{"id":150245,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150245","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/1be549810cdc3052c50b8e7304548acc6ede38528f72d0f5f8ba9b0039caa7a6ae3ce1dee761090e5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"吳春城","委員發言時間":"11:37:48 - 11:47:51","影片長度":"00:10:03","會議時間":"2024-03-21T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請教育部列席就「落實特殊教育法配套措施及普特融合教育實施概況」進行專題報告，並備質詢。（3月18日、20日及21日三天一次會））","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第4次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":4,"committees":[22],"id":"委員會-11-1-22-4"},"date":"2024-03-21","duration":603,"end_time":"2024-03-21T11:47:51+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-21T11:37:48+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":598,"blocks":[["吳委員春城：（11時37分）謝謝主席，我們請次長。"],["主席：好，次長。"],["林次長騰蛟：吳委員好。"],["吳委員春城：次長好。每次看到教育部的官員來，我覺得很開心，因為彼此都很想把事情做好，這我相信。但是我覺得我們現在的問題就像今天在談的特殊教育，其實最近的不僅是這個，幾乎每一個層面都在面臨崩潰的狀態，社工都走上街頭了，幼教、教保等，衛福部薛部長說這是社會安全網的系統性失靈。大家看一下這張照片，這張照片是一個家庭的合照，家庭是一體的，你覺得誰在裡面是一個核心者？"],["林次長騰蛟：應該是家裡面的長輩。"],["吳委員春城：長輩坐在中間的位置，看起來滿適合的，很溫馨，對不對？"],["林次長騰蛟：是。"],["吳委員春城：但是我們的教育是破碎的，我們的教育把每一個人隔離了，高齡者有終身教育、有特殊教育、有幼兒教育、有各種的教育，破碎化其實就是問題的關鍵，因為他們本來是一體，回到家庭是一體的，他們本來可以互相協助、互相支援、互相學習的，但是我們讓他變成孤單的，所以教育部一肩扛是扛不住的，現在整個社會沒有政府是扛不住的，另外看一下今天頭版的調查數據，不曉得次長有沒有看到？"],["林次長騰蛟：今天還沒有時間。"],["吳委員春城：你還沒看到？沒關係，跟你報告，這是全世界快樂指數的報告。臺灣這裡面有一個特別的數據，臺灣60歲以上的人是全世界最不快樂的，我看到這個數據覺得很驚訝，臺灣60歲以上的人，是全世界喔！這是跟全世界比，但是臺灣30歲以下的是全世界最快樂的，我還沒有研究今天頭版看到的數據，是不是請教育部研究一下？可不可以研究一下？"],["林次長騰蛟：我們來瞭解一下。"],["吳委員春城：因為你們教育的是人嘛，看各種年齡層的原因在哪裡。剛才看到中間那個位置是高齡者、長輩，是可以發揮一個家庭穩定核心的力量，但是我們現在的終身教育就是這個場景，所以整個在崩潰狀態，晚年就休閒嘛，沒有那個，所以從這裡我們看到終身教育是最值得投資的教育，是嗎？次長你認同嗎？"],["林次長騰蛟：非常同意委員的說法。"],["吳委員春城：非常同意喔？所以這也是我上次跟部長提的，他也認同，因為現在的高齡者很長壽，動輒九十幾歲，60歲退休30年，我們要讓他熱情地追求第三人生，上次我們有一個臨時提案，部長也接受了，現在要規劃，我也知道你們在啟動第三人生大學的的計畫，前天3月19號有開一個研討會，但是研討會的結論，好像出席的還是終身教育司，一個司出來出席，所以看起來它……發現這個問題很大，高教司也沒有出來理，高教司覺得這件事情跟它無關；然後這還涉及到跨部會，教育部部長這麼有熱情想要推動這件事情，結果我們還是回到體制裡面，還是想給一個小小的終身教育司扛這個責任，你覺得樂觀嗎？"],["林次長騰蛟：跟委員報告一下，同仁告訴我當天3月19號的會議雖然是由終身司主持，但是有邀請相關的司處，包含高教司、技職司都有代表參與。"],["吳委員春城：有出席？"],["林次長騰蛟：對，有出席，包含一些團體跟大學。"],["吳委員春城：我沒有看到會議紀錄，這件事情會繼續的推動，因為看起來部長是重視的，但是我們往往就是不了了之。因為我們很多的體制，我也知道你們遇到很多困難，但是有困難的部分我們可以一起努力來突破，好不好？我想立法院一定會支持，只要你們想要做。"],["林次長騰蛟：是，謝謝。"],["吳委員春城：接下來，我們來看一下教育部對終身教育有多麼的漠視。108年整個教育部本部的預算，還不講外延可以擴充到3,000億，我只講本部就1,298億，結果高齡教育的預算是1.9億，占0.14%，然後逐年有在成長。今年113年教育部有1,706億，但是高齡教育是3.4億，占0.19%，現在壯世代55歲以上的有835萬人，從108年到現在已經增加125萬人，我們平均給每一個人分配的預算現在是40.7元，有進步，從以前的26.8元，增加了大概買一顆茶葉蛋的預算，6年來我們的進步、對高齡者的對待就是給他一顆茶葉蛋作為他一年終身教育的預算，這就是我們在看待終身教育，看教育部有多麼漠視整個高齡化。","另外，終身學習法裡面對於終身學習的預算只有一句話──「應優先予以經費補助」，就是意思意思一下，大家憑良心，拿剩餘的錢來補助，沒有任何規範。我們今天談特殊教育法，我希望能夠比照特殊教育法，特殊教育法裡面說特殊教育的預算在中央不得低於4.5%，在地方不可以低於5%，我們剛才講的終身學習是0.2%，差別有夠大。現在特殊教育服務的對象有多少人？我不是說那個不重要，那個很重要，我跟你講一個，韓國的終身教育占它總體的教育預算是多少，知道嗎？"],["林次長騰蛟：謝謝委員……"],["吳委員春城：10%，我們是0.2%，差20倍，所以這一點真的要大大改進，好不好？最後兩個要求，沒有錢就不能辦事，你編一顆茶葉蛋的預算說你想要多努力、有心都是騙人的，今年編的終身教育預算要大幅增加。臺灣已經邁向超高齡社會，但是你們完全沒看到，完全不理會。","再來，相關的法規包括第三人生大學，剛才我一開始提到的，家庭教育是個核心，核心裡面應該綜合考量，而不是破碎化的考量。特別是長輩在這裡面扮演一個穩定、安定家庭的重心，如果你能夠讓他強壯起來，他會成為家庭的……，政府就不會什麼都需要自己扛，你知不知道？所以這個是最值得投資的一個教育方向，希望教育部在這方面能夠多多努力，可以嗎？"],["林次長騰蛟：好，謝謝委員，不過剛剛委員的數據資料裡面，我們可以看得出終身教育、高齡者教育的經費還是有逐年微幅增加，只是因為教育部的母數增加，尤其是增加學前教育，所以它的比例有稍微下降……"],["吳委員春城：不要這樣講，對，有增加，但是目前最高3.4億而已。"],["林次長騰蛟：對，委員建議的部分……"],["吳委員春城：3.4億占0.19%。"],["林次長騰蛟：連同相關的法規我們持續檢討。謝謝吳委員。"],["吳委員春城：是，這實在差太多了，太離譜了。"],["林次長騰蛟：好，謝謝吳委員。"],["主席：好，謝謝兩位。","接下來請王鴻薇委員，4分鐘。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":454,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-4","speakers":["柯志恩","萬美玲","洪孟楷","陳培瑜","葛如鈞","吳沛憶","郭昱晴","張雅琳","葉元之","林宜瑾","羅廷瑋","范雲","吳春城","王鴻薇","陳秀寳","林倩綺","黃珊珊","羅智強","何欣純","黃捷","楊瓊瓔"],"page_start":393,"meetingDate":["2024-03-21"],"gazette_id":"1131701","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1131701_00007"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請教育部列席就「落實特殊教育法配套措施及普特融合教育實施概況」進行專題報告，並備質\n詢","agenda_id":"1131701_00006"}},"transcript":{"id":"150245","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150245","tool":"pyannote","id":"150245-pyannote"},"job_id":"iy1blYEHmXzqF3fW","queued_at":"2024-06-01 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{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 407.541, \"end\": 407.841, \"score\": 0.869}, {\"word\": \"概\", \"start\": 407.841, \"end\": 408.001, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"買\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 408.001, \"end\": 408.461, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"顆\"}, {\"word\": \"茶\", \"start\": 408.461, \"end\": 408.861, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"葉\"}, {\"word\": \"蛋\", \"start\": 408.861, \"end\": 409.642, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 409.642, \"end\": 410.882, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"6\"}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 410.882, \"end\": 411.282, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 411.282, \"end\": 411.422, \"score\": 0.757}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 411.422, \"end\": 411.783, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"步\", \"start\": 411.783, \"end\": 412.143, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 412.143, \"end\": 412.303, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 412.303, \"end\": 412.623, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"高\", \"start\": 412.623, \"end\": 413.063, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"齡\"}, {\"word\": \"者\", \"start\": 413.063, \"end\": 413.263, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 413.263, \"end\": 414.023, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"待\", \"start\": 414.023, \"end\": 414.524, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 414.524, \"end\": 414.684, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 414.684, \"end\": 415.564, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"給\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 415.564, \"end\": 415.884, \"score\": 0.984}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 415.884, \"end\": 416.284, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"顆\"}, {\"word\": \"茶\", \"start\": 416.284, \"end\": 416.525, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"葉\"}, {\"word\": \"蛋\", \"start\": 416.525, \"end\": 416.545, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 417.725, \"end\": 429.385, \"text\": 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0.908}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 448.811, \"end\": 449.811, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 449.811, \"end\": 450.031, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"家\", \"start\": 450.031, \"end\": 450.171, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"憑\"}, {\"word\": \"良\", \"start\": 450.171, \"end\": 450.411, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"心\", \"start\": 450.411, \"end\": 450.732, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 450.732, \"end\": 451.212, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"補\"}, {\"word\": \"助\", \"start\": 451.212, \"end\": 451.632, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"剩\", \"start\": 451.632, \"end\": 451.892, \"score\": 0.851}, {\"word\": \"餘\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 451.892, \"end\": 452.552, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"錢\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"補\"}, {\"word\": \"助\", \"start\": 452.552, \"end\": 453.172, \"score\": 0.965}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 453.172, \"end\": 453.352, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": 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{\"word\": \".\"}, {\"word\": \"2\"}, {\"word\": \"%\"}, {\"word\": \"差\", \"start\": 475.458, \"end\": 475.638, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"別\", \"start\": 475.638, \"end\": 476.018, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 476.018, \"end\": 476.198, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 476.198, \"end\": 477.518, \"score\": 0.806}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 477.518, \"end\": 477.958, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 477.958, \"end\": 478.058, \"score\": 0.805}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 478.058, \"end\": 478.198, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"特\", \"start\": 478.198, \"end\": 478.298, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"殊\", \"start\": 478.298, \"end\": 478.458, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"教\", \"start\": 478.458, \"end\": 478.638, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"育\", \"start\": 478.638, \"end\": 479.399, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"服\", \"start\": 479.399, \"end\": 479.679, 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00:00:44,128\n每次看到教育部的我們官員來其實我覺得都很開心然後大家彼此事實上是都很想把事情做好我相信但是呢我覺得我們現在的問題就像今天在談這個特殊教育其實最近不僅是這個幾乎每一個層面\n\n3\n00:00:46,874 --> 00:01:03,385\n都在面臨崩潰狀態從社工都走上街頭了然後這個幼教、教保這個我們衛福部的學部長說這個是社會安全網的系統性失靈\n\n4\n00:01:10,715 --> 00:01:32,710\n其實大家看一下這張照片這張照片是一個家庭的合照家庭是一體的你覺得誰是在裡面是一個核心核心者應該是家裡面的長輩長輩喔長輩坐在中間的位置看起來蠻適合的很溫馨對不對\n\n5\n00:01:36,482 --> 00:02:05,094\n但是呢我們的教育是破碎的我們的教育呢把每一個人隔離了都有了高齡者有終身教育有特殊教育有幼兒教育有各種的教育破碎化其實這就是問題的關鍵因為他們本來是議題回到家庭是議題但是呢他們本來可以互相協助互相支援互相成為協助互相學習的但是我們讓他變成孤單了\n\n6\n00:02:06,607 --> 00:02:30,860\n所以這個教育部一肩扛你是扛不住的現在整個的這個社會沒有政府是扛不住的我們整個的這個你看這個另外看一下這個是今天的頭版的調查這個數據不曉得這個次長有沒有看到\n\n7\n00:02:33,861 --> 00:02:35,422\n台灣60歲以上的人是全世界最不快樂的\n\n8\n00:02:55,562 --> 00:03:19,860\n這個我看這數據很驚訝台灣60歲以上的人是全世界這還是全世界比了但是台灣30歲以下的是全世界最快樂的我還沒有研究這個數據今天頭版看到的數據是不是請教一部研究一下可不可以研究一下因為你們教育的是人嘛這各種年齡層這個原因在哪裡\n\n9\n00:03:22,526 --> 00:03:49,549\n剛才看到了中間那個位置高齡者、長輩是可以發揮一個家庭穩定的力量穩定核心的力量但是呢我們現在終身教育就是這個場景這個場景所以整個在崩潰狀態就晚年就休閒嘛沒有那個所以從這裡我們看到\n\n10\n00:03:50,851 --> 00:04:17,986\n中生教育是最值得投資的教育是嗎?市長你認同嗎?非常同意委員所以這個也就是我在上次跟部長提的他也認同我們要因為現在的高齡者很長壽動者都90幾歲60歲退休30年我們要讓他熱情地追求第三人生那上次我們一個臨時提案\n\n11\n00:04:19,106 --> 00:04:42,539\n部長也接受了現在要規劃我也知道你們在啟動第三人生大學的計畫好像前天3月19日有開一個研討會但是研討會的結論好像出席的還是終身教育師一個師出來出席所以看起來他\n\n12\n00:04:45,928 --> 00:05:05,368\n發現這個問題很大高教師也沒有出來理這高教師覺得這件事情跟他無關然後呢這個還涉及到跨部會然後部長這麼有熱情想要推動這件事情結果我們還是回到體制裡面還是給一個小小的一個終身教育師想要扛這個責任我覺得你覺得樂觀嗎\n\n13\n00:05:07,229 --> 00:05:35,169\n跟委員報告一下那個同仁告訴我說當天3月19號的會議雖然是中村司主持但是是有邀請我們相關的司數包含了高教師、技師都有代表的參與有出席喔我沒有看到那個會議記錄但是呢這件事情就會繼續的推動因為看起來部長是重視的啦但是呢我們往往就是不了了之啦\n\n14\n00:05:35,549 --> 00:05:37,090\n中生教育部對中生教育有多麼的默示從108年\n\n15\n00:05:56,698 --> 00:06:14,964\n整個教育部本部的預算還不講外延的外延可以擴充到3000億我只講本部就1298億結果教育高領教育師預算是1.9億占0.14然後逐年這樣子有在成長今年113年\n\n16\n00:06:17,836 --> 00:06:22,098\n教育部有1706億但高齡教育是3.4億占0.19現在的壯世代有55歲以上人有835萬人已經增加了從108萬人到現在增加125萬人\n\n17\n00:06:36,656 --> 00:06:56,545\n我們平均給每一個人分配的預算現在是40.7塊那有進步從以前的26.8增加了這樣大概買一顆茶葉蛋那6年來我們的進步就是對高齡者的對待就是給他一顆茶葉蛋\n\n18\n00:06:57,725 --> 00:07:09,385\n作為他一年的這個教育、終身教育的預算這就是我們在看待終身教育看整個高年化的教育部有多麼的末世這樣子的一個\n\n19\n00:07:13,365 --> 00:07:33,753\n另外,我們要求這一個我們的終身學習法裡面對於預算,終身學習的預算只有一句話應優於清費補助,就是一署一署那大家憑良心能夠補助,剩餘的錢來補助沒有任何的規範\n\n20\n00:07:34,973 --> 00:08:00,219\n我們今天談特殊教育法我希望能夠比照特殊教育法特殊教育法裡面說這個特殊教育的預算在中央不得低於4.5%在地方不可以低於5%那我們剛才那個中正學習室是0.2%差別也夠大我們現在的特殊教育服務對象有多少人\n\n21\n00:08:01,472 --> 00:08:02,433\n韓國終身教育總體教育率是多少?10%\n\n22\n00:08:17,159 --> 00:08:36,371\n10%我們是0.2%差20倍所以這一點真的要大大改進好不好所以最後兩個要求就是沒有錢就不能辦事啦你編的那個一點的一顆茶一蛋的那個預算說你想要多努力有心那都騙人了啦\n\n23\n00:08:37,270 --> 00:08:56,379\n今年編的終身教育要大幅增加台灣已經邁向超高齡社會了整個完全沒看到整個完全不理會再來的話就是相關的法規包括第三人生納學剛才我一開始提到的家庭教育是個核心\n\n24\n00:08:57,139 --> 00:08:58,200\n希望教育部在這方面能夠多多努力可以嗎?\n\n25\n00:09:24,501 --> 00:09:24,642\n主席\n\n26\n00:09:41,562 --> 00:09:42,223\n主席主席主席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n46\t166\t謝謝主席。我們請次長。\n23263\t44128\t每次看到教育部的我們官員來其實我覺得都很開心然後大家彼此事實上是都很想把事情做好我相信但是呢我覺得我們現在的問題就像今天在談這個特殊教育其實最近不僅是這個幾乎每一個層面\n46874\t63385\t都在面臨崩潰狀態從社工都走上街頭了然後這個幼教、教保這個我們衛福部的學部長說這個是社會安全網的系統性失靈\n70715\t92710\t其實大家看一下這張照片這張照片是一個家庭的合照家庭是一體的你覺得誰是在裡面是一個核心核心者應該是家裡面的長輩長輩喔長輩坐在中間的位置看起來蠻適合的很溫馨對不對\n96482\t125094\t但是呢我們的教育是破碎的我們的教育呢把每一個人隔離了都有了高齡者有終身教育有特殊教育有幼兒教育有各種的教育破碎化其實這就是問題的關鍵因為他們本來是議題回到家庭是議題但是呢他們本來可以互相協助互相支援互相成為協助互相學習的但是我們讓他變成孤單了\n126607\t150860\t所以這個教育部一肩扛你是扛不住的現在整個的這個社會沒有政府是扛不住的我們整個的這個你看這個另外看一下這個是今天的頭版的調查這個數據不曉得這個次長有沒有看到\n153861\t155422\t台灣60歲以上的人是全世界最不快樂的\n175562\t199860\t這個我看這數據很驚訝台灣60歲以上的人是全世界這還是全世界比了但是台灣30歲以下的是全世界最快樂的我還沒有研究這個數據今天頭版看到的數據是不是請教一部研究一下可不可以研究一下因為你們教育的是人嘛這各種年齡層這個原因在哪裡\n202526\t229549\t剛才看到了中間那個位置高齡者、長輩是可以發揮一個家庭穩定的力量穩定核心的力量但是呢我們現在終身教育就是這個場景這個場景所以整個在崩潰狀態就晚年就休閒嘛沒有那個所以從這裡我們看到\n230851\t257986\t中生教育是最值得投資的教育是嗎?市長你認同嗎?非常同意委員所以這個也就是我在上次跟部長提的他也認同我們要因為現在的高齡者很長壽動者都90幾歲60歲退休30年我們要讓他熱情地追求第三人生那上次我們一個臨時提案\n259106\t282539\t部長也接受了 現在要規劃我也知道你們在啟動第三人生大學的計畫好像前天3月19日有開一個研討會但是研討會的結論好像出席的還是終身教育師一個師出來出席所以看起來他\n285928\t305368\t發現這個問題很大高教師也沒有出來理這高教師覺得這件事情跟他無關然後呢這個還涉及到跨部會然後部長這麼有熱情想要推動這件事情結果我們還是回到體制裡面還是給一個小小的一個終身教育師想要扛這個責任我覺得你覺得樂觀嗎\n307229\t335169\t跟委員報告一下那個同仁告訴我說當天3月19號的會議雖然是中村司主持但是是有邀請我們相關的司數包含了高教師、技師都有代表的參與有出席喔我沒有看到那個會議記錄但是呢這件事情就會繼續的推動因為看起來部長是重視的啦但是呢我們往往就是不了了之啦\n335549\t337090\t中生教育部對中生教育有多麼的默示從108年\n356698\t374964\t整個教育部本部的預算還不講外延的外延可以擴充到3000億我只講本部就1298億結果教育高領教育師預算是1.9億占0.14然後逐年這樣子有在成長今年113年\n377836\t382098\t教育部有1706億但高齡教育是3.4億占0.19現在的壯世代有55歲以上人有835萬人已經增加了從108萬人到現在增加125萬人\n396656\t416545\t我們平均給每一個人分配的預算現在是40.7塊那有進步從以前的26.8增加了這樣大概買一顆茶葉蛋那6年來我們的進步就是對高齡者的對待就是給他一顆茶葉蛋\n417725\t429385\t作為他一年的這個教育、終身教育的預算這就是我們在看待終身教育看整個高年化的教育部有多麼的末世這樣子的一個\n433365\t453753\t另外,我們要求這一個我們的終身學習法裡面對於預算,終身學習的預算只有一句話應優於清費補助,就是一署一署那大家憑良心能夠補助,剩餘的錢來補助沒有任何的規範\n454973\t480219\t我們今天談特殊教育法我希望能夠比照特殊教育法特殊教育法裡面說這個特殊教育的預算在中央不得低於4.5%在地方不可以低於5%那我們剛才那個中正學習室是0.2%差別也夠大我們現在的特殊教育服務對象有多少人\n481472\t482433\t韓國終身教育總體教育率是多少?10%\n497159\t516371\t10%我們是0.2%差20倍所以這一點真的要大大改進好不好所以最後兩個要求就是沒有錢就不能辦事啦你編的那個一點的一顆茶一蛋的那個預算說你想要多努力有心那都騙人了啦\n517270\t536379\t今年編的終身教育要大幅增加台灣已經邁向超高齡社會了整個完全沒看到整個完全不理會再來的話就是相關的法規包括第三人生納學剛才我一開始提到的家庭教育是個核心\n537139\t538200\t希望教育部在這方面能夠多多努力可以嗎?\n564501\t564642\t主席\n581562\t582223\t主席主席主席\n","txt":"謝謝主席。我們請次長。\n每次看到教育部的我們官員來其實我覺得都很開心然後大家彼此事實上是都很想把事情做好我相信但是呢我覺得我們現在的問題就像今天在談這個特殊教育其實最近不僅是這個幾乎每一個層面\n都在面臨崩潰狀態從社工都走上街頭了然後這個幼教、教保這個我們衛福部的學部長說這個是社會安全網的系統性失靈\n其實大家看一下這張照片這張照片是一個家庭的合照家庭是一體的你覺得誰是在裡面是一個核心核心者應該是家裡面的長輩長輩喔長輩坐在中間的位置看起來蠻適合的很溫馨對不對\n但是呢我們的教育是破碎的我們的教育呢把每一個人隔離了都有了高齡者有終身教育有特殊教育有幼兒教育有各種的教育破碎化其實這就是問題的關鍵因為他們本來是議題回到家庭是議題但是呢他們本來可以互相協助互相支援互相成為協助互相學習的但是我們讓他變成孤單了\n所以這個教育部一肩扛你是扛不住的現在整個的這個社會沒有政府是扛不住的我們整個的這個你看這個另外看一下這個是今天的頭版的調查這個數據不曉得這個次長有沒有看到\n台灣60歲以上的人是全世界最不快樂的\n這個我看這數據很驚訝台灣60歲以上的人是全世界這還是全世界比了但是台灣30歲以下的是全世界最快樂的我還沒有研究這個數據今天頭版看到的數據是不是請教一部研究一下可不可以研究一下因為你們教育的是人嘛這各種年齡層這個原因在哪裡\n剛才看到了中間那個位置高齡者、長輩是可以發揮一個家庭穩定的力量穩定核心的力量但是呢我們現在終身教育就是這個場景這個場景所以整個在崩潰狀態就晚年就休閒嘛沒有那個所以從這裡我們看到\n中生教育是最值得投資的教育是嗎?市長你認同嗎?非常同意委員所以這個也就是我在上次跟部長提的他也認同我們要因為現在的高齡者很長壽動者都90幾歲60歲退休30年我們要讓他熱情地追求第三人生那上次我們一個臨時提案\n部長也接受了 現在要規劃我也知道你們在啟動第三人生大學的計畫好像前天3月19日有開一個研討會但是研討會的結論好像出席的還是終身教育師一個師出來出席所以看起來他\n發現這個問題很大高教師也沒有出來理這高教師覺得這件事情跟他無關然後呢這個還涉及到跨部會然後部長這麼有熱情想要推動這件事情結果我們還是回到體制裡面還是給一個小小的一個終身教育師想要扛這個責任我覺得你覺得樂觀嗎\n跟委員報告一下那個同仁告訴我說當天3月19號的會議雖然是中村司主持但是是有邀請我們相關的司數包含了高教師、技師都有代表的參與有出席喔我沒有看到那個會議記錄但是呢這件事情就會繼續的推動因為看起來部長是重視的啦但是呢我們往往就是不了了之啦\n中生教育部對中生教育有多麼的默示從108年\n整個教育部本部的預算還不講外延的外延可以擴充到3000億我只講本部就1298億結果教育高領教育師預算是1.9億占0.14然後逐年這樣子有在成長今年113年\n教育部有1706億但高齡教育是3.4億占0.19現在的壯世代有55歲以上人有835萬人已經增加了從108萬人到現在增加125萬人\n我們平均給每一個人分配的預算現在是40.7塊那有進步從以前的26.8增加了這樣大概買一顆茶葉蛋那6年來我們的進步就是對高齡者的對待就是給他一顆茶葉蛋\n作為他一年的這個教育、終身教育的預算這就是我們在看待終身教育看整個高年化的教育部有多麼的末世這樣子的一個\n另外,我們要求這一個我們的終身學習法裡面對於預算,終身學習的預算只有一句話應優於清費補助,就是一署一署那大家憑良心能夠補助,剩餘的錢來補助沒有任何的規範\n我們今天談特殊教育法我希望能夠比照特殊教育法特殊教育法裡面說這個特殊教育的預算在中央不得低於4.5%在地方不可以低於5%那我們剛才那個中正學習室是0.2%差別也夠大我們現在的特殊教育服務對象有多少人\n韓國終身教育總體教育率是多少?10%\n10%我們是0.2%差20倍所以這一點真的要大大改進好不好所以最後兩個要求就是沒有錢就不能辦事啦你編的那個一點的一顆茶一蛋的那個預算說你想要多努力有心那都騙人了啦\n今年編的終身教育要大幅增加台灣已經邁向超高齡社會了整個完全沒看到整個完全不理會再來的話就是相關的法規包括第三人生納學剛才我一開始提到的家庭教育是個核心\n希望教育部在這方面能夠多多努力可以嗎?\n主席\n主席主席主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.046 --> 00:00.166\n謝謝主席。我們請次長。\n\n00:23.263 --> 00:44.128\n每次看到教育部的我們官員來其實我覺得都很開心然後大家彼此事實上是都很想把事情做好我相信但是呢我覺得我們現在的問題就像今天在談這個特殊教育其實最近不僅是這個幾乎每一個層面\n\n00:46.874 --> 01:03.385\n都在面臨崩潰狀態從社工都走上街頭了然後這個幼教、教保這個我們衛福部的學部長說這個是社會安全網的系統性失靈\n\n01:10.715 --> 01:32.710\n其實大家看一下這張照片這張照片是一個家庭的合照家庭是一體的你覺得誰是在裡面是一個核心核心者應該是家裡面的長輩長輩喔長輩坐在中間的位置看起來蠻適合的很溫馨對不對\n\n01:36.482 --> 02:05.094\n但是呢我們的教育是破碎的我們的教育呢把每一個人隔離了都有了高齡者有終身教育有特殊教育有幼兒教育有各種的教育破碎化其實這就是問題的關鍵因為他們本來是議題回到家庭是議題但是呢他們本來可以互相協助互相支援互相成為協助互相學習的但是我們讓他變成孤單了\n\n02:06.607 --> 02:30.860\n所以這個教育部一肩扛你是扛不住的現在整個的這個社會沒有政府是扛不住的我們整個的這個你看這個另外看一下這個是今天的頭版的調查這個數據不曉得這個次長有沒有看到\n\n02:33.861 --> 02:35.422\n台灣60歲以上的人是全世界最不快樂的\n\n02:55.562 --> 03:19.860\n這個我看這數據很驚訝台灣60歲以上的人是全世界這還是全世界比了但是台灣30歲以下的是全世界最快樂的我還沒有研究這個數據今天頭版看到的數據是不是請教一部研究一下可不可以研究一下因為你們教育的是人嘛這各種年齡層這個原因在哪裡\n\n03:22.526 --> 03:49.549\n剛才看到了中間那個位置高齡者、長輩是可以發揮一個家庭穩定的力量穩定核心的力量但是呢我們現在終身教育就是這個場景這個場景所以整個在崩潰狀態就晚年就休閒嘛沒有那個所以從這裡我們看到\n\n03:50.851 --> 04:17.986\n中生教育是最值得投資的教育是嗎?市長你認同嗎?非常同意委員所以這個也就是我在上次跟部長提的他也認同我們要因為現在的高齡者很長壽動者都90幾歲60歲退休30年我們要讓他熱情地追求第三人生那上次我們一個臨時提案\n\n04:19.106 --> 04:42.539\n部長也接受了現在要規劃我也知道你們在啟動第三人生大學的計畫好像前天3月19日有開一個研討會但是研討會的結論好像出席的還是終身教育師一個師出來出席所以看起來他\n\n04:45.928 --> 05:05.368\n發現這個問題很大高教師也沒有出來理這高教師覺得這件事情跟他無關然後呢這個還涉及到跨部會然後部長這麼有熱情想要推動這件事情結果我們還是回到體制裡面還是給一個小小的一個終身教育師想要扛這個責任我覺得你覺得樂觀嗎\n\n05:07.229 --> 05:35.169\n跟委員報告一下那個同仁告訴我說當天3月19號的會議雖然是中村司主持但是是有邀請我們相關的司數包含了高教師、技師都有代表的參與有出席喔我沒有看到那個會議記錄但是呢這件事情就會繼續的推動因為看起來部長是重視的啦但是呢我們往往就是不了了之啦\n\n05:35.549 --> 05:37.090\n中生教育部對中生教育有多麼的默示從108年\n\n05:56.698 --> 06:14.964\n整個教育部本部的預算還不講外延的外延可以擴充到3000億我只講本部就1298億結果教育高領教育師預算是1.9億占0.14然後逐年這樣子有在成長今年113年\n\n06:17.836 --> 06:22.098\n教育部有1706億但高齡教育是3.4億占0.19現在的壯世代有55歲以上人有835萬人已經增加了從108萬人到現在增加125萬人\n\n06:36.656 --> 06:56.545\n我們平均給每一個人分配的預算現在是40.7塊那有進步從以前的26.8增加了這樣大概買一顆茶葉蛋那6年來我們的進步就是對高齡者的對待就是給他一顆茶葉蛋\n\n06:57.725 --> 07:09.385\n作為他一年的這個教育、終身教育的預算這就是我們在看待終身教育看整個高年化的教育部有多麼的末世這樣子的一個\n\n07:13.365 --> 07:33.753\n另外,我們要求這一個我們的終身學習法裡面對於預算,終身學習的預算只有一句話應優於清費補助,就是一署一署那大家憑良心能夠補助,剩餘的錢來補助沒有任何的規範\n\n07:34.973 --> 08:00.219\n我們今天談特殊教育法我希望能夠比照特殊教育法特殊教育法裡面說這個特殊教育的預算在中央不得低於4.5%在地方不可以低於5%那我們剛才那個中正學習室是0.2%差別也夠大我們現在的特殊教育服務對象有多少人\n\n08:01.472 --> 08:02.433\n韓國終身教育總體教育率是多少?10%\n\n08:17.159 --> 08:36.371\n10%我們是0.2%差20倍所以這一點真的要大大改進好不好所以最後兩個要求就是沒有錢就不能辦事啦你編的那個一點的一顆茶一蛋的那個預算說你想要多努力有心那都騙人了啦\n\n08:37.270 --> 08:56.379\n今年編的終身教育要大幅增加台灣已經邁向超高齡社會了整個完全沒看到整個完全不理會再來的話就是相關的法規包括第三人生納學剛才我一開始提到的家庭教育是個核心\n\n08:57.139 --> 08:58.200\n希望教育部在這方面能夠多多努力可以嗎?\n\n09:24.501 --> 09:24.642\n主席\n\n09:41.562 --> 09:42.223\n主席主席主席\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.046,"end":0.166,"text":"謝謝主席。我們請次長。"},{"start":23.263,"end":44.128,"text":"每次看到教育部的我們官員來其實我覺得都很開心然後大家彼此事實上是都很想把事情做好我相信但是呢我覺得我們現在的問題就像今天在談這個特殊教育其實最近不僅是這個幾乎每一個層面"},{"start":46.874,"end":63.385,"text":"都在面臨崩潰狀態從社工都走上街頭了然後這個幼教、教保這個我們衛福部的學部長說這個是社會安全網的系統性失靈"},{"start":70.715,"end":92.71,"text":"其實大家看一下這張照片這張照片是一個家庭的合照家庭是一體的你覺得誰是在裡面是一個核心核心者應該是家裡面的長輩長輩喔長輩坐在中間的位置看起來蠻適合的很溫馨對不對"},{"start":96.482,"end":125.094,"text":"但是呢我們的教育是破碎的我們的教育呢把每一個人隔離了都有了高齡者有終身教育有特殊教育有幼兒教育有各種的教育破碎化其實這就是問題的關鍵因為他們本來是議題回到家庭是議題但是呢他們本來可以互相協助互相支援互相成為協助互相學習的但是我們讓他變成孤單了"},{"start":126.607,"end":150.86,"text":"所以這個教育部一肩扛你是扛不住的現在整個的這個社會沒有政府是扛不住的我們整個的這個你看這個另外看一下這個是今天的頭版的調查這個數據不曉得這個次長有沒有看到"},{"start":153.861,"end":155.422,"text":"台灣60歲以上的人是全世界最不快樂的"},{"start":175.562,"end":199.86,"text":"這個我看這數據很驚訝台灣60歲以上的人是全世界這還是全世界比了但是台灣30歲以下的是全世界最快樂的我還沒有研究這個數據今天頭版看到的數據是不是請教一部研究一下可不可以研究一下因為你們教育的是人嘛這各種年齡層這個原因在哪裡"},{"start":202.526,"end":229.549,"text":"剛才看到了中間那個位置高齡者、長輩是可以發揮一個家庭穩定的力量穩定核心的力量但是呢我們現在終身教育就是這個場景這個場景所以整個在崩潰狀態就晚年就休閒嘛沒有那個所以從這裡我們看到"},{"start":230.851,"end":257.986,"text":"中生教育是最值得投資的教育是嗎?市長你認同嗎?非常同意委員所以這個也就是我在上次跟部長提的他也認同我們要因為現在的高齡者很長壽動者都90幾歲60歲退休30年我們要讓他熱情地追求第三人生那上次我們一個臨時提案"},{"start":259.106,"end":282.539,"text":"部長也接受了 現在要規劃我也知道你們在啟動第三人生大學的計畫好像前天3月19日有開一個研討會但是研討會的結論好像出席的還是終身教育師一個師出來出席所以看起來他"},{"start":285.928,"end":305.368,"text":"發現這個問題很大高教師也沒有出來理這高教師覺得這件事情跟他無關然後呢這個還涉及到跨部會然後部長這麼有熱情想要推動這件事情結果我們還是回到體制裡面還是給一個小小的一個終身教育師想要扛這個責任我覺得你覺得樂觀嗎"},{"start":307.229,"end":335.169,"text":"跟委員報告一下那個同仁告訴我說當天3月19號的會議雖然是中村司主持但是是有邀請我們相關的司數包含了高教師、技師都有代表的參與有出席喔我沒有看到那個會議記錄但是呢這件事情就會繼續的推動因為看起來部長是重視的啦但是呢我們往往就是不了了之啦"},{"start":335.549,"end":337.09,"text":"中生教育部對中生教育有多麼的默示從108年"},{"start":356.698,"end":374.964,"text":"整個教育部本部的預算還不講外延的外延可以擴充到3000億我只講本部就1298億結果教育高領教育師預算是1.9億占0.14然後逐年這樣子有在成長今年113年"},{"start":377.836,"end":382.098,"text":"教育部有1706億但高齡教育是3.4億占0.19現在的壯世代有55歲以上人有835萬人已經增加了從108萬人到現在增加125萬人"},{"start":396.656,"end":416.545,"text":"我們平均給每一個人分配的預算現在是40.7塊那有進步從以前的26.8增加了這樣大概買一顆茶葉蛋那6年來我們的進步就是對高齡者的對待就是給他一顆茶葉蛋"},{"start":417.725,"end":429.385,"text":"作為他一年的這個教育、終身教育的預算這就是我們在看待終身教育看整個高年化的教育部有多麼的末世這樣子的一個"},{"start":433.365,"end":453.753,"text":"另外,我們要求這一個我們的終身學習法裡面對於預算,終身學習的預算只有一句話應優於清費補助,就是一署一署那大家憑良心能夠補助,剩餘的錢來補助沒有任何的規範"},{"start":454.973,"end":480.219,"text":"我們今天談特殊教育法我希望能夠比照特殊教育法特殊教育法裡面說這個特殊教育的預算在中央不得低於4.5%在地方不可以低於5%那我們剛才那個中正學習室是0.2%差別也夠大我們現在的特殊教育服務對象有多少人"},{"start":481.472,"end":482.433,"text":"韓國終身教育總體教育率是多少?10%"},{"start":497.159,"end":516.371,"text":"10%我們是0.2%差20倍所以這一點真的要大大改進好不好所以最後兩個要求就是沒有錢就不能辦事啦你編的那個一點的一顆茶一蛋的那個預算說你想要多努力有心那都騙人了啦"},{"start":517.27,"end":536.379,"text":"今年編的終身教育要大幅增加台灣已經邁向超高齡社會了整個完全沒看到整個完全不理會再來的話就是相關的法規包括第三人生納學剛才我一開始提到的家庭教育是個核心"},{"start":537.139,"end":538.2,"text":"希望教育部在這方面能夠多多努力可以嗎?"},{"start":564.501,"end":564.642,"text":"主席"},{"start":581.562,"end":582.223,"text":"主席主席主席"}]}}}}