{"id":149531,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149531","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/1441ba9c2015bdbe9ed3d8bdccb12c0c52afbb2d65d0dae1f8ba9b0039caa7a675552f8ea93320f75ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"羅智強","委員發言時間":"11:25:24 - 11:31:20","影片長度":"00:05:56","會議時間":"2024-03-07T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第3次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國防部部長邱國正報告業務概況，並備質詢。）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第3次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":3,"committees":[35],"id":"委員會-11-1-35-3"},"date":"2024-03-07","duration":356,"end_time":"2024-03-07T11:31:20+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-07T11:25:24+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":624,"blocks":[["羅委員智強：（11時25分）主席，有請部長。"],["主席：部長請。"],["邱部長國正：羅委員好。"],["羅委員智強：部長好。前幾天您到立法院來備詢，受訪時對外表示，你說坦言擔憂兩岸敵意螺旋升高，所以希望能夠避免戰爭，因此從未挑起或挑釁，不過，如何用平和的方式來處理，不光是軍方做決定，還涉及政治跟外交，軍事是政治的延長，政治有很多作為，軍事不宜貿然躁進。我認同部長您說的這一段話，最近大家確實有很多人擔心兩岸的敵意不斷地升高，我看到趙春山教授也說，拖越久，兩岸敵意螺旋持續上升，所以如果大陸要對臺灣動武，我一點也不驚訝。","我想請教部長，你為什麼覺得兩岸敵意會升高呢？"],["邱部長國正：因為我多年看到這個狀況，我自己在內心做一個衡量比較！以前沒有的，現在都發生了嘛！而且以前他也沒有講不承認中心線、不承認這個、那個，那他既然講出來，這不就是危機的一個升高嗎？"],["羅委員智強：對。所以換言之，先就您在國防部的業務上所看到的，您覺得過去有些他們沒有做的，現在都做了，是不是？"],["邱部長國正：對。"],["羅委員智強：比方說第一個是什麼？比方說？具體有哪些？"],["邱部長國正：比如說，以前好像出海，空中或海航兵力、頻次，然後它的距離，或者以前從來沒有到ADIZ裡面，後來初步從北端、從南端的灰地就慢慢進來了。甚至於一有什麼政治方面的問題的話，他藉著軍事動作來表達他政治方面不滿，這我都看得出來，所以這的確是有很大變化。"],["羅委員智強：是，所以我想部長等於也是在為國家守衛安全的第一線，所以親身感受到這個敵意螺旋上升的跡證嘛！我想請問您，您覺得目前政府端有哪些方式還有可能去降低敵意螺旋的呢？"],["邱部長國正：我講了嘛！軍事是政治延長，政治層面有很多東西，問到我，我提供意見；沒有問到我的話，我就強化我的戰備。但是一切我們還是那句話，就算提出意見，他也很清楚，接受我提意見的也很清楚，不宜貿然地挑起任何戰端，這是大家共有的共識，這是絕對沒問題的。"],["羅委員智強：趙春山教授所擔心的動武也不意外，你覺得目前的走向會有這個跡象嗎？往動武的方向走嗎？"],["邱部長國正：趙教授我也很敬佩他，以前也接觸過，他是按照這個常理來推嘛！因為螺旋慢慢升高了，而且很多意外的狀況，萬一擦槍走火，雖然在克制，但難免萬一擦槍走火的話，這個問題誰都不敢保證。就跟我們海巡在執法當中碰到這種狀況，不願意發生，但畢竟是碰到了。碰到以後，這就提升危機，所以這種事情一發生以後，起了戰端，那並不意外，所以我們不樂見，還是要努力去防備。"],["羅委員智強：我有一個感觸啦！我剛剛才從質詢陸委會過來，我真的是誠摯地希望我們政府尤其跟兩岸有關的部門、部會能夠多跟我們的邱部長請教啦！"],["邱部長國正：不敢。"],["羅委員智強：因為我覺得，事實上您比較能夠去比較和緩、收縮，就是說能夠顧住我們的國家安全的尊嚴的前提之下……"],["邱部長國正：對。"],["羅委員智強：我覺得您的一些擔憂能不能也適時地傳遞給我們現在的行政團隊？目前看到有一些作法上的話，我覺得我是滿肯定您目前對於兩岸之間問題的處理態度。我希望能夠也讓你這個態度不會是只有國防部或是您個人的態度，也希望是政府處理現在兩岸不斷衝突的一個態度，希望部長能夠再加油一下。"],["邱部長國正：是。報告委員，我是行政團隊一員，只要有益於我工作推動，而且跟行政團隊有利的，問到我的話，我都會提供這個意見的。"],["羅委員智強：是。因為以前實質上比較沒有面對所謂第一擊的問題啦！因為兩岸關係在之前相對比較和緩，所以那種越來越拉近，所謂我們講的緩衝越來越小的情況比較少。我有聽到您說我們的第一擊要件也改變了，不等對方開槍開砲，這第一擊要件有沒有辦法更明確告訴我們？什麼情況之下，我們會第一擊？"],["邱部長國正：我跟委員報告，當初訂的第一擊要由部長來決定要反制的命令，是在湯部長，他為了要承擔責任。我們現在改那個第一擊，通常一聽到第一擊，不外乎槍砲飛彈，這叫第一擊。我們現在目前環境的變化，灰色地帶這種襲擾，我們看到他方法很多，不見得開槍開砲。所以我就把他界定為，只要是一個航空器材或者海航的一個實體逾越我們的規範，譬如說我們的界線，我就把它當作它發起的第一擊。它現在發起第一擊，我們就有權力針對它的第一擊做反制。所以我們沒有第一擊的問題，我們只有反制的問題。"],["羅委員智強：好，謝謝部長，以上。"],["主席：謝謝羅智強委員，部長請回。"],["邱部長國正：謝謝委員。"],["主席：我們接戰的規範到目前還是機密嗎？第一擊定義應該是羅委員問的第一擊定義，但是我們接戰的規範是機密，我印象我們在國防委員，包含我們本會委員都沒辦法問這個問題。好，謝謝。","好，接下來進行詢答委員是李柏毅委員，時間5分鐘。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":60,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-35-3","speakers":["王定宇","羅美玲","沈伯洋","徐巧芯","馬文君","陳永康","洪申翰","林楚茵","林憶君","鄭天財Sra 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00:01:05,100\n軍事是政治的延長,那政治有很多作為軍事不宜貿然躁進那我認同部長您說的這一段話那最近大家確實有很多人擔心兩岸的敵意不斷的升高我看到那個趙春山教授也說拖越久兩岸敵意螺旋持續上升所以如果大陸要對台灣動我一點也不驚訝那我想請教部長你為什麼覺得兩岸敵意會升高呢\n\n4\n00:01:06,321 --> 00:01:21,459\n因為我是多年看到這個狀況,當年我在自己做內心一個衡量比較以前沒有的現在都發生了,而且以前他也沒有講不承認中信,不承認這個那個,他現在竟然講出來,那這不就是一個\n\n5\n00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:38,934\n對﹖所以換言之就是先不管先把就是您在國防部的業務上所看到的吧你就覺得過去有些他們沒有做的現在都做了是不是那比方說第一個是什麼比方說具體的哪些\n\n6\n00:01:47,947 --> 00:01:47,967\n羅智強\n\n7\n00:02:06,733 --> 00:02:24,626\n所以我想部長也是在等於是為國家守衛安全的第一線所以親身感受到這一個敵意螺旋上升的一個激戰那我想請問您就是說您覺得目前政府端有哪些方式還有可能去降低敵意螺旋的呢\n\n8\n00:02:25,890 --> 00:02:48,095\n我講了軍事政治延長政治層面有很多問到我我提供意見沒有問到我的話我就強化我的戰備但是一切我們還是那句話就算提出意見他們也很清楚接受我提意見的人也很清楚不宜貿然挑起任何戰端這是大家共有共識這是絕對沒問題的\n\n9\n00:02:50,080 --> 00:03:15,747\n那趙春山教授所擔心的話就是動武也不意外你覺得目前的走向會有這個跡象嗎往動武的方向走嗎趙教授我也很敬佩他以前也接觸過他就按照這個常理來推嘛因為羅智強辦案升高了而且很多的意外的狀況萬一擦槍走火雖然再克制但難免萬一擦槍走火的話\n\n10\n00:03:16,787 --> 00:03:17,247\n我有一個感觸,我剛才從質詢陸委會過來\n\n11\n00:03:43,789 --> 00:04:05,787\n那我真的是這邊誠摯的希望就是說我們政府其他尤其跟兩岸有關的部門的部會能夠多跟我們的邱部長你請教因為我覺得事實上您的很多比較能夠去比較和緩收縮就是說能夠去當然也要顧住我們的國家安全的尊嚴的前提之下\n\n12\n00:04:06,508 --> 00:04:31,779\n那我覺得您的一些擔憂能不能也適時的傳遞給我們現在的行政團隊那我覺得目前看到有些做法上的話我覺得我是蠻肯定您目前對於就是兩岸之間的問題的一個處理的態度那我希望能夠也讓你這個態度不會是只有國防部或是您個人的態度也希望是政府來處理現在兩岸不斷衝突的一個態度那希望部長您能夠再加油一下\n\n13\n00:04:32,039 --> 00:04:39,982\n因為以前實際上比較沒有面對所謂第一級的問題因為兩岸關係在之前相對比較和緩所以那種所謂的越來越拉近這個所謂我們講的緩衝越來越小的情況比較少那我也聽到您說我們的第一級要件也改變了不等對方開槍開炮\n\n14\n00:05:01,189 --> 00:05:19,200\n那我想說這第1集要件有沒有辦法更明確告訴我們什麼情況之下我們會第1集我跟委員報告當初的定第1集要由部長來決定要反制的這個命令是當初在湯部長他會要承擔責任但我們現在改這個第1集他通常一聽到第1集\n\n15\n00:05:21,221 --> 00:05:35,606\n在目前環境的變化,灰色地帶的洗澡,我們看到方法很多,不見得開槍開炮,所以我就把它界定為一個航空器材,或者海航的一個實體\n\n16\n00:05:37,262 --> 00:05:38,443\n謝謝羅智強委員：部長請回\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n2890\t2910\t來 部長請\n11601\t34699\t各位好部長好前幾天您到立法院來備詢那受訪時對外表示你說坦言擔憂兩岸敵意螺旋升高所以希望能夠避免戰爭嘛那因此從未挑起或挑釁不過如何用平和的方式來處理不光是軍方做決定還涉及政治跟外交\n36120\t65100\t軍事是政治的延長,那政治有很多作為軍事不宜貿然躁進那我認同部長您說的這一段話那最近大家確實有很多人擔心兩岸的敵意不斷的升高我看到那個趙春山教授也說拖越久兩岸敵意螺旋持續上升所以如果大陸要對台灣動我一點也不驚訝那我想請教部長你為什麼覺得兩岸敵意會升高呢\n66321\t81459\t因為我是多年看到這個狀況,當年我在自己做內心一個衡量比較以前沒有的現在都發生了,而且以前他也沒有講不承認中信,不承認這個那個,他現在竟然講出來,那這不就是一個\n84080\t98934\t對﹖所以換言之就是先不管先把就是您在國防部的業務上所看到的吧你就覺得過去有些他們沒有做的現在都做了是不是那比方說第一個是什麼比方說具體的哪些\n107947\t107967\t羅智強\n126733\t144626\t所以我想部長也是在等於是為國家守衛安全的第一線所以親身感受到這一個敵意螺旋上升的一個激戰那我想請問您就是說您覺得目前政府端有哪些方式還有可能去降低敵意螺旋的呢\n145890\t168095\t我講了軍事政治延長政治層面有很多問到我我提供意見沒有問到我的話我就強化我的戰備但是一切我們還是那句話就算提出意見他們也很清楚接受我提意見的人也很清楚不宜貿然挑起任何戰端這是大家共有共識這是絕對沒問題的\n170080\t195747\t那趙春山教授所擔心的話就是動武也不意外你覺得目前的走向會有這個跡象嗎往動武的方向走嗎趙教授我也很敬佩他以前也接觸過他就按照這個常理來推嘛因為羅智強辦案升高了而且很多的意外的狀況萬一擦槍走火雖然再克制但難免萬一擦槍走火的話\n196787\t197247\t我有一個感觸,我剛才從質詢陸委會過來\n223789\t245787\t那我真的是這邊誠摯的希望就是說我們政府其他尤其跟兩岸有關的部門的部會能夠多跟我們的邱部長你請教因為我覺得事實上您的很多比較能夠去比較和緩收縮就是說能夠去當然也要顧住我們的國家安全的尊嚴的前提之下\n246508\t271779\t那我覺得您的一些擔憂能不能也適時的傳遞給我們現在的行政團隊那我覺得目前看到有些做法上的話我覺得我是蠻肯定您目前對於就是兩岸之間的問題的一個處理的態度那我希望能夠也讓你這個態度不會是只有國防部或是您個人的態度也希望是政府來處理現在兩岸不斷衝突的一個態度那希望部長您能夠再加油一下\n272039\t279982\t因為以前實際上比較沒有面對所謂第一級的問題因為兩岸關係在之前相對比較和緩所以那種所謂的越來越拉近這個所謂我們講的緩衝越來越小的情況比較少那我也聽到您說我們的第一級要件也改變了不等對方開槍開炮\n301189\t319200\t那我想說這第1集要件有沒有辦法更明確告訴我們什麼情況之下我們會第1集我跟委員報告當初的定第1集要由部長來決定要反制的這個命令是當初在湯部長他會要承擔責任但我們現在改這個第1集他通常一聽到第1集\n321221\t335606\t在目前環境的變化,灰色地帶的洗澡,我們看到方法很多,不見得開槍開炮,所以我就把它界定為一個航空器材,或者海航的一個實體\n337262\t338443\t謝謝羅智強委員：部長請回\n","txt":"來 部長請\n各位好部長好前幾天您到立法院來備詢那受訪時對外表示你說坦言擔憂兩岸敵意螺旋升高所以希望能夠避免戰爭嘛那因此從未挑起或挑釁不過如何用平和的方式來處理不光是軍方做決定還涉及政治跟外交\n軍事是政治的延長,那政治有很多作為軍事不宜貿然躁進那我認同部長您說的這一段話那最近大家確實有很多人擔心兩岸的敵意不斷的升高我看到那個趙春山教授也說拖越久兩岸敵意螺旋持續上升所以如果大陸要對台灣動我一點也不驚訝那我想請教部長你為什麼覺得兩岸敵意會升高呢\n因為我是多年看到這個狀況,當年我在自己做內心一個衡量比較以前沒有的現在都發生了,而且以前他也沒有講不承認中信,不承認這個那個,他現在竟然講出來,那這不就是一個\n對﹖所以換言之就是先不管先把就是您在國防部的業務上所看到的吧你就覺得過去有些他們沒有做的現在都做了是不是那比方說第一個是什麼比方說具體的哪些\n羅智強\n所以我想部長也是在等於是為國家守衛安全的第一線所以親身感受到這一個敵意螺旋上升的一個激戰那我想請問您就是說您覺得目前政府端有哪些方式還有可能去降低敵意螺旋的呢\n我講了軍事政治延長政治層面有很多問到我我提供意見沒有問到我的話我就強化我的戰備但是一切我們還是那句話就算提出意見他們也很清楚接受我提意見的人也很清楚不宜貿然挑起任何戰端這是大家共有共識這是絕對沒問題的\n那趙春山教授所擔心的話就是動武也不意外你覺得目前的走向會有這個跡象嗎往動武的方向走嗎趙教授我也很敬佩他以前也接觸過他就按照這個常理來推嘛因為羅智強辦案升高了而且很多的意外的狀況萬一擦槍走火雖然再克制但難免萬一擦槍走火的話\n我有一個感觸,我剛才從質詢陸委會過來\n那我真的是這邊誠摯的希望就是說我們政府其他尤其跟兩岸有關的部門的部會能夠多跟我們的邱部長你請教因為我覺得事實上您的很多比較能夠去比較和緩收縮就是說能夠去當然也要顧住我們的國家安全的尊嚴的前提之下\n那我覺得您的一些擔憂能不能也適時的傳遞給我們現在的行政團隊那我覺得目前看到有些做法上的話我覺得我是蠻肯定您目前對於就是兩岸之間的問題的一個處理的態度那我希望能夠也讓你這個態度不會是只有國防部或是您個人的態度也希望是政府來處理現在兩岸不斷衝突的一個態度那希望部長您能夠再加油一下\n因為以前實際上比較沒有面對所謂第一級的問題因為兩岸關係在之前相對比較和緩所以那種所謂的越來越拉近這個所謂我們講的緩衝越來越小的情況比較少那我也聽到您說我們的第一級要件也改變了不等對方開槍開炮\n那我想說這第1集要件有沒有辦法更明確告訴我們什麼情況之下我們會第1集我跟委員報告當初的定第1集要由部長來決定要反制的這個命令是當初在湯部長他會要承擔責任但我們現在改這個第1集他通常一聽到第1集\n在目前環境的變化,灰色地帶的洗澡,我們看到方法很多,不見得開槍開炮,所以我就把它界定為一個航空器材,或者海航的一個實體\n謝謝羅智強委員：部長請回\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:02.890 --> 00:02.910\n來部長請\n\n00:11.601 --> 00:34.699\n各位好部長好前幾天您到立法院來備詢那受訪時對外表示你說坦言擔憂兩岸敵意螺旋升高所以希望能夠避免戰爭嘛那因此從未挑起或挑釁不過如何用平和的方式來處理不光是軍方做決定還涉及政治跟外交\n\n00:36.120 --> 01:05.100\n軍事是政治的延長,那政治有很多作為軍事不宜貿然躁進那我認同部長您說的這一段話那最近大家確實有很多人擔心兩岸的敵意不斷的升高我看到那個趙春山教授也說拖越久兩岸敵意螺旋持續上升所以如果大陸要對台灣動我一點也不驚訝那我想請教部長你為什麼覺得兩岸敵意會升高呢\n\n01:06.321 --> 01:21.459\n因為我是多年看到這個狀況,當年我在自己做內心一個衡量比較以前沒有的現在都發生了,而且以前他也沒有講不承認中信,不承認這個那個,他現在竟然講出來,那這不就是一個\n\n01:24.080 --> 01:38.934\n對﹖所以換言之就是先不管先把就是您在國防部的業務上所看到的吧你就覺得過去有些他們沒有做的現在都做了是不是那比方說第一個是什麼比方說具體的哪些\n\n01:47.947 --> 01:47.967\n羅智強\n\n02:06.733 --> 02:24.626\n所以我想部長也是在等於是為國家守衛安全的第一線所以親身感受到這一個敵意螺旋上升的一個激戰那我想請問您就是說您覺得目前政府端有哪些方式還有可能去降低敵意螺旋的呢\n\n02:25.890 --> 02:48.095\n我講了軍事政治延長政治層面有很多問到我我提供意見沒有問到我的話我就強化我的戰備但是一切我們還是那句話就算提出意見他們也很清楚接受我提意見的人也很清楚不宜貿然挑起任何戰端這是大家共有共識這是絕對沒問題的\n\n02:50.080 --> 03:15.747\n那趙春山教授所擔心的話就是動武也不意外你覺得目前的走向會有這個跡象嗎往動武的方向走嗎趙教授我也很敬佩他以前也接觸過他就按照這個常理來推嘛因為羅智強辦案升高了而且很多的意外的狀況萬一擦槍走火雖然再克制但難免萬一擦槍走火的話\n\n03:16.787 --> 03:17.247\n我有一個感觸,我剛才從質詢陸委會過來\n\n03:43.789 --> 04:05.787\n那我真的是這邊誠摯的希望就是說我們政府其他尤其跟兩岸有關的部門的部會能夠多跟我們的邱部長你請教因為我覺得事實上您的很多比較能夠去比較和緩收縮就是說能夠去當然也要顧住我們的國家安全的尊嚴的前提之下\n\n04:06.508 --> 04:31.779\n那我覺得您的一些擔憂能不能也適時的傳遞給我們現在的行政團隊那我覺得目前看到有些做法上的話我覺得我是蠻肯定您目前對於就是兩岸之間的問題的一個處理的態度那我希望能夠也讓你這個態度不會是只有國防部或是您個人的態度也希望是政府來處理現在兩岸不斷衝突的一個態度那希望部長您能夠再加油一下\n\n04:32.039 --> 04:39.982\n因為以前實際上比較沒有面對所謂第一級的問題因為兩岸關係在之前相對比較和緩所以那種所謂的越來越拉近這個所謂我們講的緩衝越來越小的情況比較少那我也聽到您說我們的第一級要件也改變了不等對方開槍開炮\n\n05:01.189 --> 05:19.200\n那我想說這第1集要件有沒有辦法更明確告訴我們什麼情況之下我們會第1集我跟委員報告當初的定第1集要由部長來決定要反制的這個命令是當初在湯部長他會要承擔責任但我們現在改這個第1集他通常一聽到第1集\n\n05:21.221 --> 05:35.606\n在目前環境的變化,灰色地帶的洗澡,我們看到方法很多,不見得開槍開炮,所以我就把它界定為一個航空器材,或者海航的一個實體\n\n05:37.262 --> 05:38.443\n謝謝羅智強委員：部長請回\n\n","segments":[{"start":2.89,"end":2.91,"text":"來 部長請"},{"start":11.601,"end":34.699,"text":"各位好部長好前幾天您到立法院來備詢那受訪時對外表示你說坦言擔憂兩岸敵意螺旋升高所以希望能夠避免戰爭嘛那因此從未挑起或挑釁不過如何用平和的方式來處理不光是軍方做決定還涉及政治跟外交"},{"start":36.12,"end":65.1,"text":"軍事是政治的延長,那政治有很多作為軍事不宜貿然躁進那我認同部長您說的這一段話那最近大家確實有很多人擔心兩岸的敵意不斷的升高我看到那個趙春山教授也說拖越久兩岸敵意螺旋持續上升所以如果大陸要對台灣動我一點也不驚訝那我想請教部長你為什麼覺得兩岸敵意會升高呢"},{"start":66.321,"end":81.459,"text":"因為我是多年看到這個狀況,當年我在自己做內心一個衡量比較以前沒有的現在都發生了,而且以前他也沒有講不承認中信,不承認這個那個,他現在竟然講出來,那這不就是一個"},{"start":84.08,"end":98.934,"text":"對﹖所以換言之就是先不管先把就是您在國防部的業務上所看到的吧你就覺得過去有些他們沒有做的現在都做了是不是那比方說第一個是什麼比方說具體的哪些"},{"start":107.947,"end":107.967,"text":"羅智強"},{"start":126.733,"end":144.626,"text":"所以我想部長也是在等於是為國家守衛安全的第一線所以親身感受到這一個敵意螺旋上升的一個激戰那我想請問您就是說您覺得目前政府端有哪些方式還有可能去降低敵意螺旋的呢"},{"start":145.89,"end":168.095,"text":"我講了軍事政治延長政治層面有很多問到我我提供意見沒有問到我的話我就強化我的戰備但是一切我們還是那句話就算提出意見他們也很清楚接受我提意見的人也很清楚不宜貿然挑起任何戰端這是大家共有共識這是絕對沒問題的"},{"start":170.08,"end":195.747,"text":"那趙春山教授所擔心的話就是動武也不意外你覺得目前的走向會有這個跡象嗎往動武的方向走嗎趙教授我也很敬佩他以前也接觸過他就按照這個常理來推嘛因為羅智強辦案升高了而且很多的意外的狀況萬一擦槍走火雖然再克制但難免萬一擦槍走火的話"},{"start":196.787,"end":197.247,"text":"我有一個感觸,我剛才從質詢陸委會過來"},{"start":223.789,"end":245.787,"text":"那我真的是這邊誠摯的希望就是說我們政府其他尤其跟兩岸有關的部門的部會能夠多跟我們的邱部長你請教因為我覺得事實上您的很多比較能夠去比較和緩收縮就是說能夠去當然也要顧住我們的國家安全的尊嚴的前提之下"},{"start":246.508,"end":271.779,"text":"那我覺得您的一些擔憂能不能也適時的傳遞給我們現在的行政團隊那我覺得目前看到有些做法上的話我覺得我是蠻肯定您目前對於就是兩岸之間的問題的一個處理的態度那我希望能夠也讓你這個態度不會是只有國防部或是您個人的態度也希望是政府來處理現在兩岸不斷衝突的一個態度那希望部長您能夠再加油一下"},{"start":272.039,"end":279.982,"text":"因為以前實際上比較沒有面對所謂第一級的問題因為兩岸關係在之前相對比較和緩所以那種所謂的越來越拉近這個所謂我們講的緩衝越來越小的情況比較少那我也聽到您說我們的第一級要件也改變了不等對方開槍開炮"},{"start":301.189,"end":319.2,"text":"那我想說這第1集要件有沒有辦法更明確告訴我們什麼情況之下我們會第1集我跟委員報告當初的定第1集要由部長來決定要反制的這個命令是當初在湯部長他會要承擔責任但我們現在改這個第1集他通常一聽到第1集"},{"start":321.221,"end":335.606,"text":"在目前環境的變化,灰色地帶的洗澡,我們看到方法很多,不見得開槍開炮,所以我就把它界定為一個航空器材,或者海航的一個實體"},{"start":337.262,"end":338.443,"text":"謝謝羅智強委員：部長請回"}]}}}}