{"id":149788,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149788","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/7ed54bd69a3b69032566c72610322dc133e530803e447454f8ba9b0039caa7a6856507347698b5fa5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳超明","委員發言時間":"11:13:39 - 11:24:32","影片長度":"00:10:53","會議時間":"2024-03-13T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第3次全體委員會議（事由：邀請經濟部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。【3月11日、13日及14日三天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第3次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":3,"committees":[19],"id":"委員會-11-1-19-3"},"date":"2024-03-13","duration":653,"end_time":"2024-03-13T11:24:32+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-13T11:13:39+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":611,"blocks":[["陳委員超明：（11時13分）主席好。首先有請王部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["王部長美花：委員好。"],["陳委員超明：王部長好。我常常下鄉，也常常碰到一些困擾的問題，就是無自來水地區自來水延管的工程，這裡面牽涉到水利署和自來水公司。現在全國自來水的普及率達到95%，但是你們要求的標準是每一戶的施工成本要在60萬以下，審查標準是60萬以下才可以，以上不可以。我覺得臺灣大家都一樣繳稅，尤其現在已經普及到95%，沒有裝自來水的地區就是偏遠地區，也是比較落後的地區，其實這是水資源涵養最重要的地區，他們那邊的人要裝自來水卻遇到這個60萬的標準而沒辦法裝。我覺得政府對民生的照顧應該是一樣的，他們是提供水源讓都市人有自來水可用的地方，自己竟然沒辦法裝自來水！所以好幾年來我一直在拜託、要求，大概只要再花百來億，臺灣自來水的普及率還會更高。我覺得這個非常重要，所以我今天特別來這邊拜託，多一點經費、資源給我們的水利署和自來水公司，讓無自來水地區能慢慢地一直把自來水普及率提高上來。你讓我拜託一下，你關係很好，到行政院會拿到很多經費，這樣有困難嗎？"],["王部長美花：跟委員報告，我個人也覺得這個事情要用更好的想像，所以有兩個方向，一個是水利署這邊去把60萬的金額提高，但是也跟委員講，有一些地方因為它很散，需要的經費真的遠遠高出60萬甚至80萬，我請署長去想一些聰明的方法，譬如說有沒有一些淨水設施，因為我們大旱的時候有一些廠商已經會做淨水設施，有沒有可能以這些淨水設施就近協助？這個經費相對也比較可行，可以讓更多的戶數來做。他們現在正在評估技術的部分、可行性的部分和經費的部分，我覺得這個說不定可以更加快來解決偏遠地區無自來水的問題。"],["陳委員超明：這個方式我贊成，因為我以前就提出了，要用科技方法來解決偏遠地區的問題，在那邊把淨水、濾水的功能做好，打地下水出來給他們，但是已經講了三、四年，四、五年了啦！早期我接觸過淨水、濾水，大概瞭解這些。要怎麼做可以節省很多成本？我也很希望你們趕快這樣去做，好不好？"],["王部長美花：是、是。"],["陳委員超明：賴署長，看著我，我以前跟你討論過了，還有自來水公司這邊也加強一下啦！不然我到地方上，大家天天都在追我，說：我們沒有自來水啦！他們有，我們怎麼沒有？我們很痛苦耶！"],["賴署長建信：有關委員建議的方向，部長在今年1月初的時候就找我們朝這個方向……"],["陳委員超明：好、好、好，我提出的建議總算被認同了，要好好做，我會盯緊。"],["王部長美花：謝謝委員。"],["陳委員超明：因為現在科技很發達。"],["王部長美花：對。"],["陳委員超明：接下來，大家都在討論電價上漲的問題，可是不曉得幅度是多少。我查了一下，我看你上漲電價留給國民黨執政來做好了，馬英九執政的時間一共漲了40.65%，蔡英文當總統是22.4%，你說你們慢慢漲，叫做「消波塊式」防止通貨膨脹，喔！好會取名字喔！這樣查起來好像沒多少。這一次電價大概要漲百分之幾？工業用電、特高壓用電、大戶用電，你跟我講一下我就知道了。"],["王部長美花：目前他們工作小組其實正在就各種方向進行討論，目前還沒有定案，這是真的。"],["陳委員超明：你這個部長真的很會做啦，還沒漲價以前就把這個漲價消息放出去，大家都以為會漲得很高，其實你在試水溫。所以從這個比例可以看出來，並不是國民黨執政時代漲價。你們以前都罵國民黨執政漲價，我看等國民黨執政再來給它漲。繼續凍漲就會繼續執政！你的看法怎麼樣？要不要漲？"],["王部長美花：沒有，所以這個……"],["陳委員超明：啊，都是兩套標準啦！"],["王部長美花：台電要穩健經營，它是很重要的。"],["陳委員超明：兩套標準！","接下來有一個問題可能會很嚴重：未來會不會缺電？"],["王部長美花：不會啦！我們非常努力在做這個事情。"],["陳委員超明：好、好、好，很有自信。"],["王部長美花：是。"],["陳委員超明：我看到世界最有錢的人──特斯拉執行長馬斯克說，現在是缺晶片，未來是缺電。AI的這些晶片是吃電的怪獸，你覺得不重要嗎？人家說以後不是缺晶片就是缺電，你要怎麼應付這個問題？你們有沒有去考慮？這可能是一個消息，但是也代表一個警訊。你們有準備嗎？"],["王部長美花：他這個AI講的……"],["陳委員超明：這份資料要不要給你們看？"],["王部長美花：這是兩個部分，因為目前在AI訓練的部分確實都是美國這幾家大公司，他們在訓練階段真的是用非常多的電。"],["陳委員超明：訓練的話大概不用什麼電，你不要把我偏離主題，因為AI……"],["王部長美花：沒有、沒有，是……"],["陳委員超明：因為AI是生產的電才吃得大。"],["王部長美花：是那個時候的用電最大，那個時候……"],["陳委員超明：訓練的時候用電最大？"],["王部長美花：對。在弄成一個AI模型的時候，用電量非常大，所以他們提到的是，這個部分的用電真的是吃電怪獸，後續的應用相對比較小。"],["陳委員超明：好，這一點我學習到了，原來是那個時候用電最大，我要去瞭解一下。"],["王部長美花：是。"],["陳委員超明：我看了幾個工業會、工商總會還是工業總會提出的產業報告，幾乎六大工業總會都希望核能電廠能延役。新國會準備要解套這個問題，而執政黨是把反核當做神主牌，你的看法是要不要延役？"],["王部長美花：跟委員報告……"],["陳委員超明：你要跟我講實際的喔！你在這裡不要不好意思說，只在為你們的政策辯護，現在要面對我們現實面臨的實際問題，有沒有希望延役？"],["王部長美花：第一個，當然在這裡面委員有一些針對延役的提案，但是這個法律的提案，我們尊重委員。"],["陳委員超明：國會除了男人不能生孩子這點不能改變以外，其他都可以改變，你們也常常在改變！你要不要？"],["王部長美花：事實上核電有幾個面向，我的報告也有提到，一個是法律面，最重要的是核能安全，這要由核安會來審查。"],["陳委員超明：只要二、三廠都沒有意外，我們……"],["王部長美花：還有核廢料的問題。"],["陳委員超明：我現在只問你如果缺電的話，要不要延役啦！你跟我講句比較實在的話啦！我看你左右為難。"],["王部長美花：這個是兩件事，我們……"],["陳委員超明：不是兩件事情，我問的是一件事情，你要如何解決？你跟我……"],["王部長美花：我們對電力的供給目前都有非常多……"],["陳委員超明：你們有沒有要支持核電廠延役？我只問這個重心點的問題。"],["王部長美花：核電廠延役其實第一個問題就是安全的問題，第二個是社會大家要有……"],["陳委員超明：如果安全有問題呢？"],["王部長美花：大家要有共識。"],["陳委員超明：大家如果有共識了，你們會不會反對？"],["王部長美花：這些大前提如果都能夠解決，那當然是一個……"],["陳委員超明：所以表示有共識，你們不反對……"],["王部長美花：社會上要有共識……"],["陳委員超明：那核電的神主牌就要被打破了，對不對？"],["王部長美花：我有講，其實核電主要是安全的問題。"],["陳委員超明：我曉得你很難為地回答。現在兩年了，幾十年把國家投資的核電廠將近5,000億，你們也把它擺在那邊、把它報廢掉，現在也來延役、要怎麼樣，總經理，你要不要回答一下？還是能源局局長來回答？我看到你們碰到核電廠要不要延役都閃來閃去。總經理，那兩個核電廠一年幫你們賺400億，你要怎麼去解決這個問題？"],["王總經理耀庭：核電廠延役誠如剛才部長講的，它是個安全問題，這些都必須要先克服……"],["陳委員超明：難怪你會繼續當總經理，你也很優秀。我跟你講，你要表示態度，萬一缺電、萬一需要核電廠，你不要說在野黨把這個打破……以前你們從來就是反對核能發電，核能發電都綠能，這裡面5個公會的理事長都一直要求考慮核電廠要不要延役、能把電費降低一下。你們現在遇到這個問題都不敢講，國民黨笨笨的，最大的在野黨笨笨的，要幫你們擦屁股，要看你們的態度，如果你們不敢講支持核電廠延役，我想就不要給它通過最好，也保持了你們民進黨執政的獨立性。要還是不要就看你們怎麼講，不要閃來閃去，因為我相信核電廠不延役，缺電的情形會滿嚴重，不要翻來覆去，私底下我都有去探聽過，台電苦不堪言。主席站起來了，我要下台了，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝陳超明委員。","接下來我們請賴瑞隆委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":168,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-19-3","speakers":["邱議瑩","林岱樺","謝衣鳯","張啓楷","楊瓊瓔","陳亭妃","鄭天財Sra 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00:01:45,944\n我覺得這個要照顧民生都要一樣,還是給你提供水源的地方竟然裝不到自來水,讓你這裡多錢人都在用所以我好幾年我一直在拜託要求,大概再開8個月台灣的自來水大概普及率就會很高我覺得這個非常重要,所以我今天來這邊特別拜託多一點經費\n\n5\n00:01:47,825 --> 00:02:04,357\n支援給我們的水利市給我們的自來水公司讓這個自來水地區能馬上把它慢慢的一直把自來水的普及率普及出來你好好拜託你關係很好到行政院會拿到很多的獎勵這樣有困難嗎?\n\n6\n00:02:06,318 --> 00:02:08,842\n跟委員報告因為我個人也覺得這個事情要用更好的想像所以兩個方向一個就是水利署這邊也去把這個60萬的部分拉高來提高這個門檻\n\n7\n00:02:21,138 --> 00:02:25,920\n但是也跟委員講有一些地方因為他很善他要的經費真的遠遠高出60萬甚至80萬那我請署長說去想一些聰明的方法比如說有沒有一些淨水設施因為我們大旱的時候有一些廠商已經會做淨水設施那有沒有可能這些淨水設施就近那這個經費相對也比較可惜那可以讓更多的戶數來做那他們現在正在評估\n\n8\n00:02:49,927 --> 00:03:05,530\n技術的部分可行性的部分經費的部分我覺得這個是不是可以更加快來解決這個偏遠地區的無自來水的問題這個方式我贊成是因為我以前就提出了要用科技方法來解決偏遠的地區\n\n9\n00:03:06,651 --> 00:03:26,382\n在那邊你淨水、瀝水的功能做好打地下水出來給他們但是已經講了3、4年、4、5年了這個早期我沒過淨水、瀝水我大概了解這些我們要怎麼來做可以省了很多的成本所以希望您趕快這樣子去做好不好\n\n10\n00:03:27,807 --> 00:03:30,888\n委員建議的方向,部長在今年的1月初的時候就找我們朝這個方向\n\n11\n00:03:51,896 --> 00:03:57,424\n總算我最後提出的爭議被認同了要好好做我會盯得緊因為現在這個科技也很發達請回座\n\n12\n00:04:03,588 --> 00:04:14,417\n大家都討論電價的上漲大家也不曉得幅度有多少我查了一下我看你這個上漲電價留給國民黨來執政馬英九執政的時間一共漲了40.65%蔡英文當總統的話\n\n13\n00:04:23,584 --> 00:04:43,793\n是22.4%啊你說你們慢慢漲叫做消波制防止我們的通貨膨脹喔命很高企的實在這樣快點炒到沒法去休一次你大概漲現在要漲幾%工業用電高鐵要用電大副用電你告訴我我就知道了\n\n14\n00:04:44,591 --> 00:05:00,823\n目前他們工作相組其實正在就各種的方向正在討論目前還沒有定案是真的還沒漲價疫情就把這個漲價消息放出去大家都以為漲得很高你在試水文\n\n15\n00:05:01,804 --> 00:05:13,230\n所以這個比例可以看出來不是國民黨時代長假你們以前都罵國民黨長假我看國民黨執政再來給他長繼續動長就會繼續執政你看法怎麼樣?要不要長?兩套的標準再來有一個問題可能會很嚴重未來會不會缺電?\n\n16\n00:05:32,247 --> 00:06:01,110\n不會啦,我們非常努力在做這個事情很有自信現在我看了一個那個特斯拉的執行長叫做馬斯克世界最有錢的人他說現在是缺晶片未來是缺電晶片的話AAI的這些晶片是吃電的怪獸你覺得沒重要人家是幾十年以後不是缺晶片就是缺電啦\n\n17\n00:06:02,210 --> 00:06:08,870\n你怎麼來應付這個問題?你們有沒有去考慮?這個可能是一個消息但是也是代表著一個警訊\n\n18\n00:06:10,816 --> 00:06:35,530\n你有準備吧?那個資料我要給你們看吧?因為現在目前在這個AI訓練的部分確實都是美國這幾個大公司那他們這個在訓練階段真的是用非常多的電訓練的話是大概不用什麼你不要把我騙你死體因為AI你生產的電才要吃得到沒有沒有是那個時候的用電最大\n\n19\n00:06:36,070 --> 00:06:37,231\n我看了我們幾個工業會工商總會還是工業總會提出的一個產業報告裡面\n\n20\n00:07:04,501 --> 00:07:20,529\n幾乎六大工業總會都希望核能、核能產能延運那新國會準備要解套這個問題阿民執政黨是把核能當作行之百你的看法要不要延運?\n\n21\n00:07:22,451 --> 00:07:24,352\n你要告訴我一件事嗎?\n\n22\n00:07:24,352 --> 00:07:25,292\n這個可能要不要研議?\n\n23\n00:07:25,292 --> 00:07:36,320\n你不是在這裡排斥共和為了你們政策辯論現在是對著我們現實面臨的實際的問題有沒有希望、原因?\n\n24\n00:07:37,211 --> 00:07:56,995\n第一個當然在這個裡面委員有一些對演繹的提案但是這個法律的提案你法律的提案什麼不是國會裡面就是說不會把男的不能生孩子這個不能改變的話其他都可以改變你們也常常在改變你要不要\n\n25\n00:07:58,421 --> 00:08:09,831\n市商核電就幾個面向所以我報告也有提到一個是法律面最重要是核能安全那要有核安會來審討還有核廢電的問題我現在只問你如果缺電的話要不要研議啦你給我說一下才知道啦\n\n26\n00:08:16,917 --> 00:08:30,084\n我看你左右為難這個是兩兩兩件事然後我們我們問的是一件事情你要熱解我們對電力的攻擊齁目前都有沒有要支持核電廠研議我只問了重心點的問題\n\n27\n00:08:31,431 --> 00:08:50,138\n核電廠研議其實第一個問題就是安全的問題第二個是大家要有共識阿大家如果有共識的你們會不會反對這些的大前提如果都能夠解決那當然是一個所以表示有共識你們不反對了那核電的繩子牌就要被打破了對不對\n\n28\n00:08:51,594 --> 00:09:14,546\n我有講喔,其實核電一定要是安全的問題很難為的回答你現在現在兩年幾十年把國家投資的核電廠將近5000億你們也把它擺在那邊把它報廢掉好,現在原來演藝要怎麼樣總經理你要不要回答一下還是能演幾場我看到你們碰到核電廠要不會演藝都閃來閃去啊\n\n29\n00:09:18,986 --> 00:09:39,798\n總經理那個兩個核電廠一年幫你們賺400億喔你要怎麼去解決這個問題核電廠原理純如剛才部長講的它是一個安全問題這些都必須要先克服難怪你會繼續當總經理你也很優秀我跟你講表示態度\n\n30\n00:09:41,170 --> 00:10:03,070\n萬一缺電萬一需要核能廠你不要說那個在野黨把這個打破以前你們從來就是反對核能發電核能發電都利冷這裡面五個工會的理事長都一直要求考慮核電廠要不要延運能把定位降低一下\n\n31\n00:10:04,451 --> 00:10:18,840\n你們現在出了這個問題都不跟我說,要國民黨往往,最大的在野黨往往,要趕你們擦屁股,要看你們態度。如果你們不敢講說支持核電廠研議,我相信不要給他通過最好。\n\n32\n00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:22,963\n會保持人民進黨執政的獨立性。\n\n33\n00:10:50,780 --> 00:10:51,285\n謝謝陳超明委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n10048\t36218\t主席好首先有請王部長來請部長王部長好常常下鄉常常碰到一些困擾的問題就是無自來水地區自來水源管的工程這裡面就牽涉到水利跟自來水公司\n37366\t58095\t但是現在全國自來水的普及率達到95%但是你們邀請了一個標準就是每一戶的要有60萬的施工成本審查的標準是以60萬以下才可以,以上不可以我認為台灣我們的稿稅都很寬\n60876\t75452\t尤其現在普及到95%沒有裝自來水的地區﹐我們叫做偏遠的地區﹐也比較落後的地區﹐即使這個是水資源含有最重要的地區﹐他們要裝自來水都這樣補了這60萬、50萬人\n80237\t105944\t我覺得這個要照顧民生都要一樣,還是給你提供水源的地方竟然裝不到自來水,讓你這裡多錢人都在用所以我好幾年我一直在拜託要求,大概再開8個月台灣的自來水大概普及率就會很高我覺得這個非常重要,所以我今天來這邊特別拜託多一點經費\n107825\t124357\t支援給我們的水利市給我們的自來水公司讓這個自來水地區能馬上把它慢慢的一直把自來水的普及率普及出來你好好拜託你關係很好到行政院會拿到很多的獎勵這樣有困難嗎?\n126318\t128842\t跟委員報告因為我個人也覺得這個事情要用更好的想像所以兩個方向一個就是水利署這邊也去把這個60萬的部分拉高來提高這個門檻\n141138\t145920\t但是也跟委員講有一些地方因為他很善他要的經費真的遠遠高出60萬甚至80萬那我請署長說去想一些聰明的方法比如說有沒有一些淨水設施因為我們大旱的時候有一些廠商已經會做淨水設施那有沒有可能這些淨水設施就近那這個經費相對也比較可惜那可以讓更多的戶數來做那他們現在正在評估\n169927\t185530\t技術的部分可行性的部分經費的部分我覺得這個是不是可以更加快來解決這個偏遠地區的無自來水的問題這個方式我贊成是因為我以前就提出了要用科技方法來解決偏遠的地區\n186651\t206382\t在那邊你淨水、瀝水的功能做好打地下水出來給他們但是已經講了3、4年、4、5年了這個早期我沒過淨水、瀝水我大概了解這些我們要怎麼來做可以省了很多的成本所以希望您趕快這樣子去做好不好\n207807\t210888\t委員建議的方向,部長在今年的1月初的時候就找我們朝這個方向\n231896\t237424\t總算我最後提出的爭議被認同了要好好做我會盯得緊因為現在這個科技也很發達請回座\n243588\t254417\t大家都討論電價的上漲大家也不曉得幅度有多少我查了一下我看你這個上漲電價留給國民黨來執政馬英九執政的時間一共漲了40.65%蔡英文當總統的話\n263584\t283793\t是22.4% 啊你說你們慢慢漲叫做消波制防止我們的通貨膨脹 喔 命很高企的 實在 這樣快點炒到沒法去 休一次你大概漲現在要漲幾% 工業用電 高鐵要用電 大副用電 你告訴我我就知道了\n284591\t300823\t目前他們工作相組其實正在就各種的方向正在討論目前還沒有定案是真的還沒漲價疫情就把這個漲價消息放出去大家都以為漲得很高你在試水文\n301804\t313230\t所以這個比例可以看出來不是國民黨時代長假你們以前都罵國民黨長假我看國民黨執政再來給他長繼續動長就會繼續執政你看法怎麼樣?要不要長?兩套的標準再來有一個問題可能會很嚴重未來會不會缺電?\n332247\t361110\t不會啦,我們非常努力在做這個事情很有自信現在我看了一個那個特斯拉的執行長叫做馬斯克世界最有錢的人他說現在是缺晶片未來是缺電晶片的話AAI的這些晶片是吃電的怪獸你覺得沒重要人家是幾十年以後不是缺晶片就是缺電啦\n362210\t368870\t你怎麼來應付這個問題?你們有沒有去考慮?這個可能是一個消息但是也是代表著一個警訊\n370816\t395530\t你有準備吧?那個資料我要給你們看吧?因為現在目前在這個AI訓練的部分確實都是美國這幾個大公司那他們這個在訓練階段真的是用非常多的電訓練的話是大概不用什麼你不要把我騙你死體因為AI你生產的電才要吃得到沒有沒有是那個時候的用電最大\n396070\t397231\t我看了我們幾個工業會工商總會還是工業總會提出的一個產業報告裡面\n424501\t440529\t幾乎六大工業總會都希望核能、核能產能延運那新國會準備要解套這個問題阿民執政黨是把核能當作行之百你的看法要不要延運?\n442451\t444352\t你要告訴我一件事嗎?\n444352\t445292\t這個可能要不要研議?\n445292\t456320\t你不是在這裡排斥共和為了你們政策辯論 現在是對著我們現實面臨的實際的問題 有沒有希望、原因?\n457211\t476995\t第一個當然在這個裡面委員有一些對演繹的提案但是這個法律的提案你法律的提案什麼不是國會裡面就是說不會把男的不能生孩子這個不能改變的話其他都可以改變你們也常常在改變你要不要\n478421\t489831\t市商核電就幾個面向所以我報告也有提到一個是法律面最重要是核能安全那要有核安會來審討還有核廢電的問題我現在只問你如果缺電的話要不要研議啦你給我說一下才知道啦\n496917\t510084\t我看你左右為難這個是兩兩兩件事然後我們我們問的是一件事情你要熱解我們對電力的攻擊齁目前都有沒有要支持核電廠研議我只問了重心點的問題\n511431\t530138\t核電廠研議其實第一個問題就是安全的問題第二個是大家要有共識阿大家如果有共識的你們會不會反對這些的大前提如果都能夠解決那當然是一個所以表示有共識你們不反對了那核電的繩子牌就要被打破了對不對\n531594\t554546\t我有講喔,其實核電一定要是安全的問題很難為的回答你現在現在兩年幾十年把國家投資的核電廠將近5000億你們也把它擺在那邊把它報廢掉好,現在原來演藝要怎麼樣總經理你要不要回答一下還是能演幾場我看到你們碰到核電廠要不會演藝都閃來閃去啊\n558986\t579798\t總經理 那個兩個核電廠一年幫你們賺400億喔你要怎麼去解決這個問題核電廠原理 純如剛才部長講的 它是一個安全問題 這些都必須要先克服難怪你會繼續當總經理 你也很優秀我跟你講 表示態度\n581170\t603070\t萬一缺電萬一需要核能廠你不要說那個在野黨把這個打破以前你們從來就是反對核能發電核能發電都利冷這裡面五個工會的理事長都一直要求考慮核電廠要不要延運能把定位降低一下\n604451\t618840\t你們現在出了這個問題都不跟我說,要國民黨往往,最大的在野黨往往,要趕你們擦屁股,要看你們態度。如果你們不敢講說支持核電廠研議,我相信不要給他通過最好。\n620320\t622963\t會保持人民進黨執政的獨立性。\n650780\t651285\t謝謝陳超明委員\n","txt":"主席好首先有請王部長來請部長王部長好常常下鄉常常碰到一些困擾的問題就是無自來水地區自來水源管的工程這裡面就牽涉到水利跟自來水公司\n但是現在全國自來水的普及率達到95%但是你們邀請了一個標準就是每一戶的要有60萬的施工成本審查的標準是以60萬以下才可以,以上不可以我認為台灣我們的稿稅都很寬\n尤其現在普及到95%沒有裝自來水的地區﹐我們叫做偏遠的地區﹐也比較落後的地區﹐即使這個是水資源含有最重要的地區﹐他們要裝自來水都這樣補了這60萬、50萬人\n我覺得這個要照顧民生都要一樣,還是給你提供水源的地方竟然裝不到自來水,讓你這裡多錢人都在用所以我好幾年我一直在拜託要求,大概再開8個月台灣的自來水大概普及率就會很高我覺得這個非常重要,所以我今天來這邊特別拜託多一點經費\n支援給我們的水利市給我們的自來水公司讓這個自來水地區能馬上把它慢慢的一直把自來水的普及率普及出來你好好拜託你關係很好到行政院會拿到很多的獎勵這樣有困難嗎?\n跟委員報告因為我個人也覺得這個事情要用更好的想像所以兩個方向一個就是水利署這邊也去把這個60萬的部分拉高來提高這個門檻\n但是也跟委員講有一些地方因為他很善他要的經費真的遠遠高出60萬甚至80萬那我請署長說去想一些聰明的方法比如說有沒有一些淨水設施因為我們大旱的時候有一些廠商已經會做淨水設施那有沒有可能這些淨水設施就近那這個經費相對也比較可惜那可以讓更多的戶數來做那他們現在正在評估\n技術的部分可行性的部分經費的部分我覺得這個是不是可以更加快來解決這個偏遠地區的無自來水的問題這個方式我贊成是因為我以前就提出了要用科技方法來解決偏遠的地區\n在那邊你淨水、瀝水的功能做好打地下水出來給他們但是已經講了3、4年、4、5年了這個早期我沒過淨水、瀝水我大概了解這些我們要怎麼來做可以省了很多的成本所以希望您趕快這樣子去做好不好\n委員建議的方向,部長在今年的1月初的時候就找我們朝這個方向\n總算我最後提出的爭議被認同了要好好做我會盯得緊因為現在這個科技也很發達請回座\n大家都討論電價的上漲大家也不曉得幅度有多少我查了一下我看你這個上漲電價留給國民黨來執政馬英九執政的時間一共漲了40.65%蔡英文當總統的話\n是22.4% 啊你說你們慢慢漲叫做消波制防止我們的通貨膨脹 喔 命很高企的 實在 這樣快點炒到沒法去 休一次你大概漲現在要漲幾% 工業用電 高鐵要用電 大副用電 你告訴我我就知道了\n目前他們工作相組其實正在就各種的方向正在討論目前還沒有定案是真的還沒漲價疫情就把這個漲價消息放出去大家都以為漲得很高你在試水文\n所以這個比例可以看出來不是國民黨時代長假你們以前都罵國民黨長假我看國民黨執政再來給他長繼續動長就會繼續執政你看法怎麼樣?要不要長?兩套的標準再來有一個問題可能會很嚴重未來會不會缺電?\n不會啦,我們非常努力在做這個事情很有自信現在我看了一個那個特斯拉的執行長叫做馬斯克世界最有錢的人他說現在是缺晶片未來是缺電晶片的話AAI的這些晶片是吃電的怪獸你覺得沒重要人家是幾十年以後不是缺晶片就是缺電啦\n你怎麼來應付這個問題?你們有沒有去考慮?這個可能是一個消息但是也是代表著一個警訊\n你有準備吧?那個資料我要給你們看吧?因為現在目前在這個AI訓練的部分確實都是美國這幾個大公司那他們這個在訓練階段真的是用非常多的電訓練的話是大概不用什麼你不要把我騙你死體因為AI你生產的電才要吃得到沒有沒有是那個時候的用電最大\n我看了我們幾個工業會工商總會還是工業總會提出的一個產業報告裡面\n幾乎六大工業總會都希望核能、核能產能延運那新國會準備要解套這個問題阿民執政黨是把核能當作行之百你的看法要不要延運?\n你要告訴我一件事嗎?\n這個可能要不要研議?\n你不是在這裡排斥共和為了你們政策辯論 現在是對著我們現實面臨的實際的問題 有沒有希望、原因?\n第一個當然在這個裡面委員有一些對演繹的提案但是這個法律的提案你法律的提案什麼不是國會裡面就是說不會把男的不能生孩子這個不能改變的話其他都可以改變你們也常常在改變你要不要\n市商核電就幾個面向所以我報告也有提到一個是法律面最重要是核能安全那要有核安會來審討還有核廢電的問題我現在只問你如果缺電的話要不要研議啦你給我說一下才知道啦\n我看你左右為難這個是兩兩兩件事然後我們我們問的是一件事情你要熱解我們對電力的攻擊齁目前都有沒有要支持核電廠研議我只問了重心點的問題\n核電廠研議其實第一個問題就是安全的問題第二個是大家要有共識阿大家如果有共識的你們會不會反對這些的大前提如果都能夠解決那當然是一個所以表示有共識你們不反對了那核電的繩子牌就要被打破了對不對\n我有講喔,其實核電一定要是安全的問題很難為的回答你現在現在兩年幾十年把國家投資的核電廠將近5000億你們也把它擺在那邊把它報廢掉好,現在原來演藝要怎麼樣總經理你要不要回答一下還是能演幾場我看到你們碰到核電廠要不會演藝都閃來閃去啊\n總經理 那個兩個核電廠一年幫你們賺400億喔你要怎麼去解決這個問題核電廠原理 純如剛才部長講的 它是一個安全問題 這些都必須要先克服難怪你會繼續當總經理 你也很優秀我跟你講 表示態度\n萬一缺電萬一需要核能廠你不要說那個在野黨把這個打破以前你們從來就是反對核能發電核能發電都利冷這裡面五個工會的理事長都一直要求考慮核電廠要不要延運能把定位降低一下\n你們現在出了這個問題都不跟我說,要國民黨往往,最大的在野黨往往,要趕你們擦屁股,要看你們態度。如果你們不敢講說支持核電廠研議,我相信不要給他通過最好。\n會保持人民進黨執政的獨立性。\n謝謝陳超明委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:10.048 --> 00:36.218\n主席好首先有請王部長來請部長王部長好常常下鄉常常碰到一些困擾的問題就是無自來水地區自來水源管的工程這裡面就牽涉到水利跟自來水公司\n\n00:37.366 --> 00:58.095\n但是現在全國自來水的普及率達到95%但是你們邀請了一個標準就是每一戶的要有60萬的施工成本審查的標準是以60萬以下才可以,以上不可以我認為台灣我們的稿稅都很寬\n\n01:00.876 --> 01:15.452\n尤其現在普及到95%沒有裝自來水的地區﹐我們叫做偏遠的地區﹐也比較落後的地區﹐即使這個是水資源含有最重要的地區﹐他們要裝自來水都這樣補了這60萬、50萬人\n\n01:20.237 --> 01:45.944\n我覺得這個要照顧民生都要一樣,還是給你提供水源的地方竟然裝不到自來水,讓你這裡多錢人都在用所以我好幾年我一直在拜託要求,大概再開8個月台灣的自來水大概普及率就會很高我覺得這個非常重要,所以我今天來這邊特別拜託多一點經費\n\n01:47.825 --> 02:04.357\n支援給我們的水利市給我們的自來水公司讓這個自來水地區能馬上把它慢慢的一直把自來水的普及率普及出來你好好拜託你關係很好到行政院會拿到很多的獎勵這樣有困難嗎?\n\n02:06.318 --> 02:08.842\n跟委員報告因為我個人也覺得這個事情要用更好的想像所以兩個方向一個就是水利署這邊也去把這個60萬的部分拉高來提高這個門檻\n\n02:21.138 --> 02:25.920\n但是也跟委員講有一些地方因為他很善他要的經費真的遠遠高出60萬甚至80萬那我請署長說去想一些聰明的方法比如說有沒有一些淨水設施因為我們大旱的時候有一些廠商已經會做淨水設施那有沒有可能這些淨水設施就近那這個經費相對也比較可惜那可以讓更多的戶數來做那他們現在正在評估\n\n02:49.927 --> 03:05.530\n技術的部分可行性的部分經費的部分我覺得這個是不是可以更加快來解決這個偏遠地區的無自來水的問題這個方式我贊成是因為我以前就提出了要用科技方法來解決偏遠的地區\n\n03:06.651 --> 03:26.382\n在那邊你淨水、瀝水的功能做好打地下水出來給他們但是已經講了3、4年、4、5年了這個早期我沒過淨水、瀝水我大概了解這些我們要怎麼來做可以省了很多的成本所以希望您趕快這樣子去做好不好\n\n03:27.807 --> 03:30.888\n委員建議的方向,部長在今年的1月初的時候就找我們朝這個方向\n\n03:51.896 --> 03:57.424\n總算我最後提出的爭議被認同了要好好做我會盯得緊因為現在這個科技也很發達請回座\n\n04:03.588 --> 04:14.417\n大家都討論電價的上漲大家也不曉得幅度有多少我查了一下我看你這個上漲電價留給國民黨來執政馬英九執政的時間一共漲了40.65%蔡英文當總統的話\n\n04:23.584 --> 04:43.793\n是22.4%啊你說你們慢慢漲叫做消波制防止我們的通貨膨脹喔命很高企的實在這樣快點炒到沒法去休一次你大概漲現在要漲幾%工業用電高鐵要用電大副用電你告訴我我就知道了\n\n04:44.591 --> 05:00.823\n目前他們工作相組其實正在就各種的方向正在討論目前還沒有定案是真的還沒漲價疫情就把這個漲價消息放出去大家都以為漲得很高你在試水文\n\n05:01.804 --> 05:13.230\n所以這個比例可以看出來不是國民黨時代長假你們以前都罵國民黨長假我看國民黨執政再來給他長繼續動長就會繼續執政你看法怎麼樣?要不要長?兩套的標準再來有一個問題可能會很嚴重未來會不會缺電?\n\n05:32.247 --> 06:01.110\n不會啦,我們非常努力在做這個事情很有自信現在我看了一個那個特斯拉的執行長叫做馬斯克世界最有錢的人他說現在是缺晶片未來是缺電晶片的話AAI的這些晶片是吃電的怪獸你覺得沒重要人家是幾十年以後不是缺晶片就是缺電啦\n\n06:02.210 --> 06:08.870\n你怎麼來應付這個問題?你們有沒有去考慮?這個可能是一個消息但是也是代表著一個警訊\n\n06:10.816 --> 06:35.530\n你有準備吧?那個資料我要給你們看吧?因為現在目前在這個AI訓練的部分確實都是美國這幾個大公司那他們這個在訓練階段真的是用非常多的電訓練的話是大概不用什麼你不要把我騙你死體因為AI你生產的電才要吃得到沒有沒有是那個時候的用電最大\n\n06:36.070 --> 06:37.231\n我看了我們幾個工業會工商總會還是工業總會提出的一個產業報告裡面\n\n07:04.501 --> 07:20.529\n幾乎六大工業總會都希望核能、核能產能延運那新國會準備要解套這個問題阿民執政黨是把核能當作行之百你的看法要不要延運?\n\n07:22.451 --> 07:24.352\n你要告訴我一件事嗎?\n\n07:24.352 --> 07:25.292\n這個可能要不要研議?\n\n07:25.292 --> 07:36.320\n你不是在這裡排斥共和為了你們政策辯論現在是對著我們現實面臨的實際的問題有沒有希望、原因?\n\n07:37.211 --> 07:56.995\n第一個當然在這個裡面委員有一些對演繹的提案但是這個法律的提案你法律的提案什麼不是國會裡面就是說不會把男的不能生孩子這個不能改變的話其他都可以改變你們也常常在改變你要不要\n\n07:58.421 --> 08:09.831\n市商核電就幾個面向所以我報告也有提到一個是法律面最重要是核能安全那要有核安會來審討還有核廢電的問題我現在只問你如果缺電的話要不要研議啦你給我說一下才知道啦\n\n08:16.917 --> 08:30.084\n我看你左右為難這個是兩兩兩件事然後我們我們問的是一件事情你要熱解我們對電力的攻擊齁目前都有沒有要支持核電廠研議我只問了重心點的問題\n\n08:31.431 --> 08:50.138\n核電廠研議其實第一個問題就是安全的問題第二個是大家要有共識阿大家如果有共識的你們會不會反對這些的大前提如果都能夠解決那當然是一個所以表示有共識你們不反對了那核電的繩子牌就要被打破了對不對\n\n08:51.594 --> 09:14.546\n我有講喔,其實核電一定要是安全的問題很難為的回答你現在現在兩年幾十年把國家投資的核電廠將近5000億你們也把它擺在那邊把它報廢掉好,現在原來演藝要怎麼樣總經理你要不要回答一下還是能演幾場我看到你們碰到核電廠要不會演藝都閃來閃去啊\n\n09:18.986 --> 09:39.798\n總經理那個兩個核電廠一年幫你們賺400億喔你要怎麼去解決這個問題核電廠原理純如剛才部長講的它是一個安全問題這些都必須要先克服難怪你會繼續當總經理你也很優秀我跟你講表示態度\n\n09:41.170 --> 10:03.070\n萬一缺電萬一需要核能廠你不要說那個在野黨把這個打破以前你們從來就是反對核能發電核能發電都利冷這裡面五個工會的理事長都一直要求考慮核電廠要不要延運能把定位降低一下\n\n10:04.451 --> 10:18.840\n你們現在出了這個問題都不跟我說,要國民黨往往,最大的在野黨往往,要趕你們擦屁股,要看你們態度。如果你們不敢講說支持核電廠研議,我相信不要給他通過最好。\n\n10:20.320 --> 10:22.963\n會保持人民進黨執政的獨立性。\n\n10:50.780 --> 10:51.285\n謝謝陳超明委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":10.048,"end":36.218,"text":"主席好首先有請王部長來請部長王部長好常常下鄉常常碰到一些困擾的問題就是無自來水地區自來水源管的工程這裡面就牽涉到水利跟自來水公司"},{"start":37.366,"end":58.095,"text":"但是現在全國自來水的普及率達到95%但是你們邀請了一個標準就是每一戶的要有60萬的施工成本審查的標準是以60萬以下才可以,以上不可以我認為台灣我們的稿稅都很寬"},{"start":60.876,"end":75.452,"text":"尤其現在普及到95%沒有裝自來水的地區﹐我們叫做偏遠的地區﹐也比較落後的地區﹐即使這個是水資源含有最重要的地區﹐他們要裝自來水都這樣補了這60萬、50萬人"},{"start":80.237,"end":105.944,"text":"我覺得這個要照顧民生都要一樣,還是給你提供水源的地方竟然裝不到自來水,讓你這裡多錢人都在用所以我好幾年我一直在拜託要求,大概再開8個月台灣的自來水大概普及率就會很高我覺得這個非常重要,所以我今天來這邊特別拜託多一點經費"},{"start":107.825,"end":124.357,"text":"支援給我們的水利市給我們的自來水公司讓這個自來水地區能馬上把它慢慢的一直把自來水的普及率普及出來你好好拜託你關係很好到行政院會拿到很多的獎勵這樣有困難嗎?"},{"start":126.318,"end":128.842,"text":"跟委員報告因為我個人也覺得這個事情要用更好的想像所以兩個方向一個就是水利署這邊也去把這個60萬的部分拉高來提高這個門檻"},{"start":141.138,"end":145.92,"text":"但是也跟委員講有一些地方因為他很善他要的經費真的遠遠高出60萬甚至80萬那我請署長說去想一些聰明的方法比如說有沒有一些淨水設施因為我們大旱的時候有一些廠商已經會做淨水設施那有沒有可能這些淨水設施就近那這個經費相對也比較可惜那可以讓更多的戶數來做那他們現在正在評估"},{"start":169.927,"end":185.53,"text":"技術的部分可行性的部分經費的部分我覺得這個是不是可以更加快來解決這個偏遠地區的無自來水的問題這個方式我贊成是因為我以前就提出了要用科技方法來解決偏遠的地區"},{"start":186.651,"end":206.382,"text":"在那邊你淨水、瀝水的功能做好打地下水出來給他們但是已經講了3、4年、4、5年了這個早期我沒過淨水、瀝水我大概了解這些我們要怎麼來做可以省了很多的成本所以希望您趕快這樣子去做好不好"},{"start":207.807,"end":210.888,"text":"委員建議的方向,部長在今年的1月初的時候就找我們朝這個方向"},{"start":231.896,"end":237.424,"text":"總算我最後提出的爭議被認同了要好好做我會盯得緊因為現在這個科技也很發達請回座"},{"start":243.588,"end":254.417,"text":"大家都討論電價的上漲大家也不曉得幅度有多少我查了一下我看你這個上漲電價留給國民黨來執政馬英九執政的時間一共漲了40.65%蔡英文當總統的話"},{"start":263.584,"end":283.793,"text":"是22.4% 啊你說你們慢慢漲叫做消波制防止我們的通貨膨脹 喔 命很高企的 實在 這樣快點炒到沒法去 休一次你大概漲現在要漲幾% 工業用電 高鐵要用電 大副用電 你告訴我我就知道了"},{"start":284.591,"end":300.823,"text":"目前他們工作相組其實正在就各種的方向正在討論目前還沒有定案是真的還沒漲價疫情就把這個漲價消息放出去大家都以為漲得很高你在試水文"},{"start":301.804,"end":313.23,"text":"所以這個比例可以看出來不是國民黨時代長假你們以前都罵國民黨長假我看國民黨執政再來給他長繼續動長就會繼續執政你看法怎麼樣?要不要長?兩套的標準再來有一個問題可能會很嚴重未來會不會缺電?"},{"start":332.247,"end":361.11,"text":"不會啦,我們非常努力在做這個事情很有自信現在我看了一個那個特斯拉的執行長叫做馬斯克世界最有錢的人他說現在是缺晶片未來是缺電晶片的話AAI的這些晶片是吃電的怪獸你覺得沒重要人家是幾十年以後不是缺晶片就是缺電啦"},{"start":362.21,"end":368.87,"text":"你怎麼來應付這個問題?你們有沒有去考慮?這個可能是一個消息但是也是代表著一個警訊"},{"start":370.816,"end":395.53,"text":"你有準備吧?那個資料我要給你們看吧?因為現在目前在這個AI訓練的部分確實都是美國這幾個大公司那他們這個在訓練階段真的是用非常多的電訓練的話是大概不用什麼你不要把我騙你死體因為AI你生產的電才要吃得到沒有沒有是那個時候的用電最大"},{"start":396.07,"end":397.231,"text":"我看了我們幾個工業會工商總會還是工業總會提出的一個產業報告裡面"},{"start":424.501,"end":440.529,"text":"幾乎六大工業總會都希望核能、核能產能延運那新國會準備要解套這個問題阿民執政黨是把核能當作行之百你的看法要不要延運?"},{"start":442.451,"end":444.352,"text":" 你要告訴我一件事嗎?"},{"start":444.352,"end":445.292,"text":"這個可能要不要研議?"},{"start":445.292,"end":456.32,"text":"你不是在這裡排斥共和為了你們政策辯論 現在是對著我們現實面臨的實際的問題 有沒有希望、原因?"},{"start":457.211,"end":476.995,"text":"第一個當然在這個裡面委員有一些對演繹的提案但是這個法律的提案你法律的提案什麼不是國會裡面就是說不會把男的不能生孩子這個不能改變的話其他都可以改變你們也常常在改變你要不要"},{"start":478.421,"end":489.831,"text":"市商核電就幾個面向所以我報告也有提到一個是法律面最重要是核能安全那要有核安會來審討還有核廢電的問題我現在只問你如果缺電的話要不要研議啦你給我說一下才知道啦"},{"start":496.917,"end":510.084,"text":"我看你左右為難這個是兩兩兩件事然後我們我們問的是一件事情你要熱解我們對電力的攻擊齁目前都有沒有要支持核電廠研議我只問了重心點的問題"},{"start":511.431,"end":530.138,"text":"核電廠研議其實第一個問題就是安全的問題第二個是大家要有共識阿大家如果有共識的你們會不會反對這些的大前提如果都能夠解決那當然是一個所以表示有共識你們不反對了那核電的繩子牌就要被打破了對不對"},{"start":531.594,"end":554.546,"text":"我有講喔,其實核電一定要是安全的問題很難為的回答你現在現在兩年幾十年把國家投資的核電廠將近5000億你們也把它擺在那邊把它報廢掉好,現在原來演藝要怎麼樣總經理你要不要回答一下還是能演幾場我看到你們碰到核電廠要不會演藝都閃來閃去啊"},{"start":558.986,"end":579.798,"text":"總經理 那個兩個核電廠一年幫你們賺400億喔你要怎麼去解決這個問題核電廠原理 純如剛才部長講的 它是一個安全問題 這些都必須要先克服難怪你會繼續當總經理 你也很優秀我跟你講 表示態度"},{"start":581.17,"end":603.07,"text":"萬一缺電萬一需要核能廠你不要說那個在野黨把這個打破以前你們從來就是反對核能發電核能發電都利冷這裡面五個工會的理事長都一直要求考慮核電廠要不要延運能把定位降低一下"},{"start":604.451,"end":618.84,"text":"你們現在出了這個問題都不跟我說,要國民黨往往,最大的在野黨往往,要趕你們擦屁股,要看你們態度。如果你們不敢講說支持核電廠研議,我相信不要給他通過最好。"},{"start":620.32,"end":622.963,"text":"會保持人民進黨執政的獨立性。"},{"start":650.78,"end":651.285,"text":"謝謝陳超明委員"}]}}}}