{"id":150396,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150396","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3b2b855ee35a005b873abb4740ab2e78cabe2e38d5d7efe9f8ba9b0039caa7a67bed10a2a74c501c5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林沛祥","委員發言時間":"12:38:21 - 12:45:49","影片長度":"00:07:28","會議時間":"2024-03-25T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期交通委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：審查委員傅崐萁等33人擬具「花東快速公路建設特別條例草案」案。【詢答及處理】【3月25日及27日二天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期交通委員會第5次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":5,"committees":[23],"id":"委員會-11-1-23-5"},"date":"2024-03-25","duration":448,"end_time":"2024-03-25T12:45:49+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-25T12:38:21+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":1051,"blocks":[["林委員沛祥：（12時38分）請王部長備詢。"],["主席：王部長。"],["王部長國材：你好。"],["林委員沛祥：部長，您剛剛說過花東快速道路是行政院中長型計畫的大型交通建設，對於北北基地區來講，另外一個極為重要的中長期大型交通建設就是基隆捷運。請問一下，您知道基隆捷運目前的進行路線嗎？你是否知道？"],["王部長國材：我知道。"],["林委員沛祥：好。那您知道基捷經過的路線有絕大部分都是貨櫃的內陸集散站？"],["王部長國材：因為當時提到這邊未來會做一些都市計畫變更……"],["林委員沛祥：對，可是絕大多數都是內陸集散站，所謂的內陸集散站，如果以航運來講的話，嚴格講起來，如果沒有內陸集散站，這個港口勢必會被毀滅。也就是說，當基隆捷運正式進入基隆市區之前，基隆港就被滅了，因為基隆港將會沒有後場，也就是沒有土地來做多國拆併櫃。基隆跟高雄是不一樣的，高雄在港區旁邊是有許多土地的，如果沒有土地來做多國拆併櫃的話，我很難想像航商會願意把30%的貨櫃留在基隆做多國拆併櫃之後，再把70%流到臺北港去做多國拆併櫃。"],["王部長國材：我跟林委員報告，縱然它經過，然後有一些這個貨櫃的集散地，如果它還有它的功能，我並不覺得……"],["林委員沛祥：本席想要問的第二個問題……"],["王部長國材：它可以轉型，不是全部都把它變成都市……"],["林委員沛祥：本席在院會質詢的時候，我很擔心，那時候部長也在場，本席直接問陳建仁院長，賴清德總統在今天在去年12月24日講的，要把五堵、六堵、七堵所有的貨櫃集散地往臺北港塞，這件事是否是真的？","不好意思，長官，我沒有請你備詢。"],["王部長國材：是，我是覺得這個是按照所有業者的需求……"],["林委員沛祥：這就是本席要講的……"],["王部長國材：我絕對不會說什麼……"],["林委員沛祥：部長，我今天是做理性的討論，我不是來罵人的。"],["王部長國材：是，我瞭解。"],["林委員沛祥：可是這個事情對基隆是絕對重要的事情，因為你可能會害得基隆市因此有更大的財務危機跟經濟危機。"],["王部長國材：沒問題。"],["林委員沛祥：第二點，想請問一下，部長，您既然對基隆港這麼瞭解，你知道基隆港的在地就業機會有幾個嗎？"],["王部長國材：數字我……"],["林委員沛祥：不好意思，長官，我並沒有請你上台備詢。","我可以很負責地跟部長您報告，是13,000個到15,000個，換句話說，有13,000個到15,000個家庭目前還在基隆港工作，在全盛時期，基隆港曾經到將近40,000人甚至45,000人，所以基隆有很多外來人口，是從1980年代、1970年代開始的，但是之前本席在基隆市議會的時候，一直聽到北五堵科技園區，請問交通部知道這個事情嗎？"],["王部長國材：我知道，因為那時候應該是林右昌市長的時候，他有一個計畫，他想……"],["林委員沛祥：請問，北五堵科技園區何時興建完成？現在有報行政院嗎？有核定過嗎？因為這跟基隆捷運有絕對的關係，基隆捷運直接從中間經過北五堵科技園區，甚至很多徵收的土地，都是因為北五堵科技園區而去做的。"],["王部長國材：是，當時有一個計畫是補助基隆市政府做規劃。"],["林委員沛祥：所以現在沒有全何規劃……"],["王部長國材：現在還沒有，應該還沒有到都市計劃程序，我不知道現在謝市長他們進行得怎麼樣，我不是很清楚。"],["林委員沛祥：以當初林右昌市長的規劃，或者現在林右昌部長的規劃，他有沒有保留過倉儲用地呢？倉儲用地就是交通部的業務了吧？"],["王部長國材：當時北五堵是以造新鎮的方式。"],["林委員沛祥：所以完全沒有保留倉儲用地嗎？"],["王部長國材：沿線應該有一些保留，但是北五堵當時他當作一個最重要的開發地方……"],["林委員沛祥：部長，您也知道，剛剛啓楷委員也講過，國道客運塞車是很嚴重的事情，尤其是基隆到臺北端。"],["王部長國材：是。"],["林委員沛祥：每天早上本席要從6時15分出發，才不會塞車，從6時55分到8時，我相信所有的學術研究都講過了，如果你沒有把這15,000人好好地留在基隆上班，他們就會想盡辦法上國道，不管是國道1號還是國道3號，直接天天塞車，到新北跟臺北。"],["王部長國材：是。"],["林委員沛祥：那個時候你的客運和你的捷運，我們不知道10年之後是不是能夠順利完工，我們也不知道客運是不是能夠找到那麼多的司機，甚至我們也不知道火車是否能夠輔助我們現在的運輸功能，你現在跟我講什麼都不知道的時候，然後貨櫃集散站要拆，因為12月24日我曾經問過陳建仁院長，那時候陳院長跟我說是不會的，但是現在部長您說現在的狀況不知道，對吧？"],["王部長國材：我是覺得透過都市計畫來檢討，跟業者有沒有要轉型，我覺得這個部分真的是要從需求面來看。"],["林委員沛祥：如果從需求面來看的話，我一直聽到航商直接給我的反映，他們想留在基隆港，因為如果搬到臺北港，只有一條台64線，如果被炸掉，或是一個地震，造成台64線不能通行之後，所有北臺灣的貨運會癱瘓，對吧？"],["王部長國材：是。我跟委員報告，我從來……"],["林委員沛祥：我只是問說「對吧」，因為說真的，我以前在臺北港任職過，部長，你也知道我的resume，我在臺北港任職過，所以我知道台64線多重要，我也不希望台64線出事，但是只要台64線出事，臺北港將整個癱瘓，對吧？"],["王部長國材：應該不要這麼說……"],["林委員沛祥：要去做空港聯營，是吧？"],["王部長國材：我覺得基礎設施要維護，不會那麼脆弱。"],["林委員沛祥：空港聯營是不夠的，所以本席在這邊特地強力建議，麻煩部長跟交通部，甚至中央政府，要幫基隆人，要幫辛苦的基隆人想多一點。在地的13,000到15,000個工作，是因為有基隆貨櫃港，而不是基隆郵輪港，到目前為止，郵輪港製造當地的就業機會不到2,000個，我可以很負責任地講，因為我敢講港口。"],["王部長國材：對。"],["林委員沛祥：我知道港務公司現在還在做成效不佳的自營櫃場，那是不是可以可憐一下航商，讓航商能夠繼續留在基隆呢？"],["王部長國材：我們也沒有趕航商。"],["林委員沛祥：航商會為了自己而離開，是因為沒有後場的原因，部長，這就是我們兩邊有一點落差的地方。"],["王部長國材：是。"],["林委員沛祥：航商會因為沒有後場的原因，自動跑到臺北港，他們不想去臺北港，因為臺北港如果台64線出問題，所有貨運全部爛掉，那基隆至少有兩條高速公路，一條國1，一條國3，可以很順利地運送貨物。"],["王部長國材：基礎的交通網路，我覺得兩邊都完整，最重要的就是，基隆港的建設，我們並沒有把貨運停掉，我們現在是內客外貨。"],["林委員沛祥：內客外貨是十幾年前的港務政策，是不是還在內客外貨，還是東客西貨，未來我們再來討論。現在時間到了，但是我希望未來針對是否能夠把基隆港的貨櫃航商留在基隆，我相信部裡面要給我完整的書面回答。"],["王部長國材：好，OK。"],["林委員沛祥：謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝林沛祥委員的發言。","下一位請林憶君委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":472,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-23-5","speakers":["陳雪生","傅崐萁","李昆澤","廖先翔","黃健豪","游顥","徐富癸","林國成","魯明哲","蔡其昌","陳素月","何欣純","林俊憲","邱若華","許智傑","鄭天財Sra 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{\"word\": \"沛\", \"start\": 419.296, \"end\": 419.396, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"祥\", \"start\": 419.396, \"end\": 419.416, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:06,639 --> 00:00:06,960\n王部長部長\n\n2\n00:00:15,492 --> 00:00:38,322\n花東快速公路是您剛剛說過行政院的中長期計畫的大型交通建設那對於北北基地區來講另外一個極為重要的中長期大型交通建設就是基隆捷運請問一下您知道基隆捷運目前的進行路線嗎您是否知道我知道好那您知道基捷經過的路線有絕大部分都是所謂的內陸集散站\n\n3\n00:00:39,326 --> 00:00:40,867\n當基隆捷運正式進入基隆市區之前基隆港就被滅了\n\n4\n00:01:01,047 --> 00:01:24,546\n因為基隆港將會沒有所謂的後廠也就是沒有所謂的土地來去做多貨拆品櫃基隆跟高雄是不一樣的高雄在港區旁邊是有許多的土地的而如果你沒有這個土地來去做多貨拆品櫃的話我很難想像行商會願意把30%的貨櫃留在基隆做拆品櫃之後再把70%留到台北港去做多貨拆品櫃\n\n5\n00:01:25,126 --> 00:01:38,982\n我跟你們報告,縱然他經過然後有一些這個後跪的集散地,如果他還有他的功能,我不覺得,我並不覺得啦,他可以轉型。我只是說全部都把他變成……\n\n6\n00:01:40,644 --> 00:02:00,950\n我本席在院會質詢的時候我很擔心所以我那時候部長也在場本席直接問陳建仁院長賴清哲總統在去年12月24號講的要把五堵六堵七堵的所有的貨櫃集散地往台北港塞這件事是否是真的那個時候不好意思長官我們也請您備詢\n\n7\n00:02:03,425 --> 00:02:27,170\n我是覺得這個是按照這個所有的業者的需求這就是本席要講的第二句話部長我今天是做理性的討論我不是來罵人的可是這個事情對基隆市絕對重要的事情因為你可能會害的基隆市因此有更大有更大的財務危機跟經濟危機第二點想請問一下部長您既然對基隆港這麼瞭解你知道基隆港的在地就業機會有幾個嗎\n\n8\n00:02:30,173 --> 00:02:56,664\n數字我沒有數字我並沒有心情上台備訓我可以很負責的跟部長您報告是一萬三千個到一萬五千個換句話說有一萬三千個家庭跟一戶到一萬五千個家庭目前還在基隆港工作在全盛時期基隆港曾經到將近四萬人甚至四萬五千人所以基隆有很多外來人口是從1980年代1970年代開始的但是\n\n9\n00:02:57,364 --> 00:03:24,646\n目前我聽到之前本席在基隆市議會的時候一直聽到所謂的北五堵科技園區請問交通部知道這個事情嗎我知道因為那時候應該是林佑昌市長的時候他有一個計畫他想請問北五堵科技園區何時先進完成現在有報行政院嗎有核定過嗎因為這跟基隆捷運有絕對的關係基隆捷運直接從中間經過北五堵科技園區甚至很多徵收的土地都是因為北五堵科技園區所需做的是\n\n10\n00:03:25,547 --> 00:03:46,474\n現在好像當時有一個計畫是補助金融市政府在做規劃應該還沒有到度假程序但是我不知道現在接鎖謝市長他們現在進行怎麼樣我不是很清楚以當初林沛祥市長的規劃或現在林沛祥部長的規劃他有沒有保留過所謂的倉儲用地呢\n\n11\n00:03:47,758 --> 00:03:49,941\n國道客運的塞車是很嚴重的事情尤其當基隆到台北端\n\n12\n00:04:08,141 --> 00:04:37,664\n每天早上本席要每天早上6點15分出發才不會塞車從6點55到8點我相信所有學術研究都講過了那如果說你沒有把這一個一萬五千人好好的留在基隆上班那他們就會想盡辦法上國道上國道不管是國道一號還是國道三號直接天天的塞車到新北跟台北那那個時候你的客運你的捷運我們不知道十年之後是不是能夠順利順利完工\n\n13\n00:04:38,024 --> 00:05:05,829\n我們也不知道客運是不是能夠找到那麼多司機甚至我們也不知道火車是否能夠能夠輔助我們現在運輸功能那你現在跟我講什麼都不知道的時候然後你貨櫃集散站要拆因為這是目前我看到2012月24號我曾經問過那時候陳建源陳建源院長跟我說是不會的但是現在部長您說我們現在狀況不知道對吧我是也透過都市計畫的檢討跟業者他有沒有要轉型啊\n\n14\n00:05:06,429 --> 00:05:26,201\n我覺得這部分真的是要從需求面來看那如果需求面的話我一直聽到航商直接給我的反應他們想留在基隆港因為如果你搬到台北港你只有一個64號隨時被炸掉還是隨時一個地震觀音山64號被炸掉被地震之後所有北台灣的貨運會癱瘓\n\n15\n00:05:29,932 --> 00:05:45,288\n我只是會說對吧因為說真的我以前在台北港任職過我想部長您也知道我的resume我以前在台北港任職過所以我知道64號多重要我也不希望64號出事但是只要64號出事之後台北港整個癱瘓對吧\n\n16\n00:05:47,129 --> 00:06:12,074\n應該不要這麼說我覺得就有設施要去做空港聯營嗎空港聯營是不夠的所以說北溪在這邊特地強力建議麻煩部長跟交通部甚至中央政府要幫基隆人要幫辛苦的基隆人想多一點在地的13000到15000工作因為基隆商港基隆貨櫃港基隆貨櫃港而不是基隆郵輪港郵輪港到目前為止\n\n17\n00:06:12,814 --> 00:06:29,848\n制造當地的就業機會不到2000我可以很負責任的講因為港口我敢講港口而這邊的話我知道港務公司現在還在做成效不佳的自營櫃場那是不是可以可憐一下說讓行商能夠繼續留在基隆呢\n\n18\n00:06:30,562 --> 00:06:58,176\n我們也沒有趕航商耶沒有,航商會為了自己因為沒有後廠的原因部長這就是我們兩邊有點落差的地方航商會因為沒有後廠的原因自動跑到台北港他們不想去台北港因為台北港如果一個64號出問題所有貨運全部爛掉那基隆至少有兩條高速公路一條國一一條國三可以很順利的運送貨物我想那個基礎的交通網路我是覺得兩邊都完整\n\n19\n00:06:59,116 --> 00:06:59,416\n謝謝林沛祥\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6639\t6960\t王部長部長\n15492\t38322\t花東快速公路是您剛剛說過行政院的中長期計畫的大型交通建設那對於北北基地區來講另外一個極為重要的中長期大型交通建設就是基隆捷運請問一下您知道基隆捷運目前的進行路線嗎您是否知道我知道好那您知道基捷經過的路線有絕大部分都是所謂的內陸集散站\n39326\t40867\t當基隆捷運正式進入基隆市區之前基隆港就被滅了\n61047\t84546\t因為基隆港將會沒有所謂的後廠也就是沒有所謂的土地來去做多貨拆品櫃基隆跟高雄是不一樣的高雄在港區旁邊是有許多的土地的而如果你沒有這個土地來去做多貨拆品櫃的話我很難想像行商會願意把30%的貨櫃留在基隆做拆品櫃之後再把70%留到台北港去做多貨拆品櫃\n85126\t98982\t我跟你們報告,縱然他經過然後有一些這個後跪的集散地,如果他還有他的功能,我不覺得,我並不覺得啦,他可以轉型。我只是說全部都把他變成……\n100644\t120950\t我本席在院會質詢的時候我很擔心所以我那時候部長也在場本席直接問陳建仁院長賴清哲總統在去年12月24號講的要把五堵六堵七堵的所有的貨櫃集散地往台北港塞這件事是否是真的那個時候不好意思長官我們也請您備詢\n123425\t147170\t我是覺得這個是按照這個所有的業者的需求這就是本席要講的第二句話部長我今天是做理性的討論我不是來罵人的可是這個事情對基隆市絕對重要的事情因為你可能會害的基隆市因此有更大有更大的財務危機跟經濟危機第二點想請問一下部長您既然對基隆港這麼瞭解你知道基隆港的在地就業機會有幾個嗎\n150173\t176664\t數字我沒有數字我並沒有心情上台備訓我可以很負責的跟部長您報告是一萬三千個到一萬五千個換句話說有一萬三千個家庭跟一戶到一萬五千個家庭目前還在基隆港工作在全盛時期基隆港曾經到將近四萬人甚至四萬五千人所以基隆有很多外來人口是從1980年代1970年代開始的但是\n177364\t204646\t目前我聽到之前本席在基隆市議會的時候一直聽到所謂的北五堵科技園區請問交通部知道這個事情嗎我知道因為那時候應該是林佑昌市長的時候他有一個計畫他想請問北五堵科技園區何時先進完成現在有報行政院嗎有核定過嗎因為這跟基隆捷運有絕對的關係基隆捷運直接從中間經過北五堵科技園區甚至很多徵收的土地都是因為北五堵科技園區所需做的是\n205547\t226474\t現在好像當時有一個計畫是補助金融市政府在做規劃應該還沒有到度假程序但是我不知道現在接鎖謝市長他們現在進行怎麼樣我不是很清楚以當初林沛祥市長的規劃或現在林沛祥部長的規劃他有沒有保留過所謂的倉儲用地呢\n227758\t229941\t國道客運的塞車是很嚴重的事情尤其當基隆到台北端\n248141\t277664\t每天早上本席要每天早上6點15分出發才不會塞車從6點55到8點我相信所有學術研究都講過了那如果說你沒有把這一個一萬五千人好好的留在基隆上班那他們就會想盡辦法上國道上國道不管是國道一號還是國道三號直接天天的塞車到新北跟台北那那個時候你的客運你的捷運我們不知道十年之後是不是能夠順利順利完工\n278024\t305829\t我們也不知道客運是不是能夠找到那麼多司機甚至我們也不知道火車是否能夠能夠輔助我們現在運輸功能那你現在跟我講什麼都不知道的時候然後你貨櫃集散站要拆因為這是目前我看到2012月24號我曾經問過那時候陳建源陳建源院長跟我說是不會的但是現在部長您說我們現在狀況不知道對吧我是也透過都市計畫的檢討跟業者他有沒有要轉型啊\n306429\t326201\t我覺得這部分真的是要從需求面來看 那如果需求面的話我一直聽到航商直接給我的反應他們想留在基隆港因為如果你搬到台北港你只有一個64號隨時被炸掉還是隨時一個地震觀音山64號被炸掉被地震之後所有北台灣的貨運會癱瘓\n329932\t345288\t我只是會說對吧因為說真的我以前在台北港任職過我想部長您也知道我的resume我以前在台北港任職過所以我知道64號多重要我也不希望64號出事但是只要64號出事之後台北港整個癱瘓對吧\n347129\t372074\t應該不要這麼說我覺得就有設施要去做空港聯營嗎空港聯營是不夠的所以說北溪在這邊特地強力建議麻煩部長跟交通部甚至中央政府要幫基隆人要幫辛苦的基隆人想多一點在地的13000到15000工作因為基隆商港基隆貨櫃港基隆貨櫃港而不是基隆郵輪港郵輪港到目前為止\n372814\t389848\t制造當地的就業機會不到2000我可以很負責任的講因為港口我敢講港口而這邊的話我知道港務公司現在還在做成效不佳的自營櫃場那是不是可以可憐一下說讓行商能夠繼續留在基隆呢\n390562\t418176\t我們也沒有趕航商耶沒有,航商會為了自己因為沒有後廠的原因部長這就是我們兩邊有點落差的地方航商會因為沒有後廠的原因自動跑到台北港他們不想去台北港因為台北港如果一個64號出問題所有貨運全部爛掉那基隆至少有兩條高速公路一條國一一條國三可以很順利的運送貨物我想那個基礎的交通網路我是覺得兩邊都完整\n419116\t419416\t謝謝林沛祥\n","txt":"王部長部長\n花東快速公路是您剛剛說過行政院的中長期計畫的大型交通建設那對於北北基地區來講另外一個極為重要的中長期大型交通建設就是基隆捷運請問一下您知道基隆捷運目前的進行路線嗎您是否知道我知道好那您知道基捷經過的路線有絕大部分都是所謂的內陸集散站\n當基隆捷運正式進入基隆市區之前基隆港就被滅了\n因為基隆港將會沒有所謂的後廠也就是沒有所謂的土地來去做多貨拆品櫃基隆跟高雄是不一樣的高雄在港區旁邊是有許多的土地的而如果你沒有這個土地來去做多貨拆品櫃的話我很難想像行商會願意把30%的貨櫃留在基隆做拆品櫃之後再把70%留到台北港去做多貨拆品櫃\n我跟你們報告,縱然他經過然後有一些這個後跪的集散地,如果他還有他的功能,我不覺得,我並不覺得啦,他可以轉型。我只是說全部都把他變成……\n我本席在院會質詢的時候我很擔心所以我那時候部長也在場本席直接問陳建仁院長賴清哲總統在去年12月24號講的要把五堵六堵七堵的所有的貨櫃集散地往台北港塞這件事是否是真的那個時候不好意思長官我們也請您備詢\n我是覺得這個是按照這個所有的業者的需求這就是本席要講的第二句話部長我今天是做理性的討論我不是來罵人的可是這個事情對基隆市絕對重要的事情因為你可能會害的基隆市因此有更大有更大的財務危機跟經濟危機第二點想請問一下部長您既然對基隆港這麼瞭解你知道基隆港的在地就業機會有幾個嗎\n數字我沒有數字我並沒有心情上台備訓我可以很負責的跟部長您報告是一萬三千個到一萬五千個換句話說有一萬三千個家庭跟一戶到一萬五千個家庭目前還在基隆港工作在全盛時期基隆港曾經到將近四萬人甚至四萬五千人所以基隆有很多外來人口是從1980年代1970年代開始的但是\n目前我聽到之前本席在基隆市議會的時候一直聽到所謂的北五堵科技園區請問交通部知道這個事情嗎我知道因為那時候應該是林佑昌市長的時候他有一個計畫他想請問北五堵科技園區何時先進完成現在有報行政院嗎有核定過嗎因為這跟基隆捷運有絕對的關係基隆捷運直接從中間經過北五堵科技園區甚至很多徵收的土地都是因為北五堵科技園區所需做的是\n現在好像當時有一個計畫是補助金融市政府在做規劃應該還沒有到度假程序但是我不知道現在接鎖謝市長他們現在進行怎麼樣我不是很清楚以當初林沛祥市長的規劃或現在林沛祥部長的規劃他有沒有保留過所謂的倉儲用地呢\n國道客運的塞車是很嚴重的事情尤其當基隆到台北端\n每天早上本席要每天早上6點15分出發才不會塞車從6點55到8點我相信所有學術研究都講過了那如果說你沒有把這一個一萬五千人好好的留在基隆上班那他們就會想盡辦法上國道上國道不管是國道一號還是國道三號直接天天的塞車到新北跟台北那那個時候你的客運你的捷運我們不知道十年之後是不是能夠順利順利完工\n我們也不知道客運是不是能夠找到那麼多司機甚至我們也不知道火車是否能夠能夠輔助我們現在運輸功能那你現在跟我講什麼都不知道的時候然後你貨櫃集散站要拆因為這是目前我看到2012月24號我曾經問過那時候陳建源陳建源院長跟我說是不會的但是現在部長您說我們現在狀況不知道對吧我是也透過都市計畫的檢討跟業者他有沒有要轉型啊\n我覺得這部分真的是要從需求面來看 那如果需求面的話我一直聽到航商直接給我的反應他們想留在基隆港因為如果你搬到台北港你只有一個64號隨時被炸掉還是隨時一個地震觀音山64號被炸掉被地震之後所有北台灣的貨運會癱瘓\n我只是會說對吧因為說真的我以前在台北港任職過我想部長您也知道我的resume我以前在台北港任職過所以我知道64號多重要我也不希望64號出事但是只要64號出事之後台北港整個癱瘓對吧\n應該不要這麼說我覺得就有設施要去做空港聯營嗎空港聯營是不夠的所以說北溪在這邊特地強力建議麻煩部長跟交通部甚至中央政府要幫基隆人要幫辛苦的基隆人想多一點在地的13000到15000工作因為基隆商港基隆貨櫃港基隆貨櫃港而不是基隆郵輪港郵輪港到目前為止\n制造當地的就業機會不到2000我可以很負責任的講因為港口我敢講港口而這邊的話我知道港務公司現在還在做成效不佳的自營櫃場那是不是可以可憐一下說讓行商能夠繼續留在基隆呢\n我們也沒有趕航商耶沒有,航商會為了自己因為沒有後廠的原因部長這就是我們兩邊有點落差的地方航商會因為沒有後廠的原因自動跑到台北港他們不想去台北港因為台北港如果一個64號出問題所有貨運全部爛掉那基隆至少有兩條高速公路一條國一一條國三可以很順利的運送貨物我想那個基礎的交通網路我是覺得兩邊都完整\n謝謝林沛祥\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.639 --> 00:06.960\n王部長部長\n\n00:15.492 --> 00:38.322\n花東快速公路是您剛剛說過行政院的中長期計畫的大型交通建設那對於北北基地區來講另外一個極為重要的中長期大型交通建設就是基隆捷運請問一下您知道基隆捷運目前的進行路線嗎您是否知道我知道好那您知道基捷經過的路線有絕大部分都是所謂的內陸集散站\n\n00:39.326 --> 00:40.867\n當基隆捷運正式進入基隆市區之前基隆港就被滅了\n\n01:01.047 --> 01:24.546\n因為基隆港將會沒有所謂的後廠也就是沒有所謂的土地來去做多貨拆品櫃基隆跟高雄是不一樣的高雄在港區旁邊是有許多的土地的而如果你沒有這個土地來去做多貨拆品櫃的話我很難想像行商會願意把30%的貨櫃留在基隆做拆品櫃之後再把70%留到台北港去做多貨拆品櫃\n\n01:25.126 --> 01:38.982\n我跟你們報告,縱然他經過然後有一些這個後跪的集散地,如果他還有他的功能,我不覺得,我並不覺得啦,他可以轉型。我只是說全部都把他變成……\n\n01:40.644 --> 02:00.950\n我本席在院會質詢的時候我很擔心所以我那時候部長也在場本席直接問陳建仁院長賴清哲總統在去年12月24號講的要把五堵六堵七堵的所有的貨櫃集散地往台北港塞這件事是否是真的那個時候不好意思長官我們也請您備詢\n\n02:03.425 --> 02:27.170\n我是覺得這個是按照這個所有的業者的需求這就是本席要講的第二句話部長我今天是做理性的討論我不是來罵人的可是這個事情對基隆市絕對重要的事情因為你可能會害的基隆市因此有更大有更大的財務危機跟經濟危機第二點想請問一下部長您既然對基隆港這麼瞭解你知道基隆港的在地就業機會有幾個嗎\n\n02:30.173 --> 02:56.664\n數字我沒有數字我並沒有心情上台備訓我可以很負責的跟部長您報告是一萬三千個到一萬五千個換句話說有一萬三千個家庭跟一戶到一萬五千個家庭目前還在基隆港工作在全盛時期基隆港曾經到將近四萬人甚至四萬五千人所以基隆有很多外來人口是從1980年代1970年代開始的但是\n\n02:57.364 --> 03:24.646\n目前我聽到之前本席在基隆市議會的時候一直聽到所謂的北五堵科技園區請問交通部知道這個事情嗎我知道因為那時候應該是林佑昌市長的時候他有一個計畫他想請問北五堵科技園區何時先進完成現在有報行政院嗎有核定過嗎因為這跟基隆捷運有絕對的關係基隆捷運直接從中間經過北五堵科技園區甚至很多徵收的土地都是因為北五堵科技園區所需做的是\n\n03:25.547 --> 03:46.474\n現在好像當時有一個計畫是補助金融市政府在做規劃應該還沒有到度假程序但是我不知道現在接鎖謝市長他們現在進行怎麼樣我不是很清楚以當初林沛祥市長的規劃或現在林沛祥部長的規劃他有沒有保留過所謂的倉儲用地呢\n\n03:47.758 --> 03:49.941\n國道客運的塞車是很嚴重的事情尤其當基隆到台北端\n\n04:08.141 --> 04:37.664\n每天早上本席要每天早上6點15分出發才不會塞車從6點55到8點我相信所有學術研究都講過了那如果說你沒有把這一個一萬五千人好好的留在基隆上班那他們就會想盡辦法上國道上國道不管是國道一號還是國道三號直接天天的塞車到新北跟台北那那個時候你的客運你的捷運我們不知道十年之後是不是能夠順利順利完工\n\n04:38.024 --> 05:05.829\n我們也不知道客運是不是能夠找到那麼多司機甚至我們也不知道火車是否能夠能夠輔助我們現在運輸功能那你現在跟我講什麼都不知道的時候然後你貨櫃集散站要拆因為這是目前我看到2012月24號我曾經問過那時候陳建源陳建源院長跟我說是不會的但是現在部長您說我們現在狀況不知道對吧我是也透過都市計畫的檢討跟業者他有沒有要轉型啊\n\n05:06.429 --> 05:26.201\n我覺得這部分真的是要從需求面來看那如果需求面的話我一直聽到航商直接給我的反應他們想留在基隆港因為如果你搬到台北港你只有一個64號隨時被炸掉還是隨時一個地震觀音山64號被炸掉被地震之後所有北台灣的貨運會癱瘓\n\n05:29.932 --> 05:45.288\n我只是會說對吧因為說真的我以前在台北港任職過我想部長您也知道我的resume我以前在台北港任職過所以我知道64號多重要我也不希望64號出事但是只要64號出事之後台北港整個癱瘓對吧\n\n05:47.129 --> 06:12.074\n應該不要這麼說我覺得就有設施要去做空港聯營嗎空港聯營是不夠的所以說北溪在這邊特地強力建議麻煩部長跟交通部甚至中央政府要幫基隆人要幫辛苦的基隆人想多一點在地的13000到15000工作因為基隆商港基隆貨櫃港基隆貨櫃港而不是基隆郵輪港郵輪港到目前為止\n\n06:12.814 --> 06:29.848\n制造當地的就業機會不到2000我可以很負責任的講因為港口我敢講港口而這邊的話我知道港務公司現在還在做成效不佳的自營櫃場那是不是可以可憐一下說讓行商能夠繼續留在基隆呢\n\n06:30.562 --> 06:58.176\n我們也沒有趕航商耶沒有,航商會為了自己因為沒有後廠的原因部長這就是我們兩邊有點落差的地方航商會因為沒有後廠的原因自動跑到台北港他們不想去台北港因為台北港如果一個64號出問題所有貨運全部爛掉那基隆至少有兩條高速公路一條國一一條國三可以很順利的運送貨物我想那個基礎的交通網路我是覺得兩邊都完整\n\n06:59.116 --> 06:59.416\n謝謝林沛祥\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.639,"end":6.96,"text":"王部長部長"},{"start":15.492,"end":38.322,"text":"花東快速公路是您剛剛說過行政院的中長期計畫的大型交通建設那對於北北基地區來講另外一個極為重要的中長期大型交通建設就是基隆捷運請問一下您知道基隆捷運目前的進行路線嗎您是否知道我知道好那您知道基捷經過的路線有絕大部分都是所謂的內陸集散站"},{"start":39.326,"end":40.867,"text":"當基隆捷運正式進入基隆市區之前基隆港就被滅了"},{"start":61.047,"end":84.546,"text":"因為基隆港將會沒有所謂的後廠也就是沒有所謂的土地來去做多貨拆品櫃基隆跟高雄是不一樣的高雄在港區旁邊是有許多的土地的而如果你沒有這個土地來去做多貨拆品櫃的話我很難想像行商會願意把30%的貨櫃留在基隆做拆品櫃之後再把70%留到台北港去做多貨拆品櫃"},{"start":85.126,"end":98.982,"text":"我跟你們報告,縱然他經過然後有一些這個後跪的集散地,如果他還有他的功能,我不覺得,我並不覺得啦,他可以轉型。我只是說全部都把他變成……"},{"start":100.644,"end":120.95,"text":"我本席在院會質詢的時候我很擔心所以我那時候部長也在場本席直接問陳建仁院長賴清哲總統在去年12月24號講的要把五堵六堵七堵的所有的貨櫃集散地往台北港塞這件事是否是真的那個時候不好意思長官我們也請您備詢"},{"start":123.425,"end":147.17,"text":"我是覺得這個是按照這個所有的業者的需求這就是本席要講的第二句話部長我今天是做理性的討論我不是來罵人的可是這個事情對基隆市絕對重要的事情因為你可能會害的基隆市因此有更大有更大的財務危機跟經濟危機第二點想請問一下部長您既然對基隆港這麼瞭解你知道基隆港的在地就業機會有幾個嗎"},{"start":150.173,"end":176.664,"text":"數字我沒有數字我並沒有心情上台備訓我可以很負責的跟部長您報告是一萬三千個到一萬五千個換句話說有一萬三千個家庭跟一戶到一萬五千個家庭目前還在基隆港工作在全盛時期基隆港曾經到將近四萬人甚至四萬五千人所以基隆有很多外來人口是從1980年代1970年代開始的但是"},{"start":177.364,"end":204.646,"text":"目前我聽到之前本席在基隆市議會的時候一直聽到所謂的北五堵科技園區請問交通部知道這個事情嗎我知道因為那時候應該是林佑昌市長的時候他有一個計畫他想請問北五堵科技園區何時先進完成現在有報行政院嗎有核定過嗎因為這跟基隆捷運有絕對的關係基隆捷運直接從中間經過北五堵科技園區甚至很多徵收的土地都是因為北五堵科技園區所需做的是"},{"start":205.547,"end":226.474,"text":"現在好像當時有一個計畫是補助金融市政府在做規劃應該還沒有到度假程序但是我不知道現在接鎖謝市長他們現在進行怎麼樣我不是很清楚以當初林沛祥市長的規劃或現在林沛祥部長的規劃他有沒有保留過所謂的倉儲用地呢"},{"start":227.758,"end":229.941,"text":"國道客運的塞車是很嚴重的事情尤其當基隆到台北端"},{"start":248.141,"end":277.664,"text":"每天早上本席要每天早上6點15分出發才不會塞車從6點55到8點我相信所有學術研究都講過了那如果說你沒有把這一個一萬五千人好好的留在基隆上班那他們就會想盡辦法上國道上國道不管是國道一號還是國道三號直接天天的塞車到新北跟台北那那個時候你的客運你的捷運我們不知道十年之後是不是能夠順利順利完工"},{"start":278.024,"end":305.829,"text":"我們也不知道客運是不是能夠找到那麼多司機甚至我們也不知道火車是否能夠能夠輔助我們現在運輸功能那你現在跟我講什麼都不知道的時候然後你貨櫃集散站要拆因為這是目前我看到2012月24號我曾經問過那時候陳建源陳建源院長跟我說是不會的但是現在部長您說我們現在狀況不知道對吧我是也透過都市計畫的檢討跟業者他有沒有要轉型啊"},{"start":306.429,"end":326.201,"text":"我覺得這部分真的是要從需求面來看 那如果需求面的話我一直聽到航商直接給我的反應他們想留在基隆港因為如果你搬到台北港你只有一個64號隨時被炸掉還是隨時一個地震觀音山64號被炸掉被地震之後所有北台灣的貨運會癱瘓"},{"start":329.932,"end":345.288,"text":"我只是會說對吧因為說真的我以前在台北港任職過我想部長您也知道我的resume我以前在台北港任職過所以我知道64號多重要我也不希望64號出事但是只要64號出事之後台北港整個癱瘓對吧"},{"start":347.129,"end":372.074,"text":"應該不要這麼說我覺得就有設施要去做空港聯營嗎空港聯營是不夠的所以說北溪在這邊特地強力建議麻煩部長跟交通部甚至中央政府要幫基隆人要幫辛苦的基隆人想多一點在地的13000到15000工作因為基隆商港基隆貨櫃港基隆貨櫃港而不是基隆郵輪港郵輪港到目前為止"},{"start":372.814,"end":389.848,"text":"制造當地的就業機會不到2000我可以很負責任的講因為港口我敢講港口而這邊的話我知道港務公司現在還在做成效不佳的自營櫃場那是不是可以可憐一下說讓行商能夠繼續留在基隆呢"},{"start":390.562,"end":418.176,"text":"我們也沒有趕航商耶沒有,航商會為了自己因為沒有後廠的原因部長這就是我們兩邊有點落差的地方航商會因為沒有後廠的原因自動跑到台北港他們不想去台北港因為台北港如果一個64號出問題所有貨運全部爛掉那基隆至少有兩條高速公路一條國一一條國三可以很順利的運送貨物我想那個基礎的交通網路我是覺得兩邊都完整"},{"start":419.116,"end":419.416,"text":"謝謝林沛祥"}]}}}}