{"id":150121,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150121","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/b8deaa01a2e7f192397332501c13b7cfed861a3b97380652f8ba9b0039caa7a62358c043e02a71fb5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"黃珊珊","委員發言時間":"10:46:38 - 10:58:13","影片長度":"00:11:35","會議時間":"2024-03-20T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：處理或審查中華民國113年度中央政府總預算決議，有關財政部主管預算凍結書面報告案45案。[如經院會復議，則不予處理或審查]\n【3月18日及20日二天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":4,"committees":[20],"id":"委員會-11-1-20-4"},"date":"2024-03-20","duration":695,"end_time":"2024-03-20T10:58:13+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-20T10:46:38+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":702,"blocks":[["黃委員珊珊：（10時46分）謝謝主席。請部長。"],["主席：有請莊部長。"],["莊部長翠雲：委員好。"],["黃委員珊珊：部長，臺灣最嚴重的問題大概還是回到居住正義，政府在租金緩漲跟房市緩漲的努力之下，用了非常多的租稅工具，但是你認為有沒有達到所謂居住正義的效果？尤其是我們在質詢央行總裁的時候，他也說過了，他提出的是選擇性信用管制；可是政府又做了新青安貸款，把房市撐住了，現在健全房市變成政府之間左手打右手，你認不認同政府應該有一致的作法來做到居住正義？"],["莊部長翠雲：跟委員報告，居住正義是我們一直在這條路上去走，採取相關的措施，那在……"],["黃委員珊珊：所以居住正義不能做一半嘛！對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：對，當然，各項措施。有關租稅的部分，譬如說社宅的包租代管、公益出租人的戶數都逐漸上升，因為我們有相關的賦稅減少……"],["黃委員珊珊：沒錯，政府不斷的在鼓勵所謂的公益出租、所謂的包租代管，賦稅也做了非常多的優惠，但是要跟部長討論的是，房屋稅條例跟住宅法都已經修訂了，也把自住跟公益出租人出租使用同等待遇，而且很多人也開始做公益出租人。按照內政部估算，全臺的租屋族大概有300萬人，依照擴大所謂租金補貼的收入門檻，六都以外的縣市大概是每個人每個月四萬兩千多，有40%的受僱員工目前統計上的薪資是低於這個門檻。","也就是說全臺灣的租屋族裡面，大概有120萬人可以適用所謂的租金補貼，可是現在的公益出租人只有12萬。也就是有120萬人適合租金補貼的標準，但是只有12萬的公益出租人願意拿房子出來租給符合租金補貼的人，你覺得問題出在哪裡？也就是十分之一的人來做公益出租人，表示公益出租人的誘因沒有那麼大，不是嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：這個部分事實上還需要讓更多的房東可以知道這樣的事情，因為很多房東可能對這個部分還……"],["黃委員珊珊：房東都知道，只是房東會去算划不划算啦！房東不可能不知道，這12萬的公益出租人拿出來租了，將來會碰到一個問題，就是可能之前大家討論過很多次的，還有沒有更好的賦稅優惠？如果他今天當了公益出租人，拿房子出來租，可是將來轉賣的時候，一樣還是會受到必須要1年、甚至是5年這樣的時程，才能夠享有所謂土地增值稅自用住宅的一生一次優惠。所以就這個部分，公益出租人並沒有在土地增值稅轉賣的時候得到更多的優惠，不是嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：跟委員報告，現在公益出租人的話，第一個，他的租金所得部分，1個月有1萬5,000塊是可以免稅，超過的部分，它的費用比例也比一般的費用比例高，可以到60%。"],["黃委員珊珊：如果我當公益出租人，你知道能夠節省的稅負只有幾千塊，但是轉賣的時候增值稅會有10%跟20%的差距，將近幾十萬。"],["莊部長翠雲：是。"],["黃委員珊珊：這兩個的差距就會讓很多人不願意來當公益出租人，這才是問題嘛！"],["莊部長翠雲：因為土地增值稅要適用優惠稅率必須是要自用，就是剛剛委員所提到的2年或5年。"],["黃委員珊珊：沒錯。"],["莊部長翠雲：我想這個部分，其實漲價歸公，因為它是有交易，就漲價的部分課稅嘛！"],["黃委員珊珊：我同意。部長，我的意思是如果當了公益出租人，應該在所謂必須損失1年的租金上面再給多一點的誘因。也就是說，這個1年的時程其實對公益出租人可以有個例外的條款，這樣的誘因會讓公益出租人更願意多拿他的房子出來，因為他不會受到必須要1年不能出租這樣子的事實狀態，而且他當了公益出租人，他已經對這個國家社會有一些貢獻了。我的意思是如果要做就做全套，這全套在土地增值稅的部分也應該設想一下對公益出租人的誘因可以再增加，或者是在這1年的時程裡面給他一些優惠的其他條款。部長同意嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：因為土地增值稅是屬於地方稅，而且地方稅對地方來說是一個滿重要的……"],["黃委員珊珊：如果按照剛剛講起來，其實它占了非常非常少的比例，也就是這12萬戶占地方土地增值稅的比例也不會太高，我的意思是，如果政府要做對公益出租人相關優惠，這部分也可以列入考慮。"],["莊部長翠雲：這個部分涉及到地方政府的地方稅，可能要審慎考慮，然後再加上未來公益出租人的戶數應該會逐年上升。"],["黃委員珊珊：部長，囤房稅這些稅也都是地方稅啊！一樣的問題嘛！"],["莊部長翠雲：是。"],["黃委員珊珊：如果要做這些相關的稅負改革，我希望也開始去思考怎麼給公益出租人更多的優惠，這是第一點，好嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：我想這個部分……"],["黃委員珊珊：公益出租人包括居住正義、包括現在內政部所提出的一些相關方案，我覺得政府常常左手打右手，我們到底是要推居住正義還是不要？如果要，就做全套，而不是做半套。"],["莊部長翠雲：居住正義是我們一直都在努力的。"],["黃委員珊珊：麻煩部長可以針對土地增值稅有沒有可能在公益出租人上面再做一些優惠，你們回去研議一下，好嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：可以，我們再給您書面報告，好嗎？"],["黃委員珊珊：接下來我想問一下，2月份又超收了吧？超徵稅收。"],["莊部長翠雲：2月份，我想跟委員報告，沒有所謂的超收，就是我們可以跟委員報告的是較去年增加。"],["黃委員珊珊：每個月都收得很好？"],["莊部長翠雲：對，大概跟委員報告一下到2月為止的稅收情況……"],["黃委員珊珊：3月可能因為ETF又會超徵很多啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：對。"],["黃委員珊珊：所以你覺得今年會超徵嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：跟委員報告，因為現在是到2月為止，全國稅收達到3,185億，中央是2,206億，比去年同期是增加的，主要稅收增加最多的不可否認是證交稅，因為每日成交值算是高的，所以證交稅比去年增加很多。"],["黃委員珊珊：所以有可能會再超徵？"],["莊部長翠雲：營業稅和綜所稅是增加的。"],["黃委員珊珊：根據我們調國庫署的資料顯示，其實每年我們都在花很多的錢，包括特別預算都陸續在支出，去年就付了4.1兆，特別預算達到1.4兆，財政部推估今年的收支會短絀，還是會有所謂的超收？"],["莊部長翠雲：就總預算來說，目前來說是短收，但是還是要看稅收的情況。跟委員報告，比如112年的總預算也是短收，但是稅收超過預算數，所以我們在舉債的部分1,732億沒有舉債，而且增加還債。我們到5月以後要看稅收的情形……"],["黃委員珊珊：部長，不管怎麼超收，還是有舉債的問題，因為將來特別預算的支付會越來越沉重，審計部也做了相關的報告。接下去看到主計總處的推估，到2025會短差2,000億，2026會短差一千多億，所以超收不應該成為高度依賴的不確定因素。我希望現在的超收，如果能夠……只有兩個原則嘛，第一個是少花錢，第二是多還債。按照現在的狀況，我們去年多還了1,100億，如果這樣的話，財政部能不能估今年有沒有可能再多還多少錢？"],["莊部長翠雲：跟委員報告，去年我們是還了1,260億，就是說除了預算編了1,110億之外，我們又多還了150億，然後1,732億原來要舉借的也沒有舉借，所以就是減少舉借增加還債。今年預算數要還1,150億，那我們會在5月、6月大額稅款進來的時候就先去做一些還債的工作，然後到年底的時候……"],["黃委員珊珊：所以部長的意思是我們能還債會先還債。"],["莊部長翠雲：會儘量還債，是的，這是財政部一直都在做的。"],["黃委員珊珊：也就是說，我們希望將來的超收不要成為人民的假象，我們不希望這邊超收，那邊在舉債，這是一個事實的狀況，而且每年都告訴大家，我們超收很多，還可以發6,000塊，但是政府的舉債並沒有減少，這才是我們的問題啊！","最後一個問題就是有關台彩公司，它在大年初四曾經發生系統設定錯誤，然後讓民眾買不到彩券，後來的補救措施，部長覺得滿意嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：第一個，它是讓大家買得到，也就是說它的對獎時間變成第二天。"],["黃委員珊珊：這個怎麼會出這種錯啊？"],["莊部長翠雲：對、對、對，這個不應該……"],["黃委員珊珊：台彩已經那麼久了，而且怎麼會是所謂的內控人員疏失？這是什麼問題，你們查過了沒有？"],["莊部長翠雲：我們有查，也澈底……我們馬上就請台彩公司處理，而且他們也做了補救措施，對於那一天提早……"],["黃委員珊珊：部長，我們發現了一個很嚴重的問題，就是你們查了，但是依照公益彩券發行條例，目前為止對於這種內控失當的狀況，國庫署好像說沒有任何罰則，是嗎？你沒有辦法處罰它嗎？以後再發生還是一樣嗎？只是寫個報告草草了事？"],["莊部長翠雲：有相關議處啊！"],["黃委員珊珊：這個有議處嗎？這個有裁罰嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：有啊！"],["黃委員珊珊：我們得到的消息是沒有裁罰，只有寫報告啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：沒有，有相關的議處。"],["黃委員珊珊：所以是國庫署給我的資料有問題，是嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：請國庫署說明。"],["黃委員珊珊：我的問題就是說內控、內稽是重要的，而且這是彩券對人民的公信力，彩券是小老百姓都會去購買，發生這種事情會造成政府公信力的損失。如果你有裁罰，把相關資料給我。"],["陳署長柏誠：報告委員，相關的裁罰如果說是嚴重損害彩券公信力是要停止……"],["黃委員珊珊：我只問你，這個案子有沒有裁罰？"],["陳署長柏誠：目前因為我們認定還沒有到嚴重到要停止。"],["黃委員珊珊：所以認為這是小事？"],["陳署長柏誠：但是台彩公司有對相關人員議處。"],["黃委員珊珊：如果你要訂出相關裁罰的話，你可能也要告訴我，你為什麼認為這個案子是小事！好嗎？謝謝。"],["莊部長翠雲：好，謝謝。"],["黃委員珊珊：請將書面資料給我。"],["主席：請署長儘速將書面資料回報給黃珊珊委員。"],["莊部長翠雲：好，我們再跟委員說明。"],["主席：謝謝黃珊珊委員。緊接著請吳秉叡委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":278,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-20-4","speakers":["郭國文","林德福","賴士葆","賴惠員","王世堅","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","顏寬恒","李坤城","黃珊珊","吳秉叡","陳玉珍","李彥秀","鍾佳濱","黃國昌","王鴻薇","謝衣鳯","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","羅明才"],"page_start":215,"meetingDate":["2024-03-20"],"gazette_id":"1131601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1131601_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"處理或審查中華民國113年度中央政府總預算決議，有關財政部主管預算凍結書面報告案45案","agenda_id":"1131601_00004"}},"transcript":{"id":"150121","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150121","tool":"pyannote","id":"150121-pyannote"},"job_id":"KvQgcH1kWs8KbfH7","queued_at":"2024-06-02 00:04:08","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2024-06-02 00:05:26","msg":"downloading https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150121"},{"time":"2024-06-02 00:05:27","msg":"downloading https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/b8deaa01a2e7f192397332501c13b7cfed861a3b9738065239fe8f237991028f3c0b16c68b9325bf5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8"},{"time":"2024-06-02 00:05:50","msg":"converting mp4 to wav"},{"time":"2024-06-02 00:05:52","msg":"running pyannote"},{"time":"2024-06-02 00:06:03","msg":"status: 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511.358, \"end\": 511.819, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"少\", \"start\": 511.819, \"end\": 511.999, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"花\", \"start\": 511.999, \"end\": 512.62, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"錢\"}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 512.62, \"end\": 512.74, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"二\", \"start\": 512.74, \"end\": 512.86, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 512.86, \"end\": 513.24, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 513.24, \"end\": 513.26, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"債\"}]}, {\"start\": 514.389, \"end\": 517.692, \"text\": \"如果按照現在的狀況我們去年多還了1100億如果這樣的話財政部能不能估今年有沒有可能再多還多少錢跟委員報告去年我們是還了1260億就是說除了預算邊的1111億我們又多還了150億然後1732億原來要舉借的也沒有舉借\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 514.389, \"end\": 514.469, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 514.469, \"end\": 514.549, \"score\": 0.354}, {\"word\": \"按\", \"start\": 514.549, \"end\": 514.729, \"score\": 0.779}, {\"word\": \"照\", \"start\": 514.729, \"end\": 514.749, 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\"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:07,362 --> 00:00:08,024\n謝謝主席我請部長我請莊部長\n\n2\n00:00:14,451 --> 00:00:41,396\n委員好是部長我想我們臺灣最嚴重的問題大概還是回到居住正義那在相關的政府在租金房租還漲跟房市還漲的努力之下有用了非常多的租稅工具但是你認為有沒有達到所謂的居住正義的效果尤其是在央行總裁我們在質詢他的時候他也說過了他提\n\n3\n00:00:42,136 --> 00:01:01,296\n提出的是選擇性的信用管制可是政府又做了新清安貸款又把房市撐住了那現在建權房市成了變成政府之間左手打右手你認不認同政府應該有一致的做法來做到居住正義\n\n4\n00:01:02,253 --> 00:01:24,186\n跟委員報告居住正義是我們一直在這個條路上去走採取相關的一個措施所以居住正義不能做一半嘛對對當然那個各項措施那有關租稅的部分比如說社宅的包租代管公益出租人的這個戶數都逐漸的上升因為我們有相關的戶稅減少政府不斷的在鼓勵\n\n5\n00:01:25,427 --> 00:01:50,952\n所謂的公益出租所謂的包租貸款付稅也做了非常多的優惠但是看起來這邊要跟部長討論的就是我們防護稅條例跟住宅法都已經修訂了也把自住跟公益出租人出租使用的同等待遇而且也很多的人也開始做公益出租人但是按照內政部估算全台的租屋圖大概有300萬人\n\n6\n00:01:52,412 --> 00:02:18,771\n那依照我們擴大所謂租金補貼的收入門檻六都以外的縣市大概是每個人每個月4萬2千多可是40%的受僱員工目前統計上面是低於這個門檻也就是說全台灣的租屋族裡面大概有120萬人可以適用所謂的租金補貼可是現在的公益出租人只有12萬也就是我有120萬人適合\n\n7\n00:02:40,874 --> 00:03:06,128\n這個部分事實上還需要讓更多的房東可以知道這樣的一個事情因為很多房東可能對這個部分還拿...房東都知道只是房東會去算划不划算房東不可能不知道這12萬的公益出租人拿出來租了他將來碰到了一個問題就是可能之前大家討論過很多次的還有沒有更好的付稅優惠\n\n8\n00:03:07,489 --> 00:03:32,179\n如果他今天當了公益出租人拿出來租房子可是將來在轉賣的時候一樣還是會受到土地增值稅必須要一年甚至五年這樣的時程才能夠所謂的享有自用住宅的一生一世所以就這個部分公益出租人並沒有在土地增值稅轉賣的時候得到更多的優惠不是嗎\n\n9\n00:03:33,544 --> 00:03:45,748\n因為跟委員報告現在公益出租人的話第一個他的租金所得的部分一個月有15000塊是可以免稅那超過的部分他的費用的比例也比一般的費用比例高可以到60你知道他能夠節省的稅負只有幾千塊但是他移轉轉賣的時候他的增值稅會從10%跟20%的差距將近幾十萬是\n\n10\n00:03:57,893 --> 00:04:17,213\n這兩個的差距就會讓很多的人不願意來當公益出租人這才是問題嘛那在因為土地增值稅的時候你要適用優惠稅率必須是要自用嘛就是剛剛委員所提到兩年或五年這個部分那我想這個部分其實漲價歸公因為他是有交易他就漲價的部分我同意啦\n\n11\n00:04:18,754 --> 00:04:33,901\n我的意思是說如果我當了公益出租人我應該在這個所謂的我必須損失一年的租金上面再給他多一點的誘因也就是說這個一年的時程其實在公益出租人可以有個例外的條款\n\n12\n00:04:35,113 --> 00:04:55,454\n的用因會讓公益出租人更願意多拿他的房子出來因為他不會受到必須要一年不能出租這樣子的事實狀態而且他當了公益出租人他已經對這個國家社會有一些貢獻我的意思是如果我們要做就做全套這全套在土地增值稅的部分也應該\n\n13\n00:04:57,836 --> 00:05:24,370\n來設想一下公益出租人他的誘因可以再增加或者是說在這一年的時程裡面給他一些優惠的其他的條款部長同意嗎我想委員這個部分因為土地增值稅是屬於地方稅那地方稅的而且對他們來說是一個蠻重要的剛剛的講起來其實他佔了非常非常少的比例也就是這12萬戶他的比例佔地方的土地增值稅的比例也不會太高\n\n14\n00:05:45,911 --> 00:06:13,967\n我們如果要做相關的這些稅賦的改善我希望在公益出租人這邊也開始去思考怎麼給他更多的優惠。這是第一點。好嗎?我想公益出租人包括居住正義包括現在內政部他所提出的一些相關的方案我覺得政府常常左手打右手我們到底是要推居住正義還是不要?如果要就做全套而不是做半套。居住正義是我們一直都在努力的。\n\n15\n00:06:15,087 --> 00:06:31,613\n這個麻煩部長也可以給我一個相關對於這個土地增值稅有沒有可能在公益出租金上面再做一些優惠你們回去研議一下好嗎可以我們再給您書面報告接下來的部分就是我想問一下我們現在2月份又超收了吧超徵稅收\n\n16\n00:06:33,411 --> 00:06:52,489\n二月份我想這個跟委員報告沒有所謂超收就是我們可以跟委員報告去年增加對大概跟委員報告一下到二月為底的稅收情況因為你三月可能ETF又會超增很多啊對所以今年你會覺得今年會超增嗎\n\n17\n00:06:53,786 --> 00:07:08,398\n跟委員報告因為現在是到2月為止我們全國稅收是達到3185億那中央是2206億那是比去年同期是增加的那主要的稅收增加最多的不可否認是政交稅因為每\n\n18\n00:07:09,679 --> 00:07:32,585\n因為那個每日的成交值算是高的所以政交稅比去年增加很多營業稅跟中所稅是增加的接下來但是我們現在在調國庫署的資料有關每年其實我們都在花很多的錢因為包括特別預算都陸續的在支出所以去年我們就付錢就付了4.1兆那特別預算就是達到1.4兆\n\n19\n00:07:34,745 --> 00:07:45,610\n財政部推估今年的收支會短促還是會有所謂的超收?就預算來說總預算來說目前來說是短收但是還是要看稅收的情況跟委員報告比如說像112年的話我們的總預算裡面也是短收但是因為稅收超過預算數所以我們在舉債的部分1730而已沒有舉債而且增加還債\n\n20\n00:07:59,436 --> 00:08:17,146\n我們怎麼超收但是我們還是有舉債的問題因為我們將來的特別預算的支付會越來越沉重這也是審計部也做了相關的報告所以接下來去看到主計出的推估到2025會短差2000億2026會短差1000多億\n\n21\n00:08:20,228 --> 00:08:33,260\n所以超收不應該是成為我們高度依賴的不確定因素我希望說現在的超收如果能夠只有兩個原則嘛第一個是少花錢第二是多還債\n\n22\n00:08:34,389 --> 00:08:37,692\n如果按照現在的狀況我們去年多還了1100億如果這樣的話財政部能不能估今年有沒有可能再多還多少錢跟委員報告去年我們是還了1260億就是說除了預算邊的1111億我們又多還了150億然後1732億原來要舉借的也沒有舉借\n\n23\n00:09:16,613 --> 00:09:40,439\n朝收不要成為人民的假象我們不希望說這邊超收那邊再舉債這是一個事實上狀況而且會每年都告訴大家我們超收很多還可以發6000塊但是政府的舉債並沒有減少這才是我們的問題最後一個問題就是有關台彩公司他在大年初四的時候曾經發生系統設定錯誤然後讓民眾買不到\n\n24\n00:09:43,260 --> 00:09:56,983\n財卷然後來的補救措施部長覺得滿意嗎這件事情第一個他是讓他買得到也就是說他提早那個就是他用那個對講時間就有點要變成第二天的這個怎麼會出這種錯啊對對對這個不應該已經那麼久了而且怎麼會是所謂的內控人員疏失這是什麼問題你們查過了沒有\n\n25\n00:10:05,845 --> 00:10:25,320\n我們有查也徹底我們馬上就請台彩公司做處理而且他們也做了補救措施那對於但是部長我們發現了一個很嚴重的問題就是你們查了但是依照供應彩券發行條例目前為止對於這種內控失道的狀況好像國庫署說沒有任何法則是嗎你沒有辦法處罰他嗎\n\n26\n00:10:29,431 --> 00:10:39,840\n那以後再發生還是一樣嗎?只是寫個報告草草了事有相關的啊有相關議處啊這個有議處嗎?這個有裁罰嗎?有啊我們得到的消息是沒有裁罰只有寫報告啊沒有有相關的議處這是國庫署給我的資料有問題是嗎?我的問題就是說內控內機是重要的\n\n27\n00:10:56,374 --> 00:11:17,651\n而且這種是我們彩券對人民的公信力彩券是小老百姓都會去購買的發生這種事情會造成政府公信力的損失如果你沒有裁罰把相關資料給我那個相關的裁罰如果說是嚴重損害彩券公信力阿是要停止我只問你這個案子有沒有裁罰這目前因為我們認定還沒有到嚴重到要停止所以你認為這是小事\n\n28\n00:11:18,651 --> 00:11:27,134\n但是他們相關的財財公司如果你要訂出相關的財閥的話你可能也要告訴我這個案子你為什麼認為是小事好嗎?謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n7362\t8024\t謝謝主席 我請部長我請莊部長\n14451\t41396\t委員好是部長我想我們臺灣最嚴重的問題大概還是回到居住正義那在相關的政府在租金房租還漲跟房市還漲的努力之下有用了非常多的租稅工具但是你認為有沒有達到所謂的居住正義的效果尤其是在央行總裁我們在質詢他的時候他也說過了他提\n42136\t61296\t提出的是選擇性的信用管制可是政府又做了新清安貸款又把房市撐住了那現在建權房市成了變成政府之間左手打右手你認不認同政府應該有一致的做法來做到居住正義\n62253\t84186\t跟委員報告居住正義是我們一直在這個條路上去走採取相關的一個措施所以居住正義不能做一半嘛對對當然那個各項措施那有關租稅的部分比如說社宅的包租代管公益出租人的這個戶數都逐漸的上升因為我們有相關的戶稅減少政府不斷的在鼓勵\n85427\t110952\t所謂的公益出租所謂的包租貸款付稅也做了非常多的優惠但是看起來這邊要跟部長討論的就是我們防護稅條例跟住宅法都已經修訂了也把自住跟公益出租人出租使用的同等待遇而且也很多的人也開始做公益出租人但是按照內政部估算全台的租屋圖大概有300萬人\n112412\t138771\t那依照我們擴大所謂租金補貼的收入門檻六都以外的縣市大概是每個人每個月4萬2千多可是40%的受僱員工目前統計上面是低於這個門檻也就是說全台灣的租屋族裡面大概有120萬人可以適用所謂的租金補貼可是現在的公益出租人只有12萬也就是我有120萬人適合\n141783\t159445\t﹗\n160874\t186128\t這個部分事實上還需要讓更多的房東可以知道這樣的一個事情因為很多房東可能對這個部分還拿...房東都知道只是房東會去算划不划算房東不可能不知道這12萬的公益出租人拿出來租了他將來碰到了一個問題就是可能之前大家討論過很多次的還有沒有更好的付稅優惠\n187489\t212179\t如果他今天當了公益出租人拿出來租房子可是將來在轉賣的時候一樣還是會受到土地增值稅必須要一年甚至五年這樣的時程才能夠所謂的享有自用住宅的一生一世所以就這個部分公益出租人並沒有在土地增值稅轉賣的時候得到更多的優惠不是嗎\n213544\t225748\t因為跟委員報告現在公益出租人的話第一個他的租金所得的部分一個月有15000塊是可以免稅那超過的部分他的費用的比例也比一般的費用比例高可以到60你知道他能夠節省的稅負只有幾千塊但是他移轉轉賣的時候他的增值稅會從10%跟20%的差距將近幾十萬是\n237893\t257213\t這兩個的差距就會讓很多的人不願意來當公益出租人這才是問題嘛那在因為土地增值稅的時候你要適用優惠稅率必須是要自用嘛就是剛剛委員所提到兩年或五年這個部分那我想這個部分其實漲價歸公因為他是有交易他就漲價的部分我同意啦\n258754\t273901\t我的意思是說如果我當了公益出租人我應該在這個所謂的我必須損失一年的租金上面再給他多一點的誘因也就是說這個一年的時程其實在公益出租人可以有個例外的條款\n275113\t295454\t的用因會讓公益出租人更願意多拿他的房子出來因為他不會受到必須要一年不能出租這樣子的事實狀態而且他當了公益出租人他已經對這個國家社會有一些貢獻我的意思是如果我們要做就做全套這全套在土地增值稅的部分也應該\n297836\t324370\t來設想一下公益出租人他的誘因可以再增加或者是說在這一年的時程裡面給他一些優惠的其他的條款部長同意嗎我想委員這個部分因為土地增值稅是屬於地方稅那地方稅的而且對他們來說是一個蠻重要的剛剛的講起來其實他佔了非常非常少的比例也就是這12萬戶他的比例佔地方的土地增值稅的比例也不會太高\n324770\t345811\t​​​​​​​​​​\n345911\t373967\t我們如果要做相關的這些稅賦的改善我希望在公益出租人這邊也開始去思考怎麼給他更多的優惠。這是第一點。好嗎?我想公益出租人包括居住正義包括現在內政部他所提出的一些相關的方案我覺得政府常常左手打右手我們到底是要推居住正義還是不要?如果要就做全套而不是做半套。居住正義是我們一直都在努力的。\n375087\t391613\t這個麻煩部長也可以給我一個相關對於這個土地增值稅有沒有可能在公益出租金上面再做一些優惠你們回去研議一下好嗎可以我們再給您書面報告接下來的部分就是我想問一下我們現在2月份又超收了吧超徵稅收\n393411\t412489\t二月份我想這個跟委員報告沒有所謂超收就是我們可以跟委員報告去年增加對大概跟委員報告一下到二月為底的稅收情況因為你三月可能ETF又會超增很多啊對所以今年你會覺得今年會超增嗎\n413786\t428398\t跟委員報告因為現在是到2月為止我們全國稅收是達到3185億那中央是2206億那是比去年同期是增加的那主要的稅收增加最多的不可否認是政交稅因為每\n429679\t452585\t因為那個每日的成交值算是高的所以政交稅比去年增加很多營業稅跟中所稅是增加的接下來但是我們現在在調國庫署的資料有關每年其實我們都在花很多的錢因為包括特別預算都陸續的在支出所以去年我們就付錢就付了4.1兆那特別預算就是達到1.4兆\n454745\t465610\t財政部推估今年的收支會短促還是會有所謂的超收?就預算來說總預算來說目前來說是短收但是還是要看稅收的情況跟委員報告比如說像112年的話我們的總預算裡面也是短收但是因為稅收超過預算數所以我們在舉債的部分1730而已沒有舉債而且增加還債\n479436\t497146\t我們怎麼超收但是我們還是有舉債的問題因為我們將來的特別預算的支付會越來越沉重這也是審計部也做了相關的報告所以接下來去看到主計出的推估到2025會短差2000億2026會短差1000多億\n500228\t513260\t所以超收不應該是成為我們高度依賴的不確定因素我希望說現在的超收如果能夠只有兩個原則嘛第一個是少花錢第二是多還債\n514389\t517692\t如果按照現在的狀況我們去年多還了1100億如果這樣的話財政部能不能估今年有沒有可能再多還多少錢跟委員報告去年我們是還了1260億就是說除了預算邊的1111億我們又多還了150億然後1732億原來要舉借的也沒有舉借\n536988\t556493\t​​​​​​​​\n556613\t580439\t朝收不要成為人民的假象我們不希望說這邊超收那邊再舉債這是一個事實上狀況而且會每年都告訴大家我們超收很多還可以發6000塊但是政府的舉債並沒有減少這才是我們的問題最後一個問題就是有關台彩公司他在大年初四的時候曾經發生系統設定錯誤然後讓民眾買不到\n583260\t596983\t財卷然後來的補救措施部長覺得滿意嗎這件事情第一個他是讓他買得到也就是說他提早那個就是他用那個對講時間就有點要變成第二天的這個怎麼會出這種錯啊對對對這個不應該已經那麼久了而且怎麼會是所謂的內控人員疏失這是什麼問題你們查過了沒有\n605845\t625320\t我們有查也徹底我們馬上就請台彩公司做處理而且他們也做了補救措施那對於但是部長我們發現了一個很嚴重的問題就是你們查了但是依照供應彩券發行條例目前為止對於這種內控失道的狀況好像國庫署說沒有任何法則是嗎你沒有辦法處罰他嗎\n629431\t639840\t那以後再發生還是一樣嗎?只是寫個報告草草了事有相關的啊 有相關議處啊這個有議處嗎?這個有裁罰嗎?有啊我們得到的消息是沒有裁罰只有寫報告啊沒有 有相關的議處這是國庫署給我的資料有問題是嗎?我的問題就是說內控內機是重要的\n656374\t677651\t而且這種是我們彩券對人民的公信力彩券是小老百姓都會去購買的發生這種事情會造成政府公信力的損失如果你沒有裁罰把相關資料給我那個相關的裁罰如果說是嚴重損害彩券公信力阿是要停止我只問你這個案子有沒有裁罰這目前因為我們認定還沒有到嚴重到要停止所以你認為這是小事\n678651\t687134\t但是他們相關的財財公司如果你要訂出相關的財閥的話你可能也要告訴我這個案子你為什麼認為是小事好嗎?謝謝\n","txt":"謝謝主席 我請部長我請莊部長\n委員好是部長我想我們臺灣最嚴重的問題大概還是回到居住正義那在相關的政府在租金房租還漲跟房市還漲的努力之下有用了非常多的租稅工具但是你認為有沒有達到所謂的居住正義的效果尤其是在央行總裁我們在質詢他的時候他也說過了他提\n提出的是選擇性的信用管制可是政府又做了新清安貸款又把房市撐住了那現在建權房市成了變成政府之間左手打右手你認不認同政府應該有一致的做法來做到居住正義\n跟委員報告居住正義是我們一直在這個條路上去走採取相關的一個措施所以居住正義不能做一半嘛對對當然那個各項措施那有關租稅的部分比如說社宅的包租代管公益出租人的這個戶數都逐漸的上升因為我們有相關的戶稅減少政府不斷的在鼓勵\n所謂的公益出租所謂的包租貸款付稅也做了非常多的優惠但是看起來這邊要跟部長討論的就是我們防護稅條例跟住宅法都已經修訂了也把自住跟公益出租人出租使用的同等待遇而且也很多的人也開始做公益出租人但是按照內政部估算全台的租屋圖大概有300萬人\n那依照我們擴大所謂租金補貼的收入門檻六都以外的縣市大概是每個人每個月4萬2千多可是40%的受僱員工目前統計上面是低於這個門檻也就是說全台灣的租屋族裡面大概有120萬人可以適用所謂的租金補貼可是現在的公益出租人只有12萬也就是我有120萬人適合\n﹗\n這個部分事實上還需要讓更多的房東可以知道這樣的一個事情因為很多房東可能對這個部分還拿...房東都知道只是房東會去算划不划算房東不可能不知道這12萬的公益出租人拿出來租了他將來碰到了一個問題就是可能之前大家討論過很多次的還有沒有更好的付稅優惠\n如果他今天當了公益出租人拿出來租房子可是將來在轉賣的時候一樣還是會受到土地增值稅必須要一年甚至五年這樣的時程才能夠所謂的享有自用住宅的一生一世所以就這個部分公益出租人並沒有在土地增值稅轉賣的時候得到更多的優惠不是嗎\n因為跟委員報告現在公益出租人的話第一個他的租金所得的部分一個月有15000塊是可以免稅那超過的部分他的費用的比例也比一般的費用比例高可以到60你知道他能夠節省的稅負只有幾千塊但是他移轉轉賣的時候他的增值稅會從10%跟20%的差距將近幾十萬是\n這兩個的差距就會讓很多的人不願意來當公益出租人這才是問題嘛那在因為土地增值稅的時候你要適用優惠稅率必須是要自用嘛就是剛剛委員所提到兩年或五年這個部分那我想這個部分其實漲價歸公因為他是有交易他就漲價的部分我同意啦\n我的意思是說如果我當了公益出租人我應該在這個所謂的我必須損失一年的租金上面再給他多一點的誘因也就是說這個一年的時程其實在公益出租人可以有個例外的條款\n的用因會讓公益出租人更願意多拿他的房子出來因為他不會受到必須要一年不能出租這樣子的事實狀態而且他當了公益出租人他已經對這個國家社會有一些貢獻我的意思是如果我們要做就做全套這全套在土地增值稅的部分也應該\n來設想一下公益出租人他的誘因可以再增加或者是說在這一年的時程裡面給他一些優惠的其他的條款部長同意嗎我想委員這個部分因為土地增值稅是屬於地方稅那地方稅的而且對他們來說是一個蠻重要的剛剛的講起來其實他佔了非常非常少的比例也就是這12萬戶他的比例佔地方的土地增值稅的比例也不會太高\n​​​​​​​​​​\n我們如果要做相關的這些稅賦的改善我希望在公益出租人這邊也開始去思考怎麼給他更多的優惠。這是第一點。好嗎?我想公益出租人包括居住正義包括現在內政部他所提出的一些相關的方案我覺得政府常常左手打右手我們到底是要推居住正義還是不要?如果要就做全套而不是做半套。居住正義是我們一直都在努力的。\n這個麻煩部長也可以給我一個相關對於這個土地增值稅有沒有可能在公益出租金上面再做一些優惠你們回去研議一下好嗎可以我們再給您書面報告接下來的部分就是我想問一下我們現在2月份又超收了吧超徵稅收\n二月份我想這個跟委員報告沒有所謂超收就是我們可以跟委員報告去年增加對大概跟委員報告一下到二月為底的稅收情況因為你三月可能ETF又會超增很多啊對所以今年你會覺得今年會超增嗎\n跟委員報告因為現在是到2月為止我們全國稅收是達到3185億那中央是2206億那是比去年同期是增加的那主要的稅收增加最多的不可否認是政交稅因為每\n因為那個每日的成交值算是高的所以政交稅比去年增加很多營業稅跟中所稅是增加的接下來但是我們現在在調國庫署的資料有關每年其實我們都在花很多的錢因為包括特別預算都陸續的在支出所以去年我們就付錢就付了4.1兆那特別預算就是達到1.4兆\n財政部推估今年的收支會短促還是會有所謂的超收?就預算來說總預算來說目前來說是短收但是還是要看稅收的情況跟委員報告比如說像112年的話我們的總預算裡面也是短收但是因為稅收超過預算數所以我們在舉債的部分1730而已沒有舉債而且增加還債\n我們怎麼超收但是我們還是有舉債的問題因為我們將來的特別預算的支付會越來越沉重這也是審計部也做了相關的報告所以接下來去看到主計出的推估到2025會短差2000億2026會短差1000多億\n所以超收不應該是成為我們高度依賴的不確定因素我希望說現在的超收如果能夠只有兩個原則嘛第一個是少花錢第二是多還債\n如果按照現在的狀況我們去年多還了1100億如果這樣的話財政部能不能估今年有沒有可能再多還多少錢跟委員報告去年我們是還了1260億就是說除了預算邊的1111億我們又多還了150億然後1732億原來要舉借的也沒有舉借\n​​​​​​​​\n朝收不要成為人民的假象我們不希望說這邊超收那邊再舉債這是一個事實上狀況而且會每年都告訴大家我們超收很多還可以發6000塊但是政府的舉債並沒有減少這才是我們的問題最後一個問題就是有關台彩公司他在大年初四的時候曾經發生系統設定錯誤然後讓民眾買不到\n財卷然後來的補救措施部長覺得滿意嗎這件事情第一個他是讓他買得到也就是說他提早那個就是他用那個對講時間就有點要變成第二天的這個怎麼會出這種錯啊對對對這個不應該已經那麼久了而且怎麼會是所謂的內控人員疏失這是什麼問題你們查過了沒有\n我們有查也徹底我們馬上就請台彩公司做處理而且他們也做了補救措施那對於但是部長我們發現了一個很嚴重的問題就是你們查了但是依照供應彩券發行條例目前為止對於這種內控失道的狀況好像國庫署說沒有任何法則是嗎你沒有辦法處罰他嗎\n那以後再發生還是一樣嗎?只是寫個報告草草了事有相關的啊 有相關議處啊這個有議處嗎?這個有裁罰嗎?有啊我們得到的消息是沒有裁罰只有寫報告啊沒有 有相關的議處這是國庫署給我的資料有問題是嗎?我的問題就是說內控內機是重要的\n而且這種是我們彩券對人民的公信力彩券是小老百姓都會去購買的發生這種事情會造成政府公信力的損失如果你沒有裁罰把相關資料給我那個相關的裁罰如果說是嚴重損害彩券公信力阿是要停止我只問你這個案子有沒有裁罰這目前因為我們認定還沒有到嚴重到要停止所以你認為這是小事\n但是他們相關的財財公司如果你要訂出相關的財閥的話你可能也要告訴我這個案子你為什麼認為是小事好嗎?謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:07.362 --> 00:08.024\n謝謝主席我請部長我請莊部長\n\n00:14.451 --> 00:41.396\n委員好是部長我想我們臺灣最嚴重的問題大概還是回到居住正義那在相關的政府在租金房租還漲跟房市還漲的努力之下有用了非常多的租稅工具但是你認為有沒有達到所謂的居住正義的效果尤其是在央行總裁我們在質詢他的時候他也說過了他提\n\n00:42.136 --> 01:01.296\n提出的是選擇性的信用管制可是政府又做了新清安貸款又把房市撐住了那現在建權房市成了變成政府之間左手打右手你認不認同政府應該有一致的做法來做到居住正義\n\n01:02.253 --> 01:24.186\n跟委員報告居住正義是我們一直在這個條路上去走採取相關的一個措施所以居住正義不能做一半嘛對對當然那個各項措施那有關租稅的部分比如說社宅的包租代管公益出租人的這個戶數都逐漸的上升因為我們有相關的戶稅減少政府不斷的在鼓勵\n\n01:25.427 --> 01:50.952\n所謂的公益出租所謂的包租貸款付稅也做了非常多的優惠但是看起來這邊要跟部長討論的就是我們防護稅條例跟住宅法都已經修訂了也把自住跟公益出租人出租使用的同等待遇而且也很多的人也開始做公益出租人但是按照內政部估算全台的租屋圖大概有300萬人\n\n01:52.412 --> 02:18.771\n那依照我們擴大所謂租金補貼的收入門檻六都以外的縣市大概是每個人每個月4萬2千多可是40%的受僱員工目前統計上面是低於這個門檻也就是說全台灣的租屋族裡面大概有120萬人可以適用所謂的租金補貼可是現在的公益出租人只有12萬也就是我有120萬人適合\n\n02:40.874 --> 03:06.128\n這個部分事實上還需要讓更多的房東可以知道這樣的一個事情因為很多房東可能對這個部分還拿...房東都知道只是房東會去算划不划算房東不可能不知道這12萬的公益出租人拿出來租了他將來碰到了一個問題就是可能之前大家討論過很多次的還有沒有更好的付稅優惠\n\n03:07.489 --> 03:32.179\n如果他今天當了公益出租人拿出來租房子可是將來在轉賣的時候一樣還是會受到土地增值稅必須要一年甚至五年這樣的時程才能夠所謂的享有自用住宅的一生一世所以就這個部分公益出租人並沒有在土地增值稅轉賣的時候得到更多的優惠不是嗎\n\n03:33.544 --> 03:45.748\n因為跟委員報告現在公益出租人的話第一個他的租金所得的部分一個月有15000塊是可以免稅那超過的部分他的費用的比例也比一般的費用比例高可以到60你知道他能夠節省的稅負只有幾千塊但是他移轉轉賣的時候他的增值稅會從10%跟20%的差距將近幾十萬是\n\n03:57.893 --> 04:17.213\n這兩個的差距就會讓很多的人不願意來當公益出租人這才是問題嘛那在因為土地增值稅的時候你要適用優惠稅率必須是要自用嘛就是剛剛委員所提到兩年或五年這個部分那我想這個部分其實漲價歸公因為他是有交易他就漲價的部分我同意啦\n\n04:18.754 --> 04:33.901\n我的意思是說如果我當了公益出租人我應該在這個所謂的我必須損失一年的租金上面再給他多一點的誘因也就是說這個一年的時程其實在公益出租人可以有個例外的條款\n\n04:35.113 --> 04:55.454\n的用因會讓公益出租人更願意多拿他的房子出來因為他不會受到必須要一年不能出租這樣子的事實狀態而且他當了公益出租人他已經對這個國家社會有一些貢獻我的意思是如果我們要做就做全套這全套在土地增值稅的部分也應該\n\n04:57.836 --> 05:24.370\n來設想一下公益出租人他的誘因可以再增加或者是說在這一年的時程裡面給他一些優惠的其他的條款部長同意嗎我想委員這個部分因為土地增值稅是屬於地方稅那地方稅的而且對他們來說是一個蠻重要的剛剛的講起來其實他佔了非常非常少的比例也就是這12萬戶他的比例佔地方的土地增值稅的比例也不會太高\n\n05:45.911 --> 06:13.967\n我們如果要做相關的這些稅賦的改善我希望在公益出租人這邊也開始去思考怎麼給他更多的優惠。這是第一點。好嗎?我想公益出租人包括居住正義包括現在內政部他所提出的一些相關的方案我覺得政府常常左手打右手我們到底是要推居住正義還是不要?如果要就做全套而不是做半套。居住正義是我們一直都在努力的。\n\n06:15.087 --> 06:31.613\n這個麻煩部長也可以給我一個相關對於這個土地增值稅有沒有可能在公益出租金上面再做一些優惠你們回去研議一下好嗎可以我們再給您書面報告接下來的部分就是我想問一下我們現在2月份又超收了吧超徵稅收\n\n06:33.411 --> 06:52.489\n二月份我想這個跟委員報告沒有所謂超收就是我們可以跟委員報告去年增加對大概跟委員報告一下到二月為底的稅收情況因為你三月可能ETF又會超增很多啊對所以今年你會覺得今年會超增嗎\n\n06:53.786 --> 07:08.398\n跟委員報告因為現在是到2月為止我們全國稅收是達到3185億那中央是2206億那是比去年同期是增加的那主要的稅收增加最多的不可否認是政交稅因為每\n\n07:09.679 --> 07:32.585\n因為那個每日的成交值算是高的所以政交稅比去年增加很多營業稅跟中所稅是增加的接下來但是我們現在在調國庫署的資料有關每年其實我們都在花很多的錢因為包括特別預算都陸續的在支出所以去年我們就付錢就付了4.1兆那特別預算就是達到1.4兆\n\n07:34.745 --> 07:45.610\n財政部推估今年的收支會短促還是會有所謂的超收?就預算來說總預算來說目前來說是短收但是還是要看稅收的情況跟委員報告比如說像112年的話我們的總預算裡面也是短收但是因為稅收超過預算數所以我們在舉債的部分1730而已沒有舉債而且增加還債\n\n07:59.436 --> 08:17.146\n我們怎麼超收但是我們還是有舉債的問題因為我們將來的特別預算的支付會越來越沉重這也是審計部也做了相關的報告所以接下來去看到主計出的推估到2025會短差2000億2026會短差1000多億\n\n08:20.228 --> 08:33.260\n所以超收不應該是成為我們高度依賴的不確定因素我希望說現在的超收如果能夠只有兩個原則嘛第一個是少花錢第二是多還債\n\n08:34.389 --> 08:37.692\n如果按照現在的狀況我們去年多還了1100億如果這樣的話財政部能不能估今年有沒有可能再多還多少錢跟委員報告去年我們是還了1260億就是說除了預算邊的1111億我們又多還了150億然後1732億原來要舉借的也沒有舉借\n\n09:16.613 --> 09:40.439\n朝收不要成為人民的假象我們不希望說這邊超收那邊再舉債這是一個事實上狀況而且會每年都告訴大家我們超收很多還可以發6000塊但是政府的舉債並沒有減少這才是我們的問題最後一個問題就是有關台彩公司他在大年初四的時候曾經發生系統設定錯誤然後讓民眾買不到\n\n09:43.260 --> 09:56.983\n財卷然後來的補救措施部長覺得滿意嗎這件事情第一個他是讓他買得到也就是說他提早那個就是他用那個對講時間就有點要變成第二天的這個怎麼會出這種錯啊對對對這個不應該已經那麼久了而且怎麼會是所謂的內控人員疏失這是什麼問題你們查過了沒有\n\n10:05.845 --> 10:25.320\n我們有查也徹底我們馬上就請台彩公司做處理而且他們也做了補救措施那對於但是部長我們發現了一個很嚴重的問題就是你們查了但是依照供應彩券發行條例目前為止對於這種內控失道的狀況好像國庫署說沒有任何法則是嗎你沒有辦法處罰他嗎\n\n10:29.431 --> 10:39.840\n那以後再發生還是一樣嗎?只是寫個報告草草了事有相關的啊有相關議處啊這個有議處嗎?這個有裁罰嗎?有啊我們得到的消息是沒有裁罰只有寫報告啊沒有有相關的議處這是國庫署給我的資料有問題是嗎?我的問題就是說內控內機是重要的\n\n10:56.374 --> 11:17.651\n而且這種是我們彩券對人民的公信力彩券是小老百姓都會去購買的發生這種事情會造成政府公信力的損失如果你沒有裁罰把相關資料給我那個相關的裁罰如果說是嚴重損害彩券公信力阿是要停止我只問你這個案子有沒有裁罰這目前因為我們認定還沒有到嚴重到要停止所以你認為這是小事\n\n11:18.651 --> 11:27.134\n但是他們相關的財財公司如果你要訂出相關的財閥的話你可能也要告訴我這個案子你為什麼認為是小事好嗎?謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":7.362,"end":8.024,"text":"謝謝主席 我請部長我請莊部長"},{"start":14.451,"end":41.396,"text":"委員好是部長我想我們臺灣最嚴重的問題大概還是回到居住正義那在相關的政府在租金房租還漲跟房市還漲的努力之下有用了非常多的租稅工具但是你認為有沒有達到所謂的居住正義的效果尤其是在央行總裁我們在質詢他的時候他也說過了他提"},{"start":42.136,"end":61.296,"text":"提出的是選擇性的信用管制可是政府又做了新清安貸款又把房市撐住了那現在建權房市成了變成政府之間左手打右手你認不認同政府應該有一致的做法來做到居住正義"},{"start":62.253,"end":84.186,"text":"跟委員報告居住正義是我們一直在這個條路上去走採取相關的一個措施所以居住正義不能做一半嘛對對當然那個各項措施那有關租稅的部分比如說社宅的包租代管公益出租人的這個戶數都逐漸的上升因為我們有相關的戶稅減少政府不斷的在鼓勵"},{"start":85.427,"end":110.952,"text":"所謂的公益出租所謂的包租貸款付稅也做了非常多的優惠但是看起來這邊要跟部長討論的就是我們防護稅條例跟住宅法都已經修訂了也把自住跟公益出租人出租使用的同等待遇而且也很多的人也開始做公益出租人但是按照內政部估算全台的租屋圖大概有300萬人"},{"start":112.412,"end":138.771,"text":"那依照我們擴大所謂租金補貼的收入門檻六都以外的縣市大概是每個人每個月4萬2千多可是40%的受僱員工目前統計上面是低於這個門檻也就是說全台灣的租屋族裡面大概有120萬人可以適用所謂的租金補貼可是現在的公益出租人只有12萬也就是我有120萬人適合"},{"start":141.783,"end":159.445,"text":"﹗"},{"start":160.874,"end":186.128,"text":"這個部分事實上還需要讓更多的房東可以知道這樣的一個事情因為很多房東可能對這個部分還拿...房東都知道只是房東會去算划不划算房東不可能不知道這12萬的公益出租人拿出來租了他將來碰到了一個問題就是可能之前大家討論過很多次的還有沒有更好的付稅優惠"},{"start":187.489,"end":212.179,"text":"如果他今天當了公益出租人拿出來租房子可是將來在轉賣的時候一樣還是會受到土地增值稅必須要一年甚至五年這樣的時程才能夠所謂的享有自用住宅的一生一世所以就這個部分公益出租人並沒有在土地增值稅轉賣的時候得到更多的優惠不是嗎"},{"start":213.544,"end":225.748,"text":"因為跟委員報告現在公益出租人的話第一個他的租金所得的部分一個月有15000塊是可以免稅那超過的部分他的費用的比例也比一般的費用比例高可以到60你知道他能夠節省的稅負只有幾千塊但是他移轉轉賣的時候他的增值稅會從10%跟20%的差距將近幾十萬是"},{"start":237.893,"end":257.213,"text":"這兩個的差距就會讓很多的人不願意來當公益出租人這才是問題嘛那在因為土地增值稅的時候你要適用優惠稅率必須是要自用嘛就是剛剛委員所提到兩年或五年這個部分那我想這個部分其實漲價歸公因為他是有交易他就漲價的部分我同意啦"},{"start":258.754,"end":273.901,"text":"我的意思是說如果我當了公益出租人我應該在這個所謂的我必須損失一年的租金上面再給他多一點的誘因也就是說這個一年的時程其實在公益出租人可以有個例外的條款"},{"start":275.113,"end":295.454,"text":"的用因會讓公益出租人更願意多拿他的房子出來因為他不會受到必須要一年不能出租這樣子的事實狀態而且他當了公益出租人他已經對這個國家社會有一些貢獻我的意思是如果我們要做就做全套這全套在土地增值稅的部分也應該"},{"start":297.836,"end":324.37,"text":"來設想一下公益出租人他的誘因可以再增加或者是說在這一年的時程裡面給他一些優惠的其他的條款部長同意嗎我想委員這個部分因為土地增值稅是屬於地方稅那地方稅的而且對他們來說是一個蠻重要的剛剛的講起來其實他佔了非常非常少的比例也就是這12萬戶他的比例佔地方的土地增值稅的比例也不會太高"},{"start":324.77,"end":345.811,"text":"​​​​​​​​​​"},{"start":345.911,"end":373.967,"text":"我們如果要做相關的這些稅賦的改善我希望在公益出租人這邊也開始去思考怎麼給他更多的優惠。這是第一點。好嗎?我想公益出租人包括居住正義包括現在內政部他所提出的一些相關的方案我覺得政府常常左手打右手我們到底是要推居住正義還是不要?如果要就做全套而不是做半套。居住正義是我們一直都在努力的。"},{"start":375.087,"end":391.613,"text":"這個麻煩部長也可以給我一個相關對於這個土地增值稅有沒有可能在公益出租金上面再做一些優惠你們回去研議一下好嗎可以我們再給您書面報告接下來的部分就是我想問一下我們現在2月份又超收了吧超徵稅收"},{"start":393.411,"end":412.489,"text":"二月份我想這個跟委員報告沒有所謂超收就是我們可以跟委員報告去年增加對大概跟委員報告一下到二月為底的稅收情況因為你三月可能ETF又會超增很多啊對所以今年你會覺得今年會超增嗎"},{"start":413.786,"end":428.398,"text":"跟委員報告因為現在是到2月為止我們全國稅收是達到3185億那中央是2206億那是比去年同期是增加的那主要的稅收增加最多的不可否認是政交稅因為每"},{"start":429.679,"end":452.585,"text":"因為那個每日的成交值算是高的所以政交稅比去年增加很多營業稅跟中所稅是增加的接下來但是我們現在在調國庫署的資料有關每年其實我們都在花很多的錢因為包括特別預算都陸續的在支出所以去年我們就付錢就付了4.1兆那特別預算就是達到1.4兆"},{"start":454.745,"end":465.61,"text":"財政部推估今年的收支會短促還是會有所謂的超收?就預算來說總預算來說目前來說是短收但是還是要看稅收的情況跟委員報告比如說像112年的話我們的總預算裡面也是短收但是因為稅收超過預算數所以我們在舉債的部分1730而已沒有舉債而且增加還債"},{"start":479.436,"end":497.146,"text":"我們怎麼超收但是我們還是有舉債的問題因為我們將來的特別預算的支付會越來越沉重這也是審計部也做了相關的報告所以接下來去看到主計出的推估到2025會短差2000億2026會短差1000多億"},{"start":500.228,"end":513.26,"text":"所以超收不應該是成為我們高度依賴的不確定因素我希望說現在的超收如果能夠只有兩個原則嘛第一個是少花錢第二是多還債"},{"start":514.389,"end":517.692,"text":"如果按照現在的狀況我們去年多還了1100億如果這樣的話財政部能不能估今年有沒有可能再多還多少錢跟委員報告去年我們是還了1260億就是說除了預算邊的1111億我們又多還了150億然後1732億原來要舉借的也沒有舉借"},{"start":536.988,"end":556.493,"text":"​​​​​​​​"},{"start":556.613,"end":580.439,"text":"朝收不要成為人民的假象我們不希望說這邊超收那邊再舉債這是一個事實上狀況而且會每年都告訴大家我們超收很多還可以發6000塊但是政府的舉債並沒有減少這才是我們的問題最後一個問題就是有關台彩公司他在大年初四的時候曾經發生系統設定錯誤然後讓民眾買不到"},{"start":583.26,"end":596.983,"text":"財卷然後來的補救措施部長覺得滿意嗎這件事情第一個他是讓他買得到也就是說他提早那個就是他用那個對講時間就有點要變成第二天的這個怎麼會出這種錯啊對對對這個不應該已經那麼久了而且怎麼會是所謂的內控人員疏失這是什麼問題你們查過了沒有"},{"start":605.845,"end":625.32,"text":"我們有查也徹底我們馬上就請台彩公司做處理而且他們也做了補救措施那對於但是部長我們發現了一個很嚴重的問題就是你們查了但是依照供應彩券發行條例目前為止對於這種內控失道的狀況好像國庫署說沒有任何法則是嗎你沒有辦法處罰他嗎"},{"start":629.431,"end":639.84,"text":"那以後再發生還是一樣嗎?只是寫個報告草草了事有相關的啊 有相關議處啊這個有議處嗎?這個有裁罰嗎?有啊我們得到的消息是沒有裁罰只有寫報告啊沒有 有相關的議處這是國庫署給我的資料有問題是嗎?我的問題就是說內控內機是重要的"},{"start":656.374,"end":677.651,"text":"而且這種是我們彩券對人民的公信力彩券是小老百姓都會去購買的發生這種事情會造成政府公信力的損失如果你沒有裁罰把相關資料給我那個相關的裁罰如果說是嚴重損害彩券公信力阿是要停止我只問你這個案子有沒有裁罰這目前因為我們認定還沒有到嚴重到要停止所以你認為這是小事"},{"start":678.651,"end":687.134,"text":"但是他們相關的財財公司如果你要訂出相關的財閥的話你可能也要告訴我這個案子你為什麼認為是小事好嗎?謝謝"}]}}}}