{"id":150012,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150012","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/14550b3f67fe733a300db1aa2638c3cf1b0cd19bcd66f1b3f8ba9b0039caa7a65cb637de7fc32a3b5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"王世堅","委員發言時間":"12:13:54 - 12:25:49","影片長度":"00:11:55","會議時間":"2024-03-18T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請金融監督管理委員會黃主任委員天牧率臺灣證券交易所股份有限公司林董事長修銘及財團法人中華民國證券櫃檯買賣中心陳董事長永誠、中央銀行分別就「從ETF熱賣看政府如何健全投資管道引導民間游資，避免熱錢過度投入房市」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n【3月18日及20日二天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":4,"committees":[20],"id":"委員會-11-1-20-4"},"date":"2024-03-18","duration":715,"end_time":"2024-03-18T12:25:49+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-18T12:13:54+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":1018,"blocks":[["王委員世堅：（12時14分）主席，我請金管會黃主委。"],["主席：有請黃主委。"],["黃主任委員天牧：委員好。"],["王委員世堅：主委，我今天不跟你談ETF，這已經談很多，我下次再就教你。我要談一個我個人覺得是蠻嚴重的問題，金管會對於實際已經在經營融資的這三家租賃公司，我用八個字形容，就是「自廢武功、該管不管」，這就是金管會現在的情況。","根據銀行法第二十九條「非銀行不得執行銀行相關的業務」，你也很清楚金管會的組織法第二條、第三條，金管會就是掌管國內金控公司、銀行業、保險業、期貨、證券等等，對於這些行業的設立以及管理，都是在你們的職掌範圍內，你非常清楚，不是嗎？那麼這三家公司中租迪和、和潤、裕融，現在放款金額的來源還不是他們自有資金，而是大量從銀行業融資，他們跟38家銀行低利融資，再高利貸放款給需要的消費者，這筆金額多大啊！","黃主委，我私下跟金管會講過，光是中租迪和向銀行借的就高達2,396億元，天啊！然後和潤不遑多讓，大概它的一半，980億元；另外這家裕融，可能後台很硬，連金額都懶得申報！這也是我要求金管會要下去查察的。他們實質經營銀行最重要的融資項目，結果占盡全體國人辛苦存款的便宜，他們便宜行事，由銀行手中取得低利的融資，再去放高利貸，結果金管會放任這個事情不管。","六年前，中央銀行就有做出一些調查報告，也提供給金管會啊。2018年，六年前中央銀行調查的結果，全世界各國多數BNPL做租賃業的公司，都是由他們國家像金管會這樣的單位在管理，由公部門的金融管理機關管理。所以我不懂啊，我們金管會有那麼多專業的金融人士，有這麼多的專業人才，才能夠經常性的對這些實質在作金融放款業務的公司做查察，不是這樣嗎？金管會有全國最多這部分的專業人士，結果你們放任不管。","上次我質詢的時候，也虧另外一位召集人質詢後跟我說，這個部分經濟部管。我去查這是什麼經濟部管，經濟部管的是公司法，臺灣有100萬家公司，這三家金額這麼重大的公司，經濟部只能管百萬分之三，而且是用公司法，這在管什麼管？！現在金管會不管的做法，我認為就是推卸責任啦！避重就輕，把它推給經濟部。我們質詢經濟部，他也一問三不知啊！所以黃主委，我希望你今天就能正式答復我，到底你們管是不管啦？基於事權統一，基於金管會本來就應該納管國內做這樣銀行業務的公司，不是這樣嗎？黃主委，你的看法呢？"],["黃主任委員天牧：委員，是不是可以給我一點時間跟你報告？"],["王委員世堅：您請說，您請說。"],["黃主任委員天牧：第一次拜會您，對您關於金融事務的了解非常尊敬，不過我以下回答如果有跟您的想法不一樣的地方，請您多包涵。"],["王委員世堅：您請說，您請說。"],["黃主任委員天牧：第一點，融資公司是不是專屬銀行業務，銀行法第二十九條其實重點是吸收存款，對不特定多數人吸收存款，那是專屬業務，放款不是銀行的專屬業務。"],["王委員世堅：這個就是漏洞，我們會另外提案來修法……"],["黃主任委員天牧：這是民法規定的。"],["王委員世堅：但是，放款跟存款是一體兩面的業務，他們就是鑽這個漏洞，我認為這就是立法上這一個小疏忽讓大家有話講，不是這樣嗎？"],["黃主任委員天牧：跟委員……"],["王委員世堅：你請說。"],["黃主任委員天牧：經濟部的公司登記中，公司業務有這種融資行為的就有六千八百多家，這就是現況，所以現在就沒有說融資一定是專屬銀行業務。然後，您垂詢的問題這幾家所謂的大型的融資公司，我們管不管？我跟您報告，在2016、2017的時候，它的洗錢防制就已經由主管機關在管，融資性租賃公司是我們在管。","第二個，去年年初大家談BNPL的時候，我們就找最大的那家中租迪和來，我說你們一定要好好去做這件事情，我們根據銀行的授信規則，做了一個租賃的BNPL原則給他們，請他們在租賃公會通過，請各租賃公司去遵循。","第三個，最近網路上那個影片出來之後，我們約談了四家這種上市櫃的大型租賃公司，兩個禮拜前我們召開會議，由金管會提供一個專業的內控準則，要求這四家公司訂在自己的規定中怎麼樣去做，尤其是對年輕人的授信租賃業務，年底之前交易所、櫃買中心會去做內控查核。第二點……"],["王委員世堅：黃主委，剛才這一點，兩個字簡單講，你們就是要求他們這些租賃公司「自律」就對了！"],["黃主任委員天牧：內控不是自律喔！內控要……"],["王委員世堅：你們自己去訂一個怎麼內控、怎麼管理，這樣子！都已經成了這麼龐大的金融怪獸，你竟然只要求他自律？天啊！「他律」都律不住了，不是嗎？"],["黃主任委員天牧：報告委員，內控是年底前交易所要去查核的，不是自律；第二點，您關心租賃公司對年輕人的這種授信原則，我們會要求再訂一個完整的準則，在公會中要求他們去遵循。最重要的，您提到這些租賃公司的資金來源來自於金融機構、票券公司，銀行局也會去跟這些……"],["王委員世堅：這就是我覺得最莫名其妙的一點，他自家的錢拿去借還比較沒話講，如果把裕融加進去，我保守估計這三家將近有五千億來自我們存款大眾存在銀行的錢，被銀行大剌剌的用人情的方式低利借給這三家超大的金融怪獸──租賃公司，讓他們去放高利貸！如果這樣的放款是對的，那銀行來做就好了，消費性貸款銀行直接可以做啊！銀行等於變相圖利了這三家租賃怪獸。"],["黃主任委員天牧：委員，我跟你報告……"],["王委員世堅：因為時間有限，我跟你講我認為最可怕的還有另外一個問題，就是「超額授信」四個字！你知道他們如何戕害我們現在這一代的青年人嗎？剛出社會的年輕人要買車或其他消費品，買一輛車80萬元，卻借給他100萬元──車子都不用自己出錢，還給你20萬的零用金，這些都有高額的利息跟超高額的違約金，還有父母親擔保，青年人還有30年的工作餘命，他們不怕討不回錢。這些公司因為不是銀行，就找討債公司來追討，目前社會的情況是這個樣子。我想以金管會這麼資深的金融專業來講，超額授信是所有銀行業、金融機構最忌諱的事情，結果我們現在卻眼睜睜的看這三家租賃怪獸每天在做超額授信的事情，在戕害剛出社會的青年朋友們。"],["黃主任委員天牧：報告委員，你語重心長的指示，我們都會去處理，尤其你講到對年輕人授信超額的部分，我們會去處理。"],["王委員世堅：他們用這個超額授信來誘惑年輕人……"],["黃主任委員天牧：是。"],["王委員世堅：抱歉主席，我再30秒就好。所以，本席要求你們去查銀行是以什麼樣的名義貸款給這三家租賃公司，也就是銀行這五千億的貸款融資給這三家金融怪獸──租賃業，是用什麼樣的名義？這些放款融資中間有沒有不當的勾串？","謝謝主席。"],["黃主任委員天牧：我們會照委員的提示去處理，謝謝。"],["王委員世堅：你們查了之後，要給我答復。"],["黃主任委員天牧：謝謝委員指導。"],["主席：接著請林楚茵委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":214,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-20-4","speakers":["郭國文","林德福","吳秉叡","李彥秀","賴士葆","賴惠員","羅明才","黃珊珊","顏寬恒","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","王鴻薇","陳玉珍","李坤城","洪孟楷","王世堅","林楚茵","牛煦庭","徐巧芯"],"page_start":147,"meetingDate":["2024-03-18"],"gazette_id":"1131601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1131601_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請金融監督管理委員會黃主任委員天牧率臺灣證券交易所股份有限公司林董事長修銘及財團法\n人中華民國證券櫃檯買賣中心陳董事長永誠、中央銀行分別就「從 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306.979, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 311.533, \"end\": 334.074, \"text\": \"我希望你今天就能夠正式答覆我到底你們管是不管啦基於事權統一基於金管會應該對我們國內做這樣子銀行業務的公司本來就應該要納管不是這樣嗎黃主委你的看法呢\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 311.533, \"end\": 311.773, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"希\", \"start\": 311.773, \"end\": 311.953, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"望\", \"start\": 311.953, \"end\": 312.274, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 312.274, \"end\": 312.414, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 312.414, \"end\": 312.534, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 312.534, \"end\": 312.714, \"score\": 0.893}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 312.714, \"end\": 312.874, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 312.874, \"end\": 313.635, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"正\", \"start\": 313.635, \"end\": 313.915, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"式\", \"start\": 313.915, \"end\": 314.155, \"score\": 0.955}, {\"word\": \"答\", \"start\": 314.155, \"end\": 314.356, 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702.521, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 702.521, \"end\": 702.581, \"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"林\", \"start\": 702.581, \"end\": 702.841, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"楚\", \"start\": 702.841, \"end\": 702.961, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"雲\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 702.961, \"end\": 702.981, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:07,070 --> 00:00:26,041\n主席有請金管會黃主委有請黃主委黃主委我今天不跟你談ETF這已經談了很多我下次再救教你我談另外一個我個人覺得是蠻嚴重的問題就是說我們金管會對實際已經在經營融資的這三家註定公司\n\n2\n00:00:35,953 --> 00:01:01,179\n我用八個字形容就是自廢武功該管不管這就是金管會現在的情況如果根據銀行法第29條非銀行不得執行銀行相關的這些業務那你也很清楚你們金管會的組織法第二條第三條\n\n3\n00:01:02,543 --> 00:01:30,693\n金管會就是掌管我們國內金融公司銀行業、保險業期貨證券等等那你們對於這些行業他們的設立以及管理這都是在你們執掌的範圍內你非常清楚嘛不是嗎那麼這三家中租抵合合論跟育融\n\n4\n00:01:31,894 --> 00:01:58,987\n他們現在放款的金額來源還不是他們自有資金他們還是大量的從我們的銀行業來融資他們跟38家銀行融資低利那麼高利貸放款給需要的消費者那這金額多大\n\n5\n00:02:00,253 --> 00:02:28,948\n那個黃主任我私下跟金管會講過啊光是中租敵核向銀行借的就高達2396億天啊然後核潤不遑多讓啦大概他一半980億另外這一家裕融他可能後台很硬嘛\n\n6\n00:02:30,421 --> 00:02:53,687\n他連金額都懶得申報啦這也是我要求金管委員你們要下去查查的他們實質經營銀行當中最重要的融資的項目結果他佔盡我們全體我們國人辛苦的存款他們佔盡這些便宜\n\n7\n00:02:56,271 --> 00:03:24,528\n他們便於形式由銀行的手中取得低利的融資再去放高利貸結果金管會放任這個事情不管6年前中央銀行他們就有做出一些調查一些報告也提供給我們金管會啊2018年6年前中央銀行調查的結果\n\n8\n00:03:25,649 --> 00:03:53,848\n全世界各國多數這樣子做BMPL做這樣租賃的行業公司都是由他們國家之內像我們金管會這樣子的單位他們在管理由公部門的金融管理機關在管理所以我不懂啊我們金管會有那麼多專業的金融人士\n\n9\n00:03:55,390 --> 00:04:19,057\n我們有專業的這麼多的人才我們才能夠經常性的去對這些實質在金融放款業務的這些公司去做查查不是這樣嗎金管會是全國最多這一部分的專業人士結果你們放任不管\n\n10\n00:04:20,942 --> 00:04:39,012\n上次我質詢的時候也虧我們另外一位召集人還跟我說質詢完以後他跟我說這個部分經濟不管我去查一下這是什麼經濟不管經濟不管的是公司法我們臺灣有100萬公司100萬家公司\n\n11\n00:04:41,685 --> 00:05:06,979\n這三家這麼重大金額的經濟部問他只能管百萬分之三而且是公司法那在管什麼管所以儘管會現在這個不管的做法我認為就推卸責任了避重就輕把他推給經濟部經濟部我們實質去問他也一問三不知啊所以那個黃主委\n\n12\n00:05:11,533 --> 00:05:34,074\n我希望你今天就能夠正式答覆我到底你們管是不管啦基於事權統一基於金管會應該對我們國內做這樣子銀行業務的公司本來就應該要納管不是這樣嗎黃主委你的看法呢\n\n13\n00:05:35,064 --> 00:05:58,347\n委員是不是可以給我一點時間回覆您報告第一點我想第一次拜會您對金融事務的瞭解是非常尊敬我以下回答如果有跟您的想法不一樣的地方請您多包涵第一點這個人資公司是不是專屬銀行業務其實銀行法29條其實重點是吸收存款對不特定多數人吸收存款那是專屬業務\n\n14\n00:05:59,648 --> 00:06:21,507\n放款不是銀行的專屬業務這個就是漏洞這個我們會另外提案改修法但是但是放款跟存款是一體兩面的業務啊他們就是鑽這個漏洞我認為這就是立法上這一個疏忽那讓大家有話講不是這樣嗎你請說\n\n15\n00:06:24,129 --> 00:06:29,472\n經濟部公司登記中有這種公司業務有這種融資行為的有6800多家\n\n16\n00:06:33,171 --> 00:06:54,506\n那這就是現在的現況就現在就沒有說融資一定是專屬銀行業務然後跟你回答您垂詢的這幾家所謂的大型的融資公司我們管不管我跟您報告在2016、2017的時候它的洗錢房子就已經由主管機關在管融資性住院公司是我們在管\n\n17\n00:06:55,327 --> 00:07:07,322\n第二去年年初大家談BNPL的時候我們就找最大的那家中租公中租集合來我說你們做這件事情一定要好好去做我們把銀行做\n\n18\n00:07:08,362 --> 00:07:29,184\n做這種授信的規則用了一個租賃做BNPL的原則給他請你在租賃公會通過請各租賃公司去遵循這是第二件事第三點最近網路上那個影片出來之後我們約談了四家上市櫃公司的這種大型租賃公司兩禮拜前我們開了一個會議\n\n19\n00:07:30,726 --> 00:07:51,339\n要求因為都是上市櫃要求交易所櫃買中心訂一個內控準則由金管會提供一個專業的內控準則要求這4家公司訂在自己的規定中怎麼樣去做這種尤其對年輕人的壽性租賃業務年底之前交易所櫃買中心去做內控查核第二點\n\n20\n00:07:52,523 --> 00:07:52,843\n黃主任委員\n\n21\n00:08:10,271 --> 00:08:29,286\n到了已經到金融怪獸這麼龐大的金融怪獸你竟然只要求他自律天啊他律都律不住了不是嗎報告委員那個內控是要年底前交易所要去查核的不是指自律第二點\n\n22\n00:08:31,158 --> 00:08:54,498\n我們會要求再訂一個完整的租賃公司做這種您關心對這種年輕人的這種授信的原則要求在公會中要求他們去遵循最重要您提到這些租賃公司的資金來源來自於金融機構票券公司銀行局也會去跟這些這就是我覺得最莫名其妙的他自家的錢去借\n\n23\n00:08:55,427 --> 00:09:23,747\n那還比較沒話講如果他是大量的如果把裕榮加進去我保守估計這三家等於五千億啦來自我們存款大眾存到銀行的錢被銀行大剌剌的用人情的方式低利借給這三家超大的金融怪獸租賃公司讓他們去放高利貸如果這樣子的放款是對的的話\n\n24\n00:09:24,708 --> 00:09:52,148\n那你銀行來做就好啊消費性貸款銀行直接可以做嘛銀行等於變相圖利了這三家租賃貫受報告委員我跟您報告因為時間有限我跟你講我認為的最可怕還有另外一個問題就是四個字超額授信啊你知道他們如何強害我們現在這一代的青年人嗎他們利用他們剛出社會那\n\n25\n00:09:53,627 --> 00:10:13,090\n要買車啦買其他消費品買一部80萬的車借他100萬你車子都不用自己出錢還20萬給你零用金結果這些是高額的利息跟超高額的違約金還有父母金擔保啊\n\n26\n00:10:14,031 --> 00:10:38,390\n青年人還有30年的工作餘命啊他們也不怕討不到那這些公司他們因為他假借他因為他不是銀行嘛所以他就找這個討債公司來討現在目前社會的情況是這個樣子所以超額授信這個我想您與金管會你這麼資深的金融專業來講\n\n27\n00:10:39,744 --> 00:10:58,837\n超額授信是所有銀行業金融機構最忌諱的事情結果現在我們眼睜睜的看這三家租賃怪獸他們每天在做超額授信的事情在搶賴我們社會的青年朋友們\n\n28\n00:11:00,202 --> 00:11:15,704\n法委員您宇宙新常的指示我們都會去處理尤其您講到對於年輕人的獸性超額部分我們會去處理我跟您報告他們用這個超額獸性來誘惑年輕人嘛是我想委員會主席啊抱歉主席我再30秒就好所以喔我要求你這樣啦\n\n29\n00:11:17,066 --> 00:11:41,016\n請去查我們銀行是以什麼樣的名義貸款給這三家租賃公司這五千億的貸款銀行的融資融資給這三家金融怪獸租賃業是什麼樣的名義查這些放款融資有沒有中間不當的\n\n30\n00:11:42,381 --> 00:11:42,981\n接著我們請林楚雲委員質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n7070\t26041\t主席有請金管會黃主委有請黃主委黃主委我今天不跟你談ETF這已經談了很多我下次再救教你我談另外一個我個人覺得是蠻嚴重的問題就是說我們金管會對實際已經在經營融資的這三家註定公司\n35953\t61179\t我用八個字形容就是自廢武功該管不管這就是金管會現在的情況如果根據銀行法第29條非銀行不得執行銀行相關的這些業務那你也很清楚你們金管會的組織法第二條第三條\n62543\t90693\t金管會就是掌管我們國內金融公司銀行業、保險業期貨證券等等那你們對於這些行業他們的設立以及管理這都是在你們執掌的範圍內你非常清楚嘛不是嗎那麼這三家中租抵合合論跟育融\n91894\t118987\t他們現在放款的金額來源還不是他們自有資金他們還是大量的從我們的銀行業來融資他們跟38家銀行融資低利那麼高利貸放款給需要的消費者那這金額多大\n120253\t148948\t那個黃主任我私下跟金管會講過啊光是中租敵核向銀行借的就高達2396億天啊然後核潤不遑多讓啦大概他一半980億另外這一家裕融他可能後台很硬嘛\n150421\t173687\t他連金額都懶得申報啦這也是我要求金管委員你們要下去查查的他們實質經營銀行當中最重要的融資的項目結果他佔盡我們全體我們國人辛苦的存款他們佔盡這些便宜\n176271\t204528\t他們便於形式由銀行的手中取得低利的融資再去放高利貸結果金管會放任這個事情不管6年前中央銀行他們就有做出一些調查一些報告也提供給我們金管會啊2018年6年前中央銀行調查的結果\n205649\t233848\t全世界各國多數這樣子做BMPL做這樣租賃的行業公司都是由他們國家之內像我們金管會這樣子的單位他們在管理由公部門的金融管理機關在管理所以我不懂啊我們金管會有那麼多專業的金融人士\n235390\t259057\t我們有專業的這麼多的人才我們才能夠經常性的去對這些實質在金融放款業務的這些公司去做查查不是這樣嗎金管會是全國最多這一部分的專業人士結果你們放任不管\n260942\t279012\t上次我質詢的時候也虧我們另外一位召集人還跟我說質詢完以後他跟我說這個部分經濟不管我去查一下這是什麼經濟不管經濟不管的是公司法我們臺灣有100萬公司100萬家公司\n281685\t306979\t這三家這麼重大金額的經濟部問他只能管百萬分之三而且是公司法那在管什麼管所以儘管會現在這個不管的做法我認為就推卸責任了避重就輕把他推給經濟部經濟部我們實質去問他也一問三不知啊所以那個黃主委\n311533\t334074\t我希望你今天就能夠正式答覆我到底你們管是不管啦基於事權統一基於金管會應該對我們國內做這樣子銀行業務的公司本來就應該要納管不是這樣嗎黃主委你的看法呢\n335064\t358347\t委員是不是可以給我一點時間回覆您報告第一點我想第一次拜會您對金融事務的瞭解是非常尊敬我以下回答如果有跟您的想法不一樣的地方請您多包涵第一點這個人資公司是不是專屬銀行業務其實銀行法29條其實重點是吸收存款對不特定多數人吸收存款那是專屬業務\n359648\t381507\t放款不是銀行的專屬業務這個就是漏洞這個我們會另外提案改修法但是但是放款跟存款是一體兩面的業務啊他們就是鑽這個漏洞我認為這就是立法上這一個疏忽那讓大家有話講不是這樣嗎你請說\n384129\t389472\t經濟部公司登記中有這種公司業務有這種融資行為的有6800多家\n393171\t414506\t那這就是現在的現況就現在就沒有說融資一定是專屬銀行業務然後跟你回答您垂詢的這幾家所謂的大型的融資公司我們管不管我跟您報告在2016、2017的時候它的洗錢房子就已經由主管機關在管融資性住院公司是我們在管\n415327\t427322\t第二 去年年初大家談BNPL的時候我們就找最大的那家中租公中租集合來我說你們做這件事情一定要好好去做我們把銀行做\n428362\t449184\t做這種授信的規則用了一個租賃做BNPL的原則給他請你在租賃公會通過請各租賃公司去遵循這是第二件事第三點最近網路上那個影片出來之後我們約談了四家上市櫃公司的這種大型租賃公司兩禮拜前我們開了一個會議\n450726\t471339\t要求因為都是上市櫃要求交易所櫃買中心訂一個內控準則由金管會提供一個專業的內控準則要求這4家公司訂在自己的規定中怎麼樣去做這種尤其對年輕人的壽性租賃業務年底之前交易所櫃買中心去做內控查核第二點\n472523\t472843\t黃主任委員\n490271\t509286\t到了已經到金融怪獸這麼龐大的金融怪獸你竟然只要求他自律天啊他律都律不住了不是嗎報告委員那個內控是要年底前交易所要去查核的不是指自律第二點\n511158\t534498\t我們會要求再訂一個完整的租賃公司做這種您關心對這種年輕人的這種授信的原則要求在公會中要求他們去遵循最重要您提到這些租賃公司的資金來源來自於金融機構票券公司銀行局也會去跟這些這就是我覺得最莫名其妙的他自家的錢去借\n535427\t563747\t那還比較沒話講如果他是大量的如果把裕榮加進去我保守估計這三家等於五千億啦來自我們存款大眾存到銀行的錢被銀行大剌剌的用人情的方式低利借給這三家超大的金融怪獸租賃公司讓他們去放高利貸如果這樣子的放款是對的的話\n564708\t592148\t那你銀行來做就好啊消費性貸款銀行直接可以做嘛銀行等於變相圖利了這三家租賃貫受報告委員我跟您報告因為時間有限我跟你講我認為的最可怕還有另外一個問題就是四個字超額授信啊你知道他們如何強害我們現在這一代的青年人嗎他們利用他們剛出社會那\n593627\t613090\t要買車啦買其他消費品買一部80萬的車借他100萬你車子都不用自己出錢還20萬給你零用金結果這些是高額的利息跟超高額的違約金還有父母金擔保啊\n614031\t638390\t青年人還有30年的工作餘命啊他們也不怕討不到那這些公司他們因為他假借他因為他不是銀行嘛所以他就找這個討債公司來討現在目前社會的情況是這個樣子所以超額授信這個我想您與金管會你這麼資深的金融專業來講\n639744\t658837\t超額授信是所有銀行業金融機構最忌諱的事情結果現在我們眼睜睜的看這三家租賃怪獸他們每天在做超額授信的事情在搶賴我們社會的青年朋友們\n660202\t675704\t法委員您宇宙新常的指示我們都會去處理尤其您講到對於年輕人的獸性超額部分我們會去處理我跟您報告他們用這個超額獸性來誘惑年輕人嘛是 我想委員會主席啊 抱歉主席我再30秒就好所以喔 我要求你這樣啦\n677066\t701016\t請去查我們銀行是以什麼樣的名義貸款給這三家租賃公司這五千億的貸款銀行的融資融資給這三家金融怪獸租賃業是什麼樣的名義查這些放款融資有沒有中間不當的\n702381\t702981\t接著我們請林楚雲委員質詢\n","txt":"主席有請金管會黃主委有請黃主委黃主委我今天不跟你談ETF這已經談了很多我下次再救教你我談另外一個我個人覺得是蠻嚴重的問題就是說我們金管會對實際已經在經營融資的這三家註定公司\n我用八個字形容就是自廢武功該管不管這就是金管會現在的情況如果根據銀行法第29條非銀行不得執行銀行相關的這些業務那你也很清楚你們金管會的組織法第二條第三條\n金管會就是掌管我們國內金融公司銀行業、保險業期貨證券等等那你們對於這些行業他們的設立以及管理這都是在你們執掌的範圍內你非常清楚嘛不是嗎那麼這三家中租抵合合論跟育融\n他們現在放款的金額來源還不是他們自有資金他們還是大量的從我們的銀行業來融資他們跟38家銀行融資低利那麼高利貸放款給需要的消費者那這金額多大\n那個黃主任我私下跟金管會講過啊光是中租敵核向銀行借的就高達2396億天啊然後核潤不遑多讓啦大概他一半980億另外這一家裕融他可能後台很硬嘛\n他連金額都懶得申報啦這也是我要求金管委員你們要下去查查的他們實質經營銀行當中最重要的融資的項目結果他佔盡我們全體我們國人辛苦的存款他們佔盡這些便宜\n他們便於形式由銀行的手中取得低利的融資再去放高利貸結果金管會放任這個事情不管6年前中央銀行他們就有做出一些調查一些報告也提供給我們金管會啊2018年6年前中央銀行調查的結果\n全世界各國多數這樣子做BMPL做這樣租賃的行業公司都是由他們國家之內像我們金管會這樣子的單位他們在管理由公部門的金融管理機關在管理所以我不懂啊我們金管會有那麼多專業的金融人士\n我們有專業的這麼多的人才我們才能夠經常性的去對這些實質在金融放款業務的這些公司去做查查不是這樣嗎金管會是全國最多這一部分的專業人士結果你們放任不管\n上次我質詢的時候也虧我們另外一位召集人還跟我說質詢完以後他跟我說這個部分經濟不管我去查一下這是什麼經濟不管經濟不管的是公司法我們臺灣有100萬公司100萬家公司\n這三家這麼重大金額的經濟部問他只能管百萬分之三而且是公司法那在管什麼管所以儘管會現在這個不管的做法我認為就推卸責任了避重就輕把他推給經濟部經濟部我們實質去問他也一問三不知啊所以那個黃主委\n我希望你今天就能夠正式答覆我到底你們管是不管啦基於事權統一基於金管會應該對我們國內做這樣子銀行業務的公司本來就應該要納管不是這樣嗎黃主委你的看法呢\n委員是不是可以給我一點時間回覆您報告第一點我想第一次拜會您對金融事務的瞭解是非常尊敬我以下回答如果有跟您的想法不一樣的地方請您多包涵第一點這個人資公司是不是專屬銀行業務其實銀行法29條其實重點是吸收存款對不特定多數人吸收存款那是專屬業務\n放款不是銀行的專屬業務這個就是漏洞這個我們會另外提案改修法但是但是放款跟存款是一體兩面的業務啊他們就是鑽這個漏洞我認為這就是立法上這一個疏忽那讓大家有話講不是這樣嗎你請說\n經濟部公司登記中有這種公司業務有這種融資行為的有6800多家\n那這就是現在的現況就現在就沒有說融資一定是專屬銀行業務然後跟你回答您垂詢的這幾家所謂的大型的融資公司我們管不管我跟您報告在2016、2017的時候它的洗錢房子就已經由主管機關在管融資性住院公司是我們在管\n第二 去年年初大家談BNPL的時候我們就找最大的那家中租公中租集合來我說你們做這件事情一定要好好去做我們把銀行做\n做這種授信的規則用了一個租賃做BNPL的原則給他請你在租賃公會通過請各租賃公司去遵循這是第二件事第三點最近網路上那個影片出來之後我們約談了四家上市櫃公司的這種大型租賃公司兩禮拜前我們開了一個會議\n要求因為都是上市櫃要求交易所櫃買中心訂一個內控準則由金管會提供一個專業的內控準則要求這4家公司訂在自己的規定中怎麼樣去做這種尤其對年輕人的壽性租賃業務年底之前交易所櫃買中心去做內控查核第二點\n黃主任委員\n到了已經到金融怪獸這麼龐大的金融怪獸你竟然只要求他自律天啊他律都律不住了不是嗎報告委員那個內控是要年底前交易所要去查核的不是指自律第二點\n我們會要求再訂一個完整的租賃公司做這種您關心對這種年輕人的這種授信的原則要求在公會中要求他們去遵循最重要您提到這些租賃公司的資金來源來自於金融機構票券公司銀行局也會去跟這些這就是我覺得最莫名其妙的他自家的錢去借\n那還比較沒話講如果他是大量的如果把裕榮加進去我保守估計這三家等於五千億啦來自我們存款大眾存到銀行的錢被銀行大剌剌的用人情的方式低利借給這三家超大的金融怪獸租賃公司讓他們去放高利貸如果這樣子的放款是對的的話\n那你銀行來做就好啊消費性貸款銀行直接可以做嘛銀行等於變相圖利了這三家租賃貫受報告委員我跟您報告因為時間有限我跟你講我認為的最可怕還有另外一個問題就是四個字超額授信啊你知道他們如何強害我們現在這一代的青年人嗎他們利用他們剛出社會那\n要買車啦買其他消費品買一部80萬的車借他100萬你車子都不用自己出錢還20萬給你零用金結果這些是高額的利息跟超高額的違約金還有父母金擔保啊\n青年人還有30年的工作餘命啊他們也不怕討不到那這些公司他們因為他假借他因為他不是銀行嘛所以他就找這個討債公司來討現在目前社會的情況是這個樣子所以超額授信這個我想您與金管會你這麼資深的金融專業來講\n超額授信是所有銀行業金融機構最忌諱的事情結果現在我們眼睜睜的看這三家租賃怪獸他們每天在做超額授信的事情在搶賴我們社會的青年朋友們\n法委員您宇宙新常的指示我們都會去處理尤其您講到對於年輕人的獸性超額部分我們會去處理我跟您報告他們用這個超額獸性來誘惑年輕人嘛是 我想委員會主席啊 抱歉主席我再30秒就好所以喔 我要求你這樣啦\n請去查我們銀行是以什麼樣的名義貸款給這三家租賃公司這五千億的貸款銀行的融資融資給這三家金融怪獸租賃業是什麼樣的名義查這些放款融資有沒有中間不當的\n接著我們請林楚雲委員質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:07.070 --> 00:26.041\n主席有請金管會黃主委有請黃主委黃主委我今天不跟你談ETF這已經談了很多我下次再救教你我談另外一個我個人覺得是蠻嚴重的問題就是說我們金管會對實際已經在經營融資的這三家註定公司\n\n00:35.953 --> 01:01.179\n我用八個字形容就是自廢武功該管不管這就是金管會現在的情況如果根據銀行法第29條非銀行不得執行銀行相關的這些業務那你也很清楚你們金管會的組織法第二條第三條\n\n01:02.543 --> 01:30.693\n金管會就是掌管我們國內金融公司銀行業、保險業期貨證券等等那你們對於這些行業他們的設立以及管理這都是在你們執掌的範圍內你非常清楚嘛不是嗎那麼這三家中租抵合合論跟育融\n\n01:31.894 --> 01:58.987\n他們現在放款的金額來源還不是他們自有資金他們還是大量的從我們的銀行業來融資他們跟38家銀行融資低利那麼高利貸放款給需要的消費者那這金額多大\n\n02:00.253 --> 02:28.948\n那個黃主任我私下跟金管會講過啊光是中租敵核向銀行借的就高達2396億天啊然後核潤不遑多讓啦大概他一半980億另外這一家裕融他可能後台很硬嘛\n\n02:30.421 --> 02:53.687\n他連金額都懶得申報啦這也是我要求金管委員你們要下去查查的他們實質經營銀行當中最重要的融資的項目結果他佔盡我們全體我們國人辛苦的存款他們佔盡這些便宜\n\n02:56.271 --> 03:24.528\n他們便於形式由銀行的手中取得低利的融資再去放高利貸結果金管會放任這個事情不管6年前中央銀行他們就有做出一些調查一些報告也提供給我們金管會啊2018年6年前中央銀行調查的結果\n\n03:25.649 --> 03:53.848\n全世界各國多數這樣子做BMPL做這樣租賃的行業公司都是由他們國家之內像我們金管會這樣子的單位他們在管理由公部門的金融管理機關在管理所以我不懂啊我們金管會有那麼多專業的金融人士\n\n03:55.390 --> 04:19.057\n我們有專業的這麼多的人才我們才能夠經常性的去對這些實質在金融放款業務的這些公司去做查查不是這樣嗎金管會是全國最多這一部分的專業人士結果你們放任不管\n\n04:20.942 --> 04:39.012\n上次我質詢的時候也虧我們另外一位召集人還跟我說質詢完以後他跟我說這個部分經濟不管我去查一下這是什麼經濟不管經濟不管的是公司法我們臺灣有100萬公司100萬家公司\n\n04:41.685 --> 05:06.979\n這三家這麼重大金額的經濟部問他只能管百萬分之三而且是公司法那在管什麼管所以儘管會現在這個不管的做法我認為就推卸責任了避重就輕把他推給經濟部經濟部我們實質去問他也一問三不知啊所以那個黃主委\n\n05:11.533 --> 05:34.074\n我希望你今天就能夠正式答覆我到底你們管是不管啦基於事權統一基於金管會應該對我們國內做這樣子銀行業務的公司本來就應該要納管不是這樣嗎黃主委你的看法呢\n\n05:35.064 --> 05:58.347\n委員是不是可以給我一點時間回覆您報告第一點我想第一次拜會您對金融事務的瞭解是非常尊敬我以下回答如果有跟您的想法不一樣的地方請您多包涵第一點這個人資公司是不是專屬銀行業務其實銀行法29條其實重點是吸收存款對不特定多數人吸收存款那是專屬業務\n\n05:59.648 --> 06:21.507\n放款不是銀行的專屬業務這個就是漏洞這個我們會另外提案改修法但是但是放款跟存款是一體兩面的業務啊他們就是鑽這個漏洞我認為這就是立法上這一個疏忽那讓大家有話講不是這樣嗎你請說\n\n06:24.129 --> 06:29.472\n經濟部公司登記中有這種公司業務有這種融資行為的有6800多家\n\n06:33.171 --> 06:54.506\n那這就是現在的現況就現在就沒有說融資一定是專屬銀行業務然後跟你回答您垂詢的這幾家所謂的大型的融資公司我們管不管我跟您報告在2016、2017的時候它的洗錢房子就已經由主管機關在管融資性住院公司是我們在管\n\n06:55.327 --> 07:07.322\n第二去年年初大家談BNPL的時候我們就找最大的那家中租公中租集合來我說你們做這件事情一定要好好去做我們把銀行做\n\n07:08.362 --> 07:29.184\n做這種授信的規則用了一個租賃做BNPL的原則給他請你在租賃公會通過請各租賃公司去遵循這是第二件事第三點最近網路上那個影片出來之後我們約談了四家上市櫃公司的這種大型租賃公司兩禮拜前我們開了一個會議\n\n07:30.726 --> 07:51.339\n要求因為都是上市櫃要求交易所櫃買中心訂一個內控準則由金管會提供一個專業的內控準則要求這4家公司訂在自己的規定中怎麼樣去做這種尤其對年輕人的壽性租賃業務年底之前交易所櫃買中心去做內控查核第二點\n\n07:52.523 --> 07:52.843\n黃主任委員\n\n08:10.271 --> 08:29.286\n到了已經到金融怪獸這麼龐大的金融怪獸你竟然只要求他自律天啊他律都律不住了不是嗎報告委員那個內控是要年底前交易所要去查核的不是指自律第二點\n\n08:31.158 --> 08:54.498\n我們會要求再訂一個完整的租賃公司做這種您關心對這種年輕人的這種授信的原則要求在公會中要求他們去遵循最重要您提到這些租賃公司的資金來源來自於金融機構票券公司銀行局也會去跟這些這就是我覺得最莫名其妙的他自家的錢去借\n\n08:55.427 --> 09:23.747\n那還比較沒話講如果他是大量的如果把裕榮加進去我保守估計這三家等於五千億啦來自我們存款大眾存到銀行的錢被銀行大剌剌的用人情的方式低利借給這三家超大的金融怪獸租賃公司讓他們去放高利貸如果這樣子的放款是對的的話\n\n09:24.708 --> 09:52.148\n那你銀行來做就好啊消費性貸款銀行直接可以做嘛銀行等於變相圖利了這三家租賃貫受報告委員我跟您報告因為時間有限我跟你講我認為的最可怕還有另外一個問題就是四個字超額授信啊你知道他們如何強害我們現在這一代的青年人嗎他們利用他們剛出社會那\n\n09:53.627 --> 10:13.090\n要買車啦買其他消費品買一部80萬的車借他100萬你車子都不用自己出錢還20萬給你零用金結果這些是高額的利息跟超高額的違約金還有父母金擔保啊\n\n10:14.031 --> 10:38.390\n青年人還有30年的工作餘命啊他們也不怕討不到那這些公司他們因為他假借他因為他不是銀行嘛所以他就找這個討債公司來討現在目前社會的情況是這個樣子所以超額授信這個我想您與金管會你這麼資深的金融專業來講\n\n10:39.744 --> 10:58.837\n超額授信是所有銀行業金融機構最忌諱的事情結果現在我們眼睜睜的看這三家租賃怪獸他們每天在做超額授信的事情在搶賴我們社會的青年朋友們\n\n11:00.202 --> 11:15.704\n法委員您宇宙新常的指示我們都會去處理尤其您講到對於年輕人的獸性超額部分我們會去處理我跟您報告他們用這個超額獸性來誘惑年輕人嘛是我想委員會主席啊抱歉主席我再30秒就好所以喔我要求你這樣啦\n\n11:17.066 --> 11:41.016\n請去查我們銀行是以什麼樣的名義貸款給這三家租賃公司這五千億的貸款銀行的融資融資給這三家金融怪獸租賃業是什麼樣的名義查這些放款融資有沒有中間不當的\n\n11:42.381 --> 11:42.981\n接著我們請林楚雲委員質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":7.07,"end":26.041,"text":"主席有請金管會黃主委有請黃主委黃主委我今天不跟你談ETF這已經談了很多我下次再救教你我談另外一個我個人覺得是蠻嚴重的問題就是說我們金管會對實際已經在經營融資的這三家註定公司"},{"start":35.953,"end":61.179,"text":"我用八個字形容就是自廢武功該管不管這就是金管會現在的情況如果根據銀行法第29條非銀行不得執行銀行相關的這些業務那你也很清楚你們金管會的組織法第二條第三條"},{"start":62.543,"end":90.693,"text":"金管會就是掌管我們國內金融公司銀行業、保險業期貨證券等等那你們對於這些行業他們的設立以及管理這都是在你們執掌的範圍內你非常清楚嘛不是嗎那麼這三家中租抵合合論跟育融"},{"start":91.894,"end":118.987,"text":"他們現在放款的金額來源還不是他們自有資金他們還是大量的從我們的銀行業來融資他們跟38家銀行融資低利那麼高利貸放款給需要的消費者那這金額多大"},{"start":120.253,"end":148.948,"text":"那個黃主任我私下跟金管會講過啊光是中租敵核向銀行借的就高達2396億天啊然後核潤不遑多讓啦大概他一半980億另外這一家裕融他可能後台很硬嘛"},{"start":150.421,"end":173.687,"text":"他連金額都懶得申報啦這也是我要求金管委員你們要下去查查的他們實質經營銀行當中最重要的融資的項目結果他佔盡我們全體我們國人辛苦的存款他們佔盡這些便宜"},{"start":176.271,"end":204.528,"text":"他們便於形式由銀行的手中取得低利的融資再去放高利貸結果金管會放任這個事情不管6年前中央銀行他們就有做出一些調查一些報告也提供給我們金管會啊2018年6年前中央銀行調查的結果"},{"start":205.649,"end":233.848,"text":"全世界各國多數這樣子做BMPL做這樣租賃的行業公司都是由他們國家之內像我們金管會這樣子的單位他們在管理由公部門的金融管理機關在管理所以我不懂啊我們金管會有那麼多專業的金融人士"},{"start":235.39,"end":259.057,"text":"我們有專業的這麼多的人才我們才能夠經常性的去對這些實質在金融放款業務的這些公司去做查查不是這樣嗎金管會是全國最多這一部分的專業人士結果你們放任不管"},{"start":260.942,"end":279.012,"text":"上次我質詢的時候也虧我們另外一位召集人還跟我說質詢完以後他跟我說這個部分經濟不管我去查一下這是什麼經濟不管經濟不管的是公司法我們臺灣有100萬公司100萬家公司"},{"start":281.685,"end":306.979,"text":"這三家這麼重大金額的經濟部問他只能管百萬分之三而且是公司法那在管什麼管所以儘管會現在這個不管的做法我認為就推卸責任了避重就輕把他推給經濟部經濟部我們實質去問他也一問三不知啊所以那個黃主委"},{"start":311.533,"end":334.074,"text":"我希望你今天就能夠正式答覆我到底你們管是不管啦基於事權統一基於金管會應該對我們國內做這樣子銀行業務的公司本來就應該要納管不是這樣嗎黃主委你的看法呢"},{"start":335.064,"end":358.347,"text":"委員是不是可以給我一點時間回覆您報告第一點我想第一次拜會您對金融事務的瞭解是非常尊敬我以下回答如果有跟您的想法不一樣的地方請您多包涵第一點這個人資公司是不是專屬銀行業務其實銀行法29條其實重點是吸收存款對不特定多數人吸收存款那是專屬業務"},{"start":359.648,"end":381.507,"text":"放款不是銀行的專屬業務這個就是漏洞這個我們會另外提案改修法但是但是放款跟存款是一體兩面的業務啊他們就是鑽這個漏洞我認為這就是立法上這一個疏忽那讓大家有話講不是這樣嗎你請說"},{"start":384.129,"end":389.472,"text":"經濟部公司登記中有這種公司業務有這種融資行為的有6800多家"},{"start":393.171,"end":414.506,"text":"那這就是現在的現況就現在就沒有說融資一定是專屬銀行業務然後跟你回答您垂詢的這幾家所謂的大型的融資公司我們管不管我跟您報告在2016、2017的時候它的洗錢房子就已經由主管機關在管融資性住院公司是我們在管"},{"start":415.327,"end":427.322,"text":"第二 去年年初大家談BNPL的時候我們就找最大的那家中租公中租集合來我說你們做這件事情一定要好好去做我們把銀行做"},{"start":428.362,"end":449.184,"text":"做這種授信的規則用了一個租賃做BNPL的原則給他請你在租賃公會通過請各租賃公司去遵循這是第二件事第三點最近網路上那個影片出來之後我們約談了四家上市櫃公司的這種大型租賃公司兩禮拜前我們開了一個會議"},{"start":450.726,"end":471.339,"text":"要求因為都是上市櫃要求交易所櫃買中心訂一個內控準則由金管會提供一個專業的內控準則要求這4家公司訂在自己的規定中怎麼樣去做這種尤其對年輕人的壽性租賃業務年底之前交易所櫃買中心去做內控查核第二點"},{"start":472.523,"end":472.843,"text":"黃主任委員"},{"start":490.271,"end":509.286,"text":"到了已經到金融怪獸這麼龐大的金融怪獸你竟然只要求他自律天啊他律都律不住了不是嗎報告委員那個內控是要年底前交易所要去查核的不是指自律第二點"},{"start":511.158,"end":534.498,"text":"我們會要求再訂一個完整的租賃公司做這種您關心對這種年輕人的這種授信的原則要求在公會中要求他們去遵循最重要您提到這些租賃公司的資金來源來自於金融機構票券公司銀行局也會去跟這些這就是我覺得最莫名其妙的他自家的錢去借"},{"start":535.427,"end":563.747,"text":"那還比較沒話講如果他是大量的如果把裕榮加進去我保守估計這三家等於五千億啦來自我們存款大眾存到銀行的錢被銀行大剌剌的用人情的方式低利借給這三家超大的金融怪獸租賃公司讓他們去放高利貸如果這樣子的放款是對的的話"},{"start":564.708,"end":592.148,"text":"那你銀行來做就好啊消費性貸款銀行直接可以做嘛銀行等於變相圖利了這三家租賃貫受報告委員我跟您報告因為時間有限我跟你講我認為的最可怕還有另外一個問題就是四個字超額授信啊你知道他們如何強害我們現在這一代的青年人嗎他們利用他們剛出社會那"},{"start":593.627,"end":613.09,"text":"要買車啦買其他消費品買一部80萬的車借他100萬你車子都不用自己出錢還20萬給你零用金結果這些是高額的利息跟超高額的違約金還有父母金擔保啊"},{"start":614.031,"end":638.39,"text":"青年人還有30年的工作餘命啊他們也不怕討不到那這些公司他們因為他假借他因為他不是銀行嘛所以他就找這個討債公司來討現在目前社會的情況是這個樣子所以超額授信這個我想您與金管會你這麼資深的金融專業來講"},{"start":639.744,"end":658.837,"text":"超額授信是所有銀行業金融機構最忌諱的事情結果現在我們眼睜睜的看這三家租賃怪獸他們每天在做超額授信的事情在搶賴我們社會的青年朋友們"},{"start":660.202,"end":675.704,"text":"法委員您宇宙新常的指示我們都會去處理尤其您講到對於年輕人的獸性超額部分我們會去處理我跟您報告他們用這個超額獸性來誘惑年輕人嘛是 我想委員會主席啊 抱歉主席我再30秒就好所以喔 我要求你這樣啦"},{"start":677.066,"end":701.016,"text":"請去查我們銀行是以什麼樣的名義貸款給這三家租賃公司這五千億的貸款銀行的融資融資給這三家金融怪獸租賃業是什麼樣的名義查這些放款融資有沒有中間不當的"},{"start":702.381,"end":702.981,"text":"接著我們請林楚雲委員質詢"}]}}}}