{"id":150020,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150020","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/14550b3f67fe733ac1e0ab7e7a7ff2c087ed802f1bf30134f8ba9b0039caa7a6498159baeeef385c5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"何欣純","委員發言時間":"12:35:14 - 12:41:09","影片長度":"00:05:55","會議時間":"2024-03-18T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請教育部、司法院、法務部及內政部列席就「校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園之輔導機制及前科紀錄是否塗銷」進行專題報告，並備質詢。（3月18日、20日及21日三天一次會））","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第4次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":4,"committees":[22],"id":"委員會-11-1-22-4"},"date":"2024-03-18","duration":355,"end_time":"2024-03-18T12:41:09+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-18T12:35:14+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":947,"blocks":[["何委員欣純：（12時35分）謝謝柯召委。請部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["潘部長文忠：委員好。"],["何委員欣純：部長好。部長，過去我一直在教文委員會，我們也已經就今天相關的校安問題跟孩子的輔導問題當面溝通好多次。但是很遺憾，或說我認為好還可以更好的是，發生一連串事件是告訴我們不夠好，我們還必須再檢討、再改進、再加強。"],["潘部長文忠：是。"],["何委員欣純：譬如說以校安來講，我講得比較實務面。除了新北市這個孩子的割頸事件，前些日子臺中某校園也有家長攜帶武士刀進入校園。所以，在校安管理的實務面上，我覺得教育部是不是應該積極處理？包含國教署與地方政府教育局體系、警政體系、社會安全網體系，如何在實務面上讓校方在事前就可以預防？事前如果沒有辦法預防，事後如何面對、處置？我覺得整個緊急應變SOP是全國性的問題，目的是保護我們的孩子。部長，這幾件事情發生之後，教育部的檢討是什麼？"],["潘部長文忠：跟委員報告，當然，在這起事件之後，教育部邀集各縣市還有相關團體、校長、老師們做了滿多討論，也將原來跟校安有關的、老師輔導管教的注意事項全面調整，當中確實也在老師的輔導管教方面，賦予老師一些更合理、有效的管教……"],["何委員欣純：部長，我舉個例子，曾經有基層教師跟我反映，比如說孩子帶了一些比較危險的物品進入學校，但放在書包裡，老師沒有權限搜書包，這是第一點。第二，老師從何得知學生可能攜帶危險物品？這涉及部長剛剛講的，我們可以給校方或老師到哪個程度的SOP？"],["潘部長文忠：對，我再跟委員報告，安全檢查這件事也是這次討論裡非常重要的重點之一。"],["何委員欣純：也包括我剛剛講的家長攜帶武士刀進入校園，誰可以發現他帶了武士刀？"],["潘部長文忠：是，所以在這個部分，我們也像委員所說的，有非常完整的、可操作的手冊，讓學校可以進行這方面的工作。","剛才委員提到一點非常關鍵，學校本來就有相關的應變小組與演練，因為我覺得透過演練這件事情才能提升他們的能力，真的碰到緊急事項時也可以應變。"],["何委員欣純：部長，應該是說就各種情境加以模擬、討論，甚至建立起你剛剛說的機制，思考在面對不同情境下的安全問題時如何緊急、即時反映跟處理，在第一時間如何跟其他相關單位，譬如說警政單位合作，如何面對這種緊急、危急的狀況。我知道寫手冊、寫SOP是必要的，但是模擬現實、實務面上發生當下如何處置其實更重要。"],["潘部長文忠：是，委員所提的這個真的是關鍵。現在學校本來就有跟鄰近警政單位合作的機制，而且這是每所學校都要具備的。"],["何委員欣純：這都是一定要做的，我知道。"],["潘部長文忠：甚至是用最緊急件處理，也就是發生的時候按鈕一按，事實上就會連結到我們說的……"],["何委員欣純：派出所或是鄰近的警政單位就對了。"],["潘部長文忠：他們就會進來支援。","至於剛才委員提到那個演練，在我們給學校、縣市的規劃裡本來就有，每學年一定要。但是對於落實這件事，我覺得教育部可以再積極一點。"],["何委員欣純：落實這件事情很重要。"],["潘部長文忠：對，對於有些影響很大的，而且可能是常見的，我們應該連結做成一些範例，讓他們可以練習，因為跟警政單位的聯繫其實也包含這一段。我們真的要防患於未然，有時候學校覺得不會發生什麼，但一旦發生就手忙腳亂，那些傷亡等等可能就會造成，所以我想在這件事情上面，教育部會再往下針對一些常見的樣態，除了每學年之外，學校一定要針對各種樣態練習，我覺得這方面應該要做。"],["何委員欣純：應該要更多。"],["潘部長文忠：其實這樣的練習對孩子、老師和教職人員來講，也是一種危機防護意識。"],["何委員欣純：這個可以保護校園裡的人身安全，沒錯，所以拜託部長，這個一定要跟地方教育局一起來做好，然後把它落實。"],["潘部長文忠：好，這個我們會再強化。"],["何委員欣純：另外，因為時間不夠，我還是要提醒部長，校園裡面的毒品問題，這個很多家長都不斷的在關心跟反映，希望政府應該要有更積極的作為。還有學生輔導法，這個過去我們有修法，所以輔導人力要增加和補強，我希望這部分能夠到位和落實，事後是不是請教育部給我一個書面報告，好不好？謝謝。"],["潘部長文忠：好，這個我們提供書面報告給委員參考，謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝。","接下來黃國昌委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":340,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-4","speakers":["柯志恩","萬美玲","陳培瑜","葛如鈞","葉元之","洪孟楷","郭昱晴","羅廷瑋","張雅琳","林宜瑾","吳沛憶","陳秀寳","范雲","林倩綺","黃建賓","鍾佳濱","林月琴","何欣純","黃國昌","翁曉玲","鄭天財Sra 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\"score\": 0.666}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"參\"}, {\"word\": \"考\", \"start\": 351.183, \"end\": 351.203, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:03,883 --> 00:00:06,586\n謝謝召委科召委喔那我們是不是請部長好部長\n\n2\n00:00:11,525 --> 00:00:16,086\n部長好,好久不見部長過去我一直在教育委員會我們也就今天相關的校園問題跟孩子的一個輔導問題我們已經當面溝通了好多次但是很遺憾或是說我認為好還可以更好就是說我們發生了一連串的事件告訴我們不夠好我們還必須要再檢討再改進\n\n3\n00:00:38,353 --> 00:00:39,053\n臺中某校園也發生了家長攜帶武士刀進入校園\n\n4\n00:00:56,161 --> 00:00:56,961\n校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園之輔導機制及前科紀錄是否塗銷：何欣純\n\n5\n00:01:17,146 --> 00:01:35,834\n事前就可以預防事前如果沒有辦法預防的時候事後如何面對處置我覺得這個整個緊急應變的SOP這個是全國性的問題是保護我們的孩子所以部長就這幾件事情發生了之後我們的檢討是什麼\n\n6\n00:01:36,454 --> 00:02:05,401\n是跟委員報告當然就這些事件後教育部邀請各縣市還有我們相關團體校長、老師們大概做了蠻多討論也把原來跟這個校安有關還有老師的輔導管教那個注意項做全面的調整那這個裡面確實也在老師的輔導管教這上面能夠賦予老師有一些更合理有效的這個管教部長我舉個例子成就基層的教師就來跟我\n\n7\n00:02:31,718 --> 00:02:32,619\n家長攜帶武士刀進入校園誰可以發現他裡面有帶武士刀\n\n8\n00:02:48,182 --> 00:02:59,086\n所以在這個部分我們也做了像委員所說的有一個非常完整的可操作的這個手冊主要是讓學校可以來進行這方面那當然委員提到一個非常關鍵的那個學校還是要我們對於已經就是本來就有相關應變的這個小組跟演練因為演練這件事情我覺得才能夠提升他們真的碰到緊急事項也可以去做應變\n\n9\n00:03:16,773 --> 00:03:32,248\n各種情境去做一個模擬去做一個討論甚至建立起你剛剛說的不同情境之下的一些安全問題我們如何能夠緊急及時的反應跟處理\n\n10\n00:03:34,130 --> 00:03:59,218\n又如何在第一時間上面可以跟其他相關的單位比如說警政單位如何合作如何來面對這個緊急的危急的一個狀況這個其實我知道寫手冊寫SOP是必要但是模擬在現實實務面上發生的當下如何處置其實是更重要是是委員所提的這個真的是關鍵因為現在我們所給學校的本來在有關\n\n11\n00:04:03,659 --> 00:04:10,865\n跟臨近的這些警政單位就有一個合作的這個每個學校都要具備政治是用最緊急鍵發生的時候你一按事實上就會連結到那個派出所或是臨近的警政單位就會來支援那剛才委員提到那個演練本來在我們給學校縣市的這個裡面就有每學年一定要但是落實這件事情我覺得教育部可以再繼續\n\n12\n00:04:31,340 --> 00:04:34,682\n對因為覺得有些我們比較我們說影響很大的而且可能常見的我們應該來連結做成一些讓他們也可以做一個範例可以做練習因為跟警政單位的聯繫之間其實也包含這一段我也覺得用這個真的要防範於未然我們覺得怕學校有時候也覺得說不會發生什麼但一旦發生就會發現手忙腳亂\n\n13\n00:05:19,811 --> 00:05:23,652\n所以再拜託部長這應該跟地方教育直接來做好然後把它落實那另外當然時間不夠我還是要提醒部長校園裡面的這個毒品問題這個很多家長都不斷的在關心跟反映希望政府應該要有更積極的作為那還有學生輔導法過去我們修法所以呢我們那個輔導的人力要增加要補強那我希望能夠到位跟落實\n\n14\n00:05:48,038 --> 00:05:51,203\n事後是不是再請教育部給我一個書面報告?好,這個我們提供書面給委員參考\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n3883\t6586\t謝謝召委科召委喔那我們是不是請部長好 部長\n11525\t16086\t部長好,好久不見部長過去我一直在教育委員會我們也就今天相關的校園問題跟孩子的一個輔導問題我們已經當面溝通了好多次但是很遺憾或是說我認為好還可以更好就是說我們發生了一連串的事件告訴我們不夠好我們還必須要再檢討再改進\n38353\t39053\t臺中某校園也發生了家長攜帶武士刀進入校園\n56161\t56961\t校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園之輔導機制及前科紀錄是否塗銷：何欣純\n77146\t95834\t事前就可以預防事前如果沒有辦法預防的時候事後如何面對處置我覺得這個整個緊急應變的SOP這個是全國性的問題是保護我們的孩子所以部長就這幾件事情發生了之後我們的檢討是什麼\n96454\t125401\t是 跟委員報告當然就這些事件後教育部邀請各縣市還有我們相關團體校長、老師們大概做了蠻多討論也把原來跟這個校安有關還有老師的輔導管教那個注意項做全面的調整那這個裡面確實也在老師的輔導管教這上面能夠賦予老師有一些更合理有效的這個管教部長我舉個例子成就基層的教師就來跟我\n125981\t151425\t對﹖對\n151718\t152619\t家長攜帶武士刀進入校園誰可以發現他裡面有帶武士刀\n168182\t179086\t所以在這個部分我們也做了像委員所說的有一個非常完整的可操作的這個手冊主要是讓學校可以來進行這方面那當然委員提到一個非常關鍵的那個學校還是要我們對於已經就是本來就有相關應變的這個小組跟演練因為演練這件事情我覺得才能夠提升他們真的碰到緊急事項也可以去做應變\n196773\t212248\t各種情境去做一個模擬去做一個討論甚至建立起你剛剛說的不同情境之下的一些安全問題我們如何能夠緊急及時的反應跟處理\n214130\t239218\t又如何在第一時間上面可以跟其他相關的單位比如說警政單位如何合作如何來面對這個緊急的危急的一個狀況這個其實我知道寫手冊寫SOP是必要但是模擬在現實實務面上發生的當下如何處置其實是更重要是是委員所提的這個真的是關鍵因為現在我們所給學校的本來在有關\n243659\t250865\t跟臨近的這些警政單位就有一個合作的這個每個學校都要具備政治是用最緊急鍵發生的時候你一按事實上就會連結到那個派出所或是臨近的警政單位就會來支援那剛才委員提到那個演練本來在我們給學校縣市的這個裡面就有每學年一定要但是落實這件事情我覺得教育部可以再繼續\n271340\t274682\t對 因為覺得有些我們比較我們說影響很大的而且可能常見的我們應該來連結做成一些讓他們也可以做一個範例可以做練習因為跟警政單位的聯繫之間其實也包含這一段我也覺得用這個真的要防範於未然我們覺得怕學校有時候也覺得說不會發生什麼但一旦發生就會發現手忙腳亂\n295691\t319531\t﹗\n319811\t323652\t所以再拜託部長這應該跟地方教育直接來做好然後把它落實那另外當然時間不夠我還是要提醒部長校園裡面的這個毒品問題這個很多家長都不斷的在關心跟反映希望政府應該要有更積極的作為那還有學生輔導法過去我們修法所以呢我們那個輔導的人力要增加要補強那我希望能夠到位跟落實\n348038\t351203\t事後是不是再請教育部給我一個書面報告?好,這個我們提供書面給委員參考\n","txt":"謝謝召委科召委喔那我們是不是請部長好 部長\n部長好,好久不見部長過去我一直在教育委員會我們也就今天相關的校園問題跟孩子的一個輔導問題我們已經當面溝通了好多次但是很遺憾或是說我認為好還可以更好就是說我們發生了一連串的事件告訴我們不夠好我們還必須要再檢討再改進\n臺中某校園也發生了家長攜帶武士刀進入校園\n校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園之輔導機制及前科紀錄是否塗銷：何欣純\n事前就可以預防事前如果沒有辦法預防的時候事後如何面對處置我覺得這個整個緊急應變的SOP這個是全國性的問題是保護我們的孩子所以部長就這幾件事情發生了之後我們的檢討是什麼\n是 跟委員報告當然就這些事件後教育部邀請各縣市還有我們相關團體校長、老師們大概做了蠻多討論也把原來跟這個校安有關還有老師的輔導管教那個注意項做全面的調整那這個裡面確實也在老師的輔導管教這上面能夠賦予老師有一些更合理有效的這個管教部長我舉個例子成就基層的教師就來跟我\n對﹖對\n家長攜帶武士刀進入校園誰可以發現他裡面有帶武士刀\n所以在這個部分我們也做了像委員所說的有一個非常完整的可操作的這個手冊主要是讓學校可以來進行這方面那當然委員提到一個非常關鍵的那個學校還是要我們對於已經就是本來就有相關應變的這個小組跟演練因為演練這件事情我覺得才能夠提升他們真的碰到緊急事項也可以去做應變\n各種情境去做一個模擬去做一個討論甚至建立起你剛剛說的不同情境之下的一些安全問題我們如何能夠緊急及時的反應跟處理\n又如何在第一時間上面可以跟其他相關的單位比如說警政單位如何合作如何來面對這個緊急的危急的一個狀況這個其實我知道寫手冊寫SOP是必要但是模擬在現實實務面上發生的當下如何處置其實是更重要是是委員所提的這個真的是關鍵因為現在我們所給學校的本來在有關\n跟臨近的這些警政單位就有一個合作的這個每個學校都要具備政治是用最緊急鍵發生的時候你一按事實上就會連結到那個派出所或是臨近的警政單位就會來支援那剛才委員提到那個演練本來在我們給學校縣市的這個裡面就有每學年一定要但是落實這件事情我覺得教育部可以再繼續\n對 因為覺得有些我們比較我們說影響很大的而且可能常見的我們應該來連結做成一些讓他們也可以做一個範例可以做練習因為跟警政單位的聯繫之間其實也包含這一段我也覺得用這個真的要防範於未然我們覺得怕學校有時候也覺得說不會發生什麼但一旦發生就會發現手忙腳亂\n﹗\n所以再拜託部長這應該跟地方教育直接來做好然後把它落實那另外當然時間不夠我還是要提醒部長校園裡面的這個毒品問題這個很多家長都不斷的在關心跟反映希望政府應該要有更積極的作為那還有學生輔導法過去我們修法所以呢我們那個輔導的人力要增加要補強那我希望能夠到位跟落實\n事後是不是再請教育部給我一個書面報告?好,這個我們提供書面給委員參考\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:03.883 --> 00:06.586\n謝謝召委科召委喔那我們是不是請部長好部長\n\n00:11.525 --> 00:16.086\n部長好,好久不見部長過去我一直在教育委員會我們也就今天相關的校園問題跟孩子的一個輔導問題我們已經當面溝通了好多次但是很遺憾或是說我認為好還可以更好就是說我們發生了一連串的事件告訴我們不夠好我們還必須要再檢討再改進\n\n00:38.353 --> 00:39.053\n臺中某校園也發生了家長攜帶武士刀進入校園\n\n00:56.161 --> 00:56.961\n校園暴力事件之處置、少年犯回歸校園之輔導機制及前科紀錄是否塗銷：何欣純\n\n01:17.146 --> 01:35.834\n事前就可以預防事前如果沒有辦法預防的時候事後如何面對處置我覺得這個整個緊急應變的SOP這個是全國性的問題是保護我們的孩子所以部長就這幾件事情發生了之後我們的檢討是什麼\n\n01:36.454 --> 02:05.401\n是跟委員報告當然就這些事件後教育部邀請各縣市還有我們相關團體校長、老師們大概做了蠻多討論也把原來跟這個校安有關還有老師的輔導管教那個注意項做全面的調整那這個裡面確實也在老師的輔導管教這上面能夠賦予老師有一些更合理有效的這個管教部長我舉個例子成就基層的教師就來跟我\n\n02:31.718 --> 02:32.619\n家長攜帶武士刀進入校園誰可以發現他裡面有帶武士刀\n\n02:48.182 --> 02:59.086\n所以在這個部分我們也做了像委員所說的有一個非常完整的可操作的這個手冊主要是讓學校可以來進行這方面那當然委員提到一個非常關鍵的那個學校還是要我們對於已經就是本來就有相關應變的這個小組跟演練因為演練這件事情我覺得才能夠提升他們真的碰到緊急事項也可以去做應變\n\n03:16.773 --> 03:32.248\n各種情境去做一個模擬去做一個討論甚至建立起你剛剛說的不同情境之下的一些安全問題我們如何能夠緊急及時的反應跟處理\n\n03:34.130 --> 03:59.218\n又如何在第一時間上面可以跟其他相關的單位比如說警政單位如何合作如何來面對這個緊急的危急的一個狀況這個其實我知道寫手冊寫SOP是必要但是模擬在現實實務面上發生的當下如何處置其實是更重要是是委員所提的這個真的是關鍵因為現在我們所給學校的本來在有關\n\n04:03.659 --> 04:10.865\n跟臨近的這些警政單位就有一個合作的這個每個學校都要具備政治是用最緊急鍵發生的時候你一按事實上就會連結到那個派出所或是臨近的警政單位就會來支援那剛才委員提到那個演練本來在我們給學校縣市的這個裡面就有每學年一定要但是落實這件事情我覺得教育部可以再繼續\n\n04:31.340 --> 04:34.682\n對因為覺得有些我們比較我們說影響很大的而且可能常見的我們應該來連結做成一些讓他們也可以做一個範例可以做練習因為跟警政單位的聯繫之間其實也包含這一段我也覺得用這個真的要防範於未然我們覺得怕學校有時候也覺得說不會發生什麼但一旦發生就會發現手忙腳亂\n\n05:19.811 --> 05:23.652\n所以再拜託部長這應該跟地方教育直接來做好然後把它落實那另外當然時間不夠我還是要提醒部長校園裡面的這個毒品問題這個很多家長都不斷的在關心跟反映希望政府應該要有更積極的作為那還有學生輔導法過去我們修法所以呢我們那個輔導的人力要增加要補強那我希望能夠到位跟落實\n\n05:48.038 --> 05:51.203\n事後是不是再請教育部給我一個書面報告?好,這個我們提供書面給委員參考\n\n","segments":[{"start":3.883,"end":6.586,"text":"謝謝召委科召委喔那我們是不是請部長好 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跟委員報告當然就這些事件後教育部邀請各縣市還有我們相關團體校長、老師們大概做了蠻多討論也把原來跟這個校安有關還有老師的輔導管教那個注意項做全面的調整那這個裡面確實也在老師的輔導管教這上面能夠賦予老師有一些更合理有效的這個管教部長我舉個例子成就基層的教師就來跟我"},{"start":125.981,"end":151.425,"text":"對﹖對"},{"start":151.718,"end":152.619,"text":"家長攜帶武士刀進入校園誰可以發現他裡面有帶武士刀"},{"start":168.182,"end":179.086,"text":"所以在這個部分我們也做了像委員所說的有一個非常完整的可操作的這個手冊主要是讓學校可以來進行這方面那當然委員提到一個非常關鍵的那個學校還是要我們對於已經就是本來就有相關應變的這個小組跟演練因為演練這件事情我覺得才能夠提升他們真的碰到緊急事項也可以去做應變"},{"start":196.773,"end":212.248,"text":"各種情境去做一個模擬去做一個討論甚至建立起你剛剛說的不同情境之下的一些安全問題我們如何能夠緊急及時的反應跟處理"},{"start":214.13,"end":239.218,"text":"又如何在第一時間上面可以跟其他相關的單位比如說警政單位如何合作如何來面對這個緊急的危急的一個狀況這個其實我知道寫手冊寫SOP是必要但是模擬在現實實務面上發生的當下如何處置其實是更重要是是委員所提的這個真的是關鍵因為現在我們所給學校的本來在有關"},{"start":243.659,"end":250.865,"text":"跟臨近的這些警政單位就有一個合作的這個每個學校都要具備政治是用最緊急鍵發生的時候你一按事實上就會連結到那個派出所或是臨近的警政單位就會來支援那剛才委員提到那個演練本來在我們給學校縣市的這個裡面就有每學年一定要但是落實這件事情我覺得教育部可以再繼續"},{"start":271.34,"end":274.682,"text":"對 因為覺得有些我們比較我們說影響很大的而且可能常見的我們應該來連結做成一些讓他們也可以做一個範例可以做練習因為跟警政單位的聯繫之間其實也包含這一段我也覺得用這個真的要防範於未然我們覺得怕學校有時候也覺得說不會發生什麼但一旦發生就會發現手忙腳亂"},{"start":295.691,"end":319.531,"text":"﹗"},{"start":319.811,"end":323.652,"text":"所以再拜託部長這應該跟地方教育直接來做好然後把它落實那另外當然時間不夠我還是要提醒部長校園裡面的這個毒品問題這個很多家長都不斷的在關心跟反映希望政府應該要有更積極的作為那還有學生輔導法過去我們修法所以呢我們那個輔導的人力要增加要補強那我希望能夠到位跟落實"},{"start":348.038,"end":351.203,"text":"事後是不是再請教育部給我一個書面報告?好,這個我們提供書面給委員參考"}]}}}}