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\"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:06,661 --> 00:00:06,902\n委員會主席\n\n2\n00:00:16,497 --> 00:00:30,434\n昨天我們開第二場碳費率的審議會本來決定要端出來的最後的調整機制就是我們要端出碳費率的相關的一些調整要公佈到最後我們還是再一次跳票\n\n3\n00:00:31,275 --> 00:00:52,443\n我們這個跳票其實已經不是第一次包括在112年當時我們本來說要推出來到最後我們還是延期那昨天的說法是說我們要等到今年溫室氣體排放的計算碳費出來溫室氣體排放量出來才有辦法去做估算那我們要114年才開始繳碳費\n\n4\n00:00:57,205 --> 00:01:08,438\n就是不管現在遊戲規則是什麼包括剛才提到台版的CBAN就是看起來我們在很多法規上好像看起來都還沒有準備好那這個就牽涉到幾個問題就是接下來整個遊戲規則是什麼\n\n5\n00:01:13,343 --> 00:01:38,790\n不論是大型的企業界產業界或中小型的企業界現在都完全不知道我們未來碳費的徵收的規劃跟方向到底是怎麼處理包括產業界也產生幾個問題它相關的一些產業界的佈局機器的佈局相關的佈局它到底要怎麼去做調整佈局營運等等其實這些都牽扯在裡頭那去年我們也看到\n\n6\n00:01:39,790 --> 00:01:54,701\n蔡英文總統去參加我們的這個碳交易所的接牌典禮,她也特別提到就是說要把低碳跟零碳的挑戰化為新的機會跟商機但是機會到底是什麼?商機到底是什麼?現在還沒看到\n\n7\n00:01:59,564 --> 00:02:27,398\n對於中小企業來說他們還不知道到底整個邏輯跟方向到底是什麼也沒有辦法知道說到底後面是什麼怎麼去做一個遵循的方向所以現在很多產業界都普遍對於未來徵收碳稅也好碳費也好都面臨叫做碳焦慮所以臺大風險中心連續兩年公正轉型的調查當中有五成的受訪者完全不清楚\n\n8\n00:02:27,938 --> 00:02:44,038\n政府的淨零政策到底是什麼?你的方向到底是什麼?你的內容實際到底是什麼?八成的受訪者更認為淨零排碳的政策應該關注更多的中小企業。有六成四的民眾受訪者擔心會有物價上漲的問題。\n\n9\n00:02:47,282 --> 00:02:50,904\n無論碳稅或碳費最後可能會有綠色通膨的問題有50.4%的民眾會擔心說公司會經營困難倒閉因為這些都可能還有一些營運成本還有相關的法規的配合\n\n10\n00:03:03,969 --> 00:03:07,990\n二、處理或審查中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度\n\n11\n00:03:32,801 --> 00:03:57,597\n沒有耶你沒問對不對我們如果是中小企業我點進去看我真的不知道在未來因應淨零轉型的過程當中碳稅或碳費我法規的配合政府可以給我什麼樣的支持跟援助我打電話進去問我如果是一個中小企業的老闆我問說我應該怎麼遵循你可以給我什麼樣的援助我覺得他也講不出來你同意我的說法嗎我現在在你現場我馬上打電話問\n\n12\n00:04:00,467 --> 00:04:08,912\n理委員當然表示的是不問民眾的聲音或企業的聲音環境部會來重視經濟部應該給的資助我覺得這個議題是跨部會無論是經濟部也好或是環境部也好未來的\n\n13\n00:04:21,019 --> 00:04:45,169\n內容到底是什麼我遵循的方向到底是什麼未來我的產業佈局我的機器設備我可以上下游我做什麼樣的調整這個不是你馬上法令一公佈我馬上就可以做調整企業因應產業界因應它有它的佈局跟時間嘛是就如李委員所講事實上這方面的資訊非常的豐富啦並沒有所謂的他不曉得要怎麼去轉型因為\n\n14\n00:04:46,189 --> 00:04:46,850\n沒有李委員講的這個情況\n\n15\n00:05:04,213 --> 00:05:17,107\n所有這次要接受碳會徵收的對象甚至是3年前就已經得到通知他們去做碳盤查你法規跟內容怎麼去做調整\n\n16\n00:05:18,936 --> 00:05:36,191\n部長我包括我們中小企業你雖然說第一階段不去徵收但是我們台灣有13%的中小企業是靠外銷營收佔將近三兆那未來他有沒有足夠的資源瞭解這些遊戲內容規則包括他後面的邏輯到底是什麼\n\n17\n00:05:40,735 --> 00:06:02,418\n我覺得非常重要,他們到底清不清楚政府可以給予多少的資訊跟資源,包括我剛才講的那個LineApp圖片,包括我打電話進去一個專線問,他到底能不能,因為每個中小型企業營運的方向不一樣,他的產業也不一樣,你經濟部也好,你環境部也好,你能直接面對他的問題可以回答到哪個程度?\n\n18\n00:06:04,790 --> 00:06:05,770\n接下來我覺得還有綠色通紅的挑戰的問題\n\n19\n00:06:22,978 --> 00:06:48,280\n因為民眾也擔心說未來如果針對於碳費或碳稅的徵收會不會增加一些通膨的問題會不會有直接的影響那後續行政部門到底有沒有什麼樣的工具可以抑制通膨方向正確我們絕對要走有沒有其他的工具因為現在電價一漲通膨已經很嚴重那綠色通膨又一再來你明年又要做我支持要做我也覺得應該要做\n\n20\n00:06:50,302 --> 00:07:06,729\n這個你有沒有工具?所以李委員就是說我們不要把沒有在3月底前公佈碳費的費率一直站在比較負面的角度從某一個角度來看不是正好符合剛剛李委員講我們事實上應該考量是不是將來會有綠色通膨以及電費的漲價\n\n21\n00:07:10,971 --> 00:07:33,687\n會不會對部長我不希望我覺得這件事情如果要做他不是你他不是你的藉口我覺得你不要拿現在通膨的問題來做因為這個是一個正確方向我們也要跟國際接軌謝謝李委員支持你現在來講這個事情就是你的藉口方向正確但是重點是你已經準備了兩三天到底準備了什麼東西你今年還不斷的在拖\n\n22\n00:07:34,895 --> 00:08:02,103\n因為大院也是在去年1月份才通過《氣候變遷因應法》環境部以前的...國際都在準備啦你不要講說大院去年才通過你環境部在這麼久你什麼都沒做那也真是離譜但是全世界立法院光是在討論碳稅、碳費已經討論得及了是啊討論很久2020年就提出這個...你不要講立法院提出你自己是環境部你行政部門都在等立法院做\n\n23\n00:08:03,705 --> 00:08:04,486\n李燕秀委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6661\t6902\t委員會主席\n16497\t30434\t昨天我們開第二場碳費率的審議會本來決定要端出來的最後的調整機制就是我們要端出碳費率的相關的一些調整要公佈到最後我們還是再一次跳票\n31275\t52443\t我們這個跳票其實已經不是第一次包括在112年當時我們本來說要推出來到最後我們還是延期那昨天的說法是說我們要等到今年溫室氣體排放的計算碳費出來溫室氣體排放量出來才有辦法去做估算那我們要114年才開始繳碳費\n57205\t68438\t就是不管現在遊戲規則是什麼包括剛才提到台版的CBAN就是看起來我們在很多法規上好像看起來都還沒有準備好那這個就牽涉到幾個問題就是接下來整個遊戲規則是什麼\n73343\t98790\t不論是大型的企業界產業界或中小型的企業界現在都完全不知道我們未來碳費的徵收的規劃跟方向到底是怎麼處理包括產業界也產生幾個問題它相關的一些產業界的佈局機器的佈局相關的佈局它到底要怎麼去做調整佈局營運等等其實這些都牽扯在裡頭那去年我們也看到\n99790\t114701\t蔡英文總統去參加我們的這個碳交易所的接牌典禮,她也特別提到就是說要把低碳跟零碳的挑戰化為新的機會跟商機但是機會到底是什麼?商機到底是什麼?現在還沒看到\n119564\t147398\t對於中小企業來說他們還不知道到底整個邏輯跟方向到底是什麼也沒有辦法知道說到底後面是什麼怎麼去做一個遵循的方向所以現在很多產業界都普遍對於未來徵收碳稅也好碳費也好都面臨叫做碳焦慮所以臺大風險中心連續兩年公正轉型的調查當中有五成的受訪者完全不清楚\n147938\t164038\t政府的淨零政策到底是什麼?你的方向到底是什麼?你的內容實際到底是什麼?八成的受訪者更認為淨零排碳的政策應該關注更多的中小企業。有六成四的民眾受訪者擔心會有物價上漲的問題。\n167282\t170904\t無論碳稅或碳費最後可能會有綠色通膨的問題有50.4%的民眾會擔心說公司會經營困難倒閉因為這些都可能還有一些營運成本還有相關的法規的配合\n183969\t187990\t二、處理或審查中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度\n212801\t237597\t沒有耶你沒問對不對我們如果是中小企業我點進去看我真的不知道在未來因應淨零轉型的過程當中碳稅或碳費我法規的配合政府可以給我什麼樣的支持跟援助我打電話進去問我如果是一個中小企業的老闆我問說我應該怎麼遵循你可以給我什麼樣的援助我覺得他也講不出來你同意我的說法嗎我現在在你現場我馬上打電話問\n240467\t248912\t理委員當然表示的是不問民眾的聲音或企業的聲音環境部會來重視經濟部應該給的資助我覺得這個議題是跨部會無論是經濟部也好或是環境部也好未來的\n261019\t285169\t內容到底是什麼我遵循的方向到底是什麼未來我的產業佈局我的機器設備我可以上下游我做什麼樣的調整這個不是你馬上法令一公佈我馬上就可以做調整企業因應產業界因應它有它的佈局跟時間嘛是就如李委員所講事實上這方面的資訊非常的豐富啦並沒有所謂的他不曉得要怎麼去轉型因為\n286189\t286850\t沒有李委員講的這個情況\n304213\t317107\t所有這次要接受碳會徵收的對象甚至是3年前就已經得到通知他們去做碳盤查你法規跟內容怎麼去做調整\n318936\t336191\t部長我包括我們中小企業你雖然說第一階段不去徵收但是我們台灣有13%的中小企業是靠外銷營收佔將近三兆那未來他有沒有足夠的資源瞭解這些遊戲內容規則包括他後面的邏輯到底是什麼\n340735\t362418\t我覺得非常重要,他們到底清不清楚政府可以給予多少的資訊跟資源,包括我剛才講的那個Line App圖片,包括我打電話進去一個專線問,他到底能不能,因為每個中小型企業營運的方向不一樣,他的產業也不一樣,你經濟部也好,你環境部也好,你能直接面對他的問題可以回答到哪個程度?\n364790\t365770\t接下來我覺得還有綠色通紅的挑戰的問題\n382978\t408280\t因為民眾也擔心說未來如果針對於碳費或碳稅的徵收會不會增加一些通膨的問題會不會有直接的影響那後續行政部門到底有沒有什麼樣的工具可以抑制通膨方向正確我們絕對要走有沒有其他的工具因為現在電價一漲通膨已經很嚴重那綠色通膨又一再來你明年又要做我支持要做我也覺得應該要做\n410302\t426729\t這個你有沒有工具?所以李委員就是說我們不要把沒有在3月底前公佈碳費的費率一直站在比較負面的角度從某一個角度來看不是正好符合剛剛李委員講我們事實上應該考量是不是將來會有綠色通膨以及電費的漲價\n430971\t453687\t會不會對部長我不希望我覺得這件事情如果要做他不是你他不是你的藉口我覺得你不要拿現在通膨的問題來做因為這個是一個正確方向我們也要跟國際接軌謝謝李委員支持你現在來講這個事情就是你的藉口方向正確但是重點是你已經準備了兩三天到底準備了什麼東西你今年還不斷的在拖\n454895\t482103\t因為大院也是在去年1月份才通過《氣候變遷因應法》環境部以前的...國際都在準備啦你不要講說大院去年才通過你環境部在這麼久你什麼都沒做那也真是離譜但是全世界立法院光是在討論碳稅、碳費已經討論得及了是啊討論很久2020年就提出這個...你不要講立法院提出你自己是環境部你行政部門都在等立法院做\n483705\t484486\t李燕秀委員\n","txt":"委員會主席\n昨天我們開第二場碳費率的審議會本來決定要端出來的最後的調整機制就是我們要端出碳費率的相關的一些調整要公佈到最後我們還是再一次跳票\n我們這個跳票其實已經不是第一次包括在112年當時我們本來說要推出來到最後我們還是延期那昨天的說法是說我們要等到今年溫室氣體排放的計算碳費出來溫室氣體排放量出來才有辦法去做估算那我們要114年才開始繳碳費\n就是不管現在遊戲規則是什麼包括剛才提到台版的CBAN就是看起來我們在很多法規上好像看起來都還沒有準備好那這個就牽涉到幾個問題就是接下來整個遊戲規則是什麼\n不論是大型的企業界產業界或中小型的企業界現在都完全不知道我們未來碳費的徵收的規劃跟方向到底是怎麼處理包括產業界也產生幾個問題它相關的一些產業界的佈局機器的佈局相關的佈局它到底要怎麼去做調整佈局營運等等其實這些都牽扯在裡頭那去年我們也看到\n蔡英文總統去參加我們的這個碳交易所的接牌典禮,她也特別提到就是說要把低碳跟零碳的挑戰化為新的機會跟商機但是機會到底是什麼?商機到底是什麼?現在還沒看到\n對於中小企業來說他們還不知道到底整個邏輯跟方向到底是什麼也沒有辦法知道說到底後面是什麼怎麼去做一個遵循的方向所以現在很多產業界都普遍對於未來徵收碳稅也好碳費也好都面臨叫做碳焦慮所以臺大風險中心連續兩年公正轉型的調查當中有五成的受訪者完全不清楚\n政府的淨零政策到底是什麼?你的方向到底是什麼?你的內容實際到底是什麼?八成的受訪者更認為淨零排碳的政策應該關注更多的中小企業。有六成四的民眾受訪者擔心會有物價上漲的問題。\n無論碳稅或碳費最後可能會有綠色通膨的問題有50.4%的民眾會擔心說公司會經營困難倒閉因為這些都可能還有一些營運成本還有相關的法規的配合\n二、處理或審查中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度\n沒有耶你沒問對不對我們如果是中小企業我點進去看我真的不知道在未來因應淨零轉型的過程當中碳稅或碳費我法規的配合政府可以給我什麼樣的支持跟援助我打電話進去問我如果是一個中小企業的老闆我問說我應該怎麼遵循你可以給我什麼樣的援助我覺得他也講不出來你同意我的說法嗎我現在在你現場我馬上打電話問\n理委員當然表示的是不問民眾的聲音或企業的聲音環境部會來重視經濟部應該給的資助我覺得這個議題是跨部會無論是經濟部也好或是環境部也好未來的\n內容到底是什麼我遵循的方向到底是什麼未來我的產業佈局我的機器設備我可以上下游我做什麼樣的調整這個不是你馬上法令一公佈我馬上就可以做調整企業因應產業界因應它有它的佈局跟時間嘛是就如李委員所講事實上這方面的資訊非常的豐富啦並沒有所謂的他不曉得要怎麼去轉型因為\n沒有李委員講的這個情況\n所有這次要接受碳會徵收的對象甚至是3年前就已經得到通知他們去做碳盤查你法規跟內容怎麼去做調整\n部長我包括我們中小企業你雖然說第一階段不去徵收但是我們台灣有13%的中小企業是靠外銷營收佔將近三兆那未來他有沒有足夠的資源瞭解這些遊戲內容規則包括他後面的邏輯到底是什麼\n我覺得非常重要,他們到底清不清楚政府可以給予多少的資訊跟資源,包括我剛才講的那個Line App圖片,包括我打電話進去一個專線問,他到底能不能,因為每個中小型企業營運的方向不一樣,他的產業也不一樣,你經濟部也好,你環境部也好,你能直接面對他的問題可以回答到哪個程度?\n接下來我覺得還有綠色通紅的挑戰的問題\n因為民眾也擔心說未來如果針對於碳費或碳稅的徵收會不會增加一些通膨的問題會不會有直接的影響那後續行政部門到底有沒有什麼樣的工具可以抑制通膨方向正確我們絕對要走有沒有其他的工具因為現在電價一漲通膨已經很嚴重那綠色通膨又一再來你明年又要做我支持要做我也覺得應該要做\n這個你有沒有工具?所以李委員就是說我們不要把沒有在3月底前公佈碳費的費率一直站在比較負面的角度從某一個角度來看不是正好符合剛剛李委員講我們事實上應該考量是不是將來會有綠色通膨以及電費的漲價\n會不會對部長我不希望我覺得這件事情如果要做他不是你他不是你的藉口我覺得你不要拿現在通膨的問題來做因為這個是一個正確方向我們也要跟國際接軌謝謝李委員支持你現在來講這個事情就是你的藉口方向正確但是重點是你已經準備了兩三天到底準備了什麼東西你今年還不斷的在拖\n因為大院也是在去年1月份才通過《氣候變遷因應法》環境部以前的...國際都在準備啦你不要講說大院去年才通過你環境部在這麼久你什麼都沒做那也真是離譜但是全世界立法院光是在討論碳稅、碳費已經討論得及了是啊討論很久2020年就提出這個...你不要講立法院提出你自己是環境部你行政部門都在等立法院做\n李燕秀委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.661 --> 00:06.902\n委員會主席\n\n00:16.497 --> 00:30.434\n昨天我們開第二場碳費率的審議會本來決定要端出來的最後的調整機制就是我們要端出碳費率的相關的一些調整要公佈到最後我們還是再一次跳票\n\n00:31.275 --> 00:52.443\n我們這個跳票其實已經不是第一次包括在112年當時我們本來說要推出來到最後我們還是延期那昨天的說法是說我們要等到今年溫室氣體排放的計算碳費出來溫室氣體排放量出來才有辦法去做估算那我們要114年才開始繳碳費\n\n00:57.205 --> 01:08.438\n就是不管現在遊戲規則是什麼包括剛才提到台版的CBAN就是看起來我們在很多法規上好像看起來都還沒有準備好那這個就牽涉到幾個問題就是接下來整個遊戲規則是什麼\n\n01:13.343 --> 01:38.790\n不論是大型的企業界產業界或中小型的企業界現在都完全不知道我們未來碳費的徵收的規劃跟方向到底是怎麼處理包括產業界也產生幾個問題它相關的一些產業界的佈局機器的佈局相關的佈局它到底要怎麼去做調整佈局營運等等其實這些都牽扯在裡頭那去年我們也看到\n\n01:39.790 --> 01:54.701\n蔡英文總統去參加我們的這個碳交易所的接牌典禮,她也特別提到就是說要把低碳跟零碳的挑戰化為新的機會跟商機但是機會到底是什麼?商機到底是什麼?現在還沒看到\n\n01:59.564 --> 02:27.398\n對於中小企業來說他們還不知道到底整個邏輯跟方向到底是什麼也沒有辦法知道說到底後面是什麼怎麼去做一個遵循的方向所以現在很多產業界都普遍對於未來徵收碳稅也好碳費也好都面臨叫做碳焦慮所以臺大風險中心連續兩年公正轉型的調查當中有五成的受訪者完全不清楚\n\n02:27.938 --> 02:44.038\n政府的淨零政策到底是什麼?你的方向到底是什麼?你的內容實際到底是什麼?八成的受訪者更認為淨零排碳的政策應該關注更多的中小企業。有六成四的民眾受訪者擔心會有物價上漲的問題。\n\n02:47.282 --> 02:50.904\n無論碳稅或碳費最後可能會有綠色通膨的問題有50.4%的民眾會擔心說公司會經營困難倒閉因為這些都可能還有一些營運成本還有相關的法規的配合\n\n03:03.969 --> 03:07.990\n二、處理或審查中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度\n\n03:32.801 --> 03:57.597\n沒有耶你沒問對不對我們如果是中小企業我點進去看我真的不知道在未來因應淨零轉型的過程當中碳稅或碳費我法規的配合政府可以給我什麼樣的支持跟援助我打電話進去問我如果是一個中小企業的老闆我問說我應該怎麼遵循你可以給我什麼樣的援助我覺得他也講不出來你同意我的說法嗎我現在在你現場我馬上打電話問\n\n04:00.467 --> 04:08.912\n理委員當然表示的是不問民眾的聲音或企業的聲音環境部會來重視經濟部應該給的資助我覺得這個議題是跨部會無論是經濟部也好或是環境部也好未來的\n\n04:21.019 --> 04:45.169\n內容到底是什麼我遵循的方向到底是什麼未來我的產業佈局我的機器設備我可以上下游我做什麼樣的調整這個不是你馬上法令一公佈我馬上就可以做調整企業因應產業界因應它有它的佈局跟時間嘛是就如李委員所講事實上這方面的資訊非常的豐富啦並沒有所謂的他不曉得要怎麼去轉型因為\n\n04:46.189 --> 04:46.850\n沒有李委員講的這個情況\n\n05:04.213 --> 05:17.107\n所有這次要接受碳會徵收的對象甚至是3年前就已經得到通知他們去做碳盤查你法規跟內容怎麼去做調整\n\n05:18.936 --> 05:36.191\n部長我包括我們中小企業你雖然說第一階段不去徵收但是我們台灣有13%的中小企業是靠外銷營收佔將近三兆那未來他有沒有足夠的資源瞭解這些遊戲內容規則包括他後面的邏輯到底是什麼\n\n05:40.735 --> 06:02.418\n我覺得非常重要,他們到底清不清楚政府可以給予多少的資訊跟資源,包括我剛才講的那個LineApp圖片,包括我打電話進去一個專線問,他到底能不能,因為每個中小型企業營運的方向不一樣,他的產業也不一樣,你經濟部也好,你環境部也好,你能直接面對他的問題可以回答到哪個程度?\n\n06:04.790 --> 06:05.770\n接下來我覺得還有綠色通紅的挑戰的問題\n\n06:22.978 --> 06:48.280\n因為民眾也擔心說未來如果針對於碳費或碳稅的徵收會不會增加一些通膨的問題會不會有直接的影響那後續行政部門到底有沒有什麼樣的工具可以抑制通膨方向正確我們絕對要走有沒有其他的工具因為現在電價一漲通膨已經很嚴重那綠色通膨又一再來你明年又要做我支持要做我也覺得應該要做\n\n06:50.302 --> 07:06.729\n這個你有沒有工具?所以李委員就是說我們不要把沒有在3月底前公佈碳費的費率一直站在比較負面的角度從某一個角度來看不是正好符合剛剛李委員講我們事實上應該考量是不是將來會有綠色通膨以及電費的漲價\n\n07:10.971 --> 07:33.687\n會不會對部長我不希望我覺得這件事情如果要做他不是你他不是你的藉口我覺得你不要拿現在通膨的問題來做因為這個是一個正確方向我們也要跟國際接軌謝謝李委員支持你現在來講這個事情就是你的藉口方向正確但是重點是你已經準備了兩三天到底準備了什麼東西你今年還不斷的在拖\n\n07:34.895 --> 08:02.103\n因為大院也是在去年1月份才通過《氣候變遷因應法》環境部以前的...國際都在準備啦你不要講說大院去年才通過你環境部在這麼久你什麼都沒做那也真是離譜但是全世界立法院光是在討論碳稅、碳費已經討論得及了是啊討論很久2020年就提出這個...你不要講立法院提出你自己是環境部你行政部門都在等立法院做\n\n08:03.705 --> 08:04.486\n李燕秀委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.661,"end":6.902,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":16.497,"end":30.434,"text":"昨天我們開第二場碳費率的審議會本來決定要端出來的最後的調整機制就是我們要端出碳費率的相關的一些調整要公佈到最後我們還是再一次跳票"},{"start":31.275,"end":52.443,"text":"我們這個跳票其實已經不是第一次包括在112年當時我們本來說要推出來到最後我們還是延期那昨天的說法是說我們要等到今年溫室氣體排放的計算碳費出來溫室氣體排放量出來才有辦法去做估算那我們要114年才開始繳碳費"},{"start":57.205,"end":68.438,"text":"就是不管現在遊戲規則是什麼包括剛才提到台版的CBAN就是看起來我們在很多法規上好像看起來都還沒有準備好那這個就牽涉到幾個問題就是接下來整個遊戲規則是什麼"},{"start":73.343,"end":98.79,"text":"不論是大型的企業界產業界或中小型的企業界現在都完全不知道我們未來碳費的徵收的規劃跟方向到底是怎麼處理包括產業界也產生幾個問題它相關的一些產業界的佈局機器的佈局相關的佈局它到底要怎麼去做調整佈局營運等等其實這些都牽扯在裡頭那去年我們也看到"},{"start":99.79,"end":114.701,"text":"蔡英文總統去參加我們的這個碳交易所的接牌典禮,她也特別提到就是說要把低碳跟零碳的挑戰化為新的機會跟商機但是機會到底是什麼?商機到底是什麼?現在還沒看到"},{"start":119.564,"end":147.398,"text":"對於中小企業來說他們還不知道到底整個邏輯跟方向到底是什麼也沒有辦法知道說到底後面是什麼怎麼去做一個遵循的方向所以現在很多產業界都普遍對於未來徵收碳稅也好碳費也好都面臨叫做碳焦慮所以臺大風險中心連續兩年公正轉型的調查當中有五成的受訪者完全不清楚"},{"start":147.938,"end":164.038,"text":"政府的淨零政策到底是什麼?你的方向到底是什麼?你的內容實際到底是什麼?八成的受訪者更認為淨零排碳的政策應該關注更多的中小企業。有六成四的民眾受訪者擔心會有物價上漲的問題。"},{"start":167.282,"end":170.904,"text":"無論碳稅或碳費最後可能會有綠色通膨的問題有50.4%的民眾會擔心說公司會經營困難倒閉因為這些都可能還有一些營運成本還有相關的法規的配合"},{"start":183.969,"end":187.99,"text":"二、處理或審查中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度中華民國113年度"},{"start":212.801,"end":237.597,"text":"沒有耶你沒問對不對我們如果是中小企業我點進去看我真的不知道在未來因應淨零轉型的過程當中碳稅或碳費我法規的配合政府可以給我什麼樣的支持跟援助我打電話進去問我如果是一個中小企業的老闆我問說我應該怎麼遵循你可以給我什麼樣的援助我覺得他也講不出來你同意我的說法嗎我現在在你現場我馬上打電話問"},{"start":240.467,"end":248.912,"text":"理委員當然表示的是不問民眾的聲音或企業的聲音環境部會來重視經濟部應該給的資助我覺得這個議題是跨部會無論是經濟部也好或是環境部也好未來的"},{"start":261.019,"end":285.169,"text":"內容到底是什麼我遵循的方向到底是什麼未來我的產業佈局我的機器設備我可以上下游我做什麼樣的調整這個不是你馬上法令一公佈我馬上就可以做調整企業因應產業界因應它有它的佈局跟時間嘛是就如李委員所講事實上這方面的資訊非常的豐富啦並沒有所謂的他不曉得要怎麼去轉型因為"},{"start":286.189,"end":286.85,"text":"沒有李委員講的這個情況"},{"start":304.213,"end":317.107,"text":"所有這次要接受碳會徵收的對象甚至是3年前就已經得到通知他們去做碳盤查你法規跟內容怎麼去做調整"},{"start":318.936,"end":336.191,"text":"部長我包括我們中小企業你雖然說第一階段不去徵收但是我們台灣有13%的中小企業是靠外銷營收佔將近三兆那未來他有沒有足夠的資源瞭解這些遊戲內容規則包括他後面的邏輯到底是什麼"},{"start":340.735,"end":362.418,"text":"我覺得非常重要,他們到底清不清楚政府可以給予多少的資訊跟資源,包括我剛才講的那個Line App圖片,包括我打電話進去一個專線問,他到底能不能,因為每個中小型企業營運的方向不一樣,他的產業也不一樣,你經濟部也好,你環境部也好,你能直接面對他的問題可以回答到哪個程度?"},{"start":364.79,"end":365.77,"text":"接下來我覺得還有綠色通紅的挑戰的問題"},{"start":382.978,"end":408.28,"text":"因為民眾也擔心說未來如果針對於碳費或碳稅的徵收會不會增加一些通膨的問題會不會有直接的影響那後續行政部門到底有沒有什麼樣的工具可以抑制通膨方向正確我們絕對要走有沒有其他的工具因為現在電價一漲通膨已經很嚴重那綠色通膨又一再來你明年又要做我支持要做我也覺得應該要做"},{"start":410.302,"end":426.729,"text":"這個你有沒有工具?所以李委員就是說我們不要把沒有在3月底前公佈碳費的費率一直站在比較負面的角度從某一個角度來看不是正好符合剛剛李委員講我們事實上應該考量是不是將來會有綠色通膨以及電費的漲價"},{"start":430.971,"end":453.687,"text":"會不會對部長我不希望我覺得這件事情如果要做他不是你他不是你的藉口我覺得你不要拿現在通膨的問題來做因為這個是一個正確方向我們也要跟國際接軌謝謝李委員支持你現在來講這個事情就是你的藉口方向正確但是重點是你已經準備了兩三天到底準備了什麼東西你今年還不斷的在拖"},{"start":454.895,"end":482.103,"text":"因為大院也是在去年1月份才通過《氣候變遷因應法》環境部以前的...國際都在準備啦你不要講說大院去年才通過你環境部在這麼久你什麼都沒做那也真是離譜但是全世界立法院光是在討論碳稅、碳費已經討論得及了是啊討論很久2020年就提出這個...你不要講立法院提出你自己是環境部你行政部門都在等立法院做"},{"start":483.705,"end":484.486,"text":"李燕秀委員"}]}}}}