{"id":149441,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149441","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/aa454a369d2b172fc752e0a77993e0ba52d2a45619e6d6e6f8ba9b0039caa7a6b75eef7241a86e735ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"高金素梅","委員發言時間":"13:46:17 - 13:53:20","影片長度":"00:07:03","會議時間":"2024-03-06T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期交通委員會第2次全體委員會議（事由：邀請交通部部長王國材列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。【3月4日、6日及7日三天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期交通委員會第2次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":2,"committees":[23],"id":"委員會-11-1-23-2"},"date":"2024-03-06","duration":423,"end_time":"2024-03-06T13:53:20+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-06T13:46:17+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":1209,"blocks":[["高金委員素梅：（13時46分）謝謝召委，請王部長和觀光署周署長。"],["主席：請王部長、周署長。"],["高金委員素梅：2022年7月20日交通部發布露營場管理要點，我們原本以為既有露營場的合法化工作就會順利展開，可是一年半過去，露營場合法化的問題卻成為所有部落族人的惡夢。我們來看一下，根據觀光署的統計，目前全臺灣露營場總共1,845處，其中1,667處並不合法。根據本席了解，目前申請案件總共是800件，但是既有場家的部分只有307件，另外493件都是新增的露營場。而我們整合起來800件的申請案，部長知道有幾家通過嗎？"],["王部長國材：現在……"],["高金委員素梅：好，不要浪費本席的時間，只有1家。"],["周署長永暉：因為還在輔導。"],["高金委員素梅：而且這一家是新設立的露營場，不是既有的。當初我們制定露營場合法化要點，最重要的就是輔導既有的業者合法，可是您看看本席的數據，一年半過去了，既有業者不只申請意願非常低，到現在也沒有任何一家通過，所以我們做這件事情是枉然的。我們族人的惡夢是什麼呢？因為露營場不可以設立在19項環境敏感區，其中有一項叫做土石流潛勢溪流的範圍。","部長，土石流產生的要件是什麼？我們都知道是土砂、坡度大，還要有水。農業部公布土石流潛勢溪流的範圍是防災用的，對不對？它主要是在做風險潛勢分級，劃出可能會影響到的範圍，主要是為了防災工作。本席要請教部長，颱風警戒發布的時候，你會去露營嗎？不會吧！露營業者敢收這些客人嗎？也不會吧！","根據水保署公告的土石流潛勢溪流，你知道全臺有多少嗎？有1,732條，範圍包括風景區、休閒農業區、學校、寺廟、派出所，就連參山國家風景區的獅山遊客中心，也位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍之內，所以這些地方並沒有禁限建，可是根據非都市土地使用管制規則第六條附表一的規定，我們的露營場卻不可以位於土石流潛勢溪流的範圍內，請問一下，我們的禁限依據為何？這是毫無根據的嘛。","結果造成我們族人一個很大的困擾，是什麼？這是已經發生的事情，我們現在的住家位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍，同時也在經營露營場，結果現在卻被縣市政府，因為所謂的開放露營場，而被開罰了，這顯然是不合理，也不合法的規定，我們的族人真的是啞口無言。是不是應該協助他們救濟？這是本席今天的問題。","第二點，本席要再建議部長，針對19項環境敏感區不可以設立露營場的規定，本席希望一週內你們能通知國土署，一起檢討修正非都市土地使用管制規則第六條附表一的規定。部長同意嗎？"],["王部長國材：是，的確我們希望……現在露營活動很普遍……"],["高金委員素梅：對，這是既有的。"],["王部長國材：尤其在山地也非常普遍。但是您剛才談到，現在最大的問題的確是19項環境敏感地區限制了他們合法化，這部分是不是請……"],["高金委員素梅：不用他回答，本席剛才就說了，請部長在一週內邀請相關單位開會，包括營建署的國土署，好不好？"],["王部長國材：我們和國土署，還有……"],["周署長永暉：農業部。"],["高金委員素梅：周署長，本席還沒有請你回答，抱歉，現在本席是在和部長對話，謝謝。","同時還要輔導露營場，交通部應該可以分階段辦理。你應該也清楚，5月1日縣市國土計畫就要公告實施，其中一個很重要的部分，就是原住民族部落只要是105年5月1日前的既有住宅，未來都會合法，同時土地會變更為建地，對不對？原住民的土地也會同步制定原住民族土地管制規則，進行建管的工作。","因為我們很多族人的露營場都是用自宅做為管理基地，屬於無痕露營區，就像這個照片一樣，像這種僅有住宅和浴廁的露營場，本席覺得交通部應該立刻和原民會成立輔導平台，優先協助處理這個部分。所以本席今天三個總結是，第一個，要協助族人救濟，現在要被開罰的人，怎麼協助他們？第二個，依照露營場樣態分階段輔導，並且要優先輔導無痕露營區。第三個，交通部和原民會必須成立一個合作平台，輔導原住民經營的露營場。可不可以？"],["王部長國材：例如剛才提到的原民會，我們看能不能在下禮拜開會討論。的確，現在輔導工作遇到一些困境，尤其是原住民區，他們也希望趕快合法經營，我們會儘量協助。"],["高金委員素梅：對，先針對既有的部分，不要這個法一實施，就是處罰這些既有的業者。"],["王部長國材：了解。"],["高金委員素梅：現在我們的族人哀鴻遍野。部長，你今天的回應非常好，本席要對你比讚，包括觀光署、國土署或原民會，希望你們召開這個討論的會議時，也讓本席知道。"],["王部長國材：好的。"],["高金委員素梅：因為我們需要把現在原住民地區的樣態讓相關單位都清楚，本席跑了全臺灣所有的原鄉地區，我非常清楚知道他們的困境在哪裡。可以嗎？"],["王部長國材：好，我們會通知委員辦公室。"],["高金委員素梅：好的，謝謝部長，謝謝。"],["主席：高金委員發言完畢。","現在請王委員鴻薇發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":348,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-23-2","speakers":["李昆澤","林國成","廖先翔","黃健豪","林沛祥","陳素月","何欣純","林俊憲","魯明哲","游顥","萬美玲","邱若華","蔡其昌","徐富癸","許智傑","洪孟楷","牛煦庭","鍾佳濱","謝衣鳯","高金素梅","王鴻薇","李柏毅","楊瓊瓔","鄭天財Sra 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00:00:13,617\n素梅委員發言好,謝謝召委,我們請王部長還有觀光署的周署長請王部長、周署長\n\n2\n00:00:14,906 --> 00:00:30,992\n好,2022年的時候7月20日交通部你們發布了露營場管理要點我們原本以為既有的露營場的合法化工作就會順利地展開了可是一年半過去露營場合法化卻成了我們所有部落族人的噩夢\n\n3\n00:00:31,912 --> 00:00:57,413\n我們來看一下根據官網署的統計目前全台灣露營場總共有1845處其中有1667處是沒有合法的根據我的了解目前申請的案件總共是800件但是屬於既有的廠家卻只有307件其他的493件都是新增的露營場而我們整合起來800件的申請案部長你知道有幾家通過了嗎?\n\n4\n00:00:59,637 --> 00:00:59,817\n主席\n\n5\n00:01:14,318 --> 00:01:40,128\n既有的業者來合法可是您看到我的數據一年半過去了既有業者不僅他的申請意願非常的低到現在沒有任何一家通過所以這件事情是恍然的那我們族人的噩夢是什麼呢因為露營場的設立不可以位於19項環境敏感區其中有一項叫做土石流淺室溪的範圍\n\n6\n00:01:41,428 --> 00:02:09,013\n部長土石流產生的要件是什麼我們都知道土砂坡度大還要有水所以呢農業部因此公布的土石流潛勢溪流的範圍是用防災用的對不對他主要是在風險潛勢分級可能會影響的範圍之內然後以防災工作之用我要請教部長了颱風警戒發布的時候你會去露營嗎不會吧\n\n7\n00:02:11,074 --> 00:02:22,186\n入營業者敢收這些客人嗎?也不會吧?所以根據水保署公告的土石流潛勢溪流你知道全台有多少個嗎?有1732條\n\n8\n00:02:25,410 --> 00:02:42,169\n他的含括包括什麼風景區、休閒農業區、學校、寺廟、派出所就連山山國家風景區的獅山遊客中心他也位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍之內所以並沒有禁縣建\n\n9\n00:02:46,494 --> 00:03:02,552\n可是根據非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定我們的露營場卻不可以位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍的請問一下我們的境線依據\n\n10\n00:03:03,453 --> 00:03:17,523\n委託是毫無根據的嘛所以呢結果會造成我們現在族人一個很大的困擾是什麼嗎而且是已經發生的事情了就因為我們現在的住家位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍那麼他同時也是經營露營場現在卻被我們的縣市政府因為這樣子的你們所謂的要開放露營而被開罰了\n\n11\n00:03:30,091 --> 00:03:51,844\n這顯然不合理也不合法的規定造成我們族人真的是很啞口無言所以是不是應該協助他們救濟這是我今天的問題第二點我要再建議部長針對19項環境敏感區不可以設立露營場的規定我希望一週內\n\n12\n00:03:53,425 --> 00:04:20,472\n也希望你們來通知國土署來檢討修正非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定。部長你同意嗎?是,的確我們希望,錄影室現在很普遍,尤其在山地這個也非常普遍但是你談到現在最大問題的確就是這19項環境敏感地區限制它能夠合法的\n\n13\n00:04:21,448 --> 00:04:39,202\n那這個我想說這部分我是不是請那個不用他回答了我剛剛就說請部長來一週內來請他們來開會包括這個營建署的國土署好不好國土署還有光這個現在錄影我還沒有請你回答說署長抱歉我再跟部長對話謝謝\n\n14\n00:04:41,184 --> 00:05:08,988\n同時還要輔導我們露營場的工作因為交通部你們應該可以分階段來辦理特別是你應該也清楚5月1號縣市國土計畫他就要公告實施其中很重要的部分是原住民族的部落只要是在105年5月1號前他既有的住宅未來都會合法同時土地會變更為建地\n\n15\n00:05:10,288 --> 00:05:30,356\n而原住民的土地也會同步來制定原住民族土地管制規則然後來進行建管的工作那因為我們很多的族人露營場都是用自宅作為管理看一下這個照片經營的是無橫露營區就好像這個照片一樣像這種僅有住宅跟預測的露營場我覺得交通部你們應該立刻要跟園民會成立輔導平台\n\n16\n00:05:36,358 --> 00:06:04,046\n優先來協助處理他們所以我今天的三個總結是第一個要協助族人救濟現在已經要被開罰的人怎麼樣來協助他們第二個依照露營場的樣態然後分階段的來輔導並且要優先輔導無痕露營區第三個交通部和園民會你們必須要成立一個合作平台來輔導原住民經營的露營場可不可以\n\n17\n00:06:04,606 --> 00:06:21,367\n我想說我們就跟他我看他們下禮拜做一個開會來討論就的確現在福島的困境尤其是原住民區他們是需要趕快合法來經營這件事對既有的嘛\n\n18\n00:06:22,108 --> 00:06:24,709\n希望你們請這些各包括觀光署也好包括國土署也好包括園民會也好你們討論這個會議的時候也讓我知道因為\n\n19\n00:06:44,753 --> 00:06:45,033\n高金委員發言\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n169\t13617\t素梅委員發言好,謝謝召委,我們請王部長還有觀光署的周署長請王部長、周署長\n14906\t30992\t好,2022年的時候7月20日交通部你們發布了露營場管理要點我們原本以為既有的露營場的合法化工作就會順利地展開了可是一年半過去露營場合法化卻成了我們所有部落族人的噩夢\n31912\t57413\t我們來看一下根據官網署的統計目前全台灣露營場總共有1845處其中有1667處是沒有合法的根據我的了解目前申請的案件總共是800件但是屬於既有的廠家卻只有307件其他的493件都是新增的露營場而我們整合起來800件的申請案部長你知道有幾家通過了嗎?\n59637\t59817\t主席\n74318\t100128\t既有的業者來合法可是您看到我的數據一年半過去了既有業者不僅他的申請意願非常的低到現在沒有任何一家通過所以這件事情是恍然的那我們族人的噩夢是什麼呢因為露營場的設立不可以位於19項環境敏感區其中有一項叫做土石流淺室溪的範圍\n101428\t129013\t部長土石流產生的要件是什麼我們都知道土砂坡度大還要有水所以呢農業部因此公布的土石流潛勢溪流的範圍是用防災用的對不對他主要是在風險潛勢分級可能會影響的範圍之內然後以防災工作之用我要請教部長了颱風警戒發布的時候你會去露營嗎不會吧\n131074\t142186\t入營業者敢收這些客人嗎?也不會吧?所以根據水保署公告的土石流潛勢溪流你知道全台有多少個嗎?有1732條\n145410\t162169\t他的含括包括什麼風景區、休閒農業區、學校、寺廟、派出所就連山山國家風景區的獅山遊客中心他也位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍之內所以並沒有禁縣建\n166494\t182552\t可是根據非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定我們的露營場卻不可以位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍的請問一下我們的境線依據\n183453\t197523\t委託是毫無根據的嘛所以呢結果會造成我們現在族人一個很大的困擾是什麼嗎而且是已經發生的事情了就因為我們現在的住家位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍那麼他同時也是經營露營場現在卻被我們的縣市政府因為這樣子的你們所謂的要開放露營而被開罰了\n210091\t231844\t這顯然不合理也不合法的規定造成我們族人真的是很啞口無言所以是不是應該協助他們救濟這是我今天的問題第二點我要再建議部長針對19項環境敏感區不可以設立露營場的規定我希望一週內\n233425\t260472\t也希望你們來通知國土署來檢討修正非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定。部長你同意嗎?是,的確我們希望,錄影室現在很普遍,尤其在山地這個也非常普遍但是你談到現在最大問題的確就是這19項環境敏感地區限制它能夠合法的\n261448\t279202\t那這個我想說這部分我是不是請那個不用他回答了我剛剛就說請部長來一週內來請他們來開會包括這個營建署的國土署好不好國土署還有光這個現在錄影我還沒有請你回答說署長抱歉我再跟部長對話謝謝\n281184\t308988\t同時還要輔導我們露營場的工作因為交通部你們應該可以分階段來辦理特別是你應該也清楚5月1號縣市國土計畫他就要公告實施其中很重要的部分是原住民族的部落只要是在105年5月1號前他既有的住宅未來都會合法同時土地會變更為建地\n310288\t330356\t而原住民的土地也會同步來制定原住民族土地管制規則然後來進行建管的工作那因為我們很多的族人露營場都是用自宅作為管理看一下這個照片經營的是無橫露營區就好像這個照片一樣像這種僅有住宅跟預測的露營場我覺得交通部你們應該立刻要跟園民會成立輔導平台\n336358\t364046\t優先來協助處理他們所以我今天的三個總結是第一個要協助族人救濟現在已經要被開罰的人怎麼樣來協助他們第二個依照露營場的樣態然後分階段的來輔導並且要優先輔導無痕露營區第三個交通部和園民會你們必須要成立一個合作平台來輔導原住民經營的露營場可不可以\n364606\t381367\t我想說我們就跟他我看他們下禮拜做一個開會來討論就的確現在福島的困境尤其是原住民區他們是需要趕快合法來經營這件事對既有的嘛\n382108\t384709\t希望你們請這些各包括觀光署也好包括國土署也好包括園民會也好你們討論這個會議的時候也讓我知道因為\n404753\t405033\t高金委員發言\n","txt":"素梅委員發言好,謝謝召委,我們請王部長還有觀光署的周署長請王部長、周署長\n好,2022年的時候7月20日交通部你們發布了露營場管理要點我們原本以為既有的露營場的合法化工作就會順利地展開了可是一年半過去露營場合法化卻成了我們所有部落族人的噩夢\n我們來看一下根據官網署的統計目前全台灣露營場總共有1845處其中有1667處是沒有合法的根據我的了解目前申請的案件總共是800件但是屬於既有的廠家卻只有307件其他的493件都是新增的露營場而我們整合起來800件的申請案部長你知道有幾家通過了嗎?\n主席\n既有的業者來合法可是您看到我的數據一年半過去了既有業者不僅他的申請意願非常的低到現在沒有任何一家通過所以這件事情是恍然的那我們族人的噩夢是什麼呢因為露營場的設立不可以位於19項環境敏感區其中有一項叫做土石流淺室溪的範圍\n部長土石流產生的要件是什麼我們都知道土砂坡度大還要有水所以呢農業部因此公布的土石流潛勢溪流的範圍是用防災用的對不對他主要是在風險潛勢分級可能會影響的範圍之內然後以防災工作之用我要請教部長了颱風警戒發布的時候你會去露營嗎不會吧\n入營業者敢收這些客人嗎?也不會吧?所以根據水保署公告的土石流潛勢溪流你知道全台有多少個嗎?有1732條\n他的含括包括什麼風景區、休閒農業區、學校、寺廟、派出所就連山山國家風景區的獅山遊客中心他也位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍之內所以並沒有禁縣建\n可是根據非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定我們的露營場卻不可以位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍的請問一下我們的境線依據\n委託是毫無根據的嘛所以呢結果會造成我們現在族人一個很大的困擾是什麼嗎而且是已經發生的事情了就因為我們現在的住家位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍那麼他同時也是經營露營場現在卻被我們的縣市政府因為這樣子的你們所謂的要開放露營而被開罰了\n這顯然不合理也不合法的規定造成我們族人真的是很啞口無言所以是不是應該協助他們救濟這是我今天的問題第二點我要再建議部長針對19項環境敏感區不可以設立露營場的規定我希望一週內\n也希望你們來通知國土署來檢討修正非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定。部長你同意嗎?是,的確我們希望,錄影室現在很普遍,尤其在山地這個也非常普遍但是你談到現在最大問題的確就是這19項環境敏感地區限制它能夠合法的\n那這個我想說這部分我是不是請那個不用他回答了我剛剛就說請部長來一週內來請他們來開會包括這個營建署的國土署好不好國土署還有光這個現在錄影我還沒有請你回答說署長抱歉我再跟部長對話謝謝\n同時還要輔導我們露營場的工作因為交通部你們應該可以分階段來辦理特別是你應該也清楚5月1號縣市國土計畫他就要公告實施其中很重要的部分是原住民族的部落只要是在105年5月1號前他既有的住宅未來都會合法同時土地會變更為建地\n而原住民的土地也會同步來制定原住民族土地管制規則然後來進行建管的工作那因為我們很多的族人露營場都是用自宅作為管理看一下這個照片經營的是無橫露營區就好像這個照片一樣像這種僅有住宅跟預測的露營場我覺得交通部你們應該立刻要跟園民會成立輔導平台\n優先來協助處理他們所以我今天的三個總結是第一個要協助族人救濟現在已經要被開罰的人怎麼樣來協助他們第二個依照露營場的樣態然後分階段的來輔導並且要優先輔導無痕露營區第三個交通部和園民會你們必須要成立一個合作平台來輔導原住民經營的露營場可不可以\n我想說我們就跟他我看他們下禮拜做一個開會來討論就的確現在福島的困境尤其是原住民區他們是需要趕快合法來經營這件事對既有的嘛\n希望你們請這些各包括觀光署也好包括國土署也好包括園民會也好你們討論這個會議的時候也讓我知道因為\n高金委員發言\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.169 --> 00:13.617\n素梅委員發言好,謝謝召委,我們請王部長還有觀光署的周署長請王部長、周署長\n\n00:14.906 --> 00:30.992\n好,2022年的時候7月20日交通部你們發布了露營場管理要點我們原本以為既有的露營場的合法化工作就會順利地展開了可是一年半過去露營場合法化卻成了我們所有部落族人的噩夢\n\n00:31.912 --> 00:57.413\n我們來看一下根據官網署的統計目前全台灣露營場總共有1845處其中有1667處是沒有合法的根據我的了解目前申請的案件總共是800件但是屬於既有的廠家卻只有307件其他的493件都是新增的露營場而我們整合起來800件的申請案部長你知道有幾家通過了嗎?\n\n00:59.637 --> 00:59.817\n主席\n\n01:14.318 --> 01:40.128\n既有的業者來合法可是您看到我的數據一年半過去了既有業者不僅他的申請意願非常的低到現在沒有任何一家通過所以這件事情是恍然的那我們族人的噩夢是什麼呢因為露營場的設立不可以位於19項環境敏感區其中有一項叫做土石流淺室溪的範圍\n\n01:41.428 --> 02:09.013\n部長土石流產生的要件是什麼我們都知道土砂坡度大還要有水所以呢農業部因此公布的土石流潛勢溪流的範圍是用防災用的對不對他主要是在風險潛勢分級可能會影響的範圍之內然後以防災工作之用我要請教部長了颱風警戒發布的時候你會去露營嗎不會吧\n\n02:11.074 --> 02:22.186\n入營業者敢收這些客人嗎?也不會吧?所以根據水保署公告的土石流潛勢溪流你知道全台有多少個嗎?有1732條\n\n02:25.410 --> 02:42.169\n他的含括包括什麼風景區、休閒農業區、學校、寺廟、派出所就連山山國家風景區的獅山遊客中心他也位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍之內所以並沒有禁縣建\n\n02:46.494 --> 03:02.552\n可是根據非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定我們的露營場卻不可以位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍的請問一下我們的境線依據\n\n03:03.453 --> 03:17.523\n委託是毫無根據的嘛所以呢結果會造成我們現在族人一個很大的困擾是什麼嗎而且是已經發生的事情了就因為我們現在的住家位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍那麼他同時也是經營露營場現在卻被我們的縣市政府因為這樣子的你們所謂的要開放露營而被開罰了\n\n03:30.091 --> 03:51.844\n這顯然不合理也不合法的規定造成我們族人真的是很啞口無言所以是不是應該協助他們救濟這是我今天的問題第二點我要再建議部長針對19項環境敏感區不可以設立露營場的規定我希望一週內\n\n03:53.425 --> 04:20.472\n也希望你們來通知國土署來檢討修正非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定。部長你同意嗎?是,的確我們希望,錄影室現在很普遍,尤其在山地這個也非常普遍但是你談到現在最大問題的確就是這19項環境敏感地區限制它能夠合法的\n\n04:21.448 --> 04:39.202\n那這個我想說這部分我是不是請那個不用他回答了我剛剛就說請部長來一週內來請他們來開會包括這個營建署的國土署好不好國土署還有光這個現在錄影我還沒有請你回答說署長抱歉我再跟部長對話謝謝\n\n04:41.184 --> 05:08.988\n同時還要輔導我們露營場的工作因為交通部你們應該可以分階段來辦理特別是你應該也清楚5月1號縣市國土計畫他就要公告實施其中很重要的部分是原住民族的部落只要是在105年5月1號前他既有的住宅未來都會合法同時土地會變更為建地\n\n05:10.288 --> 05:30.356\n而原住民的土地也會同步來制定原住民族土地管制規則然後來進行建管的工作那因為我們很多的族人露營場都是用自宅作為管理看一下這個照片經營的是無橫露營區就好像這個照片一樣像這種僅有住宅跟預測的露營場我覺得交通部你們應該立刻要跟園民會成立輔導平台\n\n05:36.358 --> 06:04.046\n優先來協助處理他們所以我今天的三個總結是第一個要協助族人救濟現在已經要被開罰的人怎麼樣來協助他們第二個依照露營場的樣態然後分階段的來輔導並且要優先輔導無痕露營區第三個交通部和園民會你們必須要成立一個合作平台來輔導原住民經營的露營場可不可以\n\n06:04.606 --> 06:21.367\n我想說我們就跟他我看他們下禮拜做一個開會來討論就的確現在福島的困境尤其是原住民區他們是需要趕快合法來經營這件事對既有的嘛\n\n06:22.108 --> 06:24.709\n希望你們請這些各包括觀光署也好包括國土署也好包括園民會也好你們討論這個會議的時候也讓我知道因為\n\n06:44.753 --> 06:45.033\n高金委員發言\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.169,"end":13.617,"text":"素梅委員發言好,謝謝召委,我們請王部長還有觀光署的周署長請王部長、周署長"},{"start":14.906,"end":30.992,"text":"好,2022年的時候7月20日交通部你們發布了露營場管理要點我們原本以為既有的露營場的合法化工作就會順利地展開了可是一年半過去露營場合法化卻成了我們所有部落族人的噩夢"},{"start":31.912,"end":57.413,"text":"我們來看一下根據官網署的統計目前全台灣露營場總共有1845處其中有1667處是沒有合法的根據我的了解目前申請的案件總共是800件但是屬於既有的廠家卻只有307件其他的493件都是新增的露營場而我們整合起來800件的申請案部長你知道有幾家通過了嗎?"},{"start":59.637,"end":59.817,"text":"主席"},{"start":74.318,"end":100.128,"text":"既有的業者來合法可是您看到我的數據一年半過去了既有業者不僅他的申請意願非常的低到現在沒有任何一家通過所以這件事情是恍然的那我們族人的噩夢是什麼呢因為露營場的設立不可以位於19項環境敏感區其中有一項叫做土石流淺室溪的範圍"},{"start":101.428,"end":129.013,"text":"部長土石流產生的要件是什麼我們都知道土砂坡度大還要有水所以呢農業部因此公布的土石流潛勢溪流的範圍是用防災用的對不對他主要是在風險潛勢分級可能會影響的範圍之內然後以防災工作之用我要請教部長了颱風警戒發布的時候你會去露營嗎不會吧"},{"start":131.074,"end":142.186,"text":"入營業者敢收這些客人嗎?也不會吧?所以根據水保署公告的土石流潛勢溪流你知道全台有多少個嗎?有1732條"},{"start":145.41,"end":162.169,"text":"他的含括包括什麼風景區、休閒農業區、學校、寺廟、派出所就連山山國家風景區的獅山遊客中心他也位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍之內所以並沒有禁縣建"},{"start":166.494,"end":182.552,"text":"可是根據非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定我們的露營場卻不可以位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍的請問一下我們的境線依據"},{"start":183.453,"end":197.523,"text":"委託是毫無根據的嘛所以呢結果會造成我們現在族人一個很大的困擾是什麼嗎而且是已經發生的事情了就因為我們現在的住家位於土石流潛勢溪流範圍那麼他同時也是經營露營場現在卻被我們的縣市政府因為這樣子的你們所謂的要開放露營而被開罰了"},{"start":210.091,"end":231.844,"text":"這顯然不合理也不合法的規定造成我們族人真的是很啞口無言所以是不是應該協助他們救濟這是我今天的問題第二點我要再建議部長針對19項環境敏感區不可以設立露營場的規定我希望一週內"},{"start":233.425,"end":260.472,"text":"也希望你們來通知國土署來檢討修正非都市土地使用管制規則第6條附表1的規定。部長你同意嗎?是,的確我們希望,錄影室現在很普遍,尤其在山地這個也非常普遍但是你談到現在最大問題的確就是這19項環境敏感地區限制它能夠合法的"},{"start":261.448,"end":279.202,"text":"那這個我想說這部分我是不是請那個不用他回答了我剛剛就說請部長來一週內來請他們來開會包括這個營建署的國土署好不好國土署還有光這個現在錄影我還沒有請你回答說署長抱歉我再跟部長對話謝謝"},{"start":281.184,"end":308.988,"text":"同時還要輔導我們露營場的工作因為交通部你們應該可以分階段來辦理特別是你應該也清楚5月1號縣市國土計畫他就要公告實施其中很重要的部分是原住民族的部落只要是在105年5月1號前他既有的住宅未來都會合法同時土地會變更為建地"},{"start":310.288,"end":330.356,"text":"而原住民的土地也會同步來制定原住民族土地管制規則然後來進行建管的工作那因為我們很多的族人露營場都是用自宅作為管理看一下這個照片經營的是無橫露營區就好像這個照片一樣像這種僅有住宅跟預測的露營場我覺得交通部你們應該立刻要跟園民會成立輔導平台"},{"start":336.358,"end":364.046,"text":"優先來協助處理他們所以我今天的三個總結是第一個要協助族人救濟現在已經要被開罰的人怎麼樣來協助他們第二個依照露營場的樣態然後分階段的來輔導並且要優先輔導無痕露營區第三個交通部和園民會你們必須要成立一個合作平台來輔導原住民經營的露營場可不可以"},{"start":364.606,"end":381.367,"text":"我想說我們就跟他我看他們下禮拜做一個開會來討論就的確現在福島的困境尤其是原住民區他們是需要趕快合法來經營這件事對既有的嘛"},{"start":382.108,"end":384.709,"text":"希望你們請這些各包括觀光署也好包括國土署也好包括園民會也好你們討論這個會議的時候也讓我知道因為"},{"start":404.753,"end":405.033,"text":"高金委員發言"}]}}}}