{"id":149724,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149724","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3a8d0956074a2938cdf3b00c116b10d904b328b65eecebe0f8ba9b0039caa7a6c4d3c1afc80b58e25ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"徐巧芯","委員發言時間":"14:30:32 - 14:46:22","影片長度":"00:15:50","會議時間":"2024-03-12T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第11屆第1會期第4次會議（事由：一、對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢。\n二、3月8日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。 \n三、3月12日下午1時50分至2時30分為處理臨時提案時間。）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"立法院第11屆第1會期第4次會議","id":"院會-11-1-4","type":"院會","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":4},"date":"2024-03-12","duration":950,"end_time":"2024-03-12T14:46:22+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-12T14:30:32+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":2,"blocks":[["徐委員巧芯：（14時30分）院長好，我想有請陳建仁院長及國防部邱部長。"],["主席：請陳院長、國防部備詢。"],["陳院長建仁：徐委員午安。"],["徐委員巧芯：午安。先請教一下陳院長，最近晚上睡得怎麼樣？"],["陳院長建仁：我一向睡眠都很好，謝謝。"],["徐委員巧芯：一向睡眠都很好，我想最近大家都很關心我們的部會首長，還有我們院長，睡得好不好，主要是因為先前在質詢的過程當中，邱國正部長有告訴我們兩岸相當的危險，所以他晚上有的時候很煩惱會睡不著，那想必陳建仁院長沒有這樣子的困擾。但我們今天要問的是CNN著名的評論員他的意見，他談到了現在臺灣已經是世界上最危險的地方，現在變得更加危險，所以我們才會很好奇陳建仁院長怎麼看待目前兩岸的情勢，有感覺到CNN評論員所說的變得更加危險嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：Zakaria在COVID-19的時間曾經訪問過我，我也知道他很關心臺灣的安全，也算是朋友，那我想他最主要的呼籲，就是希望我們臺灣要提高警覺，然後美國跟其他的盟友應該要來協助臺灣做很好的我們臺灣的國防自衛，我們要能戰才能夠避戰，然後備戰才能夠止戰這樣的努力來進行。"],["徐委員巧芯：是的，您說得很好。但是我們看到的是確實有很多各種的問題，比方說最近有一件跟國安疑慮相關的事情，媒體剛才才披露Google Earth這一波臺灣西部做了圖資更新，我們可以看到更新之後，西側國防部過去協調模糊化的高司軍事建築，包含是國防部、空軍司令部、海軍司令部等等都相當的清楚，包含整建中的北部龜山愛國者預備陣地、預部署M1A2戰車的大岡營區、楊梅飛彈營區、苗栗西湖飛彈基地及臺中清泉崗新建萬劍彈庫等等，都在圖資上面可以顯示的相當清楚，我想問一下部長，我們有沒有掌握這個狀況，以及後續有沒有要進行任何的處置？"],["邱部長國正：跟委員報告，國防安全是大家很關切的課題，像現在科技那麼發達，不管是衛星偵照等等，這些圖資都很容易顯露出來，但我們有一個作為，通常我們會跟這些單位，不管是Google這些單位，會去跟他們做一個協議，有關機敏處所，他們會把它給遮蓋掉，以往都這樣做。"],["徐委員巧芯：目前這個西部圖資的部分，你們會跟Google來協調……"],["邱部長國正：也當然要去。"],["徐委員巧芯：希望他們能夠隱藏起來，保護我們的國防安全嗎？"],["邱部長國正：是，這一定要去做的。"],["徐委員巧芯：會去處理。"],["邱部長國正：是。"],["徐委員巧芯：大概什麼時候會去處理？因為今天大家都蠻關心這個事情，最近？近期？"],["邱部長國正：除了去，我們有個作業程序，我去把它瞭解一下，我再跟委員做說明。"],["徐委員巧芯：好。除了圖資之外，我們都很關心，剛剛院長說睡得很好，但是我想蘇丹紅的問題到現在還沒有解決，包含是已經流向軍方了，老共還沒有打過來，我們先開始擔心國軍的飲食，蘇丹紅議題當時在食安專報的時候就已經延燒了，那時候行政院還講得很大聲說蔡政府任內沒有系統性的食安問題，可是現在蘇丹紅的議題都已經流到軍隊裡面了，陸軍後勤指揮部也有買到了，當然今天國軍有說要預防性下架，可是蘇丹紅現在還沒有查完，每天都有辣椒粉、胡椒粉、雞排粉，咖哩跟沙茶醬都有，請問院長，行政院什麼時候才會把整個蘇丹紅的問題徹查完畢，讓國軍弟兄能夠安心飲食？"],["陳院長建仁：好，謝謝委員很好的問題，實際上昨天我們鄭文燦副院長已經邀集相關的六個部會就這個蘇丹紅的議題加以討論，我也要求要在1個月內把所有相關消費端的……"],["徐委員巧芯：1個月內你們自己評估會不會太長？"],["陳院長建仁：我跟委員報告，我們現在為什麼會要繼續再來做這個檢查呢？最主要是因為我們往前推6個月啦……"],["徐委員巧芯：往前推6個月。"],["陳院長建仁：因為我們從12月開始就有逐批檢查，那我們往前推6個月的這一些都做逐批檢查，所以現在我要求他們要加速的檢查，把前6個月的這一些萬一有蘇丹紅……"],["徐委員巧芯：可是你們已經查好久了……"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["徐委員巧芯：那前6個月的檢查目前已經完成多少？"],["陳院長建仁：因為前6個月的這部分以前都是抽樣檢查，叫抽批的檢查，所以我們現在要求他一個一個都檢查出來，如果這樣檢查出來的話，可能還是會有漏網之魚，但是我跟委員報告，因為我們現在已經掌握了這十幾家同一個家族的公司……"],["徐委員巧芯：理解，所以你們會針對這6個月去做調查，我們現在很清楚。"],["陳院長建仁：所以我們實際上現在對這幾家，只要有這幾家的產品，我們就會提前下架，所以我們有把握下架的時間可能會更提前。"],["徐委員巧芯：對於近期，包含是蘇丹紅，它變成是各種不同的產品流入到市面以及軍隊裡面，行政院有沒有考慮向國人表達歉意？"],["陳院長建仁：好，蘇丹紅確實在整個早期的輸入情況是用抽批的，而且我們都是請他退貨而不是銷毀，我們也發現我們這樣的作法需要再精進，所以我們現在就要求逐批，而且進口非法食品的廠商我們已經禁止它再進口，未來在邊境發現有這樣的情形我們就會銷毀。"],["徐委員巧芯：這本來就是你們應該做的事情。那我想要問消費者權益保障的部分……"],["陳院長建仁：所以確實我們有疏忽的地方，在前面這一個區塊要改進。"],["徐委員巧芯：院長，消費者權益保障的部分，過去食用到蘇丹紅的，相關的消費者權益保障包含退貨等等的，行政院有什麼樣的要求跟處理？"],["陳院長建仁：這個部分我們有……"],["徐委員巧芯：有的拿去，他說你沒有發票，不讓人退貨，怎麼處理？"],["陳院長建仁：我們這個部分會來要求這一些第二層、第三層的食品公司都要接受相關的退貨，如果沒有的話，它是有刑責的，因為這些他們如果不下架，他們是有刑責。"],["徐委員巧芯：當然。針對向國人跟我們軍方弟兄表達歉意的這個部分，目前行政院不考慮，是嗎？還是你們……"],["陳院長建仁：不好意思，再說一次。"],["徐委員巧芯：我的意思是說，請問你們會考慮跟社會外界還有包含我們國人、國軍弟兄，因為過去整個檢查過程當中或許不夠嚴謹導致系統性的蘇丹紅問題跟國人致歉嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：這個部分我們昨天就已經有表示，我們在以往對於這些違法廠商的篩檢確實沒有逐批檢查……"],["徐委員巧芯：沒有逐批檢查、沒有做好。"],["陳院長建仁：所以我們有所要求精進。"],["徐委員巧芯：要求精進。"],["陳院長建仁：然後要改進。"],["徐委員巧芯：要改進。"],["陳院長建仁：對，我們確實需要改進。"],["徐委員巧芯：要改進，院長認為要改進。","主席，我想要請外交部長。"],["主席：麻煩請外交部備詢。"],["徐委員巧芯：謝謝部長，請外交部。"],["主席：謝謝。"],["徐委員巧芯：我想要請問幾個跟臺灣民主基金會相關的問題。"],["吳部長釗燮：委員好，是。"],["徐委員巧芯：請問這個基金會按照組織人事規章是由誰提名後任命執行長？"],["吳部長釗燮：依照規章的規定，執行長是由董事長提名，由董事會通過。"],["徐委員巧芯：董事長按照過去的慣例是由立法院長來擔任嗎？有沒有向民主基金會瞭解，新國會之後新任的董事會什麼時候會召開改選？"],["吳部長釗燮：有關於董事會召開的時間，我們正在跟即將接任董事長的立法院院長協商當中。"],["徐委員巧芯：好。再來我想要問的是，臺灣民主基金會是接受外交部的補助，開放政黨按照得票比例申請預算，這些申請有沒有相關的規範，例如要要求哪一類型的活動才符合補助的原則，你們有沒有審核的機制？"],["吳部長釗燮：並沒有很仔細的規範，但是各個政黨都有他們自己想要展開……"],["徐委員巧芯：沒有很仔細的規範，但我們在官網上就可以看到補助類型，這5項是你們具體上面講到補助類型，所以沒有在補助類型上面的我們也可以申請，你們也會給它通過嗎？"],["吳部長釗燮：是由各個政黨認為他們要進行民主外交的過程當中……"],["徐委員巧芯：所以上面這個補助類型是寫好看的？不一定？"],["吳部長釗燮：也不是，以這個為主。"],["徐委員巧芯：需不需要審核？有關補助類型，政黨來申請需不需要按照上面，我要寫跟上面補助類型1、2、3、4、5有關的才能申請，沒有關的就別申請了，你們會不會說沒有關的請你不要申請？會不會？"],["吳部長釗燮：以這個為主，但是我們尊重各個政黨他們自己的外交活動。"],["徐委員巧芯：請問這些補助案、補助給政黨的案子您有看過嗎？結案報告您在意嗎？以及就你的瞭解，政黨向民主基金會申請的補助是具有國家機密性的嗎？"],["吳部長釗燮：這個部分我們並沒有去看，因為我的職責可能不到這邊，而是這個民主基金會必須要向我們的主計處來核銷。"],["徐委員巧芯：好，我們補助的活動除了上述的補助要點之外，有包含選舉活動嗎？這個我想要問一下院長，您覺得外交部所補助的臺灣民主基金會，然後讓政黨來申請補助的時候，包含選舉相關的活動，您覺得是合適的嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：我覺得如果有國外的人要來臺灣看我們選舉的狀況……"],["徐委員巧芯：觀選OK？"],["陳院長建仁：對，觀選。"],["徐委員巧芯：但是政黨拿這個經費補助去掛羊頭賣狗肉辦選舉活動，您認可嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：我覺得這要看它的報告內容。"],["徐委員巧芯：要看報告的內容，對不對？"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["徐委員巧芯：您先記得這句話。如果發生政黨申請補助然後拿去做競選活動，後來才發現這件事情，我們有任何機制會追回或是會懲罰嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：這個基金會的操作我不是很清楚。"],["吳部長釗燮：到目前為止，那個基金會是獨立運作的，我們也沒有看到這方面的資料……"],["徐委員巧芯：但是我們政府的錢不應該被政黨拿去作為選舉之用，兩位同意嗎？"],["吳部長釗燮：如果委員有這方面的資料，交給我們，我們來看。"],["徐委員巧芯：好，有這方面的資料，我們現在就讓大家來看看。第一個，2023年的國務青旗艦營核銷補助80萬，賴清德當面力邀民進黨國務青宣示投入輔選，9月投入空戰跟陸戰；我們看下一張投影片，2023年青年對話行動核銷補助100萬元，新聞上面都直接講是在搶選票，鎖定KOL20人操盤搶年輕選票，賴清德青年對話行動3月開跑；下一張投影片，2023民主臺灣客家峰會核銷補助62萬元也是，新聞下標直接寫搶攻客家選票；再下一張，民主和平兵推營100萬，裡面寫什麼呢？這個裡面直接就講大型營隊兵推營是要做輔選活動。這些都是由執行長核定的，對吧？臺灣民主基金會執行長核定。"],["吳部長釗燮：對，應該是。"],["徐委員巧芯：我們剛詢問兩位，對於政黨申請補助透過這個來做外交或者觀選，我們都覺得很棒，但如果是像剛才那樣拿來做政黨的競選，請問院長，您覺得合適嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：如果剛才那幾個案子像青年人的座談或者是客家的座談等等，我覺得這不盡然是輔選。"],["徐委員巧芯：我們回到剛才國務青那個，國務青就是民進黨的青年軍，他們來參加活動就是去輔選的，我相信在選舉過程中您們也都有遇到過國務青，結果國務青輔選團隊的訓練經費是由臺灣民主基金會來提供，你們真的覺得這樣合適嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：國務青不是輔選的團隊，國務青是民進黨的一個團隊，然後是年輕人的團隊……"],["徐委員巧芯：然後他們有沒有參與輔選？"],["陳院長建仁：他們在別的活動裡面是參與輔選，可在這個活動裡……"],["徐委員巧芯：這個活動您確定沒有嗎？"],["陳院長建仁：我沒有看過報告我不知道……"],["徐委員巧芯：所以我給您看的就是……"],["陳院長建仁：但是我不能夠看到一個名字就說……"],["徐委員巧芯：院長，我們想要瞭解他們有沒有濫用我們補助的公帑去做輔選之實，所以我向對方要求提供結案報告，您覺得他們應該要提供嗎？"],["吳部長釗燮：跟委員報告一下，民主基金會是獨立運作的一個單位，但是……"],["徐委員巧芯：當然，但是裡面用了公帑，如果拿去選舉，這就會產生很大的問題，所以我們希望瞭解它有沒有濫用，所以我們向你們去調閱了，請問可不可以提供結案報告，結果我們得到的答案是因為各政黨計畫具機敏性，故無法提供政黨所送的結案報告。你們覺得這樣合理嗎？如果我們沒有辦法看結案報告，我要怎麼知道它當時送進來的計畫有沒有符合補助要點？結案報告裡面到底這個活動是被拿去作為選舉之用還是做一些所謂的青年相關的對話而已？我們該怎麼知道、我們該怎麼審核預算、我們該怎麼決定接下來對於民主基金會的相關補助要如何進行呢？"],["吳部長釗燮：我剛剛跟委員報告過，民主基金會是一個獨立運作的單位，今年下半年在審核民主基金會預算的時候，我想這個委員可以提出來。"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["徐委員巧芯：是，未來如果還有政黨拿了選舉的計畫，掛羊頭賣狗肉，它給你的時候講我們要辦民主、我們要辦青年，但是最後拿去做了選舉之實，請問我們有沒有相當的效力去要求不能這樣做？因為裡面涉及到的是我們外交部的補助，而外交部的經費來自人民的納稅錢。"],["陳院長建仁：我想是這樣子，如果委員覺得要有加強這一個力道，對於民間的團體來做監督的話，也許在今年審查會的時候、預算審查的時候，應該加一些決議讓他們來遵循。"],["徐委員巧芯：最後我問一下，您覺得這樣子的政黨申請補助之後的結案報告是涉及什麼方面的機敏性，不能讓立法委員來做調閱？"],["吳部長釗燮：這個應該由民主基金會來回答，因為民主基金會……"],["陳院長建仁：對，我們沒有辦法……"],["徐委員巧芯：沒有，它不提供給我們，所以我問你們認不認為這有機敏性嘛！你們認不認為這涉及所謂的政黨或是國家的機密？這是你們的看法，跟它無關啊！"],["吳部長釗燮：剛剛跟委員報告過，民主基金會是一個獨立運作的單位……"],["徐委員巧芯：我聽過了、我聽過了……"],["吳部長釗燮：也跟委員講一下……"],["徐委員巧芯：我問的是你覺得政黨申請的部分有沒有涉及機敏性？"],["吳部長釗燮：民主基金會有很多的慣例存在，我們基本上對這些慣例都尊重。"],["徐委員巧芯：謝謝主席。"],["主席：謝謝徐委員巧芯的質詢，謝謝陳院長的備詢。","接下來請登記第4位的陳委員永康質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":184,"meet_id":"院會-11-1-4","speakers":["韓國瑜","麥玉珍","范雲","陳玉珍","謝龍介","吳沛憶","李彥秀","馬文君","李坤城","沈伯洋","張雅琳","吳宗憲","徐巧芯","陳永康","楊曜","陳俊宇","邱鎮軍","蘇清泉","劉建國","張嘉郡","陳超明","陳秀寳"],"page_start":99,"meetingDate":["2024-03-12"],"gazette_id":"1130601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1130601_00004","1130601_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期第4次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢─ 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\"您說得很好但是呢我們想看到的是確實有很多的各種的問題比方說最近有一件呢跟國安有點疑慮相關的事情媒體剛才才披露Google Earth這一波呢台灣西部做了一個圖資的更新\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"您\", \"start\": 103.675, \"end\": 103.955, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 103.955, \"end\": 104.075, \"score\": 0.815}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 104.075, \"end\": 104.316, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 104.316, \"end\": 104.576, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 104.576, \"end\": 104.756, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 104.756, \"end\": 104.896, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 104.896, \"end\": 105.096, \"score\": 0.97}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 105.096, \"end\": 105.316, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 105.316, \"end\": 106.136, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"看\", \"start\": 106.136, \"end\": 106.376, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 106.376, \"end\": 106.556, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 106.556, 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\"end\": 115.318, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"t\", \"start\": 115.318, \"end\": 115.338, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"h\", \"start\": 115.338, \"end\": 115.458, \"score\": 0.827}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 115.458, \"end\": 115.578, \"score\": 0.881}, {\"word\": \"波\", \"start\": 115.578, \"end\": 115.778, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 115.778, \"end\": 115.958, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 115.958, \"end\": 116.358, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"灣\"}, {\"word\": \"西\", \"start\": 116.358, \"end\": 116.579, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 116.579, \"end\": 116.759, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"做\", \"start\": 116.759, \"end\": 116.899, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 116.899, \"end\": 116.999, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 116.999, \"end\": 117.599, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"圖\"}, {\"word\": \"資\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 117.599, \"end\": 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{\"word\": \"栗\", \"start\": 139.356, \"end\": 139.556, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"西\", \"start\": 139.556, \"end\": 139.756, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"湖\", \"start\": 139.756, \"end\": 140.377, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"飛\"}, {\"word\": \"彈\"}, {\"word\": \"基\", \"start\": 140.377, \"end\": 140.557, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"地\", \"start\": 140.557, \"end\": 140.757, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 140.757, \"end\": 140.817, \"score\": 0.668}, {\"word\": \"及\", \"start\": 140.817, \"end\": 140.957, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 140.957, \"end\": 141.217, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 141.217, \"end\": 141.478, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"清\", \"start\": 141.478, \"end\": 141.658, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"泉\", \"start\": 141.658, \"end\": 142.078, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"崗\"}, {\"word\": \"新\", \"start\": 142.078, \"end\": 142.298, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"建\", \"start\": 142.298, 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148.867, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"掌\", \"start\": 148.867, \"end\": 149.048, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"握\", \"start\": 149.048, \"end\": 150.07, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"狀\"}, {\"word\": \"況\"}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 150.07, \"end\": 150.251, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"及\", \"start\": 150.251, \"end\": 150.672, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 150.672, \"end\": 151.073, \"score\": 0.896}, {\"word\": \"續\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 151.073, \"end\": 151.193, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 151.193, \"end\": 151.314, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 151.314, \"end\": 151.514, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 151.514, \"end\": 151.675, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 151.675, \"end\": 151.855, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"任\", \"start\": 151.855, \"end\": 152.036, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"何\", \"start\": 152.036, \"end\": 152.176, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 152.176, \"end\": 152.317, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"處\"}, {\"word\": \"置\", \"start\": 152.317, \"end\": 152.337, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"?\"}]}, {\"start\": 154.831, \"end\": 181.809, \"text\": \"國防安全是大家很關切課題像現在科技那麼發達不管是衛星徵兆等等這些圖資都很容易顯露出來但我有一個作為通常我會跟這些單位不管是Google這些單位會有去跟他們做一個協議有關於這個機敏處所他會把它給遮蓋掉那目前這個西部圖資的部分我們會跟Google來協調希望他們能夠隱藏起來保護我們的國防安全嗎\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"防\", \"start\": 154.831, \"end\": 154.991, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"安\", \"start\": 154.991, \"end\": 155.151, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"全\", \"start\": 155.151, \"end\": 155.511, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 155.511, \"end\": 155.692, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 155.692, \"end\": 155.812, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"家\", \"start\": 155.812, \"end\": 155.932, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 155.932, \"end\": 156.492, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, 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\"end\": 904.087, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 904.087, \"end\": 904.207, \"score\": 0.868}, {\"word\": \"它\", \"start\": 904.207, \"end\": 904.347, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 904.347, \"end\": 904.547, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"涉\", \"start\": 904.547, \"end\": 904.768, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"及\", \"start\": 904.768, \"end\": 904.948, \"score\": 0.891}, {\"word\": \"怎\", \"start\": 904.948, \"end\": 905.488, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 905.488, \"end\": 905.688, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 905.688, \"end\": 905.828, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 905.828, \"end\": 906.189, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"機\"}, {\"word\": \"敏\", \"start\": 906.189, \"end\": 906.369, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"性\", \"start\": 906.369, \"end\": 906.609, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 906.609, \"end\": 906.749, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 906.749, \"end\": 907.11, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"讓\"}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 907.11, \"end\": 907.27, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 907.27, \"end\": 907.43, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 907.43, \"end\": 907.55, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"做\", \"start\": 907.55, \"end\": 907.57, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"閱\"}, {\"word\": \"?\"}]}, {\"start\": 909.682, \"end\": 932.287, \"text\": \"這個應該由民主基金會那邊來回答沒有我是問你們覺得沒有那他不提供給我們那我問你們是你們認不認為這有機敏性嗎你們認不認為這涉及所謂的政黨或是國家的機密這是你們的看法這跟他無關吶剛剛跟委員報過那個民主基金會他是一個獨立運作的這個單位我聽過了我聽過了我問的是你覺得那個民主基金會有很多的\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"應\"}, {\"word\": \"該\"}, {\"word\": \"由\", \"start\": 909.682, \"end\": 909.882, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 909.882, \"end\": 910.062, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 910.062, \"end\": 910.202, \"score\": 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{\"word\": \"永\", \"start\": 946.668, \"end\": 946.969, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"康\", \"start\": 946.969, \"end\": 946.989, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:11,993 --> 00:00:30,027\n委員長好,我想有請我們陳建仁院長以及國防部邱部長。請陳院長國防部備詢。徐委員午安。午安。那我想先請教一下我們陳院長,最近呢晚上睡得怎麼樣?\n\n2\n00:00:31,511 --> 00:00:51,562\n我一向睡眠都很好。謝謝。一向睡眠都很好。我想最近大家都很關心我們的部會首長還有我們院長睡得好不好。主要是因為先前在質詢的過程當中,邱國正部長有告訴我們兩岸相當的危險,所以他晚上有的時候很煩惱會睡不著。那想必這個陳建仁院長沒有這樣子的困擾,\n\n3\n00:00:52,182 --> 00:01:12,311\n但我們今天要問的是CNN的著名的評論員他的意見他談到了說呢現在台灣已經是世界上最危險的地方現在變得更加危險那所以我們才會很好奇說陳建仁院長怎麼看待目前兩岸的情勢有感覺到CNN的評論員所說的變得更加危險嗎\n\n4\n00:01:14,174 --> 00:01:31,368\n在COVID-19的時間曾經訪問過我,我也知道他很關心臺灣的安全,算是朋友。我想他最主要的呼籲就是希望我們臺灣要提高警覺,然後美國跟其他的盟友應該要來協助臺灣做很好的我們臺灣的國防自衛。\n\n5\n00:01:43,675 --> 00:01:58,019\n您說得很好但是呢我們想看到的是確實有很多的各種的問題比方說最近有一件呢跟國安有點疑慮相關的事情媒體剛才才披露GoogleEarth這一波呢台灣西部做了一個圖資的更新\n\n6\n00:01:58,559 --> 00:02:26,722\n我們可以看到更新之後那可以看到西側國防部這個過去協調模糊化的高斯軍事建築包含是國防部、空軍司令部、海軍司令部等等都相當的清楚包含整建中的北部龜山愛國者獄被鎮地、獄部屬M1、A2戰車的大崗營區、楊梅飛彈營區、苗栗西湖飛彈基地以及台中清泉崗新建萬建庫等等都在圖資上面可以顯示的相當清楚\n\n7\n00:02:27,122 --> 00:02:32,337\n我想問一下部長我們有沒有掌握這個狀況以及後續有沒有要進行任何的處置?\n\n8\n00:02:34,831 --> 00:03:01,809\n國防安全是大家很關切課題像現在科技那麼發達不管是衛星徵兆等等這些圖資都很容易顯露出來但我有一個作為通常我會跟這些單位不管是Google這些單位會有去跟他們做一個協議有關於這個機敏處所他會把它給遮蓋掉那目前這個西部圖資的部分我們會跟Google來協調希望他們能夠隱藏起來保護我們的國防安全嗎\n\n9\n00:03:02,629 --> 00:03:06,791\n除了這個圖資之外呢這個我們都很關心剛剛院長說得很好那但是呢我想蘇丹紅的問題到現在還沒有解決那包含是已經流向軍方了\n\n10\n00:03:25,037 --> 00:03:44,700\n老共還沒有打過來,我們先開始擔心國軍的飲食。蘇丹紅議題當時在食安專報的時候就已經延燒了,那時候行政院還講得很大聲說蔡政府任內沒有系統性的食安問題,可現在蘇丹紅的議題都已經流到軍隊裡面了,陸軍的後勤指揮部也有買到了。\n\n11\n00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:45,280\n好,謝謝委員的很好的問題。\n\n12\n00:04:06,896 --> 00:04:27,810\n實際上昨天我們鄭文燦副院長已經召開了相關的六個部會就蘇丹紅的這個議題加以討論那我也要求要在一個月內要把所有的相關的消費端的一個月內你們自己評估會不會太差\n\n13\n00:04:29,170 --> 00:04:57,260\n我跟委員報告,我們現在為什麼會要繼續再來做這個檢查呢?最主要是因為我們往前推6個月啦。往前推6個月。因為我們從12月開始就有逐批檢查。那我們往前推6個月的這一些,我們都做逐批檢查。所以現在我要求他們要加速的檢查以後,把前6個月的這一些萬一有疏擋防控。可是我們已經查好久了。那前6個月的檢查目前已經完成?\n\n14\n00:04:57,520 --> 00:05:23,730\n因為前6個月的這一個部分以前都是抽樣檢查叫抽批的檢查那我們現在要求他一個一個都檢查出來所以如果這樣檢查出來的話可能還是會有漏網之魚但是我跟委員報告因為我們現在已經掌握了這十幾家的這一個同一個家族的這一些公司所以你們會針對這6個月去做調查所以我們實際上現在對這幾家\n\n15\n00:05:26,551 --> 00:05:28,111\n徐巧芯徐巧芯\n\n16\n00:05:54,735 --> 00:05:54,995\n徐巧芯\n\n17\n00:06:15,302 --> 00:06:33,563\n那我想問消費者的權益保障部分。院長,消費者權益保障的部分,過去使用到蘇丹紅的,那相關的消費者權益保障,包含是退貨啊等等的,我們行政院有什麼樣的要求跟處理呢?有的拿得去,他說你沒有發票不讓他退貨。\n\n18\n00:06:34,324 --> 00:07:03,543\n我們這個部分會來要求相關的第二層第三層的這一些食品公司都要接受這個相關的退貨如果沒有的話他是有刑責的因為這些他們如果不下架他們是有刑責針對國人跟我們軍方的弟兄表達歉意的這個部分目前行政院不考慮是嗎還是你們我的意思是說請問你們會考慮跟社會外界還有包含我們國人國軍弟兄\n\n19\n00:07:03,983 --> 00:07:17,688\n因為過去整個檢查的過程當中或許不夠嚴謹所產生導致於系統性的蘇丹紅的問題跟國人致歉嗎?這個部分我們昨天就已經有表示我們在以往的這個對於這些違法廠商的篩檢確實沒有\n\n20\n00:07:21,509 --> 00:07:37,056\n主批檢查,所以我們有所要求精進,然後要改進,對,我們確實需要改進。要改進,院長認為要改進。主席,我想請那個,主席,院長我想要請那個外交部長,我們先謝謝。麻煩請外交部被請。謝謝,謝謝部長,請外交部。謝謝。\n\n21\n00:07:46,431 --> 00:08:13,124\n我想要請問幾個跟臺灣民主基金會相關的問題請問呢這個基金會按照我們的組織人事規章是由誰提名後任命執行長?依照規章的這個規定是由那個執行長是由董事長提名由董事會通過那董事長呢按照過去的慣例是由立法院長來擔任嗎?有沒有像民主基金會瞭解新國會之後新任的董事會什麼時候會召開改選?\n\n22\n00:08:14,837 --> 00:08:41,380\n有關於董事會召開的時間我們正在跟那個即將接任董事長的立法院院長正在協商當中。好那再來我們想要問的是台灣民主基金會是接受我們外交部的補助開放政黨按照比例申請的得票比例申請預算那這些申請有沒有相關的規範例如要要求哪一類型的活動才符合補助的原則我們有沒有審核的機制?\n\n23\n00:08:42,259 --> 00:08:42,399\n﹚徐巧芯﹚\n\n24\n00:09:05,146 --> 00:09:07,087\n徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯\n\n25\n00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:37,127\n政黨向民主基金會申請的補助它是具有國家機密性的嗎?\n\n26\n00:09:38,140 --> 00:09:38,160\n我認為\n\n27\n00:10:08,140 --> 00:10:13,910\n如果有國外的人要來臺灣看我們的選舉的狀況關選OK關選OK但是政黨拿這個經費補助其實去掛羊頭賣狗肉去辦選舉活動您認可嗎?\n\n28\n00:10:22,130 --> 00:10:50,532\n我覺得這要看報告的內容。要看報告的內容對不對。您先記得這句話。那如果發生是政黨申請補助然後拿去做競選活動後來才發現這件事情我們有任何機制會追回嗎?或是會懲罰嗎?這個基金會的操作我不是很清楚。到目前為止那個基金會是獨立運作的。那我們也沒有看到這方面的資料。獨立運作但是我們政府的錢不應該被拿去政黨作為選舉之用兩位同意嗎?\n\n29\n00:10:51,420 --> 00:11:10,278\n如果說委員有這方面的資料交給我們以後我們來看。好,有這方面的資料我們就現在讓大家來看看喔。這個第一個,2023年的國務卿齊建穎核銷補助80萬,賴清德當面力邀民進黨國務卿宣誓投入輔選,9月投入空戰跟陸戰,我們看下一張投影片。\n\n30\n00:11:11,107 --> 00:11:34,181\n二零二三年青年對話行動和蕭補助一百萬元在新聞上面都直接講是在搶選票鎖定KOL二十人超盤搶年輕選票賴清德青年對話行動三月開跑下一張投影片二零二三民主台灣客家峰會和蕭補助六十二萬元也是新聞下標直接寫搶攻客家選票再下一張\n\n31\n00:11:35,393 --> 00:11:51,330\n民主、和平、兵推營100萬,裡面寫什麼呢?你們直接就講了,這個裡面的直接就講大型營隊兵推營是要幹嘛呢?復選活動,下一頁。這些都是由執行長核定的對吧?\n\n32\n00:11:52,342 --> 00:12:11,395\n臺灣民主基金會執行長何鼎我們剛詢問兩位大家對於政黨來申請補助去透過這個來做外交或者官選我們都覺得很棒但如果是像剛才那樣拿來做政黨的競選請問院長您覺得合適嗎如果剛才那幾個案子像那個\n\n33\n00:12:13,183 --> 00:12:14,544\n國務卿就是民進黨的青年軍他們來參加活動就是去輔選的\n\n34\n00:12:30,140 --> 00:12:32,462\n國務卿是一個民進黨的一個團隊,然後是年輕人的團隊。然後他們有沒有參與輔選?\n\n35\n00:12:55,629 --> 00:13:00,835\n院長您覺得我們想要了解他們有沒有濫用我們的輔助的公帑去做輔選之事所以我向對方要求提供結案報告您覺得他們應該要提供嗎?\n\n36\n00:13:18,684 --> 00:13:37,906\n跟委員報告一下就是民主基金會他是獨立運作的一個當然但是裡面用了公卡如果拿去選舉這就會產生很大的問題所以我們希望了解他有沒有濫用所以我們向你們去調閱了請問可不可以提供結案報告結果我們得到的答案是\n\n37\n00:13:38,927 --> 00:13:53,023\n因為各政黨計劃具機敏性,無法提供政黨所送的結案報告。你們覺得這樣合理嗎?如果我們沒有辦法看結案報告,我要怎麼知道他當時送的計劃進來有沒有符合補助要點?\n\n38\n00:13:53,624 --> 00:13:58,228\n我剛跟委員報告過民主基金會是一個獨立運作的單位那在今年下半年在審核民主基金會預算的時候那我想這個委員可以提出來\n\n39\n00:14:20,307 --> 00:14:42,148\n是未來如果還有政黨拿了選舉的計劃掛羊頭賣狗肉他給你的時候講說有我們要辦民主我們要辦青年但是最後拿去做了選舉支持請問我們有沒有相當的效力要求說不能這樣做因為裡面涉及到的是我們外交部的補助而外交部的經費來自人民的納稅錢\n\n40\n00:14:43,509 --> 00:15:07,570\n我想這樣子,如果委員覺得要有加強這個力道對於這個民間的團體來做監督的話,也許在今年的審查會的時候,預算審查的時候應該有加一些這個決議讓他們來遵行。最後我問一下,您覺得這樣子的政黨申請補助之後的結案報告它是涉及怎麼樣方面的機敏性不能讓立法委員來做調閱?\n\n41\n00:15:09,682 --> 00:15:32,287\n這個應該由民主基金會那邊來回答沒有我是問你們覺得沒有那他不提供給我們那我問你們是你們認不認為這有機敏性嗎你們認不認為這涉及所謂的政黨或是國家的機密這是你們的看法這跟他無關吶剛剛跟委員報過那個民主基金會他是一個獨立運作的這個單位我聽過了我聽過了我問的是你覺得那個民主基金會有很多的\n\n42\n00:15:40,069 --> 00:15:46,989\n謝謝徐委員巧芯的質詢謝謝陳院長的備詢接下來我們請登記第四位陳委員永康質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n11993\t30027\t委員長好,我想有請我們陳建仁院長以及國防部邱部長。請陳院長國防部備詢。徐委員午安。午安。那我想先請教一下我們陳院長,最近呢晚上睡得怎麼樣?\n31511\t51562\t我一向睡眠都很好。謝謝。一向睡眠都很好。我想最近大家都很關心我們的部會首長還有我們院長睡得好不好。主要是因為先前在質詢的過程當中,邱國正部長有告訴我們兩岸相當的危險,所以他晚上有的時候很煩惱會睡不著。那想必這個陳建仁院長沒有這樣子的困擾,\n52182\t72311\t但我們今天要問的是CNN的著名的評論員他的意見他談到了說呢現在台灣已經是世界上最危險的地方現在變得更加危險那所以我們才會很好奇說陳建仁院長怎麼看待目前兩岸的情勢有感覺到CNN的評論員所說的變得更加危險嗎\n74174\t91368\t在COVID-19的時間曾經訪問過我,我也知道他很關心臺灣的安全,算是朋友。我想他最主要的呼籲就是希望我們臺灣要提高警覺,然後美國跟其他的盟友應該要來協助臺灣做很好的我們臺灣的國防自衛。\n103675\t118019\t您說得很好但是呢我們想看到的是確實有很多的各種的問題比方說最近有一件呢跟國安有點疑慮相關的事情媒體剛才才披露Google Earth這一波呢台灣西部做了一個圖資的更新\n118559\t146722\t我們可以看到更新之後那可以看到西側國防部這個過去協調模糊化的高斯軍事建築包含是國防部、空軍司令部、海軍司令部等等都相當的清楚包含整建中的北部龜山愛國者獄被鎮地、獄部屬M1、A2戰車的大崗營區、楊梅飛彈營區、苗栗西湖飛彈基地以及台中清泉崗新建萬建庫等等都在圖資上面可以顯示的相當清楚\n147122\t152337\t我想問一下部長我們有沒有掌握這個狀況以及後續有沒有要進行任何的處置?\n154831\t181809\t國防安全是大家很關切課題像現在科技那麼發達不管是衛星徵兆等等這些圖資都很容易顯露出來但我有一個作為通常我會跟這些單位不管是Google這些單位會有去跟他們做一個協議有關於這個機敏處所他會把它給遮蓋掉那目前這個西部圖資的部分我們會跟Google來協調希望他們能夠隱藏起來保護我們的國防安全嗎\n182629\t186791\t除了這個圖資之外呢這個我們都很關心剛剛院長說得很好那但是呢我想蘇丹紅的問題到現在還沒有解決那包含是已經流向軍方了\n205037\t224700\t老共還沒有打過來,我們先開始擔心國軍的飲食。蘇丹紅議題當時在食安專報的時候就已經延燒了,那時候行政院還講得很大聲說蔡政府任內沒有系統性的食安問題,可現在蘇丹紅的議題都已經流到軍隊裡面了,陸軍的後勤指揮部也有買到了。\n225000\t225280\t好,謝謝委員的很好的問題。\n246896\t267810\t實際上昨天我們鄭文燦副院長已經召開了相關的六個部會就蘇丹紅的這個議題加以討論那我也要求要在一個月內要把所有的相關的消費端的一個月內你們自己評估會不會太差\n269170\t297260\t我跟委員報告,我們現在為什麼會要繼續再來做這個檢查呢?最主要是因為我們往前推6個月啦。往前推6個月。因為我們從12月開始就有逐批檢查。那我們往前推6個月的這一些,我們都做逐批檢查。所以現在我要求他們要加速的檢查以後,把前6個月的這一些萬一有疏擋防控。可是我們已經查好久了。那前6個月的檢查目前已經完成?\n297520\t323730\t因為前6個月的這一個部分以前都是抽樣檢查叫抽批的檢查那我們現在要求他一個一個都檢查出來所以如果這樣檢查出來的話可能還是會有漏網之魚但是我跟委員報告因為我們現在已經掌握了這十幾家的這一個同一個家族的這一些公司所以你們會針對這6個月去做調查所以我們實際上現在對這幾家\n326551\t328111\t徐巧芯徐巧芯\n354735\t354995\t徐巧芯\n375302\t393563\t那我想問消費者的權益保障部分。院長,消費者權益保障的部分,過去使用到蘇丹紅的,那相關的消費者權益保障,包含是退貨啊等等的,我們行政院有什麼樣的要求跟處理呢?有的拿得去,他說你沒有發票不讓他退貨。\n394324\t423543\t我們這個部分會來要求相關的第二層第三層的這一些食品公司都要接受這個相關的退貨如果沒有的話他是有刑責的因為這些他們如果不下架他們是有刑責針對國人跟我們軍方的弟兄表達歉意的這個部分目前行政院不考慮是嗎還是你們我的意思是說請問你們會考慮跟社會外界還有包含我們國人國軍弟兄\n423983\t437688\t因為過去整個檢查的過程當中或許不夠嚴謹所產生導致於系統性的蘇丹紅的問題跟國人致歉嗎?這個部分我們昨天就已經有表示我們在以往的這個對於這些違法廠商的篩檢確實沒有\n441509\t457056\t主批檢查,所以我們有所要求精進,然後要改進,對,我們確實需要改進。要改進,院長認為要改進。主席,我想請那個,主席,院長我想要請那個外交部長,我們先謝謝。麻煩請外交部被請。謝謝,謝謝部長,請外交部。謝謝。\n466431\t493124\t我想要請問幾個跟臺灣民主基金會相關的問題請問呢這個基金會按照我們的組織人事規章是由誰提名後任命執行長?依照規章的這個規定是由那個執行長是由董事長提名由董事會通過那董事長呢按照過去的慣例是由立法院長來擔任嗎?有沒有像民主基金會瞭解新國會之後新任的董事會什麼時候會召開改選?\n494837\t521380\t有關於董事會召開的時間我們正在跟那個即將接任董事長的立法院院長正在協商當中。好那再來我們想要問的是台灣民主基金會是接受我們外交部的補助開放政黨按照比例申請的得票比例申請預算那這些申請有沒有相關的規範例如要要求哪一類型的活動才符合補助的原則我們有沒有審核的機制?\n522259\t522399\t﹚徐巧芯﹚\n545146\t547087\t徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯\n573280\t577127\t政黨向民主基金會申請的補助它是具有國家機密性的嗎?\n578140\t578160\t我認為\n608140\t613910\t如果有國外的人要來臺灣看我們的選舉的狀況關選OK關選OK但是政黨拿這個經費補助其實去掛羊頭賣狗肉去辦選舉活動您認可嗎?\n622130\t650532\t我覺得這要看報告的內容。要看報告的內容對不對。您先記得這句話。那如果發生是政黨申請補助然後拿去做競選活動後來才發現這件事情我們有任何機制會追回嗎?或是會懲罰嗎?這個基金會的操作我不是很清楚。到目前為止那個基金會是獨立運作的。那我們也沒有看到這方面的資料。獨立運作但是我們政府的錢不應該被拿去政黨作為選舉之用兩位同意嗎?\n651420\t670278\t如果說委員有這方面的資料交給我們以後我們來看。好,有這方面的資料我們就現在讓大家來看看喔。 這個第一個,2023年的國務卿齊建穎核銷補助80萬,賴清德當面力邀民進黨國務卿宣誓投入輔選,9月投入空戰跟陸戰,我們看下一張投影片。\n671107\t694181\t二零二三年青年對話行動和蕭補助一百萬元在新聞上面都直接講是在搶選票鎖定KOL二十人超盤搶年輕選票賴清德青年對話行動三月開跑下一張投影片二零二三民主台灣客家峰會和蕭補助六十二萬元也是新聞下標直接寫搶攻客家選票再下一張\n695393\t711330\t民主、和平、兵推營100萬,裡面寫什麼呢?你們直接就講了,這個裡面的直接就講大型營隊兵推營是要幹嘛呢?復選活動,下一頁。這些都是由執行長核定的對吧?\n712342\t731395\t臺灣民主基金會執行長何鼎我們剛詢問兩位大家對於政黨來申請補助去透過這個來做外交或者官選我們都覺得很棒但如果是像剛才那樣拿來做政黨的競選請問院長您覺得合適嗎如果剛才那幾個案子像那個\n733183\t734544\t國務卿就是民進黨的青年軍他們來參加活動就是去輔選的\n750140\t752462\t國務卿是一個民進黨的一個團隊,然後是年輕人的團隊。 然後他們有沒有參與輔選?\n775629\t780835\t院長您覺得我們想要了解他們有沒有濫用我們的輔助的公帑去做輔選之事所以我向對方要求提供結案報告您覺得他們應該要提供嗎?\n798684\t817906\t跟委員報告一下就是民主基金會他是獨立運作的一個當然但是裡面用了公卡如果拿去選舉這就會產生很大的問題所以我們希望了解他有沒有濫用所以我們向你們去調閱了請問可不可以提供結案報告結果我們得到的答案是\n818927\t833023\t因為各政黨計劃具機敏性,無法提供政黨所送的結案報告。你們覺得這樣合理嗎?如果我們沒有辦法看結案報告,我要怎麼知道他當時送的計劃進來有沒有符合補助要點?\n833624\t838228\t我剛跟委員報告過民主基金會是一個獨立運作的單位那在今年下半年在審核民主基金會預算的時候那我想這個委員可以提出來\n860307\t882148\t是未來如果還有政黨拿了選舉的計劃掛羊頭賣狗肉他給你的時候講說有我們要辦民主我們要辦青年但是最後拿去做了選舉支持請問我們有沒有相當的效力要求說不能這樣做因為裡面涉及到的是我們外交部的補助而外交部的經費來自人民的納稅錢\n883509\t907570\t我想這樣子,如果委員覺得要有加強這個力道對於這個民間的團體來做監督的話,也許在今年的審查會的時候,預算審查的時候應該有加一些這個決議讓他們來遵行。最後我問一下,您覺得這樣子的政黨申請補助之後的結案報告它是涉及怎麼樣方面的機敏性不能讓立法委員來做調閱?\n909682\t932287\t這個應該由民主基金會那邊來回答沒有我是問你們覺得沒有那他不提供給我們那我問你們是你們認不認為這有機敏性嗎你們認不認為這涉及所謂的政黨或是國家的機密這是你們的看法這跟他無關吶剛剛跟委員報過那個民主基金會他是一個獨立運作的這個單位我聽過了我聽過了我問的是你覺得那個民主基金會有很多的\n940069\t946989\t謝謝徐委員巧芯的質詢謝謝陳院長的備詢接下來我們請登記第四位陳委員永康質詢\n","txt":"委員長好,我想有請我們陳建仁院長以及國防部邱部長。請陳院長國防部備詢。徐委員午安。午安。那我想先請教一下我們陳院長,最近呢晚上睡得怎麼樣?\n我一向睡眠都很好。謝謝。一向睡眠都很好。我想最近大家都很關心我們的部會首長還有我們院長睡得好不好。主要是因為先前在質詢的過程當中,邱國正部長有告訴我們兩岸相當的危險,所以他晚上有的時候很煩惱會睡不著。那想必這個陳建仁院長沒有這樣子的困擾,\n但我們今天要問的是CNN的著名的評論員他的意見他談到了說呢現在台灣已經是世界上最危險的地方現在變得更加危險那所以我們才會很好奇說陳建仁院長怎麼看待目前兩岸的情勢有感覺到CNN的評論員所說的變得更加危險嗎\n在COVID-19的時間曾經訪問過我,我也知道他很關心臺灣的安全,算是朋友。我想他最主要的呼籲就是希望我們臺灣要提高警覺,然後美國跟其他的盟友應該要來協助臺灣做很好的我們臺灣的國防自衛。\n您說得很好但是呢我們想看到的是確實有很多的各種的問題比方說最近有一件呢跟國安有點疑慮相關的事情媒體剛才才披露Google Earth這一波呢台灣西部做了一個圖資的更新\n我們可以看到更新之後那可以看到西側國防部這個過去協調模糊化的高斯軍事建築包含是國防部、空軍司令部、海軍司令部等等都相當的清楚包含整建中的北部龜山愛國者獄被鎮地、獄部屬M1、A2戰車的大崗營區、楊梅飛彈營區、苗栗西湖飛彈基地以及台中清泉崗新建萬建庫等等都在圖資上面可以顯示的相當清楚\n我想問一下部長我們有沒有掌握這個狀況以及後續有沒有要進行任何的處置?\n國防安全是大家很關切課題像現在科技那麼發達不管是衛星徵兆等等這些圖資都很容易顯露出來但我有一個作為通常我會跟這些單位不管是Google這些單位會有去跟他們做一個協議有關於這個機敏處所他會把它給遮蓋掉那目前這個西部圖資的部分我們會跟Google來協調希望他們能夠隱藏起來保護我們的國防安全嗎\n除了這個圖資之外呢這個我們都很關心剛剛院長說得很好那但是呢我想蘇丹紅的問題到現在還沒有解決那包含是已經流向軍方了\n老共還沒有打過來,我們先開始擔心國軍的飲食。蘇丹紅議題當時在食安專報的時候就已經延燒了,那時候行政院還講得很大聲說蔡政府任內沒有系統性的食安問題,可現在蘇丹紅的議題都已經流到軍隊裡面了,陸軍的後勤指揮部也有買到了。\n好,謝謝委員的很好的問題。\n實際上昨天我們鄭文燦副院長已經召開了相關的六個部會就蘇丹紅的這個議題加以討論那我也要求要在一個月內要把所有的相關的消費端的一個月內你們自己評估會不會太差\n我跟委員報告,我們現在為什麼會要繼續再來做這個檢查呢?最主要是因為我們往前推6個月啦。往前推6個月。因為我們從12月開始就有逐批檢查。那我們往前推6個月的這一些,我們都做逐批檢查。所以現在我要求他們要加速的檢查以後,把前6個月的這一些萬一有疏擋防控。可是我們已經查好久了。那前6個月的檢查目前已經完成?\n因為前6個月的這一個部分以前都是抽樣檢查叫抽批的檢查那我們現在要求他一個一個都檢查出來所以如果這樣檢查出來的話可能還是會有漏網之魚但是我跟委員報告因為我們現在已經掌握了這十幾家的這一個同一個家族的這一些公司所以你們會針對這6個月去做調查所以我們實際上現在對這幾家\n徐巧芯徐巧芯\n徐巧芯\n那我想問消費者的權益保障部分。院長,消費者權益保障的部分,過去使用到蘇丹紅的,那相關的消費者權益保障,包含是退貨啊等等的,我們行政院有什麼樣的要求跟處理呢?有的拿得去,他說你沒有發票不讓他退貨。\n我們這個部分會來要求相關的第二層第三層的這一些食品公司都要接受這個相關的退貨如果沒有的話他是有刑責的因為這些他們如果不下架他們是有刑責針對國人跟我們軍方的弟兄表達歉意的這個部分目前行政院不考慮是嗎還是你們我的意思是說請問你們會考慮跟社會外界還有包含我們國人國軍弟兄\n因為過去整個檢查的過程當中或許不夠嚴謹所產生導致於系統性的蘇丹紅的問題跟國人致歉嗎?這個部分我們昨天就已經有表示我們在以往的這個對於這些違法廠商的篩檢確實沒有\n主批檢查,所以我們有所要求精進,然後要改進,對,我們確實需要改進。要改進,院長認為要改進。主席,我想請那個,主席,院長我想要請那個外交部長,我們先謝謝。麻煩請外交部被請。謝謝,謝謝部長,請外交部。謝謝。\n我想要請問幾個跟臺灣民主基金會相關的問題請問呢這個基金會按照我們的組織人事規章是由誰提名後任命執行長?依照規章的這個規定是由那個執行長是由董事長提名由董事會通過那董事長呢按照過去的慣例是由立法院長來擔任嗎?有沒有像民主基金會瞭解新國會之後新任的董事會什麼時候會召開改選?\n有關於董事會召開的時間我們正在跟那個即將接任董事長的立法院院長正在協商當中。好那再來我們想要問的是台灣民主基金會是接受我們外交部的補助開放政黨按照比例申請的得票比例申請預算那這些申請有沒有相關的規範例如要要求哪一類型的活動才符合補助的原則我們有沒有審核的機制?\n﹚徐巧芯﹚\n徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯\n政黨向民主基金會申請的補助它是具有國家機密性的嗎?\n我認為\n如果有國外的人要來臺灣看我們的選舉的狀況關選OK關選OK但是政黨拿這個經費補助其實去掛羊頭賣狗肉去辦選舉活動您認可嗎?\n我覺得這要看報告的內容。要看報告的內容對不對。您先記得這句話。那如果發生是政黨申請補助然後拿去做競選活動後來才發現這件事情我們有任何機制會追回嗎?或是會懲罰嗎?這個基金會的操作我不是很清楚。到目前為止那個基金會是獨立運作的。那我們也沒有看到這方面的資料。獨立運作但是我們政府的錢不應該被拿去政黨作為選舉之用兩位同意嗎?\n如果說委員有這方面的資料交給我們以後我們來看。好,有這方面的資料我們就現在讓大家來看看喔。 這個第一個,2023年的國務卿齊建穎核銷補助80萬,賴清德當面力邀民進黨國務卿宣誓投入輔選,9月投入空戰跟陸戰,我們看下一張投影片。\n二零二三年青年對話行動和蕭補助一百萬元在新聞上面都直接講是在搶選票鎖定KOL二十人超盤搶年輕選票賴清德青年對話行動三月開跑下一張投影片二零二三民主台灣客家峰會和蕭補助六十二萬元也是新聞下標直接寫搶攻客家選票再下一張\n民主、和平、兵推營100萬,裡面寫什麼呢?你們直接就講了,這個裡面的直接就講大型營隊兵推營是要幹嘛呢?復選活動,下一頁。這些都是由執行長核定的對吧?\n臺灣民主基金會執行長何鼎我們剛詢問兩位大家對於政黨來申請補助去透過這個來做外交或者官選我們都覺得很棒但如果是像剛才那樣拿來做政黨的競選請問院長您覺得合適嗎如果剛才那幾個案子像那個\n國務卿就是民進黨的青年軍他們來參加活動就是去輔選的\n國務卿是一個民進黨的一個團隊,然後是年輕人的團隊。 然後他們有沒有參與輔選?\n院長您覺得我們想要了解他們有沒有濫用我們的輔助的公帑去做輔選之事所以我向對方要求提供結案報告您覺得他們應該要提供嗎?\n跟委員報告一下就是民主基金會他是獨立運作的一個當然但是裡面用了公卡如果拿去選舉這就會產生很大的問題所以我們希望了解他有沒有濫用所以我們向你們去調閱了請問可不可以提供結案報告結果我們得到的答案是\n因為各政黨計劃具機敏性,無法提供政黨所送的結案報告。你們覺得這樣合理嗎?如果我們沒有辦法看結案報告,我要怎麼知道他當時送的計劃進來有沒有符合補助要點?\n我剛跟委員報告過民主基金會是一個獨立運作的單位那在今年下半年在審核民主基金會預算的時候那我想這個委員可以提出來\n是未來如果還有政黨拿了選舉的計劃掛羊頭賣狗肉他給你的時候講說有我們要辦民主我們要辦青年但是最後拿去做了選舉支持請問我們有沒有相當的效力要求說不能這樣做因為裡面涉及到的是我們外交部的補助而外交部的經費來自人民的納稅錢\n我想這樣子,如果委員覺得要有加強這個力道對於這個民間的團體來做監督的話,也許在今年的審查會的時候,預算審查的時候應該有加一些這個決議讓他們來遵行。最後我問一下,您覺得這樣子的政黨申請補助之後的結案報告它是涉及怎麼樣方面的機敏性不能讓立法委員來做調閱?\n這個應該由民主基金會那邊來回答沒有我是問你們覺得沒有那他不提供給我們那我問你們是你們認不認為這有機敏性嗎你們認不認為這涉及所謂的政黨或是國家的機密這是你們的看法這跟他無關吶剛剛跟委員報過那個民主基金會他是一個獨立運作的這個單位我聽過了我聽過了我問的是你覺得那個民主基金會有很多的\n謝謝徐委員巧芯的質詢謝謝陳院長的備詢接下來我們請登記第四位陳委員永康質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:11.993 --> 00:30.027\n委員長好,我想有請我們陳建仁院長以及國防部邱部長。請陳院長國防部備詢。徐委員午安。午安。那我想先請教一下我們陳院長,最近呢晚上睡得怎麼樣?\n\n00:31.511 --> 00:51.562\n我一向睡眠都很好。謝謝。一向睡眠都很好。我想最近大家都很關心我們的部會首長還有我們院長睡得好不好。主要是因為先前在質詢的過程當中,邱國正部長有告訴我們兩岸相當的危險,所以他晚上有的時候很煩惱會睡不著。那想必這個陳建仁院長沒有這樣子的困擾,\n\n00:52.182 --> 01:12.311\n但我們今天要問的是CNN的著名的評論員他的意見他談到了說呢現在台灣已經是世界上最危險的地方現在變得更加危險那所以我們才會很好奇說陳建仁院長怎麼看待目前兩岸的情勢有感覺到CNN的評論員所說的變得更加危險嗎\n\n01:14.174 --> 01:31.368\n在COVID-19的時間曾經訪問過我,我也知道他很關心臺灣的安全,算是朋友。我想他最主要的呼籲就是希望我們臺灣要提高警覺,然後美國跟其他的盟友應該要來協助臺灣做很好的我們臺灣的國防自衛。\n\n01:43.675 --> 01:58.019\n您說得很好但是呢我們想看到的是確實有很多的各種的問題比方說最近有一件呢跟國安有點疑慮相關的事情媒體剛才才披露GoogleEarth這一波呢台灣西部做了一個圖資的更新\n\n01:58.559 --> 02:26.722\n我們可以看到更新之後那可以看到西側國防部這個過去協調模糊化的高斯軍事建築包含是國防部、空軍司令部、海軍司令部等等都相當的清楚包含整建中的北部龜山愛國者獄被鎮地、獄部屬M1、A2戰車的大崗營區、楊梅飛彈營區、苗栗西湖飛彈基地以及台中清泉崗新建萬建庫等等都在圖資上面可以顯示的相當清楚\n\n02:27.122 --> 02:32.337\n我想問一下部長我們有沒有掌握這個狀況以及後續有沒有要進行任何的處置?\n\n02:34.831 --> 03:01.809\n國防安全是大家很關切課題像現在科技那麼發達不管是衛星徵兆等等這些圖資都很容易顯露出來但我有一個作為通常我會跟這些單位不管是Google這些單位會有去跟他們做一個協議有關於這個機敏處所他會把它給遮蓋掉那目前這個西部圖資的部分我們會跟Google來協調希望他們能夠隱藏起來保護我們的國防安全嗎\n\n03:02.629 --> 03:06.791\n除了這個圖資之外呢這個我們都很關心剛剛院長說得很好那但是呢我想蘇丹紅的問題到現在還沒有解決那包含是已經流向軍方了\n\n03:25.037 --> 03:44.700\n老共還沒有打過來,我們先開始擔心國軍的飲食。蘇丹紅議題當時在食安專報的時候就已經延燒了,那時候行政院還講得很大聲說蔡政府任內沒有系統性的食安問題,可現在蘇丹紅的議題都已經流到軍隊裡面了,陸軍的後勤指揮部也有買到了。\n\n03:45.000 --> 03:45.280\n好,謝謝委員的很好的問題。\n\n04:06.896 --> 04:27.810\n實際上昨天我們鄭文燦副院長已經召開了相關的六個部會就蘇丹紅的這個議題加以討論那我也要求要在一個月內要把所有的相關的消費端的一個月內你們自己評估會不會太差\n\n04:29.170 --> 04:57.260\n我跟委員報告,我們現在為什麼會要繼續再來做這個檢查呢?最主要是因為我們往前推6個月啦。往前推6個月。因為我們從12月開始就有逐批檢查。那我們往前推6個月的這一些,我們都做逐批檢查。所以現在我要求他們要加速的檢查以後,把前6個月的這一些萬一有疏擋防控。可是我們已經查好久了。那前6個月的檢查目前已經完成?\n\n04:57.520 --> 05:23.730\n因為前6個月的這一個部分以前都是抽樣檢查叫抽批的檢查那我們現在要求他一個一個都檢查出來所以如果這樣檢查出來的話可能還是會有漏網之魚但是我跟委員報告因為我們現在已經掌握了這十幾家的這一個同一個家族的這一些公司所以你們會針對這6個月去做調查所以我們實際上現在對這幾家\n\n05:26.551 --> 05:28.111\n徐巧芯徐巧芯\n\n05:54.735 --> 05:54.995\n徐巧芯\n\n06:15.302 --> 06:33.563\n那我想問消費者的權益保障部分。院長,消費者權益保障的部分,過去使用到蘇丹紅的,那相關的消費者權益保障,包含是退貨啊等等的,我們行政院有什麼樣的要求跟處理呢?有的拿得去,他說你沒有發票不讓他退貨。\n\n06:34.324 --> 07:03.543\n我們這個部分會來要求相關的第二層第三層的這一些食品公司都要接受這個相關的退貨如果沒有的話他是有刑責的因為這些他們如果不下架他們是有刑責針對國人跟我們軍方的弟兄表達歉意的這個部分目前行政院不考慮是嗎還是你們我的意思是說請問你們會考慮跟社會外界還有包含我們國人國軍弟兄\n\n07:03.983 --> 07:17.688\n因為過去整個檢查的過程當中或許不夠嚴謹所產生導致於系統性的蘇丹紅的問題跟國人致歉嗎?這個部分我們昨天就已經有表示我們在以往的這個對於這些違法廠商的篩檢確實沒有\n\n07:21.509 --> 07:37.056\n主批檢查,所以我們有所要求精進,然後要改進,對,我們確實需要改進。要改進,院長認為要改進。主席,我想請那個,主席,院長我想要請那個外交部長,我們先謝謝。麻煩請外交部被請。謝謝,謝謝部長,請外交部。謝謝。\n\n07:46.431 --> 08:13.124\n我想要請問幾個跟臺灣民主基金會相關的問題請問呢這個基金會按照我們的組織人事規章是由誰提名後任命執行長?依照規章的這個規定是由那個執行長是由董事長提名由董事會通過那董事長呢按照過去的慣例是由立法院長來擔任嗎?有沒有像民主基金會瞭解新國會之後新任的董事會什麼時候會召開改選?\n\n08:14.837 --> 08:41.380\n有關於董事會召開的時間我們正在跟那個即將接任董事長的立法院院長正在協商當中。好那再來我們想要問的是台灣民主基金會是接受我們外交部的補助開放政黨按照比例申請的得票比例申請預算那這些申請有沒有相關的規範例如要要求哪一類型的活動才符合補助的原則我們有沒有審核的機制?\n\n08:42.259 --> 08:42.399\n﹚徐巧芯﹚\n\n09:05.146 --> 09:07.087\n徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯\n\n09:33.280 --> 09:37.127\n政黨向民主基金會申請的補助它是具有國家機密性的嗎?\n\n09:38.140 --> 09:38.160\n我認為\n\n10:08.140 --> 10:13.910\n如果有國外的人要來臺灣看我們的選舉的狀況關選OK關選OK但是政黨拿這個經費補助其實去掛羊頭賣狗肉去辦選舉活動您認可嗎?\n\n10:22.130 --> 10:50.532\n我覺得這要看報告的內容。要看報告的內容對不對。您先記得這句話。那如果發生是政黨申請補助然後拿去做競選活動後來才發現這件事情我們有任何機制會追回嗎?或是會懲罰嗎?這個基金會的操作我不是很清楚。到目前為止那個基金會是獨立運作的。那我們也沒有看到這方面的資料。獨立運作但是我們政府的錢不應該被拿去政黨作為選舉之用兩位同意嗎?\n\n10:51.420 --> 11:10.278\n如果說委員有這方面的資料交給我們以後我們來看。好,有這方面的資料我們就現在讓大家來看看喔。這個第一個,2023年的國務卿齊建穎核銷補助80萬,賴清德當面力邀民進黨國務卿宣誓投入輔選,9月投入空戰跟陸戰,我們看下一張投影片。\n\n11:11.107 --> 11:34.181\n二零二三年青年對話行動和蕭補助一百萬元在新聞上面都直接講是在搶選票鎖定KOL二十人超盤搶年輕選票賴清德青年對話行動三月開跑下一張投影片二零二三民主台灣客家峰會和蕭補助六十二萬元也是新聞下標直接寫搶攻客家選票再下一張\n\n11:35.393 --> 11:51.330\n民主、和平、兵推營100萬,裡面寫什麼呢?你們直接就講了,這個裡面的直接就講大型營隊兵推營是要幹嘛呢?復選活動,下一頁。這些都是由執行長核定的對吧?\n\n11:52.342 --> 12:11.395\n臺灣民主基金會執行長何鼎我們剛詢問兩位大家對於政黨來申請補助去透過這個來做外交或者官選我們都覺得很棒但如果是像剛才那樣拿來做政黨的競選請問院長您覺得合適嗎如果剛才那幾個案子像那個\n\n12:13.183 --> 12:14.544\n國務卿就是民進黨的青年軍他們來參加活動就是去輔選的\n\n12:30.140 --> 12:32.462\n國務卿是一個民進黨的一個團隊,然後是年輕人的團隊。然後他們有沒有參與輔選?\n\n12:55.629 --> 13:00.835\n院長您覺得我們想要了解他們有沒有濫用我們的輔助的公帑去做輔選之事所以我向對方要求提供結案報告您覺得他們應該要提供嗎?\n\n13:18.684 --> 13:37.906\n跟委員報告一下就是民主基金會他是獨立運作的一個當然但是裡面用了公卡如果拿去選舉這就會產生很大的問題所以我們希望了解他有沒有濫用所以我們向你們去調閱了請問可不可以提供結案報告結果我們得到的答案是\n\n13:38.927 --> 13:53.023\n因為各政黨計劃具機敏性,無法提供政黨所送的結案報告。你們覺得這樣合理嗎?如果我們沒有辦法看結案報告,我要怎麼知道他當時送的計劃進來有沒有符合補助要點?\n\n13:53.624 --> 13:58.228\n我剛跟委員報告過民主基金會是一個獨立運作的單位那在今年下半年在審核民主基金會預算的時候那我想這個委員可以提出來\n\n14:20.307 --> 14:42.148\n是未來如果還有政黨拿了選舉的計劃掛羊頭賣狗肉他給你的時候講說有我們要辦民主我們要辦青年但是最後拿去做了選舉支持請問我們有沒有相當的效力要求說不能這樣做因為裡面涉及到的是我們外交部的補助而外交部的經費來自人民的納稅錢\n\n14:43.509 --> 15:07.570\n我想這樣子,如果委員覺得要有加強這個力道對於這個民間的團體來做監督的話,也許在今年的審查會的時候,預算審查的時候應該有加一些這個決議讓他們來遵行。最後我問一下,您覺得這樣子的政黨申請補助之後的結案報告它是涉及怎麼樣方面的機敏性不能讓立法委員來做調閱?\n\n15:09.682 --> 15:32.287\n這個應該由民主基金會那邊來回答沒有我是問你們覺得沒有那他不提供給我們那我問你們是你們認不認為這有機敏性嗎你們認不認為這涉及所謂的政黨或是國家的機密這是你們的看法這跟他無關吶剛剛跟委員報過那個民主基金會他是一個獨立運作的這個單位我聽過了我聽過了我問的是你覺得那個民主基金會有很多的\n\n15:40.069 --> 15:46.989\n謝謝徐委員巧芯的質詢謝謝陳院長的備詢接下來我們請登記第四位陳委員永康質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":11.993,"end":30.027,"text":"委員長好,我想有請我們陳建仁院長以及國防部邱部長。請陳院長國防部備詢。徐委員午安。午安。那我想先請教一下我們陳院長,最近呢晚上睡得怎麼樣?"},{"start":31.511,"end":51.562,"text":"我一向睡眠都很好。謝謝。一向睡眠都很好。我想最近大家都很關心我們的部會首長還有我們院長睡得好不好。主要是因為先前在質詢的過程當中,邱國正部長有告訴我們兩岸相當的危險,所以他晚上有的時候很煩惱會睡不著。那想必這個陳建仁院長沒有這樣子的困擾,"},{"start":52.182,"end":72.311,"text":"但我們今天要問的是CNN的著名的評論員他的意見他談到了說呢現在台灣已經是世界上最危險的地方現在變得更加危險那所以我們才會很好奇說陳建仁院長怎麼看待目前兩岸的情勢有感覺到CNN的評論員所說的變得更加危險嗎"},{"start":74.174,"end":91.368,"text":"在COVID-19的時間曾經訪問過我,我也知道他很關心臺灣的安全,算是朋友。我想他最主要的呼籲就是希望我們臺灣要提高警覺,然後美國跟其他的盟友應該要來協助臺灣做很好的我們臺灣的國防自衛。"},{"start":103.675,"end":118.019,"text":"您說得很好但是呢我們想看到的是確實有很多的各種的問題比方說最近有一件呢跟國安有點疑慮相關的事情媒體剛才才披露Google Earth這一波呢台灣西部做了一個圖資的更新"},{"start":118.559,"end":146.722,"text":"我們可以看到更新之後那可以看到西側國防部這個過去協調模糊化的高斯軍事建築包含是國防部、空軍司令部、海軍司令部等等都相當的清楚包含整建中的北部龜山愛國者獄被鎮地、獄部屬M1、A2戰車的大崗營區、楊梅飛彈營區、苗栗西湖飛彈基地以及台中清泉崗新建萬建庫等等都在圖資上面可以顯示的相當清楚"},{"start":147.122,"end":152.337,"text":"我想問一下部長我們有沒有掌握這個狀況以及後續有沒有要進行任何的處置?"},{"start":154.831,"end":181.809,"text":"國防安全是大家很關切課題像現在科技那麼發達不管是衛星徵兆等等這些圖資都很容易顯露出來但我有一個作為通常我會跟這些單位不管是Google這些單位會有去跟他們做一個協議有關於這個機敏處所他會把它給遮蓋掉那目前這個西部圖資的部分我們會跟Google來協調希望他們能夠隱藏起來保護我們的國防安全嗎"},{"start":182.629,"end":186.791,"text":"除了這個圖資之外呢這個我們都很關心剛剛院長說得很好那但是呢我想蘇丹紅的問題到現在還沒有解決那包含是已經流向軍方了"},{"start":205.037,"end":224.7,"text":"老共還沒有打過來,我們先開始擔心國軍的飲食。蘇丹紅議題當時在食安專報的時候就已經延燒了,那時候行政院還講得很大聲說蔡政府任內沒有系統性的食安問題,可現在蘇丹紅的議題都已經流到軍隊裡面了,陸軍的後勤指揮部也有買到了。"},{"start":225,"end":225.28,"text":"好,謝謝委員的很好的問題。"},{"start":246.896,"end":267.81,"text":"實際上昨天我們鄭文燦副院長已經召開了相關的六個部會就蘇丹紅的這個議題加以討論那我也要求要在一個月內要把所有的相關的消費端的一個月內你們自己評估會不會太差"},{"start":269.17,"end":297.26,"text":"我跟委員報告,我們現在為什麼會要繼續再來做這個檢查呢?最主要是因為我們往前推6個月啦。往前推6個月。因為我們從12月開始就有逐批檢查。那我們往前推6個月的這一些,我們都做逐批檢查。所以現在我要求他們要加速的檢查以後,把前6個月的這一些萬一有疏擋防控。可是我們已經查好久了。那前6個月的檢查目前已經完成?"},{"start":297.52,"end":323.73,"text":"因為前6個月的這一個部分以前都是抽樣檢查叫抽批的檢查那我們現在要求他一個一個都檢查出來所以如果這樣檢查出來的話可能還是會有漏網之魚但是我跟委員報告因為我們現在已經掌握了這十幾家的這一個同一個家族的這一些公司所以你們會針對這6個月去做調查所以我們實際上現在對這幾家"},{"start":326.551,"end":328.111,"text":"徐巧芯徐巧芯"},{"start":354.735,"end":354.995,"text":"徐巧芯"},{"start":375.302,"end":393.563,"text":"那我想問消費者的權益保障部分。院長,消費者權益保障的部分,過去使用到蘇丹紅的,那相關的消費者權益保障,包含是退貨啊等等的,我們行政院有什麼樣的要求跟處理呢?有的拿得去,他說你沒有發票不讓他退貨。"},{"start":394.324,"end":423.543,"text":"我們這個部分會來要求相關的第二層第三層的這一些食品公司都要接受這個相關的退貨如果沒有的話他是有刑責的因為這些他們如果不下架他們是有刑責針對國人跟我們軍方的弟兄表達歉意的這個部分目前行政院不考慮是嗎還是你們我的意思是說請問你們會考慮跟社會外界還有包含我們國人國軍弟兄"},{"start":423.983,"end":437.688,"text":"因為過去整個檢查的過程當中或許不夠嚴謹所產生導致於系統性的蘇丹紅的問題跟國人致歉嗎?這個部分我們昨天就已經有表示我們在以往的這個對於這些違法廠商的篩檢確實沒有"},{"start":441.509,"end":457.056,"text":"主批檢查,所以我們有所要求精進,然後要改進,對,我們確實需要改進。要改進,院長認為要改進。主席,我想請那個,主席,院長我想要請那個外交部長,我們先謝謝。麻煩請外交部被請。謝謝,謝謝部長,請外交部。謝謝。"},{"start":466.431,"end":493.124,"text":"我想要請問幾個跟臺灣民主基金會相關的問題請問呢這個基金會按照我們的組織人事規章是由誰提名後任命執行長?依照規章的這個規定是由那個執行長是由董事長提名由董事會通過那董事長呢按照過去的慣例是由立法院長來擔任嗎?有沒有像民主基金會瞭解新國會之後新任的董事會什麼時候會召開改選?"},{"start":494.837,"end":521.38,"text":"有關於董事會召開的時間我們正在跟那個即將接任董事長的立法院院長正在協商當中。好那再來我們想要問的是台灣民主基金會是接受我們外交部的補助開放政黨按照比例申請的得票比例申請預算那這些申請有沒有相關的規範例如要要求哪一類型的活動才符合補助的原則我們有沒有審核的機制?"},{"start":522.259,"end":522.399,"text":"﹚徐巧芯﹚"},{"start":545.146,"end":547.087,"text":"徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯徐巧芯"},{"start":573.28,"end":577.127,"text":"政黨向民主基金會申請的補助它是具有國家機密性的嗎?"},{"start":578.14,"end":578.16,"text":"我認為"},{"start":608.14,"end":613.91,"text":"如果有國外的人要來臺灣看我們的選舉的狀況關選OK關選OK但是政黨拿這個經費補助其實去掛羊頭賣狗肉去辦選舉活動您認可嗎?"},{"start":622.13,"end":650.532,"text":"我覺得這要看報告的內容。要看報告的內容對不對。您先記得這句話。那如果發生是政黨申請補助然後拿去做競選活動後來才發現這件事情我們有任何機制會追回嗎?或是會懲罰嗎?這個基金會的操作我不是很清楚。到目前為止那個基金會是獨立運作的。那我們也沒有看到這方面的資料。獨立運作但是我們政府的錢不應該被拿去政黨作為選舉之用兩位同意嗎?"},{"start":651.42,"end":670.278,"text":"如果說委員有這方面的資料交給我們以後我們來看。好,有這方面的資料我們就現在讓大家來看看喔。 這個第一個,2023年的國務卿齊建穎核銷補助80萬,賴清德當面力邀民進黨國務卿宣誓投入輔選,9月投入空戰跟陸戰,我們看下一張投影片。"},{"start":671.107,"end":694.181,"text":"二零二三年青年對話行動和蕭補助一百萬元在新聞上面都直接講是在搶選票鎖定KOL二十人超盤搶年輕選票賴清德青年對話行動三月開跑下一張投影片二零二三民主台灣客家峰會和蕭補助六十二萬元也是新聞下標直接寫搶攻客家選票再下一張"},{"start":695.393,"end":711.33,"text":"民主、和平、兵推營100萬,裡面寫什麼呢?你們直接就講了,這個裡面的直接就講大型營隊兵推營是要幹嘛呢?復選活動,下一頁。這些都是由執行長核定的對吧?"},{"start":712.342,"end":731.395,"text":"臺灣民主基金會執行長何鼎我們剛詢問兩位大家對於政黨來申請補助去透過這個來做外交或者官選我們都覺得很棒但如果是像剛才那樣拿來做政黨的競選請問院長您覺得合適嗎如果剛才那幾個案子像那個"},{"start":733.183,"end":734.544,"text":"國務卿就是民進黨的青年軍他們來參加活動就是去輔選的"},{"start":750.14,"end":752.462,"text":"國務卿是一個民進黨的一個團隊,然後是年輕人的團隊。 然後他們有沒有參與輔選?"},{"start":775.629,"end":780.835,"text":"院長您覺得我們想要了解他們有沒有濫用我們的輔助的公帑去做輔選之事所以我向對方要求提供結案報告您覺得他們應該要提供嗎?"},{"start":798.684,"end":817.906,"text":"跟委員報告一下就是民主基金會他是獨立運作的一個當然但是裡面用了公卡如果拿去選舉這就會產生很大的問題所以我們希望了解他有沒有濫用所以我們向你們去調閱了請問可不可以提供結案報告結果我們得到的答案是"},{"start":818.927,"end":833.023,"text":"因為各政黨計劃具機敏性,無法提供政黨所送的結案報告。你們覺得這樣合理嗎?如果我們沒有辦法看結案報告,我要怎麼知道他當時送的計劃進來有沒有符合補助要點?"},{"start":833.624,"end":838.228,"text":"我剛跟委員報告過民主基金會是一個獨立運作的單位那在今年下半年在審核民主基金會預算的時候那我想這個委員可以提出來"},{"start":860.307,"end":882.148,"text":"是未來如果還有政黨拿了選舉的計劃掛羊頭賣狗肉他給你的時候講說有我們要辦民主我們要辦青年但是最後拿去做了選舉支持請問我們有沒有相當的效力要求說不能這樣做因為裡面涉及到的是我們外交部的補助而外交部的經費來自人民的納稅錢"},{"start":883.509,"end":907.57,"text":"我想這樣子,如果委員覺得要有加強這個力道對於這個民間的團體來做監督的話,也許在今年的審查會的時候,預算審查的時候應該有加一些這個決議讓他們來遵行。最後我問一下,您覺得這樣子的政黨申請補助之後的結案報告它是涉及怎麼樣方面的機敏性不能讓立法委員來做調閱?"},{"start":909.682,"end":932.287,"text":"這個應該由民主基金會那邊來回答沒有我是問你們覺得沒有那他不提供給我們那我問你們是你們認不認為這有機敏性嗎你們認不認為這涉及所謂的政黨或是國家的機密這是你們的看法這跟他無關吶剛剛跟委員報過那個民主基金會他是一個獨立運作的這個單位我聽過了我聽過了我問的是你覺得那個民主基金會有很多的"},{"start":940.069,"end":946.989,"text":"謝謝徐委員巧芯的質詢謝謝陳院長的備詢接下來我們請登記第四位陳委員永康質詢"}]}}}}