{"id":149763,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149763","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/7ed54bd69a3b6903f1ea331db3ba37e8b77cff0621b76d91f8ba9b0039caa7a6b87984df7be5c61d5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"李彥秀","委員發言時間":"10:21:12 - 10:32:55","影片長度":"00:11:43","會議時間":"2024-03-13T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第3次全體委員會議（事由：邀請行政院主計總處朱主計長澤民、審計部陳審計長瑞敏率所屬單位主管列席業務報告，並備質詢。\n【3月13日及14日二天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第3次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":3,"committees":[20],"id":"委員會-11-1-20-3"},"date":"2024-03-13","duration":703,"end_time":"2024-03-13T10:32:55+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-13T10:21:12+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":694,"blocks":[["李委員彥秀：（10時21分）謝謝召委，我請主計長。"],["主席：請朱主計長。"],["朱主計長澤民：委員好。"],["李委員彥秀：主計長好。主計長，這幾年原物料上漲，大家都知道通膨的狀況也越來越嚴重，所以我們對軍公教人員也經歷了3次調薪，在過去7年分別由107年的3%、111年的4%、還有到今年的4%。我先感謝主計長、大家體恤到52萬軍公教人員的辛勞，幫公務員加薪，這個加薪當然也會帶動民間企業後續加薪至少2.4%到2.6%之間左右，這是我們期待的。我想就這個部分來肯定主計長，但是主計長，這個加薪固然對全國民間也好、軍公教也好是好事，不過相對地我們也要考量到地方財源的負擔。我肯定這件事情，但是地方的財源負擔一定會有的，你同意我這樣的說法吧？"],["朱主計長澤民：對，同意。我們有一個方式，就是如果我們的政策宣布是在地方政府預算還沒有送到議會的時候，第一年中央政府會協助，以後就是由他們編到預算裡面去，我們一直採用這個措施。"],["李委員彥秀：主計長，狀況是這樣子，從107年到現在，我們至少調幅11%左右，就像您剛才講的，譬如今年我們打算加薪4%，這個立即就會增加臺北市22億，要追加這些預算、要找出這些錢出來，所以鄭文燦副院長才會講中央對地方挹注也會考慮到加薪這一塊。您剛才講說如果預算還沒送到議會，如果在之後的話，你們就會補足全部？"],["朱主計長澤民：對。我跟委員報告……"],["李委員彥秀：主計長，我知道你會考量到你突然宣布的話，錢不知道從哪裡來，所以其實我關注的是，因為過去這幾年我們看到，你看一下我的圖表，107年加薪的幅度是3%，你們補助了5,000萬；111年21億，你們100%補助；113年你們補助50%。所以對地方來說，它當然希望它是一個制度化的處理或者至少可以預期。大家都肯定這件事情，但是每個縣市的財源狀況不一致，我當然不敢講可不可以全部都由你們來補助，地方很多縣市首長會覺得這是中央請客、地方買單，但我不願意這樣子講，不過如果我們可以有一個制度性的討論，我覺得對地方一下子要找這個財源，即便如果是議會還沒審到預算，你會補助全年，但是我覺得如果有機會做制度化的處理，譬如第一年由中央全部來負擔，第二年、第三年他們再想辦法去籌措預算來處理，這會不會是一個更好的方式？"],["朱主計長澤民：那個方向可以……委員所講的可以討論。我必須說明一下，調薪的政策是人事總處主管的，它是業務主管單位。您剛才講的113年我們補助一半，是因為我們的政策在他們編預算送到立法院之前就宣布，所以調50%是額外給它的，本來按照制度都不會給的，但是我們額外給它，謝謝。"],["李委員彥秀：主計長，所以我今天才跟你討論我們可不可以制度化的處理，以後第一年都由中央來負擔？"],["朱主計長澤民：那個要討論，因為按照地方制度法，它本來就是地方自治應該負擔的經費，我們可以討論，謝謝。"],["李委員彥秀：主計長，所以我今天有個臨時提案，我希望這個事情可以做制度化的處理。當然，我再次強調，我們肯定對軍公教調薪，因為原物料上漲、通膨的問題，所以我們都認為要加薪，對軍公教加薪這件事情我們都給予肯定，但地方、各縣市的財源狀況不一樣，我剛才已經舉例了，所以如果第一年有機會由中央來負擔全部，第二年、第三年後面再由地方完全負擔，我覺得對地方的財政、找錢也好、各方面，才不會影響到地方原來的市政推動。如果可以的話，我希望主計長可以朝向這個方式進行，才不會對地方的財政造成立即性的衝擊。"],["朱主計長澤民：對，對財政情況不好的，我們事實上是全補、全部補助。"],["李委員彥秀：不要啦，主計長，我覺得不要說財政好不好，對地方來說，本來每個縣市都有既定的預算、既定的市政要推動。"],["朱主計長澤民：對，它可以預測，它比較容易……"],["李委員彥秀：你臨時12月30日宣布，1月1日議會才審完，它哪裡臨時來找錢？所以我覺得還是制度化地處理這件事情……"],["朱主計長澤民：對，我同意制度化……"],["李委員彥秀：我希望主計長來研議這件事情。"],["朱主計長澤民：我也希望人總的薪資政策能夠提早宣布，謝謝。"],["李委員彥秀：好，這個也是中央的問題，好不好？"],["朱主計長澤民：是，謝謝。"],["李委員彥秀：主計長，第二件事情，我關注到前兩天陳院長在回答柯志恩委員的時候講到：股票上2萬點，你開不開心？主計長，股票上兩萬點，你開不開心？"],["朱主計長澤民：我個人一點都不開心，因為我沒有股票。"],["李委員彥秀：對呀！我就查到你的財產申報裡面，你的股票才5,560塊啊！所以……"],["朱主計長澤民：那個是已經沒有上市……"],["李委員彥秀：對啦！所以院長搞錯了啦！股票上2萬點，是少數人開心，因為以臺灣的股市來說，將近44%是外資，我們的護國神山台積電有七成也是外資，所以所有的股票好當然是好事，經濟預期也會比較好，但是這個利多並不是全民共享的利多。","主計長，我要給你看幾個數字。依照我們的GDP來說，從2012年到2021年我們的經濟成長率6.53%，蔡英文講是二十年來最好的時刻；但是在我們的GDP占比中，我們受僱人員的報酬從2012年的45.8%降到2021年的43%，是歷年來最低。這個數字我相信你非常清楚，代表的意義是臺灣的經濟紅利其實資方享受到，勞工沒有享受到，這是第一點；第二個代表的意義是，臺灣產業結構出現了很大的問題，少數贏者圈的收入很高，但是大多數的民眾沒有享受到經濟的利益。再來，我想你非常清楚，這幾年我們的貧富差距創下12年的新高；過去這3年即便有加薪，我們的實質經常性薪資的調幅全部都被通膨吃掉了；我們看到近5年的實質總薪資是倒退的，而且是7年來首度的負成長。","主計長，我看到你在去年10月26日講過一句話：貧富差距是過去十年的新高，所得分配不均，政府的責任最大。你現在還是同意這句話嗎？"],["朱主計長澤民：跟委員報告，這個有一點斷章取義。我是說所得分配不均，政府就要來做所得分配的工作，所以民間也有責任……"],["李委員彥秀：主計長，我們不要玩文字遊戲。那我這樣講，政府有責任去處理貧富所得分配不均的問題，好不好？"],["朱主計長澤民：對……"],["李委員彥秀：所以我要講的是，蔡英文不要老拿經濟是二十年來最好、6.53%來志得意滿。我們股票上2萬點，你回去也應該跟院長講，股票2萬點就只有少數人開心、外資開心啦！以我來說，以你來說，我們都沒有玩股票的人，我們都不開心，你要告訴他這件事情。"],["朱主計長澤民：我怕大家誤解，我個人不開心，可是我管國家的財政很開心，因為證券交易稅增加，謝謝，而且……"],["李委員彥秀：但是，主計長，那我就要糾正你，稅收增加很開心，但是人民的經濟、人民生活過得好不好，才是我們身為政府的最大責任，你同意這句話嘛！"],["朱主計長澤民：當然。"],["李委員彥秀：大多數的人民過得好不好，才是政府最重要的責任，所以主計長，你應該對於明年的經濟有所預測，包括我剛剛講的，我們的實質薪資明年到底會不會再往上調？會不會變成由負轉正，或我們的總薪資有沒有機會從負轉正？"],["朱主計長澤民：那要看CPI的成長率，他們名目的……"],["李委員彥秀：你應該都要預期啊！你是主計長啊！"],["朱主計長澤民：對，那個名目薪資一定會成長，那要看CPI的上漲，CPI的上漲有時候會有一些不確定因素……"],["李委員彥秀：我知道啦，但是你每一年都會預測，那你能不能預測明年？你評估、預測明年啊！"],["朱主計長澤民：因為我不曉得相關……"],["李委員彥秀：包括我們的經常性薪資，包括明年的總薪資有沒有機會由負轉正？你不敢講？"],["朱主計長澤民：我只能說有50%的機會。"],["李委員彥秀：50%喔？"],["朱主計長澤民：對。"],["李委員彥秀：所以人民要繼續過苦日子就對了？"],["朱主計長澤民：另外50%也可能不上漲，因為我們不曉得……"],["李委員彥秀：主計長，你這個50、50是他們猜的，還是真的？還是你是有經過預測的？"],["朱主計長澤民：沒有預測，我們沒有預測薪資的一個成長，因為……"],["李委員彥秀：主計長，因為下個月電價還要漲，電價要漲，對於產業界獲利的分配，還有對於一般的民眾，臺灣的民眾生活影響衝擊也非常大，我希望你們有去做評估，你們應該有吧？"],["朱主計長澤民：我們主計總處沒有，經濟部有沒有我不曉得。"],["李委員彥秀：這個CPI因為你明年也會做預測，你應該是……"],["朱主計長澤民：因為我不曉得經濟部的方案是……"],["李委員彥秀：財政三長，主計長、財政部部長、經濟部部長應該對這個有所評估。主計長，我的時間到了，我覺得這個都是連動性的問題。"],["朱主計長澤民：對，的確是。"],["李委員彥秀：明年人民生活過得好不好，是仰賴我們的主計長、經濟部部長、財政部部長，我覺得對於後續電價調整的影響、財富的分配狀況，連動的部分我覺得你們都一定要更仔細地評估，我也希望你回去告訴陳建仁院長，不要老活在股市2萬點的這個夢幻裡面，不要贏了指數失了民心。"],["朱主計長澤民：謝謝。"],["李委員彥秀：謝謝。"],["主席：等一下黃珊珊委員發言完畢，我們就休息5分鐘。","接著請王鴻薇委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":128,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-20-3","speakers":["羅明才","林德福","吳秉叡","賴士葆","郭國文","賴惠員","李彥秀","王鴻薇","黃珊珊","顏寬恒","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","李坤城","陳玉珍","王世堅","謝衣鳯","張啓楷","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","羅智強"],"page_start":33,"meetingDate":["2024-03-13"],"gazette_id":"1131301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1131301_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第3次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請行政院主計總處朱主計長澤民、審計部陳審計長瑞敏率所屬單位主管列席業務報告，並備質\n詢","agenda_id":"1131301_00002"}},"transcript":{"id":"149763","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149763","tool":"pyannote","id":"149763-pyannote"},"job_id":"44EBkocZp9EuS5Db","queued_at":"2024-06-02 05:09:56","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2024-06-02 05:09:56","msg":"downloading https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149763"},{"time":"2024-06-02 05:09:57","msg":"downloading https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/7ed54bd69a3b6903f1ea331db3ba37e8b77cff0621b76d91afb54cff4db4c430d0998d854c4b636f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8"},{"time":"2024-06-02 05:10:15","msg":"converting mp4 to wav"},{"time":"2024-06-02 05:10:17","msg":"running pyannote"},{"time":"2024-06-02 05:10:29","msg":"status: 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00:01:22,840\n但是他相對的我們要考量到地方的財源的負擔我肯定這件事情但是地方的財源負擔一定會有的你同意我這樣的說法嗎對同意到那個我們有一個方式如果我們的政策宣布是在那個地方政府預算還沒有送到議會的時候第一年中央政府會協助以後就是由他們編到預算裡面去我們還是採用這個措施\n\n4\n00:01:24,181 --> 00:01:41,146\n因為狀況是這樣子從107年到現在我們至少調幅11%左右您剛才講的就是說譬如說今年我們打算加薪4%這個立即就會增加臺北市22億要追加這些預算要去找出這些錢出來\n\n5\n00:01:42,847 --> 00:01:57,108\n所以鄭文燦院長才會講說這個中央對地方藝術也會考慮到加薪這一塊你剛才講說如果預算還沒送到議會的話你們就會如果在之後的話你們就會補足全部對\n\n6\n00:02:00,050 --> 00:02:14,176\n主席長我知道你會考量到說你突然宣布的話錢不知道從哪裡來所以其實我關注的就因為過去這幾年我們看到107年你們只補助了我們加薪的幅度是3%我們補助5000萬然後111年21億我們百分之百補助113年我們補助50%所以\n\n7\n00:02:26,801 --> 00:02:49,675\n就是說對地方來說他當然希望他是一個制度化的處理或者是至少可以預期大家都肯定這件事情但是財源每個縣市的財源的狀況不一致我當然不敢講說那你可不可以全部全部都你來補助地方很多縣市常常會覺得中央請客地方買單但我不願意這樣子講\n\n8\n00:02:50,876 --> 00:03:20,245\n但是如果我們可以有一個制度性的討論我覺得對地方一下子要找這個財源你即便說如果是還沒送到預算議會還沒審到預算之後你會補助全年但我覺得如果有機會制度化的處理比如說第一年由我們中央全部來負擔第二年第三年那他們再想辦法去籌措預算來處理我覺得會不會這是一個更好的方式\n\n9\n00:03:20,845 --> 00:03:48,386\n那個方向可以委員的所講的可以討論我必須說明一下條新的政策是人事總處主管的他的業務主管單位您剛才講的113年我們補助一半是因為我們的政策在他們的那個編預算送到立法院之前就宣布那個所以條50%是額外給他的啦他本來是按照\n\n10\n00:03:49,099 --> 00:04:02,689\n制度他都都不會給的但是我們額外給他所以所以主計長我說我今天才跟你討論說我們可不可以制度化的處理以後第一年都由中央來負擔那個要要要那個是\n\n11\n00:04:03,797 --> 00:04:08,580\n主席長我希望這件事情說我今天有個臨時提案我希望這個事情可以做制度化的處理當然\n\n12\n00:04:21,488 --> 00:04:49,158\n我再次強調我們肯定對軍公教因為原物料上漲通膨的問題所以我們都認為要加薪對軍公教加薪這件事情我們都給予肯定但地方各縣市的財源狀況不一樣我剛才就已經舉例了所以如果第一年有機會中央來負擔全部第二年第三年後面才由地方完全來做負擔我覺得對地方的財政找錢也好我覺得各方面\n\n13\n00:04:50,118 --> 00:04:52,719\n對地方的財政造成立即性的衝擊對地方來說本來每一個縣市都有既定的預算既定的市政要推動\n\n14\n00:05:20,046 --> 00:05:44,566\n你臨時12月30號宣布他1月1號他1月1號議會才審完他哪裏來臨時來找錢所以我覺得還是制度化的來處理這件事情我希望主計長來研議這件事情那我也希望任總的那個薪資政策能夠提早宣布謝謝好那這個也是中央的問題好不好主計長第二件事情我關注到前兩天\n\n15\n00:05:46,368 --> 00:05:59,169\n陳院長在回答科珍委員的時候講到說股票上兩萬點你開不開心主計長股票上兩萬點你開不開心我一點我個人一點都不開心因為我沒有股票\n\n16\n00:06:00,278 --> 00:06:17,548\n對阿我就查到你的財產申報裡面你的股票才5560塊阿所以那個是已經沒有上市對阿所以院長搞錯了啦股票上兩萬點是少數人開經因為以台灣的股市來說我們將近44%是外資我們的護國神山台積電還有七成也是外資所以\n\n17\n00:06:28,915 --> 00:06:42,439\n所有的股票好當然好就是說經濟預期也會比較好但是這個利多並不是全民共享的利多主計長我要給你看幾個數字依照我們GDP來說從2012年到2021年蔡英文所講的6.53是我們經濟成長是20年來最好的時刻但是在我們的GDP佔比中我們受雇人員的報酬從2012年的45.8%\n\n18\n00:06:58,183 --> 00:07:11,355\n降到我們現在2021��二零二一年的四十三趴是歷年來最低這個數字我相信數字你非常清楚代表的意義是臺灣的經濟紅利其實勞工沒有享受到\n\n19\n00:07:12,555 --> 00:07:35,501\n第一點資方享受到勞工沒有享受到第二個代表的意義是臺灣產業結構出現了很大的問題我們少數贏者圈的收入很高但是大多數的民眾沒有享受到經濟的利益然後再下來我想你非常清楚這幾年我們貧富差距造成12年來的新高然後我們這幾年我們的實質經常\n\n20\n00:07:37,402 --> 00:07:53,120\n實質經常性的薪資過去這3年都被即便有加薪全部這3年都被吞捧吃掉了再來下一張我們看到我們近5年實質種薪資是倒退的而且是7年來首度的負成長\n\n21\n00:07:54,741 --> 00:08:00,743\n主計長我也看到齁其實你有講你在去年的10月26號齁你講過一句話貧富差距是過去10年的新高所得分配不均政府的責任最大你現在還是同意這句話嗎跟那個委員報告這個有點斷章起義啦我都所得分配不均政府就要來\n\n22\n00:08:21,252 --> 00:08:33,040\n主計長我們不要玩文字遊戲政府有最大的我這樣講政府有責任去處理分配貧富分配不足的問題好不好所以\n\n23\n00:08:34,020 --> 00:09:02,527\n所以我要講的說蔡英文不要老拿經濟20年來最好6.53來自得滿意我們股票上兩萬點你回去你也應該跟院長講說兩萬點齁這時候少數人開心外資開心啦以我來說以你來說我們都沒有玩股票的人我們都不開心你要告訴他這件事情我要怕大家誤解我個人不開心可是我管國家的財政很開心因為證券交易稅增加對不對謝謝\n\n24\n00:09:04,188 --> 00:09:15,517\n但是主事長那我就要糾正你稅收增加很開心但是人民的經濟人民生活過得好不好才是我們身為政府的最大責任\n\n25\n00:09:16,598 --> 00:09:44,105\n你同意這句話嗎當然所有大多數的人民過得好不好才是政府最重要的責任所以主計長你應該對於明年的經濟有所預測包括我剛剛講的人民我們實質薪資明年到底會不會再往上跳會不會變成有負轉正或我們總薪資有沒有機會重負轉正我們是說可以那要看那個CPI的成長率阿你都應該要預期阿你是主計長阿對\n\n26\n00:09:45,945 --> 00:10:09,811\n那個明目薪資一定會成長那要看那個CPI的一個上漲CPI的上漲有時候會有一些不確定因素我知道啦但是你每一年都會預測那你能不能預測明年你評估預測明年因為我不曉得包括我們的經常薪資包括明年的總薪資有沒有機會有負轉勝你不敢講我只能說有50%的機會\n\n27\n00:10:12,458 --> 00:10:12,938\n朱主計長,你這個是．﹖\n\n28\n00:10:43,018 --> 00:10:55,725\n我希望你們有去做評估。你們應該有吧?我主計總處沒有。經濟部有沒有,我不曉得。因為CPI明年你應該是財政三長、主計長、財政部部長、經濟部部長應該對這個有所評估。主計長我的時間到了。我覺得這個都是聯動性的問題。明年人民生活過得好不好?\n\n29\n00:11:08,251 --> 00:11:08,271\n謝謝謝謝好謝謝\n\n30\n00:11:38,191 --> 00:11:42,405\n那我們等一下現場委員請等一下黃珊珊委員發言完畢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n2530\t18994\t主計長,這幾年原物料上漲那大家都知道通膨的狀況也越來越嚴重所以我們對於軍公教人員也經歷了三次調薪在過去七年分別有107年的3%、111年的4%還有到今年的4%\n25015\t53469\t我先感謝主計長這邊大家體恤到軍公教52萬軍公教人員的辛勞那幫工人員加薪我們這個加薪當然也會帶動民間企業後續的加資是我們期待至少在2.4到2.6%中間左右我想這個部分來肯定主計長但是主計長這個加薪固然對全國民間也好軍公教也好是好事\n54449\t82840\t但是他相對的我們要考量到地方的財源的負擔我肯定這件事情但是地方的財源負擔一定會有的你同意我這樣的說法嗎對同意到那個我們有一個方式如果我們的政策宣布是在那個地方政府預算還沒有送到議會的時候第一年中央政府會協助以後就是由他們編到預算裡面去我們還是採用這個措施\n84181\t101146\t因為狀況是這樣子從107年到現在我們至少調幅11%左右您剛才講的就是說譬如說今年我們打算加薪4%這個立即就會增加臺北市22億要追加這些預算要去找出這些錢出來\n102847\t117108\t所以鄭文燦院長才會講說這個中央對地方藝術也會考慮到加薪這一塊你剛才講說如果預算還沒送到議會的話你們就會如果在之後的話你們就會補足全部對\n120050\t134176\t主席長我知道你會考量到說你突然宣布的話錢不知道從哪裡來所以其實我關注的就因為過去這幾年我們看到107年你們只補助了我們加薪的幅度是3%我們補助5000萬然後111年21億我們百分之百補助113年我們補助50%所以\n146801\t169675\t就是說對地方來說他當然希望他是一個制度化的處理或者是至少可以預期大家都肯定這件事情但是財源每個縣市的財源的狀況不一致我當然不敢講說那你可不可以全部全部都你來補助地方很多縣市常常會覺得中央請客地方買單但我不願意這樣子講\n170876\t200245\t但是如果我們可以有一個制度性的討論我覺得對地方一下子要找這個財源你即便說如果是還沒送到預算議會還沒審到預算之後你會補助全年但我覺得如果有機會制度化的處理比如說第一年由我們中央全部來負擔第二年第三年那他們再想辦法去籌措預算來處理我覺得會不會這是一個更好的方式\n200845\t228386\t那個方向可以委員的所講的可以討論我必須說明一下條新的政策是人事總處主管的他的業務主管單位您剛才講的113年我們補助一半是因為我們的政策在他們的那個編預算送到立法院之前就宣布那個所以條50%是額外給他的啦他本來是按照\n229099\t242689\t制度他都都不會給的但是我們額外給他所以所以主計長我說我今天才跟你討論說我們可不可以制度化的處理以後第一年都由中央來負擔那個要要要那個是\n243797\t248580\t主席長我希望這件事情說我今天有個臨時提案我希望這個事情可以做制度化的處理當然\n261488\t289158\t我再次強調我們肯定對軍公教因為原物料上漲通膨的問題所以我們都認為要加薪對軍公教加薪這件事情我們都給予肯定但地方各縣市的財源狀況不一樣我剛才就已經舉例了所以如果第一年有機會中央來負擔全部第二年第三年後面才由地方完全來做負擔我覺得對地方的財政找錢也好我覺得各方面\n290118\t292719\t對地方的財政造成立即性的衝擊對地方來說本來每一個縣市都有既定的預算既定的市政要推動\n320046\t344566\t你臨時12月30號宣布他1月1號他1月1號議會才審完他哪裏來臨時來找錢所以我覺得還是制度化的來處理這件事情我希望主計長來研議這件事情那我也希望任總的那個薪資政策能夠提早宣布謝謝好那這個也是中央的問題好不好主計長第二件事情我關注到前兩天\n346368\t359169\t陳院長在回答科珍委員的時候講到說股票上兩萬點你開不開心主計長股票上兩萬點你開不開心我一點我個人一點都不開心因為我沒有股票\n360278\t377548\t對阿我就查到你的財產申報裡面你的股票才5560塊阿所以那個是已經沒有上市對阿所以院長搞錯了啦股票上兩萬點是少數人開經因為以台灣的股市來說我們將近44%是外資我們的護國神山台積電還有七成也是外資所以\n388915\t402439\t所有的股票好當然好就是說經濟預期也會比較好但是這個利多並不是全民共享的利多主計長我要給你看幾個數字依照我們GDP來說從2012年到2021年蔡英文所講的6.53是我們經濟成長是20年來最好的時刻但是在我們的GDP佔比中我們受雇人員的報酬從2012年的45.8%\n418183\t431355\t降到我們現在2021��二零二一年的四十三趴是歷年來最低這個數字我相信數字你非常清楚代表的意義是臺灣的經濟紅利其實勞工沒有享受到\n432555\t455501\t第一點資方享受到勞工沒有享受到第二個代表的意義是臺灣產業結構出現了很大的問題我們少數贏者圈的收入很高但是大多數的民眾沒有享受到經濟的利益然後再下來我想你非常清楚這幾年我們貧富差距造成12年來的新高然後我們這幾年我們的實質經常\n457402\t473120\t實質經常性的薪資過去這3年都被即便有加薪全部這3年都被吞捧吃掉了再來下一張我們看到我們近5年實質種薪資是倒退的而且是7年來首度的負成長\n474741\t480743\t主計長我也看到齁其實你有講你在去年的10月26號齁你講過一句話貧富差距是過去10年的新高所得分配不均政府的責任最大你現在還是同意這句話嗎跟那個委員報告這個有點斷章起義啦我都所得分配不均政府就要來\n501252\t513040\t主計長我們不要玩文字遊戲政府有最大的我這樣講政府有責任去處理分配貧富分配不足的問題好不好所以\n514020\t542527\t所以我要講的說蔡英文不要老拿經濟20年來最好6.53來自得滿意我們股票上兩萬點你回去你也應該跟院長講說兩萬點齁這時候少數人開心外資開心啦以我來說以你來說我們都沒有玩股票的人我們都不開心你要告訴他這件事情我要怕大家誤解我個人不開心可是我管國家的財政很開心因為證券交易稅增加對不對謝謝\n544188\t555517\t但是主事長那我就要糾正你稅收增加很開心但是人民的經濟人民生活過得好不好才是我們身為政府的最大責任\n556598\t584105\t你同意這句話嗎當然所有大多數的人民過得好不好才是政府最重要的責任所以主計長你應該對於明年的經濟有所預測包括我剛剛講的人民我們實質薪資明年到底會不會再往上跳會不會變成有負轉正或我們總薪資有沒有機會重負轉正我們是說可以那要看那個CPI的成長率阿你都應該要預期阿你是主計長阿對\n585945\t609811\t那個明目薪資一定會成長那要看那個CPI的一個上漲CPI的上漲有時候會有一些不確定因素我知道啦但是你每一年都會預測那你能不能預測明年你評估預測明年因為我不曉得包括我們的經常薪資包括明年的總薪資有沒有機會有負轉勝你不敢講我只能說有50%的機會\n612458\t612938\t朱主計長,你這個是．﹖\n643018\t655725\t我希望你們有去做評估。你們應該有吧?我主計總處沒有。經濟部有沒有,我不曉得。因為CPI明年你應該是財政三長、主計長、財政部部長、經濟部部長應該對這個有所評估。主計長我的時間到了。我覺得這個都是聯動性的問題。明年人民生活過得好不好?\n668251\t668271\t謝謝謝謝好 謝謝\n698191\t702405\t那我們等一下現場委員請等一下黃珊珊委員發言完畢\n","txt":"主計長,這幾年原物料上漲那大家都知道通膨的狀況也越來越嚴重所以我們對於軍公教人員也經歷了三次調薪在過去七年分別有107年的3%、111年的4%還有到今年的4%\n我先感謝主計長這邊大家體恤到軍公教52萬軍公教人員的辛勞那幫工人員加薪我們這個加薪當然也會帶動民間企業後續的加資是我們期待至少在2.4到2.6%中間左右我想這個部分來肯定主計長但是主計長這個加薪固然對全國民間也好軍公教也好是好事\n但是他相對的我們要考量到地方的財源的負擔我肯定這件事情但是地方的財源負擔一定會有的你同意我這樣的說法嗎對同意到那個我們有一個方式如果我們的政策宣布是在那個地方政府預算還沒有送到議會的時候第一年中央政府會協助以後就是由他們編到預算裡面去我們還是採用這個措施\n因為狀況是這樣子從107年到現在我們至少調幅11%左右您剛才講的就是說譬如說今年我們打算加薪4%這個立即就會增加臺北市22億要追加這些預算要去找出這些錢出來\n所以鄭文燦院長才會講說這個中央對地方藝術也會考慮到加薪這一塊你剛才講說如果預算還沒送到議會的話你們就會如果在之後的話你們就會補足全部對\n主席長我知道你會考量到說你突然宣布的話錢不知道從哪裡來所以其實我關注的就因為過去這幾年我們看到107年你們只補助了我們加薪的幅度是3%我們補助5000萬然後111年21億我們百分之百補助113年我們補助50%所以\n就是說對地方來說他當然希望他是一個制度化的處理或者是至少可以預期大家都肯定這件事情但是財源每個縣市的財源的狀況不一致我當然不敢講說那你可不可以全部全部都你來補助地方很多縣市常常會覺得中央請客地方買單但我不願意這樣子講\n但是如果我們可以有一個制度性的討論我覺得對地方一下子要找這個財源你即便說如果是還沒送到預算議會還沒審到預算之後你會補助全年但我覺得如果有機會制度化的處理比如說第一年由我們中央全部來負擔第二年第三年那他們再想辦法去籌措預算來處理我覺得會不會這是一個更好的方式\n那個方向可以委員的所講的可以討論我必須說明一下條新的政策是人事總處主管的他的業務主管單位您剛才講的113年我們補助一半是因為我們的政策在他們的那個編預算送到立法院之前就宣布那個所以條50%是額外給他的啦他本來是按照\n制度他都都不會給的但是我們額外給他所以所以主計長我說我今天才跟你討論說我們可不可以制度化的處理以後第一年都由中央來負擔那個要要要那個是\n主席長我希望這件事情說我今天有個臨時提案我希望這個事情可以做制度化的處理當然\n我再次強調我們肯定對軍公教因為原物料上漲通膨的問題所以我們都認為要加薪對軍公教加薪這件事情我們都給予肯定但地方各縣市的財源狀況不一樣我剛才就已經舉例了所以如果第一年有機會中央來負擔全部第二年第三年後面才由地方完全來做負擔我覺得對地方的財政找錢也好我覺得各方面\n對地方的財政造成立即性的衝擊對地方來說本來每一個縣市都有既定的預算既定的市政要推動\n你臨時12月30號宣布他1月1號他1月1號議會才審完他哪裏來臨時來找錢所以我覺得還是制度化的來處理這件事情我希望主計長來研議這件事情那我也希望任總的那個薪資政策能夠提早宣布謝謝好那這個也是中央的問題好不好主計長第二件事情我關注到前兩天\n陳院長在回答科珍委員的時候講到說股票上兩萬點你開不開心主計長股票上兩萬點你開不開心我一點我個人一點都不開心因為我沒有股票\n對阿我就查到你的財產申報裡面你的股票才5560塊阿所以那個是已經沒有上市對阿所以院長搞錯了啦股票上兩萬點是少數人開經因為以台灣的股市來說我們將近44%是外資我們的護國神山台積電還有七成也是外資所以\n所有的股票好當然好就是說經濟預期也會比較好但是這個利多並不是全民共享的利多主計長我要給你看幾個數字依照我們GDP來說從2012年到2021年蔡英文所講的6.53是我們經濟成長是20年來最好的時刻但是在我們的GDP佔比中我們受雇人員的報酬從2012年的45.8%\n降到我們現在2021��二零二一年的四十三趴是歷年來最低這個數字我相信數字你非常清楚代表的意義是臺灣的經濟紅利其實勞工沒有享受到\n第一點資方享受到勞工沒有享受到第二個代表的意義是臺灣產業結構出現了很大的問題我們少數贏者圈的收入很高但是大多數的民眾沒有享受到經濟的利益然後再下來我想你非常清楚這幾年我們貧富差距造成12年來的新高然後我們這幾年我們的實質經常\n實質經常性的薪資過去這3年都被即便有加薪全部這3年都被吞捧吃掉了再來下一張我們看到我們近5年實質種薪資是倒退的而且是7年來首度的負成長\n主計長我也看到齁其實你有講你在去年的10月26號齁你講過一句話貧富差距是過去10年的新高所得分配不均政府的責任最大你現在還是同意這句話嗎跟那個委員報告這個有點斷章起義啦我都所得分配不均政府就要來\n主計長我們不要玩文字遊戲政府有最大的我這樣講政府有責任去處理分配貧富分配不足的問題好不好所以\n所以我要講的說蔡英文不要老拿經濟20年來最好6.53來自得滿意我們股票上兩萬點你回去你也應該跟院長講說兩萬點齁這時候少數人開心外資開心啦以我來說以你來說我們都沒有玩股票的人我們都不開心你要告訴他這件事情我要怕大家誤解我個人不開心可是我管國家的財政很開心因為證券交易稅增加對不對謝謝\n但是主事長那我就要糾正你稅收增加很開心但是人民的經濟人民生活過得好不好才是我們身為政府的最大責任\n你同意這句話嗎當然所有大多數的人民過得好不好才是政府最重要的責任所以主計長你應該對於明年的經濟有所預測包括我剛剛講的人民我們實質薪資明年到底會不會再往上跳會不會變成有負轉正或我們總薪資有沒有機會重負轉正我們是說可以那要看那個CPI的成長率阿你都應該要預期阿你是主計長阿對\n那個明目薪資一定會成長那要看那個CPI的一個上漲CPI的上漲有時候會有一些不確定因素我知道啦但是你每一年都會預測那你能不能預測明年你評估預測明年因為我不曉得包括我們的經常薪資包括明年的總薪資有沒有機會有負轉勝你不敢講我只能說有50%的機會\n朱主計長,你這個是．﹖\n我希望你們有去做評估。你們應該有吧?我主計總處沒有。經濟部有沒有,我不曉得。因為CPI明年你應該是財政三長、主計長、財政部部長、經濟部部長應該對這個有所評估。主計長我的時間到了。我覺得這個都是聯動性的問題。明年人民生活過得好不好?\n謝謝謝謝好 謝謝\n那我們等一下現場委員請等一下黃珊珊委員發言完畢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:02.530 --> 00:18.994\n主計長,這幾年原物料上漲那大家都知道通膨的狀況也越來越嚴重所以我們對於軍公教人員也經歷了三次調薪在過去七年分別有107年的3%、111年的4%還有到今年的4%\n\n00:25.015 --> 00:53.469\n我先感謝主計長這邊大家體恤到軍公教52萬軍公教人員的辛勞那幫工人員加薪我們這個加薪當然也會帶動民間企業後續的加資是我們期待至少在2.4到2.6%中間左右我想這個部分來肯定主計長但是主計長這個加薪固然對全國民間也好軍公教也好是好事\n\n00:54.449 --> 01:22.840\n但是他相對的我們要考量到地方的財源的負擔我肯定這件事情但是地方的財源負擔一定會有的你同意我這樣的說法嗎對同意到那個我們有一個方式如果我們的政策宣布是在那個地方政府預算還沒有送到議會的時候第一年中央政府會協助以後就是由他們編到預算裡面去我們還是採用這個措施\n\n01:24.181 --> 01:41.146\n因為狀況是這樣子從107年到現在我們至少調幅11%左右您剛才講的就是說譬如說今年我們打算加薪4%這個立即就會增加臺北市22億要追加這些預算要去找出這些錢出來\n\n01:42.847 --> 01:57.108\n所以鄭文燦院長才會講說這個中央對地方藝術也會考慮到加薪這一塊你剛才講說如果預算還沒送到議會的話你們就會如果在之後的話你們就會補足全部對\n\n02:00.050 --> 02:14.176\n主席長我知道你會考量到說你突然宣布的話錢不知道從哪裡來所以其實我關注的就因為過去這幾年我們看到107年你們只補助了我們加薪的幅度是3%我們補助5000萬然後111年21億我們百分之百補助113年我們補助50%所以\n\n02:26.801 --> 02:49.675\n就是說對地方來說他當然希望他是一個制度化的處理或者是至少可以預期大家都肯定這件事情但是財源每個縣市的財源的狀況不一致我當然不敢講說那你可不可以全部全部都你來補助地方很多縣市常常會覺得中央請客地方買單但我不願意這樣子講\n\n02:50.876 --> 03:20.245\n但是如果我們可以有一個制度性的討論我覺得對地方一下子要找這個財源你即便說如果是還沒送到預算議會還沒審到預算之後你會補助全年但我覺得如果有機會制度化的處理比如說第一年由我們中央全部來負擔第二年第三年那他們再想辦法去籌措預算來處理我覺得會不會這是一個更好的方式\n\n03:20.845 --> 03:48.386\n那個方向可以委員的所講的可以討論我必須說明一下條新的政策是人事總處主管的他的業務主管單位您剛才講的113年我們補助一半是因為我們的政策在他們的那個編預算送到立法院之前就宣布那個所以條50%是額外給他的啦他本來是按照\n\n03:49.099 --> 04:02.689\n制度他都都不會給的但是我們額外給他所以所以主計長我說我今天才跟你討論說我們可不可以制度化的處理以後第一年都由中央來負擔那個要要要那個是\n\n04:03.797 --> 04:08.580\n主席長我希望這件事情說我今天有個臨時提案我希望這個事情可以做制度化的處理當然\n\n04:21.488 --> 04:49.158\n我再次強調我們肯定對軍公教因為原物料上漲通膨的問題所以我們都認為要加薪對軍公教加薪這件事情我們都給予肯定但地方各縣市的財源狀況不一樣我剛才就已經舉例了所以如果第一年有機會中央來負擔全部第二年第三年後面才由地方完全來做負擔我覺得對地方的財政找錢也好我覺得各方面\n\n04:50.118 --> 04:52.719\n對地方的財政造成立即性的衝擊對地方來說本來每一個縣市都有既定的預算既定的市政要推動\n\n05:20.046 --> 05:44.566\n你臨時12月30號宣布他1月1號他1月1號議會才審完他哪裏來臨時來找錢所以我覺得還是制度化的來處理這件事情我希望主計長來研議這件事情那我也希望任總的那個薪資政策能夠提早宣布謝謝好那這個也是中央的問題好不好主計長第二件事情我關注到前兩天\n\n05:46.368 --> 05:59.169\n陳院長在回答科珍委員的時候講到說股票上兩萬點你開不開心主計長股票上兩萬點你開不開心我一點我個人一點都不開心因為我沒有股票\n\n06:00.278 --> 06:17.548\n對阿我就查到你的財產申報裡面你的股票才5560塊阿所以那個是已經沒有上市對阿所以院長搞錯了啦股票上兩萬點是少數人開經因為以台灣的股市來說我們將近44%是外資我們的護國神山台積電還有七成也是外資所以\n\n06:28.915 --> 06:42.439\n所有的股票好當然好就是說經濟預期也會比較好但是這個利多並不是全民共享的利多主計長我要給你看幾個數字依照我們GDP來說從2012年到2021年蔡英文所講的6.53是我們經濟成長是20年來最好的時刻但是在我們的GDP佔比中我們受雇人員的報酬從2012年的45.8%\n\n06:58.183 --> 07:11.355\n降到我們現在2021��二零二一年的四十三趴是歷年來最低這個數字我相信數字你非常清楚代表的意義是臺灣的經濟紅利其實勞工沒有享受到\n\n07:12.555 --> 07:35.501\n第一點資方享受到勞工沒有享受到第二個代表的意義是臺灣產業結構出現了很大的問題我們少數贏者圈的收入很高但是大多數的民眾沒有享受到經濟的利益然後再下來我想你非常清楚這幾年我們貧富差距造成12年來的新高然後我們這幾年我們的實質經常\n\n07:37.402 --> 07:53.120\n實質經常性的薪資過去這3年都被即便有加薪全部這3年都被吞捧吃掉了再來下一張我們看到我們近5年實質種薪資是倒退的而且是7年來首度的負成長\n\n07:54.741 --> 08:00.743\n主計長我也看到齁其實你有講你在去年的10月26號齁你講過一句話貧富差距是過去10年的新高所得分配不均政府的責任最大你現在還是同意這句話嗎跟那個委員報告這個有點斷章起義啦我都所得分配不均政府就要來\n\n08:21.252 --> 08:33.040\n主計長我們不要玩文字遊戲政府有最大的我這樣講政府有責任去處理分配貧富分配不足的問題好不好所以\n\n08:34.020 --> 09:02.527\n所以我要講的說蔡英文不要老拿經濟20年來最好6.53來自得滿意我們股票上兩萬點你回去你也應該跟院長講說兩萬點齁這時候少數人開心外資開心啦以我來說以你來說我們都沒有玩股票的人我們都不開心你要告訴他這件事情我要怕大家誤解我個人不開心可是我管國家的財政很開心因為證券交易稅增加對不對謝謝\n\n09:04.188 --> 09:15.517\n但是主事長那我就要糾正你稅收增加很開心但是人民的經濟人民生活過得好不好才是我們身為政府的最大責任\n\n09:16.598 --> 09:44.105\n你同意這句話嗎當然所有大多數的人民過得好不好才是政府最重要的責任所以主計長你應該對於明年的經濟有所預測包括我剛剛講的人民我們實質薪資明年到底會不會再往上跳會不會變成有負轉正或我們總薪資有沒有機會重負轉正我們是說可以那要看那個CPI的成長率阿你都應該要預期阿你是主計長阿對\n\n09:45.945 --> 10:09.811\n那個明目薪資一定會成長那要看那個CPI的一個上漲CPI的上漲有時候會有一些不確定因素我知道啦但是你每一年都會預測那你能不能預測明年你評估預測明年因為我不曉得包括我們的經常薪資包括明年的總薪資有沒有機會有負轉勝你不敢講我只能說有50%的機會\n\n10:12.458 --> 10:12.938\n朱主計長,你這個是．﹖\n\n10:43.018 --> 10:55.725\n我希望你們有去做評估。你們應該有吧?我主計總處沒有。經濟部有沒有,我不曉得。因為CPI明年你應該是財政三長、主計長、財政部部長、經濟部部長應該對這個有所評估。主計長我的時間到了。我覺得這個都是聯動性的問題。明年人民生活過得好不好?\n\n11:08.251 --> 11:08.271\n謝謝謝謝好謝謝\n\n11:38.191 --> 11:42.405\n那我們等一下現場委員請等一下黃珊珊委員發言完畢\n\n","segments":[{"start":2.53,"end":18.994,"text":"主計長,這幾年原物料上漲那大家都知道通膨的狀況也越來越嚴重所以我們對於軍公教人員也經歷了三次調薪在過去七年分別有107年的3%、111年的4%還有到今年的4%"},{"start":25.015,"end":53.469,"text":"我先感謝主計長這邊大家體恤到軍公教52萬軍公教人員的辛勞那幫工人員加薪我們這個加薪當然也會帶動民間企業後續的加資是我們期待至少在2.4到2.6%中間左右我想這個部分來肯定主計長但是主計長這個加薪固然對全國民間也好軍公教也好是好事"},{"start":54.449,"end":82.84,"text":"但是他相對的我們要考量到地方的財源的負擔我肯定這件事情但是地方的財源負擔一定會有的你同意我這樣的說法嗎對同意到那個我們有一個方式如果我們的政策宣布是在那個地方政府預算還沒有送到議會的時候第一年中央政府會協助以後就是由他們編到預算裡面去我們還是採用這個措施"},{"start":84.181,"end":101.146,"text":"因為狀況是這樣子從107年到現在我們至少調幅11%左右您剛才講的就是說譬如說今年我們打算加薪4%這個立即就會增加臺北市22億要追加這些預算要去找出這些錢出來"},{"start":102.847,"end":117.108,"text":"所以鄭文燦院長才會講說這個中央對地方藝術也會考慮到加薪這一塊你剛才講說如果預算還沒送到議會的話你們就會如果在之後的話你們就會補足全部對"},{"start":120.05,"end":134.176,"text":"主席長我知道你會考量到說你突然宣布的話錢不知道從哪裡來所以其實我關注的就因為過去這幾年我們看到107年你們只補助了我們加薪的幅度是3%我們補助5000萬然後111年21億我們百分之百補助113年我們補助50%所以"},{"start":146.801,"end":169.675,"text":"就是說對地方來說他當然希望他是一個制度化的處理或者是至少可以預期大家都肯定這件事情但是財源每個縣市的財源的狀況不一致我當然不敢講說那你可不可以全部全部都你來補助地方很多縣市常常會覺得中央請客地方買單但我不願意這樣子講"},{"start":170.876,"end":200.245,"text":"但是如果我們可以有一個制度性的討論我覺得對地方一下子要找這個財源你即便說如果是還沒送到預算議會還沒審到預算之後你會補助全年但我覺得如果有機會制度化的處理比如說第一年由我們中央全部來負擔第二年第三年那他們再想辦法去籌措預算來處理我覺得會不會這是一個更好的方式"},{"start":200.845,"end":228.386,"text":"那個方向可以委員的所講的可以討論我必須說明一下條新的政策是人事總處主管的他的業務主管單位您剛才講的113年我們補助一半是因為我們的政策在他們的那個編預算送到立法院之前就宣布那個所以條50%是額外給他的啦他本來是按照"},{"start":229.099,"end":242.689,"text":"制度他都都不會給的但是我們額外給他所以所以主計長我說我今天才跟你討論說我們可不可以制度化的處理以後第一年都由中央來負擔那個要要要那個是"},{"start":243.797,"end":248.58,"text":"主席長我希望這件事情說我今天有個臨時提案我希望這個事情可以做制度化的處理當然"},{"start":261.488,"end":289.158,"text":"我再次強調我們肯定對軍公教因為原物料上漲通膨的問題所以我們都認為要加薪對軍公教加薪這件事情我們都給予肯定但地方各縣市的財源狀況不一樣我剛才就已經舉例了所以如果第一年有機會中央來負擔全部第二年第三年後面才由地方完全來做負擔我覺得對地方的財政找錢也好我覺得各方面"},{"start":290.118,"end":292.719,"text":"對地方的財政造成立即性的衝擊對地方來說本來每一個縣市都有既定的預算既定的市政要推動"},{"start":320.046,"end":344.566,"text":"你臨時12月30號宣布他1月1號他1月1號議會才審完他哪裏來臨時來找錢所以我覺得還是制度化的來處理這件事情我希望主計長來研議這件事情那我也希望任總的那個薪資政策能夠提早宣布謝謝好那這個也是中央的問題好不好主計長第二件事情我關注到前兩天"},{"start":346.368,"end":359.169,"text":"陳院長在回答科珍委員的時候講到說股票上兩萬點你開不開心主計長股票上兩萬點你開不開心我一點我個人一點都不開心因為我沒有股票"},{"start":360.278,"end":377.548,"text":"對阿我就查到你的財產申報裡面你的股票才5560塊阿所以那個是已經沒有上市對阿所以院長搞錯了啦股票上兩萬點是少數人開經因為以台灣的股市來說我們將近44%是外資我們的護國神山台積電還有七成也是外資所以"},{"start":388.915,"end":402.439,"text":"所有的股票好當然好就是說經濟預期也會比較好但是這個利多並不是全民共享的利多主計長我要給你看幾個數字依照我們GDP來說從2012年到2021年蔡英文所講的6.53是我們經濟成長是20年來最好的時刻但是在我們的GDP佔比中我們受雇人員的報酬從2012年的45.8%"},{"start":418.183,"end":431.355,"text":"降到我們現在2021��二零二一年的四十三趴是歷年來最低這個數字我相信數字你非常清楚代表的意義是臺灣的經濟紅利其實勞工沒有享受到"},{"start":432.555,"end":455.501,"text":"第一點資方享受到勞工沒有享受到第二個代表的意義是臺灣產業結構出現了很大的問題我們少數贏者圈的收入很高但是大多數的民眾沒有享受到經濟的利益然後再下來我想你非常清楚這幾年我們貧富差距造成12年來的新高然後我們這幾年我們的實質經常"},{"start":457.402,"end":473.12,"text":"實質經常性的薪資過去這3年都被即便有加薪全部這3年都被吞捧吃掉了再來下一張我們看到我們近5年實質種薪資是倒退的而且是7年來首度的負成長"},{"start":474.741,"end":480.743,"text":"主計長我也看到齁其實你有講你在去年的10月26號齁你講過一句話貧富差距是過去10年的新高所得分配不均政府的責任最大你現在還是同意這句話嗎跟那個委員報告這個有點斷章起義啦我都所得分配不均政府就要來"},{"start":501.252,"end":513.04,"text":"主計長我們不要玩文字遊戲政府有最大的我這樣講政府有責任去處理分配貧富分配不足的問題好不好所以"},{"start":514.02,"end":542.527,"text":"所以我要講的說蔡英文不要老拿經濟20年來最好6.53來自得滿意我們股票上兩萬點你回去你也應該跟院長講說兩萬點齁這時候少數人開心外資開心啦以我來說以你來說我們都沒有玩股票的人我們都不開心你要告訴他這件事情我要怕大家誤解我個人不開心可是我管國家的財政很開心因為證券交易稅增加對不對謝謝"},{"start":544.188,"end":555.517,"text":"但是主事長那我就要糾正你稅收增加很開心但是人民的經濟人民生活過得好不好才是我們身為政府的最大責任"},{"start":556.598,"end":584.105,"text":"你同意這句話嗎當然所有大多數的人民過得好不好才是政府最重要的責任所以主計長你應該對於明年的經濟有所預測包括我剛剛講的人民我們實質薪資明年到底會不會再往上跳會不會變成有負轉正或我們總薪資有沒有機會重負轉正我們是說可以那要看那個CPI的成長率阿你都應該要預期阿你是主計長阿對"},{"start":585.945,"end":609.811,"text":"那個明目薪資一定會成長那要看那個CPI的一個上漲CPI的上漲有時候會有一些不確定因素我知道啦但是你每一年都會預測那你能不能預測明年你評估預測明年因為我不曉得包括我們的經常薪資包括明年的總薪資有沒有機會有負轉勝你不敢講我只能說有50%的機會"},{"start":612.458,"end":612.938,"text":"朱主計長,你這個是．﹖"},{"start":643.018,"end":655.725,"text":"我希望你們有去做評估。你們應該有吧?我主計總處沒有。經濟部有沒有,我不曉得。因為CPI明年你應該是財政三長、主計長、財政部部長、經濟部部長應該對這個有所評估。主計長我的時間到了。我覺得這個都是聯動性的問題。明年人民生活過得好不好?"},{"start":668.251,"end":668.271,"text":"謝謝謝謝好 謝謝"},{"start":698.191,"end":702.405,"text":"那我們等一下現場委員請等一下黃珊珊委員發言完畢"}]}}}}