{"id":150087,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150087","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/b8deaa01a2e7f192650c3dbddc37189a135db69d26d20764f8ba9b0039caa7a63e3ed5aee600c39c5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳永康","委員發言時間":"09:45:30 - 09:55:32","影片長度":"00:10:02","會議時間":"2024-03-20T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第7次全體委員會議（事由：邀請外交部部長吳釗燮報告業務概況，並備質詢。）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第7次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":7,"committees":[35],"id":"委員會-11-1-35-7"},"date":"2024-03-20","duration":602,"end_time":"2024-03-20T09:55:32+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-20T09:45:30+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":192,"blocks":[["陳委員永康：（9時45分）有請吳部長。"],["主席：請吳部長。"],["吳部長釗燮：陳委員好。"],["陳委員永康：部長好。過去個人在國外服務以及參加許多國際會議期間，承蒙我們外館同仁積極參與以及支持，我在這邊首先表達謝意。"],["吳部長釗燮：謝謝委員。委員能不能讓我講一些話來回應委員？"],["陳委員永康：您先請。"],["吳部長釗燮：其實我在2015、2016年那時候也曾經有短暫的時間跟委員有互動的機會，我想委員的學識、經驗以及為人處事是我向來非常重視的，而且非常尊敬的，所以有機會能夠在這邊跟委員來從事答詢的工作，我感到無上的光榮，謝謝委員。"],["陳委員永康：剛才前面王委員提到目前南海局勢非常複雜，以及M503航線的問題，我個人有一些經驗跟大家分享。在2018年跟2019年，那個時候還是林永樂前部長駐英的時間，以他的人脈關係，透過與智庫的合作，安排我有機會在英國上院的committee以及下院對M503航線以及南海的問題做過兩次的專業報告，有許多的外國使節以及國際媒體都有參與，這個基本的資料我願意提供給我們部裡面的同仁做一個分享。"],["吳部長釗燮：謝謝。"],["陳委員永康：尤其是南海，因為過去美國國務院曾經出過一個南海的專業圖，現在更新以後，所有的人工島礁合比例的，包括太平島周遭的環境，我們有做GIS校正、衛星圖資，這個圖檔的資料我們願意提供給部裡面的同仁做參考。"],["吳部長釗燮：好，謝謝委員。"],["陳委員永康：各位看到現在的狀況，外交跟國防實際上都是政治的延伸，一體兩面，未來的作為就是支持我們國家的主權、維護我們的國家利益，但是面對的挑戰，在這個動態的世局裡面，它是全面向的，不是一個單一的局面，所以我們以孫子兵法來講，上兵伐謀、其次伐交，這二個講穿了，所有的壓力就是外交部承擔；其次伐兵、其下攻城這二個就是國防部來承擔。事實上，這四個面向的壓力它是同步發生，所以外交、國防是一體兩面，要有很好的協商。","在這個同時，我們看到中國大陸對臺是威懾武嚇、軍演困臺，它是一種沒有戰火的消耗戰；持續利誘，以貿逼政，目前是一個短期內沒有替代的市場戰；美中角力，談判施壓，這是一個沒有邦交的友盟戰；國際孤立，滲透分裂，這又是一個沒有席位的法律戰。","前一陣子德國馬歇爾基金會葛萊儀女士訪問臺灣，他特別講到現在中國大陸對臺的方法，是一個四路並用的不對稱方法，其實最終的目的就是不停的施壓、施壓，全面性的施壓，希望造成你國家生存安全重心的動搖，但慶幸的是，國防部跟外交部在這上面堅持我們的立場，而且所有國內外工作同仁的共同努力，能夠挺得住、撐得下去。事實上，老共的手法實際上如果以葛萊儀女士的講法，它是一種捅箍式，就是越箍越緊，實際上他用了2019年一個英國報章上所用的一個名詞，叫做蟒蛇戰略，就是Anaconda Strategy，就是越箍越緊，所以必須有堅強的自信心、有堅韌的社會強度，以及能夠內外協同、論述一致的整體戰略觀，這樣一來，國防、外交作為一體兩面，來支持國家的主權，維護國家的利益。","因此，我後面做的是一個很簡單的建議，外交部的人才濟濟，但是年輕一代現在進來以後，我們希望提供更好的教育訓練，培養下一代卓越的人才，因此戰略觀的教育，我們希望能夠強化、納入到外交學院裡面，因為不僅止於是對話式或是作業協調的外交程序，而是你要有一個宏觀的局勢分析，並不受限於比方說在中歐、東歐或者是南太平洋或是南海，它是一個全面向的。","下面我就用一個簡單的圖，只是提出一個建議，我們在智庫上，不是形式上的蹲點，需要有實務性的參與協作，包括各部會駐外智庫的蹲點，希望能夠跟我們的駐外使館、代表處，能夠有更深層的互動。另外，訪問學者及官民的互訪，我們希望學術交流的主題能夠配合現在國際情勢的發展，而不是設定、預想一個題目，只在那個比較偏遠的邊境去作業，而是現在要反映到動態國際現實的變化上，我們讓這些年輕的受訓學員、未來要派駐的外交官，能有更深的學習角色。","人才培育，是為用而訓，要訓用合一，當然我們部隊有一個嚴格的考核制度，精進選訓用的制度，也要納入國際特定區域專業的經驗來分享，服務的經驗因為地區不同，像教廷的經驗跟南美洲的經驗是完全不相同的，我們應該要遴選優秀的學生進修，而且現在在大學裡面，我們就希望在社團裡面找到未來有志從事外交事務的年輕學生，及早讓他能夠參與這種選訓用的機會。","最後，就是遴選駐外專業的課程與師資，我特別強調，希望在我們的外交政策、外交學院，在這個裡面要精進專業考核的審查，包括政經、安全以及法律的領域，因為我們希望越來越優秀的年輕人才能夠加入外交部，共同為國家的利益、為國家主權、為中華民國在國際的影響力來做貢獻發聲。部長你有沒有什麼指教？"],["吳部長釗燮：非常謝謝委員提出來的這些意見和建議，我在這邊就很簡單的回應一下委員所提出來的，的確，我們所面對的國際情勢是有相當龐大的壓力，委員剛剛已經說明得非常清楚，中國政府從各式各樣的角度，不管是外交的、軍事的、混合戰的這種方式，要限縮我們的活動空間、要壓縮我們在回應時候的縱深，在這種情形之下，我們外交部甚至我們其他的國安單位，就必須去思考我們整體、大的戰略，對我們臺灣來講，最好的一個戰略就是結識以及跟越來越多的好朋友、重要的國家關係越來越深厚，這個對我們臺灣戰略的縱深是有更多的幫助。","在這個政策的指導之下，過去這幾年我相信委員也看到了，就是我們跟美國的關係，跟日本、澳洲、加拿大、英國以及歐盟整體的關係，都有長足的進展，委員剛剛特別提到中東歐國家，我們臺灣可以看到，因為中東歐國家他們的彈性比較大，對我們臺灣支持的口徑是特別的大，但是對我們臺灣來講，我們也知道得非常清楚，這些重要的民主國家，是我們必須全力去發展關係的。在過去這一段時間，我剛剛提到的這幾個國家，跟我們的關係也是越來越緊密，這就是我們大戰略之下一個政策的成果，具體而為，委員剛剛提到在教育、在人才的培訓，的確我們也是在這個軌道上面來走，我們願意把委員所提出來的這些看法檢討一下，看我們還有什麼不足的部分，讓年輕的外交官在外面能夠有所發揮。在這邊也順便跟委員說明一下，2018年我到外交部之後，其實我給外交部這些年輕同仁的空間比以前大很多，所以外交部的整體戰力或創造性比以前更好。這部分我們會持續來加強，謝謝委員。"],["陳委員永康：謝謝部長的論述，也感謝您的支持跟指導。謝謝。"],["吳部長釗燮：謝謝委員。"],["主席：接下來請林楚茵委員上臺發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":314,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-35-7","speakers":["馬文君","羅美玲","王定宇","陳永康","林楚茵","徐巧芯","黃仁","沈伯洋","洪申翰","陳冠廷","賴士葆","牛煦庭","林憶君","李坤城","邱志偉","謝衣鳯","翁曉玲","王鴻薇"],"page_start":253,"meetingDate":["2024-03-20"],"gazette_id":"1131501","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1131501_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第7次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請外交部部長吳釗燮報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1131501_00004"}},"transcript":{"id":"150087","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150087","tool":"pyannote","id":"150087-pyannote"},"job_id":"KVnhd8RLJkJdc2GV","queued_at":"2024-06-02 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\"text\": \"對我們台灣的這種支持的口徑是特別的大但是對我們台灣來講我們也知道的非常清楚就是說這些重要的民主國家是我們必須要去全力去發展關係的那在過去這段時間我剛剛提到的這幾個國家跟我們的關係也是越來越緊密那這個就是我們大戰略之下的一個政策的一個成果那具體而為\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 528.452, \"end\": 528.732, \"score\": 0.862}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 528.732, \"end\": 529.153, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"灣\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 529.153, \"end\": 529.693, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"種\"}, {\"word\": \"支\", \"start\": 529.693, \"end\": 530.013, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"持\", \"start\": 530.013, \"end\": 530.213, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 530.213, \"end\": 530.773, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"口\", \"start\": 530.773, \"end\": 531.674, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"徑\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 531.674, \"end\": 531.854, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"特\", \"start\": 531.854, \"end\": 532.034, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"別\", \"start\": 532.034, \"end\": 532.154, 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\"text\": \"委員剛剛所提到的就是說在教育在人才的培訓上面那的確我們也是在這個軌道上面來走那我們願意把委員所提出來這些所有的看法\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 555.686, \"end\": 556.187, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 556.187, \"end\": 556.367, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 556.367, \"end\": 556.527, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 556.527, \"end\": 556.647, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 556.647, \"end\": 556.787, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 556.787, \"end\": 556.947, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 556.947, \"end\": 557.268, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 557.268, \"end\": 557.488, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"教\", \"start\": 557.488, \"end\": 557.768, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"育\", \"start\": 557.768, \"end\": 558.529, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 558.529, \"end\": 558.709, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": 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\"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:13,848 --> 00:00:24,433\n過去個人在國外服務以及參加許多國際會議期間承蒙我們外館的同仁積極參與以及支持我在這邊首先表達謝意\n\n2\n00:00:26,191 --> 00:00:33,037\n謝謝委員,委員能不能讓我講一些話來回應委員。其實我從2015、2016年那時候也曾經有短暫的時間跟委員有這種互動的機會。\n\n3\n00:00:41,044 --> 00:00:55,222\n那我想委員的這種學識經驗以及為人處事是我向來非常重視的而且非常尊敬的所以在這邊有這個機會能夠在這邊跟委員來從事這個答詢的工作我感到無上的光榮謝謝委員\n\n4\n00:00:57,847 --> 00:01:11,787\n剛才在前面王委員提到目前的南海局勢非常複雜以及503航線這個問題那麼我個人有一些經驗跟大家分享\n\n5\n00:01:12,976 --> 00:01:33,938\n在2018年跟19年那個時候還是林永樂前部長在駐英的時間那麼他的人脈關係透過智庫的合作那麼安排我有機會在英國上院的committeeteam以及下院對503航線以及南海的問題做過兩次的\n\n6\n00:01:35,083 --> 00:01:35,684\n委員會主席\n\n7\n00:01:57,824 --> 00:01:58,204\n委員會主席\n\n8\n00:02:24,241 --> 00:02:24,381\n孫子兵法\n\n9\n00:02:38,320 --> 00:03:01,385\n上兵伐謀其次伐交這兩個講穿了所有的壓力就是外交部承擔那麼其次伐兵旗下攻城那麼這兩個呢就是國防部來承擔事實上這四個面向的壓力它是同步發生所以外交國防是一體兩面要有很好的協商那在這個同時我們看到裡面了\n\n10\n00:03:02,105 --> 00:03:27,137\n中國大陸對台是威懾武嚇軍演困台他是一種沒有戰火的消耗戰那麼慈禧利誘以貿逼陣目前是一個短期內沒有替代的市場戰美中角力談判施壓這是一個沒有邦交的友盟戰那麼國際孤立滲透分裂這又是一個沒有席位的法律戰\n\n11\n00:03:31,449 --> 00:03:56,565\n前一陣子德國馬歇爾基金會葛萊依女士訪問台灣她特別講到現在中國大陸對台的方法它是一個四路並用的不對稱方法它其實最終的目的就是不停的施壓施壓全面性的施壓那希望造成你國家生存安全重心的動搖但是\n\n12\n00:03:58,004 --> 00:04:09,117\n親信的是國防部跟外交部在這上面堅持我們的立場而且所有國內外工作同仁的共同努力能夠挺得住撐得下去那事實上\n\n13\n00:04:11,124 --> 00:04:29,546\n老共的手法他實際上如果以葛萊依女士講法他是一種捅窟式就是越窟越緊實際上他用了2019年一個英國的報章上講他用了一個名詞叫做一個蟒蛇戰略就是Anacondastrategy他就是越窟越緊\n\n14\n00:04:30,507 --> 00:04:52,319\n所以必須有堅強的自信心有堅韌的社會強度以及能夠內外協同論述一致的整體戰略觀那這個樣子下國防外交作為一體兩面來支持國家的主權維護國家的利益因此我後面做的一個是一個很簡單的建議\n\n15\n00:04:53,920 --> 00:05:03,386\n外交部的人才基金但是年輕一代現在進來以後我們希望提供更好的教育學院培養下一代卓越的人才\n\n16\n00:05:05,011 --> 00:05:33,130\n因此戰略觀的教育我們希望能夠強化納入到這個外交學院裡面因為不僅止於是對話式或是作業的協調的外交程序而是你要有一個宏觀的局勢分析那麼並不受限於這個在比方講中歐東歐或者是南太平洋或是南海它是一個全面向的那下面呢我就用一個簡單的圖\n\n17\n00:05:34,690 --> 00:05:51,469\n只是提出一個建議我們在智庫上不是形式上的蹲點需要有實務性的參與協作包括各部會駐外的這個智庫的蹲點希望能夠跟我們的駐外使館代表處能夠有更深層的互動\n\n18\n00:05:53,757 --> 00:06:15,062\n訪問學者及官民互訪,我們希望學術交流的主題能夠配合現在的國際情勢的發展,而不是設定預想一個題目,只在那個比較偏遠的邊境去溯源,而是現在要反映到動態國際現實的變化上,我們讓這些年輕的受訓的學員,未來的派駐的外交官,能有更撐的學習角色。\n\n19\n00:06:18,707 --> 00:06:39,554\n人才培育是用而訓要訓用合一當然我們部內有一個嚴格的考核制度精進選訓用的制度也要納入國際特定區域專業的經驗來分享因為服務的經驗因為地區不同那麼像教廷的經驗跟南美洲的經驗他是完全不相同的\n\n20\n00:06:40,354 --> 00:06:52,800\n我們應該要領選優秀的學生進修而且現在在大學裡面我們就希望在社團裡面找到未來有志從事外交事務的年輕學生及早能夠讓他參與這種選訓用的機會\n\n21\n00:06:56,563 --> 00:07:24,529\n最後就是領選駐外專業的課程與師資我特別強調希望在我們的外交學院在這個裡面要精進專業考核的審查包括政經安全以及法院的領域因為我們希望越來越優秀的年輕人才能夠加入外交部共同為國家的利益為國家主權為中華民國的在國際的影響力來做貢獻發聲謝謝\n\n22\n00:07:26,269 --> 00:07:43,933\n部長你有沒有什麼的指教?非常謝謝委員提出來的這些意見和建議我在這邊就很簡單的回應一下委員所提出來的的確我們所面對的這個國際的情勢是相當的龐大的壓力\n\n23\n00:07:46,434 --> 00:08:09,821\n那委員剛剛已經說明的非常清楚的中國政府從各式各樣的這個角度不管是為外交的軍事的混合戰的這種方式是要限縮我們的活動空間要壓縮我們在回應的時候的這個眾生那在這種情形之下我們外交部甚至是我們其他的那個國安單位就必須要去思考我們整體的這個大的戰略\n\n24\n00:08:10,481 --> 00:08:25,580\n那我想對我們台灣來講最好的一個戰略就是結識以及跟越來越多的這些好朋友重要的國家關係越來越深厚的話這個對我們台灣的這個戰略的這個終身是有更多的幫助\n\n25\n00:08:26,923 --> 00:08:47,472\n那在這個政策的指導之下在過去這幾年我相信委員也看到了就是我們跟美國的關係跟日本跟澳洲加拿大英國以及歐盟的整體的關係都有長足的進展那委員剛剛特別提到說中東歐國家那因為中東歐國家我們台灣看到的是因為他們的那個彈性比較大\n\n26\n00:08:48,452 --> 00:09:14,125\n對我們台灣的這種支持的口徑是特別的大但是對我們台灣來講我們也知道的非常清楚就是說這些重要的民主國家是我們必須要去全力去發展關係的那在過去這段時間我剛剛提到的這幾個國家跟我們的關係也是越來越緊密那這個就是我們大戰略之下的一個政策的一個成果那具體而為\n\n27\n00:09:15,686 --> 00:09:27,217\n委員剛剛所提到的就是說在教育在人才的培訓上面那的確我們也是在這個軌道上面來走那我們願意把委員所提出來這些所有的看法\n\n28\n00:09:29,101 --> 00:09:55,597\n來檢討一下看我們還有什麼樣不足的這個部分讓我們的年輕的這個外交官能夠在外面能夠有所發揮那在這邊順便跟委員說明一下就是說2018年我到外交部之後其實我給外交部的這些年輕的同仁的這個空間是比以前大很多所以我們外交部整體的這個戰力或者是說他們的創造性是比以前更好那這個部分是我們會持續來加強的謝謝委員\n\n29\n00:09:58,515 --> 00:10:00,904\n謝謝部長的論述也感謝您的支持跟指導謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n13848\t24433\t過去個人在國外服務以及參加許多國際會議期間 承蒙我們外館的同仁積極參與以及支持 我在這邊首先表達謝意\n26191\t33037\t謝謝委員,委員能不能讓我講一些話來回應委員。其實我從2015、2016年那時候也曾經有短暫的時間跟委員有這種互動的機會。\n41044\t55222\t那我想委員的這種學識經驗以及為人處事是我向來非常重視的而且非常尊敬的所以在這邊有這個機會能夠在這邊跟委員來從事這個答詢的工作我感到無上的光榮謝謝委員\n57847\t71787\t剛才在前面王委員提到目前的南海局勢非常複雜以及503航線這個問題那麼我個人有一些經驗跟大家分享\n72976\t93938\t在2018年跟19年那個時候還是林永樂前部長在駐英的時間那麼他的人脈關係透過智庫的合作那麼安排我有機會在英國上院的committeeteam以及下院對503航線以及南海的問題做過兩次的\n95083\t95684\t委員會主席\n117824\t118204\t委員會主席\n144241\t144381\t孫子兵法\n158320\t181385\t上兵伐謀 其次伐交這兩個講穿了所有的壓力就是外交部承擔那麼其次伐兵旗下攻城那麼這兩個呢就是國防部來承擔事實上這四個面向的壓力它是同步發生所以外交國防是一體兩面要有很好的協商那在這個同時我們看到裡面了\n182105\t207137\t中國大陸對台是威懾武嚇軍演困台他是一種沒有戰火的消耗戰那麼慈禧利誘以貿逼陣目前是一個短期內沒有替代的市場戰美中角力談判施壓這是一個沒有邦交的友盟戰那麼國際孤立滲透分裂這又是一個沒有席位的法律戰\n211449\t236565\t前一陣子德國馬歇爾基金會葛萊依女士訪問台灣她特別講到現在中國大陸對台的方法它是一個四路並用的不對稱方法它其實最終的目的就是不停的施壓施壓全面性的施壓那希望造成你國家生存安全重心的動搖但是\n238004\t249117\t親信的是國防部跟外交部在這上面堅持我們的立場而且所有國內外工作同仁的共同努力能夠挺得住撐得下去那事實上\n251124\t269546\t老共的手法他實際上如果以葛萊依女士講法他是一種捅窟式就是越窟越緊實際上他用了2019年一個英國的報章上講他用了一個名詞叫做一個蟒蛇戰略就是Anaconda strategy他就是越窟越緊\n270507\t292319\t所以必須有堅強的自信心有堅韌的社會強度以及能夠內外協同論述一致的整體戰略觀那這個樣子下國防外交作為一體兩面來支持國家的主權維護國家的利益因此我後面做的一個是一個很簡單的建議\n293920\t303386\t外交部的人才基金但是年輕一代現在進來以後我們希望提供更好的教育學院培養下一代卓越的人才\n305011\t333130\t因此戰略觀的教育我們希望能夠強化納入到這個外交學院裡面因為不僅止於是對話式或是作業的協調的外交程序而是你要有一個宏觀的局勢分析那麼並不受限於這個在比方講中歐東歐或者是南太平洋或是南海它是一個全面向的那下面呢我就用一個簡單的圖\n334690\t351469\t只是提出一個建議我們在智庫上不是形式上的蹲點需要有實務性的參與協作包括各部會駐外的這個智庫的蹲點希望能夠跟我們的駐外使館代表處能夠有更深層的互動\n353757\t375062\t訪問學者及官民互訪,我們希望學術交流的主題能夠配合現在的國際情勢的發展,而不是設定預想一個題目,只在那個比較偏遠的邊境去溯源,而是現在要反映到動態國際現實的變化上,我們讓這些年輕的受訓的學員,未來的派駐的外交官,能有更撐的學習角色。\n378707\t399554\t人才培育是用而訓 要訓用合一當然我們部內有一個嚴格的考核制度精進選訓用的制度也要納入國際特定區域專業的經驗來分享因為服務的經驗因為地區不同那麼像教廷的經驗跟南美洲的經驗他是完全不相同的\n400354\t412800\t我們應該要領選優秀的學生進修而且現在在大學裡面我們就希望在社團裡面找到未來有志從事外交事務的年輕學生及早能夠讓他參與這種選訓用的機會\n416563\t444529\t最後就是領選駐外專業的課程與師資我特別強調希望在我們的外交學院在這個裡面要精進專業考核的審查包括政經安全以及法院的領域因為我們希望越來越優秀的年輕人才能夠加入外交部共同為國家的利益為國家主權為中華民國的在國際的影響力來做貢獻發聲謝謝\n446269\t463933\t部長你有沒有什麼的指教?非常謝謝委員提出來的這些意見和建議我在這邊就很簡單的回應一下委員所提出來的的確我們所面對的這個國際的情勢是相當的龐大的壓力\n466434\t489821\t那委員剛剛已經說明的非常清楚的中國政府從各式各樣的這個角度不管是為外交的軍事的混合戰的這種方式是要限縮我們的活動空間要壓縮我們在回應的時候的這個眾生那在這種情形之下我們外交部甚至是我們其他的那個國安單位就必須要去思考我們整體的這個大的戰略\n490481\t505580\t那我想對我們台灣來講最好的一個戰略就是結識以及跟越來越多的這些好朋友重要的國家關係越來越深厚的話這個對我們台灣的這個戰略的這個終身是有更多的幫助\n506923\t527472\t那在這個政策的指導之下在過去這幾年我相信委員也看到了就是我們跟美國的關係跟日本跟澳洲加拿大英國以及歐盟的整體的關係都有長足的進展那委員剛剛特別提到說中東歐國家那因為中東歐國家我們台灣看到的是因為他們的那個彈性比較大\n528452\t554125\t對我們台灣的這種支持的口徑是特別的大但是對我們台灣來講我們也知道的非常清楚就是說這些重要的民主國家是我們必須要去全力去發展關係的那在過去這段時間我剛剛提到的這幾個國家跟我們的關係也是越來越緊密那這個就是我們大戰略之下的一個政策的一個成果那具體而為\n555686\t567217\t委員剛剛所提到的就是說在教育在人才的培訓上面那的確我們也是在這個軌道上面來走那我們願意把委員所提出來這些所有的看法\n569101\t595597\t來檢討一下看我們還有什麼樣不足的這個部分讓我們的年輕的這個外交官能夠在外面能夠有所發揮那在這邊順便跟委員說明一下就是說2018年我到外交部之後其實我給外交部的這些年輕的同仁的這個空間是比以前大很多所以我們外交部整體的這個戰力或者是說他們的創造性是比以前更好那這個部分是我們會持續來加強的謝謝委員\n598515\t600904\t謝謝部長的論述 也感謝您的支持跟指導 謝謝\n","txt":"過去個人在國外服務以及參加許多國際會議期間 承蒙我們外館的同仁積極參與以及支持 我在這邊首先表達謝意\n謝謝委員,委員能不能讓我講一些話來回應委員。其實我從2015、2016年那時候也曾經有短暫的時間跟委員有這種互動的機會。\n那我想委員的這種學識經驗以及為人處事是我向來非常重視的而且非常尊敬的所以在這邊有這個機會能夠在這邊跟委員來從事這個答詢的工作我感到無上的光榮謝謝委員\n剛才在前面王委員提到目前的南海局勢非常複雜以及503航線這個問題那麼我個人有一些經驗跟大家分享\n在2018年跟19年那個時候還是林永樂前部長在駐英的時間那麼他的人脈關係透過智庫的合作那麼安排我有機會在英國上院的committeeteam以及下院對503航線以及南海的問題做過兩次的\n委員會主席\n委員會主席\n孫子兵法\n上兵伐謀 其次伐交這兩個講穿了所有的壓力就是外交部承擔那麼其次伐兵旗下攻城那麼這兩個呢就是國防部來承擔事實上這四個面向的壓力它是同步發生所以外交國防是一體兩面要有很好的協商那在這個同時我們看到裡面了\n中國大陸對台是威懾武嚇軍演困台他是一種沒有戰火的消耗戰那麼慈禧利誘以貿逼陣目前是一個短期內沒有替代的市場戰美中角力談判施壓這是一個沒有邦交的友盟戰那麼國際孤立滲透分裂這又是一個沒有席位的法律戰\n前一陣子德國馬歇爾基金會葛萊依女士訪問台灣她特別講到現在中國大陸對台的方法它是一個四路並用的不對稱方法它其實最終的目的就是不停的施壓施壓全面性的施壓那希望造成你國家生存安全重心的動搖但是\n親信的是國防部跟外交部在這上面堅持我們的立場而且所有國內外工作同仁的共同努力能夠挺得住撐得下去那事實上\n老共的手法他實際上如果以葛萊依女士講法他是一種捅窟式就是越窟越緊實際上他用了2019年一個英國的報章上講他用了一個名詞叫做一個蟒蛇戰略就是Anaconda strategy他就是越窟越緊\n所以必須有堅強的自信心有堅韌的社會強度以及能夠內外協同論述一致的整體戰略觀那這個樣子下國防外交作為一體兩面來支持國家的主權維護國家的利益因此我後面做的一個是一個很簡單的建議\n外交部的人才基金但是年輕一代現在進來以後我們希望提供更好的教育學院培養下一代卓越的人才\n因此戰略觀的教育我們希望能夠強化納入到這個外交學院裡面因為不僅止於是對話式或是作業的協調的外交程序而是你要有一個宏觀的局勢分析那麼並不受限於這個在比方講中歐東歐或者是南太平洋或是南海它是一個全面向的那下面呢我就用一個簡單的圖\n只是提出一個建議我們在智庫上不是形式上的蹲點需要有實務性的參與協作包括各部會駐外的這個智庫的蹲點希望能夠跟我們的駐外使館代表處能夠有更深層的互動\n訪問學者及官民互訪,我們希望學術交流的主題能夠配合現在的國際情勢的發展,而不是設定預想一個題目,只在那個比較偏遠的邊境去溯源,而是現在要反映到動態國際現實的變化上,我們讓這些年輕的受訓的學員,未來的派駐的外交官,能有更撐的學習角色。\n人才培育是用而訓 要訓用合一當然我們部內有一個嚴格的考核制度精進選訓用的制度也要納入國際特定區域專業的經驗來分享因為服務的經驗因為地區不同那麼像教廷的經驗跟南美洲的經驗他是完全不相同的\n我們應該要領選優秀的學生進修而且現在在大學裡面我們就希望在社團裡面找到未來有志從事外交事務的年輕學生及早能夠讓他參與這種選訓用的機會\n最後就是領選駐外專業的課程與師資我特別強調希望在我們的外交學院在這個裡面要精進專業考核的審查包括政經安全以及法院的領域因為我們希望越來越優秀的年輕人才能夠加入外交部共同為國家的利益為國家主權為中華民國的在國際的影響力來做貢獻發聲謝謝\n部長你有沒有什麼的指教?非常謝謝委員提出來的這些意見和建議我在這邊就很簡單的回應一下委員所提出來的的確我們所面對的這個國際的情勢是相當的龐大的壓力\n那委員剛剛已經說明的非常清楚的中國政府從各式各樣的這個角度不管是為外交的軍事的混合戰的這種方式是要限縮我們的活動空間要壓縮我們在回應的時候的這個眾生那在這種情形之下我們外交部甚至是我們其他的那個國安單位就必須要去思考我們整體的這個大的戰略\n那我想對我們台灣來講最好的一個戰略就是結識以及跟越來越多的這些好朋友重要的國家關係越來越深厚的話這個對我們台灣的這個戰略的這個終身是有更多的幫助\n那在這個政策的指導之下在過去這幾年我相信委員也看到了就是我們跟美國的關係跟日本跟澳洲加拿大英國以及歐盟的整體的關係都有長足的進展那委員剛剛特別提到說中東歐國家那因為中東歐國家我們台灣看到的是因為他們的那個彈性比較大\n對我們台灣的這種支持的口徑是特別的大但是對我們台灣來講我們也知道的非常清楚就是說這些重要的民主國家是我們必須要去全力去發展關係的那在過去這段時間我剛剛提到的這幾個國家跟我們的關係也是越來越緊密那這個就是我們大戰略之下的一個政策的一個成果那具體而為\n委員剛剛所提到的就是說在教育在人才的培訓上面那的確我們也是在這個軌道上面來走那我們願意把委員所提出來這些所有的看法\n來檢討一下看我們還有什麼樣不足的這個部分讓我們的年輕的這個外交官能夠在外面能夠有所發揮那在這邊順便跟委員說明一下就是說2018年我到外交部之後其實我給外交部的這些年輕的同仁的這個空間是比以前大很多所以我們外交部整體的這個戰力或者是說他們的創造性是比以前更好那這個部分是我們會持續來加強的謝謝委員\n謝謝部長的論述 也感謝您的支持跟指導 謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:13.848 --> 00:24.433\n過去個人在國外服務以及參加許多國際會議期間承蒙我們外館的同仁積極參與以及支持我在這邊首先表達謝意\n\n00:26.191 --> 00:33.037\n謝謝委員,委員能不能讓我講一些話來回應委員。其實我從2015、2016年那時候也曾經有短暫的時間跟委員有這種互動的機會。\n\n00:41.044 --> 00:55.222\n那我想委員的這種學識經驗以及為人處事是我向來非常重視的而且非常尊敬的所以在這邊有這個機會能夠在這邊跟委員來從事這個答詢的工作我感到無上的光榮謝謝委員\n\n00:57.847 --> 01:11.787\n剛才在前面王委員提到目前的南海局勢非常複雜以及503航線這個問題那麼我個人有一些經驗跟大家分享\n\n01:12.976 --> 01:33.938\n在2018年跟19年那個時候還是林永樂前部長在駐英的時間那麼他的人脈關係透過智庫的合作那麼安排我有機會在英國上院的committeeteam以及下院對503航線以及南海的問題做過兩次的\n\n01:35.083 --> 01:35.684\n委員會主席\n\n01:57.824 --> 01:58.204\n委員會主席\n\n02:24.241 --> 02:24.381\n孫子兵法\n\n02:38.320 --> 03:01.385\n上兵伐謀其次伐交這兩個講穿了所有的壓力就是外交部承擔那麼其次伐兵旗下攻城那麼這兩個呢就是國防部來承擔事實上這四個面向的壓力它是同步發生所以外交國防是一體兩面要有很好的協商那在這個同時我們看到裡面了\n\n03:02.105 --> 03:27.137\n中國大陸對台是威懾武嚇軍演困台他是一種沒有戰火的消耗戰那麼慈禧利誘以貿逼陣目前是一個短期內沒有替代的市場戰美中角力談判施壓這是一個沒有邦交的友盟戰那麼國際孤立滲透分裂這又是一個沒有席位的法律戰\n\n03:31.449 --> 03:56.565\n前一陣子德國馬歇爾基金會葛萊依女士訪問台灣她特別講到現在中國大陸對台的方法它是一個四路並用的不對稱方法它其實最終的目的就是不停的施壓施壓全面性的施壓那希望造成你國家生存安全重心的動搖但是\n\n03:58.004 --> 04:09.117\n親信的是國防部跟外交部在這上面堅持我們的立場而且所有國內外工作同仁的共同努力能夠挺得住撐得下去那事實上\n\n04:11.124 --> 04:29.546\n老共的手法他實際上如果以葛萊依女士講法他是一種捅窟式就是越窟越緊實際上他用了2019年一個英國的報章上講他用了一個名詞叫做一個蟒蛇戰略就是Anacondastrategy他就是越窟越緊\n\n04:30.507 --> 04:52.319\n所以必須有堅強的自信心有堅韌的社會強度以及能夠內外協同論述一致的整體戰略觀那這個樣子下國防外交作為一體兩面來支持國家的主權維護國家的利益因此我後面做的一個是一個很簡單的建議\n\n04:53.920 --> 05:03.386\n外交部的人才基金但是年輕一代現在進來以後我們希望提供更好的教育學院培養下一代卓越的人才\n\n05:05.011 --> 05:33.130\n因此戰略觀的教育我們希望能夠強化納入到這個外交學院裡面因為不僅止於是對話式或是作業的協調的外交程序而是你要有一個宏觀的局勢分析那麼並不受限於這個在比方講中歐東歐或者是南太平洋或是南海它是一個全面向的那下面呢我就用一個簡單的圖\n\n05:34.690 --> 05:51.469\n只是提出一個建議我們在智庫上不是形式上的蹲點需要有實務性的參與協作包括各部會駐外的這個智庫的蹲點希望能夠跟我們的駐外使館代表處能夠有更深層的互動\n\n05:53.757 --> 06:15.062\n訪問學者及官民互訪,我們希望學術交流的主題能夠配合現在的國際情勢的發展,而不是設定預想一個題目,只在那個比較偏遠的邊境去溯源,而是現在要反映到動態國際現實的變化上,我們讓這些年輕的受訓的學員,未來的派駐的外交官,能有更撐的學習角色。\n\n06:18.707 --> 06:39.554\n人才培育是用而訓要訓用合一當然我們部內有一個嚴格的考核制度精進選訓用的制度也要納入國際特定區域專業的經驗來分享因為服務的經驗因為地區不同那麼像教廷的經驗跟南美洲的經驗他是完全不相同的\n\n06:40.354 --> 06:52.800\n我們應該要領選優秀的學生進修而且現在在大學裡面我們就希望在社團裡面找到未來有志從事外交事務的年輕學生及早能夠讓他參與這種選訓用的機會\n\n06:56.563 --> 07:24.529\n最後就是領選駐外專業的課程與師資我特別強調希望在我們的外交學院在這個裡面要精進專業考核的審查包括政經安全以及法院的領域因為我們希望越來越優秀的年輕人才能夠加入外交部共同為國家的利益為國家主權為中華民國的在國際的影響力來做貢獻發聲謝謝\n\n07:26.269 --> 07:43.933\n部長你有沒有什麼的指教?非常謝謝委員提出來的這些意見和建議我在這邊就很簡單的回應一下委員所提出來的的確我們所面對的這個國際的情勢是相當的龐大的壓力\n\n07:46.434 --> 08:09.821\n那委員剛剛已經說明的非常清楚的中國政府從各式各樣的這個角度不管是為外交的軍事的混合戰的這種方式是要限縮我們的活動空間要壓縮我們在回應的時候的這個眾生那在這種情形之下我們外交部甚至是我們其他的那個國安單位就必須要去思考我們整體的這個大的戰略\n\n08:10.481 --> 08:25.580\n那我想對我們台灣來講最好的一個戰略就是結識以及跟越來越多的這些好朋友重要的國家關係越來越深厚的話這個對我們台灣的這個戰略的這個終身是有更多的幫助\n\n08:26.923 --> 08:47.472\n那在這個政策的指導之下在過去這幾年我相信委員也看到了就是我們跟美國的關係跟日本跟澳洲加拿大英國以及歐盟的整體的關係都有長足的進展那委員剛剛特別提到說中東歐國家那因為中東歐國家我們台灣看到的是因為他們的那個彈性比較大\n\n08:48.452 --> 09:14.125\n對我們台灣的這種支持的口徑是特別的大但是對我們台灣來講我們也知道的非常清楚就是說這些重要的民主國家是我們必須要去全力去發展關係的那在過去這段時間我剛剛提到的這幾個國家跟我們的關係也是越來越緊密那這個就是我們大戰略之下的一個政策的一個成果那具體而為\n\n09:15.686 --> 09:27.217\n委員剛剛所提到的就是說在教育在人才的培訓上面那的確我們也是在這個軌道上面來走那我們願意把委員所提出來這些所有的看法\n\n09:29.101 --> 09:55.597\n來檢討一下看我們還有什麼樣不足的這個部分讓我們的年輕的這個外交官能夠在外面能夠有所發揮那在這邊順便跟委員說明一下就是說2018年我到外交部之後其實我給外交部的這些年輕的同仁的這個空間是比以前大很多所以我們外交部整體的這個戰力或者是說他們的創造性是比以前更好那這個部分是我們會持續來加強的謝謝委員\n\n09:58.515 --> 10:00.904\n謝謝部長的論述也感謝您的支持跟指導謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":13.848,"end":24.433,"text":"過去個人在國外服務以及參加許多國際會議期間 承蒙我們外館的同仁積極參與以及支持 我在這邊首先表達謝意"},{"start":26.191,"end":33.037,"text":"謝謝委員,委員能不能讓我講一些話來回應委員。其實我從2015、2016年那時候也曾經有短暫的時間跟委員有這種互動的機會。"},{"start":41.044,"end":55.222,"text":"那我想委員的這種學識經驗以及為人處事是我向來非常重視的而且非常尊敬的所以在這邊有這個機會能夠在這邊跟委員來從事這個答詢的工作我感到無上的光榮謝謝委員"},{"start":57.847,"end":71.787,"text":"剛才在前面王委員提到目前的南海局勢非常複雜以及503航線這個問題那麼我個人有一些經驗跟大家分享"},{"start":72.976,"end":93.938,"text":"在2018年跟19年那個時候還是林永樂前部長在駐英的時間那麼他的人脈關係透過智庫的合作那麼安排我有機會在英國上院的committeeteam以及下院對503航線以及南海的問題做過兩次的"},{"start":95.083,"end":95.684,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":117.824,"end":118.204,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":144.241,"end":144.381,"text":"孫子兵法"},{"start":158.32,"end":181.385,"text":"上兵伐謀 其次伐交這兩個講穿了所有的壓力就是外交部承擔那麼其次伐兵旗下攻城那麼這兩個呢就是國防部來承擔事實上這四個面向的壓力它是同步發生所以外交國防是一體兩面要有很好的協商那在這個同時我們看到裡面了"},{"start":182.105,"end":207.137,"text":"中國大陸對台是威懾武嚇軍演困台他是一種沒有戰火的消耗戰那麼慈禧利誘以貿逼陣目前是一個短期內沒有替代的市場戰美中角力談判施壓這是一個沒有邦交的友盟戰那麼國際孤立滲透分裂這又是一個沒有席位的法律戰"},{"start":211.449,"end":236.565,"text":"前一陣子德國馬歇爾基金會葛萊依女士訪問台灣她特別講到現在中國大陸對台的方法它是一個四路並用的不對稱方法它其實最終的目的就是不停的施壓施壓全面性的施壓那希望造成你國家生存安全重心的動搖但是"},{"start":238.004,"end":249.117,"text":"親信的是國防部跟外交部在這上面堅持我們的立場而且所有國內外工作同仁的共同努力能夠挺得住撐得下去那事實上"},{"start":251.124,"end":269.546,"text":"老共的手法他實際上如果以葛萊依女士講法他是一種捅窟式就是越窟越緊實際上他用了2019年一個英國的報章上講他用了一個名詞叫做一個蟒蛇戰略就是Anaconda strategy他就是越窟越緊"},{"start":270.507,"end":292.319,"text":"所以必須有堅強的自信心有堅韌的社會強度以及能夠內外協同論述一致的整體戰略觀那這個樣子下國防外交作為一體兩面來支持國家的主權維護國家的利益因此我後面做的一個是一個很簡單的建議"},{"start":293.92,"end":303.386,"text":"外交部的人才基金但是年輕一代現在進來以後我們希望提供更好的教育學院培養下一代卓越的人才"},{"start":305.011,"end":333.13,"text":"因此戰略觀的教育我們希望能夠強化納入到這個外交學院裡面因為不僅止於是對話式或是作業的協調的外交程序而是你要有一個宏觀的局勢分析那麼並不受限於這個在比方講中歐東歐或者是南太平洋或是南海它是一個全面向的那下面呢我就用一個簡單的圖"},{"start":334.69,"end":351.469,"text":"只是提出一個建議我們在智庫上不是形式上的蹲點需要有實務性的參與協作包括各部會駐外的這個智庫的蹲點希望能夠跟我們的駐外使館代表處能夠有更深層的互動"},{"start":353.757,"end":375.062,"text":"訪問學者及官民互訪,我們希望學術交流的主題能夠配合現在的國際情勢的發展,而不是設定預想一個題目,只在那個比較偏遠的邊境去溯源,而是現在要反映到動態國際現實的變化上,我們讓這些年輕的受訓的學員,未來的派駐的外交官,能有更撐的學習角色。"},{"start":378.707,"end":399.554,"text":"人才培育是用而訓 要訓用合一當然我們部內有一個嚴格的考核制度精進選訓用的制度也要納入國際特定區域專業的經驗來分享因為服務的經驗因為地區不同那麼像教廷的經驗跟南美洲的經驗他是完全不相同的"},{"start":400.354,"end":412.8,"text":"我們應該要領選優秀的學生進修而且現在在大學裡面我們就希望在社團裡面找到未來有志從事外交事務的年輕學生及早能夠讓他參與這種選訓用的機會"},{"start":416.563,"end":444.529,"text":"最後就是領選駐外專業的課程與師資我特別強調希望在我們的外交學院在這個裡面要精進專業考核的審查包括政經安全以及法院的領域因為我們希望越來越優秀的年輕人才能夠加入外交部共同為國家的利益為國家主權為中華民國的在國際的影響力來做貢獻發聲謝謝"},{"start":446.269,"end":463.933,"text":"部長你有沒有什麼的指教?非常謝謝委員提出來的這些意見和建議我在這邊就很簡單的回應一下委員所提出來的的確我們所面對的這個國際的情勢是相當的龐大的壓力"},{"start":466.434,"end":489.821,"text":"那委員剛剛已經說明的非常清楚的中國政府從各式各樣的這個角度不管是為外交的軍事的混合戰的這種方式是要限縮我們的活動空間要壓縮我們在回應的時候的這個眾生那在這種情形之下我們外交部甚至是我們其他的那個國安單位就必須要去思考我們整體的這個大的戰略"},{"start":490.481,"end":505.58,"text":"那我想對我們台灣來講最好的一個戰略就是結識以及跟越來越多的這些好朋友重要的國家關係越來越深厚的話這個對我們台灣的這個戰略的這個終身是有更多的幫助"},{"start":506.923,"end":527.472,"text":"那在這個政策的指導之下在過去這幾年我相信委員也看到了就是我們跟美國的關係跟日本跟澳洲加拿大英國以及歐盟的整體的關係都有長足的進展那委員剛剛特別提到說中東歐國家那因為中東歐國家我們台灣看到的是因為他們的那個彈性比較大"},{"start":528.452,"end":554.125,"text":"對我們台灣的這種支持的口徑是特別的大但是對我們台灣來講我們也知道的非常清楚就是說這些重要的民主國家是我們必須要去全力去發展關係的那在過去這段時間我剛剛提到的這幾個國家跟我們的關係也是越來越緊密那這個就是我們大戰略之下的一個政策的一個成果那具體而為"},{"start":555.686,"end":567.217,"text":"委員剛剛所提到的就是說在教育在人才的培訓上面那的確我們也是在這個軌道上面來走那我們願意把委員所提出來這些所有的看法"},{"start":569.101,"end":595.597,"text":"來檢討一下看我們還有什麼樣不足的這個部分讓我們的年輕的這個外交官能夠在外面能夠有所發揮那在這邊順便跟委員說明一下就是說2018年我到外交部之後其實我給外交部的這些年輕的同仁的這個空間是比以前大很多所以我們外交部整體的這個戰力或者是說他們的創造性是比以前更好那這個部分是我們會持續來加強的謝謝委員"},{"start":598.515,"end":600.904,"text":"謝謝部長的論述 也感謝您的支持跟指導 謝謝"}]}}}}