{"id":149834,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/149834","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/38af2da376d23135c7de8efbd043ce9c51d5fa63d75d4c3df8ba9b0039caa7a6ba0ce5b3b925cb395ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳亭妃","委員發言時間":"09:26:44 - 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{\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 57.79, \"end\": 57.81, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"撥\"}, {\"word\": \"補\"}]}, {\"start\": 60.578, \"end\": 84.799, \"text\": \"可是好像我們的主計長跟你的態度有點不一樣主計長的態度是說現在可運用的才1500億那如果全部都給你台電來做這樣的一個虧損補貼的話那麼政府手上可以用的餘額幾乎沒有這是很危險的那這怎麼辦\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 60.578, \"end\": 60.738, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 60.738, \"end\": 61.439, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 61.439, \"end\": 61.719, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"像\", \"start\": 61.719, \"end\": 62.54, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 62.54, \"end\": 62.78, \"score\": 0.847}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 62.78, \"end\": 62.92, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 62.92, \"end\": 64.141, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"計\"}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 64.141, \"end\": 64.421, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 64.421, \"end\": 64.642, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 64.642, 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{\"word\": \"餘\"}, {\"word\": \"額\"}, {\"word\": \"幾\"}, {\"word\": \"乎\", \"start\": 81.456, \"end\": 81.637, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 81.637, \"end\": 81.837, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 81.837, \"end\": 82.758, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 82.758, \"end\": 82.998, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 82.998, \"end\": 83.258, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"危\", \"start\": 83.258, \"end\": 83.819, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"險\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 83.819, \"end\": 84.419, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 84.419, \"end\": 84.779, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"怎\", \"start\": 84.779, \"end\": 84.799, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"辦\"}]}, {\"start\": 86.377, \"end\": 86.617, \"text\": \"1500億當時候是誰訂出來的?\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"1\"}, {\"word\": \"5\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"億\"}, {\"word\": \"當\"}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 86.377, \"end\": 86.457, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 86.457, \"end\": 86.537, \"score\": 0.487}, {\"word\": \"誰\"}, {\"word\": \"訂\"}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 86.537, \"end\": 86.597, \"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 86.597, \"end\": 86.617, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"?\"}]}, {\"start\": 113.823, \"end\": 141.335, \"text\": \"一千五百億不是定的問題而是說我們希望爭取跟院裡面爭取是啊就是說你這個應該也是你們有計算過的嘛大概是要有這樣的金額嘛是不是是怎麼樣的金額其實是我們只能表達說希望院裡面可以怎麼樣來支持當然我說部長這個一千五百億也是你當時候台電經過計算然後最小的\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 113.823, \"end\": 114.043, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"千\", \"start\": 114.043, \"end\": 114.243, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"五\", \"start\": 114.243, \"end\": 114.403, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"百\", \"start\": 114.403, \"end\": 115.104, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"億\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 115.104, \"end\": 115.304, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"是\", 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\"start\": 577.326, \"end\": 577.667, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 577.667, \"end\": 577.727, \"score\": 0.667}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 577.727, \"end\": 577.847, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 577.847, \"end\": 577.867, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"?\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:07,007 --> 00:00:31,950\n謝謝主席,我們請部長。來,請王部長。是,委員好。是,部長。我們一直強調就是說在台電的部分因為非戰之罪,這是整個國際情勢,然後二五戰爭而造成的一個狀況。那所有的\n\n2\n00:00:33,009 --> 00:00:57,810\n這一個天然氣等等的一些原物料整個上漲所以導致台電這個店家的部分有虧損而且虧損的比例是增加那我們認為這個部分不應該由我們人民來買單全面買單我們才認為說應該要來編列預算去做這樣的一個所謂的撥補\n\n3\n00:01:00,578 --> 00:01:24,799\n可是好像我們的主計長跟你的態度有點不一樣主計長的態度是說現在可運用的才1500億那如果全部都給你台電來做這樣的一個虧損補貼的話那麼政府手上可以用的餘額幾乎沒有這是很危險的那這怎麼辦\n\n4\n00:01:26,377 --> 00:01:26,617\n1500億當時候是誰訂出來的?\n\n5\n00:01:53,823 --> 00:02:21,335\n一千五百億不是定的問題而是說我們希望爭取跟院裡面爭取是啊就是說你這個應該也是你們有計算過的嘛大概是要有這樣的金額嘛是不是是怎麼樣的金額其實是我們只能表達說希望院裡面可以怎麼樣來支持當然我說部長這個一千五百億也是你當時候台電經過計算然後最小的\n\n6\n00:02:22,435 --> 00:02:26,460\n一個對於民眾整個漲電價壓力的一個數字嘛應該是這個樣子嘛\n\n7\n00:02:32,028 --> 00:02:53,631\n那所以才會有1500億這樣的數字這個應該也是你們已經有估算過的你們也因為估算過才用這樣去跟行政院提出我們的訴求那當然行政院還沒核定但是我們看到主計長、主計總署他的態度就不一樣\n\n8\n00:02:55,305 --> 00:03:03,185\n那如果今天沒有到達1500億那是不是有可能我們漲的電費會更高?\n\n9\n00:03:05,317 --> 00:03:10,241\n關於這個細節坦白講那個很多的數據然後我們會很來精算那另外一個就是說在過往電價審議會這邊也其實都有考慮到確實包括通膨的問題怎麼樣怎麼樣做細緻的安排那也確實前兩次也有這樣的例子不是部長因為今天這個新聞一出來大家開始擔心啊因為1500億是當時候\n\n10\n00:03:35,537 --> 00:03:55,125\n經濟部一定是經由我們國營會台電大家估算過大概有1500億會對於整個電價的虧損跟我們漲電價的壓力會減到最輕所以才有這個數字可是現在主計總署的意思是我們如果要用1500億\n\n11\n00:03:57,006 --> 00:04:17,563\n可能未來政府的一個運用餘額就會不夠會有危險所以這個會產生什麼樣的狀況那是不是如果萬一沒有1500億會漲得更高部長我今天在這裡慎重拜託\n\n12\n00:04:19,656 --> 00:04:47,485\n今天我們不能讓人民有太多壓力在電價部分我們一直講既然有撥補或是有虧損的一個補貼我們要從民生不論多少就是從民生不要讓民生漲得太高你一漲的話會轉嫁到物價物價一上去就回不來了\n\n13\n00:04:49,205 --> 00:05:17,536\n現在承受不了現在的狀況是承受不了的部長可不可以是是委員提到的這個部分確實也是店家審議會裡面而最關切的其中一個議題那這個我們會細緻的安排是就是不論你今天最後院版拍板定案跟主計總處協調到哪一個金額不管多少金額都是要由民生\n\n14\n00:05:18,815 --> 00:05:37,727\n先去做這樣的一個撥補補貼絕對不能讓整個民生壓力造成炸鍋這個是我們再三拜託否則今天我相信這樣的一個新聞出來大家就開始議論紛紛了是不是會一飛從天\n\n15\n00:05:44,264 --> 00:06:10,047\n一次漲到夠、一次漲到足這些很多的問號就出來了對現在整個民生經濟的發展絕對是不利的我們都會很仔細的來考慮委員提的這些問題這個部長要麻煩一下齁極力爭取回歸民生讓民生能夠穩定住物價\n\n16\n00:06:12,174 --> 00:06:40,664\n這才是我們在經濟發展當中非常重要的依據還有我之前非常關心的就是我們的管線問題部長我們地下管線的圖資國營事業地下管線圖資是由國營司在負責的但是你知道當時候其實臺南就發生了臺南山上淨水廠下游送水管線\n\n17\n00:06:42,113 --> 00:07:11,120\n的工程被挖斷管路好上個禮拜台南仁德又發生了天然氣管線遭挖斷雖然緊急處置後還有待修復可是雖然馬上去做了緊急處理可是表示這是有危機的我們地下管線的圖資根本沒有辦法監控\n\n18\n00:07:12,895 --> 00:07:25,787\n挖下去發生問題了才知道怎麼彌補可是如果沒有挖到大家就覺得是這樣嗎我們的土地在地底下\n\n19\n00:07:28,164 --> 00:07:55,974\n在這個地下管線的投資這個我確實有責成相關的單位包括我們經濟部的中油、台電、台水那甚至其實有一些是別的部會的管線那這個部分第一個會有幾個情形一個就是當時蓋的時候跟後來其實地形有一點點變動這是第一個可是變動也不可能變動到說因為它在施工一定有一個\n\n20\n00:07:57,154 --> 00:08:07,941\n所謂的阿蘇比的空間他不可能說我今天就從他旁邊硬是要把它挖進去不可能嘛他一定有一個緩衝那這個緩衝請問怎麼可能會因為整個地質變動然後差了那麼遠差了那麼大\n\n21\n00:08:18,288 --> 00:08:21,429\n現在這些我有責成大家第一個有新的科技第二個有一些比較好的工法來預防這些再挖斷的問題現在就是有可以在施工前使用探測儀器進行探測現在是重點我們有沒有落實大家就便宜行事挖了我們再說我有責成他們這個確實要去做現在好像大家的\n\n22\n00:08:46,781 --> 00:08:49,203\n共識是這樣欸,挖刀算倒霉喔?沒有沒有,這個確實委員講這是一個很重、要重視的議題沒有,部長,一個月請把到底我們國營師對於我們國營事業的這三項油、電、水我們的管線到底怎麼處理,地下投資怎麼辦?\n\n23\n00:09:11,909 --> 00:09:37,867\n之前我就要求過了,現在還沒看到半點文字麻煩一下,一個月馬上給我們。他們前幾天有送一份報告,剛送。那個不很清楚,我要清楚你們未來SOP要怎麼做。謝謝。國營司可以嗎?一個月內可以把清楚的資料都送,然後也送給經濟委員會的每一位委員,好不好?\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n7007\t31950\t謝謝主席,我們請部長。來,請王部長。是,委員好。是,部長。我們一直強調就是說在台電的部分因為非戰之罪,這是整個國際情勢,然後二五戰爭而造成的一個狀況。那所有的\n33009\t57810\t這一個天然氣等等的一些原物料整個上漲所以導致台電這個店家的部分有虧損而且虧損的比例是增加那我們認為這個部分不應該由我們人民來買單全面買單我們才認為說應該要來編列預算去做這樣的一個所謂的撥補\n60578\t84799\t可是好像我們的主計長跟你的態度有點不一樣主計長的態度是說現在可運用的才1500億那如果全部都給你台電來做這樣的一個虧損補貼的話那麼政府手上可以用的餘額幾乎沒有這是很危險的那這怎麼辦\n86377\t86617\t1500億當時候是誰訂出來的?\n113823\t141335\t一千五百億不是定的問題而是說我們希望爭取跟院裡面爭取是啊就是說你這個應該也是你們有計算過的嘛大概是要有這樣的金額嘛是不是是怎麼樣的金額其實是我們只能表達說希望院裡面可以怎麼樣來支持當然我說部長這個一千五百億也是你當時候台電經過計算然後最小的\n142435\t146460\t一個對於民眾整個漲電價壓力的一個數字嘛應該是這個樣子嘛\n152028\t173631\t那所以才會有1500億這樣的數字 這個應該也是你們已經有估算過的你們也因為估算過才用這樣去跟行政院提出我們的訴求那當然行政院還沒核定但是我們看到主計長、主計總署他的態度就不一樣\n175305\t183185\t那如果今天沒有到達1500億那是不是有可能我們漲的電費會更高?\n185317\t190241\t關於這個細節坦白講那個很多的數據然後我們會很來精算那另外一個就是說在過往電價審議會這邊也其實都有考慮到確實包括通膨的問題怎麼樣怎麼樣做細緻的安排那也確實前兩次也有這樣的例子不是部長因為今天這個新聞一出來大家開始擔心啊因為1500億是當時候\n215537\t235125\t經濟部一定是經由我們國營會台電大家估算過大概有1500億會對於整個電價的虧損跟我們漲電價的壓力會減到最輕所以才有這個數字可是現在主計總署的意思是我們如果要用1500億\n237006\t257563\t可能未來政府的一個運用餘額就會不夠會有危險所以這個會產生什麼樣的狀況那是不是如果萬一沒有1500億會漲得更高部長我今天在這裡慎重拜託\n259656\t287485\t今天我們不能讓人民有太多壓力在電價部分我們一直講既然有撥補或是有虧損的一個補貼我們要從民生不論多少就是從民生不要讓民生漲得太高你一漲的話會轉嫁到物價物價一上去就回不來了\n289205\t317536\t現在承受不了現在的狀況是承受不了的部長可不可以是是委員提到的這個部分確實也是店家審議會裡面而最關切的其中一個議題那這個我們會細緻的安排是就是不論你今天最後院版拍板定案跟主計總處協調到哪一個金額不管多少金額都是要由民生\n318815\t337727\t先去做這樣的一個撥補補貼絕對不能讓整個民生壓力造成炸鍋這個是我們再三拜託否則今天我相信這樣的一個新聞出來大家就開始議論紛紛了是不是會一飛從天\n344264\t370047\t一次漲到夠、一次漲到足這些很多的問號就出來了對現在整個民生經濟的發展絕對是不利的我們都會很仔細的來考慮委員提的這些問題這個部長要麻煩一下齁極力爭取回歸民生讓民生能夠穩定住物價\n372174\t400664\t這才是我們在經濟發展當中非常重要的依據還有我之前非常關心的就是我們的管線問題部長我們地下管線的圖資國營事業地下管線圖資是由國營司在負責的但是你知道當時候其實臺南就發生了臺南山上淨水廠下游送水管線\n402113\t431120\t的工程被挖斷管路好上個禮拜台南仁德又發生了天然氣管線遭挖斷雖然緊急處置後還有待修復可是雖然馬上去做了緊急處理可是表示這是有危機的我們地下管線的圖資根本沒有辦法監控\n432895\t445787\t挖下去發生問題了才知道怎麼彌補可是如果沒有挖到大家就覺得是這樣嗎我們的土地在地底下\n448164\t475974\t在這個地下管線的投資這個我確實有責成相關的單位包括我們經濟部的中油、台電、台水那甚至其實有一些是別的部會的管線那這個部分第一個會有幾個情形一個就是當時蓋的時候跟後來其實地形有一點點變動這是第一個可是變動也不可能變動到說因為它在施工一定有一個\n477154\t487941\t所謂的阿蘇比的空間他不可能說我今天就從他旁邊硬是要把它挖進去不可能嘛他一定有一個緩衝那這個緩衝請問怎麼可能會因為整個地質變動然後差了那麼遠差了那麼大\n498288\t501429\t現在這些我有責成大家第一個有新的科技第二個有一些比較好的工法來預防這些再挖斷的問題現在就是有可以在施工前使用探測儀器進行探測現在是重點我們有沒有落實大家就便宜行事挖了我們再說我有責成他們這個確實要去做現在好像大家的\n526781\t529203\t共識是這樣欸,挖刀算倒霉喔?沒有沒有,這個確實委員講這是一個很重、要重視的議題沒有,部長,一個月請把到底我們國營師對於我們國營事業的這三項油、電、水我們的管線到底怎麼處理,地下投資怎麼辦?\n551909\t577867\t之前我就要求過了,現在還沒看到半點文字麻煩一下,一個月馬上給我們。他們前幾天有送一份報告,剛送。那個不很清楚,我要清楚你們未來SOP要怎麼做。謝謝。國營司可以嗎?一個月內可以把清楚的資料都送,然後也送給經濟委員會的每一位委員,好不好?\n","txt":"謝謝主席,我們請部長。來,請王部長。是,委員好。是,部長。我們一直強調就是說在台電的部分因為非戰之罪,這是整個國際情勢,然後二五戰爭而造成的一個狀況。那所有的\n這一個天然氣等等的一些原物料整個上漲所以導致台電這個店家的部分有虧損而且虧損的比例是增加那我們認為這個部分不應該由我們人民來買單全面買單我們才認為說應該要來編列預算去做這樣的一個所謂的撥補\n可是好像我們的主計長跟你的態度有點不一樣主計長的態度是說現在可運用的才1500億那如果全部都給你台電來做這樣的一個虧損補貼的話那麼政府手上可以用的餘額幾乎沒有這是很危險的那這怎麼辦\n1500億當時候是誰訂出來的?\n一千五百億不是定的問題而是說我們希望爭取跟院裡面爭取是啊就是說你這個應該也是你們有計算過的嘛大概是要有這樣的金額嘛是不是是怎麼樣的金額其實是我們只能表達說希望院裡面可以怎麼樣來支持當然我說部長這個一千五百億也是你當時候台電經過計算然後最小的\n一個對於民眾整個漲電價壓力的一個數字嘛應該是這個樣子嘛\n那所以才會有1500億這樣的數字 這個應該也是你們已經有估算過的你們也因為估算過才用這樣去跟行政院提出我們的訴求那當然行政院還沒核定但是我們看到主計長、主計總署他的態度就不一樣\n那如果今天沒有到達1500億那是不是有可能我們漲的電費會更高?\n關於這個細節坦白講那個很多的數據然後我們會很來精算那另外一個就是說在過往電價審議會這邊也其實都有考慮到確實包括通膨的問題怎麼樣怎麼樣做細緻的安排那也確實前兩次也有這樣的例子不是部長因為今天這個新聞一出來大家開始擔心啊因為1500億是當時候\n經濟部一定是經由我們國營會台電大家估算過大概有1500億會對於整個電價的虧損跟我們漲電價的壓力會減到最輕所以才有這個數字可是現在主計總署的意思是我們如果要用1500億\n可能未來政府的一個運用餘額就會不夠會有危險所以這個會產生什麼樣的狀況那是不是如果萬一沒有1500億會漲得更高部長我今天在這裡慎重拜託\n今天我們不能讓人民有太多壓力在電價部分我們一直講既然有撥補或是有虧損的一個補貼我們要從民生不論多少就是從民生不要讓民生漲得太高你一漲的話會轉嫁到物價物價一上去就回不來了\n現在承受不了現在的狀況是承受不了的部長可不可以是是委員提到的這個部分確實也是店家審議會裡面而最關切的其中一個議題那這個我們會細緻的安排是就是不論你今天最後院版拍板定案跟主計總處協調到哪一個金額不管多少金額都是要由民生\n先去做這樣的一個撥補補貼絕對不能讓整個民生壓力造成炸鍋這個是我們再三拜託否則今天我相信這樣的一個新聞出來大家就開始議論紛紛了是不是會一飛從天\n一次漲到夠、一次漲到足這些很多的問號就出來了對現在整個民生經濟的發展絕對是不利的我們都會很仔細的來考慮委員提的這些問題這個部長要麻煩一下齁極力爭取回歸民生讓民生能夠穩定住物價\n這才是我們在經濟發展當中非常重要的依據還有我之前非常關心的就是我們的管線問題部長我們地下管線的圖資國營事業地下管線圖資是由國營司在負責的但是你知道當時候其實臺南就發生了臺南山上淨水廠下游送水管線\n的工程被挖斷管路好上個禮拜台南仁德又發生了天然氣管線遭挖斷雖然緊急處置後還有待修復可是雖然馬上去做了緊急處理可是表示這是有危機的我們地下管線的圖資根本沒有辦法監控\n挖下去發生問題了才知道怎麼彌補可是如果沒有挖到大家就覺得是這樣嗎我們的土地在地底下\n在這個地下管線的投資這個我確實有責成相關的單位包括我們經濟部的中油、台電、台水那甚至其實有一些是別的部會的管線那這個部分第一個會有幾個情形一個就是當時蓋的時候跟後來其實地形有一點點變動這是第一個可是變動也不可能變動到說因為它在施工一定有一個\n所謂的阿蘇比的空間他不可能說我今天就從他旁邊硬是要把它挖進去不可能嘛他一定有一個緩衝那這個緩衝請問怎麼可能會因為整個地質變動然後差了那麼遠差了那麼大\n現在這些我有責成大家第一個有新的科技第二個有一些比較好的工法來預防這些再挖斷的問題現在就是有可以在施工前使用探測儀器進行探測現在是重點我們有沒有落實大家就便宜行事挖了我們再說我有責成他們這個確實要去做現在好像大家的\n共識是這樣欸,挖刀算倒霉喔?沒有沒有,這個確實委員講這是一個很重、要重視的議題沒有,部長,一個月請把到底我們國營師對於我們國營事業的這三項油、電、水我們的管線到底怎麼處理,地下投資怎麼辦?\n之前我就要求過了,現在還沒看到半點文字麻煩一下,一個月馬上給我們。他們前幾天有送一份報告,剛送。那個不很清楚,我要清楚你們未來SOP要怎麼做。謝謝。國營司可以嗎?一個月內可以把清楚的資料都送,然後也送給經濟委員會的每一位委員,好不好?\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:07.007 --> 00:31.950\n謝謝主席,我們請部長。來,請王部長。是,委員好。是,部長。我們一直強調就是說在台電的部分因為非戰之罪,這是整個國際情勢,然後二五戰爭而造成的一個狀況。那所有的\n\n00:33.009 --> 00:57.810\n這一個天然氣等等的一些原物料整個上漲所以導致台電這個店家的部分有虧損而且虧損的比例是增加那我們認為這個部分不應該由我們人民來買單全面買單我們才認為說應該要來編列預算去做這樣的一個所謂的撥補\n\n01:00.578 --> 01:24.799\n可是好像我們的主計長跟你的態度有點不一樣主計長的態度是說現在可運用的才1500億那如果全部都給你台電來做這樣的一個虧損補貼的話那麼政府手上可以用的餘額幾乎沒有這是很危險的那這怎麼辦\n\n01:26.377 --> 01:26.617\n1500億當時候是誰訂出來的?\n\n01:53.823 --> 02:21.335\n一千五百億不是定的問題而是說我們希望爭取跟院裡面爭取是啊就是說你這個應該也是你們有計算過的嘛大概是要有這樣的金額嘛是不是是怎麼樣的金額其實是我們只能表達說希望院裡面可以怎麼樣來支持當然我說部長這個一千五百億也是你當時候台電經過計算然後最小的\n\n02:22.435 --> 02:26.460\n一個對於民眾整個漲電價壓力的一個數字嘛應該是這個樣子嘛\n\n02:32.028 --> 02:53.631\n那所以才會有1500億這樣的數字這個應該也是你們已經有估算過的你們也因為估算過才用這樣去跟行政院提出我們的訴求那當然行政院還沒核定但是我們看到主計長、主計總署他的態度就不一樣\n\n02:55.305 --> 03:03.185\n那如果今天沒有到達1500億那是不是有可能我們漲的電費會更高?\n\n03:05.317 --> 03:10.241\n關於這個細節坦白講那個很多的數據然後我們會很來精算那另外一個就是說在過往電價審議會這邊也其實都有考慮到確實包括通膨的問題怎麼樣怎麼樣做細緻的安排那也確實前兩次也有這樣的例子不是部長因為今天這個新聞一出來大家開始擔心啊因為1500億是當時候\n\n03:35.537 --> 03:55.125\n經濟部一定是經由我們國營會台電大家估算過大概有1500億會對於整個電價的虧損跟我們漲電價的壓力會減到最輕所以才有這個數字可是現在主計總署的意思是我們如果要用1500億\n\n03:57.006 --> 04:17.563\n可能未來政府的一個運用餘額就會不夠會有危險所以這個會產生什麼樣的狀況那是不是如果萬一沒有1500億會漲得更高部長我今天在這裡慎重拜託\n\n04:19.656 --> 04:47.485\n今天我們不能讓人民有太多壓力在電價部分我們一直講既然有撥補或是有虧損的一個補貼我們要從民生不論多少就是從民生不要讓民生漲得太高你一漲的話會轉嫁到物價物價一上去就回不來了\n\n04:49.205 --> 05:17.536\n現在承受不了現在的狀況是承受不了的部長可不可以是是委員提到的這個部分確實也是店家審議會裡面而最關切的其中一個議題那這個我們會細緻的安排是就是不論你今天最後院版拍板定案跟主計總處協調到哪一個金額不管多少金額都是要由民生\n\n05:18.815 --> 05:37.727\n先去做這樣的一個撥補補貼絕對不能讓整個民生壓力造成炸鍋這個是我們再三拜託否則今天我相信這樣的一個新聞出來大家就開始議論紛紛了是不是會一飛從天\n\n05:44.264 --> 06:10.047\n一次漲到夠、一次漲到足這些很多的問號就出來了對現在整個民生經濟的發展絕對是不利的我們都會很仔細的來考慮委員提的這些問題這個部長要麻煩一下齁極力爭取回歸民生讓民生能夠穩定住物價\n\n06:12.174 --> 06:40.664\n這才是我們在經濟發展當中非常重要的依據還有我之前非常關心的就是我們的管線問題部長我們地下管線的圖資國營事業地下管線圖資是由國營司在負責的但是你知道當時候其實臺南就發生了臺南山上淨水廠下游送水管線\n\n06:42.113 --> 07:11.120\n的工程被挖斷管路好上個禮拜台南仁德又發生了天然氣管線遭挖斷雖然緊急處置後還有待修復可是雖然馬上去做了緊急處理可是表示這是有危機的我們地下管線的圖資根本沒有辦法監控\n\n07:12.895 --> 07:25.787\n挖下去發生問題了才知道怎麼彌補可是如果沒有挖到大家就覺得是這樣嗎我們的土地在地底下\n\n07:28.164 --> 07:55.974\n在這個地下管線的投資這個我確實有責成相關的單位包括我們經濟部的中油、台電、台水那甚至其實有一些是別的部會的管線那這個部分第一個會有幾個情形一個就是當時蓋的時候跟後來其實地形有一點點變動這是第一個可是變動也不可能變動到說因為它在施工一定有一個\n\n07:57.154 --> 08:07.941\n所謂的阿蘇比的空間他不可能說我今天就從他旁邊硬是要把它挖進去不可能嘛他一定有一個緩衝那這個緩衝請問怎麼可能會因為整個地質變動然後差了那麼遠差了那麼大\n\n08:18.288 --> 08:21.429\n現在這些我有責成大家第一個有新的科技第二個有一些比較好的工法來預防這些再挖斷的問題現在就是有可以在施工前使用探測儀器進行探測現在是重點我們有沒有落實大家就便宜行事挖了我們再說我有責成他們這個確實要去做現在好像大家的\n\n08:46.781 --> 08:49.203\n共識是這樣欸,挖刀算倒霉喔?沒有沒有,這個確實委員講這是一個很重、要重視的議題沒有,部長,一個月請把到底我們國營師對於我們國營事業的這三項油、電、水我們的管線到底怎麼處理,地下投資怎麼辦?\n\n09:11.909 --> 09:37.867\n之前我就要求過了,現在還沒看到半點文字麻煩一下,一個月馬上給我們。他們前幾天有送一份報告,剛送。那個不很清楚,我要清楚你們未來SOP要怎麼做。謝謝。國營司可以嗎?一個月內可以把清楚的資料都送,然後也送給經濟委員會的每一位委員,好不好?\n\n","segments":[{"start":7.007,"end":31.95,"text":"謝謝主席,我們請部長。來,請王部長。是,委員好。是,部長。我們一直強調就是說在台電的部分因為非戰之罪,這是整個國際情勢,然後二五戰爭而造成的一個狀況。那所有的"},{"start":33.009,"end":57.81,"text":"這一個天然氣等等的一些原物料整個上漲所以導致台電這個店家的部分有虧損而且虧損的比例是增加那我們認為這個部分不應該由我們人民來買單全面買單我們才認為說應該要來編列預算去做這樣的一個所謂的撥補"},{"start":60.578,"end":84.799,"text":"可是好像我們的主計長跟你的態度有點不一樣主計長的態度是說現在可運用的才1500億那如果全部都給你台電來做這樣的一個虧損補貼的話那麼政府手上可以用的餘額幾乎沒有這是很危險的那這怎麼辦"},{"start":86.377,"end":86.617,"text":"1500億當時候是誰訂出來的?"},{"start":113.823,"end":141.335,"text":"一千五百億不是定的問題而是說我們希望爭取跟院裡面爭取是啊就是說你這個應該也是你們有計算過的嘛大概是要有這樣的金額嘛是不是是怎麼樣的金額其實是我們只能表達說希望院裡面可以怎麼樣來支持當然我說部長這個一千五百億也是你當時候台電經過計算然後最小的"},{"start":142.435,"end":146.46,"text":"一個對於民眾整個漲電價壓力的一個數字嘛應該是這個樣子嘛"},{"start":152.028,"end":173.631,"text":"那所以才會有1500億這樣的數字 這個應該也是你們已經有估算過的你們也因為估算過才用這樣去跟行政院提出我們的訴求那當然行政院還沒核定但是我們看到主計長、主計總署他的態度就不一樣"},{"start":175.305,"end":183.185,"text":"那如果今天沒有到達1500億那是不是有可能我們漲的電費會更高?"},{"start":185.317,"end":190.241,"text":"關於這個細節坦白講那個很多的數據然後我們會很來精算那另外一個就是說在過往電價審議會這邊也其實都有考慮到確實包括通膨的問題怎麼樣怎麼樣做細緻的安排那也確實前兩次也有這樣的例子不是部長因為今天這個新聞一出來大家開始擔心啊因為1500億是當時候"},{"start":215.537,"end":235.125,"text":"經濟部一定是經由我們國營會台電大家估算過大概有1500億會對於整個電價的虧損跟我們漲電價的壓力會減到最輕所以才有這個數字可是現在主計總署的意思是我們如果要用1500億"},{"start":237.006,"end":257.563,"text":"可能未來政府的一個運用餘額就會不夠會有危險所以這個會產生什麼樣的狀況那是不是如果萬一沒有1500億會漲得更高部長我今天在這裡慎重拜託"},{"start":259.656,"end":287.485,"text":"今天我們不能讓人民有太多壓力在電價部分我們一直講既然有撥補或是有虧損的一個補貼我們要從民生不論多少就是從民生不要讓民生漲得太高你一漲的話會轉嫁到物價物價一上去就回不來了"},{"start":289.205,"end":317.536,"text":"現在承受不了現在的狀況是承受不了的部長可不可以是是委員提到的這個部分確實也是店家審議會裡面而最關切的其中一個議題那這個我們會細緻的安排是就是不論你今天最後院版拍板定案跟主計總處協調到哪一個金額不管多少金額都是要由民生"},{"start":318.815,"end":337.727,"text":"先去做這樣的一個撥補補貼絕對不能讓整個民生壓力造成炸鍋這個是我們再三拜託否則今天我相信這樣的一個新聞出來大家就開始議論紛紛了是不是會一飛從天"},{"start":344.264,"end":370.047,"text":"一次漲到夠、一次漲到足這些很多的問號就出來了對現在整個民生經濟的發展絕對是不利的我們都會很仔細的來考慮委員提的這些問題這個部長要麻煩一下齁極力爭取回歸民生讓民生能夠穩定住物價"},{"start":372.174,"end":400.664,"text":"這才是我們在經濟發展當中非常重要的依據還有我之前非常關心的就是我們的管線問題部長我們地下管線的圖資國營事業地下管線圖資是由國營司在負責的但是你知道當時候其實臺南就發生了臺南山上淨水廠下游送水管線"},{"start":402.113,"end":431.12,"text":"的工程被挖斷管路好上個禮拜台南仁德又發生了天然氣管線遭挖斷雖然緊急處置後還有待修復可是雖然馬上去做了緊急處理可是表示這是有危機的我們地下管線的圖資根本沒有辦法監控"},{"start":432.895,"end":445.787,"text":"挖下去發生問題了才知道怎麼彌補可是如果沒有挖到大家就覺得是這樣嗎我們的土地在地底下"},{"start":448.164,"end":475.974,"text":"在這個地下管線的投資這個我確實有責成相關的單位包括我們經濟部的中油、台電、台水那甚至其實有一些是別的部會的管線那這個部分第一個會有幾個情形一個就是當時蓋的時候跟後來其實地形有一點點變動這是第一個可是變動也不可能變動到說因為它在施工一定有一個"},{"start":477.154,"end":487.941,"text":"所謂的阿蘇比的空間他不可能說我今天就從他旁邊硬是要把它挖進去不可能嘛他一定有一個緩衝那這個緩衝請問怎麼可能會因為整個地質變動然後差了那麼遠差了那麼大"},{"start":498.288,"end":501.429,"text":"現在這些我有責成大家第一個有新的科技第二個有一些比較好的工法來預防這些再挖斷的問題現在就是有可以在施工前使用探測儀器進行探測現在是重點我們有沒有落實大家就便宜行事挖了我們再說我有責成他們這個確實要去做現在好像大家的"},{"start":526.781,"end":529.203,"text":"共識是這樣欸,挖刀算倒霉喔?沒有沒有,這個確實委員講這是一個很重、要重視的議題沒有,部長,一個月請把到底我們國營師對於我們國營事業的這三項油、電、水我們的管線到底怎麼處理,地下投資怎麼辦?"},{"start":551.909,"end":577.867,"text":"之前我就要求過了,現在還沒看到半點文字麻煩一下,一個月馬上給我們。他們前幾天有送一份報告,剛送。那個不很清楚,我要清楚你們未來SOP要怎麼做。謝謝。國營司可以嗎?一個月內可以把清楚的資料都送,然後也送給經濟委員會的每一位委員,好不好?"}]}}}}