{"id":149733,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149733","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/7ed54bd69a3b6903a14836e0b4784a1f14b75c67118f492bf8ba9b0039caa7a610497944ed0372c35ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳昭姿","委員發言時間":"09:10:04 - 09:20:56","影片長度":"00:10:52","會議時間":"2024-03-13T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。\n【3月13日及14日二天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第5次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":5,"committees":[26],"id":"委員會-11-1-26-5"},"date":"2024-03-13","duration":652,"end_time":"2024-03-13T09:20:56+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-13T09:10:04+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":284,"blocks":[["陳委員昭姿：（9時10分）有請部長及職安署鄒署長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["許部長銘春：陳委員好。"],["陳委員昭姿：部長好。TS認證是我國根據職業安全衛生法令等辦理的一個合格驗證證明，只有符合標準的機械設備，就是防爆管配件才可以在我國的石化工廠或電廠類等高危險區使用，目的是讓這些工廠在發生危險的時候，能夠把災害控制在一個範圍內。但2018年黃國昌委員揭露台電大林廠高風險廠區所使用的防爆管材，有使用到東元系統的安柏產品，那個產品是偽造臺灣TS認證的，部長您還記得這件事嗎？"],["許部長銘春：是。"],["陳委員昭姿：好，當時台電要求統包商，就是現代樂鐵跟榮工公司把所有不合格的產品做更換，也對統包商提出要求使用所謂的可鍛鑄鐵材質來作為防爆管配件，在此，我先把相關背景跟部長說明一下。這一家廠商叫做申芳公司，他有許多防爆管配件的產品，也有向職安署登錄取得 TS 認證，但是我要強調的是他們眾多產品當中，只有這個可鍛鑄鐵材質有TS認證，效期是3年。部長，根據職業安全衛生法規定，是不是只有經過測試、檢定，而且在職安署網站上登錄的，才可以在銷售時宣稱是具有TS認證？我這個說法正確嗎？"],["許部長銘春：署長比較專業，我請他說明。"],["陳委員昭姿：好。"],["鄒署長子廉：謝謝委員，職安法第七條……"],["陳委員昭姿：確實是？"],["鄒署長子廉：有明確規定，製造者、輸入者、使用者對於我們指定的機械、設備，必須取得安全標準，然後才能……"],["陳委員昭姿：好，要經過認證，然後才能這樣宣稱。"],["鄒署長子廉：因為我們有管理系統跟……在執行。"],["陳委員昭姿：好，謝謝署長。我前面提到2019年台電大林廠因為不合格要更換防爆管器材時，這家申芳公司明明知道自己取得TS認證的產品只限於鑄鐵合金，他在產品送審證書上寫著鑄鐵合金，但實際成分是球墨鑄鐵，以後交貨也會是球墨鑄鐵，當然我們沒有否定球墨鑄鐵，也許它的材質是更好，但是他可以這樣濫用他的TS證照嗎？就是核什麼是什麼，他可以拿別的東西來抵嗎？"],["許部長銘春：當然不行。"],["陳委員昭姿：部長說不行。這個灰口鑄鐵、可鍛鑄鐵或球墨鑄鐵是完全不同的材質，而申芳拿出這樣的證書交給台電，還好台電當時覺得有點問題而沒有採購，但是我要談的問題是，台電沒有採購，但廠商可以這樣做嗎？","上個月底我的辦公室同仁參與了職安署到大林電廠的檢查，現場台電也承認說當時是有接到這樣的文件，部長，你何時要依法裁罰呢？就是廠商這樣的作法，你何時要去裁罰呢？"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，這個部分我們229去查，確實是有一些疑義，目前是請台電公司提供相關合約還有……"],["陳委員昭姿：部長，這個去年就有立委檢舉，這很久了欸！"],["許部長銘春：對，對，但是我們也都有按照程序在進行，詳細我請署長說明。"],["陳委員昭姿：沒關係，就是說……"],["鄒署長子廉：報告委員，我跟您簡單解釋，因為大林電廠是舊的電廠，它原來是用美規標準來設置跟施工、製造，而職安法在103年開始適用的時候，有關規定都是用新的歐規標準，所以這兩個標準在融合過程中，台電大林電廠用既有的標準設置，現在是依照用戶用電設備裝置規則，由能源署來做進一步釐清。我們勞動部會跟經濟部進一步針對規劃設計安裝的設備，有效的來做確認。"],["陳委員昭姿：我這次的重點，就是申芳他認證的配管件，因為效期是3年，他會不會一併到其他的地方，例如中油、台塑、中鼎公司也用同樣的證明文件處理？你們可不可以一併去追究這個責任？"],["鄒署長子廉：謝謝委員。其實包括原來的委員跟您都非常關心這個問題，我非常非常感謝，電廠或石化廠的防爆電氣裝置，是為了安全起見……"],["陳委員昭姿：署長可以處理嘛！"],["鄒署長子廉：所以有這樣的提醒，我們也會要求國營企業再做進一步的查辦……"],["陳委員昭姿：好，謝謝署長。"],["鄒署長子廉：針對國營企業，我們也會做後面的瞭解。謝謝。"],["陳委員昭姿：下面這一張圖的情況更嚴重，上個月底，職安署到大林電廠進行查廠的時候，發現到防爆區內的防爆管材出現嚴重瑕疵，這一張照片是另外一家叫盟諭的公司，他賣給台電裝在大林電廠防爆區內的這個所謂中間穿線盒，台電採購的品質要求是可鍛鑄鐵，但是那一天在查廠的時候，職安署有找金屬中心派人到現場進行材質檢測，發現是灰口鑄鐵，灰口鑄鐵比起可鍛鑄鐵，我想署長您是專家，它在防爆性能、抗拉強度上都比可鍛鑄鐵差很多，我知道這是台電驗收的責任，我會去追究，事實上，那個中間穿線盒並沒有取得TS認證，結果卻裝在大林電廠的高風險區、防爆區內，這已經違反職安的衛生法規……"],["鄒署長子廉：對不起，委員，可不可以插個話？這個部分是不是在防爆區，誠如我剛才跟委員解釋，大林電廠是用舊的美規標準設置規劃，所以我們現在就請經濟部做進一步釐清，如果這個區塊真的屬於是需要防爆區的話，當然台電這樣做的確是違反規定。"],["陳委員昭姿：署長，那一天台電說要帶大家去看防爆區，表示該處需要使用符合防爆標準的防爆管材，參加抽驗的人有職安署官員及工研院的專家，當時他是這麼說的……"],["鄒署長子廉：跟委員報告，這個部分就是法規適用的釐清，我們也要求經濟部能源署針對他們的相關法規，如果有跟我們的法規競合，我們再做進一步說明。其實，我們的態度是跟委員一樣……"],["陳委員昭姿：好，謝謝，我會再繼續追蹤這件事。"],["鄒署長子廉：我們不希望任何需要防爆的地方，不是使用防爆的設備。謝謝委員。"],["陳委員昭姿：部長、署長，因為這攸關台電電廠的安全，只要一個防爆管材的環節不具防爆功能，整個系統就會失靈……"],["鄒署長子廉：是，是，是。"],["陳委員昭姿：就可能失去防爆功能，所以該改善就改善，該處罰就處罰。"],["鄒署長子廉：好，瞭解。"],["陳委員昭姿：接下來我要請教部長有關直聘的問題。有關移工直聘部分，首次招募跟右邊這個再次招募、重新招募，你看直聘的比率，10年來離1%很遙遠，是0.2%，然後對於重新招募的部分，理論上移工工作滿3年，雇主要續聘，照理說他們有經驗了，還要再花那個仲介費嗎？我是說為什麼這邊的直聘也是1%？部長，勞動部雖然說直聘是既定政策，但是效果不好，是不是？"],["許部長銘春：對。"],["陳委員昭姿：效果不好，上次我質詢時也有提出來，後來就有專家，就是前勞發署跨國勞動力管理組組長薛鑑忠指出整個直聘有三大難關，即移工人選難覓、語言不通及申請程序繁複，部長同意這三個是障礙或難關嗎？部長您同意這三點嗎？"],["許部長銘春：這個人是我們之前的組長，他是主辦的人，應該很瞭解……"],["陳委員昭姿：其實我知道勞動部很努力，但是我們看看有哪一些是可以再繼續做得更好的。難關一：人選難覓。部長，有移工團體指控他們到就業服務站，全臺灣都有就業服務站，不只幫本國人，也幫助外籍移工媒合，但是移工到了現場，並沒有雇主來，他要他們簽到，因為如果不簽到就會被強制返國。這個就是他們簽到，但是簽到了，雇主在哪裡？那個工作人員就跟他們說要自己去找，那不就好像是求職的時候，人資部叫你來面試，但沒有面試官，然後面試官你要自己去104人力網站找。這樣的就業服務站，只簽名不媒合，可以嗎？"],["許部長銘春：這當然不行。"],["陳委員昭姿：所以移工抗議了嘛！"],["許部長銘春：是，報告委員，這個部分我們有開過會……"],["陳委員昭姿：改變好不好？要改進，瞭解一下再改進。"],["許部長銘春：也要針對這些缺失具體改善。"],["陳委員昭姿：OK，謝謝。另外還有兩點，一個是言語不通。我們知道全臺灣總共有48座就業服務中心，如果要提供媒合，可能就要有雙語服務。部長，你知道這48座就業服務中心有幾家是提供四國雙語服務的？"],["許部長銘春：其實我們現在各就服站是透過三方……"],["陳委員昭姿：有兩家，一個在桃園，一個在彰化，去年成立的，我覺得這個很棒……"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，這是專設的，但其實我們各就業站都可以透過三方的……"],["陳委員昭姿：部長，因為我們現在還在談直聘中心怎麼來鼓勵，請問，一年當中大概有多少移工會轉換雇主？大概有多少位要轉換雇主，而需要這樣的服務？"],["蔡署長孟良：大概2萬多。"],["許部長銘春：大概2萬多，每年大概有2萬多。"],["陳委員昭姿：老實說，48座裡面只有兩座，這種算是很好的服務，是不是可以考慮再擴大？"],["許部長銘春：沒問題，我們這兩座是先試辦，如果可以，我們就會擴大。"],["陳委員昭姿：謝謝部長的承諾。最後一個是申請程序繁瑣，上次我在質詢的時候說直聘手續非常的繁複，簡直像玩大地遊戲，像在玩大風吹，要進進出出很多的機構，但是勞動部已經做到了一個點，就是桃園跟高雄成立了一站式服務，我覺得很棒，內政部跟勞動部的跨部會合作，這種就是最便民的作法，在這個一站式的服務裡，移工可以在這個中心接受三天兩夜的講習，瞭解在臺灣的生活需知、衛生保健還有勞動權益等等，讓雇主可以在那邊一次性的辦好，我覺得這個廣設移工跟雇主的服務，部長是不是可以考慮把它擴大服務，因為原來可能要一、兩個半月的時間……"],["許部長銘春：現在就3天。"],["陳委員昭姿：現在3天就可以完成，好嗎？部長儘量幫忙做便民服務。"],["許部長銘春：我們會努力，謝謝。"],["陳委員昭姿：謝謝主席，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝陳昭姿委員。","接下來請陳菁徽委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":286,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-26-5","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","陳菁徽","盧縣一","邱鎮軍","蘇清泉","涂權吉","王正旭","楊曜","王育敏","李坤城","林淑芬","楊瓊瓔","林月琴","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","李彥秀","羅智強","牛煦庭","劉建國","王鴻薇","張雅琳","黃仁","吳春城","陳瑩","廖偉翔","林德福","葉元之"],"page_start":193,"meetingDate":["2024-03-13"],"gazette_id":"1131301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1131301_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第5次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1131301_00004"}},"transcript":{"id":"149733","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149733","tool":"pyannote","id":"149733-pyannote"},"job_id":"FR7cjyphz10Fzpti","queued_at":"2024-06-02 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625.583, \"score\": 0.006}, {\"word\": \"辦\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 625.583, \"end\": 625.603, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"陳\"}, {\"word\": \"昭\", \"start\": 632.609, \"end\": 632.729, \"score\": 0.706}, {\"word\": \"姿\", \"start\": 632.729, \"end\": 632.749, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:06,133 --> 00:00:08,422\n有請部長及安署州署長\n\n2\n00:00:12,932 --> 00:00:40,405\n部長,貼實認證是我國根據職業安全衛生法令等辦理的一個合格驗證證明那只有符合標準的這個機械設備甚至防爆管配件才可以在我國的石化工廠或電廠類的高危險區來使用目的是讓這些工廠發生危險的時候能夠把災害控制到一個範圍內但是2018年的時候王國昌委員有揭露臺電的大林廠\n\n3\n00:00:41,585 --> 00:01:00,991\n她的高風險場區使用的防暴管材有使用到東元系統的安博產品那個產品是偽造台灣TS認證的部長您還記得這件事嗎是那就是當時台電有要求同胞商的現代樂鐵跟榮工公司把這個所有不合格的產品要做一個更換\n\n4\n00:01:01,991 --> 00:01:27,371\n但是臺電也有提出對這個統包商提出要求就是要求使用所謂的可斷鑄鐵這個材質來作為這個防爆管配件那我先把這個背景跟部長說明一下好那這一家廠商叫做深方公司他也有許多防爆管配件的這個也向值安署登錄取得這個ts認證但是我要強調是他眾多產品當中只有這個\n\n5\n00:01:29,079 --> 00:01:45,804\n可斷鑄鐵的材質有TS認證他的效期有3年部長根據那個職業安全衛生法的規定是不是只有經過測試檢定而且在職安署的網站上去登錄的你才可以在銷售的時候宣稱說你是具有這個TS認證我這個說法正確嗎\n\n6\n00:01:49,133 --> 00:01:49,153\n謝謝署長\n\n7\n00:02:05,328 --> 00:02:08,972\n下一張就是因為我前面提到20192019臺電大臨場因為不合格更換防爆氣管材的時候這家生發公司他明明知道自己取得TS認證的產品只限於鑄鐵合金\n\n8\n00:02:22,932 --> 00:02:45,348\n但是他在送審的這個產品的送審證書上寫的注鐵合金但實際成分是球末注鐵以後交貨也會是球末注鐵當然我們沒有否定球末注鐵也許他的材質是更好的但是他可以這樣濫用他的貼紙證照嗎就是說他合什麼是什麼他可以拿別的東西來抵嗎當然不行\n\n9\n00:02:46,668 --> 00:03:05,475\n我們都知道部長說是不行這個灰口鑄鐵可斷鑄鐵或這個球木鑄鐵他完全不同的材質所以生方拿出這樣證書交給台電還好台電當時覺得有點問題是沒有採購但是我要談的是台電沒有採購但是廠商可以這樣做嗎所以就是說\n\n10\n00:03:28,077 --> 00:03:41,717\n確實是有一些疑義啦那也有目前是在請台電公司要提供相關的合約啦還有部長這個去年就有立委檢舉了耶這很久了耶對但是我們都有按照程序要進行啊詳細我請署長來說明好了\n\n11\n00:03:44,961 --> 00:03:55,531\n我跟您簡單解釋齁因為大林電廠是舊的電廠它是用原來是用美規的標準來做設置跟施工的製造那我們責安法在103年開始試用的時候有關我們是用新的歐規的標準所以這兩個標準在合作\n\n12\n00:04:01,136 --> 00:04:14,009\n在融合過程中臺電大林電廠用既有的標準在設置那現在是依照用戶電動裝置規則由能源署來做進步的釐清我們勞動部會跟經濟部做進步的設計安裝設備做有效來做確認\n\n13\n00:04:18,874 --> 00:04:37,225\n的重點就是像深芳他認證的配管件因為他的效期是3年那他會不會一併到其他的地方中油啦台塑啦中頂公司也是用同樣的證明文件去處理你要不要可不可以一併謝謝委員其實包括原來的委員跟您非常關心這個我非常非常感謝因為在\n\n14\n00:04:55,932 --> 00:05:20,768\n這個上個月底指安署到大陵廠進行查場的時候有發現在防暴區內的防暴管材出現嚴重的瑕疵照片上這一張是另外一家公司叫蒙玉他賣給台電裝在這個大陵廠防暴區內的這個叫所謂的中間的穿線盒那台電採購的這個品質要求是可斷鑄鐵但是那一天喔那一天在查場的時候林安署有找金屬中心派人來查場現場來進行材質的檢測發現是灰口鑄鐵\n\n15\n00:05:25,531 --> 00:05:26,451\n對不起委員可不可以插個話\n\n16\n00:05:49,319 --> 00:06:17,351\n這個部分是不是在防暴區因為我剛才跟委員解釋大聯想是用舊的美規標準設施規劃所以我現在就請經濟部做進一步的釐清如果這個區塊是真的需要屬於防暴區的話當然台電這個部分就要做比較明確的違反規定就是說那一天台電說要去帶大家去看防暴區啦說該處使用需要符合防暴標準的防暴管財那參加抽驗的人都有職安署官員啊公園院的專家在\n\n17\n00:06:18,231 --> 00:06:18,611\n所以他是這麼說的\n\n18\n00:06:48,872 --> 00:06:50,613\n部長這個職聘這個是移工職聘的部分首次招募右邊是這個再次招募重新招募你看那個職聘的比率這10年來比100%很遙遠的0.2%\n\n19\n00:07:05,447 --> 00:07:23,637\n然後對於重新這個招募的部分這個理論上說移工工作滿3年僱主要繼續聘照理說他們有經驗了那應該還要再發這個仲介費嗎我是說他們為什麼職域也是1%所以部長勞動部雖然說職聘是你的既定政策但是效果不好嗎是不是對效果不好\n\n20\n00:07:24,057 --> 00:07:43,914\n那效果在上次我質詢也有提出來那後來就有專家就是所謂的前勞發署跨國勞動力管理組組長薛建忠他指出說整個職聘有三大難關移工人選難密、語言密不通、申請程序繁複部長您同意這三個是一個障礙或難關嗎?部長您同意這三點?\n\n21\n00:07:45,470 --> 00:08:02,799\n這個因為是我們之前組長他是這個主辦的人他應該是很瞭解的其實我知道勞動部很努力但是就是說我們看看就哪一些可以再繼續做得更好難關一人選難密部長現在問題是有移工團體指控他們到就業服務站\n\n22\n00:08:03,619 --> 00:08:20,979\n我說全台灣都有就業服戰那不只幫外國本國人沒有也有幫助外籍外移工但是移工到了現場你看他們他到現場沒有僱主來他要他簽到因為如果不簽到的話他就會被強制反國那這個就是他簽到但是到了他們問僱主在哪裡\n\n23\n00:08:22,501 --> 00:08:38,916\n那個工作人員竟然說你們要自己找那不像求職的時候你這個人事部叫你來面試那你說面試官呢沒有面試官面試官你要自己去104這個銀行網站找這個這樣這個就業服務站只簽名不媒合這樣可以嗎部長\n\n24\n00:08:40,317 --> 00:09:05,264\n這當然不行所以移工抗議了嘛這個我們改變好了改進好了瞭解一下改進開過會要針對這些缺失來具體來改善那因為還有兩個點一個是言語不通啦那這個就是說我們知道全臺灣總共有48座就業服務中心如果要提供這個媒合可能要有雙語服務部長你知道這48座就業服務中心有幾家是提供的四國雙語服務\n\n25\n00:09:07,762 --> 00:09:28,985\n我們齁其實現在就是在各就福站透過三方其實有兩家有兩家一個桃園一個在彰化去年成立的我覺得這個很棒啦其實會委員這是專設的但是我們其實各就福站都可以透過三方的一個部長這個因為我們現在還在談職聘中間怎麼來鼓勵嘛齁那一年當中大概有多少移工會轉換雇主\n\n26\n00:09:31,444 --> 00:09:39,208\n大概有多少位要轉換雇主?會需要這樣的服務?大概2萬多每年大概有2萬多因為這樣的兩座老實說48座裡面兩座這樣子是不是說這種算是很好的服務是不是可能再考慮再擴大一下?我們這兩座是先示範如果可以我們就做\n\n27\n00:09:53,274 --> 00:10:07,321\n好那最後一個是身體上次我在質詢就是說執聘手續非常的繁複啊簡直像這個玩大地遊戲我覺得玩大風吹他進進出出很多的機構但是這個勞動部已經做到了一個部分點就是說\n\n28\n00:10:08,769 --> 00:10:25,603\n高雄跟長高雄的桃園高高雄成立一站式服務我覺得很棒的內動內政部勞動部跨服務的跨部會合作這種就是最便民的一個做法這個一站式的服務啊移工可以在這裡中心接受三天兩夜的這個講習來瞭解在臺灣生活需知衛生保健還有勞動權益等等那僱主這邊可以一次性的辦好對\n\n29\n00:10:32,609 --> 00:10:32,749\n謝謝陳昭姿\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6133\t8422\t有請部長及安署州署長\n12932\t40405\t部長,貼實認證是我國根據職業安全衛生法令等辦理的一個合格驗證證明那只有符合標準的這個機械設備甚至防爆管配件才可以在我國的石化工廠或電廠類的高危險區來使用目的是讓這些工廠發生危險的時候能夠把災害控制到一個範圍內但是2018年的時候王國昌委員有揭露臺電的大林廠\n41585\t60991\t她的高風險場區使用的防暴管材有使用到東元系統的安博產品 那個產品是偽造台灣TS認證的部長您還記得這件事嗎 是那就是當時台電有要求同胞商的現代樂鐵跟榮工公司把這個所有不合格的產品要做一個更換\n61991\t87371\t但是臺電也有提出對這個統包商提出要求就是要求使用所謂的可斷鑄鐵這個材質來作為這個防爆管配件那我先把這個背景跟部長說明一下好那這一家廠商叫做深方公司他也有許多防爆管配件的這個也向值安署登錄取得這個ts認證但是我要強調是他眾多產品當中只有這個\n89079\t105804\t可斷鑄鐵的材質有TS認證他的效期有3年部長根據那個職業安全衛生法的規定是不是只有經過測試檢定而且在職安署的網站上去登錄的你才可以在銷售的時候宣稱說你是具有這個TS認證我這個說法正確嗎\n109133\t109153\t謝謝署長\n125328\t128972\t下一張就是因為我前面提到20192019臺電大臨場因為不合格更換防爆氣管材的時候這家生發公司他明明知道自己取得TS認證的產品只限於鑄鐵合金\n142932\t165348\t但是他在送審的這個產品的送審證書上寫的注鐵合金但實際成分是球末注鐵以後交貨也會是球末注鐵當然我們沒有否定球末注鐵也許他的材質是更好的但是他可以這樣濫用他的貼紙證照嗎就是說他合什麼是什麼他可以拿別的東西來抵嗎當然不行\n166668\t185475\t我們都知道部長說是不行這個灰口鑄鐵可斷鑄鐵或這個球木鑄鐵他完全不同的材質所以生方拿出這樣證書交給台電還好台電當時覺得有點問題是沒有採購但是我要談的是台電沒有採購但是廠商可以這樣做嗎所以就是說\n186015\t207176\t﹖\n208077\t221717\t確實是有一些疑義啦那也有目前是在請台電公司要提供相關的合約啦還有部長這個去年就有立委檢舉了耶這很久了耶對但是我們都有按照程序要進行啊詳細我請署長來說明好了\n224961\t235531\t我跟您簡單解釋齁因為大林電廠是舊的電廠它是用原來是用美規的標準來做設置跟施工的製造那我們責安法在103年開始試用的時候有關我們是用新的歐規的標準所以這兩個標準在合作\n241136\t254009\t在融合過程中臺電大林電廠用既有的標準在設置那現在是依照用戶電動裝置規則由能源署來做進步的釐清我們勞動部會跟經濟部做進步的設計安裝設備做有效來做確認\n258874\t277225\t的重點就是像深芳他認證的配管件因為他的效期是3年那他會不會一併到其他的地方中油啦台塑啦中頂公司也是用同樣的證明文件去處理你要不要可不可以一併謝謝委員其實包括原來的委員跟您非常關心這個我非常非常感謝因為在\n277705\t294991\t​​​​​​​​\n295932\t320768\t這個上個月底指安署到大陵廠進行查場的時候有發現在防暴區內的防暴管材出現嚴重的瑕疵照片上這一張是另外一家公司叫蒙玉他賣給台電裝在這個大陵廠防暴區內的這個叫所謂的中間的穿線盒那台電採購的這個品質要求是可斷鑄鐵但是那一天喔那一天在查場的時候林安署有找金屬中心派人來查場現場來進行材質的檢測發現是灰口鑄鐵\n325531\t326451\t對不起委員可不可以插個話\n349319\t377351\t這個部分是不是在防暴區因為我剛才跟委員解釋大聯想是用舊的美規標準設施規劃所以我現在就請經濟部做進一步的釐清如果這個區塊是真的需要屬於防暴區的話當然台電這個部分就要做比較明確的違反規定就是說那一天台電說要去帶大家去看防暴區啦說該處使用需要符合防暴標準的防暴管財那參加抽驗的人都有職安署官員啊公園院的專家在\n378231\t378611\t所以他是這麼說的\n408872\t410613\t部長這個職聘這個是移工職聘的部分首次招募右邊是這個再次招募重新招募你看那個職聘的比率這10年來比100%很遙遠的0.2%\n425447\t443637\t然後對於重新這個招募的部分這個理論上說移工工作滿3年僱主要繼續聘照理說他們有經驗了那應該還要再發這個仲介費嗎我是說他們為什麼職域也是1%所以部長勞動部雖然說職聘是你的既定政策但是效果不好嗎是不是對效果不好\n444057\t463914\t那效果在上次我質詢也有提出來那後來就有專家就是所謂的前勞發署跨國勞動力管理組組長薛建忠他指出說整個職聘有三大難關移工人選難密、語言密不通、申請程序繁複部長您同意這三個是一個障礙或難關嗎?部長您同意這三點?\n465470\t482799\t這個因為是我們之前組長他是這個主辦的人他應該是很瞭解的其實我知道勞動部很努力但是就是說我們看看就哪一些可以再繼續做得更好難關一人選難密部長現在問題是有移工團體指控他們到就業服務站\n483619\t500979\t我說全台灣都有就業服戰那不只幫外國本國人沒有也有幫助外籍外移工但是移工到了現場你看他們他到現場沒有僱主來他要他簽到因為如果不簽到的話他就會被強制反國那這個就是他簽到但是到了他們問僱主在哪裡\n502501\t518916\t那個工作人員竟然說你們要自己找那不像求職的時候你這個人事部叫你來面試那你說面試官呢沒有面試官面試官你要自己去104這個銀行網站找這個這樣這個就業服務站只簽名不媒合這樣可以嗎部長\n520317\t545264\t這當然不行所以移工抗議了嘛這個我們改變好了改進好了瞭解一下改進 開過會要針對這些缺失來具體來改善那因為還有兩個點一個是言語不通啦那這個就是說我們知道全臺灣總共有48座就業服務中心如果要提供這個媒合可能要有雙語服務部長你知道這48座就業服務中心有幾家是提供的四國雙語服務\n547762\t568985\t我們齁其實現在就是在各就福站透過三方 其實有兩家有兩家 一個桃園一個在彰化 去年成立的我覺得這個很棒啦 其實 會委員這是專設的但是我們其實各就福站都可以透過三方的一個部長 這個因為我們現在還在談職聘中間怎麼來鼓勵嘛齁那一年當中大概有多少移工會轉換雇主\n571444\t579208\t大概有多少位要轉換雇主?會需要這樣的服務?大概2萬多每年大概有2萬多因為這樣的兩座老實說48座裡面兩座這樣子是不是說這種算是很好的服務是不是可能再考慮再擴大一下?我們這兩座是先示範如果可以我們就做\n593274\t607321\t好那最後一個是身體上次我在質詢就是說執聘手續非常的繁複啊簡直像這個玩大地遊戲我覺得玩大風吹他進進出出很多的機構但是這個勞動部已經做到了一個部分點就是說\n608769\t625603\t高雄跟長高雄的桃園高高雄成立一站式服務我覺得很棒的內動內政部勞動部跨服務的跨部會合作這種就是最便民的一個做法這個一站式的服務啊移工可以在這裡中心接受三天兩夜的這個講習來瞭解在臺灣生活需知衛生保健還有勞動權益等等那僱主這邊可以一次性的辦好對\n632609\t632749\t謝謝陳昭姿\n","txt":"有請部長及安署州署長\n部長,貼實認證是我國根據職業安全衛生法令等辦理的一個合格驗證證明那只有符合標準的這個機械設備甚至防爆管配件才可以在我國的石化工廠或電廠類的高危險區來使用目的是讓這些工廠發生危險的時候能夠把災害控制到一個範圍內但是2018年的時候王國昌委員有揭露臺電的大林廠\n她的高風險場區使用的防暴管材有使用到東元系統的安博產品 那個產品是偽造台灣TS認證的部長您還記得這件事嗎 是那就是當時台電有要求同胞商的現代樂鐵跟榮工公司把這個所有不合格的產品要做一個更換\n但是臺電也有提出對這個統包商提出要求就是要求使用所謂的可斷鑄鐵這個材質來作為這個防爆管配件那我先把這個背景跟部長說明一下好那這一家廠商叫做深方公司他也有許多防爆管配件的這個也向值安署登錄取得這個ts認證但是我要強調是他眾多產品當中只有這個\n可斷鑄鐵的材質有TS認證他的效期有3年部長根據那個職業安全衛生法的規定是不是只有經過測試檢定而且在職安署的網站上去登錄的你才可以在銷售的時候宣稱說你是具有這個TS認證我這個說法正確嗎\n謝謝署長\n下一張就是因為我前面提到20192019臺電大臨場因為不合格更換防爆氣管材的時候這家生發公司他明明知道自己取得TS認證的產品只限於鑄鐵合金\n但是他在送審的這個產品的送審證書上寫的注鐵合金但實際成分是球末注鐵以後交貨也會是球末注鐵當然我們沒有否定球末注鐵也許他的材質是更好的但是他可以這樣濫用他的貼紙證照嗎就是說他合什麼是什麼他可以拿別的東西來抵嗎當然不行\n我們都知道部長說是不行這個灰口鑄鐵可斷鑄鐵或這個球木鑄鐵他完全不同的材質所以生方拿出這樣證書交給台電還好台電當時覺得有點問題是沒有採購但是我要談的是台電沒有採購但是廠商可以這樣做嗎所以就是說\n﹖\n確實是有一些疑義啦那也有目前是在請台電公司要提供相關的合約啦還有部長這個去年就有立委檢舉了耶這很久了耶對但是我們都有按照程序要進行啊詳細我請署長來說明好了\n我跟您簡單解釋齁因為大林電廠是舊的電廠它是用原來是用美規的標準來做設置跟施工的製造那我們責安法在103年開始試用的時候有關我們是用新的歐規的標準所以這兩個標準在合作\n在融合過程中臺電大林電廠用既有的標準在設置那現在是依照用戶電動裝置規則由能源署來做進步的釐清我們勞動部會跟經濟部做進步的設計安裝設備做有效來做確認\n的重點就是像深芳他認證的配管件因為他的效期是3年那他會不會一併到其他的地方中油啦台塑啦中頂公司也是用同樣的證明文件去處理你要不要可不可以一併謝謝委員其實包括原來的委員跟您非常關心這個我非常非常感謝因為在\n​​​​​​​​\n這個上個月底指安署到大陵廠進行查場的時候有發現在防暴區內的防暴管材出現嚴重的瑕疵照片上這一張是另外一家公司叫蒙玉他賣給台電裝在這個大陵廠防暴區內的這個叫所謂的中間的穿線盒那台電採購的這個品質要求是可斷鑄鐵但是那一天喔那一天在查場的時候林安署有找金屬中心派人來查場現場來進行材質的檢測發現是灰口鑄鐵\n對不起委員可不可以插個話\n這個部分是不是在防暴區因為我剛才跟委員解釋大聯想是用舊的美規標準設施規劃所以我現在就請經濟部做進一步的釐清如果這個區塊是真的需要屬於防暴區的話當然台電這個部分就要做比較明確的違反規定就是說那一天台電說要去帶大家去看防暴區啦說該處使用需要符合防暴標準的防暴管財那參加抽驗的人都有職安署官員啊公園院的專家在\n所以他是這麼說的\n部長這個職聘這個是移工職聘的部分首次招募右邊是這個再次招募重新招募你看那個職聘的比率這10年來比100%很遙遠的0.2%\n然後對於重新這個招募的部分這個理論上說移工工作滿3年僱主要繼續聘照理說他們有經驗了那應該還要再發這個仲介費嗎我是說他們為什麼職域也是1%所以部長勞動部雖然說職聘是你的既定政策但是效果不好嗎是不是對效果不好\n那效果在上次我質詢也有提出來那後來就有專家就是所謂的前勞發署跨國勞動力管理組組長薛建忠他指出說整個職聘有三大難關移工人選難密、語言密不通、申請程序繁複部長您同意這三個是一個障礙或難關嗎?部長您同意這三點?\n這個因為是我們之前組長他是這個主辦的人他應該是很瞭解的其實我知道勞動部很努力但是就是說我們看看就哪一些可以再繼續做得更好難關一人選難密部長現在問題是有移工團體指控他們到就業服務站\n我說全台灣都有就業服戰那不只幫外國本國人沒有也有幫助外籍外移工但是移工到了現場你看他們他到現場沒有僱主來他要他簽到因為如果不簽到的話他就會被強制反國那這個就是他簽到但是到了他們問僱主在哪裡\n那個工作人員竟然說你們要自己找那不像求職的時候你這個人事部叫你來面試那你說面試官呢沒有面試官面試官你要自己去104這個銀行網站找這個這樣這個就業服務站只簽名不媒合這樣可以嗎部長\n這當然不行所以移工抗議了嘛這個我們改變好了改進好了瞭解一下改進 開過會要針對這些缺失來具體來改善那因為還有兩個點一個是言語不通啦那這個就是說我們知道全臺灣總共有48座就業服務中心如果要提供這個媒合可能要有雙語服務部長你知道這48座就業服務中心有幾家是提供的四國雙語服務\n我們齁其實現在就是在各就福站透過三方 其實有兩家有兩家 一個桃園一個在彰化 去年成立的我覺得這個很棒啦 其實 會委員這是專設的但是我們其實各就福站都可以透過三方的一個部長 這個因為我們現在還在談職聘中間怎麼來鼓勵嘛齁那一年當中大概有多少移工會轉換雇主\n大概有多少位要轉換雇主?會需要這樣的服務?大概2萬多每年大概有2萬多因為這樣的兩座老實說48座裡面兩座這樣子是不是說這種算是很好的服務是不是可能再考慮再擴大一下?我們這兩座是先示範如果可以我們就做\n好那最後一個是身體上次我在質詢就是說執聘手續非常的繁複啊簡直像這個玩大地遊戲我覺得玩大風吹他進進出出很多的機構但是這個勞動部已經做到了一個部分點就是說\n高雄跟長高雄的桃園高高雄成立一站式服務我覺得很棒的內動內政部勞動部跨服務的跨部會合作這種就是最便民的一個做法這個一站式的服務啊移工可以在這裡中心接受三天兩夜的這個講習來瞭解在臺灣生活需知衛生保健還有勞動權益等等那僱主這邊可以一次性的辦好對\n謝謝陳昭姿\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.133 --> 00:08.422\n有請部長及安署州署長\n\n00:12.932 --> 00:40.405\n部長,貼實認證是我國根據職業安全衛生法令等辦理的一個合格驗證證明那只有符合標準的這個機械設備甚至防爆管配件才可以在我國的石化工廠或電廠類的高危險區來使用目的是讓這些工廠發生危險的時候能夠把災害控制到一個範圍內但是2018年的時候王國昌委員有揭露臺電的大林廠\n\n00:41.585 --> 01:00.991\n她的高風險場區使用的防暴管材有使用到東元系統的安博產品那個產品是偽造台灣TS認證的部長您還記得這件事嗎是那就是當時台電有要求同胞商的現代樂鐵跟榮工公司把這個所有不合格的產品要做一個更換\n\n01:01.991 --> 01:27.371\n但是臺電也有提出對這個統包商提出要求就是要求使用所謂的可斷鑄鐵這個材質來作為這個防爆管配件那我先把這個背景跟部長說明一下好那這一家廠商叫做深方公司他也有許多防爆管配件的這個也向值安署登錄取得這個ts認證但是我要強調是他眾多產品當中只有這個\n\n01:29.079 --> 01:45.804\n可斷鑄鐵的材質有TS認證他的效期有3年部長根據那個職業安全衛生法的規定是不是只有經過測試檢定而且在職安署的網站上去登錄的你才可以在銷售的時候宣稱說你是具有這個TS認證我這個說法正確嗎\n\n01:49.133 --> 01:49.153\n謝謝署長\n\n02:05.328 --> 02:08.972\n下一張就是因為我前面提到20192019臺電大臨場因為不合格更換防爆氣管材的時候這家生發公司他明明知道自己取得TS認證的產品只限於鑄鐵合金\n\n02:22.932 --> 02:45.348\n但是他在送審的這個產品的送審證書上寫的注鐵合金但實際成分是球末注鐵以後交貨也會是球末注鐵當然我們沒有否定球末注鐵也許他的材質是更好的但是他可以這樣濫用他的貼紙證照嗎就是說他合什麼是什麼他可以拿別的東西來抵嗎當然不行\n\n02:46.668 --> 03:05.475\n我們都知道部長說是不行這個灰口鑄鐵可斷鑄鐵或這個球木鑄鐵他完全不同的材質所以生方拿出這樣證書交給台電還好台電當時覺得有點問題是沒有採購但是我要談的是台電沒有採購但是廠商可以這樣做嗎所以就是說\n\n03:28.077 --> 03:41.717\n確實是有一些疑義啦那也有目前是在請台電公司要提供相關的合約啦還有部長這個去年就有立委檢舉了耶這很久了耶對但是我們都有按照程序要進行啊詳細我請署長來說明好了\n\n03:44.961 --> 03:55.531\n我跟您簡單解釋齁因為大林電廠是舊的電廠它是用原來是用美規的標準來做設置跟施工的製造那我們責安法在103年開始試用的時候有關我們是用新的歐規的標準所以這兩個標準在合作\n\n04:01.136 --> 04:14.009\n在融合過程中臺電大林電廠用既有的標準在設置那現在是依照用戶電動裝置規則由能源署來做進步的釐清我們勞動部會跟經濟部做進步的設計安裝設備做有效來做確認\n\n04:18.874 --> 04:37.225\n的重點就是像深芳他認證的配管件因為他的效期是3年那他會不會一併到其他的地方中油啦台塑啦中頂公司也是用同樣的證明文件去處理你要不要可不可以一併謝謝委員其實包括原來的委員跟您非常關心這個我非常非常感謝因為在\n\n04:55.932 --> 05:20.768\n這個上個月底指安署到大陵廠進行查場的時候有發現在防暴區內的防暴管材出現嚴重的瑕疵照片上這一張是另外一家公司叫蒙玉他賣給台電裝在這個大陵廠防暴區內的這個叫所謂的中間的穿線盒那台電採購的這個品質要求是可斷鑄鐵但是那一天喔那一天在查場的時候林安署有找金屬中心派人來查場現場來進行材質的檢測發現是灰口鑄鐵\n\n05:25.531 --> 05:26.451\n對不起委員可不可以插個話\n\n05:49.319 --> 06:17.351\n這個部分是不是在防暴區因為我剛才跟委員解釋大聯想是用舊的美規標準設施規劃所以我現在就請經濟部做進一步的釐清如果這個區塊是真的需要屬於防暴區的話當然台電這個部分就要做比較明確的違反規定就是說那一天台電說要去帶大家去看防暴區啦說該處使用需要符合防暴標準的防暴管財那參加抽驗的人都有職安署官員啊公園院的專家在\n\n06:18.231 --> 06:18.611\n所以他是這麼說的\n\n06:48.872 --> 06:50.613\n部長這個職聘這個是移工職聘的部分首次招募右邊是這個再次招募重新招募你看那個職聘的比率這10年來比100%很遙遠的0.2%\n\n07:05.447 --> 07:23.637\n然後對於重新這個招募的部分這個理論上說移工工作滿3年僱主要繼續聘照理說他們有經驗了那應該還要再發這個仲介費嗎我是說他們為什麼職域也是1%所以部長勞動部雖然說職聘是你的既定政策但是效果不好嗎是不是對效果不好\n\n07:24.057 --> 07:43.914\n那效果在上次我質詢也有提出來那後來就有專家就是所謂的前勞發署跨國勞動力管理組組長薛建忠他指出說整個職聘有三大難關移工人選難密、語言密不通、申請程序繁複部長您同意這三個是一個障礙或難關嗎?部長您同意這三點?\n\n07:45.470 --> 08:02.799\n這個因為是我們之前組長他是這個主辦的人他應該是很瞭解的其實我知道勞動部很努力但是就是說我們看看就哪一些可以再繼續做得更好難關一人選難密部長現在問題是有移工團體指控他們到就業服務站\n\n08:03.619 --> 08:20.979\n我說全台灣都有就業服戰那不只幫外國本國人沒有也有幫助外籍外移工但是移工到了現場你看他們他到現場沒有僱主來他要他簽到因為如果不簽到的話他就會被強制反國那這個就是他簽到但是到了他們問僱主在哪裡\n\n08:22.501 --> 08:38.916\n那個工作人員竟然說你們要自己找那不像求職的時候你這個人事部叫你來面試那你說面試官呢沒有面試官面試官你要自己去104這個銀行網站找這個這樣這個就業服務站只簽名不媒合這樣可以嗎部長\n\n08:40.317 --> 09:05.264\n這當然不行所以移工抗議了嘛這個我們改變好了改進好了瞭解一下改進開過會要針對這些缺失來具體來改善那因為還有兩個點一個是言語不通啦那這個就是說我們知道全臺灣總共有48座就業服務中心如果要提供這個媒合可能要有雙語服務部長你知道這48座就業服務中心有幾家是提供的四國雙語服務\n\n09:07.762 --> 09:28.985\n我們齁其實現在就是在各就福站透過三方其實有兩家有兩家一個桃園一個在彰化去年成立的我覺得這個很棒啦其實會委員這是專設的但是我們其實各就福站都可以透過三方的一個部長這個因為我們現在還在談職聘中間怎麼來鼓勵嘛齁那一年當中大概有多少移工會轉換雇主\n\n09:31.444 --> 09:39.208\n大概有多少位要轉換雇主?會需要這樣的服務?大概2萬多每年大概有2萬多因為這樣的兩座老實說48座裡面兩座這樣子是不是說這種算是很好的服務是不是可能再考慮再擴大一下?我們這兩座是先示範如果可以我們就做\n\n09:53.274 --> 10:07.321\n好那最後一個是身體上次我在質詢就是說執聘手續非常的繁複啊簡直像這個玩大地遊戲我覺得玩大風吹他進進出出很多的機構但是這個勞動部已經做到了一個部分點就是說\n\n10:08.769 --> 10:25.603\n高雄跟長高雄的桃園高高雄成立一站式服務我覺得很棒的內動內政部勞動部跨服務的跨部會合作這種就是最便民的一個做法這個一站式的服務啊移工可以在這裡中心接受三天兩夜的這個講習來瞭解在臺灣生活需知衛生保健還有勞動權益等等那僱主這邊可以一次性的辦好對\n\n10:32.609 --> 10:32.749\n謝謝陳昭姿\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.133,"end":8.422,"text":"有請部長及安署州署長"},{"start":12.932,"end":40.405,"text":"部長,貼實認證是我國根據職業安全衛生法令等辦理的一個合格驗證證明那只有符合標準的這個機械設備甚至防爆管配件才可以在我國的石化工廠或電廠類的高危險區來使用目的是讓這些工廠發生危險的時候能夠把災害控制到一個範圍內但是2018年的時候王國昌委員有揭露臺電的大林廠"},{"start":41.585,"end":60.991,"text":"她的高風險場區使用的防暴管材有使用到東元系統的安博產品 那個產品是偽造台灣TS認證的部長您還記得這件事嗎 是那就是當時台電有要求同胞商的現代樂鐵跟榮工公司把這個所有不合格的產品要做一個更換"},{"start":61.991,"end":87.371,"text":"但是臺電也有提出對這個統包商提出要求就是要求使用所謂的可斷鑄鐵這個材質來作為這個防爆管配件那我先把這個背景跟部長說明一下好那這一家廠商叫做深方公司他也有許多防爆管配件的這個也向值安署登錄取得這個ts認證但是我要強調是他眾多產品當中只有這個"},{"start":89.079,"end":105.804,"text":"可斷鑄鐵的材質有TS認證他的效期有3年部長根據那個職業安全衛生法的規定是不是只有經過測試檢定而且在職安署的網站上去登錄的你才可以在銷售的時候宣稱說你是具有這個TS認證我這個說法正確嗎"},{"start":109.133,"end":109.153,"text":"謝謝署長"},{"start":125.328,"end":128.972,"text":"下一張就是因為我前面提到20192019臺電大臨場因為不合格更換防爆氣管材的時候這家生發公司他明明知道自己取得TS認證的產品只限於鑄鐵合金"},{"start":142.932,"end":165.348,"text":"但是他在送審的這個產品的送審證書上寫的注鐵合金但實際成分是球末注鐵以後交貨也會是球末注鐵當然我們沒有否定球末注鐵也許他的材質是更好的但是他可以這樣濫用他的貼紙證照嗎就是說他合什麼是什麼他可以拿別的東西來抵嗎當然不行"},{"start":166.668,"end":185.475,"text":"我們都知道部長說是不行這個灰口鑄鐵可斷鑄鐵或這個球木鑄鐵他完全不同的材質所以生方拿出這樣證書交給台電還好台電當時覺得有點問題是沒有採購但是我要談的是台電沒有採購但是廠商可以這樣做嗎所以就是說"},{"start":186.015,"end":207.176,"text":"﹖"},{"start":208.077,"end":221.717,"text":"確實是有一些疑義啦那也有目前是在請台電公司要提供相關的合約啦還有部長這個去年就有立委檢舉了耶這很久了耶對但是我們都有按照程序要進行啊詳細我請署長來說明好了"},{"start":224.961,"end":235.531,"text":"我跟您簡單解釋齁因為大林電廠是舊的電廠它是用原來是用美規的標準來做設置跟施工的製造那我們責安法在103年開始試用的時候有關我們是用新的歐規的標準所以這兩個標準在合作"},{"start":241.136,"end":254.009,"text":"在融合過程中臺電大林電廠用既有的標準在設置那現在是依照用戶電動裝置規則由能源署來做進步的釐清我們勞動部會跟經濟部做進步的設計安裝設備做有效來做確認"},{"start":258.874,"end":277.225,"text":"的重點就是像深芳他認證的配管件因為他的效期是3年那他會不會一併到其他的地方中油啦台塑啦中頂公司也是用同樣的證明文件去處理你要不要可不可以一併謝謝委員其實包括原來的委員跟您非常關心這個我非常非常感謝因為在"},{"start":277.705,"end":294.991,"text":"​​​​​​​​"},{"start":295.932,"end":320.768,"text":"這個上個月底指安署到大陵廠進行查場的時候有發現在防暴區內的防暴管材出現嚴重的瑕疵照片上這一張是另外一家公司叫蒙玉他賣給台電裝在這個大陵廠防暴區內的這個叫所謂的中間的穿線盒那台電採購的這個品質要求是可斷鑄鐵但是那一天喔那一天在查場的時候林安署有找金屬中心派人來查場現場來進行材質的檢測發現是灰口鑄鐵"},{"start":325.531,"end":326.451,"text":"對不起委員可不可以插個話"},{"start":349.319,"end":377.351,"text":"這個部分是不是在防暴區因為我剛才跟委員解釋大聯想是用舊的美規標準設施規劃所以我現在就請經濟部做進一步的釐清如果這個區塊是真的需要屬於防暴區的話當然台電這個部分就要做比較明確的違反規定就是說那一天台電說要去帶大家去看防暴區啦說該處使用需要符合防暴標準的防暴管財那參加抽驗的人都有職安署官員啊公園院的專家在"},{"start":378.231,"end":378.611,"text":"所以他是這麼說的"},{"start":408.872,"end":410.613,"text":"部長這個職聘這個是移工職聘的部分首次招募右邊是這個再次招募重新招募你看那個職聘的比率這10年來比100%很遙遠的0.2%"},{"start":425.447,"end":443.637,"text":"然後對於重新這個招募的部分這個理論上說移工工作滿3年僱主要繼續聘照理說他們有經驗了那應該還要再發這個仲介費嗎我是說他們為什麼職域也是1%所以部長勞動部雖然說職聘是你的既定政策但是效果不好嗎是不是對效果不好"},{"start":444.057,"end":463.914,"text":"那效果在上次我質詢也有提出來那後來就有專家就是所謂的前勞發署跨國勞動力管理組組長薛建忠他指出說整個職聘有三大難關移工人選難密、語言密不通、申請程序繁複部長您同意這三個是一個障礙或難關嗎?部長您同意這三點?"},{"start":465.47,"end":482.799,"text":"這個因為是我們之前組長他是這個主辦的人他應該是很瞭解的其實我知道勞動部很努力但是就是說我們看看就哪一些可以再繼續做得更好難關一人選難密部長現在問題是有移工團體指控他們到就業服務站"},{"start":483.619,"end":500.979,"text":"我說全台灣都有就業服戰那不只幫外國本國人沒有也有幫助外籍外移工但是移工到了現場你看他們他到現場沒有僱主來他要他簽到因為如果不簽到的話他就會被強制反國那這個就是他簽到但是到了他們問僱主在哪裡"},{"start":502.501,"end":518.916,"text":"那個工作人員竟然說你們要自己找那不像求職的時候你這個人事部叫你來面試那你說面試官呢沒有面試官面試官你要自己去104這個銀行網站找這個這樣這個就業服務站只簽名不媒合這樣可以嗎部長"},{"start":520.317,"end":545.264,"text":"這當然不行所以移工抗議了嘛這個我們改變好了改進好了瞭解一下改進 開過會要針對這些缺失來具體來改善那因為還有兩個點一個是言語不通啦那這個就是說我們知道全臺灣總共有48座就業服務中心如果要提供這個媒合可能要有雙語服務部長你知道這48座就業服務中心有幾家是提供的四國雙語服務"},{"start":547.762,"end":568.985,"text":"我們齁其實現在就是在各就福站透過三方 其實有兩家有兩家 一個桃園一個在彰化 去年成立的我覺得這個很棒啦 其實 會委員這是專設的但是我們其實各就福站都可以透過三方的一個部長 這個因為我們現在還在談職聘中間怎麼來鼓勵嘛齁那一年當中大概有多少移工會轉換雇主"},{"start":571.444,"end":579.208,"text":"大概有多少位要轉換雇主?會需要這樣的服務?大概2萬多每年大概有2萬多因為這樣的兩座老實說48座裡面兩座這樣子是不是說這種算是很好的服務是不是可能再考慮再擴大一下?我們這兩座是先示範如果可以我們就做"},{"start":593.274,"end":607.321,"text":"好那最後一個是身體上次我在質詢就是說執聘手續非常的繁複啊簡直像這個玩大地遊戲我覺得玩大風吹他進進出出很多的機構但是這個勞動部已經做到了一個部分點就是說"},{"start":608.769,"end":625.603,"text":"高雄跟長高雄的桃園高高雄成立一站式服務我覺得很棒的內動內政部勞動部跨服務的跨部會合作這種就是最便民的一個做法這個一站式的服務啊移工可以在這裡中心接受三天兩夜的這個講習來瞭解在臺灣生活需知衛生保健還有勞動權益等等那僱主這邊可以一次性的辦好對"},{"start":632.609,"end":632.749,"text":"謝謝陳昭姿"}]}}}}