{"id":150430,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150430","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/f45bf982c29023ee8603c1e99ed4a0d08ac1d636ef3e2fe8f8ba9b0039caa7a63678eecdf53964765ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"邱議瑩","委員發言時間":"15:50:04 - 16:05:36","影片長度":"00:15:32","會議時間":"2024-03-26T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"第11屆第1會期第6次會議（事由：一、對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢。\n二、3月22日上午9時至10時為國是論壇時間。\n三、3月26日下午1時50分至2時30分為處理臨時提案時間。）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"立法院第11屆第1會期第6次會議","id":"院會-11-1-6","type":"院會","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":6},"date":"2024-03-26","duration":932,"end_time":"2024-03-26T16:05:36+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-26T15:50:04+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":369,"blocks":[["邱委員議瑩：（15時50分）謝謝主席，是不是請一下陳院長？"],["主席：再請陳院長備詢。"],["陳院長建仁：邱委員午安。"],["邱委員議瑩：院長午安。經過這一整天的詢答，院長辛苦了。"],["陳院長建仁：不會。"],["邱委員議瑩：剛剛質詢的王正旭委員，他是癌症治療專家……"],["陳院長建仁：是，很專家。"],["邱委員議瑩：很巧地，他所有的質詢內容都跟癌症的治療或者是新藥有關係。院長，您跟我都是癌症的病友，對不對？"],["陳院長建仁：是。"],["邱委員議瑩：所以我接下來要跟院長請教，我們要討論的這個議題，我相信院長您大概知道我要問什麼。談到全球的再生醫療，再生醫療法其實我們推動了很久，再生醫療的研究、生技醫療的研究是一條漫長的路，小英總統這樣說過，但是我覺得再生醫療雙法的推動更是一條漫長的路。","院長，我讓您看一下，這是全球再生醫療產業的現況，到2023年的第三季為止，全球已經有1,803項的再生醫療臨床試驗在進行中；所有的開發商，相較於2022年的1,457家，到2023年已經大幅增長了77%。這一頁是全球推動再生醫療的大事記，日本早在2013年就通過再生醫療的促進法，2014年通過了再生醫療法；美國在2016年通過21世紀醫療法，在2022年FDA發布了最新的「再生醫療標準認可計畫」；韓國也在2019年通過先進再生醫療跟生物製藥的安全支持法案。","院長，我請您再看一下，這是在2023年上市的再生醫療的產品。全世界各國，包括歐盟、日本、美國，大家一直紛紛地在研究所謂的再生醫療的產品，他們已經從自體細胞的治療不只進步到異體細胞的治療，甚至基因的治療反而是新上市的這些產品的大宗。","這是我追溯最早到2018年，小英總統在出席生技展的時候公開這樣說「生技醫療產品的研發是一條漫長的路，不過政府責無旁貸，我們希望能夠陪伴我們的企業迎接所有的挑戰。」包括總統在2022年，他每一年去參加生技展，每一年都會講要推動生技，要推動再生醫療，包括院長您在今年出席工商早餐會的時候也特別談到，希望生醫成為下一座護國神山，對不對？"],["陳院長建仁：對。"],["邱委員議瑩：好。院長，我讓您看一下，這是我們賴清德總統提出的健康臺灣的政見，當然也提到了精準醫療、再生醫療，甚至癌症的防治等等。這一頁是我們臺灣在推動再生醫療法的整個進程，2015年應該是臺灣最早接觸到再生醫療，這是因為八仙塵爆的時候，我們接受了日本捐贈的所謂的自體細胞層片來醫治燒傷的病人，所以這是臺灣最早接觸到所謂的自體細胞產品；2015年同年有一個癌友叫CASPER，他在國發會的平臺上發起連署癌症免疫療法的修法法案，短短9天之內5,000人附議達標，而我也是在2015年看到這個法案之後開始投入再生醫療、投入細胞免疫療法法案的研究；接下來一直到2018年，我們通過了特管辦法；2019年因為屆期不連續，我們沒有辦法通過再生醫療法；2021年生技醫藥產業發展條例的通過，納入了再生醫療、精準醫療、數位醫療，甚至我記得在2021年您還在中研院的時候，我也曾經去拜訪您，就教在再生醫療法案的推動上面我們應該注意的事項；很可惜到2023年還是沒有辦法通過。"],["陳院長建仁：屆期不續審的關係。"],["邱委員議瑩：院長，請您再看一下，目前臺灣雖然沒有通過再生醫療法，但是我們有2018年通過的特管辦法，這是到目前為止，衛福部核可的特管辦法所收治的案例。我不知道部長您有沒有去做過統計，這樣的一個特管辦法的審查，每一個案例的審查時間，我剛剛初步算了一下，每一個案例審查的時間大概要3個月到6個月不等，而且是 case by case的審查，這一家生技業者所做出來的產品，即使上一個案在某A醫院通過審查之後，他在B醫院要做的時候，它還是要重新送件再審查一次，平均3到6個月，我不知道有多少癌症的病人可以等這麼久的時間。","再生醫療法不過，臺灣很多的生技業者不管是在研發上面、在推動上面，甚至在跟國際合作上面，其實我們都會受到許多的限制。","院長，我請您再看一下這個統計，我們衛福部有要求要從事再生醫療的醫療人員、醫師人員必須接受這樣的教育訓練課程，可是您可以看到，從 107年也就是2018年有2,099人報名參加，一直到去年只剩下494人參加，那是因為大家不關心再生醫療嗎？不是，反而因為我們的法令沒有過，讓很多業者開始地下化，因為無法可管、無法可罰，所以你沒有辦法去取締它，你也沒有辦法去罰它，甚至你也沒有辦法好好地、認真地嚴格審查這一些廠商的細胞製程過程到底合不合法、到底合不合衛福部所有GMP的規定，對不對？所以您同意我的這個看法。","這個是我大概擷取了幾個再生醫療的發展，包括杜元坤教授做膝蓋軟骨細胞，應該是臺灣的首屈一指。"],["陳院長建仁：是。"],["邱委員議瑩：包括現在我們不只做細胞治療，我們連外泌體、沒有細胞的治療都已經在蓬勃地發展、推動，可是我不知道在推動這一部法案的過程裡頭，如果從我於2015年開始接觸，一直到現在2024年，將近快要10個年頭了，很久，真的很久。","這個大概是衛福部的再生醫療法版本，那我知道衛福部最近開始在辦說明會，在21日辦了一場，在28日也辦了一場，這個說明會很詭異，它沒有開放報名，它是採用邀請制，部長，您可不可以說明一下為什麼會是這樣處理？"],["薛部長瑞元：跟委員報告，目前再生醫療法是這樣子，從上一次在立法院就差了臨門一腳，然後屆期不續審，現在我們跟行政院這邊討論的結果是我們不會退到衛福部來，所以會在行政院那邊繼續做一個審查，再來就會送立法院。在這中間條文的部分並沒有太大的差異，只有在順序上面可能有一個調動，因為過去在批評這個再生醫療法的誤解的情形就是以為再生醫療不用人體試驗，但是這是錯的觀念，所有的再生醫療如果要變成常規化的話，都一定要經過人體試驗，除了在幾個條件之下的話，才可以不用等人體試驗完成。"],["邱委員議瑩：就是所謂的 conditional approval。"],["薛部長瑞元：對，就是這種情形，那因為這一個改變屬於比較小的，所以目前我們已經把新的調整過的這個版本送到行政院……"],["陳院長建仁：3月20日送到行政院。"],["薛部長瑞元：對，政委會再審查過一次，就會送到立法院了。"],["邱委員議瑩：我想聽一下院長的看法，因為本席大概是對再生醫療比較關心的委員之一……"],["陳院長建仁：是，也都大力推動。"],["邱委員議瑩：所以我其實很想知道行政院的態度，剛剛部長也講得很清楚，但是我還是想從院長的口中聽到，到底行政院對於推動這樣的一個醫療方案、對於推動臺灣的醫療進程，行政院有沒有信心？有沒有願意很努力的來跟社會大眾，甚至跟醫界、跟某些不瞭解的人來進行溝通？"],["陳院長建仁：對，在上個會期沒有通過就讓我很失望了，但是我一直請衛福部應該再加緊腳步，然後在整個新的會期趕快送出來，謝謝衛福部3月20日就送到行政院，我會請政委趕快加速審查以後，最起碼我相信在這一、兩個月的時間內，我們就送出行政院、送到大院來，當然我是很希望看到520之前能夠送出我們行政院。"],["邱委員議瑩：院長，我其實也很期待520之前能夠趕快通過，甚至不要等到520，我覺得越快通過越好啦！我真的覺得就是很多的癌症病患或者是很多臺灣的病友，殷切的期盼這樣一個新的療法能夠讓它合法上市，所以我相信包括立法院裡頭很多醫界的委員，包括王正旭委員，包括蘇巧慧委員等等，我們大家都願意持續努力來推動，趕快把這個再生醫療的雙法推動通過。","院長，我接下來要請教這個是比較時事題，因為漲電價，所以最近包括經濟部甚至包括行政院被批評的很多，這個是經濟部的圖卡，它說用電比較多的麵包店，你可以改選時間電價，1個月可以省1萬7,000，這個時間電價，經濟部或者是台電沒有告訴大家的是，你要用時間電價，你必須先去安裝智慧電表。院長，這您知道吧！"],["陳院長建仁：是，要不少時間。"],["邱委員議瑩：你要安裝智慧電表還沒那麼簡單，院長給你看一下，台電的網站上面告訴大家，智慧電表是逐年分批布建，你不能主動去申請，除非是用電大戶或者是你的住家有再生能源併網才可以，所以很多人現在也沒有辦法去申請智慧電表。我們叫麵包店用時間電價，他如果沒有智慧電表，也沒有所謂的時間電價可以申請，甚至很多人常常在半夜洗衣服，像我常常就會半夜洗衣服，後來才發現半夜洗衣服其實也沒有比較省錢，因為你沒有智慧電表。","智慧電表只有住家可以裝嗎？可能部長還要再上來，這個是我今天早上請衛福部幫我整理的資料，部立醫院裡頭有安裝智慧電表的還滿多的，但是也有很多醫院沒有安裝智慧電表，比如說新營醫院、恆春醫院、八里療養院、嘉南療養院、玉里醫院都沒有安裝智慧電表，這是醫院喔！我再給您看高雄市醫療院所裝置智慧電表的情況，高雄市的市立醫院、高醫大附設醫院，甚至國軍總醫院都沒有安裝智慧電表，所以他們根本也沒有辦法申請所謂的時間電價，也沒有辦法能夠有更多的節電措施。院長，這個就是我要說的，我們在講說電價漲了，對於醫療院所的負擔是沉重的，但是有沒有可能，衛福部你們先去盤點這些醫療院所，到底有哪些連智慧電表都沒裝？是不是能夠push他們，或者是我們責成台電、要求台電跨部會合作，讓智慧電表早日把所有的醫療院所全部普及，有沒有可能？"],["陳院長建仁：我想我們讓衛福部跟經濟部一起努力，這個盤點應該不是太困難，因為經濟部一定有data，然後醫院，衛福部這邊有醫院的名單，match一下大概就可以有了，我想請他們跨部會來做。"],["邱委員議瑩：當然我們在談到要不要補貼醫院或者是醫院要不要凍漲電費，我覺得安裝智慧電表這件事情就是第一步。"],["陳院長建仁：是。"],["邱委員議瑩：所以是不是能夠請衛福部也能夠加速，至少你先盤點這一塊好不好？"],["薛部長瑞元：好。"],["邱委員議瑩：因為我接下來剩下不到1分鐘的時間，我想就這最後的50秒，我還是要謝謝陳建仁院長，您帶領的團隊在這段時間以來，我相信對臺灣做了非常多的貢獻跟努力，我們還是要謝謝您，今天是最後一次對您的總質詢，我想也非常感謝您過去一段時間的努力，也希望未來不管陳院長您在哪一個崗位上，是不是也能夠一起繼續守護臺灣，不只守護臺灣的健康，也守護臺灣的經濟，守護臺灣的永續發展，好不好？"],["陳院長建仁：好。謝謝。"],["邱委員議瑩：謝謝，我們幾位委員特別準備了一束花要來送給陳建仁院長，表達我們對您的祝福跟感謝，謝謝。"],["陳院長建仁：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝邱議瑩委員的質詢。","接下來第17位洪委員申翰之質詢以書面提出，請行政院書面答復，並列入紀錄，刊登公報。"],["委員洪申翰書面質詢：","近期經濟部「彰濱工業區資源化處理中心BOT案」（下稱：晶鼎焚化爐）」的環評程序及公開說明會召開方式引發爭議。","依據《環境影響評估法》第7條第3項：「前項審查結論主管機關認不須進行第二階段環境影響評估並經許可者，開發單位應舉行公開之說明會」，然開發單位所舉辦之公開說明會，顯然有重大的程序瑕疵。","在今年3月14日上午10時召開的說明會，早在7點多時開發單位即安排上百名動員者至說明會場內坐滿座席，導致多數當地自救會的民眾甚至是民意代表無法進入會場內入座。","現場亦有多位立委、議員及代表在說明會現場，指出在地民眾無法進場表達意見的情況，對說明會的程序問題表達抗議，但開發單位完成不受理、也不處理，甚至強行宣布會議開始。","質詢問題一：","開發單位應舉行之公開說明會，目的是為讓民眾充分得知資訊並有完整表達意見的權利與空間。上述晶鼎焚化爐公開說明會，由開發單位動員上百名人士提早進場，亦不受理現場民眾提出的程序瑕疵問題，並在吵鬧、喧囂的過程中草草讀過說明簡報，請問院長及環境部，這符合環境部所認定公開說明會已舉辦完成的要件嗎？","3月14日該次會議召開，顯然不符合公開說明會應充分說明相關開發案之資訊要旨，亦未有開放民眾得表達意見的空間，更沒有取得與自救會間的共識，甚至加深矛盾與對立。本席認為，環境部應該依據說明會舉辦之要旨及規範，審酌過程中是否符合相關條件，在開發單位提供相關書面報告後加以審查。","除此之外，由於現場亦有許多民意代表、在地民眾及媒體，將現場之狀況以照片、影片及文字之方式加以紀錄，本席認為環境部在審酌該次公開說明會是否符合程序時，應參酌各方提供的現場狀況資訊，作為審查過程中參考之資料。","質詢問題二：","為更全面的瞭解3月14日「彰濱工業區資源化處理中心BOT案」開發單位舉辦之公開說明會是否符合說明會舉辦之程序及要件，環境部除參酌開發單位的書面報告外，是否會參酌其他參與者所記錄或拍攝之照片、影片及文字於審查過程中？","本席認為《環境影響評估法》立法規定應舉辦公開說明會之要旨，即是要求開發單位應充分與在地民眾溝通。","若此案業者蓄意動員群眾塞滿說明會場地，阻絕在地居民及自救會參與說明會，排除民意代表及在地居民之意見於說明會討論之外的作法，還能夠符合環評公開說明會之要件，恐導致未來開發單位皆以類似作法來操作，將使環評法規流於形式，也使得公開說明會失去舉辦的意義，並徒增地方對立、不滿及衝突。"],["主席：再接下來我們請今天登記第18號鄭委員正鈐質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":219,"meet_id":"院會-11-1-6","speakers":["韓國瑜","吳宗憲","廖偉翔","陳昭姿","林憶君","賴士葆","劉建國","吳春城","王世堅","李彥秀","謝龍介","黃捷","游顥","蘇清泉","李坤城","蘇巧慧","王正旭","邱議瑩","洪申翰","鄭正鈐","涂權吉","徐巧芯"],"page_start":133,"meetingDate":["2024-03-26"],"gazette_id":"1131401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1131401_00004","1131401_00005"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期第6次會議紀錄","content":"施政質詢\n對行政院院長提出施政方針及施政報告繼續質詢─ 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{\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 439.913, \"end\": 439.933, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 439.933, \"end\": 440.053, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"版\", \"start\": 440.053, \"end\": 440.194, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 440.194, \"end\": 440.214, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 468.922, \"end\": 474.231, \"text\": \"那我知道衛福部最近開始在辦說明會21號辦了一場28號也辦了一場這個說明會很詭異他沒有開放報名他是採用邀請制\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 468.922, \"end\": 469.062, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 469.062, \"end\": 469.182, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"知\", \"start\": 469.182, \"end\": 469.263, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"道\", \"start\": 469.263, \"end\": 469.563, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"衛\"}, {\"word\": \"福\", \"start\": 469.563, \"end\": 469.703, \"score\": 0.863}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 469.703, \"end\": 469.944, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"最\", \"start\": 469.944, \"end\": 470.144, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"近\", \"start\": 470.144, 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483.621, \"end\": 508.978, \"text\": \"部長您可不可以說明一下為什麼會是這樣處理?根據委員報告目前再生醫療法現在是這樣子從上一次在立法院就插了林門一腳然後屆時不續審所以現在我們是跟行政院這邊討論的結果是我們不會退到衛福部來\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 483.621, \"end\": 483.781, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"您\", \"start\": 483.781, \"end\": 483.921, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 483.921, \"end\": 484.041, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 484.041, \"end\": 484.161, \"score\": 0.834}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 484.161, \"end\": 484.322, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 484.322, \"end\": 484.582, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"明\", \"start\": 484.582, \"end\": 484.702, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 484.702, \"end\": 484.822, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 484.822, \"end\": 485.762, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 485.762, \"end\": 486.123, \"score\": 0.847}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, 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505.235, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 505.235, \"end\": 506.216, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 506.216, \"end\": 506.356, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"邊\"}, {\"word\": \"討\"}, {\"word\": \"論\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 506.356, \"end\": 506.716, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"結\"}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 506.716, \"end\": 506.876, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 506.876, \"end\": 507.076, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 507.076, \"end\": 507.437, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 507.437, \"end\": 507.797, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"退\", \"start\": 507.797, \"end\": 508.177, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 508.177, \"end\": 508.717, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"衛\"}, {\"word\": \"福\", \"start\": 508.717, \"end\": 508.958, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 508.958, \"end\": 508.978, \"score\": 0.001}, {\"word\": \"來\"}]}, {\"start\": 510.359, \"end\": 534.309, \"text\": \"所以會在行政院那邊繼續做一個審查就會送立法院這中間條文的部分並沒有太大的差異只有這個順序上面可能有一個調動因為過去在批評這個再生醫療法的誤解的情形就是以為是再生醫療不用人體試驗\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 510.359, \"end\": 510.619, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 510.619, \"end\": 511.5, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 511.5, \"end\": 511.8, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 511.8, \"end\": 512.06, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 512.06, \"end\": 512.18, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 512.18, \"end\": 512.32, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 512.32, \"end\": 513.48, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"邊\"}, {\"word\": \"繼\"}, {\"word\": \"續\"}, {\"word\": \"做\", \"start\": 513.48, \"end\": 513.66, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 513.66, \"end\": 514.241, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"審\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 514.241, \"end\": 514.481, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 514.481, \"end\": 514.761, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"送\", \"start\": 514.761, \"end\": 515.001, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 515.001, \"end\": 515.201, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 515.201, \"end\": 515.401, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 515.401, \"end\": 517.442, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 517.442, \"end\": 518.682, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"間\"}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"文\", \"start\": 518.682, \"end\": 518.822, \"score\": 0.858}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 518.822, \"end\": 519.002, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 519.002, \"end\": 519.123, \"score\": 0.847}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 519.123, \"end\": 519.483, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"並\"}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 519.483, \"end\": 519.603, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 519.603, \"end\": 519.823, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"太\", \"start\": 519.823, \"end\": 520.123, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 520.123, \"end\": 520.303, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 520.303, \"end\": 520.483, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"差\", \"start\": 520.483, \"end\": 520.943, \"score\": 0.953}, {\"word\": \"異\"}, {\"word\": \"只\", \"start\": 520.943, \"end\": 521.103, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 521.103, \"end\": 521.944, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"順\"}, {\"word\": \"序\", \"start\": 521.944, \"end\": 522.124, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 522.124, \"end\": 522.284, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 522.284, \"end\": 522.484, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 522.484, \"end\": 522.624, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 522.624, \"end\": 523.504, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 523.504, \"end\": 523.644, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 523.644, \"end\": 526.425, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 526.425, \"end\": 527.006, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 527.006, \"end\": 527.266, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 527.266, \"end\": 527.806, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"批\", \"start\": 527.806, \"end\": 528.706, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"評\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 528.706, \"end\": 528.866, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"生\", \"start\": 528.866, \"end\": 529.427, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"醫\"}, {\"word\": \"療\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 529.427, \"end\": 530.027, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 530.027, \"end\": 530.547, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"誤\"}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 530.547, \"end\": 530.767, \"score\": 0.98}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 530.767, \"end\": 530.907, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 530.907, \"end\": 531.147, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"形\", \"start\": 531.147, \"end\": 531.808, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 531.808, \"end\": 531.968, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 531.968, \"end\": 532.188, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 532.188, \"end\": 532.628, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 532.628, \"end\": 532.908, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 532.908, \"end\": 533.148, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"生\", \"start\": 533.148, \"end\": 533.928, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"醫\"}, {\"word\": \"療\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 533.928, \"end\": 534.048, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 534.048, \"end\": 534.289, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 534.289, \"end\": 534.309, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"體\"}, {\"word\": \"試\"}, {\"word\": \"驗\"}]}, {\"start\": 535.97, \"end\": 550.107, \"text\": \"但是這是錯的觀念所謂的再生醫療如果要變成常規化的話都一定要經過人體試驗除了有幾個條件之下的話才可以不用等人體試驗完成對就是這種情形\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 535.97, \"end\": 536.15, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 536.15, \"end\": 536.731, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 536.731, \"end\": 537.151, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"錯\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 537.151, \"end\": 537.492, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"觀\"}, {\"word\": \"念\", \"start\": 537.492, \"end\": 537.832, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 537.832, \"end\": 538.113, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"謂\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 538.113, \"end\": 538.273, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 538.273, \"end\": 538.453, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"生\", \"start\": 538.453, \"end\": 538.974, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"醫\"}, {\"word\": \"療\"}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 538.974, \"end\": 539.154, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 539.154, \"end\": 539.254, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 539.254, \"end\": 539.594, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"變\"}, {\"word\": \"成\", \"start\": 539.594, \"end\": 539.775, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"常\", \"start\": 539.775, \"end\": 540.195, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"規\"}, {\"word\": \"化\", \"start\": 540.195, \"end\": 540.415, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 540.415, \"end\": 540.876, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"話\"}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 540.876, \"end\": 541.176, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 541.176, \"end\": 541.377, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"定\", \"start\": 541.377, \"end\": 541.517, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 541.517, \"end\": 542.178, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 542.178, \"end\": 543.379, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"體\"}, {\"word\": \"試\"}, {\"word\": \"驗\"}, {\"word\": \"除\", \"start\": 543.379, \"end\": 543.579, \"score\": 0.995}, 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\"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"福\", \"start\": 907.916, \"end\": 908.356, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 908.356, \"end\": 908.536, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"感\", \"start\": 908.536, \"end\": 908.556, \"score\": 0.222}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:05,258 --> 00:00:08,762\n謝謝主席。我是不是請一下陳院長。再請陳院長備詢。邱永安\n\n2\n00:00:15,816 --> 00:00:43,421\n院長午安,院長辛苦了,經過這一整天的這個詢答。那剛剛王振旭委員他是癌症治療專家。是,很專家。那很巧的,他提到的所有的質詢的內容都跟癌症的治療或者是新藥有關係。院長您跟我都是癌症的病友。是。所以我接下來要跟院長請教,我們要討論的這個議題,我相信院長您大概知道我要問什麼。\n\n3\n00:00:46,411 --> 00:01:07,491\n全球再生醫療法其實我們推動了很久再生醫療的研究生技醫療的研究是一條漫長的路小英總統這樣說過但是我覺得再生醫療雙法的推動更是一條漫長的路院長我讓您看一下這個是全球再生醫療產業的現況\n\n4\n00:01:09,793 --> 00:01:16,579\n到2023年的第三季為止,全球已經有1803項的再生醫療臨床試驗在進行中。所有的這個開發商相較於2022年的1457家,到2023年已經大幅增長了77%。\n\n5\n00:01:31,355 --> 00:01:54,163\n這個是全球推動再生醫療的大事跡日本早在2013年就通過再生醫療的促進法2014年通過了再生醫療法美國在2016年通過21世紀醫療法在2022年FDA發布了最新的再生醫療標準認可計畫\n\n6\n00:01:57,625 --> 00:02:04,195\n韓國也在2019年通過先進再生醫療跟生物製藥的安全支持法案\n\n7\n00:02:06,018 --> 00:02:30,672\n院長我請您再看一下這個是在2023年上市的再生醫療的產品全世界各國包括歐盟、日本、美國大家一直紛紛的在研究所謂的再生醫療的產品他們已經從自體細胞的治療不只進步到液體細胞的治療甚至基因的治療反而是新上市的這些產品的大宗\n\n8\n00:02:32,519 --> 00:02:50,788\n這個呢我追溯到最早2018年小英總統在出席生技展的時候公開的這樣說生技醫療產品的研發是一條漫長的路不過政府責無旁貸我們希望能夠陪伴我們的企業迎接所有的挑戰那包括\n\n9\n00:02:54,353 --> 00:03:10,812\n總統在2022年他每一年去參加生技展每一年都會講要推動生技要推動再生醫療包括院長您在今年出席工商早餐會的時候也特別談到希望生醫成為下一座的護國神山對不對\n\n10\n00:03:12,898 --> 00:03:23,410\n院長我讓您看一下這個當然是我們賴清德總統的推動的健康台灣的政見當然也提到了精準醫療再生醫療甚至癌症的防治等等\n\n11\n00:03:25,750 --> 00:03:49,691\n這個是我們在臺灣對於再生醫療法推動的整個進程。2015年應該是臺灣最早接觸到再生醫療這個是因為八仙晨報的時候我們接受了日本捐贈的所謂的細胞自體細胞成片來醫治燒傷的病人所以這個是臺灣最早接觸到所謂的自體細胞產品2015年同年\n\n12\n00:03:50,552 --> 00:04:14,935\n有一個癌友叫Casper他在國發會的平台裡頭發起連署癌症免疫療法的修法的法案短短9天之內5000人復疫達標而我也是在2015年看到這個法案之後開始投入再生醫療投入細胞免疫療法的這樣的一個法案的研究當然一直到2018年我們通過了特管辦法\n\n13\n00:04:15,996 --> 00:04:16,636\n院長,請再看一下。\n\n14\n00:04:45,366 --> 00:05:07,925\n這個是目前臺灣雖然沒有通過再生醫療法但是我們有特管辦法18年通過的特管辦法這個是到目前為止衛福部合可的特管辦法所收治的案例我不知道部長您大概有沒有去做過統計這樣的一個特管辦法的審查每一個案例的審查時間\n\n15\n00:05:09,667 --> 00:05:37,250\n我初步剛剛算了一下每一個案例審查的時間大概要3個月到6個月不等而且casebycase的審查這一家生技業者他所做出來的產品即使上一個案在某A醫院通過審查之後他在B醫院要做的時候他還是要重新送件再審查一次平均3到6個月我不知道有多少癌症的病人可以等這麼久的時間\n\n16\n00:05:40,984 --> 00:05:56,497\n在生意療法不過臺灣很多的生技業者在不管是在研發上面在推動上面甚至在跟國際合作的上面其實我們都會受到許多的限制院長我請您再看一下這個統計\n\n17\n00:05:59,411 --> 00:06:21,424\n我們衛福部有要求要從事再生醫療的醫療人員醫師人員必須接受這樣的一個教育訓練的課程可是您可以看到從107年也就是2018年的2099人報名參加一直到去年只剩下494人參加\n\n18\n00:06:25,532 --> 00:06:53,900\n是因為大家關心再生醫療嗎?不是反而因為我們的法令沒有過讓很多業者開始地下化因為無法可管無法可罰所以你沒有辦法去取締它你也沒有辦法去罰它甚至你也沒有辦法好好的認真的嚴格審查這些廠商的細胞製成的過程\n\n19\n00:06:55,060 --> 00:07:17,823\n到底合不合法?到底合不合衛福部所有的GMP的規定?對不對?所以您同意我的這個看法。這個是我大概擷取了幾個再生醫療的發展,包括杜元坤教授做膝蓋軟骨細胞,應該是台灣的首屈一指。包括現在我們不只\n\n20\n00:07:19,093 --> 00:07:20,214\n再生醫療法這個是大概是衛福部的版本\n\n21\n00:07:48,922 --> 00:07:54,231\n那我知道衛福部最近開始在辦說明會21號辦了一場28號也辦了一場這個說明會很詭異他沒有開放報名他是採用邀請制\n\n22\n00:08:03,621 --> 00:08:28,978\n部長您可不可以說明一下為什麼會是這樣處理?根據委員報告目前再生醫療法現在是這樣子從上一次在立法院就插了林門一腳然後屆時不續審所以現在我們是跟行政院這邊討論的結果是我們不會退到衛福部來\n\n23\n00:08:30,359 --> 00:08:54,309\n所以會在行政院那邊繼續做一個審查就會送立法院這中間條文的部分並沒有太大的差異只有這個順序上面可能有一個調動因為過去在批評這個再生醫療法的誤解的情形就是以為是再生醫療不用人體試驗\n\n24\n00:08:55,970 --> 00:09:10,107\n但是這是錯的觀念所謂的再生醫療如果要變成常規化的話都一定要經過人體試驗除了有幾個條件之下的話才可以不用等人體試驗完成對就是這種情形\n\n25\n00:09:13,231 --> 00:09:36,414\n那這些因為這一個改變屬於說比較小的所以目前我們已經把新的調整過了這個版本送到行政院那那個政委會再審查過一次就會送到立法院我想聽一下院長的看法因為我們本席大概是對再生醫療\n\n26\n00:09:39,670 --> 00:10:02,826\n所以我其實很想知道就行政院的態度剛剛部長也講得很清楚但是我還是想從院長的口中裡頭去聽到到底行政院對於推動這樣的一個醫療方案對於推動台灣的醫療進程行政院有沒有信心有沒有願意很努力的來跟社會大眾甚至跟醫界跟某些不了解的人來進行溝通\n\n27\n00:10:03,486 --> 00:10:25,215\n對,在上個會期沒有通過就讓我很失望了但是我一直請衛福部應該再加緊然後在這個新的會期趕快送出來謝謝衛福部3月20日就送到行政院我會請政委趕快的再加速審查以後最起碼我相信在這一兩個月的時間內我們就送出\n\n28\n00:10:33,923 --> 00:10:44,713\n我其實也很期待520之前能夠趕快通過甚至不要等到520我覺得越快通過越好啦我真的覺得就是說很多的癌症病患或者是說很多的台灣的病友\n\n29\n00:10:45,213 --> 00:10:45,913\n院長,那我接下來要請教這個是比較實事題。\n\n30\n00:11:08,787 --> 00:11:34,585\n這個呢因為漲電價所以最近包括經濟部甚至包括行政院被批評的很多這個是經濟部的圖卡他說用電比較多的麵包店呢你可以改選時間電價一個月可以省一萬七那這個時間電價經濟部或者是台電沒有告訴大家的是你要用時間電價你必須先去安裝智慧電表院長這您知道吧\n\n31\n00:11:35,746 --> 00:11:57,385\n你要安裝智慧電表還沒那麼簡單來院長給你看一下齁臺電的網站上面告訴大家智慧電表是逐年分批部件你不能主動去申請除非是用電大戶或者是你的住家有再生能源併網才可以所以很多人現在\n\n32\n00:12:22,258 --> 00:12:34,994\n這個可能部長您還要再上來這個是我今天早上請衛福部幫我整理了一下部立醫院裡頭有安裝智慧電表的\n\n33\n00:12:37,650 --> 00:12:59,480\n但是也有很多的醫院是沒有安裝智慧電表比如說新營醫院、恆春醫院、巴黎療養院、嘉南療養院、玉里醫院這個都沒有安裝智慧電表這是醫院喔來我再給您看這是高雄市的醫療院所裝置智慧電表的情況\n\n34\n00:13:01,124 --> 00:13:18,840\n高雄市的市立醫院、高醫大輔社醫院甚至國軍總醫院都沒有安裝智慧電表所以他們根本也沒有辦法申請所謂的時間電價也沒有辦法能夠更有更多的節電措施\n\n35\n00:13:19,821 --> 00:13:34,802\n院長這個就是我要說的我們在講說電價漲了對於醫療院所的負擔是沉重的但是有沒有可能衛福部你們先去盤點這些醫療院所到底有哪些連智慧電表都沒裝\n\n36\n00:13:36,553 --> 00:14:04,435\n是不是能夠push他們或者是我們責成臺電要求臺電跨部會合作讓智慧電表早日把所有的醫療院所全部普及有沒有可能我想我們讓衛福部跟經濟部一起努力這個應該盤點不是太困難因為經濟部一定有data然後衛福部這邊有醫院的名單match一下大概就可以有了我想請他們跨部會來做\n\n37\n00:14:05,285 --> 00:14:16,438\n當然我們在談到要不要補貼醫院或者是醫院要不要動漲電費我覺得安裝智慧電表這件事情就是第一步所以是不是能夠請衛福部也能夠加速\n\n38\n00:14:17,719 --> 00:14:38,776\n至少你先盤點這一塊好不好?好那因為我接下來剩下不到一分鐘的時間我想就這最後的50秒我還是要謝謝陳建仁院長您帶領的團隊在這一段時間以來我相信對台灣做了非常多的貢獻跟努力我們還是要謝謝您\n\n39\n00:14:39,697 --> 00:15:08,556\n那今天是最後一次對您的總質詢那我想也非常感謝您過去一段時間的努力也希望未來不管陳院長您在哪一個崗位上是不是也能夠一起繼續守護台灣不只守護台灣的健康也守護台灣的經濟守護台灣的永續發展好不好謝謝那我們幾位委員呢特別也準備了一束花要來送給陳建仁院長表達我們對您的祝福跟感謝謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5258\t8762\t謝謝主席。我是不是請一下陳院長。再請陳院長備詢。邱永安\n15816\t43421\t院長午安,院長辛苦了,經過這一整天的這個詢答。那剛剛王振旭委員他是癌症治療專家。是,很專家。那很巧的,他提到的所有的質詢的內容都跟癌症的治療或者是新藥有關係。院長您跟我都是癌症的病友。是。所以我接下來要跟院長請教,我們要討論的這個議題,我相信院長您大概知道我要問什麼。\n46411\t67491\t全球再生醫療法其實我們推動了很久再生醫療的研究生技醫療的研究是一條漫長的路小英總統這樣說過但是我覺得再生醫療雙法的推動更是一條漫長的路院長我讓您看一下這個是全球再生醫療產業的現況\n69793\t76579\t到2023年的第三季為止,全球已經有1803項的再生醫療臨床試驗在進行中。所有的這個開發商相較於2022年的1457家,到2023年已經大幅增長了77%。\n91355\t114163\t這個是全球推動再生醫療的大事跡日本早在2013年就通過再生醫療的促進法2014年通過了再生醫療法美國在2016年通過21世紀醫療法在2022年FDA發布了最新的再生醫療標準認可計畫\n117625\t124195\t韓國也在2019年通過先進再生醫療跟生物製藥的安全支持法案\n126018\t150672\t院長我請您再看一下這個是在2023年上市的再生醫療的產品全世界各國包括歐盟、日本、美國大家一直紛紛的在研究所謂的再生醫療的產品他們已經從自體細胞的治療不只進步到液體細胞的治療甚至基因的治療反而是新上市的這些產品的大宗\n152519\t170788\t這個呢我追溯到最早2018年小英總統在出席生技展的時候公開的這樣說生技醫療產品的研發是一條漫長的路不過政府責無旁貸我們希望能夠陪伴我們的企業迎接所有的挑戰那包括\n174353\t190812\t總統在2022年他每一年去參加生技展每一年都會講要推動生技要推動再生醫療包括院長您在今年出席工商早餐會的時候也特別談到希望生醫成為下一座的護國神山對不對\n192898\t203410\t院長我讓您看一下這個當然是我們賴清德總統的推動的健康台灣的政見當然也提到了精準醫療再生醫療甚至癌症的防治等等\n205750\t229691\t這個是我們在臺灣對於再生醫療法推動的整個進程。2015年應該是臺灣最早接觸到再生醫療這個是因為八仙晨報的時候我們接受了日本捐贈的所謂的細胞自體細胞成片來醫治燒傷的病人所以這個是臺灣最早接觸到所謂的自體細胞產品2015年同年\n230552\t254935\t有一個癌友叫Casper他在國發會的平台裡頭發起連署癌症免疫療法的修法的法案短短9天之內5000人復疫達標而我也是在2015年看到這個法案之後開始投入再生醫療投入細胞免疫療法的這樣的一個法案的研究當然一直到2018年我們通過了特管辦法\n255996\t256636\t院長,請再看一下。\n285366\t307925\t這個是目前臺灣雖然沒有通過再生醫療法但是我們有特管辦法18年通過的特管辦法這個是到目前為止衛福部合可的特管辦法所收治的案例我不知道部長您大概有沒有去做過統計這樣的一個特管辦法的審查每一個案例的審查時間\n309667\t337250\t我初步剛剛算了一下每一個案例審查的時間大概要3個月到6個月不等而且case by case的審查這一家生技業者他所做出來的產品即使上一個案在某A醫院通過審查之後他在B醫院要做的時候他還是要重新送件再審查一次平均3到6個月我不知道有多少癌症的病人可以等這麼久的時間\n340984\t356497\t在生意療法不過臺灣很多的生技業者在不管是在研發上面在推動上面甚至在跟國際合作的上面其實我們都會受到許多的限制院長我請您再看一下這個統計\n359411\t381424\t我們衛福部有要求要從事再生醫療的醫療人員醫師人員必須接受這樣的一個教育訓練的課程可是您可以看到從107年也就是2018年的2099人報名參加一直到去年只剩下494人參加\n385532\t413900\t是因為大家關心再生醫療嗎?不是反而因為我們的法令沒有過讓很多業者開始地下化因為無法可管無法可罰所以你沒有辦法去取締它你也沒有辦法去罰它甚至你也沒有辦法好好的認真的嚴格審查這些廠商的細胞製成的過程\n415060\t437823\t到底合不合法?到底合不合衛福部所有的GMP的規定?對不對?所以您同意我的這個看法。這個是我大概擷取了幾個再生醫療的發展,包括杜元坤教授做膝蓋軟骨細胞,應該是台灣的首屈一指。包括現在我們不只\n439093\t440214\t再生醫療法這個是大概是衛福部的版本\n468922\t474231\t那我知道衛福部最近開始在辦說明會21號辦了一場28號也辦了一場這個說明會很詭異他沒有開放報名他是採用邀請制\n483621\t508978\t部長您可不可以說明一下為什麼會是這樣處理?根據委員報告目前再生醫療法現在是這樣子從上一次在立法院就插了林門一腳然後屆時不續審所以現在我們是跟行政院這邊討論的結果是我們不會退到衛福部來\n510359\t534309\t所以會在行政院那邊繼續做一個審查就會送立法院這中間條文的部分並沒有太大的差異只有這個順序上面可能有一個調動因為過去在批評這個再生醫療法的誤解的情形就是以為是再生醫療不用人體試驗\n535970\t550107\t但是這是錯的觀念所謂的再生醫療如果要變成常規化的話都一定要經過人體試驗除了有幾個條件之下的話才可以不用等人體試驗完成對就是這種情形\n553231\t576414\t那這些因為這一個改變屬於說比較小的所以目前我們已經把新的調整過了這個版本送到行政院那那個政委會再審查過一次就會送到立法院我想聽一下院長的看法因為我們本席大概是對再生醫療\n579670\t602826\t所以我其實很想知道就行政院的態度剛剛部長也講得很清楚但是我還是想從院長的口中裡頭去聽到到底行政院對於推動這樣的一個醫療方案對於推動台灣的醫療進程行政院有沒有信心有沒有願意很努力的來跟社會大眾甚至跟醫界跟某些不了解的人來進行溝通\n603486\t625215\t對,在上個會期沒有通過就讓我很失望了但是我一直請衛福部應該再加緊然後在這個新的會期趕快送出來謝謝衛福部3月20日就送到行政院我會請政委趕快的再加速審查以後最起碼我相信在這一兩個月的時間內我們就送出\n633923\t644713\t我其實也很期待520之前能夠趕快通過甚至不要等到520我覺得越快通過越好啦我真的覺得就是說很多的癌症病患或者是說很多的台灣的病友\n645213\t645913\t院長,那我接下來要請教這個是比較實事題。\n668787\t694585\t這個呢因為漲電價所以最近包括經濟部甚至包括行政院被批評的很多這個是經濟部的圖卡他說用電比較多的麵包店呢你可以改選時間電價一個月可以省一萬七那這個時間電價經濟部或者是台電沒有告訴大家的是你要用時間電價你必須先去安裝智慧電表院長這您知道吧\n695746\t717385\t你要安裝智慧電表還沒那麼簡單來院長給你看一下齁臺電的網站上面告訴大家智慧電表是逐年分批部件你不能主動去申請除非是用電大戶或者是你的住家有再生能源併網才可以所以很多人現在\n718166\t741015\t來﹖\n742258\t754994\t這個可能部長您還要再上來這個是我今天早上請衛福部幫我整理了一下部立醫院裡頭有安裝智慧電表的\n757650\t779480\t但是也有很多的醫院是沒有安裝智慧電表比如說新營醫院、恆春醫院、巴黎療養院、嘉南療養院、玉里醫院這個都沒有安裝智慧電表這是醫院喔來我再給您看這是高雄市的醫療院所裝置智慧電表的情況\n781124\t798840\t高雄市的市立醫院、高醫大輔社醫院甚至國軍總醫院都沒有安裝智慧電表所以他們根本也沒有辦法申請所謂的時間電價也沒有辦法能夠更有更多的節電措施\n799821\t814802\t院長這個就是我要說的我們在講說電價漲了對於醫療院所的負擔是沉重的但是有沒有可能衛福部你們先去盤點這些醫療院所到底有哪些連智慧電表都沒裝\n816553\t844435\t是不是能夠push他們或者是我們責成臺電要求臺電跨部會合作讓智慧電表早日把所有的醫療院所全部普及有沒有可能我想我們讓衛福部跟經濟部一起努力這個應該盤點不是太困難因為經濟部一定有data然後衛福部這邊有醫院的名單match一下大概就可以有了我想請他們跨部會來做\n845285\t856438\t當然我們在談到要不要補貼醫院或者是醫院要不要動漲電費我覺得安裝智慧電表這件事情就是第一步所以是不是能夠請衛福部也能夠加速\n857719\t878776\t至少你先盤點這一塊好不好?好那因為我接下來剩下不到一分鐘的時間我想就這最後的50秒我還是要謝謝陳建仁院長您帶領的團隊在這一段時間以來我相信對台灣做了非常多的貢獻跟努力我們還是要謝謝您\n879697\t908556\t那今天是最後一次對您的總質詢那我想也非常感謝您過去一段時間的努力也希望未來不管陳院長您在哪一個崗位上是不是也能夠一起繼續守護台灣不只守護台灣的健康也守護台灣的經濟守護台灣的永續發展好不好謝謝那我們幾位委員呢特別也準備了一束花要來送給陳建仁院長表達我們對您的祝福跟感謝謝謝\n909497\t910196\t謝謝。\n","txt":"謝謝主席。我是不是請一下陳院長。再請陳院長備詢。邱永安\n院長午安,院長辛苦了,經過這一整天的這個詢答。那剛剛王振旭委員他是癌症治療專家。是,很專家。那很巧的,他提到的所有的質詢的內容都跟癌症的治療或者是新藥有關係。院長您跟我都是癌症的病友。是。所以我接下來要跟院長請教,我們要討論的這個議題,我相信院長您大概知道我要問什麼。\n全球再生醫療法其實我們推動了很久再生醫療的研究生技醫療的研究是一條漫長的路小英總統這樣說過但是我覺得再生醫療雙法的推動更是一條漫長的路院長我讓您看一下這個是全球再生醫療產業的現況\n到2023年的第三季為止,全球已經有1803項的再生醫療臨床試驗在進行中。所有的這個開發商相較於2022年的1457家,到2023年已經大幅增長了77%。\n這個是全球推動再生醫療的大事跡日本早在2013年就通過再生醫療的促進法2014年通過了再生醫療法美國在2016年通過21世紀醫療法在2022年FDA發布了最新的再生醫療標準認可計畫\n韓國也在2019年通過先進再生醫療跟生物製藥的安全支持法案\n院長我請您再看一下這個是在2023年上市的再生醫療的產品全世界各國包括歐盟、日本、美國大家一直紛紛的在研究所謂的再生醫療的產品他們已經從自體細胞的治療不只進步到液體細胞的治療甚至基因的治療反而是新上市的這些產品的大宗\n這個呢我追溯到最早2018年小英總統在出席生技展的時候公開的這樣說生技醫療產品的研發是一條漫長的路不過政府責無旁貸我們希望能夠陪伴我們的企業迎接所有的挑戰那包括\n總統在2022年他每一年去參加生技展每一年都會講要推動生技要推動再生醫療包括院長您在今年出席工商早餐會的時候也特別談到希望生醫成為下一座的護國神山對不對\n院長我讓您看一下這個當然是我們賴清德總統的推動的健康台灣的政見當然也提到了精準醫療再生醫療甚至癌症的防治等等\n這個是我們在臺灣對於再生醫療法推動的整個進程。2015年應該是臺灣最早接觸到再生醫療這個是因為八仙晨報的時候我們接受了日本捐贈的所謂的細胞自體細胞成片來醫治燒傷的病人所以這個是臺灣最早接觸到所謂的自體細胞產品2015年同年\n有一個癌友叫Casper他在國發會的平台裡頭發起連署癌症免疫療法的修法的法案短短9天之內5000人復疫達標而我也是在2015年看到這個法案之後開始投入再生醫療投入細胞免疫療法的這樣的一個法案的研究當然一直到2018年我們通過了特管辦法\n院長,請再看一下。\n這個是目前臺灣雖然沒有通過再生醫療法但是我們有特管辦法18年通過的特管辦法這個是到目前為止衛福部合可的特管辦法所收治的案例我不知道部長您大概有沒有去做過統計這樣的一個特管辦法的審查每一個案例的審查時間\n我初步剛剛算了一下每一個案例審查的時間大概要3個月到6個月不等而且case by case的審查這一家生技業者他所做出來的產品即使上一個案在某A醫院通過審查之後他在B醫院要做的時候他還是要重新送件再審查一次平均3到6個月我不知道有多少癌症的病人可以等這麼久的時間\n在生意療法不過臺灣很多的生技業者在不管是在研發上面在推動上面甚至在跟國際合作的上面其實我們都會受到許多的限制院長我請您再看一下這個統計\n我們衛福部有要求要從事再生醫療的醫療人員醫師人員必須接受這樣的一個教育訓練的課程可是您可以看到從107年也就是2018年的2099人報名參加一直到去年只剩下494人參加\n是因為大家關心再生醫療嗎?不是反而因為我們的法令沒有過讓很多業者開始地下化因為無法可管無法可罰所以你沒有辦法去取締它你也沒有辦法去罰它甚至你也沒有辦法好好的認真的嚴格審查這些廠商的細胞製成的過程\n到底合不合法?到底合不合衛福部所有的GMP的規定?對不對?所以您同意我的這個看法。這個是我大概擷取了幾個再生醫療的發展,包括杜元坤教授做膝蓋軟骨細胞,應該是台灣的首屈一指。包括現在我們不只\n再生醫療法這個是大概是衛福部的版本\n那我知道衛福部最近開始在辦說明會21號辦了一場28號也辦了一場這個說明會很詭異他沒有開放報名他是採用邀請制\n部長您可不可以說明一下為什麼會是這樣處理?根據委員報告目前再生醫療法現在是這樣子從上一次在立法院就插了林門一腳然後屆時不續審所以現在我們是跟行政院這邊討論的結果是我們不會退到衛福部來\n所以會在行政院那邊繼續做一個審查就會送立法院這中間條文的部分並沒有太大的差異只有這個順序上面可能有一個調動因為過去在批評這個再生醫療法的誤解的情形就是以為是再生醫療不用人體試驗\n但是這是錯的觀念所謂的再生醫療如果要變成常規化的話都一定要經過人體試驗除了有幾個條件之下的話才可以不用等人體試驗完成對就是這種情形\n那這些因為這一個改變屬於說比較小的所以目前我們已經把新的調整過了這個版本送到行政院那那個政委會再審查過一次就會送到立法院我想聽一下院長的看法因為我們本席大概是對再生醫療\n所以我其實很想知道就行政院的態度剛剛部長也講得很清楚但是我還是想從院長的口中裡頭去聽到到底行政院對於推動這樣的一個醫療方案對於推動台灣的醫療進程行政院有沒有信心有沒有願意很努力的來跟社會大眾甚至跟醫界跟某些不了解的人來進行溝通\n對,在上個會期沒有通過就讓我很失望了但是我一直請衛福部應該再加緊然後在這個新的會期趕快送出來謝謝衛福部3月20日就送到行政院我會請政委趕快的再加速審查以後最起碼我相信在這一兩個月的時間內我們就送出\n我其實也很期待520之前能夠趕快通過甚至不要等到520我覺得越快通過越好啦我真的覺得就是說很多的癌症病患或者是說很多的台灣的病友\n院長,那我接下來要請教這個是比較實事題。\n這個呢因為漲電價所以最近包括經濟部甚至包括行政院被批評的很多這個是經濟部的圖卡他說用電比較多的麵包店呢你可以改選時間電價一個月可以省一萬七那這個時間電價經濟部或者是台電沒有告訴大家的是你要用時間電價你必須先去安裝智慧電表院長這您知道吧\n你要安裝智慧電表還沒那麼簡單來院長給你看一下齁臺電的網站上面告訴大家智慧電表是逐年分批部件你不能主動去申請除非是用電大戶或者是你的住家有再生能源併網才可以所以很多人現在\n來﹖\n這個可能部長您還要再上來這個是我今天早上請衛福部幫我整理了一下部立醫院裡頭有安裝智慧電表的\n但是也有很多的醫院是沒有安裝智慧電表比如說新營醫院、恆春醫院、巴黎療養院、嘉南療養院、玉里醫院這個都沒有安裝智慧電表這是醫院喔來我再給您看這是高雄市的醫療院所裝置智慧電表的情況\n高雄市的市立醫院、高醫大輔社醫院甚至國軍總醫院都沒有安裝智慧電表所以他們根本也沒有辦法申請所謂的時間電價也沒有辦法能夠更有更多的節電措施\n院長這個就是我要說的我們在講說電價漲了對於醫療院所的負擔是沉重的但是有沒有可能衛福部你們先去盤點這些醫療院所到底有哪些連智慧電表都沒裝\n是不是能夠push他們或者是我們責成臺電要求臺電跨部會合作讓智慧電表早日把所有的醫療院所全部普及有沒有可能我想我們讓衛福部跟經濟部一起努力這個應該盤點不是太困難因為經濟部一定有data然後衛福部這邊有醫院的名單match一下大概就可以有了我想請他們跨部會來做\n當然我們在談到要不要補貼醫院或者是醫院要不要動漲電費我覺得安裝智慧電表這件事情就是第一步所以是不是能夠請衛福部也能夠加速\n至少你先盤點這一塊好不好?好那因為我接下來剩下不到一分鐘的時間我想就這最後的50秒我還是要謝謝陳建仁院長您帶領的團隊在這一段時間以來我相信對台灣做了非常多的貢獻跟努力我們還是要謝謝您\n那今天是最後一次對您的總質詢那我想也非常感謝您過去一段時間的努力也希望未來不管陳院長您在哪一個崗位上是不是也能夠一起繼續守護台灣不只守護台灣的健康也守護台灣的經濟守護台灣的永續發展好不好謝謝那我們幾位委員呢特別也準備了一束花要來送給陳建仁院長表達我們對您的祝福跟感謝謝謝\n謝謝。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.258 --> 00:08.762\n謝謝主席。我是不是請一下陳院長。再請陳院長備詢。邱永安\n\n00:15.816 --> 00:43.421\n院長午安,院長辛苦了,經過這一整天的這個詢答。那剛剛王振旭委員他是癌症治療專家。是,很專家。那很巧的,他提到的所有的質詢的內容都跟癌症的治療或者是新藥有關係。院長您跟我都是癌症的病友。是。所以我接下來要跟院長請教,我們要討論的這個議題,我相信院長您大概知道我要問什麼。\n\n00:46.411 --> 01:07.491\n全球再生醫療法其實我們推動了很久再生醫療的研究生技醫療的研究是一條漫長的路小英總統這樣說過但是我覺得再生醫療雙法的推動更是一條漫長的路院長我讓您看一下這個是全球再生醫療產業的現況\n\n01:09.793 --> 01:16.579\n到2023年的第三季為止,全球已經有1803項的再生醫療臨床試驗在進行中。所有的這個開發商相較於2022年的1457家,到2023年已經大幅增長了77%。\n\n01:31.355 --> 01:54.163\n這個是全球推動再生醫療的大事跡日本早在2013年就通過再生醫療的促進法2014年通過了再生醫療法美國在2016年通過21世紀醫療法在2022年FDA發布了最新的再生醫療標準認可計畫\n\n01:57.625 --> 02:04.195\n韓國也在2019年通過先進再生醫療跟生物製藥的安全支持法案\n\n02:06.018 --> 02:30.672\n院長我請您再看一下這個是在2023年上市的再生醫療的產品全世界各國包括歐盟、日本、美國大家一直紛紛的在研究所謂的再生醫療的產品他們已經從自體細胞的治療不只進步到液體細胞的治療甚至基因的治療反而是新上市的這些產品的大宗\n\n02:32.519 --> 02:50.788\n這個呢我追溯到最早2018年小英總統在出席生技展的時候公開的這樣說生技醫療產品的研發是一條漫長的路不過政府責無旁貸我們希望能夠陪伴我們的企業迎接所有的挑戰那包括\n\n02:54.353 --> 03:10.812\n總統在2022年他每一年去參加生技展每一年都會講要推動生技要推動再生醫療包括院長您在今年出席工商早餐會的時候也特別談到希望生醫成為下一座的護國神山對不對\n\n03:12.898 --> 03:23.410\n院長我讓您看一下這個當然是我們賴清德總統的推動的健康台灣的政見當然也提到了精準醫療再生醫療甚至癌症的防治等等\n\n03:25.750 --> 03:49.691\n這個是我們在臺灣對於再生醫療法推動的整個進程。2015年應該是臺灣最早接觸到再生醫療這個是因為八仙晨報的時候我們接受了日本捐贈的所謂的細胞自體細胞成片來醫治燒傷的病人所以這個是臺灣最早接觸到所謂的自體細胞產品2015年同年\n\n03:50.552 --> 04:14.935\n有一個癌友叫Casper他在國發會的平台裡頭發起連署癌症免疫療法的修法的法案短短9天之內5000人復疫達標而我也是在2015年看到這個法案之後開始投入再生醫療投入細胞免疫療法的這樣的一個法案的研究當然一直到2018年我們通過了特管辦法\n\n04:15.996 --> 04:16.636\n院長,請再看一下。\n\n04:45.366 --> 05:07.925\n這個是目前臺灣雖然沒有通過再生醫療法但是我們有特管辦法18年通過的特管辦法這個是到目前為止衛福部合可的特管辦法所收治的案例我不知道部長您大概有沒有去做過統計這樣的一個特管辦法的審查每一個案例的審查時間\n\n05:09.667 --> 05:37.250\n我初步剛剛算了一下每一個案例審查的時間大概要3個月到6個月不等而且casebycase的審查這一家生技業者他所做出來的產品即使上一個案在某A醫院通過審查之後他在B醫院要做的時候他還是要重新送件再審查一次平均3到6個月我不知道有多少癌症的病人可以等這麼久的時間\n\n05:40.984 --> 05:56.497\n在生意療法不過臺灣很多的生技業者在不管是在研發上面在推動上面甚至在跟國際合作的上面其實我們都會受到許多的限制院長我請您再看一下這個統計\n\n05:59.411 --> 06:21.424\n我們衛福部有要求要從事再生醫療的醫療人員醫師人員必須接受這樣的一個教育訓練的課程可是您可以看到從107年也就是2018年的2099人報名參加一直到去年只剩下494人參加\n\n06:25.532 --> 06:53.900\n是因為大家關心再生醫療嗎?不是反而因為我們的法令沒有過讓很多業者開始地下化因為無法可管無法可罰所以你沒有辦法去取締它你也沒有辦法去罰它甚至你也沒有辦法好好的認真的嚴格審查這些廠商的細胞製成的過程\n\n06:55.060 --> 07:17.823\n到底合不合法?到底合不合衛福部所有的GMP的規定?對不對?所以您同意我的這個看法。這個是我大概擷取了幾個再生醫療的發展,包括杜元坤教授做膝蓋軟骨細胞,應該是台灣的首屈一指。包括現在我們不只\n\n07:19.093 --> 07:20.214\n再生醫療法這個是大概是衛福部的版本\n\n07:48.922 --> 07:54.231\n那我知道衛福部最近開始在辦說明會21號辦了一場28號也辦了一場這個說明會很詭異他沒有開放報名他是採用邀請制\n\n08:03.621 --> 08:28.978\n部長您可不可以說明一下為什麼會是這樣處理?根據委員報告目前再生醫療法現在是這樣子從上一次在立法院就插了林門一腳然後屆時不續審所以現在我們是跟行政院這邊討論的結果是我們不會退到衛福部來\n\n08:30.359 --> 08:54.309\n所以會在行政院那邊繼續做一個審查就會送立法院這中間條文的部分並沒有太大的差異只有這個順序上面可能有一個調動因為過去在批評這個再生醫療法的誤解的情形就是以為是再生醫療不用人體試驗\n\n08:55.970 --> 09:10.107\n但是這是錯的觀念所謂的再生醫療如果要變成常規化的話都一定要經過人體試驗除了有幾個條件之下的話才可以不用等人體試驗完成對就是這種情形\n\n09:13.231 --> 09:36.414\n那這些因為這一個改變屬於說比較小的所以目前我們已經把新的調整過了這個版本送到行政院那那個政委會再審查過一次就會送到立法院我想聽一下院長的看法因為我們本席大概是對再生醫療\n\n09:39.670 --> 10:02.826\n所以我其實很想知道就行政院的態度剛剛部長也講得很清楚但是我還是想從院長的口中裡頭去聽到到底行政院對於推動這樣的一個醫療方案對於推動台灣的醫療進程行政院有沒有信心有沒有願意很努力的來跟社會大眾甚至跟醫界跟某些不了解的人來進行溝通\n\n10:03.486 --> 10:25.215\n對,在上個會期沒有通過就讓我很失望了但是我一直請衛福部應該再加緊然後在這個新的會期趕快送出來謝謝衛福部3月20日就送到行政院我會請政委趕快的再加速審查以後最起碼我相信在這一兩個月的時間內我們就送出\n\n10:33.923 --> 10:44.713\n我其實也很期待520之前能夠趕快通過甚至不要等到520我覺得越快通過越好啦我真的覺得就是說很多的癌症病患或者是說很多的台灣的病友\n\n10:45.213 --> 10:45.913\n院長,那我接下來要請教這個是比較實事題。\n\n11:08.787 --> 11:34.585\n這個呢因為漲電價所以最近包括經濟部甚至包括行政院被批評的很多這個是經濟部的圖卡他說用電比較多的麵包店呢你可以改選時間電價一個月可以省一萬七那這個時間電價經濟部或者是台電沒有告訴大家的是你要用時間電價你必須先去安裝智慧電表院長這您知道吧\n\n11:35.746 --> 11:57.385\n你要安裝智慧電表還沒那麼簡單來院長給你看一下齁臺電的網站上面告訴大家智慧電表是逐年分批部件你不能主動去申請除非是用電大戶或者是你的住家有再生能源併網才可以所以很多人現在\n\n12:22.258 --> 12:34.994\n這個可能部長您還要再上來這個是我今天早上請衛福部幫我整理了一下部立醫院裡頭有安裝智慧電表的\n\n12:37.650 --> 12:59.480\n但是也有很多的醫院是沒有安裝智慧電表比如說新營醫院、恆春醫院、巴黎療養院、嘉南療養院、玉里醫院這個都沒有安裝智慧電表這是醫院喔來我再給您看這是高雄市的醫療院所裝置智慧電表的情況\n\n13:01.124 --> 13:18.840\n高雄市的市立醫院、高醫大輔社醫院甚至國軍總醫院都沒有安裝智慧電表所以他們根本也沒有辦法申請所謂的時間電價也沒有辦法能夠更有更多的節電措施\n\n13:19.821 --> 13:34.802\n院長這個就是我要說的我們在講說電價漲了對於醫療院所的負擔是沉重的但是有沒有可能衛福部你們先去盤點這些醫療院所到底有哪些連智慧電表都沒裝\n\n13:36.553 --> 14:04.435\n是不是能夠push他們或者是我們責成臺電要求臺電跨部會合作讓智慧電表早日把所有的醫療院所全部普及有沒有可能我想我們讓衛福部跟經濟部一起努力這個應該盤點不是太困難因為經濟部一定有data然後衛福部這邊有醫院的名單match一下大概就可以有了我想請他們跨部會來做\n\n14:05.285 --> 14:16.438\n當然我們在談到要不要補貼醫院或者是醫院要不要動漲電費我覺得安裝智慧電表這件事情就是第一步所以是不是能夠請衛福部也能夠加速\n\n14:17.719 --> 14:38.776\n至少你先盤點這一塊好不好?好那因為我接下來剩下不到一分鐘的時間我想就這最後的50秒我還是要謝謝陳建仁院長您帶領的團隊在這一段時間以來我相信對台灣做了非常多的貢獻跟努力我們還是要謝謝您\n\n14:39.697 --> 15:08.556\n那今天是最後一次對您的總質詢那我想也非常感謝您過去一段時間的努力也希望未來不管陳院長您在哪一個崗位上是不是也能夠一起繼續守護台灣不只守護台灣的健康也守護台灣的經濟守護台灣的永續發展好不好謝謝那我們幾位委員呢特別也準備了一束花要來送給陳建仁院長表達我們對您的祝福跟感謝謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.258,"end":8.762,"text":"謝謝主席。我是不是請一下陳院長。再請陳院長備詢。邱永安"},{"start":15.816,"end":43.421,"text":"院長午安,院長辛苦了,經過這一整天的這個詢答。那剛剛王振旭委員他是癌症治療專家。是,很專家。那很巧的,他提到的所有的質詢的內容都跟癌症的治療或者是新藥有關係。院長您跟我都是癌症的病友。是。所以我接下來要跟院長請教,我們要討論的這個議題,我相信院長您大概知道我要問什麼。"},{"start":46.411,"end":67.491,"text":"全球再生醫療法其實我們推動了很久再生醫療的研究生技醫療的研究是一條漫長的路小英總統這樣說過但是我覺得再生醫療雙法的推動更是一條漫長的路院長我讓您看一下這個是全球再生醫療產業的現況"},{"start":69.793,"end":76.579,"text":"到2023年的第三季為止,全球已經有1803項的再生醫療臨床試驗在進行中。所有的這個開發商相較於2022年的1457家,到2023年已經大幅增長了77%。"},{"start":91.355,"end":114.163,"text":"這個是全球推動再生醫療的大事跡日本早在2013年就通過再生醫療的促進法2014年通過了再生醫療法美國在2016年通過21世紀醫療法在2022年FDA發布了最新的再生醫療標準認可計畫"},{"start":117.625,"end":124.195,"text":"韓國也在2019年通過先進再生醫療跟生物製藥的安全支持法案"},{"start":126.018,"end":150.672,"text":"院長我請您再看一下這個是在2023年上市的再生醫療的產品全世界各國包括歐盟、日本、美國大家一直紛紛的在研究所謂的再生醫療的產品他們已經從自體細胞的治療不只進步到液體細胞的治療甚至基因的治療反而是新上市的這些產品的大宗"},{"start":152.519,"end":170.788,"text":"這個呢我追溯到最早2018年小英總統在出席生技展的時候公開的這樣說生技醫療產品的研發是一條漫長的路不過政府責無旁貸我們希望能夠陪伴我們的企業迎接所有的挑戰那包括"},{"start":174.353,"end":190.812,"text":"總統在2022年他每一年去參加生技展每一年都會講要推動生技要推動再生醫療包括院長您在今年出席工商早餐會的時候也特別談到希望生醫成為下一座的護國神山對不對"},{"start":192.898,"end":203.41,"text":"院長我讓您看一下這個當然是我們賴清德總統的推動的健康台灣的政見當然也提到了精準醫療再生醫療甚至癌症的防治等等"},{"start":205.75,"end":229.691,"text":"這個是我們在臺灣對於再生醫療法推動的整個進程。2015年應該是臺灣最早接觸到再生醫療這個是因為八仙晨報的時候我們接受了日本捐贈的所謂的細胞自體細胞成片來醫治燒傷的病人所以這個是臺灣最早接觸到所謂的自體細胞產品2015年同年"},{"start":230.552,"end":254.935,"text":"有一個癌友叫Casper他在國發會的平台裡頭發起連署癌症免疫療法的修法的法案短短9天之內5000人復疫達標而我也是在2015年看到這個法案之後開始投入再生醫療投入細胞免疫療法的這樣的一個法案的研究當然一直到2018年我們通過了特管辦法"},{"start":255.996,"end":256.636,"text":"院長,請再看一下。"},{"start":285.366,"end":307.925,"text":"這個是目前臺灣雖然沒有通過再生醫療法但是我們有特管辦法18年通過的特管辦法這個是到目前為止衛福部合可的特管辦法所收治的案例我不知道部長您大概有沒有去做過統計這樣的一個特管辦法的審查每一個案例的審查時間"},{"start":309.667,"end":337.25,"text":"我初步剛剛算了一下每一個案例審查的時間大概要3個月到6個月不等而且case by case的審查這一家生技業者他所做出來的產品即使上一個案在某A醫院通過審查之後他在B醫院要做的時候他還是要重新送件再審查一次平均3到6個月我不知道有多少癌症的病人可以等這麼久的時間"},{"start":340.984,"end":356.497,"text":"在生意療法不過臺灣很多的生技業者在不管是在研發上面在推動上面甚至在跟國際合作的上面其實我們都會受到許多的限制院長我請您再看一下這個統計"},{"start":359.411,"end":381.424,"text":"我們衛福部有要求要從事再生醫療的醫療人員醫師人員必須接受這樣的一個教育訓練的課程可是您可以看到從107年也就是2018年的2099人報名參加一直到去年只剩下494人參加"},{"start":385.532,"end":413.9,"text":"是因為大家關心再生醫療嗎?不是反而因為我們的法令沒有過讓很多業者開始地下化因為無法可管無法可罰所以你沒有辦法去取締它你也沒有辦法去罰它甚至你也沒有辦法好好的認真的嚴格審查這些廠商的細胞製成的過程"},{"start":415.06,"end":437.823,"text":"到底合不合法?到底合不合衛福部所有的GMP的規定?對不對?所以您同意我的這個看法。這個是我大概擷取了幾個再生醫療的發展,包括杜元坤教授做膝蓋軟骨細胞,應該是台灣的首屈一指。包括現在我們不只"},{"start":439.093,"end":440.214,"text":"再生醫療法這個是大概是衛福部的版本"},{"start":468.922,"end":474.231,"text":"那我知道衛福部最近開始在辦說明會21號辦了一場28號也辦了一場這個說明會很詭異他沒有開放報名他是採用邀請制"},{"start":483.621,"end":508.978,"text":"部長您可不可以說明一下為什麼會是這樣處理?根據委員報告目前再生醫療法現在是這樣子從上一次在立法院就插了林門一腳然後屆時不續審所以現在我們是跟行政院這邊討論的結果是我們不會退到衛福部來"},{"start":510.359,"end":534.309,"text":"所以會在行政院那邊繼續做一個審查就會送立法院這中間條文的部分並沒有太大的差異只有這個順序上面可能有一個調動因為過去在批評這個再生醫療法的誤解的情形就是以為是再生醫療不用人體試驗"},{"start":535.97,"end":550.107,"text":"但是這是錯的觀念所謂的再生醫療如果要變成常規化的話都一定要經過人體試驗除了有幾個條件之下的話才可以不用等人體試驗完成對就是這種情形"},{"start":553.231,"end":576.414,"text":"那這些因為這一個改變屬於說比較小的所以目前我們已經把新的調整過了這個版本送到行政院那那個政委會再審查過一次就會送到立法院我想聽一下院長的看法因為我們本席大概是對再生醫療"},{"start":579.67,"end":602.826,"text":"所以我其實很想知道就行政院的態度剛剛部長也講得很清楚但是我還是想從院長的口中裡頭去聽到到底行政院對於推動這樣的一個醫療方案對於推動台灣的醫療進程行政院有沒有信心有沒有願意很努力的來跟社會大眾甚至跟醫界跟某些不了解的人來進行溝通"},{"start":603.486,"end":625.215,"text":"對,在上個會期沒有通過就讓我很失望了但是我一直請衛福部應該再加緊然後在這個新的會期趕快送出來謝謝衛福部3月20日就送到行政院我會請政委趕快的再加速審查以後最起碼我相信在這一兩個月的時間內我們就送出"},{"start":633.923,"end":644.713,"text":"我其實也很期待520之前能夠趕快通過甚至不要等到520我覺得越快通過越好啦我真的覺得就是說很多的癌症病患或者是說很多的台灣的病友"},{"start":645.213,"end":645.913,"text":"院長,那我接下來要請教這個是比較實事題。"},{"start":668.787,"end":694.585,"text":"這個呢因為漲電價所以最近包括經濟部甚至包括行政院被批評的很多這個是經濟部的圖卡他說用電比較多的麵包店呢你可以改選時間電價一個月可以省一萬七那這個時間電價經濟部或者是台電沒有告訴大家的是你要用時間電價你必須先去安裝智慧電表院長這您知道吧"},{"start":695.746,"end":717.385,"text":"你要安裝智慧電表還沒那麼簡單來院長給你看一下齁臺電的網站上面告訴大家智慧電表是逐年分批部件你不能主動去申請除非是用電大戶或者是你的住家有再生能源併網才可以所以很多人現在"},{"start":718.166,"end":741.015,"text":"來﹖"},{"start":742.258,"end":754.994,"text":"這個可能部長您還要再上來這個是我今天早上請衛福部幫我整理了一下部立醫院裡頭有安裝智慧電表的"},{"start":757.65,"end":779.48,"text":"但是也有很多的醫院是沒有安裝智慧電表比如說新營醫院、恆春醫院、巴黎療養院、嘉南療養院、玉里醫院這個都沒有安裝智慧電表這是醫院喔來我再給您看這是高雄市的醫療院所裝置智慧電表的情況"},{"start":781.124,"end":798.84,"text":"高雄市的市立醫院、高醫大輔社醫院甚至國軍總醫院都沒有安裝智慧電表所以他們根本也沒有辦法申請所謂的時間電價也沒有辦法能夠更有更多的節電措施"},{"start":799.821,"end":814.802,"text":"院長這個就是我要說的我們在講說電價漲了對於醫療院所的負擔是沉重的但是有沒有可能衛福部你們先去盤點這些醫療院所到底有哪些連智慧電表都沒裝"},{"start":816.553,"end":844.435,"text":"是不是能夠push他們或者是我們責成臺電要求臺電跨部會合作讓智慧電表早日把所有的醫療院所全部普及有沒有可能我想我們讓衛福部跟經濟部一起努力這個應該盤點不是太困難因為經濟部一定有data然後衛福部這邊有醫院的名單match一下大概就可以有了我想請他們跨部會來做"},{"start":845.285,"end":856.438,"text":"當然我們在談到要不要補貼醫院或者是醫院要不要動漲電費我覺得安裝智慧電表這件事情就是第一步所以是不是能夠請衛福部也能夠加速"},{"start":857.719,"end":878.776,"text":"至少你先盤點這一塊好不好?好那因為我接下來剩下不到一分鐘的時間我想就這最後的50秒我還是要謝謝陳建仁院長您帶領的團隊在這一段時間以來我相信對台灣做了非常多的貢獻跟努力我們還是要謝謝您"},{"start":879.697,"end":908.556,"text":"那今天是最後一次對您的總質詢那我想也非常感謝您過去一段時間的努力也希望未來不管陳院長您在哪一個崗位上是不是也能夠一起繼續守護台灣不只守護台灣的健康也守護台灣的經濟守護台灣的永續發展好不好謝謝那我們幾位委員呢特別也準備了一束花要來送給陳建仁院長表達我們對您的祝福跟感謝謝謝"},{"start":909.497,"end":910.196,"text":"謝謝。"}]}}}}