{"id":149715,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149715","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3a8d0956074a2938d0c3d9e205feffba04b328b65eecebe0f8ba9b0039caa7a631c2673164c3cee95ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"李彥秀","委員發言時間":"10:04:34 - 10:20:24","影片長度":"00:15:50","會議時間":"2024-03-12T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第11屆第1會期第4次會議（事由：一、對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢。\n二、3月8日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。 \n三、3月12日下午1時50分至2時30分為處理臨時提案時間。）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"立法院第11屆第1會期第4次會議","id":"院會-11-1-4","type":"院會","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":4},"date":"2024-03-12","duration":950,"end_time":"2024-03-12T10:20:24+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-12T10:04:34+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":420,"blocks":[["李委員彥秀：（10時4分）謝謝。主席，我們請陳院長。"],["主席：再請陳院長備詢。"],["陳院長建仁：李委員早，恭喜你當選立委。"],["李委員彥秀：謝謝院長，早安！今天我希望我們可以在質詢過程當中問出一些我們民眾想要知道的答案跟問題。"],["陳院長建仁：好。"],["李委員彥秀：院長，我們在處理年改的時候，特別加了一個非常重要的條文，對於物價指數超過5%的時候或者每4年，我們都應該去列入調整。"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["李委員彥秀：今年在選舉過程當中，從1月4號的新聞上，我也看到你有提到，今年因為我們111年的CPI物價指數漲了2.95，112年漲到2.49，上個月主計處公布的CPI物價消費指數更漲到3.08，我想物價通膨你非常清楚，111、112其實也超過5%，所以我也感謝院長，你看到這些指數已經超過了，行政院馬上就將這個部分列入討論，退休的軍公教人員有很多人都靠著退休金在生活。"],["陳院長建仁：沒有錯。"],["李委員彥秀：你也非常清楚地知道現在物價指數的狀況，買一個便當可能120塊，要再加蛋可能變135。對於人民的痛苦，只要退休金增加一些些、調整一些些，對他來說都有很大的幫助，很多人都是靠這份退休金在生活，所以我想請問院長，距離上次1月5號的承諾，有很多人批評您說：哎呀！這個又是政策選舉在買票，但是2個月、3個月過去了，現在已經3月12號了，很多人都在等，不是說好要調嗎？怎麼沒有調？"],["陳院長建仁：有啊！"],["李委員彥秀：我在基層很多人都在問我，所以院長你要不要回應一下，就是到底什麼時候調？要不要調？是不是真的有要調？是不是1個月之內就要調？因為每個月都差很多，對很多人來講，他可能1個月差個一、兩千塊，對他來說生活都影響非常大，你要不要具體地回應？到底你是要留給下一任的行政院長來公布，還是最近就要調？"],["陳院長建仁：不會，委員，最重要的是這樣子，因為這個和物價調整有關，物價調整最後那幾年的情況是主計處要有一個正式的公告，所以……"],["李委員彥秀：是，院長……"],["陳院長建仁：但是我要跟委員講的是，去年我們也想說可能會超過5%，所以去年就開始編列預算，但是……"],["李委員彥秀：是，你已經匡列了44億，院長我知道，要法源有法源，因為2年加起來的物價指數也超過5%，我剛才已經報告過。"],["陳院長建仁：是，但是真正要調多少，要看那個物價指數，所以我們才跟考試院以及……"],["李委員彥秀：是，要考試院、銓敘部跟國防部。"],["陳院長建仁：對，國防部一起，所以最近這個一定會……"],["李委員彥秀：院長，我現在要問時間啦，我知道其實這個都是行政作業，也不需要做到2個月，如果這個事情你覺得很重要，其實早就應該有答案。"],["陳院長建仁：對啊，所以我們……"],["李委員彥秀：所以我今天希望具體地幫所有軍公教同仁請問院長，到底這件事情什麼時候可以做？因為到時候你當然會追溯到1月1號，但是每個月錢都不夠用啊！所以院長到底什麼時候要做？"],["陳院長建仁：對，我想在最近……"],["李委員彥秀：是520前，還是下個月，還是1個月內？"],["陳院長建仁：在最近就會公告了。"],["李委員彥秀：最近？在1個月之內？"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["李委員彥秀：好，感謝院長。時間先暫停，請林右昌部長。"],["主席：請內政部備詢。"],["李委員彥秀：院長，我的時間不要一直走。"],["主席：時間暫停。"],["李委員彥秀：院長，我想第二個政策非常重要，我覺得居住正義是社會正義當中非常重要的一環。"],["陳院長建仁：確實。"],["李委員彥秀：我相信您同意。"],["陳院長建仁：我同意。"],["李委員彥秀：過去七、八年來蔡英文強調我們要興建20萬戶的社宅，賴清德更談到他要興建100萬戶，社宅的興建有它的挑戰跟困難度。"],["陳院長建仁：不是興建100萬戶，是包括包租代管還有房租補貼。"],["李委員彥秀：對，包租代管，但是我們都非常清楚，包括林右昌部長過去擔任過基隆市市長，你非常清楚興建的困難度在哪裡，所以我們才有包租代管政策。我也關注到您在基隆市市長任內的時候，包括中央的興建其實有449戶，但是我想你知道取得土地的困難度，我相信你同意我的說法，基隆的基地不大，公有土地不多，所以基隆市當時自己興建的不多，但是你的包租代管政策是成功的，我這樣講、這樣肯定你可以吧？"],["林部長右昌：謝謝。"],["李委員彥秀：來，我們來看幾個數據，我的數據裡面，大家可以看到包租代管過去有20萬戶，蔡英文的20萬戶，包租代管將近占了五成，所以包租代管的政策對我們來說其實是相對重要的，因為興建要找土地不是那麼容易，鄰近要蓋的時候，又要跟旁邊鄰地的住戶做更多的溝通，所以包租代管是重要的政策。我們也看到過去這7、8年已完成興建的只有12.8戶，然後我們再看下一張圖表……"],["陳院長建仁：12.8萬戶。"],["李委員彥秀：真正包租代管政策成功也將近占了五成，在臺北市3,296戶、新北市六千多戶、桃園一萬多戶、臺中市5,228戶，基隆就3,190戶，以人口數來說，基隆包租代管做得相當的成功。","部長，我要請教您，六都裡面各縣市租金有沒有差異性？"],["林部長右昌：當然有差異性。"],["李委員彥秀：對，我覺得我們現在包租代管政策做得好很重要，您剛才也同意，我們給的獎勵、優惠或給的蘿蔔是，你如果提出要包租代管的話，房東可以免1萬5,000塊的優惠，對不對？"],["林部長右昌：那個是稅金……"],["李委員彥秀：但是部長，你知道嗎？新北市、臺北市跟基隆市1萬5,000可以租到幾坪的房子？我幫你算，因為時間不多，臺北市大概只可以租到9坪，新北市可以租到16坪，所以1萬5,000塊的租稅優惠，其實我覺得在各縣市應該有差異性或者放寬，我們才有機會包租代管政策能夠做得更成功。院長、部長，你同意我的說法嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：對啦！但是我要跟委員講，你也剛才提到，因為以現在這樣的免稅額度，我們也發現包租代管的事情是很蓬勃在進行，甚至有些……"],["李委員彥秀：對啦！但是院長，我要告訴你……"],["陳院長建仁：你現在要講縣市差異，是嗎？"],["李委員彥秀：很多租金都是隱形收入，你稽查也不好稽查，有沒有被課到稅不好稽查，房東配合包租代管，反而被懲罰到，因為變成他的租金要揭露，對不對？部長，你同意嘛！對不對？"],["林部長右昌：不過我們現在因為已經修法，這部分是……"],["李委員彥秀：對，所以我前幾天特別在財政委員會質詢的時候跟莊部長討論，我覺得我們的包租代管成功是社會住宅居住正義當中很重要的一環，達標很重要的一環。但是各縣市在1萬5,000塊，第一，要不是更放寬，我們提高上限；第二，要不然我們就應該有各縣市租金收入的差異性，院長，您瞭解我的意思嗎？譬如以臺北市來說……"],["陳院長建仁：是免稅額的差異性。"],["李委員彥秀：我們免稅額的差異性應該要出來，我們的包租代管政策才有機會像基隆做的這麼成功，你同意我的說法嗎？部長，我們可不可以研擬這樣的方向來進行？"],["林部長右昌：謝謝委員的建議，當然這個意見其實之前也有人提過，不過它也會衍生其他的問題，因為你知道，就是所有補助的金額跟標準會整個都沒有一致性，還有第二個是其實我們……"],["李委員彥秀：部長，沒有一致性，我覺得一條法令化，但是這就是牽涉到你包租代管要不要成功這件事情……"],["林部長右昌：是，我跟委員……"],["李委員彥秀：各縣市有它的差異性在……"],["林部長右昌：我30秒跟委員報告一下……"],["李委員彥秀：地價也不一樣、租金也不一樣，你很清楚，在臺北市1萬5,000塊可以租到9坪的房子，在新北市可以租到16坪，所以我覺得每個縣市要把包租代管做得更成功，免稅額的差異性要出來，要不然你就把它放得更寬，要不然你把它放到3萬塊，那我們包租代管就有機會成功。","所以我分兩個層次來跟您建議，第一個，我們放寬免稅額的上限，譬如說是2萬5、3萬塊，你們去做討論；第二，要不然就是各縣市要有差異性出來，我們才有機會讓包租代管政策在全國各縣市都能夠做得更成功，有更多的包租代管的房子願意進來，社會住宅的政策才有機會做得更成功。"],["陳院長建仁：委員，謝謝你的創意和建議啦！因為這個會跟政府的稅收也有關係，所以我們會讓……"],["李委員彥秀：你們算其實差沒多少啦！"],["陳院長建仁：財政部來研議一下。"],["李委員彥秀：但是對於貧富的差距，買不到房子、租不到房子，在六都裡面其實大家都是有感的，所以你們才講說居住正義很重要，好不好？"],["陳院長建仁：讓我們來研議。"],["李委員彥秀：我們趕快來研擬，好不好？朝修法的方向來研擬。"],["林部長右昌：跟委員報告，這個正本清源，我們最重要的目標還是直接興建，那包租代管是一個過程……"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["李委員彥秀：興建很慢啦！"],["林部長右昌：但是我們必須要加速去追趕，我們過去……"],["李委員彥秀：我覺得你過去當基隆市市長包租代管做得很成功，所以你更應該去思考，每一塊都非常重要，興建也好、包租代管也好，因為包租代管可以讓每一個區塊都有社宅可以提供出來，更方便所需要的人，你同意我的說法嗎？"],["林部長右昌：謝謝委員的建議。"],["李委員彥秀：對不對？我們是不是可以朝向這樣的方式來進行？"],["陳院長建仁：我們來研議看看可行性多少，還有應該怎麼接，這個需要財政部的意見。"],["李委員彥秀：好，我知道，包租代管之後我希望可以去做進一步的研擬。部長請回，我現在請邱主委。","院長、主委，兩岸的問題，其實整個院裡面不同調，我覺得到底要人民能夠安心，還是應該要緊張，這個實在是很奇怪。國防部部長說他輾轉難眠，邱部長說他也睡不好，然後蔡明彥蔡局長說要國人放心，臺海的局勢沒有升高。國防部部長跟局長對臺灣來說，一個是耳目，一個是臂膀，但是兩個人卻是各自表述，我們到底應該放鬆，還是應該緊張，人民應該相信誰，我覺得這個問題很重要。院長，你上一次參加蔡總統召開的國安高層會議是什麼時候？"],["陳院長建仁：上個禮拜三。"],["李委員彥秀：上個禮拜？"],["陳院長建仁：我跟委員報告，臺灣的……"],["李委員彥秀：院長等一下，這件事情很重要，上次召開國安的高層會議是什麼時候，你參與的。"],["陳院長建仁：我們有國安的早餐會報啦！"],["李委員彥秀：國安高層會議呢？"],["陳院長建仁：國安高層會議，這個……"],["李委員彥秀：不知道？忘記了？"],["陳院長建仁：不是。"],["李委員彥秀：有沒有針對兩岸的局勢，包括金廈的事件啦……"],["陳院長建仁：都有，都有在討論。"],["李委員彥秀：包括諾魯斷交，還有大陸片面取消M503的航線，針對這些事情到底有沒有召開國安高層會議？"],["陳院長建仁：都有在討論，都有在國安的相關的會議討論。"],["李委員彥秀：但是沒有召開國安高層會議？"],["陳院長建仁：有些機密性的事情，我在這裡不方便說明啦！但是確實這一些談到的都有在討論。"],["李委員彥秀：好，那沒關係，我請問一下邱主委，你上一次參加國安高層會議是什麼時候？"],["邱主任委員太三：誠如剛才院長講的，其實我們每個禮拜都有一些相關的會議在進行，這個進行包括彙整國防、國安，還有兩岸、外交等等之類的……"],["李委員彥秀：看起來你們兩個說的是都有召開嘛！只是或許不是叫做……"],["邱主任委員太三：每個禮拜都會有一些例行的會議。"],["李委員彥秀：它不是叫做國安高層會議，但是都有召開，到底開了什麼？有一些不能對外揭露，但是有一些應該讓人民放心啊！蔡明彥局長說兩岸局勢沒有升高，那你就要讓人民放心啊！對外至少要讓大家知道你們開了什麼會議，但外界都在講蔡總統對於兩岸的局勢好像當神隱少女一樣，都沒有講半句話！"],["陳院長建仁：沒有當神隱少女！實際上國安的問題，我覺得……"],["李委員彥秀：院長，國安高層會議，我從網路上調閱資料，你們甚至對過去2022年發放6,000塊的現金，你們也召開國安高層會議；針對烏克蘭的局勢，你們也召開國安會議；然後包括美國總統大選過後，你們也召開國安高層會議。當然有些你們的內容不能揭露，但是我覺得讓外界知道每一次國安高層會議結束之後，你就必須釋放出某一些訊息，讓人民可以安心。我們現在最大的問題是我們國安局局長跟邱部長不同調，一個是他輾轉難眠，釋放出來的是兩岸局勢很緊張；另外一個是要大家放心，沒事情、沒事情，那到底是怎麼樣？ CNN國際分析的記者還說「臺海的局勢沒有最危險，只有更危險」，這是我們從媒體上看到。"],["陳院長建仁：那是他個人的看法。"],["李委員彥秀：所以我們到底是要相信誰？CNN的記者？還是我們要相信蔡局長？還是我們要相信邱部長？還是今天邱主委要說什麼？"],["邱主任委員太三：基本上兩岸的情勢它連動到所謂的國際，我想委員大概也清楚，基本上總統都會在涉及到影響我們國內重大的財政、經濟或其他的情勢的時候，他才有所謂……"],["李委員彥秀：主委、院長，我覺得兩岸局勢的緊張……"],["邱主任委員太三：對，對，對，包括兩岸。"],["李委員彥秀：我覺得要讓人民知道，現在不同調，蔡總統到底是氣定神閒……"],["邱主任委員太三：我想國安局局長昨天在大院的國防外交委員會的講法，應該就是綜合所有的局勢所做的一個報告……"],["李委員彥秀：我覺得如果有召開相關國安高層會議或相關的國安會議，就一定要釋放這訊息……"],["邱主任委員太三：但是我們要戒慎恐懼。"],["李委員彥秀：否則我們現在人民不知道兩岸局勢到底應該緊張，還是應該放心，請蔡總統不要當神隱少女，如果你們有開會，也要釋放出一些訊息讓人民知道。"],["陳院長建仁：他沒有當神隱少女，我想……"],["邱主任委員太三：沒有啦，就是有國安局長的報告……"],["陳院長建仁：我想，國安局長的講法就是代表我們對國安的看法。"],["邱主任委員太三：對啦！"],["李委員彥秀：我們也希望蔡總統要對外釋放一些訊息，因為你今天才說國安局局長的看法是你們高層的看法，所以邱部長不代表高層？"],["邱主任委員太三：他是綜合。"],["陳院長建仁：綜合。"],["邱主任委員太三：因為剛才你提到涉及國防、外交、兩岸還有其他的情勢……"],["陳院長建仁：是。"],["李委員彥秀：好。"],["主席：謝謝李委員彥秀的發言，謝謝陳院長的備詢。","接下來我們請登記第7位馬委員文君質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":184,"meet_id":"院會-11-1-4","speakers":["韓國瑜","麥玉珍","范雲","陳玉珍","謝龍介","吳沛憶","李彥秀","馬文君","李坤城","沈伯洋","張雅琳","吳宗憲","徐巧芯","陳永康","楊曜","陳俊宇","邱鎮軍","蘇清泉","劉建國","張嘉郡","陳超明","陳秀寳"],"page_start":99,"meetingDate":["2024-03-12"],"gazette_id":"1130601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1130601_00004","1130601_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期第4次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢─ 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\"end\": 337.293, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"。\"}]}, {\"start\": 365.418, \"end\": 366.459, \"text\": \"新北市跟台北市跟基隆市\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"新\", \"start\": 365.418, \"end\": 365.438, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"北\", \"start\": 365.438, \"end\": 365.979, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"市\", \"start\": 365.979, \"end\": 366.039, \"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 366.039, \"end\": 366.059, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 366.059, \"end\": 366.079, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"北\", \"start\": 366.079, \"end\": 366.179, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"市\", \"start\": 366.179, \"end\": 366.279, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 366.279, \"end\": 366.399, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"基\", \"start\": 366.399, \"end\": 366.419, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"隆\", \"start\": 366.419, \"end\": 366.439, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"市\", \"start\": 366.439, \"end\": 366.459, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 386.698, \"end\": 390.181, \"text\": \"臺北市大概只可以租到9坪新北市可以租到16坪\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"臺\"}, {\"word\": \"北\", \"start\": 386.698, \"end\": 386.798, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"市\", \"start\": 386.798, \"end\": 386.878, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 386.878, \"end\": 386.918, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"概\", \"start\": 386.918, \"end\": 387.178, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"只\", \"start\": 387.178, \"end\": 387.419, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 387.419, \"end\": 387.499, \"score\": 0.821}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 387.499, \"end\": 387.579, \"score\": 0.755}, {\"word\": \"租\", \"start\": 387.579, \"end\": 387.719, \"score\": 0.862}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 387.719, \"end\": 388.039, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"9\"}, {\"word\": \"坪\", \"start\": 388.039, \"end\": 388.159, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"新\", \"start\": 388.159, \"end\": 388.199, \"score\": 0.492}, {\"word\": \"北\", \"start\": 388.199, \"end\": 388.599, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"市\", 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\"end\": 750.489, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 750.489, \"end\": 750.609, \"score\": 0.834}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 750.609, \"end\": 750.869, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 750.869, \"end\": 751.109, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 751.109, \"end\": 751.249, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 751.249, \"end\": 751.349, \"score\": 0.955}, {\"word\": \"次\", \"start\": 751.349, \"end\": 751.709, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"參\"}, {\"word\": \"加\", \"start\": 751.709, \"end\": 752.789, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"安\", \"start\": 752.789, \"end\": 752.929, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"高\", \"start\": 752.929, \"end\": 753.43, \"score\": 0.859}, {\"word\": \"層\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 753.43, \"end\": 753.57, \"score\": 0.718}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 753.57, \"end\": 753.89, \"score\": 0.846}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 753.89, \"end\": 754.57, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"?\"}]}, {\"start\": 754.57, \"end\": 758.831, \"text\": \"周主委剛剛院長講了,其實我們每個禮拜都有一些相關的會議在進行。\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"周\", \"start\": 754.57, \"end\": 754.73, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 754.73, \"end\": 754.83, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 754.83, \"end\": 755.07, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 755.07, \"end\": 755.55, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"講\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 755.55, \"end\": 755.71, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 755.71, \"end\": 756.01, \"score\": 0.867}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 756.01, \"end\": 756.17, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"每\", \"start\": 756.17, \"end\": 756.63, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"禮\"}, {\"word\": \"拜\", \"start\": 756.63, \"end\": 756.95, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 756.95, \"end\": 757.19, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 757.19, \"end\": 757.471, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 757.471, \"end\": 757.611, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 757.611, \"end\": 757.871, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 757.871, \"end\": 758.311, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 758.311, \"end\": 758.711, \"score\": 0.887}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"議\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 758.711, \"end\": 758.811, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 758.811, \"end\": 758.831, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"。\"}]}, {\"start\": 759.671, \"end\": 775.766, \"text\": \"那這個進行了包括會長的國防、國安、還有兩岸、還有外交等等。 啊看起來你們兩個講是都有召開嘛。只是他或許他不是叫……每個禮拜都會有一型的會。 他不是叫國安高層會但是都有召開。\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 759.671, \"end\": 760.392, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, 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00:00:07,422\n謝謝主席,我們請陳院長再請陳院長備詢\n\n2\n00:00:17,728 --> 00:00:36,754\n議員長,恭喜你當選立委。謝謝院長長安奧。我們今天希望我們可以在質詢過程當中問出一些我們民眾想要知道的一些答案跟問題。院長,我們在處理年改的時候,我們特別加了一個非常重要的條文,對於物價指數超過5%的時候,或者每4年我們都應該去列入調整。\n\n3\n00:00:41,855 --> 00:01:05,758\n今年在選舉過程當中1月4號從新聞上我也看到你有提到說今年因為我們今年CPI從111年我們CPI物價指數漲了2.95112年漲到2.49那上個月主席處公布的CPI物價消費指數又更漲到3.08我想物價通膨你非常清楚\n\n4\n00:01:06,238 --> 00:01:25,948\n那從111、112其實也超過5%所以我也感謝院長你看到這些指數已經超過了所以我們行政院也馬上就列入這些討論所以退休軍公教人員很多人都靠著退休金在生活你也非常清楚知道\n\n5\n00:01:26,868 --> 00:01:51,209\n現在物價的指數狀況買一個便當盒要不要加蛋可能120塊要再加蛋可能變135人民的痛苦退休金增加一些些調整一些些對他來說都有很大的幫助更多人是靠這份退休金在生活所以我想請問院長距離上次的承諾1月5號承諾很多人批評您說哎呀這個又是政策選舉在買票\n\n6\n00:01:53,190 --> 00:02:07,446\n但是兩個月、三個月過去了,我們現在已經3月12號了,很多人都在等,不是說好要調嗎?怎麼沒有調,我在基層很多人都在問我。所以院長,你要不要回應一下,就是到底\n\n7\n00:02:08,027 --> 00:02:34,523\n什麼時候調?要不要調?是不是真的有要調?是你一個月之內就要調?因為每個月都差很多,對很多人來講他可能這個一個月差個一兩千塊對他來說影響生活都影響非常大。你要不要具體的回應?到底你要留給下一任的行政院院長來公布?還是最近就要調?我想委員最重要的是這樣子,因為這裡和物價調整有關。那物價調整的最後的那幾年的這個情況\n\n8\n00:02:37,416 --> 00:02:37,596\n﹚主席﹚\n\n9\n00:03:01,128 --> 00:03:04,110\n請問院長到底這件事情什麼時候可以做?因為\n\n10\n00:03:26,901 --> 00:03:47,311\n你到時候當然會追溯到1月1號,但是每個月錢都不夠用啊。所以院長到底什麼時候要做?是5、0前?還是下個月?還是一個月內?好,在最近就會公告了。所以是各位來的?對。好,感謝院長。時間先暫停,我可不可以請林浩昌林部長。麻煩請內政部備詢。院長我時間不要一直走。\n\n11\n00:03:52,469 --> 00:03:54,953\n我相信您同意。我同意。\n\n12\n00:04:05,143 --> 00:04:33,742\n過去7、8年來蔡英文強調我們要興建20萬戶的社宅賴清德更談到他要興建100萬戶社宅的興建有它的挑戰跟困難度不是興建100萬戶是包括包租貸款還有房租補貼但是我們都非常清楚包括林佑昌林部長您過去擔任過基隆市市長您非常清楚興建的困難度在哪裡所以我們才有包租貸款政策我也關注到您在基隆市市長任內的時候\n\n13\n00:04:35,463 --> 00:04:35,743\n來我們來看幾個數據\n\n14\n00:05:01,977 --> 00:05:08,565\n我的數據裡面大家看到包租貸款是我們整個過去20萬戶蔡英文的20萬戶包租貸款將近佔了5成\n\n15\n00:05:13,092 --> 00:05:36,232\n所以包租代管的政策對我們來說其實是相對重要因為興建要找土地不是那麼容易又要跟鄰近要蓋的時候又要跟住戶去做旁邊林地的住戶做更多的溝通所以包租代管是重要的政策我們也看到過去這七八年我們興建的已完成的只有12.8戶然後我們再看下一張圖表\n\n16\n00:05:37,093 --> 00:05:37,293\n當然有差異性。\n\n17\n00:06:05,418 --> 00:06:06,459\n新北市跟台北市跟基隆市\n\n18\n00:06:26,698 --> 00:06:30,181\n臺北市大概只可以租到9坪新北市可以租到16坪\n\n19\n00:06:37,611 --> 00:06:56,813\n所以15000塊的租稅的優惠其實我覺得在各縣市應該有差異性或者放寬我們才有機會包租代管政策能夠做得更成功院長部長你同意我的說法嗎\n\n20\n00:06:57,774 --> 00:07:21,663\n對啦但是我要跟委員講的你剛才提到因為以現在的這樣的免稅額度呢我們也發現這一個包租貸款的事情是很蓬勃在進行甚至有些……對啦但是院長我要告訴你租金很多租金都是隱形收入你積償也不好積償有沒有被課稅不好積償我配合包租貸款\n\n21\n00:07:22,703 --> 00:07:34,706\n我反而被懲罰到房東,因為我變成我的租金要揭露,對不對?部長你同意嗎?對不對?對,所以我前幾天我特別在財政委員會質詢的時候,我跟莊部長討論說,我覺得第一,\n\n22\n00:07:41,488 --> 00:08:06,702\n我們的包租貸款成功是社會住宅居住正義當中很重要的一環,達標很重要的一環。但是在各縣市在15000塊,第一要不是更放寬,我們提高上限。第二,要不然我們就應該有各縣市的租金收入的差異性。院長您了解我的意思嗎?以台北市來說,譬如說免稅額的差異性,我們應該要出來。\n\n23\n00:08:10,083 --> 00:08:34,134\n我們包出代管政策才有機會像基隆做的這麼成功,你同意我的說法嗎?我們可不可以嚴明這樣的方向來進行?謝謝委員的這個建議,當然這個意見其實之前也有人提過,不過他也會衍生其他的一個問題,也就是因為你知道所有的補助的金額跟標準會整個都\n\n24\n00:08:36,616 --> 00:08:57,305\n沒有一致性,我覺得一條法令的話,但是這就是牽涉到你包租貸款要不要成功這件事情,各縣市有它的差異性在,地價也不一樣,租金也不一樣,你很清楚,在台北市15000塊可以租到9坪的房子,在新北市可以租到16坪。\n\n25\n00:08:58,485 --> 00:09:20,493\n所以我覺得每個縣市要把包租貸款做得更成功,那個免稅額的差異性要出來,我覺得才,要不然你就把它放得更寬,要不然你把它放到3萬塊,那就有機會我們包租貸款,所以我分兩個層次來跟您建議,第一個就是我們放寬免稅額的上限,譬如說是2萬5、3萬塊,你們去做討論,\n\n26\n00:09:22,694 --> 00:09:22,834\n委員﹚李彥秀\n\n27\n00:09:48,465 --> 00:10:07,350\n但是年輕人對於貧富的差距買不到房子出不到房子在六都裡面其實大家都是有感的所以你們才講說居住生意很重要。好不好我們趕快來演你好不好朝修法的方向來演你。各位委員報告這個正本經驗我們最重要的目標還是直接興建那包租貸款是一個過程。興建很慢啊。\n\n28\n00:10:08,130 --> 00:10:35,935\n但是這個就是必須要,我們必須要加速去追趕我們過去其次前面做的事情。我覺得你過去在金融市場包租貸款做得很成功,所以你更應該去思考每一塊都非常重要。新建也好,包租貸款,因為包租貸款的話可以讓每一個區塊都有社宅可以提供出來,更方便所需要的人,你同意我的說法嗎?謝謝委員的建議。對不對,我們是不是可以朝向這樣的方式來去做進行。我們來研議看看可行性多少,還有應該怎麼簽,那個需要財政部的意見。\n\n29\n00:10:37,176 --> 00:10:37,436\n邱主委\n\n30\n00:10:46,052 --> 00:11:12,111\n院長部長兩岸的問題其實我覺得整個院裡面不同調我實在是覺得這個到底要人民能夠安心還是應該要緊張我覺得實在是很奇怪國安部部長說他輾轉難眠邱部長說他也睡不好然後我們蔡明彥蔡局長說要國人放心台海的局勢沒有升高\n\n31\n00:11:13,212 --> 00:11:40,055\n國防部部長跟局長一個是在對台灣來說一個是耳目一個是背膀但是兩個人卻是各自表述我們到底應該放鬆還是應該緊張人民應該相信誰我覺得這個問題很重要院長你上一次參加蔡總統召開的國安高層會議是什麼時候?上個禮拜三\n\n32\n00:11:41,798 --> 00:11:44,543\n我跟委員報告,臺灣的...我們有國安的早餐會報啦。國安高層會議呢?\n\n33\n00:11:55,615 --> 00:12:14,355\n國安高層會議有沒有針對兩岸的局勢,包括驚嚇的事件、若乳斷交、大陸片面取消M503的航線,針對這些事情到底有沒有召開國安高層會議?都有在討論,都有在國安相關的會議討論。\n\n34\n00:12:18,726 --> 00:12:34,570\n但是沒有召開國安高層會議。這個有些機密性的事情我在這裡不方便說明,但是確實這一些談到的都有待會。我請問一下周主委,你上一次參加國安高層會議是什麼時候?\n\n35\n00:12:34,570 --> 00:12:38,831\n周主委剛剛院長講了,其實我們每個禮拜都有一些相關的會議在進行。\n\n36\n00:12:39,671 --> 00:12:55,766\n那這個進行了包括會長的國防、國安、還有兩岸、還有外交等等。啊看起來你們兩個講是都有召開嘛。只是他或許他不是叫……每個禮拜都會有一型的會。他不是叫國安高層會但是都有召開。\n\n37\n00:12:56,727 --> 00:13:14,323\n那到底開了什麼?有一些不能對外揭露,但是有一些應該讓人民放心啊。蔡明彥局長說兩岸局勢沒有升高,那你就要讓人民放心啊。你對外至少要讓大家知道你們開了什麼會議。但外界都在講說蔡總統對於兩岸的局勢好像當神隱少女一樣,都沒有講半句話。\n\n38\n00:13:16,124 --> 00:13:20,649\n國安高層會議我從網路上調閱資料,你們甚至對過去2022年發放6000塊的現金也召開國安高層會議,針對烏克蘭的局勢也召開國安會議,包括美國總統大選過後也召開國安高層會議。\n\n39\n00:13:38,989 --> 00:14:05,707\n當然有些內容你們不能揭露但是我覺得讓外界知道每一次國安高層會議結束之後你就必須釋放出某一些訊息讓人民可以安心我們現在最大的問題是我們國安局局長跟處部長不同調一個是他輾轉難眠釋放出來的是兩岸局勢很緊張另外一個是要大家放心沒問題沒問題那到底是怎麼樣我們CNN國際分析的記者還說\n\n40\n00:14:07,048 --> 00:14:33,833\n台海的局勢沒有最危險只有更危險這是我們從媒體上看到所以我們到底是要相信誰CNN的記者還是我們要相信我們要相信蔡局長還是我們要相信邱部長還是今天邱主委要說什麼我想基本上兩岸的這個情勢它連動到所謂的國際的這我想委員大概清楚了那基本上大概總統都會在\n\n41\n00:14:36,173 --> 00:14:37,334\n國安局局長昨天在貴院的大院的這個國防外交委員會他的\n\n42\n00:14:58,777 --> 00:15:00,959\n國安局長的講法就是代表我們對國安的看法。\n\n43\n00:15:25,546 --> 00:15:27,448\n謝謝李委員彥秀的發言。謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第七位馬委員文俊\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6298\t7422\t謝謝主席,我們請陳院長再請陳院長備詢\n17728\t36754\t議員長,恭喜你當選立委。謝謝院長長安奧。我們今天希望我們可以在質詢過程當中問出一些我們民眾想要知道的一些答案跟問題。院長,我們在處理年改的時候,我們特別加了一個非常重要的條文,對於物價指數超過5%的時候,或者每4年我們都應該去列入調整。\n41855\t65758\t今年在選舉過程當中1月4號從新聞上我也看到你有提到說今年因為我們今年CPI從111年我們CPI物價指數漲了2.95112年漲到2.49那上個月主席處公布的CPI物價消費指數又更漲到3.08我想物價通膨你非常清楚\n66238\t85948\t那從111、112其實也超過5%所以我也感謝院長你看到這些指數已經超過了所以我們行政院也馬上就列入這些討論所以退休軍公教人員很多人都靠著退休金在生活你也非常清楚知道\n86868\t111209\t現在物價的指數狀況買一個便當盒要不要加蛋可能120塊要再加蛋可能變135人民的痛苦退休金增加一些些調整一些些對他來說都有很大的幫助更多人是靠這份退休金在生活所以我想請問院長距離上次的承諾1月5號承諾很多人批評您說哎呀這個又是政策選舉在買票\n113190\t127446\t但是兩個月、三個月過去了,我們現在已經3月12號了,很多人都在等,不是說好要調嗎?怎麼沒有調,我在基層很多人都在問我。所以院長,你要不要回應一下,就是到底\n128027\t154523\t什麼時候調?要不要調?是不是真的有要調?是你一個月之內就要調?因為每個月都差很多,對很多人來講他可能這個一個月差個一兩千塊對他來說影響生活都影響非常大。你要不要具體的回應?到底你要留給下一任的行政院院長來公布?還是最近就要調?我想委員最重要的是這樣子,因為這裡和物價調整有關。那物價調整的最後的那幾年的這個情況\n157416\t157596\t﹚主席﹚\n181128\t184110\t請問院長到底這件事情什麼時候可以做?因為\n206901\t227311\t你到時候當然會追溯到1月1號,但是每個月錢都不夠用啊。所以院長到底什麼時候要做?是5、0前?還是下個月?還是一個月內?好,在最近就會公告了。所以是各位來的?對。好,感謝院長。時間先暫停,我可不可以請林浩昌林部長。麻煩請內政部備詢。院長我時間不要一直走。\n232469\t234953\t我相信您同意。我同意。\n245143\t273742\t過去7、8年來蔡英文強調我們要興建20萬戶的社宅賴清德更談到他要興建100萬戶社宅的興建有它的挑戰跟困難度不是興建100萬戶是包括包租貸款還有房租補貼但是我們都非常清楚包括林佑昌林部長您過去擔任過基隆市市長您非常清楚興建的困難度在哪裡所以我們才有包租貸款政策我也關注到您在基隆市市長任內的時候\n275463\t275743\t來我們來看幾個數據\n301977\t308565\t我的數據裡面大家看到包租貸款是我們整個過去20萬戶蔡英文的20萬戶包租貸款將近佔了5成\n313092\t336232\t所以包租代管的政策對我們來說其實是相對重要因為興建要找土地不是那麼容易又要跟鄰近要蓋的時候又要跟住戶去做旁邊林地的住戶做更多的溝通所以包租代管是重要的政策我們也看到過去這七八年我們興建的已完成的只有12.8戶然後我們再看下一張圖表\n337093\t337293\t當然有差異性。\n365418\t366459\t新北市跟台北市跟基隆市\n386698\t390181\t臺北市大概只可以租到9坪新北市可以租到16坪\n397611\t416813\t所以15000塊的租稅的優惠其實我覺得在各縣市應該有差異性或者放寬我們才有機會包租代管政策能夠做得更成功 院長部長你同意我的說法嗎\n417774\t441663\t對啦但是我要跟委員講的你剛才提到因為以現在的這樣的免稅額度呢我們也發現這一個包租貸款的事情是很蓬勃在進行甚至有些……對啦但是院長我要告訴你租金很多租金都是隱形收入你積償也不好積償有沒有被課稅不好積償我配合包租貸款\n442703\t454706\t我反而被懲罰到房東,因為我變成我的租金要揭露,對不對?部長你同意嗎?對不對?對,所以我前幾天我特別在財政委員會質詢的時候,我跟莊部長討論說,我覺得第一,\n461488\t486702\t我們的包租貸款成功是社會住宅居住正義當中很重要的一環,達標很重要的一環。但是在各縣市在15000塊,第一要不是更放寬,我們提高上限。第二,要不然我們就應該有各縣市的租金收入的差異性。院長您了解我的意思嗎?以台北市來說,譬如說免稅額的差異性,我們應該要出來。\n490083\t514134\t我們包出代管政策才有機會像基隆做的這麼成功,你同意我的說法嗎?我們可不可以嚴明這樣的方向來進行?謝謝委員的這個建議,當然這個意見其實之前也有人提過,不過他也會衍生其他的一個問題,也就是因為你知道所有的補助的金額跟標準會整個都\n516616\t537305\t沒有一致性,我覺得一條法令的話,但是這就是牽涉到你包租貸款要不要成功這件事情,各縣市有它的差異性在,地價也不一樣,租金也不一樣,你很清楚,在台北市15000塊可以租到9坪的房子,在新北市可以租到16坪。\n538485\t560493\t所以我覺得每個縣市要把包租貸款做得更成功,那個免稅額的差異性要出來,我覺得才,要不然你就把它放得更寬,要不然你把它放到3萬塊,那就有機會我們包租貸款,所以我分兩個層次來跟您建議,第一個就是我們放寬免稅額的上限,譬如說是2萬5、3萬塊,你們去做討論,\n562694\t562834\t委員﹚李彥秀\n588465\t607350\t但是年輕人對於貧富的差距買不到房子出不到房子在六都裡面其實大家都是有感的所以你們才講說居住生意很重要。好不好我們趕快來演你好不好朝修法的方向來演你。各位委員報告這個正本經驗我們最重要的目標還是直接興建那包租貸款是一個過程。興建很慢啊。\n608130\t635935\t但是這個就是必須要,我們必須要加速去追趕我們過去其次前面做的事情。我覺得你過去在金融市場包租貸款做得很成功,所以你更應該去思考每一塊都非常重要。新建也好,包租貸款,因為包租貸款的話可以讓每一個區塊都有社宅可以提供出來,更方便所需要的人,你同意我的說法嗎?謝謝委員的建議。對不對,我們是不是可以朝向這樣的方式來去做進行。我們來研議看看可行性多少,還有應該怎麼簽,那個需要財政部的意見。\n637176\t637436\t邱主委\n646052\t672111\t院長部長兩岸的問題其實我覺得整個院裡面不同調我實在是覺得這個到底要人民能夠安心還是應該要緊張我覺得實在是很奇怪國安部部長說他輾轉難眠邱部長說他也睡不好然後我們蔡明彥蔡局長說要國人放心台海的局勢沒有升高\n673212\t700055\t國防部部長跟局長一個是在對台灣來說一個是耳目一個是背膀但是兩個人卻是各自表述我們到底應該放鬆還是應該緊張人民應該相信誰我覺得這個問題很重要院長你上一次參加蔡總統召開的國安高層會議是什麼時候?上個禮拜三\n701798\t704543\t我跟委員報告,臺灣的...我們有國安的早餐會報啦。國安高層會議呢?\n715615\t734355\t國安高層會議有沒有針對兩岸的局勢,包括驚嚇的事件、若乳斷交、大陸片面取消M503的航線,針對這些事情到底有沒有召開國安高層會議?都有在討論,都有在國安相關的會議討論。\n738726\t754570\t但是沒有召開國安高層會議。 這個有些機密性的事情我在這裡不方便說明,但是確實這一些談到的都有待會。 我請問一下周主委,你上一次參加國安高層會議是什麼時候?\n754570\t758831\t周主委剛剛院長講了,其實我們每個禮拜都有一些相關的會議在進行。\n759671\t775766\t那這個進行了包括會長的國防、國安、還有兩岸、還有外交等等。 啊看起來你們兩個講是都有召開嘛。只是他或許他不是叫……每個禮拜都會有一型的會。 他不是叫國安高層會但是都有召開。\n776727\t794323\t那到底開了什麼?有一些不能對外揭露,但是有一些應該讓人民放心啊。蔡明彥局長說兩岸局勢沒有升高,那你就要讓人民放心啊。你對外至少要讓大家知道你們開了什麼會議。但外界都在講說蔡總統對於兩岸的局勢好像當神隱少女一樣,都沒有講半句話。\n796124\t800649\t國安高層會議我從網路上調閱資料,你們甚至對過去2022年發放6000塊的現金也召開國安高層會議,針對烏克蘭的局勢也召開國安會議,包括美國總統大選過後也召開國安高層會議。\n818989\t845707\t當然有些內容你們不能揭露但是我覺得讓外界知道每一次國安高層會議結束之後你就必須釋放出某一些訊息讓人民可以安心我們現在最大的問題是我們國安局局長跟處部長不同調一個是他輾轉難眠釋放出來的是兩岸局勢很緊張另外一個是要大家放心沒問題沒問題那到底是怎麼樣我們CNN國際分析的記者還說\n847048\t873833\t台海的局勢沒有最危險只有更危險這是我們從媒體上看到所以我們到底是要相信誰CNN的記者還是我們要相信我們要相信蔡局長還是我們要相信邱部長還是今天邱主委要說什麼我想基本上兩岸的這個情勢它連動到所謂的國際的這我想委員大概清楚了那基本上大概總統都會在\n876173\t877334\t國安局局長昨天在貴院的大院的這個國防外交委員會他的\n898777\t900959\t國安局長的講法就是代表我們對國安的看法。\n925546\t927448\t謝謝李委員彥秀的發言。謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第七位馬委員文俊\n","txt":"謝謝主席,我們請陳院長再請陳院長備詢\n議員長,恭喜你當選立委。謝謝院長長安奧。我們今天希望我們可以在質詢過程當中問出一些我們民眾想要知道的一些答案跟問題。院長,我們在處理年改的時候,我們特別加了一個非常重要的條文,對於物價指數超過5%的時候,或者每4年我們都應該去列入調整。\n今年在選舉過程當中1月4號從新聞上我也看到你有提到說今年因為我們今年CPI從111年我們CPI物價指數漲了2.95112年漲到2.49那上個月主席處公布的CPI物價消費指數又更漲到3.08我想物價通膨你非常清楚\n那從111、112其實也超過5%所以我也感謝院長你看到這些指數已經超過了所以我們行政院也馬上就列入這些討論所以退休軍公教人員很多人都靠著退休金在生活你也非常清楚知道\n現在物價的指數狀況買一個便當盒要不要加蛋可能120塊要再加蛋可能變135人民的痛苦退休金增加一些些調整一些些對他來說都有很大的幫助更多人是靠這份退休金在生活所以我想請問院長距離上次的承諾1月5號承諾很多人批評您說哎呀這個又是政策選舉在買票\n但是兩個月、三個月過去了,我們現在已經3月12號了,很多人都在等,不是說好要調嗎?怎麼沒有調,我在基層很多人都在問我。所以院長,你要不要回應一下,就是到底\n什麼時候調?要不要調?是不是真的有要調?是你一個月之內就要調?因為每個月都差很多,對很多人來講他可能這個一個月差個一兩千塊對他來說影響生活都影響非常大。你要不要具體的回應?到底你要留給下一任的行政院院長來公布?還是最近就要調?我想委員最重要的是這樣子,因為這裡和物價調整有關。那物價調整的最後的那幾年的這個情況\n﹚主席﹚\n請問院長到底這件事情什麼時候可以做?因為\n你到時候當然會追溯到1月1號,但是每個月錢都不夠用啊。所以院長到底什麼時候要做?是5、0前?還是下個月?還是一個月內?好,在最近就會公告了。所以是各位來的?對。好,感謝院長。時間先暫停,我可不可以請林浩昌林部長。麻煩請內政部備詢。院長我時間不要一直走。\n我相信您同意。我同意。\n過去7、8年來蔡英文強調我們要興建20萬戶的社宅賴清德更談到他要興建100萬戶社宅的興建有它的挑戰跟困難度不是興建100萬戶是包括包租貸款還有房租補貼但是我們都非常清楚包括林佑昌林部長您過去擔任過基隆市市長您非常清楚興建的困難度在哪裡所以我們才有包租貸款政策我也關注到您在基隆市市長任內的時候\n來我們來看幾個數據\n我的數據裡面大家看到包租貸款是我們整個過去20萬戶蔡英文的20萬戶包租貸款將近佔了5成\n所以包租代管的政策對我們來說其實是相對重要因為興建要找土地不是那麼容易又要跟鄰近要蓋的時候又要跟住戶去做旁邊林地的住戶做更多的溝通所以包租代管是重要的政策我們也看到過去這七八年我們興建的已完成的只有12.8戶然後我們再看下一張圖表\n當然有差異性。\n新北市跟台北市跟基隆市\n臺北市大概只可以租到9坪新北市可以租到16坪\n所以15000塊的租稅的優惠其實我覺得在各縣市應該有差異性或者放寬我們才有機會包租代管政策能夠做得更成功 院長部長你同意我的說法嗎\n對啦但是我要跟委員講的你剛才提到因為以現在的這樣的免稅額度呢我們也發現這一個包租貸款的事情是很蓬勃在進行甚至有些……對啦但是院長我要告訴你租金很多租金都是隱形收入你積償也不好積償有沒有被課稅不好積償我配合包租貸款\n我反而被懲罰到房東,因為我變成我的租金要揭露,對不對?部長你同意嗎?對不對?對,所以我前幾天我特別在財政委員會質詢的時候,我跟莊部長討論說,我覺得第一,\n我們的包租貸款成功是社會住宅居住正義當中很重要的一環,達標很重要的一環。但是在各縣市在15000塊,第一要不是更放寬,我們提高上限。第二,要不然我們就應該有各縣市的租金收入的差異性。院長您了解我的意思嗎?以台北市來說,譬如說免稅額的差異性,我們應該要出來。\n我們包出代管政策才有機會像基隆做的這麼成功,你同意我的說法嗎?我們可不可以嚴明這樣的方向來進行?謝謝委員的這個建議,當然這個意見其實之前也有人提過,不過他也會衍生其他的一個問題,也就是因為你知道所有的補助的金額跟標準會整個都\n沒有一致性,我覺得一條法令的話,但是這就是牽涉到你包租貸款要不要成功這件事情,各縣市有它的差異性在,地價也不一樣,租金也不一樣,你很清楚,在台北市15000塊可以租到9坪的房子,在新北市可以租到16坪。\n所以我覺得每個縣市要把包租貸款做得更成功,那個免稅額的差異性要出來,我覺得才,要不然你就把它放得更寬,要不然你把它放到3萬塊,那就有機會我們包租貸款,所以我分兩個層次來跟您建議,第一個就是我們放寬免稅額的上限,譬如說是2萬5、3萬塊,你們去做討論,\n委員﹚李彥秀\n但是年輕人對於貧富的差距買不到房子出不到房子在六都裡面其實大家都是有感的所以你們才講說居住生意很重要。好不好我們趕快來演你好不好朝修法的方向來演你。各位委員報告這個正本經驗我們最重要的目標還是直接興建那包租貸款是一個過程。興建很慢啊。\n但是這個就是必須要,我們必須要加速去追趕我們過去其次前面做的事情。我覺得你過去在金融市場包租貸款做得很成功,所以你更應該去思考每一塊都非常重要。新建也好,包租貸款,因為包租貸款的話可以讓每一個區塊都有社宅可以提供出來,更方便所需要的人,你同意我的說法嗎?謝謝委員的建議。對不對,我們是不是可以朝向這樣的方式來去做進行。我們來研議看看可行性多少,還有應該怎麼簽,那個需要財政部的意見。\n邱主委\n院長部長兩岸的問題其實我覺得整個院裡面不同調我實在是覺得這個到底要人民能夠安心還是應該要緊張我覺得實在是很奇怪國安部部長說他輾轉難眠邱部長說他也睡不好然後我們蔡明彥蔡局長說要國人放心台海的局勢沒有升高\n國防部部長跟局長一個是在對台灣來說一個是耳目一個是背膀但是兩個人卻是各自表述我們到底應該放鬆還是應該緊張人民應該相信誰我覺得這個問題很重要院長你上一次參加蔡總統召開的國安高層會議是什麼時候?上個禮拜三\n我跟委員報告,臺灣的...我們有國安的早餐會報啦。國安高層會議呢?\n國安高層會議有沒有針對兩岸的局勢,包括驚嚇的事件、若乳斷交、大陸片面取消M503的航線,針對這些事情到底有沒有召開國安高層會議?都有在討論,都有在國安相關的會議討論。\n但是沒有召開國安高層會議。 這個有些機密性的事情我在這裡不方便說明,但是確實這一些談到的都有待會。 我請問一下周主委,你上一次參加國安高層會議是什麼時候?\n周主委剛剛院長講了,其實我們每個禮拜都有一些相關的會議在進行。\n那這個進行了包括會長的國防、國安、還有兩岸、還有外交等等。 啊看起來你們兩個講是都有召開嘛。只是他或許他不是叫……每個禮拜都會有一型的會。 他不是叫國安高層會但是都有召開。\n那到底開了什麼?有一些不能對外揭露,但是有一些應該讓人民放心啊。蔡明彥局長說兩岸局勢沒有升高,那你就要讓人民放心啊。你對外至少要讓大家知道你們開了什麼會議。但外界都在講說蔡總統對於兩岸的局勢好像當神隱少女一樣,都沒有講半句話。\n國安高層會議我從網路上調閱資料,你們甚至對過去2022年發放6000塊的現金也召開國安高層會議,針對烏克蘭的局勢也召開國安會議,包括美國總統大選過後也召開國安高層會議。\n當然有些內容你們不能揭露但是我覺得讓外界知道每一次國安高層會議結束之後你就必須釋放出某一些訊息讓人民可以安心我們現在最大的問題是我們國安局局長跟處部長不同調一個是他輾轉難眠釋放出來的是兩岸局勢很緊張另外一個是要大家放心沒問題沒問題那到底是怎麼樣我們CNN國際分析的記者還說\n台海的局勢沒有最危險只有更危險這是我們從媒體上看到所以我們到底是要相信誰CNN的記者還是我們要相信我們要相信蔡局長還是我們要相信邱部長還是今天邱主委要說什麼我想基本上兩岸的這個情勢它連動到所謂的國際的這我想委員大概清楚了那基本上大概總統都會在\n國安局局長昨天在貴院的大院的這個國防外交委員會他的\n國安局長的講法就是代表我們對國安的看法。\n謝謝李委員彥秀的發言。謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第七位馬委員文俊\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.298 --> 00:07.422\n謝謝主席,我們請陳院長再請陳院長備詢\n\n00:17.728 --> 00:36.754\n議員長,恭喜你當選立委。謝謝院長長安奧。我們今天希望我們可以在質詢過程當中問出一些我們民眾想要知道的一些答案跟問題。院長,我們在處理年改的時候,我們特別加了一個非常重要的條文,對於物價指數超過5%的時候,或者每4年我們都應該去列入調整。\n\n00:41.855 --> 01:05.758\n今年在選舉過程當中1月4號從新聞上我也看到你有提到說今年因為我們今年CPI從111年我們CPI物價指數漲了2.95112年漲到2.49那上個月主席處公布的CPI物價消費指數又更漲到3.08我想物價通膨你非常清楚\n\n01:06.238 --> 01:25.948\n那從111、112其實也超過5%所以我也感謝院長你看到這些指數已經超過了所以我們行政院也馬上就列入這些討論所以退休軍公教人員很多人都靠著退休金在生活你也非常清楚知道\n\n01:26.868 --> 01:51.209\n現在物價的指數狀況買一個便當盒要不要加蛋可能120塊要再加蛋可能變135人民的痛苦退休金增加一些些調整一些些對他來說都有很大的幫助更多人是靠這份退休金在生活所以我想請問院長距離上次的承諾1月5號承諾很多人批評您說哎呀這個又是政策選舉在買票\n\n01:53.190 --> 02:07.446\n但是兩個月、三個月過去了,我們現在已經3月12號了,很多人都在等,不是說好要調嗎?怎麼沒有調,我在基層很多人都在問我。所以院長,你要不要回應一下,就是到底\n\n02:08.027 --> 02:34.523\n什麼時候調?要不要調?是不是真的有要調?是你一個月之內就要調?因為每個月都差很多,對很多人來講他可能這個一個月差個一兩千塊對他來說影響生活都影響非常大。你要不要具體的回應?到底你要留給下一任的行政院院長來公布?還是最近就要調?我想委員最重要的是這樣子,因為這裡和物價調整有關。那物價調整的最後的那幾年的這個情況\n\n02:37.416 --> 02:37.596\n﹚主席﹚\n\n03:01.128 --> 03:04.110\n請問院長到底這件事情什麼時候可以做?因為\n\n03:26.901 --> 03:47.311\n你到時候當然會追溯到1月1號,但是每個月錢都不夠用啊。所以院長到底什麼時候要做?是5、0前?還是下個月?還是一個月內?好,在最近就會公告了。所以是各位來的?對。好,感謝院長。時間先暫停,我可不可以請林浩昌林部長。麻煩請內政部備詢。院長我時間不要一直走。\n\n03:52.469 --> 03:54.953\n我相信您同意。我同意。\n\n04:05.143 --> 04:33.742\n過去7、8年來蔡英文強調我們要興建20萬戶的社宅賴清德更談到他要興建100萬戶社宅的興建有它的挑戰跟困難度不是興建100萬戶是包括包租貸款還有房租補貼但是我們都非常清楚包括林佑昌林部長您過去擔任過基隆市市長您非常清楚興建的困難度在哪裡所以我們才有包租貸款政策我也關注到您在基隆市市長任內的時候\n\n04:35.463 --> 04:35.743\n來我們來看幾個數據\n\n05:01.977 --> 05:08.565\n我的數據裡面大家看到包租貸款是我們整個過去20萬戶蔡英文的20萬戶包租貸款將近佔了5成\n\n05:13.092 --> 05:36.232\n所以包租代管的政策對我們來說其實是相對重要因為興建要找土地不是那麼容易又要跟鄰近要蓋的時候又要跟住戶去做旁邊林地的住戶做更多的溝通所以包租代管是重要的政策我們也看到過去這七八年我們興建的已完成的只有12.8戶然後我們再看下一張圖表\n\n05:37.093 --> 05:37.293\n當然有差異性。\n\n06:05.418 --> 06:06.459\n新北市跟台北市跟基隆市\n\n06:26.698 --> 06:30.181\n臺北市大概只可以租到9坪新北市可以租到16坪\n\n06:37.611 --> 06:56.813\n所以15000塊的租稅的優惠其實我覺得在各縣市應該有差異性或者放寬我們才有機會包租代管政策能夠做得更成功院長部長你同意我的說法嗎\n\n06:57.774 --> 07:21.663\n對啦但是我要跟委員講的你剛才提到因為以現在的這樣的免稅額度呢我們也發現這一個包租貸款的事情是很蓬勃在進行甚至有些……對啦但是院長我要告訴你租金很多租金都是隱形收入你積償也不好積償有沒有被課稅不好積償我配合包租貸款\n\n07:22.703 --> 07:34.706\n我反而被懲罰到房東,因為我變成我的租金要揭露,對不對?部長你同意嗎?對不對?對,所以我前幾天我特別在財政委員會質詢的時候,我跟莊部長討論說,我覺得第一,\n\n07:41.488 --> 08:06.702\n我們的包租貸款成功是社會住宅居住正義當中很重要的一環,達標很重要的一環。但是在各縣市在15000塊,第一要不是更放寬,我們提高上限。第二,要不然我們就應該有各縣市的租金收入的差異性。院長您了解我的意思嗎?以台北市來說,譬如說免稅額的差異性,我們應該要出來。\n\n08:10.083 --> 08:34.134\n我們包出代管政策才有機會像基隆做的這麼成功,你同意我的說法嗎?我們可不可以嚴明這樣的方向來進行?謝謝委員的這個建議,當然這個意見其實之前也有人提過,不過他也會衍生其他的一個問題,也就是因為你知道所有的補助的金額跟標準會整個都\n\n08:36.616 --> 08:57.305\n沒有一致性,我覺得一條法令的話,但是這就是牽涉到你包租貸款要不要成功這件事情,各縣市有它的差異性在,地價也不一樣,租金也不一樣,你很清楚,在台北市15000塊可以租到9坪的房子,在新北市可以租到16坪。\n\n08:58.485 --> 09:20.493\n所以我覺得每個縣市要把包租貸款做得更成功,那個免稅額的差異性要出來,我覺得才,要不然你就把它放得更寬,要不然你把它放到3萬塊,那就有機會我們包租貸款,所以我分兩個層次來跟您建議,第一個就是我們放寬免稅額的上限,譬如說是2萬5、3萬塊,你們去做討論,\n\n09:22.694 --> 09:22.834\n委員﹚李彥秀\n\n09:48.465 --> 10:07.350\n但是年輕人對於貧富的差距買不到房子出不到房子在六都裡面其實大家都是有感的所以你們才講說居住生意很重要。好不好我們趕快來演你好不好朝修法的方向來演你。各位委員報告這個正本經驗我們最重要的目標還是直接興建那包租貸款是一個過程。興建很慢啊。\n\n10:08.130 --> 10:35.935\n但是這個就是必須要,我們必須要加速去追趕我們過去其次前面做的事情。我覺得你過去在金融市場包租貸款做得很成功,所以你更應該去思考每一塊都非常重要。新建也好,包租貸款,因為包租貸款的話可以讓每一個區塊都有社宅可以提供出來,更方便所需要的人,你同意我的說法嗎?謝謝委員的建議。對不對,我們是不是可以朝向這樣的方式來去做進行。我們來研議看看可行性多少,還有應該怎麼簽,那個需要財政部的意見。\n\n10:37.176 --> 10:37.436\n邱主委\n\n10:46.052 --> 11:12.111\n院長部長兩岸的問題其實我覺得整個院裡面不同調我實在是覺得這個到底要人民能夠安心還是應該要緊張我覺得實在是很奇怪國安部部長說他輾轉難眠邱部長說他也睡不好然後我們蔡明彥蔡局長說要國人放心台海的局勢沒有升高\n\n11:13.212 --> 11:40.055\n國防部部長跟局長一個是在對台灣來說一個是耳目一個是背膀但是兩個人卻是各自表述我們到底應該放鬆還是應該緊張人民應該相信誰我覺得這個問題很重要院長你上一次參加蔡總統召開的國安高層會議是什麼時候?上個禮拜三\n\n11:41.798 --> 11:44.543\n我跟委員報告,臺灣的...我們有國安的早餐會報啦。國安高層會議呢?\n\n11:55.615 --> 12:14.355\n國安高層會議有沒有針對兩岸的局勢,包括驚嚇的事件、若乳斷交、大陸片面取消M503的航線,針對這些事情到底有沒有召開國安高層會議?都有在討論,都有在國安相關的會議討論。\n\n12:18.726 --> 12:34.570\n但是沒有召開國安高層會議。這個有些機密性的事情我在這裡不方便說明,但是確實這一些談到的都有待會。我請問一下周主委,你上一次參加國安高層會議是什麼時候?\n\n12:34.570 --> 12:38.831\n周主委剛剛院長講了,其實我們每個禮拜都有一些相關的會議在進行。\n\n12:39.671 --> 12:55.766\n那這個進行了包括會長的國防、國安、還有兩岸、還有外交等等。啊看起來你們兩個講是都有召開嘛。只是他或許他不是叫……每個禮拜都會有一型的會。他不是叫國安高層會但是都有召開。\n\n12:56.727 --> 13:14.323\n那到底開了什麼?有一些不能對外揭露,但是有一些應該讓人民放心啊。蔡明彥局長說兩岸局勢沒有升高,那你就要讓人民放心啊。你對外至少要讓大家知道你們開了什麼會議。但外界都在講說蔡總統對於兩岸的局勢好像當神隱少女一樣,都沒有講半句話。\n\n13:16.124 --> 13:20.649\n國安高層會議我從網路上調閱資料,你們甚至對過去2022年發放6000塊的現金也召開國安高層會議,針對烏克蘭的局勢也召開國安會議,包括美國總統大選過後也召開國安高層會議。\n\n13:38.989 --> 14:05.707\n當然有些內容你們不能揭露但是我覺得讓外界知道每一次國安高層會議結束之後你就必須釋放出某一些訊息讓人民可以安心我們現在最大的問題是我們國安局局長跟處部長不同調一個是他輾轉難眠釋放出來的是兩岸局勢很緊張另外一個是要大家放心沒問題沒問題那到底是怎麼樣我們CNN國際分析的記者還說\n\n14:07.048 --> 14:33.833\n台海的局勢沒有最危險只有更危險這是我們從媒體上看到所以我們到底是要相信誰CNN的記者還是我們要相信我們要相信蔡局長還是我們要相信邱部長還是今天邱主委要說什麼我想基本上兩岸的這個情勢它連動到所謂的國際的這我想委員大概清楚了那基本上大概總統都會在\n\n14:36.173 --> 14:37.334\n國安局局長昨天在貴院的大院的這個國防外交委員會他的\n\n14:58.777 --> 15:00.959\n國安局長的講法就是代表我們對國安的看法。\n\n15:25.546 --> 15:27.448\n謝謝李委員彥秀的發言。謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第七位馬委員文俊\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.298,"end":7.422,"text":"謝謝主席,我們請陳院長再請陳院長備詢"},{"start":17.728,"end":36.754,"text":"議員長,恭喜你當選立委。謝謝院長長安奧。我們今天希望我們可以在質詢過程當中問出一些我們民眾想要知道的一些答案跟問題。院長,我們在處理年改的時候,我們特別加了一個非常重要的條文,對於物價指數超過5%的時候,或者每4年我們都應該去列入調整。"},{"start":41.855,"end":65.758,"text":"今年在選舉過程當中1月4號從新聞上我也看到你有提到說今年因為我們今年CPI從111年我們CPI物價指數漲了2.95112年漲到2.49那上個月主席處公布的CPI物價消費指數又更漲到3.08我想物價通膨你非常清楚"},{"start":66.238,"end":85.948,"text":"那從111、112其實也超過5%所以我也感謝院長你看到這些指數已經超過了所以我們行政院也馬上就列入這些討論所以退休軍公教人員很多人都靠著退休金在生活你也非常清楚知道"},{"start":86.868,"end":111.209,"text":"現在物價的指數狀況買一個便當盒要不要加蛋可能120塊要再加蛋可能變135人民的痛苦退休金增加一些些調整一些些對他來說都有很大的幫助更多人是靠這份退休金在生活所以我想請問院長距離上次的承諾1月5號承諾很多人批評您說哎呀這個又是政策選舉在買票"},{"start":113.19,"end":127.446,"text":"但是兩個月、三個月過去了,我們現在已經3月12號了,很多人都在等,不是說好要調嗎?怎麼沒有調,我在基層很多人都在問我。所以院長,你要不要回應一下,就是到底"},{"start":128.027,"end":154.523,"text":"什麼時候調?要不要調?是不是真的有要調?是你一個月之內就要調?因為每個月都差很多,對很多人來講他可能這個一個月差個一兩千塊對他來說影響生活都影響非常大。你要不要具體的回應?到底你要留給下一任的行政院院長來公布?還是最近就要調?我想委員最重要的是這樣子,因為這裡和物價調整有關。那物價調整的最後的那幾年的這個情況"},{"start":157.416,"end":157.596,"text":"﹚主席﹚"},{"start":181.128,"end":184.11,"text":"請問院長到底這件事情什麼時候可以做?因為"},{"start":206.901,"end":227.311,"text":"你到時候當然會追溯到1月1號,但是每個月錢都不夠用啊。所以院長到底什麼時候要做?是5、0前?還是下個月?還是一個月內?好,在最近就會公告了。所以是各位來的?對。好,感謝院長。時間先暫停,我可不可以請林浩昌林部長。麻煩請內政部備詢。院長我時間不要一直走。"},{"start":232.469,"end":234.953,"text":"我相信您同意。我同意。"},{"start":245.143,"end":273.742,"text":"過去7、8年來蔡英文強調我們要興建20萬戶的社宅賴清德更談到他要興建100萬戶社宅的興建有它的挑戰跟困難度不是興建100萬戶是包括包租貸款還有房租補貼但是我們都非常清楚包括林佑昌林部長您過去擔任過基隆市市長您非常清楚興建的困難度在哪裡所以我們才有包租貸款政策我也關注到您在基隆市市長任內的時候"},{"start":275.463,"end":275.743,"text":"來我們來看幾個數據"},{"start":301.977,"end":308.565,"text":"我的數據裡面大家看到包租貸款是我們整個過去20萬戶蔡英文的20萬戶包租貸款將近佔了5成"},{"start":313.092,"end":336.232,"text":"所以包租代管的政策對我們來說其實是相對重要因為興建要找土地不是那麼容易又要跟鄰近要蓋的時候又要跟住戶去做旁邊林地的住戶做更多的溝通所以包租代管是重要的政策我們也看到過去這七八年我們興建的已完成的只有12.8戶然後我們再看下一張圖表"},{"start":337.093,"end":337.293,"text":"當然有差異性。"},{"start":365.418,"end":366.459,"text":"新北市跟台北市跟基隆市"},{"start":386.698,"end":390.181,"text":"臺北市大概只可以租到9坪新北市可以租到16坪"},{"start":397.611,"end":416.813,"text":"所以15000塊的租稅的優惠其實我覺得在各縣市應該有差異性或者放寬我們才有機會包租代管政策能夠做得更成功 院長部長你同意我的說法嗎"},{"start":417.774,"end":441.663,"text":"對啦但是我要跟委員講的你剛才提到因為以現在的這樣的免稅額度呢我們也發現這一個包租貸款的事情是很蓬勃在進行甚至有些……對啦但是院長我要告訴你租金很多租金都是隱形收入你積償也不好積償有沒有被課稅不好積償我配合包租貸款"},{"start":442.703,"end":454.706,"text":"我反而被懲罰到房東,因為我變成我的租金要揭露,對不對?部長你同意嗎?對不對?對,所以我前幾天我特別在財政委員會質詢的時候,我跟莊部長討論說,我覺得第一,"},{"start":461.488,"end":486.702,"text":"我們的包租貸款成功是社會住宅居住正義當中很重要的一環,達標很重要的一環。但是在各縣市在15000塊,第一要不是更放寬,我們提高上限。第二,要不然我們就應該有各縣市的租金收入的差異性。院長您了解我的意思嗎?以台北市來說,譬如說免稅額的差異性,我們應該要出來。"},{"start":490.083,"end":514.134,"text":"我們包出代管政策才有機會像基隆做的這麼成功,你同意我的說法嗎?我們可不可以嚴明這樣的方向來進行?謝謝委員的這個建議,當然這個意見其實之前也有人提過,不過他也會衍生其他的一個問題,也就是因為你知道所有的補助的金額跟標準會整個都"},{"start":516.616,"end":537.305,"text":"沒有一致性,我覺得一條法令的話,但是這就是牽涉到你包租貸款要不要成功這件事情,各縣市有它的差異性在,地價也不一樣,租金也不一樣,你很清楚,在台北市15000塊可以租到9坪的房子,在新北市可以租到16坪。"},{"start":538.485,"end":560.493,"text":"所以我覺得每個縣市要把包租貸款做得更成功,那個免稅額的差異性要出來,我覺得才,要不然你就把它放得更寬,要不然你把它放到3萬塊,那就有機會我們包租貸款,所以我分兩個層次來跟您建議,第一個就是我們放寬免稅額的上限,譬如說是2萬5、3萬塊,你們去做討論,"},{"start":562.694,"end":562.834,"text":"委員﹚李彥秀"},{"start":588.465,"end":607.35,"text":"但是年輕人對於貧富的差距買不到房子出不到房子在六都裡面其實大家都是有感的所以你們才講說居住生意很重要。好不好我們趕快來演你好不好朝修法的方向來演你。各位委員報告這個正本經驗我們最重要的目標還是直接興建那包租貸款是一個過程。興建很慢啊。"},{"start":608.13,"end":635.935,"text":"但是這個就是必須要,我們必須要加速去追趕我們過去其次前面做的事情。我覺得你過去在金融市場包租貸款做得很成功,所以你更應該去思考每一塊都非常重要。新建也好,包租貸款,因為包租貸款的話可以讓每一個區塊都有社宅可以提供出來,更方便所需要的人,你同意我的說法嗎?謝謝委員的建議。對不對,我們是不是可以朝向這樣的方式來去做進行。我們來研議看看可行性多少,還有應該怎麼簽,那個需要財政部的意見。"},{"start":637.176,"end":637.436,"text":"邱主委"},{"start":646.052,"end":672.111,"text":"院長部長兩岸的問題其實我覺得整個院裡面不同調我實在是覺得這個到底要人民能夠安心還是應該要緊張我覺得實在是很奇怪國安部部長說他輾轉難眠邱部長說他也睡不好然後我們蔡明彥蔡局長說要國人放心台海的局勢沒有升高"},{"start":673.212,"end":700.055,"text":"國防部部長跟局長一個是在對台灣來說一個是耳目一個是背膀但是兩個人卻是各自表述我們到底應該放鬆還是應該緊張人民應該相信誰我覺得這個問題很重要院長你上一次參加蔡總統召開的國安高層會議是什麼時候?上個禮拜三"},{"start":701.798,"end":704.543,"text":"我跟委員報告,臺灣的...我們有國安的早餐會報啦。國安高層會議呢?"},{"start":715.615,"end":734.355,"text":"國安高層會議有沒有針對兩岸的局勢,包括驚嚇的事件、若乳斷交、大陸片面取消M503的航線,針對這些事情到底有沒有召開國安高層會議?都有在討論,都有在國安相關的會議討論。"},{"start":738.726,"end":754.57,"text":"但是沒有召開國安高層會議。 這個有些機密性的事情我在這裡不方便說明,但是確實這一些談到的都有待會。 我請問一下周主委,你上一次參加國安高層會議是什麼時候?"},{"start":754.57,"end":758.831,"text":"周主委剛剛院長講了,其實我們每個禮拜都有一些相關的會議在進行。"},{"start":759.671,"end":775.766,"text":"那這個進行了包括會長的國防、國安、還有兩岸、還有外交等等。 啊看起來你們兩個講是都有召開嘛。只是他或許他不是叫……每個禮拜都會有一型的會。 他不是叫國安高層會但是都有召開。"},{"start":776.727,"end":794.323,"text":"那到底開了什麼?有一些不能對外揭露,但是有一些應該讓人民放心啊。蔡明彥局長說兩岸局勢沒有升高,那你就要讓人民放心啊。你對外至少要讓大家知道你們開了什麼會議。但外界都在講說蔡總統對於兩岸的局勢好像當神隱少女一樣,都沒有講半句話。"},{"start":796.124,"end":800.649,"text":"國安高層會議我從網路上調閱資料,你們甚至對過去2022年發放6000塊的現金也召開國安高層會議,針對烏克蘭的局勢也召開國安會議,包括美國總統大選過後也召開國安高層會議。"},{"start":818.989,"end":845.707,"text":"當然有些內容你們不能揭露但是我覺得讓外界知道每一次國安高層會議結束之後你就必須釋放出某一些訊息讓人民可以安心我們現在最大的問題是我們國安局局長跟處部長不同調一個是他輾轉難眠釋放出來的是兩岸局勢很緊張另外一個是要大家放心沒問題沒問題那到底是怎麼樣我們CNN國際分析的記者還說"},{"start":847.048,"end":873.833,"text":"台海的局勢沒有最危險只有更危險這是我們從媒體上看到所以我們到底是要相信誰CNN的記者還是我們要相信我們要相信蔡局長還是我們要相信邱部長還是今天邱主委要說什麼我想基本上兩岸的這個情勢它連動到所謂的國際的這我想委員大概清楚了那基本上大概總統都會在"},{"start":876.173,"end":877.334,"text":"國安局局長昨天在貴院的大院的這個國防外交委員會他的"},{"start":898.777,"end":900.959,"text":"國安局長的講法就是代表我們對國安的看法。"},{"start":925.546,"end":927.448,"text":"謝謝李委員彥秀的發言。謝謝陳院長的備詢。接下來我們請登記第七位馬委員文俊"}]}}}}