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11:13:47","影片長度":"00:08:32","會議時間":"2024-03-04T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期交通委員會第2次全體委員會議（事由：邀請行政院公共工程委員會主任委員吳澤成列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。【3月4日、6日及7日三天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期交通委員會第2次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":2,"committees":[23],"id":"委員會-11-1-23-2"},"date":"2024-03-04","duration":512,"end_time":"2024-03-04T11:13:47+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-04T11:05:15+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":542,"blocks":[["游委員顥：（11時5分）請吳主委。"],["主席：請吳主委。"],["吳主任委員澤成：委員好。"],["游委員顥：主委好。本席想要就教工程會吳主委，本席知道您是工程的專家，也有非常豐富的行政經驗跟歷練，是政治的前輩。就教主委，目前來講，您做了那麼久的工程會主委，中部是不是可以列舉三個，目前在工程會所列管最關心的重大工程？"],["吳主任委員澤成：在公共工程的列管上面，我印象比較深刻的有幾個，就遵照委員所講的列舉三個，第一個是淡江大橋，淡江大橋的發包、預算編列，因為設計和發包沒有連結，造成幾次的流標及不順利……"],["游委員顥：主委直接針對三個工程名稱列舉就好。"],["吳主任委員澤成：還有桃機三航廈也是一樣，另外還有最近在臺南發生的跨港大橋發包流標的案子。"],["游委員顥：就教主委，這三個您關注的重大工程，為因應CBAM 2026上路，八大類工程將推出碳指引，目前這三大工程的碳排和碳指引是否都有充分準備，或是引導業者在碳排部分做好充足準備？"],["吳主任委員澤成：之前沒有對碳排方面做評估，但是公共工程對於價值工程的評比，怎麼樣做比較節省經費、比較可行，這個部分主辦機關應該都有做過。"],["游委員顥：跟主委特別提一下，在CBAM 2026正式上路之後，我相信工程會針對相關的指引跟作業手冊都有許多探討，碳排部分其實在很早之前就已經是國家發展的重大方針，然而目前三件重大工程在工程會及行政院下還沒有做任何碳排的規劃，也希望在2026正式上路之後，工程會可以針對相關單位，尤其是國家重大工程都能夠進行碳指引跟碳排的部分，現在國家重大工程的部分是不是已經有納入碳權管理師？"],["吳主任委員澤成：跟委員報告，以公共工程來講，碳排只是其中的一部分，我們認為更重要的是對於公共工程的價值評估，在規劃的時候，哪一個方案最經濟，可以減量、減經費且可行，這方面做得到的話，碳排就會相對減少。"],["游委員顥：我相信主委是專家，所以工程的品質您一定非常清楚，就像國道6號橋梁當時是用碳能去做設計來做碳排跟減碳，本席期許未來工程會在相關的重大工程也能夠做好相關的碳排規劃，相信這對工程品質來講並不衝突。同時，在去年底開始，工程會也與一些相關的部會溝通，請教你們跟縣市政府有沒有進行碳排指引的宣導？"],["吳主任委員澤成：目前還在溝通當中、在推動當中。"],["游委員顥：你們有沒有跟各縣市政府、縣長共同溝通，或是工程會跟縣市政府開過幾次會？"],["吳主任委員澤成：還沒有。"],["游委員顥：沒關係，我們積極去推動，好不好？"],["吳主任委員澤成：好。"],["游委員顥：接下來我要提一下南投的建設，2016年力行產業道路旁邊的力行國小，2016年到2024年的過程中其實經過了8次流標，規劃4年、施工4年到最後終於啟用，公共工程牛步化的原因，到底是因為缺工，還是原物料上漲，哪一個是最大原因？"],["吳主任委員澤成：我覺得原因應該是工程本身的設計施工可行性有沒有做到是關鍵。"],["游委員顥：這樣子請工程會再加把勁，好不好？"],["吳主任委員澤成：好。"],["游委員顥：以目前全國的重大工程來講，缺工是主因，還是原物料是主要原因，哪一個排第一？"],["吳主任委員澤成：我覺得原物料上漲及缺工是一個趨勢，但是絕對不是一個工程本身的主要原因，既然這是個趨勢，我們就要去克服它，比方物料上漲，我們就要編足夠的費用給人家，人家才願意來標。"],["游委員顥：沒錯，從疫情這3年到現在，相關的原物料都至少漲了20%，我相信原物料是重要原因，我直接就教主委，在缺工的部分，目前將要引進印度勞工10萬大軍來臺，請問勞動部和工程會開過幾次會？"],["吳主任委員澤成：開會的幕僚作業應該是有，我個人沒有參加，因為它是我們幕僚的作業。"],["游委員顥：幕僚是不是可以……"],["吳主任委員澤成：據我瞭解，印度勞工是增加一個來源國，並沒有10萬勞工要引進，並沒有。"],["游委員顥：沒關係，因為我知道這個是看申請的數量。"],["吳主任委員澤成：對。"],["游委員顥：但是至少10萬大軍，大家現在都在討論，申請到10萬就是10萬，申請到10位就是10位，幕僚怎麼跟主委回報，目前跟相關的單位、勞動部討論過幾次？"],["吳主任委員澤成：我們工程會有派員參加勞動部審查小組的委員，在那邊就有開會。"],["游委員顥：我跟主委補充一下，因為勞動部在報導上面提到跟經濟部、農業部、衛福部、內政部開會，就是沒提工程會，勞動部引進相關的外勞一定有許多的跨部會成員一起加入，但是針對如此重要的印度勞工要來臺灣的部分，工程會主管國家重大工程，我想請主委要求勞動部也一定要把營建業、營造業相關的重大工程需求提供，我希望勞動部一定要找工程會一起討論。我直接請教主委立場的問題，您是支持印度勞工來臺，還有支持來營造業的部分嗎？"],["吳主任委員澤成：它開會沒有找工程會可能是針對需求單位來談，至於引進勞工的來源，工程會基本上是支持。"],["游委員顥：營造業有沒有引進外勞的需求？"],["吳主任委員澤成：當然有。"],["游委員顥：勞動部怎麼沒有找？所以勞動部要檢討。"],["吳主任委員澤成：需要的單位是在那些部會，工程會只是協調單位。"],["游委員顥：協調單位也一樣會用到這些需求，本席在這裡同樣請主委也跟勞動部反映，因為我相信印度勞工來臺牽扯了各行各業，印度勞工來臺跟本勞一樣是有競爭關係，如何在本勞能夠就業，就如業務報告第17頁上面所寫，還能夠補充到外勞，我相信有主委的表態，更要有積極配套。"],["吳主任委員澤成：好。"],["游委員顥：謝謝。"],["吳主任委員澤成：謝謝。"],["主席（蔡委員其昌代）：接下來請李委員昆澤發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":254,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-23-2","speakers":["李昆澤","林沛祥","黃健豪","廖先翔","徐富癸","林國成","林俊憲","魯明哲","何欣純","陳素月","邱若華","游顥","蔡其昌","許智傑","陳俊宇","邱志偉"],"page_start":211,"meetingDate":["2024-03-04"],"gazette_id":"1130901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1130901_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期交通委員會第2次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請行政院公共工程委員會主任委員吳澤成列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1130901_00003"}},"transcript":{"id":"149241","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149241","tool":"pyannote","id":"149241-pyannote"},"job_id":"EpH45ljyYttU1yGO","queued_at":"2024-06-02 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{\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 488.957, \"end\": 489.457, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"勞\"}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 489.457, \"end\": 489.597, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"反\", \"start\": 489.597, \"end\": 489.777, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"映\", \"start\": 489.777, \"end\": 490.398, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 490.398, \"end\": 490.418, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 491.178, \"end\": 491.198, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"。\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:07,082 --> 00:00:07,822\n主委你好你好主委你好\n\n2\n00:00:23,735 --> 00:00:46,023\n本席想要就教我們工程會的吳主委本席知道您是工程的專家也有非常豐富的行政經驗跟歷練是政治的前輩我想請教一下就教主委在目前來講您做了那麼久的工程會的主委\n\n3\n00:00:46,863 --> 00:00:53,857\n中部是不是可以列舉三個你目前在工程會所列管最關心的一個重大工程\n\n4\n00:00:56,606 --> 00:01:22,205\n在公共工程的列管上面我印象比較深刻的有幾個就尊教委員說列講三個第一個就是像淡江大橋淡江大橋的發包那麼預算編列設計跟發包沒有連結造成幾次的流標不順利主委直接針對三個列舉就好三個工程名稱\n\n5\n00:01:23,268 --> 00:01:26,565\n還有桃機三航廈也是一樣\n\n6\n00:01:28,304 --> 00:01:36,410\n另外還有最近在臺南發生的跨港大橋的發包流標的案子\n\n7\n00:01:58,805 --> 00:01:59,846\n主委特別提一下\n\n8\n00:02:17,705 --> 00:02:44,806\n在CBA2026正式上路之後那其實工程會期針對相關的指引跟作業手冊其實相信都有許多的一個探討那在探牌的部分其實在很早之前就已經是國家發展的重大的方針那所以說目前的三件還重大工程還在工程會期包括在行政院下是沒有做任何探牌的規劃那也希望在2026正式要上路之後\n\n9\n00:02:46,708 --> 00:03:05,308\n這個工程會可以針對相關的單位還有其是在國家的重大工程還都能夠來去進行這個碳指引跟碳排的部分那以及說包括重大工程的部分是不是在現在就已經有納入這個碳權管理師還在這個國家的重大工程\n\n10\n00:03:06,774 --> 00:03:31,432\n跟委員報告我們在公共工程來講碳排只是其中的一個部分那麼我們更重要的是對於公共工程的一個價值的評估在規劃的時候哪一個方案比較最經濟可以減量減經費可行這方面做得到的話相對碳排就會減少\n\n11\n00:03:32,233 --> 00:03:58,443\n好那相信主委您是專家所以說工程的品質您一定非常的清楚那既然國道6號橋樑當時是用碳能來去做一個設計來做碳排跟減碳那本席也期許未來來講工程會在相關的重大工程也能夠做好相關的這個碳排的一個規劃那因為相信這跟工程品質來講它並不衝突那同時就是在\n\n12\n00:03:59,943 --> 00:04:25,788\n去年底開始工程會也與相關的一些部會來去做一些溝通那我想請教一下那跟縣市政府有沒有進行這個攤牌指引的宣導目前還在溝通當中在推動當中那我想問一下跟各縣市政府有沒有共同跟縣長或是相關工程會跟縣市政府開過幾次會還沒有那沒關係那我們積極來去推動好不好\n\n13\n00:04:26,508 --> 00:04:49,813\n那接著我來提一下南投的建設在2016年還有例行產業道路旁邊的例行國小2016年到2024年這過程中其實它經過了八次的流標它規劃了四年施工四年到最後終於啟用那這個公共工程牛部化的原因到底是因為缺工還是原物料上漲哪一個是最大原因\n\n14\n00:04:50,353 --> 00:05:10,681\n我覺得原因應該是工程的變身他的設計施工的可行性那麼有沒有做到是關鍵那這樣子工程會再加把勁好不好那以目前來講全國的這個重大工程來講缺工是主因還是這個原物料會是主要原因哪一個排第一\n\n15\n00:05:11,201 --> 00:05:27,362\n我覺得原物料的上漲跟缺工他是一個趨勢但是絕對不是一個工程的本身的主要原因他這個趨勢那我們就要去克服他比如說你這個物料上漲我們就要編足夠的費用來給人家\n\n16\n00:05:30,224 --> 00:05:51,316\n從疫情來講這3年到現在相關的原物料還都至少漲了20%那我相信這個原物料是重要原因那我就想要直接就教一下主委那在缺工的部分這個現在目前來講要引進印度的勞工10萬大軍要來台那想請教一下勞動部跟工程會開過幾次會\n\n17\n00:05:55,420 --> 00:06:12,584\n開會的幕僚作業應該是有我個人是沒有參加他是我們幕僚的作業那幕僚是不是會來據我的瞭解印度勞工他是一個增加一個來源國並沒有10萬的勞工要引進這一座化並沒有\n\n18\n00:06:13,064 --> 00:06:14,205\n目前跟相關的單位跟勞動部有沒有討論過幾次?\n\n19\n00:06:30,700 --> 00:06:52,999\n我們工程會有派員參加勞動部的那個審查小組的委員那在那邊就有開會好那我跟主委就是補充一下就是因為勞動部啊他其實他在報導上面他提到了他跟經濟部、農業部、衛福部、內政部開會他就是媒體工程會\n\n20\n00:06:53,940 --> 00:07:12,711\n所以本身來講相信勞動部相關的引進外勞一定有跨部會許多的成員一起加入但是在針對如此重要的印度勞工他要來台灣的這個部分工程會主管是國家重大工程我想請這個主委能夠要求\n\n21\n00:07:13,291 --> 00:07:15,173\n您是支持印度勞工來台還來支持營造業的部分嗎\n\n22\n00:07:36,391 --> 00:07:52,324\n他開會沒有找工程會可能是針對需求單位再來談那至於引進勞工的來源那麼工程會基本上是支持那我問一下那個營造業有沒有引進外勞的需求當然有那勞動部怎麼沒有找\n\n23\n00:07:54,727 --> 00:08:10,418\n所以說勞動部要檢討他需要單位是在那些部會工程會主是協調單位我跟你講協調單位也一樣會有用到這些需求那本期在這裡就同樣就是請我們的主委那也跟勞動部反映因為\n\n24\n00:08:11,178 --> 00:08:11,198\n好,謝謝。\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n7082\t7822\t主委你好你好主委你好\n23735\t46023\t本席想要就教我們工程會的吳主委本席知道您是工程的專家也有非常豐富的行政經驗跟歷練是政治的前輩我想請教一下就教主委在目前來講您做了那麼久的工程會的主委\n46863\t53857\t中部是不是可以列舉三個你目前在工程會所列管最關心的一個重大工程\n56606\t82205\t在公共工程的列管上面我印象比較深刻的有幾個就尊教委員說列講三個第一個就是像淡江大橋淡江大橋的發包那麼預算編列設計跟發包沒有連結造成幾次的流標不順利主委直接針對三個列舉就好三個工程名稱\n83268\t86565\t還有桃機三航廈也是一樣\n88304\t96410\t另外還有最近在臺南發生的跨港大橋的發包流標的案子\n118805\t119846\t主委特別提一下\n137705\t164806\t在CBA2026正式上路之後那其實工程會期針對相關的指引跟作業手冊其實相信都有許多的一個探討那在探牌的部分其實在很早之前就已經是國家發展的重大的方針那所以說目前的三件還重大工程還在工程會期包括在行政院下是沒有做任何探牌的規劃那也希望在2026正式要上路之後\n166708\t185308\t這個工程會可以針對相關的單位還有其是在國家的重大工程還都能夠來去進行這個碳指引跟碳排的部分那以及說包括重大工程的部分是不是在現在就已經有納入這個碳權管理師還在這個國家的重大工程\n186774\t211432\t跟委員報告我們在公共工程來講碳排只是其中的一個部分那麼我們更重要的是對於公共工程的一個價值的評估在規劃的時候哪一個方案比較最經濟可以減量減經費可行這方面做得到的話相對碳排就會減少\n212233\t238443\t好那相信主委您是專家所以說工程的品質您一定非常的清楚那既然國道6號橋樑當時是用碳能來去做一個設計來做碳排跟減碳那本席也期許未來來講工程會在相關的重大工程也能夠做好相關的這個碳排的一個規劃那因為相信這跟工程品質來講它並不衝突那同時就是在\n239943\t265788\t去年底開始工程會也與相關的一些部會來去做一些溝通那我想請教一下那跟縣市政府有沒有進行這個攤牌指引的宣導目前還在溝通當中在推動當中那我想問一下跟各縣市政府有沒有共同跟縣長或是相關工程會跟縣市政府開過幾次會還沒有那沒關係那我們積極來去推動好不好\n266508\t289813\t那接著我來提一下南投的建設在2016年還有例行產業道路旁邊的例行國小2016年到2024年這過程中其實它經過了八次的流標它規劃了四年施工四年到最後終於啟用那這個公共工程牛部化的原因到底是因為缺工還是原物料上漲哪一個是最大原因\n290353\t310681\t我覺得原因應該是工程的變身他的設計施工的可行性那麼有沒有做到是關鍵那這樣子工程會再加把勁好不好那以目前來講全國的這個重大工程來講缺工是主因還是這個原物料會是主要原因哪一個排第一\n311201\t327362\t我覺得原物料的上漲跟缺工他是一個趨勢但是絕對不是一個工程的本身的主要原因他這個趨勢那我們就要去克服他比如說你這個物料上漲我們就要編足夠的費用來給人家\n330224\t351316\t從疫情來講這3年到現在相關的原物料還都至少漲了20%那我相信這個原物料是重要原因那我就想要直接就教一下主委那在缺工的部分這個現在目前來講要引進印度的勞工10萬大軍要來台那想請教一下勞動部跟工程會開過幾次會\n355420\t372584\t開會的幕僚作業應該是有我個人是沒有參加他是我們幕僚的作業那幕僚是不是會來據我的瞭解印度勞工他是一個增加一個來源國並沒有10萬的勞工要引進這一座化並沒有\n373064\t374205\t目前跟相關的單位跟勞動部有沒有討論過幾次?\n390700\t412999\t我們工程會有派員參加勞動部的那個審查小組的委員那在那邊就有開會好那我跟主委就是補充一下就是因為勞動部啊他其實他在報導上面他提到了他跟經濟部、農業部、衛福部、內政部開會他就是媒體工程會\n413940\t432711\t所以本身來講相信勞動部相關的引進外勞一定有跨部會許多的成員一起加入但是在針對如此重要的印度勞工他要來台灣的這個部分工程會主管是國家重大工程我想請這個主委能夠要求\n433291\t435173\t您是支持印度勞工來台還來支持營造業的部分嗎\n456391\t472324\t他開會沒有找工程會可能是針對需求單位再來談那至於引進勞工的來源那麼工程會基本上是支持那我問一下那個營造業有沒有引進外勞的需求當然有那勞動部怎麼沒有找\n474727\t490418\t所以說勞動部要檢討他需要單位是在那些部會工程會主是協調單位我跟你講協調單位也一樣會有用到這些需求那本期在這裡就同樣就是請我們的主委那也跟勞動部反映因為\n491178\t491198\t好,謝謝。\n","txt":"主委你好你好主委你好\n本席想要就教我們工程會的吳主委本席知道您是工程的專家也有非常豐富的行政經驗跟歷練是政治的前輩我想請教一下就教主委在目前來講您做了那麼久的工程會的主委\n中部是不是可以列舉三個你目前在工程會所列管最關心的一個重大工程\n在公共工程的列管上面我印象比較深刻的有幾個就尊教委員說列講三個第一個就是像淡江大橋淡江大橋的發包那麼預算編列設計跟發包沒有連結造成幾次的流標不順利主委直接針對三個列舉就好三個工程名稱\n還有桃機三航廈也是一樣\n另外還有最近在臺南發生的跨港大橋的發包流標的案子\n主委特別提一下\n在CBA2026正式上路之後那其實工程會期針對相關的指引跟作業手冊其實相信都有許多的一個探討那在探牌的部分其實在很早之前就已經是國家發展的重大的方針那所以說目前的三件還重大工程還在工程會期包括在行政院下是沒有做任何探牌的規劃那也希望在2026正式要上路之後\n這個工程會可以針對相關的單位還有其是在國家的重大工程還都能夠來去進行這個碳指引跟碳排的部分那以及說包括重大工程的部分是不是在現在就已經有納入這個碳權管理師還在這個國家的重大工程\n跟委員報告我們在公共工程來講碳排只是其中的一個部分那麼我們更重要的是對於公共工程的一個價值的評估在規劃的時候哪一個方案比較最經濟可以減量減經費可行這方面做得到的話相對碳排就會減少\n好那相信主委您是專家所以說工程的品質您一定非常的清楚那既然國道6號橋樑當時是用碳能來去做一個設計來做碳排跟減碳那本席也期許未來來講工程會在相關的重大工程也能夠做好相關的這個碳排的一個規劃那因為相信這跟工程品質來講它並不衝突那同時就是在\n去年底開始工程會也與相關的一些部會來去做一些溝通那我想請教一下那跟縣市政府有沒有進行這個攤牌指引的宣導目前還在溝通當中在推動當中那我想問一下跟各縣市政府有沒有共同跟縣長或是相關工程會跟縣市政府開過幾次會還沒有那沒關係那我們積極來去推動好不好\n那接著我來提一下南投的建設在2016年還有例行產業道路旁邊的例行國小2016年到2024年這過程中其實它經過了八次的流標它規劃了四年施工四年到最後終於啟用那這個公共工程牛部化的原因到底是因為缺工還是原物料上漲哪一個是最大原因\n我覺得原因應該是工程的變身他的設計施工的可行性那麼有沒有做到是關鍵那這樣子工程會再加把勁好不好那以目前來講全國的這個重大工程來講缺工是主因還是這個原物料會是主要原因哪一個排第一\n我覺得原物料的上漲跟缺工他是一個趨勢但是絕對不是一個工程的本身的主要原因他這個趨勢那我們就要去克服他比如說你這個物料上漲我們就要編足夠的費用來給人家\n從疫情來講這3年到現在相關的原物料還都至少漲了20%那我相信這個原物料是重要原因那我就想要直接就教一下主委那在缺工的部分這個現在目前來講要引進印度的勞工10萬大軍要來台那想請教一下勞動部跟工程會開過幾次會\n開會的幕僚作業應該是有我個人是沒有參加他是我們幕僚的作業那幕僚是不是會來據我的瞭解印度勞工他是一個增加一個來源國並沒有10萬的勞工要引進這一座化並沒有\n目前跟相關的單位跟勞動部有沒有討論過幾次?\n我們工程會有派員參加勞動部的那個審查小組的委員那在那邊就有開會好那我跟主委就是補充一下就是因為勞動部啊他其實他在報導上面他提到了他跟經濟部、農業部、衛福部、內政部開會他就是媒體工程會\n所以本身來講相信勞動部相關的引進外勞一定有跨部會許多的成員一起加入但是在針對如此重要的印度勞工他要來台灣的這個部分工程會主管是國家重大工程我想請這個主委能夠要求\n您是支持印度勞工來台還來支持營造業的部分嗎\n他開會沒有找工程會可能是針對需求單位再來談那至於引進勞工的來源那麼工程會基本上是支持那我問一下那個營造業有沒有引進外勞的需求當然有那勞動部怎麼沒有找\n所以說勞動部要檢討他需要單位是在那些部會工程會主是協調單位我跟你講協調單位也一樣會有用到這些需求那本期在這裡就同樣就是請我們的主委那也跟勞動部反映因為\n好,謝謝。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:07.082 --> 00:07.822\n主委你好你好主委你好\n\n00:23.735 --> 00:46.023\n本席想要就教我們工程會的吳主委本席知道您是工程的專家也有非常豐富的行政經驗跟歷練是政治的前輩我想請教一下就教主委在目前來講您做了那麼久的工程會的主委\n\n00:46.863 --> 00:53.857\n中部是不是可以列舉三個你目前在工程會所列管最關心的一個重大工程\n\n00:56.606 --> 01:22.205\n在公共工程的列管上面我印象比較深刻的有幾個就尊教委員說列講三個第一個就是像淡江大橋淡江大橋的發包那麼預算編列設計跟發包沒有連結造成幾次的流標不順利主委直接針對三個列舉就好三個工程名稱\n\n01:23.268 --> 01:26.565\n還有桃機三航廈也是一樣\n\n01:28.304 --> 01:36.410\n另外還有最近在臺南發生的跨港大橋的發包流標的案子\n\n01:58.805 --> 01:59.846\n主委特別提一下\n\n02:17.705 --> 02:44.806\n在CBA2026正式上路之後那其實工程會期針對相關的指引跟作業手冊其實相信都有許多的一個探討那在探牌的部分其實在很早之前就已經是國家發展的重大的方針那所以說目前的三件還重大工程還在工程會期包括在行政院下是沒有做任何探牌的規劃那也希望在2026正式要上路之後\n\n02:46.708 --> 03:05.308\n這個工程會可以針對相關的單位還有其是在國家的重大工程還都能夠來去進行這個碳指引跟碳排的部分那以及說包括重大工程的部分是不是在現在就已經有納入這個碳權管理師還在這個國家的重大工程\n\n03:06.774 --> 03:31.432\n跟委員報告我們在公共工程來講碳排只是其中的一個部分那麼我們更重要的是對於公共工程的一個價值的評估在規劃的時候哪一個方案比較最經濟可以減量減經費可行這方面做得到的話相對碳排就會減少\n\n03:32.233 --> 03:58.443\n好那相信主委您是專家所以說工程的品質您一定非常的清楚那既然國道6號橋樑當時是用碳能來去做一個設計來做碳排跟減碳那本席也期許未來來講工程會在相關的重大工程也能夠做好相關的這個碳排的一個規劃那因為相信這跟工程品質來講它並不衝突那同時就是在\n\n03:59.943 --> 04:25.788\n去年底開始工程會也與相關的一些部會來去做一些溝通那我想請教一下那跟縣市政府有沒有進行這個攤牌指引的宣導目前還在溝通當中在推動當中那我想問一下跟各縣市政府有沒有共同跟縣長或是相關工程會跟縣市政府開過幾次會還沒有那沒關係那我們積極來去推動好不好\n\n04:26.508 --> 04:49.813\n那接著我來提一下南投的建設在2016年還有例行產業道路旁邊的例行國小2016年到2024年這過程中其實它經過了八次的流標它規劃了四年施工四年到最後終於啟用那這個公共工程牛部化的原因到底是因為缺工還是原物料上漲哪一個是最大原因\n\n04:50.353 --> 05:10.681\n我覺得原因應該是工程的變身他的設計施工的可行性那麼有沒有做到是關鍵那這樣子工程會再加把勁好不好那以目前來講全國的這個重大工程來講缺工是主因還是這個原物料會是主要原因哪一個排第一\n\n05:11.201 --> 05:27.362\n我覺得原物料的上漲跟缺工他是一個趨勢但是絕對不是一個工程的本身的主要原因他這個趨勢那我們就要去克服他比如說你這個物料上漲我們就要編足夠的費用來給人家\n\n05:30.224 --> 05:51.316\n從疫情來講這3年到現在相關的原物料還都至少漲了20%那我相信這個原物料是重要原因那我就想要直接就教一下主委那在缺工的部分這個現在目前來講要引進印度的勞工10萬大軍要來台那想請教一下勞動部跟工程會開過幾次會\n\n05:55.420 --> 06:12.584\n開會的幕僚作業應該是有我個人是沒有參加他是我們幕僚的作業那幕僚是不是會來據我的瞭解印度勞工他是一個增加一個來源國並沒有10萬的勞工要引進這一座化並沒有\n\n06:13.064 --> 06:14.205\n目前跟相關的單位跟勞動部有沒有討論過幾次?\n\n06:30.700 --> 06:52.999\n我們工程會有派員參加勞動部的那個審查小組的委員那在那邊就有開會好那我跟主委就是補充一下就是因為勞動部啊他其實他在報導上面他提到了他跟經濟部、農業部、衛福部、內政部開會他就是媒體工程會\n\n06:53.940 --> 07:12.711\n所以本身來講相信勞動部相關的引進外勞一定有跨部會許多的成員一起加入但是在針對如此重要的印度勞工他要來台灣的這個部分工程會主管是國家重大工程我想請這個主委能夠要求\n\n07:13.291 --> 07:15.173\n您是支持印度勞工來台還來支持營造業的部分嗎\n\n07:36.391 --> 07:52.324\n他開會沒有找工程會可能是針對需求單位再來談那至於引進勞工的來源那麼工程會基本上是支持那我問一下那個營造業有沒有引進外勞的需求當然有那勞動部怎麼沒有找\n\n07:54.727 --> 08:10.418\n所以說勞動部要檢討他需要單位是在那些部會工程會主是協調單位我跟你講協調單位也一樣會有用到這些需求那本期在這裡就同樣就是請我們的主委那也跟勞動部反映因為\n\n08:11.178 --> 08:11.198\n好,謝謝。\n\n","segments":[{"start":7.082,"end":7.822,"text":"主委你好你好主委你好"},{"start":23.735,"end":46.023,"text":"本席想要就教我們工程會的吳主委本席知道您是工程的專家也有非常豐富的行政經驗跟歷練是政治的前輩我想請教一下就教主委在目前來講您做了那麼久的工程會的主委"},{"start":46.863,"end":53.857,"text":"中部是不是可以列舉三個你目前在工程會所列管最關心的一個重大工程"},{"start":56.606,"end":82.205,"text":"在公共工程的列管上面我印象比較深刻的有幾個就尊教委員說列講三個第一個就是像淡江大橋淡江大橋的發包那麼預算編列設計跟發包沒有連結造成幾次的流標不順利主委直接針對三個列舉就好三個工程名稱"},{"start":83.268,"end":86.565,"text":"還有桃機三航廈也是一樣"},{"start":88.304,"end":96.41,"text":"另外還有最近在臺南發生的跨港大橋的發包流標的案子"},{"start":118.805,"end":119.846,"text":"主委特別提一下"},{"start":137.705,"end":164.806,"text":"在CBA2026正式上路之後那其實工程會期針對相關的指引跟作業手冊其實相信都有許多的一個探討那在探牌的部分其實在很早之前就已經是國家發展的重大的方針那所以說目前的三件還重大工程還在工程會期包括在行政院下是沒有做任何探牌的規劃那也希望在2026正式要上路之後"},{"start":166.708,"end":185.308,"text":"這個工程會可以針對相關的單位還有其是在國家的重大工程還都能夠來去進行這個碳指引跟碳排的部分那以及說包括重大工程的部分是不是在現在就已經有納入這個碳權管理師還在這個國家的重大工程"},{"start":186.774,"end":211.432,"text":"跟委員報告我們在公共工程來講碳排只是其中的一個部分那麼我們更重要的是對於公共工程的一個價值的評估在規劃的時候哪一個方案比較最經濟可以減量減經費可行這方面做得到的話相對碳排就會減少"},{"start":212.233,"end":238.443,"text":"好那相信主委您是專家所以說工程的品質您一定非常的清楚那既然國道6號橋樑當時是用碳能來去做一個設計來做碳排跟減碳那本席也期許未來來講工程會在相關的重大工程也能夠做好相關的這個碳排的一個規劃那因為相信這跟工程品質來講它並不衝突那同時就是在"},{"start":239.943,"end":265.788,"text":"去年底開始工程會也與相關的一些部會來去做一些溝通那我想請教一下那跟縣市政府有沒有進行這個攤牌指引的宣導目前還在溝通當中在推動當中那我想問一下跟各縣市政府有沒有共同跟縣長或是相關工程會跟縣市政府開過幾次會還沒有那沒關係那我們積極來去推動好不好"},{"start":266.508,"end":289.813,"text":"那接著我來提一下南投的建設在2016年還有例行產業道路旁邊的例行國小2016年到2024年這過程中其實它經過了八次的流標它規劃了四年施工四年到最後終於啟用那這個公共工程牛部化的原因到底是因為缺工還是原物料上漲哪一個是最大原因"},{"start":290.353,"end":310.681,"text":"我覺得原因應該是工程的變身他的設計施工的可行性那麼有沒有做到是關鍵那這樣子工程會再加把勁好不好那以目前來講全國的這個重大工程來講缺工是主因還是這個原物料會是主要原因哪一個排第一"},{"start":311.201,"end":327.362,"text":"我覺得原物料的上漲跟缺工他是一個趨勢但是絕對不是一個工程的本身的主要原因他這個趨勢那我們就要去克服他比如說你這個物料上漲我們就要編足夠的費用來給人家"},{"start":330.224,"end":351.316,"text":"從疫情來講這3年到現在相關的原物料還都至少漲了20%那我相信這個原物料是重要原因那我就想要直接就教一下主委那在缺工的部分這個現在目前來講要引進印度的勞工10萬大軍要來台那想請教一下勞動部跟工程會開過幾次會"},{"start":355.42,"end":372.584,"text":"開會的幕僚作業應該是有我個人是沒有參加他是我們幕僚的作業那幕僚是不是會來據我的瞭解印度勞工他是一個增加一個來源國並沒有10萬的勞工要引進這一座化並沒有"},{"start":373.064,"end":374.205,"text":"目前跟相關的單位跟勞動部有沒有討論過幾次?"},{"start":390.7,"end":412.999,"text":"我們工程會有派員參加勞動部的那個審查小組的委員那在那邊就有開會好那我跟主委就是補充一下就是因為勞動部啊他其實他在報導上面他提到了他跟經濟部、農業部、衛福部、內政部開會他就是媒體工程會"},{"start":413.94,"end":432.711,"text":"所以本身來講相信勞動部相關的引進外勞一定有跨部會許多的成員一起加入但是在針對如此重要的印度勞工他要來台灣的這個部分工程會主管是國家重大工程我想請這個主委能夠要求"},{"start":433.291,"end":435.173,"text":"您是支持印度勞工來台還來支持營造業的部分嗎"},{"start":456.391,"end":472.324,"text":"他開會沒有找工程會可能是針對需求單位再來談那至於引進勞工的來源那麼工程會基本上是支持那我問一下那個營造業有沒有引進外勞的需求當然有那勞動部怎麼沒有找"},{"start":474.727,"end":490.418,"text":"所以說勞動部要檢討他需要單位是在那些部會工程會主是協調單位我跟你講協調單位也一樣會有用到這些需求那本期在這裡就同樣就是請我們的主委那也跟勞動部反映因為"},{"start":491.178,"end":491.198,"text":"好,謝謝。"}]}}}}