非常的了解就院長你得知道當時我們台灣跟哪幾家公司有簽訂了疫苗採購的合約\n\n01:28.086 --> 01:55.434\n這裡面有包括了COVAVAXAZ莫德納BNT還有高端我們都有簽這個採購的這個合約聯亞有沒有簽訂聯亞當時是因為他有參加這個臨床試驗所以應該也有嘛對不對也有簽但是那個簽的就是補助他的臨床試驗到臨床試驗而其失敗部長在旁邊我想請教一下當時您當時擔任的職位是市長政務市長市長來\n\n01:56.974 --> 02:12.004\n政府次長我想請教一下這幾家簽訂合約的公司對不對齁都有沒有簽所謂的保密條款有都有有為什麼當然啊因為他裡面他有一個技術性的資料會在合約裡面是不是對\n\n02:13.530 --> 02:41.451\n他要簽約的時候要給我們看那第二個就是有關於價格跟這個數量以及他的期程的部分的話他必須要做保密所以其實大多數跟我們政府簽訂的疫苗採購的合約商基於的剛才就是剛才部長你講的這幾個原則第一個是他的整個生產的配方第二個就是他的生產的提供交貨的數量以及交貨的流程\n\n02:42.182 --> 03:03.856\n那我想請教一下部長就你的專業來判斷為什麼這幾件事情要把它保密起來因為這些東西如果洩漏出去的話第一個就是會妨礙他公司在跟其他國家簽的那個價格等等這些的價格或者是採購的速度嘛時程嘛對不對會影響到所以\n\n03:08.567 --> 03:28.343\n如果他洩露出去的話比方說他跟我們的價格是一個那跟越南的價格是一個這就互相去做比較那他們公司會受到一些壓力對或者是說每個地方不同的價格但是也有不同的交貨的時程那這些事情其實在當下\n\n03:29.204 --> 03:53.544\n在做判斷的時間其實是非常短暫的就是說當時我記得部長或者我們行政院的團隊在跟相關單位在做或者之前陳時中陳部長在做談判的過程當中可能你可能只有一兩天的考慮時間你如果不談廠商可能就下單給別的國家別的國家可能就去更好的價格去談了而且在這過程當中我們對於其他國家採購疫苗的價格能夠窒息嗎\n\n03:55.544 --> 04:20.645\n你會知道嗎?其實也困難我們完全不知道也困難嘛委員我也跟你報告一下啦實際上是這樣這個疫苗的價格是完全要看他什麼時候採購比如說我要是firstprioritytoppriority去採購當然我的價格就要高嘛等我到大量量產的時候的採購當然就會低而且這些廠商也都會考慮到不同的國家的需要性按照他的\n\n04:21.087 --> 04:21.107\n蔡適應\n\n04:38.231 --> 04:39.772\n這完全是莫名其妙的一件事情\n\n05:08.846 --> 05:09.166\n最後交貨\n\n05:32.321 --> 05:32.461\n末德納幾年\n\n05:59.369 --> 06:23.639\n莫德納他不同意解密所以莫德納不同意解密所以5年6年後也是不能夠解密就對了對好那另外就是BNT呢BNT10年BNT10年那我就很奇怪了為什麼在野黨沒有來質疑BNT啊好那我再問部長一問這幾個東西的採購啊我不曉得不能講啊單價最貴的是誰啊\n\n06:24.958 --> 06:47.740\n當價最貴的就是比高端貴的大概就是莫德納、BNT這兩個都更貴嘛對不對那怎麼沒有人質疑說BNT這麼貴為什麼政府沒有跟他砍價感覺好像這些質疑的人好像沒有人提這個質疑是不是那些人那些人可能跟BNT有勾結囉是不是這樣子我不知道啊如果要質疑的話我也會質疑啊當時有些人在\n\n06:48.721 --> 07:03.258\n有當時有些人在pushBNT說BNT很好是不是他們是買BNT的股票BNT股票輝瑞也是可以買阿美國的股票就可以買了阿那這樣我是不是可以來質疑說請法務部來調查一下台灣有哪一些人去買了輝瑞的股票\n\n07:04.999 --> 07:28.197\n這個邏輯不同吧部長對沒有錯那當時在預定要買莫德納等等這一些AZ的時候的話我們在編列預算的時候都是用一計700塊去編列預算的所以那個700塊的緣由是這裡但是後來買到的價格當然就不是一樣因為每個廠商提供的\n\n07:29.437 --> 07:44.923\n資訊或者他告訴他的研發成本或者不然就排隊等就像說等到現在買我想一季不用70塊吧就是這個差別所以我想這第一個要讓國人知道就是說在那個非常短暫的時間點做一個重要的政府官員在做決策是非常困難的\n\n07:46.518 --> 08:07.368\n怎麼樣盡量能夠保衛住國人的健康然後做這樣的決策在預算的可行範圍內我老實講用現在的角度來看那個時間點我覺得是非常苛責沒有道理所以我剛才才會跟部長院長說如果要會講我也會講說現在買更便宜但現在沒有人需要好但是另外我有第二個問題要來請教一下院長跟部長我們的國家隊的問題院長跟部長1922已經停掉了應該還有\n\n08:16.475 --> 08:41.112\n還有嗎現在打1922會通嗎現在打1922會通確定因為那個是叫防疫專線不是針對COVID那防疫專線還留著嗎有還留著那COVID的專線還留著嗎COVID當時就用這一個專線就用1922嘛當時有擴大嘛對不對擴大的合約是不是結束了應該是結束了對啊我知道是結束所以現在多少人接電話\n\n08:42.947 --> 08:53.295\n如果這樣我請教一下,你們說海流罩,我知道是沒有啦就說邊人很少了啦齁我為什麼問這件事情的原因是因為我想請教一下院長跟部長齁最近疫情是不是又起來了\n\n08:54.538 --> 09:21.115\n最近是有疫情起來但是不是只有COVID最近在中國道路的話這個疫情是比較嚴重而且發現新的這個病毒株叫做JN1更嚴重嘛對不對那這個JN1它傳染的速度會比較快但是最近我們國內採購的XBB的這個COVID-19的疫苗實際上對它是相當的有效那我想請教一下院長\n\n09:23.209 --> 09:29.792\nJ1在臺灣目前有沒有發現案例?沒有擴散開來那這些案例應該都不是本土還是境外移入的?\n\n09:36.728 --> 09:38.310\n有些國家的疫情似乎又升溫的現象\n\n10:00.962 --> 10:23.188\n這樣的生活現象對於這些國家來台灣的飛機我想請問一下院長有沒有考慮要升高他的防疫檢疫的等級我們目前的話也是知道哪一些國家呢他的疫情的狀況比較嚴重所以呢疾病管制署呢已經針對著這些特定的國家呢進來的時候呢就會加強這個體溫的測量還有加強這個症狀的\n\n10:25.047 --> 10:25.067\n臨時會議員：蔡適應\n\n10:45.742 --> 10:49.264\n因為剛才部長跟院長提到說有新採購了XBB的疫苗對不對對已經開始打了沒有有有已經開始打\n\n11:14.204 --> 11:42.622\n自費還是公費公費好那我建議一下齁要不要未來在機場也直接設一個施打站我們是在醫療院所嘛對不對研議大廚阿而且我們也已經那個疫苗配送我的意思是說可不可以請院長跟部長考慮一下啦齁因為我剛剛聽起來似乎境外的可能比例還蠻高的啦齁打這個疫苗有沒有什麼特別的要求阿跟原來打的都一樣嘛對不對齁是一樣我會建議一下院長跟部長齁\n\n11:43.786 --> 12:04.703\n在機場設啦為什麼齁我們出國的人通常在飛機場要等1到2個小時以上對不對有那個時間齁當天就設一個疫苗站在那邊很多人都會跑去打疫苗啦比他跑去醫院打我覺得更方便這第一個第二件事情出國回來進來台灣的人你跟他講可以先打一下疫苗啦\n\n12:05.740 --> 12:34.064\n我覺得這兩件事情可以給院長跟部長考慮一下擴大我們的施打範圍跟施打率我覺得講這件事情比原比講那個什麼該國民黨開記者會AB的記者會來得更重要才對好那但是在這邊我還是要拜託一下我們的院長跟部長剛才我提到的1922的防疫專線以及第二件事情地方基層醫療院所因為這件事情執行業務衍生的費用我要拜託院長跟部長我覺得這是非常重要的一件事情\n\n12:36.039 --> 12:59.831\n過去這兩年的過程當中我們看到1922的專線確實發揮了穩定人心的一個重要性那我也遇到打電話有去打電話像行政院或衛福在談的事情的人他有聊到另外一個重要議題就是說他覺得好像行政院本身就沒有一個專屬的這樣的一個客服的電話地方政府有1999但中央政府沒有\n\n13:01.155 --> 13:19.353\n中央政府沒有所以我知道說當時在1922打這件事有很多人關於政府的一些相關的議題也都透過1922詢問比如說紓困等等的內容等等為什麼呢因為我遇到這些人有跟我講說他們透過1922詢問的內容的準確度比他們問1999地方政府來得更準\n\n13:20.441 --> 13:40.525\n因為很多地方政府也搞不清楚狀況就跟他說你可能要問中央什麼都推給中央就對了然後好的就說是他的不懂的說推給中央就說中央宣導的不大夠我們也不知道你要問中央政府每次都跟地方政府這樣講我認為這個是非常不公平的一件事情但我認為沒關係中央政府我們就扛起來\n\n13:41.304 --> 13:50.689\n等行政院院長提出:「是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．\n\n14:04.977 --> 14:22.732\n我相信對於解決民間的很多問題民眾的質疑會很有幫助啦否則部長部長我們這邊講了老半天如果看的人只有一萬人看到可能還有另外的好幾百萬人沒有看到啊他還是會同樣的問題繼續來詢問那他如果看到網路上不確實的言論他就以為那是真的啊我們剛剛說不用\n\n14:23.516 --> 14:41.793\n有問題打1922問我們的行政院最準啊所以我認為這是一個非常好一個所謂解釋疑慮的一個管道像剛才我們部長提到的每個合約都有保密期限高端最短欸他們為什麼不要質疑BNT啊我也覺得很奇怪為什麼不要質疑莫德納\n\n14:42.788 --> 15:09.553\n對不對所以我的意思就是說這些事情其實就是要講給民眾知道所以我在這邊拜託一下院長我第二個問題就是說我們的1922專線還有第二個就是醫療基層醫療他們的相關的一個工作的費用我覺得要來增加啦因為這幾年我們可以看得到全球化的關係整個醫療或者疫情或者病毒的蔓延是非常跨國的啦而且我們事實上有時候看不到啊\n\n15:10.086 --> 15:13.128\n這件事要列為非常重要的重點我相信醫師公會跟護理師公會也有跟還有藥師公會也有跟部長提過這個事情好不好\n\n15:51.960 --> 15:53.608\n好謝謝蔡委員接下來請吳委員施懷質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":14.949,"end":42.004,"text":"感謝院長能不能請我們陳建仁陳院長就備群台謝謝院長請蔡委員午安院長好我剛才聽了這個我們國民黨委員的質詢尤其最後一段非常的無裡頭啦在問關於這個AV的事情我跟院長講一下最近我聽到一個笑話跟我講說現在只要在台灣打AV後面連結就是國民黨"},{"start":43.172,"end":70.135,"text":"為什麼因為大家會想到說原來上國民黨網站就可以看到關於AV的很多的相關資訊我認為說選舉剩下沒有幾天的時間任何一個政黨他應該是要就他的國家政策提出藍圖出來而不是在講什麼AV的事情所以我覺得真的是這是華天下之大績啦好那今天的重點是在於我們整個高端解密的相關的問題我想先請教一下院長我的第一個問題就是說"},{"start":71.701,"end":87.072,"text":"我們在這一次的採購裡面我想因為當時你在那時候你不是你不是擔任院長的職務但是我想你對於醫療非常的了解就院長你得知道當時我們台灣跟哪幾家公司有簽訂了疫苗採購的合約"},{"start":88.086,"end":115.434,"text":"這裡面有包括了COVAVAX AZ莫德納BNT還有高端我們都有簽這個採購的這個合約聯亞有沒有簽訂聯亞當時是因為他有參加這個臨床試驗所以應該也有嘛對不對也有簽但是那個簽的就是補助他的臨床試驗到臨床試驗而其失敗部長在旁邊我想請教一下當時您當時擔任的職位是市長政務市長市長來"},{"start":116.974,"end":132.004,"text":"政府次長我想請教一下這幾家簽訂合約的公司對不對齁都有沒有簽所謂的保密條款有都有有為什麼當然啊因為他裡面他有一個技術性的資料會在合約裡面是不是對"},{"start":133.53,"end":161.451,"text":"他要簽約的時候要給我們看那第二個就是有關於價格跟這個數量以及他的期程的部分的話他必須要做保密所以其實大多數跟我們政府簽訂的疫苗採購的合約商基於的剛才就是剛才部長你講的這幾個原則第一個是他的整個生產的配方第二個就是他的生產的提供交貨的數量以及交貨的流程"},{"start":162.182,"end":183.856,"text":"那我想請教一下部長就你的專業來判斷為什麼這幾件事情要把它保密起來因為這些東西如果洩漏出去的話第一個就是會妨礙他公司在跟其他國家簽的那個價格等等這些的價格或者是採購的速度嘛 時程嘛 對不對會影響到 所以"},{"start":188.567,"end":208.343,"text":"如果他洩露出去的話比方說他跟我們的價格是一個那跟越南的價格是一個這就互相去做比較那他們公司會受到一些壓力對 或者是說每個地方不同的價格但是也有不同的交貨的時程那這些事情其實在當下"},{"start":209.204,"end":233.544,"text":"在做判斷的時間其實是非常短暫的就是說當時我記得部長或者我們行政院的團隊在跟相關單位在做或者之前陳時中陳部長在做談判的過程當中可能你可能只有一兩天的考慮時間你如果不談廠商可能就下單給別的國家別的國家可能就去更好的價格去談了而且在這過程當中我們對於其他國家採購疫苗的價格能夠窒息嗎"},{"start":235.544,"end":260.645,"text":"你會知道嗎?其實也困難我們完全不知道也困難嘛委員我也跟你報告一下啦實際上是這樣這個疫苗的價格是完全要看他什麼時候採購比如說我要是first prioritytop priority去採購當然我的價格就要高嘛等我到大量量產的時候的採購當然就會低而且這些廠商也都會考慮到不同的國家的需要性按照他的"},{"start":261.087,"end":261.107,"text":"蔡適應"},{"start":278.231,"end":279.772,"text":"這完全是莫名其妙的一件事情"},{"start":308.846,"end":309.166,"text":"最後交貨"},{"start":332.321,"end":332.461,"text":"末德納幾年"},{"start":359.369,"end":383.639,"text":"莫德納他不同意解密所以莫德納不同意解密所以5年6年後也是不能夠解密就對了對好那另外就是BNT呢BNT10年BNT10年那我就很奇怪了為什麼在野黨沒有來質疑BNT啊好那我再問部長一問這幾個東西的採購啊我不曉得不能講啊單價最貴的是誰啊"},{"start":384.958,"end":407.74,"text":"當價最貴的就是比高端貴的大概就是莫德納、BNT這兩個都更貴嘛對不對那怎麼沒有人質疑說BNT這麼貴為什麼政府沒有跟他砍價感覺好像這些質疑的人好像沒有人提這個質疑是不是那些人那些人可能跟BNT有勾結囉是不是這樣子我不知道啊如果要質疑的話我也會質疑啊當時有些人在"},{"start":408.721,"end":423.258,"text":"有當時有些人在pushBNT說BNT很好是不是他們是買BNT的股票BNT股票輝瑞也是可以買阿美國的股票就可以買了阿那這樣我是不是可以來質疑說請法務部來調查一下台灣有哪一些人去買了輝瑞的股票"},{"start":424.999,"end":448.197,"text":"這個邏輯不同吧 部長對 沒有錯那當時在預定要買莫德納等等這一些AZ的時候的話我們在編列預算的時候都是用一計700塊去編列預算的所以那個700塊的緣由是這裡但是後來買到的價格當然就不是一樣因為每個廠商提供的"},{"start":449.437,"end":464.923,"text":"資訊或者他告訴他的研發成本或者不然就排隊等就像說等到現在買我想一季不用70塊吧就是這個差別所以我想這第一個要讓國人知道就是說在那個非常短暫的時間點做一個重要的政府官員在做決策是非常困難的"},{"start":466.518,"end":487.368,"text":"怎麼樣盡量能夠保衛住國人的健康然後做這樣的決策在預算的可行範圍內我老實講用現在的角度來看那個時間點我覺得是非常苛責沒有道理所以我剛才才會跟部長院長說如果要會講我也會講說現在買更便宜但現在沒有人需要好但是另外我有第二個問題要來請教一下院長跟部長我們的國家隊的問題院長跟部長1922已經停掉了應該還有"},{"start":496.475,"end":521.112,"text":"還有嗎 現在打1922會通嗎現在打1922會通 確定因為那個是叫防疫專線 不是針對COVID那防疫專線還留著嗎有 還留著那COVID的專線還留著嗎COVID當時就用這一個專線就用1922嘛 當時有擴大嘛 對不對擴大的合約是不是結束了應該是結束了對啊 我知道是結束 所以現在多少人接電話"},{"start":522.947,"end":533.295,"text":"如果這樣我請教一下,你們說海流罩,我知道是沒有啦就說邊人很少了啦齁我為什麼問這件事情的原因是因為我想請教一下院長跟部長齁最近疫情是不是又起來了"},{"start":534.538,"end":561.115,"text":"最近是有疫情起來但是不是只有COVID最近在中國道路的話這個疫情是比較嚴重而且發現新的這個病毒株叫做JN1更嚴重嘛 對不對那這個JN1它傳染的速度會比較快但是最近我們國內採購的XBB的這個COVID-19的疫苗實際上對它是相當的有效那我想請教一下院長"},{"start":563.209,"end":569.792,"text":"J1在臺灣目前有沒有發現案例?沒有擴散開來那這些案例應該都不是本土還是境外移入的?"},{"start":576.728,"end":578.31,"text":"有些國家的疫情似乎又升溫的現象"},{"start":600.962,"end":623.188,"text":"這樣的生活現象對於這些國家來台灣的飛機我想請問一下院長有沒有考慮要升高他的防疫檢疫的等級我們目前的話也是知道哪一些國家呢他的疫情的狀況比較嚴重所以呢疾病管制署呢已經針對著這些特定的國家呢進來的時候呢就會加強這個體溫的測量還有加強這個症狀的"},{"start":625.047,"end":625.067,"text":"臨時會議員：蔡適應"},{"start":645.742,"end":649.264,"text":"因為剛才部長跟院長提到說有新採購了XBB的疫苗對不對對已經開始打了沒有有 有已經開始打"},{"start":674.204,"end":702.622,"text":"自費還是公費公費好那我建議一下齁要不要未來在機場也直接設一個施打站我們是在醫療院所嘛對不對研議大廚阿而且我們也已經那個疫苗配送我的意思是說可不可以請院長跟部長考慮一下啦齁因為我剛剛聽起來似乎境外的可能比例還蠻高的啦齁打這個疫苗有沒有什麼特別的要求阿跟原來打的都一樣嘛對不對齁是一樣我會建議一下院長跟部長齁"},{"start":703.786,"end":724.703,"text":"在機場設啦為什麼齁 我們出國的人通常在飛機場要等1到2個小時以上對不對 有那個時間齁當天就設一個疫苗站在那邊很多人都會跑去打疫苗啦比他跑去醫院打我覺得更方便 這第一個第二件事情 出國回來進來台灣的人你跟他講可以先打一下疫苗啦"},{"start":725.74,"end":754.064,"text":"我覺得這兩件事情可以給院長跟部長考慮一下擴大我們的施打範圍跟施打率我覺得講這件事情比原比講那個什麼該國民黨開記者會AB的記者會來得更重要才對好那但是在這邊我還是要拜託一下我們的院長跟部長剛才我提到的1922的防疫專線以及第二件事情地方基層醫療院所因為這件事情執行業務衍生的費用我要拜託院長跟部長我覺得這是非常重要的一件事情"},{"start":756.039,"end":779.831,"text":"過去這兩年的過程當中我們看到1922的專線確實發揮了穩定人心的一個重要性那我也遇到打電話有去打電話像行政院或衛福在談的事情的人他有聊到另外一個重要議題就是說他覺得好像行政院本身就沒有一個專屬的這樣的一個客服的電話地方政府有1999但中央政府沒有"},{"start":781.155,"end":799.353,"text":"中央政府沒有所以我知道說當時在1922打這件事有很多人關於政府的一些相關的議題也都透過1922詢問比如說紓困等等的內容等等為什麼呢因為我遇到這些人有跟我講說他們透過1922詢問的內容的準確度比他們問1999地方政府來得更準"},{"start":800.441,"end":820.525,"text":"因為很多地方政府也搞不清楚狀況就跟他說你可能要問中央什麼都推給中央就對了然後好的就說是他的不懂的說推給中央就說中央宣導的不大夠我們也不知道你要問中央政府每次都跟地方政府這樣講我認為這個是非常不公平的一件事情但我認為沒關係中央政府我們就扛起來"},{"start":821.304,"end":830.689,"text":"等行政院院長提出:「是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．是否公布高端合約．"},{"start":844.977,"end":862.732,"text":"我相信對於解決民間的很多問題民眾的質疑會很有幫助啦否則部長部長我們這邊講了老半天如果看的人只有一萬人看到可能還有另外的好幾百萬人沒有看到啊他還是會同樣的問題繼續來詢問那他如果看到網路上不確實的言論他就以為那是真的啊我們剛剛說不用"},{"start":863.516,"end":881.793,"text":"有問題打1922問我們的行政院最準啊所以我認為這是一個非常好一個所謂解釋疑慮的一個管道像剛才我們部長提到的每個合約都有保密期限高端最短欸他們為什麼不要質疑BNT啊我也覺得很奇怪為什麼不要質疑莫德納"},{"start":882.788,"end":909.553,"text":"對不對 所以我的意思就是說這些事情其實就是要講給民眾知道所以我在這邊拜託一下院長我第二個問題就是說我們的1922專線還有第二個就是醫療基層醫療他們的相關的一個工作的費用我覺得要來增加啦因為這幾年我們可以看得到全球化的關係整個醫療或者疫情或者病毒的蔓延是非常跨國的啦而且我們事實上有時候看不到啊"},{"start":910.086,"end":913.128,"text":"這件事要列為非常重要的重點我相信醫師公會跟護理師公會也有跟還有藥師公會也有跟部長提過這個事情好不好"},{"start":951.96,"end":953.608,"text":"好 謝謝蔡委員接下來請吳委員施懷質詢"}]}}}}