{"id":149201,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149201","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/ad9f873b941d2ddd4cd6e2370afa1c5ebaff13691fd5102bf8ba9b0039caa7a60d962a79b52927965ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"柯志恩","委員發言時間":"10:01:37 - 10:15:42","影片長度":"00:14:05","會議時間":"2024-03-04T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2次全體委員會議（事由：邀請教育部部長潘文忠列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。【3月4日及7日二天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":2,"committees":[22],"id":"委員會-11-1-22-2"},"date":"2024-03-04","duration":845,"end_time":"2024-03-04T10:15:42+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-04T10:01:37+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":288,"blocks":[["柯委員志恩：（10時1分）謝謝召委，我們是不是請部長？"],["主席：請潘部長。"],["潘部長文忠：召委好。"],["柯委員志恩：部長好。部長，你已經做好續任的準備嗎？"],["潘部長文忠：謝謝召委關心啦，我想這個是新任總統及院長的職權。"],["柯委員志恩：是，我這樣的提問最主要是希望不要讓教育部每個人都有所謂待退的一個心態，否則未來剩下的七十多天，我們的質詢就會變成教育大家談，這就不是我們所希望看到的。既然是如此的話，我認為上緊發條是非常重要的，所以請問部長，你當初所承諾的所謂學生輔導法跟營養午餐的專法，這個會期可不可以在520之前送到我們立法院？"],["潘部長文忠：跟召委報告一下你所關心的這二個法案，學生輔導法教育部現在已經送到行政院在進行相關的審議，當然這裡面還要彙集相關縣市、團體的意見……"],["柯委員志恩：沒有，因為部長你特別提到說你會在這個會期送到，所以我只是要……"],["潘部長文忠：對，我是說學生輔導法的進程。至於有關午餐專法的部分，教育部近期就會送到行政院做相關的審議，這部分也跟院長及政委那邊報告過外界都很關注，各界都很關注這個法……"],["柯委員志恩：沒有錯，所以我就是不斷地希望大家能夠上緊發條，在520之前該做完的事情大家能夠把它做一個持續。剛剛我為什麼問到續任的問題？因為最近有個獨派非常建議賴清德能夠找到一個所謂具有臺灣主體意識的人來當教育部長，部長，對於這樣一個說法，你自己個人認為怎麼樣？"],["潘部長文忠：跟召委報告，因為召委也是教育人，也瞭解教育就是教育啦，教育還是要以學生受教為先，學生是一個主體，我想這些年教育部、我自己個人也都是以這樣的方式來規劃相關政策。"],["柯委員志恩：沒有錯！所以部長，未來如果你沒有續任，你在跟新部長交接的時候，你是否會把你剛剛所提到的，不要在我們教育裡面搞政治這樣的一個初衷也能夠持續地告訴我們的新部長？"],["潘部長文忠：跟委員報告，有關520之後的相關人事，這個我不便多說，因為這本來就是新任……"],["柯委員志恩：但是基本的教育立場，就是不要有意識形態放在教育，部長應該可以承諾來做一個傳承吧？"],["潘部長文忠：跟召委報告，我想教育真的核心重點就是孩子啦，所以在這一方面，教育部這幾年的政策，我相信很多也都是政策的延續，政務官有任期等等的相關問題，但是我想我們的事務官同仁、教育部同仁也都很積極在推。"],["柯委員志恩：政務官就必須要有一個教育的風骨，就像當初的黃榮村部長，他寧可被撤換，也不會在這裡面搞意識形態，我覺得這是非常重要的。還有，4年多前我離開立法院的時候非常謝謝部長特別來看我，同時也告訴我有幾件事情你會繼續協助，部長還記得是什麼事嗎？其實我已經把答案拿出來了。"],["潘部長文忠：委員，這個逆風計畫你那天還特別提……"],["柯委員志恩：對，逆風計畫，非常謝謝你，你完全沒有食言，非常謝謝部長。"],["潘部長文忠：那就是剛才回應召委的，那是一個對孩子很有幫助的計畫……"],["柯委員志恩：是，非常好，所以我要特別謝謝你，但是還有另外一件事情，是我在第9屆召委任內的時候，那時候部長也特別提到，希望能夠呼應我們體育界，希望能夠有一個室內的田徑場地，部長，這是非常重要的，當時在第9屆的時候，部長特別提到會找地。我們可以往下面去看，現在連我們鄰近的、經濟條件比不上我們的越南，都讓我們非常的羨慕，因為他都有可以舉辦亞洲賽事的室內田徑場，但你看看我們這些球員、田徑選手，而且那時候體育署答應找地，但是體育署沒有辦法補助，而高教署也只能補助三分之二，那時候我們找到的是林口體大，我們的署長當時就是該校的校長，你現在是署長了，你也承諾要好好做這樣的一個事情，可是很顯然還缺3億，3億對於很多的田徑選手來說是非常重要的，難道沒有辦法解決嗎？部長？"],["潘部長文忠：跟召委報告，當時跟召委說這個，因為本來就有一個雛形，而且也必要啦，當時我們認為林口的國體是一個適合的場所，這個計畫也真的有持續在走，但國體後來內部效益評估……"],["柯委員志恩：我知道有很多因素，我是說署長那時候是校長……"],["潘部長文忠：他是總務長啦。"],["柯委員志恩：3億！3億！部長，差3億而已，從那時候講到現在才差3億！"],["潘部長文忠：我也跟召委報告，我說這個是必要的運動設施，所以國體好像一直在溝通，但沒有很具體的進展，現在會由國訓中心，因為國訓中心終究是我們……"],["柯委員志恩：什麼時候可以完成這樣的一個方向？"],["潘部長文忠：這部分我是不是請署長跟召委報告一下？"],["柯委員志恩：我等一下會一併來問一下我們的體育署長。"],["潘部長文忠：好。"],["柯委員志恩：我只是在跟你說，在第9屆的時候……"],["潘部長文忠：我說要設置的這個方向沒變，只是在國體，我跟召委抱歉，真的……"],["柯委員志恩：差了那個3億，如果真的沒有辦法立刻解決的話，也還是會持續下去，等一下我會就教於我們的體育署長，還有其他的問題喔……"],["潘部長文忠：這個未來會在國訓的計畫執行。"],["柯委員志恩：好，部長，接下來我持續剛剛洪孟楷委員所提到的一條龍20萬的這個層面，你知道目前大學教授看一份學習檔案需要多少錢嗎？要付給大學教授多少錢嗎？部長知道嗎？"],["潘部長文忠：這我沒有……"],["柯委員志恩：你還真是不知道，我告訴你，一份所謂的學習歷程檔案通常都會有3位教授去看，一個人通常可以拿到50塊，審查費50塊，你覺得這麼快速，這麼樣的一個部分，就像剛剛這個題目一出來，每個大學老師說大概有80%都可以看出什麼是真什麼是假，但是你覺得可以看多少時間、付多少錢給大學老師，真的可以看得出來嗎？部長，我還真的點進去看，但對不起，要收費喔，裡面林林總總的，我只是說當他們提出來一條龍叫價20萬的時候，我們的教育部只是告訴大家不要浪費這些錢，但是這就是一個事實，而且你隨便打進去Google可以滿天飛，難道教育部完全沒有任何的作為，就這件事情只是告訴大家不要去相信這些，難道這樣就可以了嗎？你覺得大學老師真的就可以看得出來學習歷程檔案的真或假嗎？"],["潘部長文忠：跟召委報告，確實啦，因為這個不是行政機關在呼籲跟要求，召委所提的這個也正是學測成績公布的前一天……"],["柯委員志恩：沒錯！"],["潘部長文忠：這裡面李瑞霖就是一個學生，是108課綱第一屆的孩子，那幾位也都是一直在擔任參與的這些老師們，我覺得宣導這件事情教育部一定要再持續努力，我想召委也知道，家長信或不信這件事情是一個很關鍵的……"],["柯委員志恩：部長，我現在只是告訴你，這件事情目前在家長圈已經造成非常大的影響，大家對於這個學習歷程檔案的一個軍備，我只是告訴部長一個實情，當發生了這樣狀況的時候，教育部沒有辦法，就像我說的，你沒有辦法要求數位部或其他相關部會共同來讓家長安心嗎？數位部打詐無能，難道教育部對於要下架這一些所謂隨時可以看到在網站的這些業者，難道一點辦法都沒有嗎？一點對於代寫這樣一件事情完全沒有辦法有作為，只是勸告嗎？"],["潘部長文忠：跟委員報告，如果有察覺到有關民間的這些廣告或平臺，教育部確實會去函要求要下架啦……"],["柯委員志恩：現在有沒有下架呢？沒有喔！現在你Google打上去還是非常多喔！"],["潘部長文忠：不是，他可能還是有一直在產生這些想要從這當中去賺取利益的……"],["柯委員志恩：是，那你們有什麼做法？"],["潘部長文忠：就是我們當然會去察覺啦，只是剛才召委有……"],["柯委員志恩：好，那你有沒有查到？"],["潘部長文忠：召委有提醒，因為這個跟詐又好像不完全一樣……"],["柯委員志恩：我只是告訴部長，你如果去看的話，目前這個業者的數目完全沒有任何的增減，表示教育部在這一塊當中其實成效非常有限。我只是告訴大家，不要讓你一個好好的學習歷程檔案的美意，因為這一件事情讓很多人又開始有相對的剝奪感，教育部要有所作為，不要像數位部一樣。因為這是業務報告，所以很多事情我們以後會用專案來處理。","接下來是有關於英語雙語教育的問題，賴清德當年在當臺南市長的時候特別提出雙語，所以我不曉得英語現在是不是已經變成所謂的第二官方語言，但是部長，4年的時間用100億來推動2030雙語政策，你覺得目前為止成果如何？"],["潘部長文忠：跟委員報告，成果還是要從學生的學習表現來呈現，如果就大學的這部分，因為有參與相關計畫的會在今年做學生確實的一個……"],["柯委員志恩：你覺得大學英文因為你這樣子就會變好嗎？你不要問我這個大學老師……"],["潘部長文忠：不是啦！委員，我一直在強調，語言的提升不可能一步到位，所以為什麼我們一直在提醒也在審核，都是因為你有相關的準備計畫，我們才會核予計畫也會核予相關的經費，在中小學也如此。但這部分我也要跟召委報告一下，縣市的部分熱烈反應跟求好心切這件事情也造成很多狀況，包括師資還沒有聘進來，就要求學校說你已經叫做什麼雙語學校，這個我認為……"],["柯委員志恩：但是部長，數字還是會說話，目前申請的雙語學校有392校，這是審計部特別提出來的，但是它的報告卻顯示幾乎有三成的學生是連國中階層的基本能力都沒有具備，你也很清楚，因為你有到偏鄉去，這個落差不是只有在數位的落差，在語言的落差是非常大。","誠如部長你剛所提到的，師資的確是沒有，說實在我們聘外師是比本國的師資還多出4.4倍，但是目前為止你把人數平均下來，每一校的人數大概是不足2人，師資是非常大的問題。但在這個原則之下，我們又把所謂的雙語喊得滿天飛，很多第一線的老師都已經覺得目前孩子不僅是英文學不好，連國語、數學都學得不太好，我知道之前范委員有特別提到。還有很多時候，在國文的甄試當中，也是以英文當作非常大的一個主軸，當你把英文變成一個主軸，英文是一個國際語言，沒有問題，但是我們所做的方式，你花了4年100億到底有沒有達到這樣的效果，而不是只有一個空的，即我們臺灣2030年將會變成是雙語的學校。而且我還跟部長講，你還記不記得那時候我們有16個駐臺的代表聯名致函行政院提出對雙語政策的擔憂，當他覺得我們獨尊英文的時候，他們認為除了盎格魯撒克遜之外的語言都會被完全簡略，更不要說第一線的這些老師。","我只是告訴部長，花了這麼多錢，你覺得你的成效要到什麼地方？目前為止，從過去的很多的報告裡面可知，雙語教育可以說是教育民怨中的排名第一名，教育部有沒有一個更具體、更務實的作法來面對，否則我們孩子的競爭力是越來越低落。部長，對於2030雙語學校有沒有更具體的作法？為什麼要特別提出來？因為賴清德當上總統了，他當初可以提出2030這樣的一個目標，我不曉得未來在整個教育的系統上面，整個雙語的系統會變成什麼樣的一個局面。"],["潘部長文忠：我跟召委報告，我想在教育上對於實務的推動怎麼樣才更可以達成這個效益，尤其是語言的這部分，我剛才為什麼一直在說教育部會去審核學校所提的計畫，是會去看它各面向，但這一部分在中小學的部分我真的要跟召委說，中央跟地方在整個處理的機制上，我認為一定要再做更多的要求。"],["柯委員志恩：部長，你說中央跟地方，地方有很多的學校，特別是雙語的學校，當有人進來的時候，特別把臺語的播音改成英文，就只有那麼一小小段時間，所以這個就是往往一個政策出來的時候，就有非常多表面性的東西出現，而這種表面性的東西讓第一線的老師苦不堪言，然後讓我們的學生在整個競爭上面其實並沒有得到更大的好處。"],["潘部長文忠：這一段就是我剛才跟召委說我們要去處理，另外，學生在學習上，其實我們要強化的是希望他是在日常的生活當中、在情境裡面去學習，這是臺灣孩子……像我自己也是，過去在學習上真的是在應付考試居多啦！這一次在執行上，我們也一直在提醒學校是從生活當中去接觸語言跟學習，而不是最後還是把它限縮到孩子變成過度被挑錯，反而是不敢講、不敢說，這個……"],["柯委員志恩：但是你要在生活中去做學習，如果連師資、老師都沒有辦法做到，部長，你這個東西對我們來說還是一個非常大的空話。"],["潘部長文忠：為什麼我一直說會引進部分的外師跟外籍教學助理，其實某種程度……"],["柯委員志恩：目前為止還是不夠的，從過去到現在都還是不夠的。"],["潘部長文忠：所以我跟召委報告，為什麼這個政策我在執行上叫做準備好的先行，你根本都沒有師資，你說你要推雙語，這是不可行的事啦！"],["柯委員志恩：所以部長，這也驗證了目前為止還是沒有準備好，未來到2030年你還有5年的時間……"],["潘部長文忠：我應該這樣子說，已經準備好的學校，現在就按照計畫在上路，還沒有準備好的學校，我們請它開始做相關的準備。"],["柯委員志恩：準備好的學校，某種程度對我來說數量太少，而且沒有如你所想像的部分，教育部應該更審慎。"],["潘部長文忠：這個部分我們會持續的注意跟滾動做調整。"],["柯委員志恩：好，謝謝部長。"],["潘部長文忠：謝謝召委。"],["主席：謝謝柯志恩委員。"],["主席（柯委員志恩）：謝謝。我們現在請萬美玲委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":322,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-2","speakers":["柯志恩","陳培瑜","洪孟楷","吳沛憶","萬美玲","范雲","葛如鈞","郭昱晴","羅廷瑋","陳秀寳","林倩綺","林宜瑾","吳春城","張雅琳","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","楊瓊瓔","羅智強","王鴻薇","蔡易餘","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","呂玉玲"],"page_start":251,"meetingDate":["2024-03-04"],"gazette_id":"1130801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1130801_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請教育部部長潘文忠列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1130801_00005"}},"transcript":{"id":"149201","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149201","tool":"pyannote","id":"149201-pyannote"},"job_id":"CcFq74ufLhhDgHPi","queued_at":"2024-06-02 13:14:50","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2024-06-02 13:15:44","msg":"downloading https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149201"},{"time":"2024-06-02 13:15:45","msg":"downloading https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/ad9f873b941d2ddd4cd6e2370afa1c5ebaff13691fd5102b22d86b98097ac83e75552f8ea93320f75ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8"},{"time":"2024-06-02 13:16:07","msg":"converting mp4 to wav"},{"time":"2024-06-02 13:16:09","msg":"running pyannote"},{"time":"2024-06-02 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00:00:19,105\n謝謝張維關心,我想這個是新任總統的還有院長的職權是,我這樣子提問最主要是希望不要讓教育部每個人都有所謂的代退的一個心態或者剩下未來的70當天我們就會變成質詢,變成教育大家談這就不是我們所希望能夠做到的\n\n3\n00:00:35,129 --> 00:00:43,994\n那既然是如此的話那要上緊發條我認為這個是非常重要的所以請問部長你當初所承諾的這個所謂的學生輔導法跟營養午餐的專法這個會期可不可以在520之前送到我們立法院\n\n4\n00:00:52,098 --> 00:00:56,221\n我跟趙偉報告一下這兩個關心的法案學生輔導法教育部現在已經送到行政院在進行相關的審議當然這裡面還要匯集相關縣市團體的意見因為部長你特別提到說你會在這個會期的時候送到所以我只是要弄對我說學生輔導法的進程\n\n5\n00:01:13,314 --> 00:01:34,826\n關於午餐專法的部分教育部近期就會送到行政院做相關的審議那這部分也跟院長還有政委那邊來報告外界都很關注各界都很關注沒有錯所以我就是不斷的希望大家能夠上緊發條在520之前該做完的事情大家能夠把它來做一個持續那我為什麼剛剛問到續任的問題因為\n\n6\n00:01:36,567 --> 00:01:47,678\n最近有個獨派非常建議賴清德能夠找到一個所謂具有臺灣主體意識的人來當教育部長部長你覺得這樣的一個說法你自己個人認為怎麼樣\n\n7\n00:01:49,041 --> 00:02:17,321\n我跟趙偉報告,因為趙偉也是教育人,也了解到教育就是教育,教育還是要以特別學生受教,學生是一個主體我想這些年教育部,我自己個人也都是以這樣的方式來規劃相關政策沒有錯,所以部長你在未來,如果你沒有續任,你在跟新部長交接的時候你是否會把你剛剛所提到的不要在我們教育裡面搞政治這樣的一個初衷也能夠持續的告訴我們的新部長\n\n8\n00:02:18,081 --> 00:02:19,002\n教育部長潘文忠列席報告\n\n9\n00:02:44,300 --> 00:02:45,061\n獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得\n\n10\n00:03:08,601 --> 00:03:09,642\n但是還有另外一件事情也是我在我\n\n11\n00:03:23,993 --> 00:03:31,761\n第9任召委任內的時候呢但是部長也特別提到了希望能夠呼應我們體育界希望能夠有一個室內的田徑的一個場地部長這是非常重要當時候我們在第9屆的時候呢部長特別提到會找地\n\n12\n00:03:39,750 --> 00:03:44,332\n然後呢我們可以往下面去看現在連我們臨近的經濟條件比不上我們的越南他都我們非常的羨慕他都可以舉辦亞洲的室內田徑場就你看看我們這些的球員我們這邊的田徑選手而且呢那時候呢體育署答應掃地但是體育署沒有辦法補助所以高教署也只能補助三分之二目前就在林口體育那時候我們找到的是我們的林口體大那也就是我們的署長當時候就是我們的這個校長\n\n13\n00:04:09,261 --> 00:04:18,331\n那你現在是署長你也承諾你要好好做這樣的一個事情可是很顯然還缺3億3億對於很多的田徑學小說是非常重要的難道沒有辦法解決嗎部長\n\n14\n00:04:41,579 --> 00:04:46,125\n對,但是部長差3億而已從那時候講到現在才差3億那我也跟昭緯報告因為我說這個是必要的運動設施所以在國體好像一直在溝通沒有很具體的進展那現在會有國訓中心因為國訓中心終究是我們什麼時候可以完成這樣的一個方向\n\n15\n00:05:00,802 --> 00:05:00,902\n國訓計畫執行部長\n\n16\n00:05:19,878 --> 00:05:22,879\n一份學習地程檔案通常都會有三位教授來去看,一個人通常可以拿到50塊\n\n17\n00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:43,260\n獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得\n\n18\n00:06:12,512 --> 00:06:15,055\n但是這就是一個事實而且你全部打進去google可以滿天飛難道教育部完全沒有任何的作為就讓這件事情來告訴大家你不要去相信這些難道就這樣可以嗎你覺得大學老師真的就可以看得出來學習地勢要拿針跟子講嗎\n\n19\n00:06:28,616 --> 00:06:29,197\n李瑞玲是108課綱的第一屆孩子幾位也都是一直在擔任參與的老師們\n\n20\n00:06:49,136 --> 00:07:01,584\n我覺得宣導這件事情教育部一定要再持續努力因為我想稍微知道家長信或不信這一件事情是一個很關鍵的部長我現在只是告訴你這件事情目前在家長圈已經造成非常大家的對於這個學習歷程檔案的一個軍備我只是告訴部長一個實情當你發生這樣的狀況的時候呢\n\n21\n00:07:12,631 --> 00:07:18,714\n教育部沒有辦法就像我說的你沒有辦法要求數位部或其他相互會的這樣的部會共同來讓家長安心嗎數位部打仗無能難道教育部對於要下架這一些所謂隨時可以看到在網站的這些業者難道一點辦法都沒有嗎一點對於代謝這樣的一件事情完全沒有辦法有作為只是勸告嗎\n\n22\n00:07:34,161 --> 00:07:51,540\n各位報告,如果有察覺到這個有關民間的這些廣告或平台教育部是會確實去去喊做要求要下架了現在有沒有下架呢?沒有喔現在你Google打上去還是非常多喔他可能還是有一直在產生的這些想要從這當中去賺取利益的那你們怎麼做法?就是我們當然會去察覺啦\n\n23\n00:07:55,104 --> 00:07:55,824\n教育部要有所作為不要像數位部一樣\n\n24\n00:08:22,992 --> 00:08:44,445\n接下來還有因為這是義務報告所以我覺得很多事情我們會以後用專案來做一個處理有關英語雙語教育的一個問題這個賴清德當年當市長的時候在當台南市長的時候他特別提出來這個雙語所以我不曉得台南現在是已經變成這個所謂的第二官方語言的不知道但是呢部長4年的時間100億來推動2030的雙語政策你覺得目前為止成果如何\n\n25\n00:08:51,449 --> 00:08:54,812\n各位報告成果還是要從學生的學習表現那如果就大學的這部分因為有參與的相關的計畫會在今年做學生確實的一個你覺得大學英文因為你這樣子就變好嗎你不要問我這個大學老師你整個完全好像給你\n\n26\n00:09:09,042 --> 00:09:33,970\n委員我一直在強調語言的提升不可能一步到位所以為什麼我們一直在提醒也在審核都是因為你有相關的準備的計畫我們才會合以計畫也會合以相關的經費在中小學也如此但這部分我要跟趙薇也要報告一下縣市的部分當然熱烈反應跟求好心切這件事情也造成很多的狀況是什麼\n\n27\n00:09:35,430 --> 00:09:42,135\n但是還沒有聘進來是有小九學校說你已經叫做什麼雙語學校這個我認為不是對但是部長數字還是會說話嘛你目前申請的雙語學校有392校嘛這是審計部所特別提出來但是他卻報告出來幾乎有三成的學生還是沒有具備連國中階層的這個基本的能力都沒有你也很清楚如果你有到偏鄉去這個落差不是只有在數位的落差在語言的落差是非常大誠如部長你剛所提到的師資的確是沒有嘛\n\n28\n00:10:04,651 --> 00:10:21,566\n我們的本國的師資說實在我們拼外資來說的話是比本國的師資還多出4.4倍但是目前為止我們的人數幾乎你把它平均下來是每一個的每一校人數大概是不足以兩人這是一個師資非常大的問題但在這個原則之下我們又把這個所謂的雙語喊得滿天飛很多的第一線的老師都已經覺得目前孩子不僅是英文學不好\n\n29\n00:10:31,073 --> 00:10:43,981\n國語數學都學得不太好我知道之前範委員有特別提到還有很多時候在國文的真實當中也是以英文為當作非常大的一個主軸當你把英文變成一個主軸英文是個國際語言沒有問題但是我們所做的方式你花了4年100億到底有沒有達到這樣的效果而不是只有一個空的我們台灣將會變成是2030年一個雙語的學校不是而且我還跟部長講你還記不記得那時候我們有15個\n\n30\n00:10:58,870 --> 00:11:06,978\n我們下一頁有16個駐台的代表聯名來致函我們的行政院提出來雙語政策的一個擔憂當他覺得我們獨尊英文的時候他們認為除了楊格魯撒克遜之外的語言都完全會被會被完全簡略更不要說第一線的這些老師我只是告訴部長花了這麼多錢你覺得你的成效要帶到什麼地方\n\n31\n00:11:21,072 --> 00:11:39,858\n目前為止從過去的很多的報告裡面雙語的教育可以說是教育的民怨的排名第一名我覺得教育部有沒有一個比較更具體更務實的做法來面對否則我們孩子的競爭力是越來越低落不知道有沒有更具體的做法對於雙語的學校2030為什麼要特別提出來因為賴清德當上總統了他當初可以提出一個2030的這樣的一個目標我不曉得未來在整個教育的系統上面整個雙語的系統會變成什麼樣的一個局面\n\n32\n00:11:48,890 --> 00:12:07,041\n我跟趙偉報告我想在教育推動對於食物的推動怎麼樣才是可以更達成這個效益尤其是語言的這部分我剛剛為什麼一直在說教育部會去審核學校所提的計畫是會去看它各面向但這部分我想在中小學的部分我真的要跟趙偉說\n\n33\n00:12:09,002 --> 00:12:18,410\n中央跟地方在整個處理的機制上我認為一定要再做更多的要求部長我還提出你說中央跟地方地方有很多的學校特別是雙語的學校當有人進來的時候他特別把台語的播音改成英文就是那麼一小小的事件\n\n34\n00:12:24,275 --> 00:12:36,204\n所以這個就是一個往往一個政策出來的時候就有非常多的表面性的東西出現而這種表面性的東西讓第1屆的老師不敢言然後讓我們的學生其實在這整個競爭上面其實並沒有得到更大的好處我剛才跟趙偉說我們要去處理另外一個當然就是說學生在學習上其實我們要強化的不是希望他是在日常的生活當中在情境裡面這是台灣孩子像我自己也是過去在學習上真的在應付考試的居多\n\n35\n00:12:54,198 --> 00:12:54,238\n委員問什麼?\n\n36\n00:13:16,425 --> 00:13:20,386\n所以我跟召委報告為什麼這個政策我在執行上叫做準備好的先行你根本都沒有失職你說你要推雙語這是不可行的事啦\n\n37\n00:13:35,230 --> 00:13:35,370\n謝謝柯志恩委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5139\t14372\t致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,\n16144\t19105\t謝謝張維關心,我想這個是新任總統的還有院長的職權是,我這樣子提問最主要是希望不要讓教育部每個人都有所謂的代退的一個心態或者剩下未來的70當天我們就會變成質詢,變成教育大家談這就不是我們所希望能夠做到的\n35129\t43994\t那既然是如此的話那要上緊發條我認為這個是非常重要的所以請問部長你當初所承諾的這個所謂的學生輔導法跟營養午餐的專法這個會期可不可以在520之前送到我們立法院\n52098\t56221\t我跟趙偉報告一下這兩個關心的法案學生輔導法教育部現在已經送到行政院在進行相關的審議當然這裡面還要匯集相關縣市團體的意見因為部長你特別提到說你會在這個會期的時候送到所以我只是要弄對我說學生輔導法的進程\n73314\t94826\t關於午餐專法的部分教育部近期就會送到行政院做相關的審議那這部分也跟院長還有政委那邊來報告外界都很關注各界都很關注沒有錯所以我就是不斷的希望大家能夠上緊發條在520之前該做完的事情大家能夠把它來做一個持續那我為什麼剛剛問到續任的問題因為\n96567\t107678\t最近有個獨派非常建議賴清德能夠找到一個所謂具有臺灣主體意識的人來當教育部長部長你覺得這樣的一個說法你自己個人認為怎麼樣\n109041\t137321\t我跟趙偉報告,因為趙偉也是教育人,也了解到教育就是教育,教育還是要以特別學生受教,學生是一個主體我想這些年教育部,我自己個人也都是以這樣的方式來規劃相關政策沒有錯,所以部長你在未來,如果你沒有續任,你在跟新部長交接的時候你是否會把你剛剛所提到的不要在我們教育裡面搞政治這樣的一個初衷也能夠持續的告訴我們的新部長\n138081\t139002\t教育部長潘文忠列席報告\n164300\t165061\t獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得\n188601\t189642\t但是還有另外一件事情也是我在我\n203993\t211761\t第9任召委任內的時候呢但是部長也特別提到了希望能夠呼應我們體育界希望能夠有一個室內的田徑的一個場地部長這是非常重要當時候我們在第9屆的時候呢部長特別提到會找地\n219750\t224332\t然後呢我們可以往下面去看現在連我們臨近的經濟條件比不上我們的越南他都我們非常的羨慕他都可以舉辦亞洲的室內田徑場就你看看我們這些的球員我們這邊的田徑選手而且呢那時候呢體育署答應掃地但是體育署沒有辦法補助所以高教署也只能補助三分之二目前就在林口體育那時候我們找到的是我們的林口體大那也就是我們的署長當時候就是我們的這個校長\n249261\t258331\t那你現在是署長你也承諾你要好好做這樣的一個事情可是很顯然還缺3億3億對於很多的田徑學小說是非常重要的難道沒有辦法解決嗎部長\n259497\t281459\t總務長 總務長\n281579\t286125\t對,但是部長差3億而已從那時候講到現在才差3億那我也跟昭緯報告因為我說這個是必要的運動設施所以在國體好像一直在溝通沒有很具體的進展那現在會有國訓中心因為國訓中心終究是我們什麼時候可以完成這樣的一個方向\n300802\t300902\t國訓計畫執行部長\n319878\t322879\t一份學習地程檔案通常都會有三位教授來去看,一個人通常可以拿到50塊\n343080\t343260\t獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得\n372512\t375055\t但是這就是一個事實而且你全部打進去google可以滿天飛難道教育部完全沒有任何的作為就讓這件事情來告訴大家你不要去相信這些難道就這樣可以嗎你覺得大學老師真的就可以看得出來學習地勢要拿針跟子講嗎\n388616\t389197\t李瑞玲是108課綱的第一屆孩子幾位也都是一直在擔任參與的老師們\n409136\t421584\t我覺得宣導這件事情教育部一定要再持續努力因為我想稍微知道家長信或不信這一件事情是一個很關鍵的部長我現在只是告訴你這件事情目前在家長圈已經造成非常大家的對於這個學習歷程檔案的一個軍備我只是告訴部長一個實情當你發生這樣的狀況的時候呢\n432631\t438714\t教育部沒有辦法就像我說的你沒有辦法要求數位部或其他相互會的這樣的部會共同來讓家長安心嗎數位部打仗無能難道教育部對於要下架這一些所謂隨時可以看到在網站的這些業者難道一點辦法都沒有嗎一點對於代謝這樣的一件事情完全沒有辦法有作為只是勸告嗎\n454161\t471540\t各位報告,如果有察覺到這個有關民間的這些廣告或平台教育部是會確實去去喊做要求要下架了現在有沒有下架呢?沒有喔現在你Google打上去還是非常多喔他可能還是有一直在產生的這些想要從這當中去賺取利益的那你們怎麼做法?就是我們當然會去察覺啦\n475104\t475824\t教育部要有所作為不要像數位部一樣\n502992\t524445\t接下來還有因為這是義務報告所以我覺得很多事情我們會以後用專案來做一個處理有關英語雙語教育的一個問題這個賴清德當年當市長的時候在當台南市長的時候他特別提出來這個雙語所以我不曉得台南現在是已經變成這個所謂的第二官方語言的不知道但是呢部長4年的時間100億來推動2030的雙語政策你覺得目前為止成果如何\n531449\t534812\t各位報告成果還是要從學生的學習表現那如果就大學的這部分因為有參與的相關的計畫會在今年做學生確實的一個你覺得大學英文因為你這樣子就變好嗎你不要問我這個大學老師你整個完全好像給你\n549042\t573970\t委員我一直在強調語言的提升不可能一步到位所以為什麼我們一直在提醒也在審核都是因為你有相關的準備的計畫我們才會合以計畫也會合以相關的經費在中小學也如此但這部分我要跟趙薇也要報告一下縣市的部分當然熱烈反應跟求好心切這件事情也造成很多的狀況是什麼\n575430\t582135\t但是還沒有聘進來是有小九學校說你已經叫做什麼雙語學校這個我認為不是對但是部長數字還是會說話嘛你目前申請的雙語學校有392校嘛這是審計部所特別提出來但是他卻報告出來幾乎有三成的學生還是沒有具備連國中階層的這個基本的能力都沒有你也很清楚如果你有到偏鄉去這個落差不是只有在數位的落差在語言的落差是非常大誠如部長你剛所提到的師資的確是沒有嘛\n604651\t621566\t我們的本國的師資說實在我們拼外資來說的話是比本國的師資還多出4.4倍但是目前為止我們的人數幾乎你把它平均下來是每一個的每一校人數大概是不足以兩人這是一個師資非常大的問題但在這個原則之下我們又把這個所謂的雙語喊得滿天飛很多的第一線的老師都已經覺得目前孩子不僅是英文學不好\n631073\t643981\t國語數學都學得不太好我知道之前範委員有特別提到還有很多時候在國文的真實當中也是以英文為當作非常大的一個主軸當你把英文變成一個主軸英文是個國際語言沒有問題但是我們所做的方式你花了4年100億到底有沒有達到這樣的效果而不是只有一個空的我們台灣將會變成是2030年一個雙語的學校不是而且我還跟部長講你還記不記得那時候我們有15個\n658870\t666978\t我們下一頁有16個駐台的代表聯名來致函我們的行政院提出來雙語政策的一個擔憂當他覺得我們獨尊英文的時候他們認為除了楊格魯撒克遜之外的語言都完全會被會被完全簡略更不要說第一線的這些老師我只是告訴部長花了這麼多錢你覺得你的成效要帶到什麼地方\n681072\t699858\t目前為止從過去的很多的報告裡面雙語的教育可以說是教育的民怨的排名第一名我覺得教育部有沒有一個比較更具體更務實的做法來面對否則我們孩子的競爭力是越來越低落不知道有沒有更具體的做法對於雙語的學校2030為什麼要特別提出來因為賴清德當上總統了他當初可以提出一個2030的這樣的一個目標我不曉得未來在整個教育的系統上面整個雙語的系統會變成什麼樣的一個局面\n708890\t727041\t我跟趙偉報告我想在教育推動對於食物的推動怎麼樣才是可以更達成這個效益尤其是語言的這部分我剛剛為什麼一直在說教育部會去審核學校所提的計畫是會去看它各面向但這部分我想在中小學的部分我真的要跟趙偉說\n729002\t738410\t中央跟地方在整個處理的機制上我認為一定要再做更多的要求部長我還提出你說中央跟地方地方有很多的學校特別是雙語的學校當有人進來的時候他特別把台語的播音改成英文就是那麼一小小的事件\n744275\t756204\t所以這個就是一個往往一個政策出來的時候就有非常多的表面性的東西出現而這種表面性的東西讓第1屆的老師不敢言然後讓我們的學生其實在這整個競爭上面其實並沒有得到更大的好處我剛才跟趙偉說我們要去處理另外一個當然就是說學生在學習上其實我們要強化的不是希望他是在日常的生活當中在情境裡面這是台灣孩子像我自己也是過去在學習上真的在應付考試的居多\n774198\t774238\t委員問什麼?\n796425\t800386\t所以我跟召委報告為什麼這個政策我在執行上叫做準備好的先行你根本都沒有失職你說你要推雙語這是不可行的事啦\n815230\t815370\t謝謝柯志恩委員\n","txt":"致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,\n謝謝張維關心,我想這個是新任總統的還有院長的職權是,我這樣子提問最主要是希望不要讓教育部每個人都有所謂的代退的一個心態或者剩下未來的70當天我們就會變成質詢,變成教育大家談這就不是我們所希望能夠做到的\n那既然是如此的話那要上緊發條我認為這個是非常重要的所以請問部長你當初所承諾的這個所謂的學生輔導法跟營養午餐的專法這個會期可不可以在520之前送到我們立法院\n我跟趙偉報告一下這兩個關心的法案學生輔導法教育部現在已經送到行政院在進行相關的審議當然這裡面還要匯集相關縣市團體的意見因為部長你特別提到說你會在這個會期的時候送到所以我只是要弄對我說學生輔導法的進程\n關於午餐專法的部分教育部近期就會送到行政院做相關的審議那這部分也跟院長還有政委那邊來報告外界都很關注各界都很關注沒有錯所以我就是不斷的希望大家能夠上緊發條在520之前該做完的事情大家能夠把它來做一個持續那我為什麼剛剛問到續任的問題因為\n最近有個獨派非常建議賴清德能夠找到一個所謂具有臺灣主體意識的人來當教育部長部長你覺得這樣的一個說法你自己個人認為怎麼樣\n我跟趙偉報告,因為趙偉也是教育人,也了解到教育就是教育,教育還是要以特別學生受教,學生是一個主體我想這些年教育部,我自己個人也都是以這樣的方式來規劃相關政策沒有錯,所以部長你在未來,如果你沒有續任,你在跟新部長交接的時候你是否會把你剛剛所提到的不要在我們教育裡面搞政治這樣的一個初衷也能夠持續的告訴我們的新部長\n教育部長潘文忠列席報告\n獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得\n但是還有另外一件事情也是我在我\n第9任召委任內的時候呢但是部長也特別提到了希望能夠呼應我們體育界希望能夠有一個室內的田徑的一個場地部長這是非常重要當時候我們在第9屆的時候呢部長特別提到會找地\n然後呢我們可以往下面去看現在連我們臨近的經濟條件比不上我們的越南他都我們非常的羨慕他都可以舉辦亞洲的室內田徑場就你看看我們這些的球員我們這邊的田徑選手而且呢那時候呢體育署答應掃地但是體育署沒有辦法補助所以高教署也只能補助三分之二目前就在林口體育那時候我們找到的是我們的林口體大那也就是我們的署長當時候就是我們的這個校長\n那你現在是署長你也承諾你要好好做這樣的一個事情可是很顯然還缺3億3億對於很多的田徑學小說是非常重要的難道沒有辦法解決嗎部長\n總務長 總務長\n對,但是部長差3億而已從那時候講到現在才差3億那我也跟昭緯報告因為我說這個是必要的運動設施所以在國體好像一直在溝通沒有很具體的進展那現在會有國訓中心因為國訓中心終究是我們什麼時候可以完成這樣的一個方向\n國訓計畫執行部長\n一份學習地程檔案通常都會有三位教授來去看,一個人通常可以拿到50塊\n獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得\n但是這就是一個事實而且你全部打進去google可以滿天飛難道教育部完全沒有任何的作為就讓這件事情來告訴大家你不要去相信這些難道就這樣可以嗎你覺得大學老師真的就可以看得出來學習地勢要拿針跟子講嗎\n李瑞玲是108課綱的第一屆孩子幾位也都是一直在擔任參與的老師們\n我覺得宣導這件事情教育部一定要再持續努力因為我想稍微知道家長信或不信這一件事情是一個很關鍵的部長我現在只是告訴你這件事情目前在家長圈已經造成非常大家的對於這個學習歷程檔案的一個軍備我只是告訴部長一個實情當你發生這樣的狀況的時候呢\n教育部沒有辦法就像我說的你沒有辦法要求數位部或其他相互會的這樣的部會共同來讓家長安心嗎數位部打仗無能難道教育部對於要下架這一些所謂隨時可以看到在網站的這些業者難道一點辦法都沒有嗎一點對於代謝這樣的一件事情完全沒有辦法有作為只是勸告嗎\n各位報告,如果有察覺到這個有關民間的這些廣告或平台教育部是會確實去去喊做要求要下架了現在有沒有下架呢?沒有喔現在你Google打上去還是非常多喔他可能還是有一直在產生的這些想要從這當中去賺取利益的那你們怎麼做法?就是我們當然會去察覺啦\n教育部要有所作為不要像數位部一樣\n接下來還有因為這是義務報告所以我覺得很多事情我們會以後用專案來做一個處理有關英語雙語教育的一個問題這個賴清德當年當市長的時候在當台南市長的時候他特別提出來這個雙語所以我不曉得台南現在是已經變成這個所謂的第二官方語言的不知道但是呢部長4年的時間100億來推動2030的雙語政策你覺得目前為止成果如何\n各位報告成果還是要從學生的學習表現那如果就大學的這部分因為有參與的相關的計畫會在今年做學生確實的一個你覺得大學英文因為你這樣子就變好嗎你不要問我這個大學老師你整個完全好像給你\n委員我一直在強調語言的提升不可能一步到位所以為什麼我們一直在提醒也在審核都是因為你有相關的準備的計畫我們才會合以計畫也會合以相關的經費在中小學也如此但這部分我要跟趙薇也要報告一下縣市的部分當然熱烈反應跟求好心切這件事情也造成很多的狀況是什麼\n但是還沒有聘進來是有小九學校說你已經叫做什麼雙語學校這個我認為不是對但是部長數字還是會說話嘛你目前申請的雙語學校有392校嘛這是審計部所特別提出來但是他卻報告出來幾乎有三成的學生還是沒有具備連國中階層的這個基本的能力都沒有你也很清楚如果你有到偏鄉去這個落差不是只有在數位的落差在語言的落差是非常大誠如部長你剛所提到的師資的確是沒有嘛\n我們的本國的師資說實在我們拼外資來說的話是比本國的師資還多出4.4倍但是目前為止我們的人數幾乎你把它平均下來是每一個的每一校人數大概是不足以兩人這是一個師資非常大的問題但在這個原則之下我們又把這個所謂的雙語喊得滿天飛很多的第一線的老師都已經覺得目前孩子不僅是英文學不好\n國語數學都學得不太好我知道之前範委員有特別提到還有很多時候在國文的真實當中也是以英文為當作非常大的一個主軸當你把英文變成一個主軸英文是個國際語言沒有問題但是我們所做的方式你花了4年100億到底有沒有達到這樣的效果而不是只有一個空的我們台灣將會變成是2030年一個雙語的學校不是而且我還跟部長講你還記不記得那時候我們有15個\n我們下一頁有16個駐台的代表聯名來致函我們的行政院提出來雙語政策的一個擔憂當他覺得我們獨尊英文的時候他們認為除了楊格魯撒克遜之外的語言都完全會被會被完全簡略更不要說第一線的這些老師我只是告訴部長花了這麼多錢你覺得你的成效要帶到什麼地方\n目前為止從過去的很多的報告裡面雙語的教育可以說是教育的民怨的排名第一名我覺得教育部有沒有一個比較更具體更務實的做法來面對否則我們孩子的競爭力是越來越低落不知道有沒有更具體的做法對於雙語的學校2030為什麼要特別提出來因為賴清德當上總統了他當初可以提出一個2030的這樣的一個目標我不曉得未來在整個教育的系統上面整個雙語的系統會變成什麼樣的一個局面\n我跟趙偉報告我想在教育推動對於食物的推動怎麼樣才是可以更達成這個效益尤其是語言的這部分我剛剛為什麼一直在說教育部會去審核學校所提的計畫是會去看它各面向但這部分我想在中小學的部分我真的要跟趙偉說\n中央跟地方在整個處理的機制上我認為一定要再做更多的要求部長我還提出你說中央跟地方地方有很多的學校特別是雙語的學校當有人進來的時候他特別把台語的播音改成英文就是那麼一小小的事件\n所以這個就是一個往往一個政策出來的時候就有非常多的表面性的東西出現而這種表面性的東西讓第1屆的老師不敢言然後讓我們的學生其實在這整個競爭上面其實並沒有得到更大的好處我剛才跟趙偉說我們要去處理另外一個當然就是說學生在學習上其實我們要強化的不是希望他是在日常的生活當中在情境裡面這是台灣孩子像我自己也是過去在學習上真的在應付考試的居多\n委員問什麼?\n所以我跟召委報告為什麼這個政策我在執行上叫做準備好的先行你根本都沒有失職你說你要推雙語這是不可行的事啦\n謝謝柯志恩委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.139 --> 00:14.372\n致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,\n\n00:16.144 --> 00:19.105\n謝謝張維關心,我想這個是新任總統的還有院長的職權是,我這樣子提問最主要是希望不要讓教育部每個人都有所謂的代退的一個心態或者剩下未來的70當天我們就會變成質詢,變成教育大家談這就不是我們所希望能夠做到的\n\n00:35.129 --> 00:43.994\n那既然是如此的話那要上緊發條我認為這個是非常重要的所以請問部長你當初所承諾的這個所謂的學生輔導法跟營養午餐的專法這個會期可不可以在520之前送到我們立法院\n\n00:52.098 --> 00:56.221\n我跟趙偉報告一下這兩個關心的法案學生輔導法教育部現在已經送到行政院在進行相關的審議當然這裡面還要匯集相關縣市團體的意見因為部長你特別提到說你會在這個會期的時候送到所以我只是要弄對我說學生輔導法的進程\n\n01:13.314 --> 01:34.826\n關於午餐專法的部分教育部近期就會送到行政院做相關的審議那這部分也跟院長還有政委那邊來報告外界都很關注各界都很關注沒有錯所以我就是不斷的希望大家能夠上緊發條在520之前該做完的事情大家能夠把它來做一個持續那我為什麼剛剛問到續任的問題因為\n\n01:36.567 --> 01:47.678\n最近有個獨派非常建議賴清德能夠找到一個所謂具有臺灣主體意識的人來當教育部長部長你覺得這樣的一個說法你自己個人認為怎麼樣\n\n01:49.041 --> 02:17.321\n我跟趙偉報告,因為趙偉也是教育人,也了解到教育就是教育,教育還是要以特別學生受教,學生是一個主體我想這些年教育部,我自己個人也都是以這樣的方式來規劃相關政策沒有錯,所以部長你在未來,如果你沒有續任,你在跟新部長交接的時候你是否會把你剛剛所提到的不要在我們教育裡面搞政治這樣的一個初衷也能夠持續的告訴我們的新部長\n\n02:18.081 --> 02:19.002\n教育部長潘文忠列席報告\n\n02:44.300 --> 02:45.061\n獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得\n\n03:08.601 --> 03:09.642\n但是還有另外一件事情也是我在我\n\n03:23.993 --> 03:31.761\n第9任召委任內的時候呢但是部長也特別提到了希望能夠呼應我們體育界希望能夠有一個室內的田徑的一個場地部長這是非常重要當時候我們在第9屆的時候呢部長特別提到會找地\n\n03:39.750 --> 03:44.332\n然後呢我們可以往下面去看現在連我們臨近的經濟條件比不上我們的越南他都我們非常的羨慕他都可以舉辦亞洲的室內田徑場就你看看我們這些的球員我們這邊的田徑選手而且呢那時候呢體育署答應掃地但是體育署沒有辦法補助所以高教署也只能補助三分之二目前就在林口體育那時候我們找到的是我們的林口體大那也就是我們的署長當時候就是我們的這個校長\n\n04:09.261 --> 04:18.331\n那你現在是署長你也承諾你要好好做這樣的一個事情可是很顯然還缺3億3億對於很多的田徑學小說是非常重要的難道沒有辦法解決嗎部長\n\n04:41.579 --> 04:46.125\n對,但是部長差3億而已從那時候講到現在才差3億那我也跟昭緯報告因為我說這個是必要的運動設施所以在國體好像一直在溝通沒有很具體的進展那現在會有國訓中心因為國訓中心終究是我們什麼時候可以完成這樣的一個方向\n\n05:00.802 --> 05:00.902\n國訓計畫執行部長\n\n05:19.878 --> 05:22.879\n一份學習地程檔案通常都會有三位教授來去看,一個人通常可以拿到50塊\n\n05:43.080 --> 05:43.260\n獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得\n\n06:12.512 --> 06:15.055\n但是這就是一個事實而且你全部打進去google可以滿天飛難道教育部完全沒有任何的作為就讓這件事情來告訴大家你不要去相信這些難道就這樣可以嗎你覺得大學老師真的就可以看得出來學習地勢要拿針跟子講嗎\n\n06:28.616 --> 06:29.197\n李瑞玲是108課綱的第一屆孩子幾位也都是一直在擔任參與的老師們\n\n06:49.136 --> 07:01.584\n我覺得宣導這件事情教育部一定要再持續努力因為我想稍微知道家長信或不信這一件事情是一個很關鍵的部長我現在只是告訴你這件事情目前在家長圈已經造成非常大家的對於這個學習歷程檔案的一個軍備我只是告訴部長一個實情當你發生這樣的狀況的時候呢\n\n07:12.631 --> 07:18.714\n教育部沒有辦法就像我說的你沒有辦法要求數位部或其他相互會的這樣的部會共同來讓家長安心嗎數位部打仗無能難道教育部對於要下架這一些所謂隨時可以看到在網站的這些業者難道一點辦法都沒有嗎一點對於代謝這樣的一件事情完全沒有辦法有作為只是勸告嗎\n\n07:34.161 --> 07:51.540\n各位報告,如果有察覺到這個有關民間的這些廣告或平台教育部是會確實去去喊做要求要下架了現在有沒有下架呢?沒有喔現在你Google打上去還是非常多喔他可能還是有一直在產生的這些想要從這當中去賺取利益的那你們怎麼做法?就是我們當然會去察覺啦\n\n07:55.104 --> 07:55.824\n教育部要有所作為不要像數位部一樣\n\n08:22.992 --> 08:44.445\n接下來還有因為這是義務報告所以我覺得很多事情我們會以後用專案來做一個處理有關英語雙語教育的一個問題這個賴清德當年當市長的時候在當台南市長的時候他特別提出來這個雙語所以我不曉得台南現在是已經變成這個所謂的第二官方語言的不知道但是呢部長4年的時間100億來推動2030的雙語政策你覺得目前為止成果如何\n\n08:51.449 --> 08:54.812\n各位報告成果還是要從學生的學習表現那如果就大學的這部分因為有參與的相關的計畫會在今年做學生確實的一個你覺得大學英文因為你這樣子就變好嗎你不要問我這個大學老師你整個完全好像給你\n\n09:09.042 --> 09:33.970\n委員我一直在強調語言的提升不可能一步到位所以為什麼我們一直在提醒也在審核都是因為你有相關的準備的計畫我們才會合以計畫也會合以相關的經費在中小學也如此但這部分我要跟趙薇也要報告一下縣市的部分當然熱烈反應跟求好心切這件事情也造成很多的狀況是什麼\n\n09:35.430 --> 09:42.135\n但是還沒有聘進來是有小九學校說你已經叫做什麼雙語學校這個我認為不是對但是部長數字還是會說話嘛你目前申請的雙語學校有392校嘛這是審計部所特別提出來但是他卻報告出來幾乎有三成的學生還是沒有具備連國中階層的這個基本的能力都沒有你也很清楚如果你有到偏鄉去這個落差不是只有在數位的落差在語言的落差是非常大誠如部長你剛所提到的師資的確是沒有嘛\n\n10:04.651 --> 10:21.566\n我們的本國的師資說實在我們拼外資來說的話是比本國的師資還多出4.4倍但是目前為止我們的人數幾乎你把它平均下來是每一個的每一校人數大概是不足以兩人這是一個師資非常大的問題但在這個原則之下我們又把這個所謂的雙語喊得滿天飛很多的第一線的老師都已經覺得目前孩子不僅是英文學不好\n\n10:31.073 --> 10:43.981\n國語數學都學得不太好我知道之前範委員有特別提到還有很多時候在國文的真實當中也是以英文為當作非常大的一個主軸當你把英文變成一個主軸英文是個國際語言沒有問題但是我們所做的方式你花了4年100億到底有沒有達到這樣的效果而不是只有一個空的我們台灣將會變成是2030年一個雙語的學校不是而且我還跟部長講你還記不記得那時候我們有15個\n\n10:58.870 --> 11:06.978\n我們下一頁有16個駐台的代表聯名來致函我們的行政院提出來雙語政策的一個擔憂當他覺得我們獨尊英文的時候他們認為除了楊格魯撒克遜之外的語言都完全會被會被完全簡略更不要說第一線的這些老師我只是告訴部長花了這麼多錢你覺得你的成效要帶到什麼地方\n\n11:21.072 --> 11:39.858\n目前為止從過去的很多的報告裡面雙語的教育可以說是教育的民怨的排名第一名我覺得教育部有沒有一個比較更具體更務實的做法來面對否則我們孩子的競爭力是越來越低落不知道有沒有更具體的做法對於雙語的學校2030為什麼要特別提出來因為賴清德當上總統了他當初可以提出一個2030的這樣的一個目標我不曉得未來在整個教育的系統上面整個雙語的系統會變成什麼樣的一個局面\n\n11:48.890 --> 12:07.041\n我跟趙偉報告我想在教育推動對於食物的推動怎麼樣才是可以更達成這個效益尤其是語言的這部分我剛剛為什麼一直在說教育部會去審核學校所提的計畫是會去看它各面向但這部分我想在中小學的部分我真的要跟趙偉說\n\n12:09.002 --> 12:18.410\n中央跟地方在整個處理的機制上我認為一定要再做更多的要求部長我還提出你說中央跟地方地方有很多的學校特別是雙語的學校當有人進來的時候他特別把台語的播音改成英文就是那麼一小小的事件\n\n12:24.275 --> 12:36.204\n所以這個就是一個往往一個政策出來的時候就有非常多的表面性的東西出現而這種表面性的東西讓第1屆的老師不敢言然後讓我們的學生其實在這整個競爭上面其實並沒有得到更大的好處我剛才跟趙偉說我們要去處理另外一個當然就是說學生在學習上其實我們要強化的不是希望他是在日常的生活當中在情境裡面這是台灣孩子像我自己也是過去在學習上真的在應付考試的居多\n\n12:54.198 --> 12:54.238\n委員問什麼?\n\n13:16.425 --> 13:20.386\n所以我跟召委報告為什麼這個政策我在執行上叫做準備好的先行你根本都沒有失職你說你要推雙語這是不可行的事啦\n\n13:35.230 --> 13:35.370\n謝謝柯志恩委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.139,"end":14.372,"text":"致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,我們是不是請潘部長?致謝昭偉,"},{"start":16.144,"end":19.105,"text":"謝謝張維關心,我想這個是新任總統的還有院長的職權是,我這樣子提問最主要是希望不要讓教育部每個人都有所謂的代退的一個心態或者剩下未來的70當天我們就會變成質詢,變成教育大家談這就不是我們所希望能夠做到的"},{"start":35.129,"end":43.994,"text":"那既然是如此的話那要上緊發條我認為這個是非常重要的所以請問部長你當初所承諾的這個所謂的學生輔導法跟營養午餐的專法這個會期可不可以在520之前送到我們立法院"},{"start":52.098,"end":56.221,"text":"我跟趙偉報告一下這兩個關心的法案學生輔導法教育部現在已經送到行政院在進行相關的審議當然這裡面還要匯集相關縣市團體的意見因為部長你特別提到說你會在這個會期的時候送到所以我只是要弄對我說學生輔導法的進程"},{"start":73.314,"end":94.826,"text":"關於午餐專法的部分教育部近期就會送到行政院做相關的審議那這部分也跟院長還有政委那邊來報告外界都很關注各界都很關注沒有錯所以我就是不斷的希望大家能夠上緊發條在520之前該做完的事情大家能夠把它來做一個持續那我為什麼剛剛問到續任的問題因為"},{"start":96.567,"end":107.678,"text":"最近有個獨派非常建議賴清德能夠找到一個所謂具有臺灣主體意識的人來當教育部長部長你覺得這樣的一個說法你自己個人認為怎麼樣"},{"start":109.041,"end":137.321,"text":"我跟趙偉報告,因為趙偉也是教育人,也了解到教育就是教育,教育還是要以特別學生受教,學生是一個主體我想這些年教育部,我自己個人也都是以這樣的方式來規劃相關政策沒有錯,所以部長你在未來,如果你沒有續任,你在跟新部長交接的時候你是否會把你剛剛所提到的不要在我們教育裡面搞政治這樣的一個初衷也能夠持續的告訴我們的新部長"},{"start":138.081,"end":139.002,"text":"教育部長潘文忠列席報告"},{"start":164.3,"end":165.061,"text":"獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得"},{"start":188.601,"end":189.642,"text":"但是還有另外一件事情也是我在我"},{"start":203.993,"end":211.761,"text":"第9任召委任內的時候呢但是部長也特別提到了希望能夠呼應我們體育界希望能夠有一個室內的田徑的一個場地部長這是非常重要當時候我們在第9屆的時候呢部長特別提到會找地"},{"start":219.75,"end":224.332,"text":"然後呢我們可以往下面去看現在連我們臨近的經濟條件比不上我們的越南他都我們非常的羨慕他都可以舉辦亞洲的室內田徑場就你看看我們這些的球員我們這邊的田徑選手而且呢那時候呢體育署答應掃地但是體育署沒有辦法補助所以高教署也只能補助三分之二目前就在林口體育那時候我們找到的是我們的林口體大那也就是我們的署長當時候就是我們的這個校長"},{"start":249.261,"end":258.331,"text":"那你現在是署長你也承諾你要好好做這樣的一個事情可是很顯然還缺3億3億對於很多的田徑學小說是非常重要的難道沒有辦法解決嗎部長"},{"start":259.497,"end":281.459,"text":"總務長 總務長"},{"start":281.579,"end":286.125,"text":"對,但是部長差3億而已從那時候講到現在才差3億那我也跟昭緯報告因為我說這個是必要的運動設施所以在國體好像一直在溝通沒有很具體的進展那現在會有國訓中心因為國訓中心終究是我們什麼時候可以完成這樣的一個方向"},{"start":300.802,"end":300.902,"text":"國訓計畫執行部長"},{"start":319.878,"end":322.879,"text":"一份學習地程檔案通常都會有三位教授來去看,一個人通常可以拿到50塊"},{"start":343.08,"end":343.26,"text":"獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得獲得"},{"start":372.512,"end":375.055,"text":"但是這就是一個事實而且你全部打進去google可以滿天飛難道教育部完全沒有任何的作為就讓這件事情來告訴大家你不要去相信這些難道就這樣可以嗎你覺得大學老師真的就可以看得出來學習地勢要拿針跟子講嗎"},{"start":388.616,"end":389.197,"text":"李瑞玲是108課綱的第一屆孩子幾位也都是一直在擔任參與的老師們"},{"start":409.136,"end":421.584,"text":"我覺得宣導這件事情教育部一定要再持續努力因為我想稍微知道家長信或不信這一件事情是一個很關鍵的部長我現在只是告訴你這件事情目前在家長圈已經造成非常大家的對於這個學習歷程檔案的一個軍備我只是告訴部長一個實情當你發生這樣的狀況的時候呢"},{"start":432.631,"end":438.714,"text":"教育部沒有辦法就像我說的你沒有辦法要求數位部或其他相互會的這樣的部會共同來讓家長安心嗎數位部打仗無能難道教育部對於要下架這一些所謂隨時可以看到在網站的這些業者難道一點辦法都沒有嗎一點對於代謝這樣的一件事情完全沒有辦法有作為只是勸告嗎"},{"start":454.161,"end":471.54,"text":"各位報告,如果有察覺到這個有關民間的這些廣告或平台教育部是會確實去去喊做要求要下架了現在有沒有下架呢?沒有喔現在你Google打上去還是非常多喔他可能還是有一直在產生的這些想要從這當中去賺取利益的那你們怎麼做法?就是我們當然會去察覺啦"},{"start":475.104,"end":475.824,"text":"教育部要有所作為不要像數位部一樣"},{"start":502.992,"end":524.445,"text":"接下來還有因為這是義務報告所以我覺得很多事情我們會以後用專案來做一個處理有關英語雙語教育的一個問題這個賴清德當年當市長的時候在當台南市長的時候他特別提出來這個雙語所以我不曉得台南現在是已經變成這個所謂的第二官方語言的不知道但是呢部長4年的時間100億來推動2030的雙語政策你覺得目前為止成果如何"},{"start":531.449,"end":534.812,"text":"各位報告成果還是要從學生的學習表現那如果就大學的這部分因為有參與的相關的計畫會在今年做學生確實的一個你覺得大學英文因為你這樣子就變好嗎你不要問我這個大學老師你整個完全好像給你"},{"start":549.042,"end":573.97,"text":"委員我一直在強調語言的提升不可能一步到位所以為什麼我們一直在提醒也在審核都是因為你有相關的準備的計畫我們才會合以計畫也會合以相關的經費在中小學也如此但這部分我要跟趙薇也要報告一下縣市的部分當然熱烈反應跟求好心切這件事情也造成很多的狀況是什麼"},{"start":575.43,"end":582.135,"text":"但是還沒有聘進來是有小九學校說你已經叫做什麼雙語學校這個我認為不是對但是部長數字還是會說話嘛你目前申請的雙語學校有392校嘛這是審計部所特別提出來但是他卻報告出來幾乎有三成的學生還是沒有具備連國中階層的這個基本的能力都沒有你也很清楚如果你有到偏鄉去這個落差不是只有在數位的落差在語言的落差是非常大誠如部長你剛所提到的師資的確是沒有嘛"},{"start":604.651,"end":621.566,"text":"我們的本國的師資說實在我們拼外資來說的話是比本國的師資還多出4.4倍但是目前為止我們的人數幾乎你把它平均下來是每一個的每一校人數大概是不足以兩人這是一個師資非常大的問題但在這個原則之下我們又把這個所謂的雙語喊得滿天飛很多的第一線的老師都已經覺得目前孩子不僅是英文學不好"},{"start":631.073,"end":643.981,"text":"國語數學都學得不太好我知道之前範委員有特別提到還有很多時候在國文的真實當中也是以英文為當作非常大的一個主軸當你把英文變成一個主軸英文是個國際語言沒有問題但是我們所做的方式你花了4年100億到底有沒有達到這樣的效果而不是只有一個空的我們台灣將會變成是2030年一個雙語的學校不是而且我還跟部長講你還記不記得那時候我們有15個"},{"start":658.87,"end":666.978,"text":"我們下一頁有16個駐台的代表聯名來致函我們的行政院提出來雙語政策的一個擔憂當他覺得我們獨尊英文的時候他們認為除了楊格魯撒克遜之外的語言都完全會被會被完全簡略更不要說第一線的這些老師我只是告訴部長花了這麼多錢你覺得你的成效要帶到什麼地方"},{"start":681.072,"end":699.858,"text":"目前為止從過去的很多的報告裡面雙語的教育可以說是教育的民怨的排名第一名我覺得教育部有沒有一個比較更具體更務實的做法來面對否則我們孩子的競爭力是越來越低落不知道有沒有更具體的做法對於雙語的學校2030為什麼要特別提出來因為賴清德當上總統了他當初可以提出一個2030的這樣的一個目標我不曉得未來在整個教育的系統上面整個雙語的系統會變成什麼樣的一個局面"},{"start":708.89,"end":727.041,"text":"我跟趙偉報告我想在教育推動對於食物的推動怎麼樣才是可以更達成這個效益尤其是語言的這部分我剛剛為什麼一直在說教育部會去審核學校所提的計畫是會去看它各面向但這部分我想在中小學的部分我真的要跟趙偉說"},{"start":729.002,"end":738.41,"text":"中央跟地方在整個處理的機制上我認為一定要再做更多的要求部長我還提出你說中央跟地方地方有很多的學校特別是雙語的學校當有人進來的時候他特別把台語的播音改成英文就是那麼一小小的事件"},{"start":744.275,"end":756.204,"text":"所以這個就是一個往往一個政策出來的時候就有非常多的表面性的東西出現而這種表面性的東西讓第1屆的老師不敢言然後讓我們的學生其實在這整個競爭上面其實並沒有得到更大的好處我剛才跟趙偉說我們要去處理另外一個當然就是說學生在學習上其實我們要強化的不是希望他是在日常的生活當中在情境裡面這是台灣孩子像我自己也是過去在學習上真的在應付考試的居多"},{"start":774.198,"end":774.238,"text":"委員問什麼?"},{"start":796.425,"end":800.386,"text":"所以我跟召委報告為什麼這個政策我在執行上叫做準備好的先行你根本都沒有失職你說你要推雙語這是不可行的事啦"},{"start":815.23,"end":815.37,"text":"謝謝柯志恩委員"}]}}}}