{"id":149225,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149225","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/ad9f873b941d2dddabe04fabd9903c0de0c93a942a018238f8ba9b0039caa7a6094ecae5687cafe55ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"吳秉叡","委員發言時間":"09:36:12 - 09:47:14","影片長度":"00:11:02","會議時間":"2024-03-04T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第2次全體委員會議（事由：邀請金融監督管理委員會黃主任委員天牧率所屬機關首長暨中央存款保險股份有限公司、監管相關機構有關之財團法人、臺灣證券交易所股份有限公司、臺灣期貨交易所股份有限公司、臺灣集中保管結算所股份有限公司等董事長、總經理列席業務報告，並備質詢。\n【3月4日及7日二天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第2次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":2,"committees":[20],"id":"委員會-11-1-20-2"},"date":"2024-03-04","duration":662,"end_time":"2024-03-04T09:47:14+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-04T09:36:12+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":131,"blocks":[["吳委員秉叡：（9時36分）主席，麻煩請金管會黃主委。"],["主席：有請黃主委。"],["黃主任委員天牧：委員早。"],["吳委員秉叡：主委好。比特幣最近又暴漲，3月2日又漲到六萬多塊，虛擬貨幣去年發生非常多的風險，也發生非常多的事件，既然現在金管會被政府指定為虛擬貨幣的管理機關、主管機關。主委，虛擬貨幣起伏這麼大，有人冒著高風險想要獲得高報酬，同時它的風險大，代表虧本的機會也很大，你有什麼樣的看法？"],["黃主任委員天牧：謝謝委員關心這樣一個重要的問題，其實對於虛擬資產，國際監理機關的看法都是覺得它有相當的風險投機性，但是因為投資人青睞，所以有很大量的投資，因為預期它有很高的漲幅，各國監理機關現在的態度都是要強化這方面的監理。我覺得虛擬資產最重要，大家要注意的就是它沒有內在價值，波動性很高，平台有風險，也有錢包的管理，這些都有很多顧慮。所以我們在去年9月有發布一些指導原則，希望投資人如果真的想投資，要先弄清楚那個商品的風險，並評估自己的風險承擔能力，謝謝。"],["吳委員秉叡：因為它沒有實質的資產，而是投資者信心的堆疊，我聽起來這個就是泡沫，在金融市場如果大家都持正面看法就會去堆疊，等哪一天氣球破的時候，後果會很嚴重。最近比特幣有這一波最大漲幅的原因是不是因為美國把它納入可以發行ETF，可以做ETF的買賣，最主要是不是因為這個原因？"],["黃主任委員天牧：其實美國證管會也是因為法院裁決，它原來是禁止，結果法院裁決這個禁止是不對的，所以才讓現貨的ETF上市，但是市場都覺得既然得到監理機關的肯認，所以就一窩蜂進去。另外一個原因應該是比特幣在今年4月份有一個自動減半的機制，讓大家覺得供應量可能變少了，所以需求就開始往上竄升。"],["吳委員秉叡：延續我剛剛講的那個問題，如果大家都一窩蜂進去的時候，它的漲幅當然就會很大，但是如果有一天出現了不利的消息，或是大家失去信心，它又會大量崩跌，以比特幣為例，其實已經有好幾波很大的跌幅跟很大的漲幅。我在這邊一再強調，也跟你已經報告過很多次，我觀察臺灣投資民眾的屬性，他賺錢不會感謝政府，但是賠錢大家就會怪政府，以前沒有指定管理機關，還可以講沒有機關管理，現在已經指定金管會為管理機關，如果有一些人去投資比特幣賠錢，在累積了很多人之後，就有可能去你的辦公室門口圍你，或要跟你抗議，出現這樣的狀況怎麼辦？"],["黃主任委員天牧：委員，我跟您報告，謝謝您給我這個機會說明。因為現在是一個網路世界，我們希望投資人真的覺得願意承擔這個風險、願意投資，這時應該是到向金管會申報洗錢防制聲明的這二十幾家平臺業者去投資，現在有很多境外的幣商或是沒有核准過的個人幣商，最好都不要透過那些平臺去投資。"],["吳委員秉叡：因為沒有實質資產，所以這個是虛擬的世界，相對的，還有實質資產現在要代幣化，有所謂RWA這樣的機制，美國也一邊在進行，這個部分你怎麼想呢？如果我們有提供更多的投資管道，在實質資產這種有東西、有憑藉的，你也把它代幣化，也是一樣可以像這樣來虛擬交易的時候，是不是可以產生替代的效果？不要讓那些人想要賺錢，但都去投在這種非常高風險的、虛擬的資產，所以實質的資產是不是要受到應當有的重視跟應當有的強化呢？"],["黃主任委員天牧：我跟委員報告，您垂詢到我們正在思考的一個重要政策，其實大家對虛幣、虛擬資產，除了它投資上可能帶來的漲幅之外，還有一個是它跟區塊鏈未來發展的連結。可是我們觀察國際的趨勢，像美國跟亞洲的新加坡，其實重點應該是在您剛才所提到RWA（Real World Assets），其中有實質經濟價值的金融資產代幣化，透過區塊鏈把它數位代幣化，這個是各國金融監理機關目前在注意的問題，金管會從半年前就已經開始重視金融資產代幣化的這個問題，而這個跟虛幣的管理是不同的邏輯，虛幣是從投資人保護去處理，可是實質資產代幣化是從區塊鏈的發展去處理。事實上，在今年年初記者會，我們也在資料中有特別記載，我們在今年下半年就會對於基金的代幣化，就是tokenization去做一些研究，現在證期局跟相關公會已經在研究了。"],["吳委員秉叡：從你管理的角度以及這個東西的屬性，當然這樣來講沒有錯，但是投資者有了閒錢要投資，可以有好幾種選擇，如果實質資產代幣化做得也可以很好，是不是至少可以替代掉一窩蜂搶進虛擬世界這樣的機會成本？"],["黃主任委員天牧：Yeah。"],["吳委員秉叡：第二點，就是實質資產的波動可能沒有辦法像虛擬世界，也沒有辦法像它這樣懸殊，但是相對也比較安全。其實在之前的不動產證券化就體現了這樣的概念，現在只是把更多的東西包裝，可以把它代幣化，讓它等於是可以證券化這樣的觀念。"],["黃主任委員天牧：是。"],["吳委員秉叡：重點是你願意開放哪一些資產可以讓它來代幣化呢？"],["黃主任委員天牧：我跟您報告，有關金融資產的代幣化（tokenization）的部分，包括美國跟亞洲這些重要國家，其實都還在試驗性質，因為它有可能產生一些金融穩定的顧慮，但是我們會朝這方向去處理、去研究，為什麼？它可以把虛實整合，把跟實質經濟連結的這些資產，透過去中心化、金融連結變成數位代幣，可以分割得很細、容易交易、跨域、可以隨時清算，這些都是它的好處，可是這些在美國、新加坡等國全部都還是在試驗性質，所以我們會密切關注他們推動的情況，包括監理架構跟商品面，希望將來能夠有機會推出這些商品。"],["吳委員秉叡：現在你們提出的法案裡面，對於不動產證券化，基本上就是這一屆你們打算要推的方案。"],["黃主任委員天牧：希望能夠。"],["吳委員秉叡：「希望能夠」是要立法院能夠支持，當然行政院送到立法院來，我們會看看那個內容，如果合理會支持，讓其有比較大的空間，對國人來講要投資是有好處。我的意思是，因為這工作實在是很複雜，第一個是交易的時間，隨時都可以交易，然後要怎麼樣細分等等，這個東西都很複雜，可能還要發展很久，可是我比較是站在我個人角度，我講我的想法給你聽。如果實質資產代幣化的交易可以很活絡，我們的年輕人或是我們的國人有一筆不太大的資金或是想投資，就可以走到這個領域來，而不是現在找不到投資的管道，每天晚上就是看虛擬貨幣，然後去買比特幣或是什麼樣的貨幣，結果冒了大風險。其實，萬變不離其宗，有一句名言，風險之所在才是利益之所在，想要得到大利益的人，他必須要冒高風險，但是我現在很怕大家會放不下輸贏，所以你必須要把這個東西弄得更清楚，同時在實質資產這邊提供出來，讓大家有更多的投資管道，才不會說都沒有投資管道，也不想買股票，就去買虛擬貨幣。我比較希望能夠做的事，就是如果可以這樣做，就可以減輕投資虛擬貨幣一窩蜂這樣的現象。"],["黃主任委員天牧：委員我跟您報告，這個RWA、金融資產代幣化，其實各國都還在試驗階段，還沒有到所謂真正可以商業化的商品，這還要一段時間。不過我覺得這個在方向上是我們要密切注意的，所以金管會在這個議題上面會非常重視而且採積極的態度，但是我們現階段做的，就像我剛剛跟您報告的，還是以基金的實質資產代幣化作為一個開頭，那還要一些時間去研究，我們已經開始啟動了。"],["吳委員秉叡：是啊！其實這從某一個角度來講，不動產的證券化就是這個領域的一部分。"],["黃主任委員天牧：類似。"],["吳委員秉叡：它本身就是這個領域的一部分，只是將來要把它擴到多大的範圍，交易要怎麼樣來規範，就是關於這一方面。因為像歐美國家，有一些是把藝術品也納進來，有一些是把其他很高價值的珠寶也納進來等等，這都是可以思考的。我是希望有實質的東西、有實質的價值，就算投資了將來遇到了風險跌價的時候，它也不會完全變成零。"],["黃主任委員天牧：這也是我們的想法。"],["吳委員秉叡：這個虛擬世界根本就不存在實質的價值，全部都是靠大家信心的堆疊，等到信心泡沫、破裂了之後，下跌的幅度可能是沒有辦法接受的，我擔心的是這個。"],["黃主任委員天牧：瞭解。"],["吳委員秉叡：好，謝謝，大家一起加油。"],["黃主任委員天牧：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝吳秉叡委員的質詢。","接著請賴士葆委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":322,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-20-2","speakers":["郭國文","吳秉叡","林德福","賴士葆","賴惠員","王鴻薇","陳玉珍","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","顏寬恒","黃珊珊","李坤城","王世堅","李彥秀","謝衣鳯","葛如鈞","邱志偉","黃國昌","林楚茵","羅明才","楊瓊瓔"],"page_start":269,"meetingDate":["2024-03-04"],"gazette_id":"1130701","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1130701_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第2次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請金融監督管理委員會黃主任委員天牧率所屬機關首長暨中央存款保險股份有限公司、監管相\n關機構有關之財團法人、臺灣證券交易所股份有限公司、臺灣期貨交易所股份有限公司、臺灣集\n中保管結算所股份有限公司等董事長、總經理列席業務報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1130701_00005"}},"transcript":{"id":"149225","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149225","tool":"pyannote","id":"149225-pyannote"},"job_id":"S37ZgPJHOf1roFJl","queued_at":"2024-06-02 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00:01:25,004\n謝謝委員關心這樣一個重要的問題其實我先說其實我們對虛擬資產國際間監理機關的看法都是覺得它有相當的風險投機性但是因為投資人青睞那有很大量的投資因為它有預期很高的漲幅所以各國監理機關現在的態度都是要強化這方面的監理那我覺得虛擬資產最重要讓大家要注意就是它沒有內在價值\n\n4\n00:01:26,425 --> 00:01:27,045\n因為他沒有實質的資產是大家投資者信心的堆疊\n\n5\n00:01:49,691 --> 00:02:07,691\n這個我聽起來很類比一個這個就是泡沫我們的金融市場如果大家都持正面看法那就是會去堆疊但哪一天氣球破的時候後果很嚴重最近的這個EDF這一波最大的漲幅的原因是因為美國\n\n6\n00:02:10,077 --> 00:02:28,653\n這個比特幣的漲幅的原因是不是因為美國把他納入可以發行ETF可以做ETF的買賣其實因為美國證券會也是因為法院裁決他原來禁止法院裁決說你這個禁止是不對的所以才讓他現貨的ETF才上市但是市場都覺得說那這樣既然得到監理機關的肯認\n\n7\n00:02:29,333 --> 00:02:50,832\n所以就一窩蜂進去另外一個原因應該是今年4月份的比特幣的機制4月份有一個自動減半的機制讓他覺得供應量可能變少了所以覺得需求就開始往上竄升那你我剛剛也許我剛剛講那個問題就是大家一窩蜂如果大家都一窩蜂進去的時候他當然就\n\n8\n00:02:51,946 --> 00:03:18,667\n政府就很大但是有一天如果出現了不利的消息或是大家失去信心他又會大量的崩跌所以其實這個唯比對比唯利已經有好幾波很大的跌幅跟很大的漲幅那這個我在這邊一再強調跟你已經報告過很多次我觀察臺灣投資民眾的屬性他賺錢不會感謝政府但是如果大家賠錢大家就怪政府\n\n9\n00:03:19,500 --> 00:03:41,791\n以前沒有管理機關沒有指定管理機關還可以講說沒有機關管理現在已經指定金管會有管理機關了所以如果有一些人去投資比特幣他自己賠錢累積很多人之後他有可能還去你的辦公室門口要跟你圍你要跟你抗議那出現這樣的狀況怎麼辦呢\n\n10\n00:03:43,700 --> 00:04:08,934\n委員我跟您報告謝謝您給我這個機會說明其實我們也希望因為現在一個網路世界我們希望投資人真的覺得他願意他願意承擔這個風險願意投資應該是到像金管會有申報洗錢防治聲明的這20幾家的平台業者去做投資那現在有很多境外的幣商或是沒有核准過的個人幣商最好都不要去透過那些平台去投資\n\n11\n00:04:09,735 --> 00:04:11,139\n因為沒有實質資產所以這個是虛擬的世界相對的還有實質資產現在要這個\n\n12\n00:04:18,614 --> 00:04:44,716\n這個代幣化這個所謂的RWA這樣子的一個機制美國也一邊在進行這個部分你怎麼講如果我們有提供更多的投資管道那在實質資產這個有東西有憑藉的你也把它代幣化也是一樣可以像這樣子的虛擬的這樣的交易的時候是不是可以產生替代的效果不要讓那些人想要賺錢都去投在這個非常高風險的這個虛擬的這個資產\n\n13\n00:04:47,578 --> 00:05:11,806\n實質的資產這一邊是不是要受到像應當有的重視跟應當有的強化呢?我跟委員報告其實您垂尋到一個非常我們正在思考的一個重要的政策其實大家對虛幣、虛擬資產除了它投資上可能帶來的這種漲幅之外還有一個兩法就是它跟區塊鏈未來發展的連結可是我們觀察國際的趨勢像美國跟亞洲、新加坡\n\n14\n00:05:12,466 --> 00:05:38,164\n其實重點應該是在您剛所提到RWA其中有關有實質經濟價值的金融資產的代幣化透過區塊鏈把它數位代幣化這個是各國監理機關金融監理機關目前在在注意的這個問題那其實金管會已經從半年前就開始重視這個金融資產的代幣化這個問題那這個跟虛幣的管理是不同的邏輯虛幣是從\n\n15\n00:05:40,586 --> 00:06:01,745\n投資人保護可是實質資產代幣化是從區塊鏈的發展去處理那事實上今年年初記者會我們也在資料中有特別記載我們在今年下半年就會對於我們的基金的代幣化就是Tokenization去做一些研究那現在政體局跟相關的工會已經在做研究了\n\n16\n00:06:03,147 --> 00:06:16,668\n這個從你管理的角度以及這個屬性當然是這樣來講沒有錯但是投資者他有了閒錢他要投資他是有好幾種選擇嘛如果你在這個實質資產代幣化這一邊做的也可以很好\n\n17\n00:06:17,777 --> 00:06:17,977\n主席\n\n18\n00:06:36,980 --> 00:06:55,741\n其實這個概念之前在不動產的證券化就體現了這樣的概念現在是把更多的東西可以包裝可以讓它代幣化讓它等於是可以證券化這樣子的觀念那重點是你願意開放哪一些資產可以讓它來代幣化呢我跟您報告\n\n19\n00:06:56,522 --> 00:07:17,598\n有關金融資產的代幣化部分其實包括美國跟亞洲這些國家重要國家其實都還在試驗性質因為它有可能產生一些金融穩定的顧慮但是我覺得我們會朝這方向去處理去研究為什麼?它可以把虛實整合把有實質經濟跟實質經濟連結的這些資產把它透過去中心化金融連結變成數位代幣那可以\n\n20\n00:07:23,642 --> 00:07:42,190\n分割很細,容易交易,跨域可以隨時清算,這些都是它的好處,可是這些在美國、新加坡等國,他們還是在試驗性質,所以我們會密切關注他們推動的情況,在建立架構跟商品面,希望將來能夠有機會推出這些商品。\n\n21\n00:07:42,890 --> 00:08:08,411\n那現在你們提出的法案裡面對於這個不動產證券化基本上這是這一屆你們打算要推的這個方案希望能夠是要立法院能夠支持當然行政院送到立法院來我們看看那個內容如果合理支持讓有比較大的空間對國人來講要投資是好處我的意思是說你是不是在這個做的時候\n\n22\n00:08:09,793 --> 00:08:28,723\n考慮因為這工作實在是很複雜我知道你要第一個交易的時間隨時可以交易然後怎麼樣細分這個東西都很複雜這個還要發展很久可是我個人比較站在我個人角度我講我的想法給你聽如果你這個實質資產的這個代幣化的交易可以很活絡的話我們年輕人\n\n23\n00:08:31,044 --> 00:08:57,701\n或是我們的國人他有一筆不太大的資金或是說他想投資他可以走到這個領域裡面來而不用現在找不到投資的管道然後每天晚上看這個虛擬貨幣然後去買比特幣去什麼樣的貨幣結果就冒了一個大風險其實萬變不離其中一句名言風險之所在才是利益之所在想要得到大利益的人他必須要冒高風險\n\n24\n00:08:58,982 --> 00:09:26,820\n但是我現在很怕大家不感受而已所以你就是必須要把這個東西弄得更清楚同時在實質市場這邊提供出來讓大家有更多的投資管道才不會說都沒有投資管道我也不想買股票我就去買這個虛擬貨幣我比較擔心的是我比較希望能夠做的是如果這樣做可以減輕投資虛擬貨幣一窩蜂這樣的現象是委員跟您報告\n\n25\n00:09:27,580 --> 00:09:55,525\n我跟您報告這個RWH是金融資產代幣化其實各國還在試驗階段還沒有真正所謂可以商業化的商品還要一段時間不過我覺得這個方向上是我們要密切注意的所以金管會在這個議題上面會非常重視而且採積及的態度但是我們現階段做的就像我剛剛跟您報告的還是以基金的實質資產代幣化作為一個開頭那還要一些時間去研究但是我們已經開始啟動了\n\n26\n00:09:56,945 --> 00:10:15,635\n其實這個某一個角度來講不動產的證券化就是這個就是這個領域的一部分他本身就是這個領域的一部分只是將來這個要把它擴大多大的範圍那你的交易要怎麼樣的規範是這一方面因為像歐美國家他有一些是把藝術品也納進來有一些是把其他的這個\n\n27\n00:10:16,556 --> 00:10:28,514\n很高價值的珠寶也納進來等等這個都是可以思考的那希望能夠我是希望有實質的東西有實質的價值你就算投資他將來就算\n\n28\n00:10:32,886 --> 00:10:51,949\n這也是我們的想法你這個虛擬世界根本就不存在那實質的價值他的那個全部都是靠大家信心的堆疊等到那個信心泡沫破裂的時候他的下跌可能那個幅度是沒有辦法接受的所以是擔心的是這個了解好謝謝大家加油謝謝委員謝謝秉瑞委員的質詢接著我們請賴世保委員質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n851\t3693\t主席麻煩請金管會黃主委有請黃主委博文長主委好這個比特幣最近又暴漲是3月2號又漲到等於是6萬多塊那這個虛擬貨幣齁去年發生非常多的這個風險也發生非常多的事件那既然現在\n31328\t55527\t今晚會被政府指定為是這個虛擬貨幣的這個管理的機關主管機關那主委你對於這個虛擬貨幣那現在這個起伏這麼大那風險當然有人在冒著風險高風險想要獲得高報酬但是同時他的風險大也代表說他虧本的機會也很大這個你有什麼樣子的看法\n56913\t85004\t謝謝委員關心這樣一個重要的問題其實我先說其實我們對虛擬資產國際間監理機關的看法都是覺得它有相當的風險投機性但是因為投資人青睞那有很大量的投資因為它有預期很高的漲幅所以各國監理機關現在的態度都是要強化這方面的監理那我覺得虛擬資產最重要讓大家要注意就是它沒有內在價值\n86425\t87045\t因為他沒有實質的資產是大家投資者信心的堆疊\n109691\t127691\t這個我聽起來很類比一個這個就是泡沫我們的金融市場如果大家都持正面看法那就是會去堆疊但哪一天氣球破的時候後果很嚴重最近的這個EDF這一波最大的漲幅的原因是因為美國\n130077\t148653\t這個比特幣的漲幅的原因是不是因為美國把他納入可以發行ETF可以做ETF的買賣其實因為美國證券會也是因為法院裁決他原來禁止法院裁決說你這個禁止是不對的所以才讓他現貨的ETF才上市但是市場都覺得說那這樣既然得到監理機關的肯認\n149333\t170832\t所以就一窩蜂進去另外一個原因應該是今年4月份的比特幣的機制4月份有一個自動減半的機制讓他覺得供應量可能變少了所以覺得需求就開始往上竄升那你我剛剛也許我剛剛講那個問題就是大家一窩蜂如果大家都一窩蜂進去的時候他當然就\n171946\t198667\t政府就很大但是有一天如果出現了不利的消息或是大家失去信心他又會大量的崩跌所以其實這個唯比對比唯利已經有好幾波很大的跌幅跟很大的漲幅那這個我在這邊一再強調跟你已經報告過很多次我觀察臺灣投資民眾的屬性他賺錢不會感謝政府但是如果大家賠錢大家就怪政府\n199500\t221791\t以前沒有管理機關沒有指定管理機關還可以講說沒有機關管理現在已經指定金管會有管理機關了所以如果有一些人去投資比特幣他自己賠錢累積很多人之後他有可能還去你的辦公室門口要跟你圍你要跟你抗議那出現這樣的狀況怎麼辦呢\n223700\t248934\t委員我跟您報告謝謝您給我這個機會說明其實我們也希望因為現在一個網路世界我們希望投資人真的覺得他願意他願意承擔這個風險願意投資應該是到像金管會有申報洗錢防治聲明的這20幾家的平台業者去做投資那現在有很多境外的幣商或是沒有核准過的個人幣商最好都不要去透過那些平台去投資\n249735\t251139\t因為沒有實質資產所以這個是虛擬的世界相對的還有實質資產現在要這個\n258614\t284716\t這個代幣化這個所謂的RWA這樣子的一個機制美國也一邊在進行這個部分你怎麼講如果我們有提供更多的投資管道那在實質資產這個有東西有憑藉的你也把它代幣化也是一樣可以像這樣子的虛擬的這樣的交易的時候是不是可以產生替代的效果不要讓那些人想要賺錢都去投在這個非常高風險的這個虛擬的這個資產\n287578\t311806\t實質的資產這一邊是不是要受到像應當有的重視跟應當有的強化呢?我跟委員報告其實您垂尋到一個非常我們正在思考的一個重要的政策其實大家對虛幣、虛擬資產除了它投資上可能帶來的這種漲幅之外還有一個兩法就是它跟區塊鏈未來發展的連結可是我們觀察國際的趨勢像美國跟亞洲、新加坡\n312466\t338164\t其實重點應該是在您剛所提到RWA其中有關有實質經濟價值的金融資產的代幣化透過區塊鏈把它數位代幣化這個是各國監理機關金融監理機關目前在在注意的這個問題那其實金管會已經從半年前就開始重視這個金融資產的代幣化這個問題那這個跟虛幣的管理是不同的邏輯虛幣是從\n340586\t361745\t投資人保護可是實質資產代幣化是從區塊鏈的發展去處理那事實上今年年初記者會我們也在資料中有特別記載我們在今年下半年就會對於我們的基金的代幣化就是Tokenization去做一些研究那現在政體局跟相關的工會已經在做研究了\n363147\t376668\t這個從你管理的角度以及這個屬性當然是這樣來講沒有錯但是投資者他有了閒錢他要投資他是有好幾種選擇嘛如果你在這個實質資產代幣化這一邊做的也可以很好\n377777\t377977\t主席\n396980\t415741\t其實這個概念之前在不動產的證券化就體現了這樣的概念現在是把更多的東西可以包裝可以讓它代幣化讓它等於是可以證券化這樣子的觀念那重點是你願意開放哪一些資產可以讓它來代幣化呢我跟您報告\n416522\t437598\t有關金融資產的代幣化部分其實包括美國跟亞洲這些國家重要國家其實都還在試驗性質因為它有可能產生一些金融穩定的顧慮但是我覺得我們會朝這方向去處理去研究為什麼?它可以把虛實整合把有實質經濟跟實質經濟連結的這些資產把它透過去中心化金融連結變成數位代幣那可以\n443642\t462190\t分割很細,容易交易,跨域可以隨時清算,這些都是它的好處,可是這些在美國、新加坡等國,他們還是在試驗性質,所以我們會密切關注他們推動的情況,在建立架構跟商品面,希望將來能夠有機會推出這些商品。\n462890\t488411\t那現在你們提出的法案裡面對於這個不動產證券化基本上這是這一屆你們打算要推的這個方案希望能夠是要立法院能夠支持當然行政院送到立法院來我們看看那個內容如果合理支持讓有比較大的空間對國人來講要投資是好處我的意思是說你是不是在這個做的時候\n489793\t508723\t考慮因為這工作實在是很複雜我知道你要第一個交易的時間隨時可以交易然後怎麼樣細分這個東西都很複雜這個還要發展很久可是我個人比較站在我個人角度我講我的想法給你聽如果你這個實質資產的這個代幣化的交易可以很活絡的話我們年輕人\n511044\t537701\t或是我們的國人他有一筆不太大的資金或是說他想投資他可以走到這個領域裡面來而不用現在找不到投資的管道然後每天晚上看這個虛擬貨幣然後去買比特幣去什麼樣的貨幣結果就冒了一個大風險其實萬變不離其中一句名言風險之所在才是利益之所在想要得到大利益的人他必須要冒高風險\n538982\t566820\t但是我現在很怕大家不感受而已所以你就是必須要把這個東西弄得更清楚同時在實質市場這邊提供出來讓大家有更多的投資管道才不會說都沒有投資管道我也不想買股票我就去買這個虛擬貨幣我比較擔心的是我比較希望能夠做的是如果這樣做可以減輕投資虛擬貨幣一窩蜂這樣的現象是委員跟您報告\n567580\t595525\t我跟您報告這個RWH是金融資產代幣化其實各國還在試驗階段還沒有真正所謂可以商業化的商品還要一段時間不過我覺得這個方向上是我們要密切注意的所以金管會在這個議題上面會非常重視而且採積及的態度但是我們現階段做的就像我剛剛跟您報告的還是以基金的實質資產代幣化作為一個開頭那還要一些時間去研究但是我們已經開始啟動了\n596945\t615635\t其實這個某一個角度來講不動產的證券化就是這個就是這個領域的一部分他本身就是這個領域的一部分只是將來這個要把它擴大多大的範圍那你的交易要怎麼樣的規範是這一方面因為像歐美國家他有一些是把藝術品也納進來有一些是把其他的這個\n616556\t628514\t很高價值的珠寶也納進來等等這個都是可以思考的那希望能夠我是希望有實質的東西有實質的價值你就算投資他將來就算\n632886\t651949\t這也是我們的想法你這個虛擬世界根本就不存在那實質的價值他的那個全部都是靠大家信心的堆疊等到那個信心泡沫破裂的時候他的下跌可能那個幅度是沒有辦法接受的所以是擔心的是這個了解好謝謝大家加油謝謝委員謝謝秉瑞委員的質詢接著我們請賴世保委員質詢\n","txt":"主席麻煩請金管會黃主委有請黃主委博文長主委好這個比特幣最近又暴漲是3月2號又漲到等於是6萬多塊那這個虛擬貨幣齁去年發生非常多的這個風險也發生非常多的事件那既然現在\n今晚會被政府指定為是這個虛擬貨幣的這個管理的機關主管機關那主委你對於這個虛擬貨幣那現在這個起伏這麼大那風險當然有人在冒著風險高風險想要獲得高報酬但是同時他的風險大也代表說他虧本的機會也很大這個你有什麼樣子的看法\n謝謝委員關心這樣一個重要的問題其實我先說其實我們對虛擬資產國際間監理機關的看法都是覺得它有相當的風險投機性但是因為投資人青睞那有很大量的投資因為它有預期很高的漲幅所以各國監理機關現在的態度都是要強化這方面的監理那我覺得虛擬資產最重要讓大家要注意就是它沒有內在價值\n因為他沒有實質的資產是大家投資者信心的堆疊\n這個我聽起來很類比一個這個就是泡沫我們的金融市場如果大家都持正面看法那就是會去堆疊但哪一天氣球破的時候後果很嚴重最近的這個EDF這一波最大的漲幅的原因是因為美國\n這個比特幣的漲幅的原因是不是因為美國把他納入可以發行ETF可以做ETF的買賣其實因為美國證券會也是因為法院裁決他原來禁止法院裁決說你這個禁止是不對的所以才讓他現貨的ETF才上市但是市場都覺得說那這樣既然得到監理機關的肯認\n所以就一窩蜂進去另外一個原因應該是今年4月份的比特幣的機制4月份有一個自動減半的機制讓他覺得供應量可能變少了所以覺得需求就開始往上竄升那你我剛剛也許我剛剛講那個問題就是大家一窩蜂如果大家都一窩蜂進去的時候他當然就\n政府就很大但是有一天如果出現了不利的消息或是大家失去信心他又會大量的崩跌所以其實這個唯比對比唯利已經有好幾波很大的跌幅跟很大的漲幅那這個我在這邊一再強調跟你已經報告過很多次我觀察臺灣投資民眾的屬性他賺錢不會感謝政府但是如果大家賠錢大家就怪政府\n以前沒有管理機關沒有指定管理機關還可以講說沒有機關管理現在已經指定金管會有管理機關了所以如果有一些人去投資比特幣他自己賠錢累積很多人之後他有可能還去你的辦公室門口要跟你圍你要跟你抗議那出現這樣的狀況怎麼辦呢\n委員我跟您報告謝謝您給我這個機會說明其實我們也希望因為現在一個網路世界我們希望投資人真的覺得他願意他願意承擔這個風險願意投資應該是到像金管會有申報洗錢防治聲明的這20幾家的平台業者去做投資那現在有很多境外的幣商或是沒有核准過的個人幣商最好都不要去透過那些平台去投資\n因為沒有實質資產所以這個是虛擬的世界相對的還有實質資產現在要這個\n這個代幣化這個所謂的RWA這樣子的一個機制美國也一邊在進行這個部分你怎麼講如果我們有提供更多的投資管道那在實質資產這個有東西有憑藉的你也把它代幣化也是一樣可以像這樣子的虛擬的這樣的交易的時候是不是可以產生替代的效果不要讓那些人想要賺錢都去投在這個非常高風險的這個虛擬的這個資產\n實質的資產這一邊是不是要受到像應當有的重視跟應當有的強化呢?我跟委員報告其實您垂尋到一個非常我們正在思考的一個重要的政策其實大家對虛幣、虛擬資產除了它投資上可能帶來的這種漲幅之外還有一個兩法就是它跟區塊鏈未來發展的連結可是我們觀察國際的趨勢像美國跟亞洲、新加坡\n其實重點應該是在您剛所提到RWA其中有關有實質經濟價值的金融資產的代幣化透過區塊鏈把它數位代幣化這個是各國監理機關金融監理機關目前在在注意的這個問題那其實金管會已經從半年前就開始重視這個金融資產的代幣化這個問題那這個跟虛幣的管理是不同的邏輯虛幣是從\n投資人保護可是實質資產代幣化是從區塊鏈的發展去處理那事實上今年年初記者會我們也在資料中有特別記載我們在今年下半年就會對於我們的基金的代幣化就是Tokenization去做一些研究那現在政體局跟相關的工會已經在做研究了\n這個從你管理的角度以及這個屬性當然是這樣來講沒有錯但是投資者他有了閒錢他要投資他是有好幾種選擇嘛如果你在這個實質資產代幣化這一邊做的也可以很好\n主席\n其實這個概念之前在不動產的證券化就體現了這樣的概念現在是把更多的東西可以包裝可以讓它代幣化讓它等於是可以證券化這樣子的觀念那重點是你願意開放哪一些資產可以讓它來代幣化呢我跟您報告\n有關金融資產的代幣化部分其實包括美國跟亞洲這些國家重要國家其實都還在試驗性質因為它有可能產生一些金融穩定的顧慮但是我覺得我們會朝這方向去處理去研究為什麼?它可以把虛實整合把有實質經濟跟實質經濟連結的這些資產把它透過去中心化金融連結變成數位代幣那可以\n分割很細,容易交易,跨域可以隨時清算,這些都是它的好處,可是這些在美國、新加坡等國,他們還是在試驗性質,所以我們會密切關注他們推動的情況,在建立架構跟商品面,希望將來能夠有機會推出這些商品。\n那現在你們提出的法案裡面對於這個不動產證券化基本上這是這一屆你們打算要推的這個方案希望能夠是要立法院能夠支持當然行政院送到立法院來我們看看那個內容如果合理支持讓有比較大的空間對國人來講要投資是好處我的意思是說你是不是在這個做的時候\n考慮因為這工作實在是很複雜我知道你要第一個交易的時間隨時可以交易然後怎麼樣細分這個東西都很複雜這個還要發展很久可是我個人比較站在我個人角度我講我的想法給你聽如果你這個實質資產的這個代幣化的交易可以很活絡的話我們年輕人\n或是我們的國人他有一筆不太大的資金或是說他想投資他可以走到這個領域裡面來而不用現在找不到投資的管道然後每天晚上看這個虛擬貨幣然後去買比特幣去什麼樣的貨幣結果就冒了一個大風險其實萬變不離其中一句名言風險之所在才是利益之所在想要得到大利益的人他必須要冒高風險\n但是我現在很怕大家不感受而已所以你就是必須要把這個東西弄得更清楚同時在實質市場這邊提供出來讓大家有更多的投資管道才不會說都沒有投資管道我也不想買股票我就去買這個虛擬貨幣我比較擔心的是我比較希望能夠做的是如果這樣做可以減輕投資虛擬貨幣一窩蜂這樣的現象是委員跟您報告\n我跟您報告這個RWH是金融資產代幣化其實各國還在試驗階段還沒有真正所謂可以商業化的商品還要一段時間不過我覺得這個方向上是我們要密切注意的所以金管會在這個議題上面會非常重視而且採積及的態度但是我們現階段做的就像我剛剛跟您報告的還是以基金的實質資產代幣化作為一個開頭那還要一些時間去研究但是我們已經開始啟動了\n其實這個某一個角度來講不動產的證券化就是這個就是這個領域的一部分他本身就是這個領域的一部分只是將來這個要把它擴大多大的範圍那你的交易要怎麼樣的規範是這一方面因為像歐美國家他有一些是把藝術品也納進來有一些是把其他的這個\n很高價值的珠寶也納進來等等這個都是可以思考的那希望能夠我是希望有實質的東西有實質的價值你就算投資他將來就算\n這也是我們的想法你這個虛擬世界根本就不存在那實質的價值他的那個全部都是靠大家信心的堆疊等到那個信心泡沫破裂的時候他的下跌可能那個幅度是沒有辦法接受的所以是擔心的是這個了解好謝謝大家加油謝謝委員謝謝秉瑞委員的質詢接著我們請賴世保委員質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.851 --> 00:03.693\n主席麻煩請金管會黃主委有請黃主委博文長主委好這個比特幣最近又暴漲是3月2號又漲到等於是6萬多塊那這個虛擬貨幣齁去年發生非常多的這個風險也發生非常多的事件那既然現在\n\n00:31.328 --> 00:55.527\n今晚會被政府指定為是這個虛擬貨幣的這個管理的機關主管機關那主委你對於這個虛擬貨幣那現在這個起伏這麼大那風險當然有人在冒著風險高風險想要獲得高報酬但是同時他的風險大也代表說他虧本的機會也很大這個你有什麼樣子的看法\n\n00:56.913 --> 01:25.004\n謝謝委員關心這樣一個重要的問題其實我先說其實我們對虛擬資產國際間監理機關的看法都是覺得它有相當的風險投機性但是因為投資人青睞那有很大量的投資因為它有預期很高的漲幅所以各國監理機關現在的態度都是要強化這方面的監理那我覺得虛擬資產最重要讓大家要注意就是它沒有內在價值\n\n01:26.425 --> 01:27.045\n因為他沒有實質的資產是大家投資者信心的堆疊\n\n01:49.691 --> 02:07.691\n這個我聽起來很類比一個這個就是泡沫我們的金融市場如果大家都持正面看法那就是會去堆疊但哪一天氣球破的時候後果很嚴重最近的這個EDF這一波最大的漲幅的原因是因為美國\n\n02:10.077 --> 02:28.653\n這個比特幣的漲幅的原因是不是因為美國把他納入可以發行ETF可以做ETF的買賣其實因為美國證券會也是因為法院裁決他原來禁止法院裁決說你這個禁止是不對的所以才讓他現貨的ETF才上市但是市場都覺得說那這樣既然得到監理機關的肯認\n\n02:29.333 --> 02:50.832\n所以就一窩蜂進去另外一個原因應該是今年4月份的比特幣的機制4月份有一個自動減半的機制讓他覺得供應量可能變少了所以覺得需求就開始往上竄升那你我剛剛也許我剛剛講那個問題就是大家一窩蜂如果大家都一窩蜂進去的時候他當然就\n\n02:51.946 --> 03:18.667\n政府就很大但是有一天如果出現了不利的消息或是大家失去信心他又會大量的崩跌所以其實這個唯比對比唯利已經有好幾波很大的跌幅跟很大的漲幅那這個我在這邊一再強調跟你已經報告過很多次我觀察臺灣投資民眾的屬性他賺錢不會感謝政府但是如果大家賠錢大家就怪政府\n\n03:19.500 --> 03:41.791\n以前沒有管理機關沒有指定管理機關還可以講說沒有機關管理現在已經指定金管會有管理機關了所以如果有一些人去投資比特幣他自己賠錢累積很多人之後他有可能還去你的辦公室門口要跟你圍你要跟你抗議那出現這樣的狀況怎麼辦呢\n\n03:43.700 --> 04:08.934\n委員我跟您報告謝謝您給我這個機會說明其實我們也希望因為現在一個網路世界我們希望投資人真的覺得他願意他願意承擔這個風險願意投資應該是到像金管會有申報洗錢防治聲明的這20幾家的平台業者去做投資那現在有很多境外的幣商或是沒有核准過的個人幣商最好都不要去透過那些平台去投資\n\n04:09.735 --> 04:11.139\n因為沒有實質資產所以這個是虛擬的世界相對的還有實質資產現在要這個\n\n04:18.614 --> 04:44.716\n這個代幣化這個所謂的RWA這樣子的一個機制美國也一邊在進行這個部分你怎麼講如果我們有提供更多的投資管道那在實質資產這個有東西有憑藉的你也把它代幣化也是一樣可以像這樣子的虛擬的這樣的交易的時候是不是可以產生替代的效果不要讓那些人想要賺錢都去投在這個非常高風險的這個虛擬的這個資產\n\n04:47.578 --> 05:11.806\n實質的資產這一邊是不是要受到像應當有的重視跟應當有的強化呢?我跟委員報告其實您垂尋到一個非常我們正在思考的一個重要的政策其實大家對虛幣、虛擬資產除了它投資上可能帶來的這種漲幅之外還有一個兩法就是它跟區塊鏈未來發展的連結可是我們觀察國際的趨勢像美國跟亞洲、新加坡\n\n05:12.466 --> 05:38.164\n其實重點應該是在您剛所提到RWA其中有關有實質經濟價值的金融資產的代幣化透過區塊鏈把它數位代幣化這個是各國監理機關金融監理機關目前在在注意的這個問題那其實金管會已經從半年前就開始重視這個金融資產的代幣化這個問題那這個跟虛幣的管理是不同的邏輯虛幣是從\n\n05:40.586 --> 06:01.745\n投資人保護可是實質資產代幣化是從區塊鏈的發展去處理那事實上今年年初記者會我們也在資料中有特別記載我們在今年下半年就會對於我們的基金的代幣化就是Tokenization去做一些研究那現在政體局跟相關的工會已經在做研究了\n\n06:03.147 --> 06:16.668\n這個從你管理的角度以及這個屬性當然是這樣來講沒有錯但是投資者他有了閒錢他要投資他是有好幾種選擇嘛如果你在這個實質資產代幣化這一邊做的也可以很好\n\n06:17.777 --> 06:17.977\n主席\n\n06:36.980 --> 06:55.741\n其實這個概念之前在不動產的證券化就體現了這樣的概念現在是把更多的東西可以包裝可以讓它代幣化讓它等於是可以證券化這樣子的觀念那重點是你願意開放哪一些資產可以讓它來代幣化呢我跟您報告\n\n06:56.522 --> 07:17.598\n有關金融資產的代幣化部分其實包括美國跟亞洲這些國家重要國家其實都還在試驗性質因為它有可能產生一些金融穩定的顧慮但是我覺得我們會朝這方向去處理去研究為什麼?它可以把虛實整合把有實質經濟跟實質經濟連結的這些資產把它透過去中心化金融連結變成數位代幣那可以\n\n07:23.642 --> 07:42.190\n分割很細,容易交易,跨域可以隨時清算,這些都是它的好處,可是這些在美國、新加坡等國,他們還是在試驗性質,所以我們會密切關注他們推動的情況,在建立架構跟商品面,希望將來能夠有機會推出這些商品。\n\n07:42.890 --> 08:08.411\n那現在你們提出的法案裡面對於這個不動產證券化基本上這是這一屆你們打算要推的這個方案希望能夠是要立法院能夠支持當然行政院送到立法院來我們看看那個內容如果合理支持讓有比較大的空間對國人來講要投資是好處我的意思是說你是不是在這個做的時候\n\n08:09.793 --> 08:28.723\n考慮因為這工作實在是很複雜我知道你要第一個交易的時間隨時可以交易然後怎麼樣細分這個東西都很複雜這個還要發展很久可是我個人比較站在我個人角度我講我的想法給你聽如果你這個實質資產的這個代幣化的交易可以很活絡的話我們年輕人\n\n08:31.044 --> 08:57.701\n或是我們的國人他有一筆不太大的資金或是說他想投資他可以走到這個領域裡面來而不用現在找不到投資的管道然後每天晚上看這個虛擬貨幣然後去買比特幣去什麼樣的貨幣結果就冒了一個大風險其實萬變不離其中一句名言風險之所在才是利益之所在想要得到大利益的人他必須要冒高風險\n\n08:58.982 --> 09:26.820\n但是我現在很怕大家不感受而已所以你就是必須要把這個東西弄得更清楚同時在實質市場這邊提供出來讓大家有更多的投資管道才不會說都沒有投資管道我也不想買股票我就去買這個虛擬貨幣我比較擔心的是我比較希望能夠做的是如果這樣做可以減輕投資虛擬貨幣一窩蜂這樣的現象是委員跟您報告\n\n09:27.580 --> 09:55.525\n我跟您報告這個RWH是金融資產代幣化其實各國還在試驗階段還沒有真正所謂可以商業化的商品還要一段時間不過我覺得這個方向上是我們要密切注意的所以金管會在這個議題上面會非常重視而且採積及的態度但是我們現階段做的就像我剛剛跟您報告的還是以基金的實質資產代幣化作為一個開頭那還要一些時間去研究但是我們已經開始啟動了\n\n09:56.945 --> 10:15.635\n其實這個某一個角度來講不動產的證券化就是這個就是這個領域的一部分他本身就是這個領域的一部分只是將來這個要把它擴大多大的範圍那你的交易要怎麼樣的規範是這一方面因為像歐美國家他有一些是把藝術品也納進來有一些是把其他的這個\n\n10:16.556 --> 10:28.514\n很高價值的珠寶也納進來等等這個都是可以思考的那希望能夠我是希望有實質的東西有實質的價值你就算投資他將來就算\n\n10:32.886 --> 10:51.949\n這也是我們的想法你這個虛擬世界根本就不存在那實質的價值他的那個全部都是靠大家信心的堆疊等到那個信心泡沫破裂的時候他的下跌可能那個幅度是沒有辦法接受的所以是擔心的是這個了解好謝謝大家加油謝謝委員謝謝秉瑞委員的質詢接著我們請賴世保委員質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.851,"end":3.693,"text":"主席麻煩請金管會黃主委有請黃主委博文長主委好這個比特幣最近又暴漲是3月2號又漲到等於是6萬多塊那這個虛擬貨幣齁去年發生非常多的這個風險也發生非常多的事件那既然現在"},{"start":31.328,"end":55.527,"text":"今晚會被政府指定為是這個虛擬貨幣的這個管理的機關主管機關那主委你對於這個虛擬貨幣那現在這個起伏這麼大那風險當然有人在冒著風險高風險想要獲得高報酬但是同時他的風險大也代表說他虧本的機會也很大這個你有什麼樣子的看法"},{"start":56.913,"end":85.004,"text":"謝謝委員關心這樣一個重要的問題其實我先說其實我們對虛擬資產國際間監理機關的看法都是覺得它有相當的風險投機性但是因為投資人青睞那有很大量的投資因為它有預期很高的漲幅所以各國監理機關現在的態度都是要強化這方面的監理那我覺得虛擬資產最重要讓大家要注意就是它沒有內在價值"},{"start":86.425,"end":87.045,"text":"因為他沒有實質的資產是大家投資者信心的堆疊"},{"start":109.691,"end":127.691,"text":"這個我聽起來很類比一個這個就是泡沫我們的金融市場如果大家都持正面看法那就是會去堆疊但哪一天氣球破的時候後果很嚴重最近的這個EDF這一波最大的漲幅的原因是因為美國"},{"start":130.077,"end":148.653,"text":"這個比特幣的漲幅的原因是不是因為美國把他納入可以發行ETF可以做ETF的買賣其實因為美國證券會也是因為法院裁決他原來禁止法院裁決說你這個禁止是不對的所以才讓他現貨的ETF才上市但是市場都覺得說那這樣既然得到監理機關的肯認"},{"start":149.333,"end":170.832,"text":"所以就一窩蜂進去另外一個原因應該是今年4月份的比特幣的機制4月份有一個自動減半的機制讓他覺得供應量可能變少了所以覺得需求就開始往上竄升那你我剛剛也許我剛剛講那個問題就是大家一窩蜂如果大家都一窩蜂進去的時候他當然就"},{"start":171.946,"end":198.667,"text":"政府就很大但是有一天如果出現了不利的消息或是大家失去信心他又會大量的崩跌所以其實這個唯比對比唯利已經有好幾波很大的跌幅跟很大的漲幅那這個我在這邊一再強調跟你已經報告過很多次我觀察臺灣投資民眾的屬性他賺錢不會感謝政府但是如果大家賠錢大家就怪政府"},{"start":199.5,"end":221.791,"text":"以前沒有管理機關沒有指定管理機關還可以講說沒有機關管理現在已經指定金管會有管理機關了所以如果有一些人去投資比特幣他自己賠錢累積很多人之後他有可能還去你的辦公室門口要跟你圍你要跟你抗議那出現這樣的狀況怎麼辦呢"},{"start":223.7,"end":248.934,"text":"委員我跟您報告謝謝您給我這個機會說明其實我們也希望因為現在一個網路世界我們希望投資人真的覺得他願意他願意承擔這個風險願意投資應該是到像金管會有申報洗錢防治聲明的這20幾家的平台業者去做投資那現在有很多境外的幣商或是沒有核准過的個人幣商最好都不要去透過那些平台去投資"},{"start":249.735,"end":251.139,"text":"因為沒有實質資產所以這個是虛擬的世界相對的還有實質資產現在要這個"},{"start":258.614,"end":284.716,"text":"這個代幣化這個所謂的RWA這樣子的一個機制美國也一邊在進行這個部分你怎麼講如果我們有提供更多的投資管道那在實質資產這個有東西有憑藉的你也把它代幣化也是一樣可以像這樣子的虛擬的這樣的交易的時候是不是可以產生替代的效果不要讓那些人想要賺錢都去投在這個非常高風險的這個虛擬的這個資產"},{"start":287.578,"end":311.806,"text":"實質的資產這一邊是不是要受到像應當有的重視跟應當有的強化呢?我跟委員報告其實您垂尋到一個非常我們正在思考的一個重要的政策其實大家對虛幣、虛擬資產除了它投資上可能帶來的這種漲幅之外還有一個兩法就是它跟區塊鏈未來發展的連結可是我們觀察國際的趨勢像美國跟亞洲、新加坡"},{"start":312.466,"end":338.164,"text":"其實重點應該是在您剛所提到RWA其中有關有實質經濟價值的金融資產的代幣化透過區塊鏈把它數位代幣化這個是各國監理機關金融監理機關目前在在注意的這個問題那其實金管會已經從半年前就開始重視這個金融資產的代幣化這個問題那這個跟虛幣的管理是不同的邏輯虛幣是從"},{"start":340.586,"end":361.745,"text":"投資人保護可是實質資產代幣化是從區塊鏈的發展去處理那事實上今年年初記者會我們也在資料中有特別記載我們在今年下半年就會對於我們的基金的代幣化就是Tokenization去做一些研究那現在政體局跟相關的工會已經在做研究了"},{"start":363.147,"end":376.668,"text":"這個從你管理的角度以及這個屬性當然是這樣來講沒有錯但是投資者他有了閒錢他要投資他是有好幾種選擇嘛如果你在這個實質資產代幣化這一邊做的也可以很好"},{"start":377.777,"end":377.977,"text":"主席"},{"start":396.98,"end":415.741,"text":"其實這個概念之前在不動產的證券化就體現了這樣的概念現在是把更多的東西可以包裝可以讓它代幣化讓它等於是可以證券化這樣子的觀念那重點是你願意開放哪一些資產可以讓它來代幣化呢我跟您報告"},{"start":416.522,"end":437.598,"text":"有關金融資產的代幣化部分其實包括美國跟亞洲這些國家重要國家其實都還在試驗性質因為它有可能產生一些金融穩定的顧慮但是我覺得我們會朝這方向去處理去研究為什麼?它可以把虛實整合把有實質經濟跟實質經濟連結的這些資產把它透過去中心化金融連結變成數位代幣那可以"},{"start":443.642,"end":462.19,"text":"分割很細,容易交易,跨域可以隨時清算,這些都是它的好處,可是這些在美國、新加坡等國,他們還是在試驗性質,所以我們會密切關注他們推動的情況,在建立架構跟商品面,希望將來能夠有機會推出這些商品。"},{"start":462.89,"end":488.411,"text":"那現在你們提出的法案裡面對於這個不動產證券化基本上這是這一屆你們打算要推的這個方案希望能夠是要立法院能夠支持當然行政院送到立法院來我們看看那個內容如果合理支持讓有比較大的空間對國人來講要投資是好處我的意思是說你是不是在這個做的時候"},{"start":489.793,"end":508.723,"text":"考慮因為這工作實在是很複雜我知道你要第一個交易的時間隨時可以交易然後怎麼樣細分這個東西都很複雜這個還要發展很久可是我個人比較站在我個人角度我講我的想法給你聽如果你這個實質資產的這個代幣化的交易可以很活絡的話我們年輕人"},{"start":511.044,"end":537.701,"text":"或是我們的國人他有一筆不太大的資金或是說他想投資他可以走到這個領域裡面來而不用現在找不到投資的管道然後每天晚上看這個虛擬貨幣然後去買比特幣去什麼樣的貨幣結果就冒了一個大風險其實萬變不離其中一句名言風險之所在才是利益之所在想要得到大利益的人他必須要冒高風險"},{"start":538.982,"end":566.82,"text":"但是我現在很怕大家不感受而已所以你就是必須要把這個東西弄得更清楚同時在實質市場這邊提供出來讓大家有更多的投資管道才不會說都沒有投資管道我也不想買股票我就去買這個虛擬貨幣我比較擔心的是我比較希望能夠做的是如果這樣做可以減輕投資虛擬貨幣一窩蜂這樣的現象是委員跟您報告"},{"start":567.58,"end":595.525,"text":"我跟您報告這個RWH是金融資產代幣化其實各國還在試驗階段還沒有真正所謂可以商業化的商品還要一段時間不過我覺得這個方向上是我們要密切注意的所以金管會在這個議題上面會非常重視而且採積及的態度但是我們現階段做的就像我剛剛跟您報告的還是以基金的實質資產代幣化作為一個開頭那還要一些時間去研究但是我們已經開始啟動了"},{"start":596.945,"end":615.635,"text":"其實這個某一個角度來講不動產的證券化就是這個就是這個領域的一部分他本身就是這個領域的一部分只是將來這個要把它擴大多大的範圍那你的交易要怎麼樣的規範是這一方面因為像歐美國家他有一些是把藝術品也納進來有一些是把其他的這個"},{"start":616.556,"end":628.514,"text":"很高價值的珠寶也納進來等等這個都是可以思考的那希望能夠我是希望有實質的東西有實質的價值你就算投資他將來就算"},{"start":632.886,"end":651.949,"text":"這也是我們的想法你這個虛擬世界根本就不存在那實質的價值他的那個全部都是靠大家信心的堆疊等到那個信心泡沫破裂的時候他的下跌可能那個幅度是沒有辦法接受的所以是擔心的是這個了解好謝謝大家加油謝謝委員謝謝秉瑞委員的質詢接著我們請賴世保委員質詢"}]}}}}