{"id":150599,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150599","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/8fc09d97f3151fdf4db29143eedd7e153836925fc87402eef8ba9b0039caa7a631724058523239b15ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"張雅琳","委員發言時間":"10:42:35 - 10:55:47","影片長度":"00:13:12","會議時間":"2024-03-28T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：邀請核能安全委員會主任委員陳東陽列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。（3月27日及28日二天一次會））","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第5次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":5,"committees":[22],"id":"委員會-11-1-22-5"},"date":"2024-03-28","duration":792,"end_time":"2024-03-28T10:55:47+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-28T10:42:35+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":475,"blocks":[["張委員雅琳：（10時42分）謝謝。再麻煩核安會主委，謝謝。"],["主席：有請主委，謝謝。"],["陳主任委員東陽：張委員好。"],["張委員雅琳：主委好。大家都非常關心有關於核能發電的問題，我想要跟主委再請教一下，現在如果在運轉執照到期的時候，根據法規，我們需要評估這一系列的像老化評估、老化管理、老化分析、還有安全分析等等的報告，對不對？我知道如果要讓它繼續運轉，我們可以用修法來取消5到15年的申請時限，但是修法只是文字作業，我們還是必須從實務面來看，就是修法過後我們還是要準備老化管理的評估研議計畫。","在2011年的時候，核一廠光是準備期就要3年，時程上面好像從現在來看有點緩不濟急，而且重點是核一廠及核二廠的燃料池都已經滿了，可是我們的乾式貯存池卻一直卡關，無法興建，所以即便是核安會同意繼續運轉，但用過的燃料棒無法更新，一樣無法順利發電，這也就是核二廠一號機為什麼因此提早半年停機。主委，我這樣子的理解是正確的嗎？"],["陳主任委員東陽：正確。"],["張委員雅琳：好的。我們現在最大的困境就是找不到核廢料的處置場，所以我們不可能要用電卻又不處理核廢料，因為安全性還是非常重要的事情。我知道核三廠一號機的運轉預計在今年7月要到期，所以供應量大概剩3%，明年5月基本上就會歸零了。所以即便現在台電提出計畫，經過種種的程序，最快要到哪一年我們才有可能發電呢？"],["陳主任委員東陽：這個要看個案的機組。"],["張委員雅琳：我們從核三來看呢？"],["陳主任委員東陽：台電必須做相關的報告，去檢視核電廠相關的老化，然後形成一個報告。我跟委員報告，這樣的報告大概多少呢？大概是這麼多。"],["張委員雅琳：所以大概就是需要的時間應該也是相當長的，對不對？"],["陳主任委員東陽：相當長。這就是為什麼核電廠屆期在延役的時候，在5年前就必須提出申請，也就是5年到前15年，其實這樣的規定跟美國核管會是一致的，因為的確需要這麼多時間。"],["張委員雅琳：瞭解。主委，不好意思，我打斷一下，我想要聽到剛剛講的根據美國相關的作業辦法，我們就是需要這些時間。我現在也看了一下，根據今天早上最新的數字，我們核電的占比大概是6%，所以尋找電力是非常重要的，但是我們必須務實地面對現在的問題，我們應該透過其他的能源解決用電的問題。","接下來更重要的是討論核安的問題，因為這是直接影響到人民的安全。我們要使用核電的話，是不是要包含發電後放射性廢棄物的管制工作？歐盟講說要將核電視為綠能有幾項前提：第一個，必須是3.5代的新型原子爐核電機組，臺灣目前是嗎？"],["陳主任委員東陽：現在不是。"],["張委員雅琳：現在不是，好。這樣的機組是即使電源發生事故的時候，還是可以冷卻燃料棒，對不對？所以對於相關核廢料的處置更是要非常地嚴格，也必須在2050年以前找到高階核廢料的最終處置辦法，臺灣現在可以嗎？"],["陳主任委員東陽：高階核廢料終極處置，剛才其他委員也有提到，其實還是一個非常困難的問題。"],["張委員雅琳：非常困難，對，沒錯。"],["陳主任委員東陽：主要還是要社會溝通、民眾的共識。"],["張委員雅琳：對，所以剛剛種種的問題就是在講，現在貯存場的進度包括室外，我想再問一下，室外前面委員有問，至於室內，照現在的進度來講，核一、核二的室內乾貯場應該都已經要申請建照了，現在的進度如何呢？"],["陳主任委員東陽：核一廠室內的部分，誠如委員的PowerPoint，去年12月它已經提出……"],["張委員雅琳：申請了？"],["陳主任委員東陽：請購、採購。"],["張委員雅琳：OK。"],["陳主任委員東陽：核二廠要到明年的7月，核三廠要到後年大概5月或7月。"],["張委員雅琳：所以我們目前都是有一點delay，是嗎？"],["陳主任委員東陽：是的。"],["張委員雅琳：好，我想……"],["陳主任委員東陽：蓋這個還是需要好幾年的時間。"],["張委員雅琳：其實要談使用核電，我想可能不是現在最務實、科學、理性的做法。我看到核研所在改制為國原院的時候也做了幾件事情很不錯，就是我們確實已經開始來做很多綠能與系統的整合研究，目前技轉的件數到了16件，等於有16件是跟綠能有關係的，這是國家所有的人民都非常看重的一件事情，也更符合所謂2050淨零排碳計畫，所以這件事情我也會持續地關心。但是有一件非常重要的事情，就是我們有沒有足夠的人員來做這件事情？我看到你們研究人員的薪資低於同行，你們的薪水怎麼會比別人還低？因為去年我們在講要以行政法人提供一些彈性，可是跟太空中心、運科中心比起來，你們大學學歷、碩士學歷的薪水都別人低，甚至還比對面的中科院的薪水都還要來得低，這一點是什麼原因，主委可說明一下嗎？這樣的薪水能夠招到優秀的人才嗎？"],["陳主任委員東陽：是不是請院長來說明一下？"],["高院長梓木：報告委員，我們目前變成行政法人以後，院裡聘到的員工必須部分從自籌款裡面來籌措這些經費，所以對於研究人員的薪資，我們會比較謹慎一點。但是去年年底招收國原院自己的第一批，我們有103個名額，結果錄取了82位，表示錄取了接近八成，所以看來我們的薪資在市場上的行情，還是有滿多的包括一些博士、一些碩士都願意投入我們的行列。因為每個單位的條件都不太一樣，像我們進來以後……"],["張委員雅琳：好，我瞭解了，院長，我瞭解了，剛剛我聽到其實你們招收員工的狀態還不錯，但是我也是有聽到一些消息，也是有員工離職跳槽，所以我們必須針對薪資上面，剛剛雖然有說到自籌款，但是我想我們作為一個行政法人還是應該要積極去面對敘薪的問題，才能夠把更好的公務人員留在我們的體系裡面，從外面去找到更優秀的人進來，因為我們畢竟還是要去面對剛剛講的綠能計畫。","再來，我想要再確認一件事情，到底現在我們的公務人員有沒有核能加給？有沒有？"],["高院長梓木：報告委員，我們的公務人員因為是由原先改制過來的，所以原來公務員保障的權利還是沿襲原來……"],["張委員雅琳：是有的，是嗎？"],["高院長梓木：是有的，現在還是有保障。"],["張委員雅琳：好喔，因為你們提供給我們的資料是看不出來的，而且其實我們從上個禮拜四就一直不停地在問這件事情，我們希望去幫國原院爭取更優秀的人才，可是國原院卻不願意提供，還告訴我們公務人員的加給是機密，請問加給是機密嗎？不是吧？"],["高院長梓木：報告委員，這是法人，法人上因為有一些等於營運上的限制，目前九成以上的法人大概都拿不到詳細的薪資，至於初步的薪資，我們都提供了，但是很詳細的公務人員其他加給，我們找時間再跟委員當面親自報告。"],["張委員雅琳：如果這個加給不是機密的話，我希望主委可以回去督導國原院，還是要配合相關的監督跟索資，但也沒有關係，我們從其他地方拿到了，我們還是要來面對這個問題，因為改制後，我們的待遇跟過去的核研所相比還是降低了。回到我的重點，我們不但要跟業界競爭人才，我們的薪水一定要非常有競爭力，所以我也希望這個敘薪標準是不是有調整的規劃？是不是在下一次董事會就可以來處理這件事情？請教一下主委或是院長。"],["高院長梓木：是，我們的薪資，像今年院聘的薪資，公務員調4%，我們調了5%。"],["張委員雅琳：對。"],["高院長梓木：所以事實上我們會逐年檢討，而且我們院聘人員的年終獎金和績效獎金跟公務人員也不一樣，公務人員就是依照公務人員公職的年終獎金跟考績獎金，所以各有兩套不一樣的制度。"],["張委員雅琳：我想獎金是有，沒有錯，但是因為光在基本薪資上就有一些落差了，你可以看一下，從一般開始，你看每個月都差兩萬塊，一年就差24萬，我覺得這件事情我們還是要回去好好的檢討。","不好意思，再給我最後一題的時間，剛剛有委員有問到含氚廢水這件事情，去年日本8月24號執行第一次排放作業，現在已經要排放到第四批了，這件事情非常重要，核安會之前也做了一些檢測，也提供國人有關於鄰近海域的一些監測狀況來確保國人食用海產的安全，也跟海委會、農業部一起合作，過去從99年的33個採樣點，到現在已經有107個採樣點。但是我昨天去看了一下，我們目前的海域都是綠燈，看起來好像是非常沒有問題的，可是我進去看了每一個時間點，我發現從107個監測點，目前已經累積了137筆的資料，包含銫和氚的一些監控數據，但是現在到3月底了，今年只有35筆。","再來，日本是在去年8月24號執行第一批，其中137筆的資料中，有22筆是在排放前取樣的，甚至有4筆已經是112年3月5號由水試所來取樣，現在已經超過一年了，我也知道核安會本身沒有船隻，所以需要別人來幫忙，我想這樣子的監測可能是不夠即時的，甚至超過一年沒有更新了，我們有沒有可能提升到每季取樣一次或是跟更多的單位來合作，來確保國人的安全呢？"],["陳主任委員東陽：跟委員報告，因為船期跟航程的關係，其實我們大部分是每一季或每半年來執行取樣，甚至有些是到北太平洋，是相當大的距離，這個部分我們也跟水試所、海巡署相關單位都有一些配合，我們會裡面的輻射偵測中心也在近海的部分有做一些監測，這些網頁，你如果往下點，回到剛才下一頁，往下點，其實你可以看到whole map整個情況，跟委員報告說明。"],["張委員雅琳：對，但是我們看到……沒關係，因為時間到了，我們就稍後繼續討論一下有關於這個時間點的更新數據好嗎？謝謝。"],["主席（林委員宜瑾）：好，謝謝張雅琳委員。","我們接下來請羅廷瑋委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":368,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-5","speakers":["林宜瑾","洪孟楷","柯志恩","萬美玲","葛如鈞","葉元之","郭昱晴","吳沛憶","陳秀寳","陳培瑜","張雅琳","羅廷瑋","范雲","羅智強","李坤城","王鴻薇","翁曉玲","吳春城","林倩綺"],"page_start":323,"meetingDate":["2024-03-28"],"gazette_id":"1132201","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1132201_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第5次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請核能安全委員會主任委員陳東陽列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1132201_00005"}},"transcript":{"id":"150599","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150599","tool":"pyannote","id":"150599-pyannote"},"job_id":"fz1Lh03KFaM47Mxg","queued_at":"2024-06-01 17:24:59","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2024-06-01 17:25:48","msg":"downloading https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150599"},{"time":"2024-06-01 17:25:49","msg":"downloading 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\"text\": \"最後一題就是在剛剛有委員有問到寒川廢水這件事情就是去年日本8月24號排放了第一次的排放作業那現在已經要排放到第4批了那這件事情非常重要那核安會之前也做了一些檢測也提供了一些國人有關於臨近海域的一些監測狀況來確保國人使用海產的安全那也跟這個海委會農業部來一起合作\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"最\", \"start\": 649.707, \"end\": 649.907, \"score\": 0.864}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 649.907, \"end\": 650.007, \"score\": 0.784}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 650.007, \"end\": 650.167, \"score\": 0.803}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 650.167, \"end\": 650.287, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 650.287, \"end\": 650.388, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 650.388, \"end\": 650.828, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 650.828, \"end\": 651.088, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 651.088, \"end\": 651.408, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 651.408, \"end\": 651.628, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 651.628, \"end\": 651.768, \"score\": 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656.152, \"score\": 0.819}, {\"word\": \"2\"}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"號\"}, {\"word\": \"排\", \"start\": 656.152, \"end\": 656.312, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"放\", \"start\": 656.312, \"end\": 656.412, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 656.412, \"end\": 656.532, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 656.532, \"end\": 656.652, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 656.652, \"end\": 656.912, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"次\", \"start\": 656.912, \"end\": 657.092, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 657.092, \"end\": 657.312, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"排\", \"start\": 657.312, \"end\": 657.573, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"放\", \"start\": 657.573, \"end\": 657.833, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"作\", \"start\": 657.833, \"end\": 658.633, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 658.633, \"end\": 658.954, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 658.954, \"end\": 659.074, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"已\", \"start\": 659.074, \"end\": 659.234, \"score\": 0.729}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 659.234, \"end\": 659.374, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"排\", \"start\": 659.374, \"end\": 659.514, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"放\", \"start\": 659.514, \"end\": 659.654, \"score\": 0.803}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 659.654, \"end\": 659.794, \"score\": 0.846}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 659.794, \"end\": 660.274, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"批\", \"start\": 660.274, \"end\": 660.455, \"score\": 0.82}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 660.455, \"end\": 661.095, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 661.095, \"end\": 661.355, \"score\": 0.802}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"件\", \"start\": 661.355, \"end\": 661.595, \"score\": 0.858}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 661.595, \"end\": 661.715, \"score\": 0.798}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 661.715, \"end\": 661.936, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"非\", 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\"start\": 666.579, \"end\": 666.739, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 666.739, \"end\": 666.839, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 666.839, \"end\": 666.899, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 666.899, \"end\": 669.061, \"score\": 0.845}, {\"word\": \"監\"}, {\"word\": \"測\"}, {\"word\": \"狀\"}, {\"word\": \"況\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"確\"}, {\"word\": \"保\", \"start\": 669.061, \"end\": 669.461, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 669.461, \"end\": 669.721, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"使\", \"start\": 669.721, \"end\": 669.881, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 669.881, \"end\": 670.101, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"海\", \"start\": 670.101, \"end\": 670.642, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"產\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 670.642, \"end\": 670.822, \"score\": 0.814}, {\"word\": \"安\", \"start\": 670.822, \"end\": 671.142, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"全\", \"start\": 671.142, \"end\": 671.783, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 671.783, \"end\": 671.943, \"score\": 0.858}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 671.943, \"end\": 672.143, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 672.143, \"end\": 672.643, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"海\", \"start\": 672.643, \"end\": 673.464, \"score\": 0.861}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 673.464, \"end\": 673.684, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"農\"}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 673.684, \"end\": 674.204, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 674.204, \"end\": 674.324, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"起\", \"start\": 674.324, \"end\": 674.544, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"合\", \"start\": 674.544, \"end\": 674.805, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"作\", \"start\": 674.805, \"end\": 674.825, \"score\": 0.882}]}, {\"start\": 675.405, \"end\": 703.133, \"text\": \"那過去呢從99年的33個採樣點到現在已經有107個採樣點但是呢我昨天我去看了一下我們目前的海域都是綠燈看起來好像是非常沒有問題的可是我進去看了每一個時間點我發現從107個監測點目前已經累積了137筆的資料包含色和穿的一些監控數據但是現在到了3月底了今年只有35筆\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 675.405, \"end\": 675.765, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 675.765, \"end\": 675.945, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 675.945, \"end\": 676.565, \"score\": 0.819}, {\"word\": \"從\"}, {\"word\": \"9\"}, {\"word\": \"9\"}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 676.565, \"end\": 676.685, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 676.685, \"end\": 678.006, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"3\"}, {\"word\": \"3\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"採\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"點\"}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 678.006, \"end\": 678.426, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 678.426, \"end\": 678.866, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"已\", \"start\": 678.866, \"end\": 679.766, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", 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{\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 700.073, \"end\": 700.753, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 700.753, \"end\": 701.013, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 701.013, \"end\": 701.233, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 701.233, \"end\": 701.673, \"score\": 0.957}, {\"word\": \"3\"}, {\"word\": \"月\", \"start\": 701.673, \"end\": 701.953, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"底\", \"start\": 701.953, \"end\": 702.153, \"score\": 0.983}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 702.153, \"end\": 702.433, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 702.433, \"end\": 702.653, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 702.653, \"end\": 702.953, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"只\", \"start\": 702.953, \"end\": 703.113, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 703.113, \"end\": 703.133, \"score\": 0.436}, {\"word\": \"3\"}, {\"word\": \"5\"}, {\"word\": \"筆\"}]}, {\"start\": 706.635, \"end\": 715.077, \"text\": \"日本在去年8月24日執行第一批．其中137筆的資料中．有22筆是在排放前取樣的．甚至有4筆已經是112年的3月5日．是由水事所來取樣．現在已經超過一年了\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"日\", \"start\": 706.635, \"end\": 706.815, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 706.815, \"end\": 707.095, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 707.095, \"end\": 707.415, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 707.415, \"end\": 707.535, \"score\": 0.961}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 707.535, \"end\": 707.895, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"8\"}, {\"word\": \"月\", \"start\": 707.895, \"end\": 709.075, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"2\"}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"日\", \"start\": 709.075, \"end\": 709.215, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"執\"}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 709.215, \"end\": 709.415, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 709.415, \"end\": 709.535, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 709.535, \"end\": 709.736, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"批\", \"start\": 709.736, \"end\": 710.776, \"score\": 0.976}, 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\"start\": 759.401, \"end\": 759.641, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"署\", \"start\": 759.641, \"end\": 760.341, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 760.341, \"end\": 760.721, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 760.721, \"end\": 760.861, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 760.861, \"end\": 761.001, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 761.001, \"end\": 761.081, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 761.081, \"end\": 761.241, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"配\", \"start\": 761.241, \"end\": 761.481, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"合\", \"start\": 761.481, \"end\": 761.841, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 761.841, \"end\": 762.001, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 762.001, \"end\": 762.662, \"score\": 0.859}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"裡\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 762.662, \"end\": 763.042, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"輻\"}, {\"word\": \"射\", \"start\": 763.042, \"end\": 763.202, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 763.202, \"end\": 763.362, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"策\", \"start\": 763.362, \"end\": 763.502, \"score\": 0.861}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 763.502, \"end\": 763.702, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"心\", \"start\": 763.702, \"end\": 763.722, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"張\"}, {\"word\": \"雅\", \"start\": 764.322, \"end\": 764.442, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"琳\", \"start\": 764.442, \"end\": 764.462, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,329 --> 00:00:00,469\n張委員好\n\n2\n00:00:13,115 --> 00:00:37,850\n主委好,就是說大家都非常關心我關於核能的這個法典的問題那我想跟主委再請教一下就是說我們現在呢如果在運轉執照到期的時候其實我們根據法規我們是需要提供這一系列的像老化評估、老化管理、老化分析還有安全分析等等的報告對不對那我知道就是說如果要讓它繼續運轉的話我們是可以用修法修法來取消5到15年的申請時限\n\n3\n00:00:38,951 --> 00:01:07,833\n但是修法只是文字作業我們還是必須的用從實務面來看就是修法過後我們還是要準備這個老化管理的評估研議計畫那在2011年的時候核一廠就是說這個光準備期就要到三年所以時程上面其實好像從現在來看是有點緩不濟急而且重點是我們的核一廠跟核二廠的這個燃料池都已經滿了可是我們的乾式儲存池卻一直卡關無法興建\n\n4\n00:01:09,074 --> 00:01:21,448\n所以即便是您同意核安會同意來繼續運轉但用過的燃料棒無法更新一樣是無法順利發電所以這也就是我們核二廠一號機為什麼因此停早半年停機主委我這樣子的理解是正確的嗎正確好的\n\n5\n00:01:23,891 --> 00:01:46,798\n我們現在最大的困境就是我們找不到核廢料的處置場所以我們不可能說要用電卻又不處理這個核廢料因為安全性還是一個非常重要的一件事情那我知道就是說我們核三廠的一號機運轉預計是在今年的7月要到期所以我們大概就是供應量大概剩3%那明年基本上就會歸零了嘛明年5月就會歸零了\n\n6\n00:01:48,146 --> 00:01:54,604\n所以即便現在臺電提出計畫然後經過這些種種種種的程序最快要到哪一年我們才有可能發電呢?\n\n7\n00:01:59,119 --> 00:02:20,784\n這個要看這個個案,個案的機組那我們從核三來看呢?臺電必須去做相關的這些的報告那去檢視這個核電廠相關的老化的然後形成一個報告我跟委員報告,這樣的報告大概多少呢?大概是這麼多\n\n8\n00:02:21,684 --> 00:02:41,536\n所以大概就是需要的時間應該是相當長的對不對相當長然後這就是為什麼核電廠藉其他在研議的時候他在5年前就必須提出申請5年到前15年其實這樣的規定其實是跟美國核管會其實是一致的因為的確是需要這麼多時間\n\n9\n00:02:44,118 --> 00:03:04,637\n我打斷一下,我打開就是想要聽到剛剛講大概需要根據美國的一些相關的作業辦法我們就是需要這些時間所以我現在也看了一下最新今天早上的數字就是我們的核電的佔比大概是6%所以我們當然尋找電力是一件非常重要但是我們是必須的務實的去面對現在的問題就是說我們現在的問題是應該透過其他的能源來解決用電的問題\n\n10\n00:03:10,463 --> 00:03:17,481\n我想接下來我們就要更重要去討論核安的問題因為這是直接影響到人民的安全\n\n11\n00:03:19,284 --> 00:03:41,610\n所以我們現在從那個核安是不是應該在發那個我們要使用核電的話我們是不是要包含發電後的放射性廢棄物的管制工作那根據歐盟是有講說我們核電要視為綠能有幾項前提第一個它必須是3.5代的新型原子爐的核電機組那台灣是嗎台灣目前是嗎\n\n12\n00:03:44,211 --> 00:03:44,832\n臺灣現在可以嗎?\n\n13\n00:04:05,831 --> 00:04:09,414\n主要還是要社會溝通和民眾的共識所以我想從剛剛種種的問題就是在講說我們現在儲存廠的進度\n\n14\n00:04:24,367 --> 00:04:28,770\n河一和二的室內乾燥場應該都已經要申請建造了那現在的進度如何呢河一廠室內的部分就是在陳竹委員在這個PowerPoint裡面的就是去年12月他已經提出這個這個申請了對這個\n\n15\n00:04:57,111 --> 00:05:06,976\n請購核二廠要到明年的7月核三廠要到後年的大概5月還是7月所以我們目前都是有一點delay的是嗎是的\n\n16\n00:05:09,898 --> 00:05:36,719\n蓋這個還是需要好幾年的時間好幾年的時間所以我想我們這個其實要談使用核電我想現在可能不是現在最務實科學理性的一個做法那我想我看到就是核研所在改制國研院的時候也做了幾件事情很不錯就是說我們確實已經開始來做很多綠能與系統的一些整合研究那目前的計轉的件數其實到了16件就等於是有16件是跟綠能有關係的\n\n17\n00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:38,401\n我看到研究人員的薪資低於同行內\n\n18\n00:05:58,814 --> 00:05:59,174\n主委抱歉\n\n19\n00:06:25,342 --> 00:06:48,660\n主委可以來說明一下呢我們這樣子的薪水能夠招到優秀的人才嗎我是不是請院長來說明一下報告委員我們目前因為是變成行政法人以後這個院裡聘到的員工就是必須要從部分要從自籌款裡面來\n\n20\n00:06:51,547 --> 00:07:14,160\n來籌措這些經費所以對於我們研究人員的薪資我們會比較謹慎一點但是去年年底我們第一批招收我們國務院自己的第一批我們有103個名額結果入取了82位表示入取了接近八成所以看來我們的薪資在市場上是還是有\n\n21\n00:07:15,220 --> 00:07:41,121\n有蠻多的這個包括這個一些博士啦一些碩士都願意來投入我們的行列所以因為每個單位的條件都不太一樣像我們進來以後好我了解了好院長我了解了就是剛我聽到說就是你們其實招收員工的狀態還不錯齁但是因為據我有聽到一些消息啦齁就是說是也是有員工離職跳槽啦齁所以我想這個我們\n\n22\n00:07:41,821 --> 00:08:10,538\n我們還是必須在薪資上面的因為剛剛雖然有說我做自籌款的但是我想我們作為一個行政法人我們還是應該要積極的來去面對這個續薪的問題啦我們才能夠把更好的公務人員留在我們的體系裡面那從外面去找到更優秀的人進來因為我們畢竟還是要去面對我們剛剛講的綠能的這個計畫所以呢那再來就是說我想要再確認一件事情我們到底現在公務人員有沒有核能加擠\n\n23\n00:08:11,811 --> 00:08:12,080\n有沒有\n\n24\n00:08:13,650 --> 00:08:41,602\n報告委員我們公務人員因為是由原先改制過來的所以原來的權利公務員的保障的權利還是原來是有的是嗎是有的現在還是有有保障那我因為你們提供給我們的資料是看不出來的而且我們其實從上禮拜四就一直不停的在問這件事情我們希望就是去幫國務院院爭取更優秀人才可是國務院院卻不願意提供還告訴我們公務人員的家籍\n\n25\n00:08:44,463 --> 00:09:08,937\n請問加擠是機密嗎?不是吧?報言這是法人法人上因為他有一些營運上的等於說限制必須有些詳細的薪資目前九成以上的法人大概都拿不到就拿不到詳細的我們初步的薪資這個都是我們都提供了但是很詳細的公務人員這個\n\n26\n00:09:11,258 --> 00:09:27,413\n其他的加級我們當面再跟委員找時間再親自報告我想這個加級如果不是機密的話那我還是希望主委可以回去督導國務院還是要配合相關的監督跟所知但也沒有關係我們還是從其他的地方拿到了這些\n\n27\n00:09:35,538 --> 00:10:01,964\n我想我們還是要去來面對這個問題因為我們改制後我們的待遇還是跟過去的核研所來比我們還是降低了還是回到我的重點我們不但要跟業界競爭人才我們的薪水一定要非常有競爭力所以我也希望這個續薪標準是不是有調整的規劃那是不是可以在下一次董事會就可以來處理這件事情\n\n28\n00:10:03,264 --> 00:10:29,642\n主委請教或是院長請教一下我們薪資像今年院聘的薪資公務員調4%我們調了5%所以事實上我們會檢討逐年會檢討而且我們院聘的人員那個年終的獎金跟績效獎金跟公務人員也不一樣公務人員就是依照公務人員公職的這個年終獎金跟考期獎金所以各有兩套不一樣的制度\n\n29\n00:10:30,462 --> 00:10:48,084\n我想獎金是有沒有錯但是我想因為光這個基本的薪資上面就有一些落差了因為你可以看一下光這個一般開始你看每個月都差兩萬塊一個月都差二十四萬我覺得這件事情我們還是要回去的好好的檢討那不好意思再給我最後一題的時間抱歉\n\n30\n00:10:49,707 --> 00:11:14,825\n最後一題就是在剛剛有委員有問到寒川廢水這件事情就是去年日本8月24號排放了第一次的排放作業那現在已經要排放到第4批了那這件事情非常重要那核安會之前也做了一些檢測也提供了一些國人有關於臨近海域的一些監測狀況來確保國人使用海產的安全那也跟這個海委會農業部來一起合作\n\n31\n00:11:15,405 --> 00:11:43,133\n那過去呢從99年的33個採樣點到現在已經有107個採樣點但是呢我昨天我去看了一下我們目前的海域都是綠燈看起來好像是非常沒有問題的可是我進去看了每一個時間點我發現從107個監測點目前已經累積了137筆的資料包含色和穿的一些監控數據但是現在到了3月底了今年只有35筆\n\n32\n00:11:46,635 --> 00:11:55,077\n日本在去年8月24日執行第一批．其中137筆的資料中．有22筆是在排放前取樣的．甚至有4筆已經是112年的3月5日．是由水事所來取樣．現在已經超過一年了\n\n33\n00:12:06,980 --> 00:12:21,955\n好那我也知道說核安會本身沒有船隻啦所以需要別人來幫忙那我想這樣子的監測可能是不夠及時的甚至超過一年沒有更新了我們有沒有可能提升到每季取樣一次或是跟更多的單位來合作來確保國人的安全呢\n\n34\n00:12:22,755 --> 00:12:43,722\n跟委員報告因為船期跟航程的關係其實我們大部分是每一季或每半年來執行取樣甚至有些是到北太平洋是相當大的距離那麼這個部分我們也跟水事所海巡署相關都有一些配合那我們會裡面輻射政策中心\n\n35\n00:12:44,322 --> 00:12:44,462\n謝謝張雅琳\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n329\t469\t張委員好\n13115\t37850\t主委好,就是說大家都非常關心我關於核能的這個法典的問題那我想跟主委再請教一下就是說我們現在呢如果在運轉執照到期的時候其實我們根據法規我們是需要提供這一系列的像老化評估、老化管理、老化分析還有安全分析等等的報告對不對那我知道就是說如果要讓它繼續運轉的話我們是可以用修法修法來取消5到15年的申請時限\n38951\t67833\t但是修法只是文字作業我們還是必須的用從實務面來看就是修法過後我們還是要準備這個老化管理的評估研議計畫那在2011年的時候核一廠就是說這個光準備期就要到三年所以時程上面其實好像從現在來看是有點緩不濟急而且重點是我們的核一廠跟核二廠的這個燃料池都已經滿了可是我們的乾式儲存池卻一直卡關無法興建\n69074\t81448\t所以即便是您同意核安會同意來繼續運轉但用過的燃料棒無法更新一樣是無法順利發電所以這也就是我們核二廠一號機為什麼因此停早半年停機主委我這樣子的理解是正確的嗎正確好的\n83891\t106798\t我們現在最大的困境就是我們找不到核廢料的處置場所以我們不可能說要用電卻又不處理這個核廢料因為安全性還是一個非常重要的一件事情那我知道就是說我們核三廠的一號機運轉預計是在今年的7月要到期所以我們大概就是供應量大概剩3%那明年基本上就會歸零了嘛明年5月就會歸零了\n108146\t114604\t所以即便現在臺電提出計畫然後經過這些種種種種的程序最快要到哪一年我們才有可能發電呢?\n119119\t140784\t這個要看這個個案,個案的機組那我們從核三來看呢?臺電必須去做相關的這些的報告那去檢視這個核電廠相關的老化的然後形成一個報告我跟委員報告,這樣的報告大概多少呢?大概是這麼多\n141684\t161536\t所以大概就是需要的時間應該是相當長的對不對相當長然後這就是為什麼核電廠藉其他在研議的時候他在5年前就必須提出申請5年到前15年其實這樣的規定其實是跟美國核管會其實是一致的因為的確是需要這麼多時間\n164118\t184637\t我打斷一下,我打開就是想要聽到剛剛講大概需要根據美國的一些相關的作業辦法我們就是需要這些時間所以我現在也看了一下最新今天早上的數字就是我們的核電的佔比大概是6%所以我們當然尋找電力是一件非常重要但是我們是必須的務實的去面對現在的問題就是說我們現在的問題是應該透過其他的能源來解決用電的問題\n190463\t197481\t我想接下來我們就要更重要去討論核安的問題因為這是直接影響到人民的安全\n199284\t221610\t所以我們現在從那個核安是不是應該在發那個我們要使用核電的話我們是不是要包含發電後的放射性廢棄物的管制工作那根據歐盟是有講說我們核電要視為綠能有幾項前提第一個它必須是3.5代的新型原子爐的核電機組那台灣是嗎台灣目前是嗎\n224211\t224832\t臺灣現在可以嗎?\n245831\t249414\t主要還是要社會溝通和民眾的共識所以我想從剛剛種種的問題就是在講說我們現在儲存廠的進度\n264367\t268770\t河一和二的室內乾燥場應該都已經要申請建造了那現在的進度如何呢河一廠室內的部分就是在陳竹委員在這個PowerPoint裡面的就是去年12月他已經提出這個這個 申請了對這個\n297111\t306976\t請購核二廠要到明年的7月核三廠要到後年的大概5月還是7月所以我們目前都是有一點delay的是嗎是的\n309898\t336719\t蓋這個還是需要好幾年的時間好幾年的時間所以我想我們這個其實要談使用核電我想現在可能不是現在最務實科學理性的一個做法那我想我看到就是核研所在改制國研院的時候也做了幾件事情很不錯就是說我們確實已經開始來做很多綠能與系統的一些整合研究那目前的計轉的件數其實到了16件就等於是有16件是跟綠能有關係的\n337760\t338401\t我看到研究人員的薪資低於同行內\n358814\t359174\t主委 抱歉\n385342\t408660\t主委可以來說明一下呢我們這樣子的薪水能夠招到優秀的人才嗎我是不是請院長來說明一下報告委員我們目前因為是變成行政法人以後這個院裡聘到的員工就是必須要從部分要從自籌款裡面來\n411547\t434160\t來籌措這些經費所以對於我們研究人員的薪資我們會比較謹慎一點但是去年年底我們第一批招收我們國務院自己的第一批我們有103個名額結果入取了82位表示入取了接近八成所以看來我們的薪資在市場上是還是有\n435220\t461121\t有蠻多的這個包括這個一些博士啦一些碩士都願意來投入我們的行列所以因為每個單位的條件都不太一樣像我們進來以後好我了解了好院長我了解了就是剛我聽到說就是你們其實招收員工的狀態還不錯齁但是因為據我有聽到一些消息啦齁就是說是也是有員工離職跳槽啦齁所以我想這個我們\n461821\t490538\t我們還是必須在薪資上面的因為剛剛雖然有說我做自籌款的但是我想我們作為一個行政法人我們還是應該要積極的來去面對這個續薪的問題啦我們才能夠把更好的公務人員留在我們的體系裡面那從外面去找到更優秀的人進來因為我們畢竟還是要去面對我們剛剛講的綠能的這個計畫所以呢那再來就是說我想要再確認一件事情我們到底現在公務人員有沒有核能加擠\n491811\t492080\t有沒有\n493650\t521602\t報告委員我們公務人員因為是由原先改制過來的所以原來的權利公務員的保障的權利還是原來是有的是嗎是有的現在還是有有保障那我因為你們提供給我們的資料是看不出來的而且我們其實從上禮拜四就一直不停的在問這件事情我們希望就是去幫國務院院爭取更優秀人才可是國務院院卻不願意提供還告訴我們公務人員的家籍\n524463\t548937\t請問加擠是機密嗎?不是吧?報言這是法人法人上因為他有一些營運上的等於說限制必須有些詳細的薪資目前九成以上的法人大概都拿不到就拿不到詳細的我們初步的薪資這個都是我們都提供了但是很詳細的公務人員這個\n551258\t567413\t其他的加級我們當面再跟委員找時間再親自報告我想這個加級如果不是機密的話那我還是希望主委可以回去督導國務院還是要配合相關的監督跟所知但也沒有關係我們還是從其他的地方拿到了這些\n575538\t601964\t我想我們還是要去來面對這個問題因為我們改制後我們的待遇還是跟過去的核研所來比我們還是降低了還是回到我的重點我們不但要跟業界競爭人才我們的薪水一定要非常有競爭力所以我也希望這個續薪標準是不是有調整的規劃那是不是可以在下一次董事會就可以來處理這件事情\n603264\t629642\t主委請教或是院長請教一下我們薪資像今年院聘的薪資公務員調4%我們調了5%所以事實上我們會檢討逐年會檢討而且我們院聘的人員那個年終的獎金跟績效獎金跟公務人員也不一樣公務人員就是依照公務人員公職的這個年終獎金跟考期獎金所以各有兩套不一樣的制度\n630462\t648084\t我想獎金是有沒有錯但是我想因為光這個基本的薪資上面就有一些落差了因為你可以看一下光這個一般開始你看每個月都差兩萬塊一個月都差二十四萬我覺得這件事情我們還是要回去的好好的檢討那不好意思再給我最後一題的時間抱歉\n649707\t674825\t最後一題就是在剛剛有委員有問到寒川廢水這件事情就是去年日本8月24號排放了第一次的排放作業那現在已經要排放到第4批了那這件事情非常重要那核安會之前也做了一些檢測也提供了一些國人有關於臨近海域的一些監測狀況來確保國人使用海產的安全那也跟這個海委會農業部來一起合作\n675405\t703133\t那過去呢從99年的33個採樣點到現在已經有107個採樣點但是呢我昨天我去看了一下我們目前的海域都是綠燈看起來好像是非常沒有問題的可是我進去看了每一個時間點我發現從107個監測點目前已經累積了137筆的資料包含色和穿的一些監控數據但是現在到了3月底了今年只有35筆\n706635\t715077\t日本在去年8月24日執行第一批．其中137筆的資料中．有22筆是在排放前取樣的．甚至有4筆已經是112年的3月5日．是由水事所來取樣．現在已經超過一年了\n726980\t741955\t好 那我也知道說 核安會本身沒有船隻啦所以需要別人來幫忙那我想這樣子的監測可能是不夠及時的甚至超過一年沒有更新了我們有沒有可能提升到每季取樣一次或是跟更多的單位來合作來確保國人的安全呢\n742755\t763722\t跟委員報告因為船期跟航程的關係其實我們大部分是每一季或每半年來執行取樣甚至有些是到北太平洋是相當大的距離那麼這個部分我們也跟水事所海巡署相關都有一些配合那我們會裡面輻射政策中心\n764322\t764462\t謝謝張雅琳\n","txt":"張委員好\n主委好,就是說大家都非常關心我關於核能的這個法典的問題那我想跟主委再請教一下就是說我們現在呢如果在運轉執照到期的時候其實我們根據法規我們是需要提供這一系列的像老化評估、老化管理、老化分析還有安全分析等等的報告對不對那我知道就是說如果要讓它繼續運轉的話我們是可以用修法修法來取消5到15年的申請時限\n但是修法只是文字作業我們還是必須的用從實務面來看就是修法過後我們還是要準備這個老化管理的評估研議計畫那在2011年的時候核一廠就是說這個光準備期就要到三年所以時程上面其實好像從現在來看是有點緩不濟急而且重點是我們的核一廠跟核二廠的這個燃料池都已經滿了可是我們的乾式儲存池卻一直卡關無法興建\n所以即便是您同意核安會同意來繼續運轉但用過的燃料棒無法更新一樣是無法順利發電所以這也就是我們核二廠一號機為什麼因此停早半年停機主委我這樣子的理解是正確的嗎正確好的\n我們現在最大的困境就是我們找不到核廢料的處置場所以我們不可能說要用電卻又不處理這個核廢料因為安全性還是一個非常重要的一件事情那我知道就是說我們核三廠的一號機運轉預計是在今年的7月要到期所以我們大概就是供應量大概剩3%那明年基本上就會歸零了嘛明年5月就會歸零了\n所以即便現在臺電提出計畫然後經過這些種種種種的程序最快要到哪一年我們才有可能發電呢?\n這個要看這個個案,個案的機組那我們從核三來看呢?臺電必須去做相關的這些的報告那去檢視這個核電廠相關的老化的然後形成一個報告我跟委員報告,這樣的報告大概多少呢?大概是這麼多\n所以大概就是需要的時間應該是相當長的對不對相當長然後這就是為什麼核電廠藉其他在研議的時候他在5年前就必須提出申請5年到前15年其實這樣的規定其實是跟美國核管會其實是一致的因為的確是需要這麼多時間\n我打斷一下,我打開就是想要聽到剛剛講大概需要根據美國的一些相關的作業辦法我們就是需要這些時間所以我現在也看了一下最新今天早上的數字就是我們的核電的佔比大概是6%所以我們當然尋找電力是一件非常重要但是我們是必須的務實的去面對現在的問題就是說我們現在的問題是應該透過其他的能源來解決用電的問題\n我想接下來我們就要更重要去討論核安的問題因為這是直接影響到人民的安全\n所以我們現在從那個核安是不是應該在發那個我們要使用核電的話我們是不是要包含發電後的放射性廢棄物的管制工作那根據歐盟是有講說我們核電要視為綠能有幾項前提第一個它必須是3.5代的新型原子爐的核電機組那台灣是嗎台灣目前是嗎\n臺灣現在可以嗎?\n主要還是要社會溝通和民眾的共識所以我想從剛剛種種的問題就是在講說我們現在儲存廠的進度\n河一和二的室內乾燥場應該都已經要申請建造了那現在的進度如何呢河一廠室內的部分就是在陳竹委員在這個PowerPoint裡面的就是去年12月他已經提出這個這個 申請了對這個\n請購核二廠要到明年的7月核三廠要到後年的大概5月還是7月所以我們目前都是有一點delay的是嗎是的\n蓋這個還是需要好幾年的時間好幾年的時間所以我想我們這個其實要談使用核電我想現在可能不是現在最務實科學理性的一個做法那我想我看到就是核研所在改制國研院的時候也做了幾件事情很不錯就是說我們確實已經開始來做很多綠能與系統的一些整合研究那目前的計轉的件數其實到了16件就等於是有16件是跟綠能有關係的\n我看到研究人員的薪資低於同行內\n主委 抱歉\n主委可以來說明一下呢我們這樣子的薪水能夠招到優秀的人才嗎我是不是請院長來說明一下報告委員我們目前因為是變成行政法人以後這個院裡聘到的員工就是必須要從部分要從自籌款裡面來\n來籌措這些經費所以對於我們研究人員的薪資我們會比較謹慎一點但是去年年底我們第一批招收我們國務院自己的第一批我們有103個名額結果入取了82位表示入取了接近八成所以看來我們的薪資在市場上是還是有\n有蠻多的這個包括這個一些博士啦一些碩士都願意來投入我們的行列所以因為每個單位的條件都不太一樣像我們進來以後好我了解了好院長我了解了就是剛我聽到說就是你們其實招收員工的狀態還不錯齁但是因為據我有聽到一些消息啦齁就是說是也是有員工離職跳槽啦齁所以我想這個我們\n我們還是必須在薪資上面的因為剛剛雖然有說我做自籌款的但是我想我們作為一個行政法人我們還是應該要積極的來去面對這個續薪的問題啦我們才能夠把更好的公務人員留在我們的體系裡面那從外面去找到更優秀的人進來因為我們畢竟還是要去面對我們剛剛講的綠能的這個計畫所以呢那再來就是說我想要再確認一件事情我們到底現在公務人員有沒有核能加擠\n有沒有\n報告委員我們公務人員因為是由原先改制過來的所以原來的權利公務員的保障的權利還是原來是有的是嗎是有的現在還是有有保障那我因為你們提供給我們的資料是看不出來的而且我們其實從上禮拜四就一直不停的在問這件事情我們希望就是去幫國務院院爭取更優秀人才可是國務院院卻不願意提供還告訴我們公務人員的家籍\n請問加擠是機密嗎?不是吧?報言這是法人法人上因為他有一些營運上的等於說限制必須有些詳細的薪資目前九成以上的法人大概都拿不到就拿不到詳細的我們初步的薪資這個都是我們都提供了但是很詳細的公務人員這個\n其他的加級我們當面再跟委員找時間再親自報告我想這個加級如果不是機密的話那我還是希望主委可以回去督導國務院還是要配合相關的監督跟所知但也沒有關係我們還是從其他的地方拿到了這些\n我想我們還是要去來面對這個問題因為我們改制後我們的待遇還是跟過去的核研所來比我們還是降低了還是回到我的重點我們不但要跟業界競爭人才我們的薪水一定要非常有競爭力所以我也希望這個續薪標準是不是有調整的規劃那是不是可以在下一次董事會就可以來處理這件事情\n主委請教或是院長請教一下我們薪資像今年院聘的薪資公務員調4%我們調了5%所以事實上我們會檢討逐年會檢討而且我們院聘的人員那個年終的獎金跟績效獎金跟公務人員也不一樣公務人員就是依照公務人員公職的這個年終獎金跟考期獎金所以各有兩套不一樣的制度\n我想獎金是有沒有錯但是我想因為光這個基本的薪資上面就有一些落差了因為你可以看一下光這個一般開始你看每個月都差兩萬塊一個月都差二十四萬我覺得這件事情我們還是要回去的好好的檢討那不好意思再給我最後一題的時間抱歉\n最後一題就是在剛剛有委員有問到寒川廢水這件事情就是去年日本8月24號排放了第一次的排放作業那現在已經要排放到第4批了那這件事情非常重要那核安會之前也做了一些檢測也提供了一些國人有關於臨近海域的一些監測狀況來確保國人使用海產的安全那也跟這個海委會農業部來一起合作\n那過去呢從99年的33個採樣點到現在已經有107個採樣點但是呢我昨天我去看了一下我們目前的海域都是綠燈看起來好像是非常沒有問題的可是我進去看了每一個時間點我發現從107個監測點目前已經累積了137筆的資料包含色和穿的一些監控數據但是現在到了3月底了今年只有35筆\n日本在去年8月24日執行第一批．其中137筆的資料中．有22筆是在排放前取樣的．甚至有4筆已經是112年的3月5日．是由水事所來取樣．現在已經超過一年了\n好 那我也知道說 核安會本身沒有船隻啦所以需要別人來幫忙那我想這樣子的監測可能是不夠及時的甚至超過一年沒有更新了我們有沒有可能提升到每季取樣一次或是跟更多的單位來合作來確保國人的安全呢\n跟委員報告因為船期跟航程的關係其實我們大部分是每一季或每半年來執行取樣甚至有些是到北太平洋是相當大的距離那麼這個部分我們也跟水事所海巡署相關都有一些配合那我們會裡面輻射政策中心\n謝謝張雅琳\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.329 --> 00:00.469\n張委員好\n\n00:13.115 --> 00:37.850\n主委好,就是說大家都非常關心我關於核能的這個法典的問題那我想跟主委再請教一下就是說我們現在呢如果在運轉執照到期的時候其實我們根據法規我們是需要提供這一系列的像老化評估、老化管理、老化分析還有安全分析等等的報告對不對那我知道就是說如果要讓它繼續運轉的話我們是可以用修法修法來取消5到15年的申請時限\n\n00:38.951 --> 01:07.833\n但是修法只是文字作業我們還是必須的用從實務面來看就是修法過後我們還是要準備這個老化管理的評估研議計畫那在2011年的時候核一廠就是說這個光準備期就要到三年所以時程上面其實好像從現在來看是有點緩不濟急而且重點是我們的核一廠跟核二廠的這個燃料池都已經滿了可是我們的乾式儲存池卻一直卡關無法興建\n\n01:09.074 --> 01:21.448\n所以即便是您同意核安會同意來繼續運轉但用過的燃料棒無法更新一樣是無法順利發電所以這也就是我們核二廠一號機為什麼因此停早半年停機主委我這樣子的理解是正確的嗎正確好的\n\n01:23.891 --> 01:46.798\n我們現在最大的困境就是我們找不到核廢料的處置場所以我們不可能說要用電卻又不處理這個核廢料因為安全性還是一個非常重要的一件事情那我知道就是說我們核三廠的一號機運轉預計是在今年的7月要到期所以我們大概就是供應量大概剩3%那明年基本上就會歸零了嘛明年5月就會歸零了\n\n01:48.146 --> 01:54.604\n所以即便現在臺電提出計畫然後經過這些種種種種的程序最快要到哪一年我們才有可能發電呢?\n\n01:59.119 --> 02:20.784\n這個要看這個個案,個案的機組那我們從核三來看呢?臺電必須去做相關的這些的報告那去檢視這個核電廠相關的老化的然後形成一個報告我跟委員報告,這樣的報告大概多少呢?大概是這麼多\n\n02:21.684 --> 02:41.536\n所以大概就是需要的時間應該是相當長的對不對相當長然後這就是為什麼核電廠藉其他在研議的時候他在5年前就必須提出申請5年到前15年其實這樣的規定其實是跟美國核管會其實是一致的因為的確是需要這麼多時間\n\n02:44.118 --> 03:04.637\n我打斷一下,我打開就是想要聽到剛剛講大概需要根據美國的一些相關的作業辦法我們就是需要這些時間所以我現在也看了一下最新今天早上的數字就是我們的核電的佔比大概是6%所以我們當然尋找電力是一件非常重要但是我們是必須的務實的去面對現在的問題就是說我們現在的問題是應該透過其他的能源來解決用電的問題\n\n03:10.463 --> 03:17.481\n我想接下來我們就要更重要去討論核安的問題因為這是直接影響到人民的安全\n\n03:19.284 --> 03:41.610\n所以我們現在從那個核安是不是應該在發那個我們要使用核電的話我們是不是要包含發電後的放射性廢棄物的管制工作那根據歐盟是有講說我們核電要視為綠能有幾項前提第一個它必須是3.5代的新型原子爐的核電機組那台灣是嗎台灣目前是嗎\n\n03:44.211 --> 03:44.832\n臺灣現在可以嗎?\n\n04:05.831 --> 04:09.414\n主要還是要社會溝通和民眾的共識所以我想從剛剛種種的問題就是在講說我們現在儲存廠的進度\n\n04:24.367 --> 04:28.770\n河一和二的室內乾燥場應該都已經要申請建造了那現在的進度如何呢河一廠室內的部分就是在陳竹委員在這個PowerPoint裡面的就是去年12月他已經提出這個這個申請了對這個\n\n04:57.111 --> 05:06.976\n請購核二廠要到明年的7月核三廠要到後年的大概5月還是7月所以我們目前都是有一點delay的是嗎是的\n\n05:09.898 --> 05:36.719\n蓋這個還是需要好幾年的時間好幾年的時間所以我想我們這個其實要談使用核電我想現在可能不是現在最務實科學理性的一個做法那我想我看到就是核研所在改制國研院的時候也做了幾件事情很不錯就是說我們確實已經開始來做很多綠能與系統的一些整合研究那目前的計轉的件數其實到了16件就等於是有16件是跟綠能有關係的\n\n05:37.760 --> 05:38.401\n我看到研究人員的薪資低於同行內\n\n05:58.814 --> 05:59.174\n主委抱歉\n\n06:25.342 --> 06:48.660\n主委可以來說明一下呢我們這樣子的薪水能夠招到優秀的人才嗎我是不是請院長來說明一下報告委員我們目前因為是變成行政法人以後這個院裡聘到的員工就是必須要從部分要從自籌款裡面來\n\n06:51.547 --> 07:14.160\n來籌措這些經費所以對於我們研究人員的薪資我們會比較謹慎一點但是去年年底我們第一批招收我們國務院自己的第一批我們有103個名額結果入取了82位表示入取了接近八成所以看來我們的薪資在市場上是還是有\n\n07:15.220 --> 07:41.121\n有蠻多的這個包括這個一些博士啦一些碩士都願意來投入我們的行列所以因為每個單位的條件都不太一樣像我們進來以後好我了解了好院長我了解了就是剛我聽到說就是你們其實招收員工的狀態還不錯齁但是因為據我有聽到一些消息啦齁就是說是也是有員工離職跳槽啦齁所以我想這個我們\n\n07:41.821 --> 08:10.538\n我們還是必須在薪資上面的因為剛剛雖然有說我做自籌款的但是我想我們作為一個行政法人我們還是應該要積極的來去面對這個續薪的問題啦我們才能夠把更好的公務人員留在我們的體系裡面那從外面去找到更優秀的人進來因為我們畢竟還是要去面對我們剛剛講的綠能的這個計畫所以呢那再來就是說我想要再確認一件事情我們到底現在公務人員有沒有核能加擠\n\n08:11.811 --> 08:12.080\n有沒有\n\n08:13.650 --> 08:41.602\n報告委員我們公務人員因為是由原先改制過來的所以原來的權利公務員的保障的權利還是原來是有的是嗎是有的現在還是有有保障那我因為你們提供給我們的資料是看不出來的而且我們其實從上禮拜四就一直不停的在問這件事情我們希望就是去幫國務院院爭取更優秀人才可是國務院院卻不願意提供還告訴我們公務人員的家籍\n\n08:44.463 --> 09:08.937\n請問加擠是機密嗎?不是吧?報言這是法人法人上因為他有一些營運上的等於說限制必須有些詳細的薪資目前九成以上的法人大概都拿不到就拿不到詳細的我們初步的薪資這個都是我們都提供了但是很詳細的公務人員這個\n\n09:11.258 --> 09:27.413\n其他的加級我們當面再跟委員找時間再親自報告我想這個加級如果不是機密的話那我還是希望主委可以回去督導國務院還是要配合相關的監督跟所知但也沒有關係我們還是從其他的地方拿到了這些\n\n09:35.538 --> 10:01.964\n我想我們還是要去來面對這個問題因為我們改制後我們的待遇還是跟過去的核研所來比我們還是降低了還是回到我的重點我們不但要跟業界競爭人才我們的薪水一定要非常有競爭力所以我也希望這個續薪標準是不是有調整的規劃那是不是可以在下一次董事會就可以來處理這件事情\n\n10:03.264 --> 10:29.642\n主委請教或是院長請教一下我們薪資像今年院聘的薪資公務員調4%我們調了5%所以事實上我們會檢討逐年會檢討而且我們院聘的人員那個年終的獎金跟績效獎金跟公務人員也不一樣公務人員就是依照公務人員公職的這個年終獎金跟考期獎金所以各有兩套不一樣的制度\n\n10:30.462 --> 10:48.084\n我想獎金是有沒有錯但是我想因為光這個基本的薪資上面就有一些落差了因為你可以看一下光這個一般開始你看每個月都差兩萬塊一個月都差二十四萬我覺得這件事情我們還是要回去的好好的檢討那不好意思再給我最後一題的時間抱歉\n\n10:49.707 --> 11:14.825\n最後一題就是在剛剛有委員有問到寒川廢水這件事情就是去年日本8月24號排放了第一次的排放作業那現在已經要排放到第4批了那這件事情非常重要那核安會之前也做了一些檢測也提供了一些國人有關於臨近海域的一些監測狀況來確保國人使用海產的安全那也跟這個海委會農業部來一起合作\n\n11:15.405 --> 11:43.133\n那過去呢從99年的33個採樣點到現在已經有107個採樣點但是呢我昨天我去看了一下我們目前的海域都是綠燈看起來好像是非常沒有問題的可是我進去看了每一個時間點我發現從107個監測點目前已經累積了137筆的資料包含色和穿的一些監控數據但是現在到了3月底了今年只有35筆\n\n11:46.635 --> 11:55.077\n日本在去年8月24日執行第一批．其中137筆的資料中．有22筆是在排放前取樣的．甚至有4筆已經是112年的3月5日．是由水事所來取樣．現在已經超過一年了\n\n12:06.980 --> 12:21.955\n好那我也知道說核安會本身沒有船隻啦所以需要別人來幫忙那我想這樣子的監測可能是不夠及時的甚至超過一年沒有更新了我們有沒有可能提升到每季取樣一次或是跟更多的單位來合作來確保國人的安全呢\n\n12:22.755 --> 12:43.722\n跟委員報告因為船期跟航程的關係其實我們大部分是每一季或每半年來執行取樣甚至有些是到北太平洋是相當大的距離那麼這個部分我們也跟水事所海巡署相關都有一些配合那我們會裡面輻射政策中心\n\n12:44.322 --> 12:44.462\n謝謝張雅琳\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.329,"end":0.469,"text":"張委員好"},{"start":13.115,"end":37.85,"text":"主委好,就是說大家都非常關心我關於核能的這個法典的問題那我想跟主委再請教一下就是說我們現在呢如果在運轉執照到期的時候其實我們根據法規我們是需要提供這一系列的像老化評估、老化管理、老化分析還有安全分析等等的報告對不對那我知道就是說如果要讓它繼續運轉的話我們是可以用修法修法來取消5到15年的申請時限"},{"start":38.951,"end":67.833,"text":"但是修法只是文字作業我們還是必須的用從實務面來看就是修法過後我們還是要準備這個老化管理的評估研議計畫那在2011年的時候核一廠就是說這個光準備期就要到三年所以時程上面其實好像從現在來看是有點緩不濟急而且重點是我們的核一廠跟核二廠的這個燃料池都已經滿了可是我們的乾式儲存池卻一直卡關無法興建"},{"start":69.074,"end":81.448,"text":"所以即便是您同意核安會同意來繼續運轉但用過的燃料棒無法更新一樣是無法順利發電所以這也就是我們核二廠一號機為什麼因此停早半年停機主委我這樣子的理解是正確的嗎正確好的"},{"start":83.891,"end":106.798,"text":"我們現在最大的困境就是我們找不到核廢料的處置場所以我們不可能說要用電卻又不處理這個核廢料因為安全性還是一個非常重要的一件事情那我知道就是說我們核三廠的一號機運轉預計是在今年的7月要到期所以我們大概就是供應量大概剩3%那明年基本上就會歸零了嘛明年5月就會歸零了"},{"start":108.146,"end":114.604,"text":"所以即便現在臺電提出計畫然後經過這些種種種種的程序最快要到哪一年我們才有可能發電呢?"},{"start":119.119,"end":140.784,"text":"這個要看這個個案,個案的機組那我們從核三來看呢?臺電必須去做相關的這些的報告那去檢視這個核電廠相關的老化的然後形成一個報告我跟委員報告,這樣的報告大概多少呢?大概是這麼多"},{"start":141.684,"end":161.536,"text":"所以大概就是需要的時間應該是相當長的對不對相當長然後這就是為什麼核電廠藉其他在研議的時候他在5年前就必須提出申請5年到前15年其實這樣的規定其實是跟美國核管會其實是一致的因為的確是需要這麼多時間"},{"start":164.118,"end":184.637,"text":"我打斷一下,我打開就是想要聽到剛剛講大概需要根據美國的一些相關的作業辦法我們就是需要這些時間所以我現在也看了一下最新今天早上的數字就是我們的核電的佔比大概是6%所以我們當然尋找電力是一件非常重要但是我們是必須的務實的去面對現在的問題就是說我們現在的問題是應該透過其他的能源來解決用電的問題"},{"start":190.463,"end":197.481,"text":"我想接下來我們就要更重要去討論核安的問題因為這是直接影響到人民的安全"},{"start":199.284,"end":221.61,"text":"所以我們現在從那個核安是不是應該在發那個我們要使用核電的話我們是不是要包含發電後的放射性廢棄物的管制工作那根據歐盟是有講說我們核電要視為綠能有幾項前提第一個它必須是3.5代的新型原子爐的核電機組那台灣是嗎台灣目前是嗎"},{"start":224.211,"end":224.832,"text":"臺灣現在可以嗎?"},{"start":245.831,"end":249.414,"text":"主要還是要社會溝通和民眾的共識所以我想從剛剛種種的問題就是在講說我們現在儲存廠的進度"},{"start":264.367,"end":268.77,"text":"河一和二的室內乾燥場應該都已經要申請建造了那現在的進度如何呢河一廠室內的部分就是在陳竹委員在這個PowerPoint裡面的就是去年12月他已經提出這個這個 申請了對這個"},{"start":297.111,"end":306.976,"text":"請購核二廠要到明年的7月核三廠要到後年的大概5月還是7月所以我們目前都是有一點delay的是嗎是的"},{"start":309.898,"end":336.719,"text":"蓋這個還是需要好幾年的時間好幾年的時間所以我想我們這個其實要談使用核電我想現在可能不是現在最務實科學理性的一個做法那我想我看到就是核研所在改制國研院的時候也做了幾件事情很不錯就是說我們確實已經開始來做很多綠能與系統的一些整合研究那目前的計轉的件數其實到了16件就等於是有16件是跟綠能有關係的"},{"start":337.76,"end":338.401,"text":"我看到研究人員的薪資低於同行內"},{"start":358.814,"end":359.174,"text":"主委 抱歉"},{"start":385.342,"end":408.66,"text":"主委可以來說明一下呢我們這樣子的薪水能夠招到優秀的人才嗎我是不是請院長來說明一下報告委員我們目前因為是變成行政法人以後這個院裡聘到的員工就是必須要從部分要從自籌款裡面來"},{"start":411.547,"end":434.16,"text":"來籌措這些經費所以對於我們研究人員的薪資我們會比較謹慎一點但是去年年底我們第一批招收我們國務院自己的第一批我們有103個名額結果入取了82位表示入取了接近八成所以看來我們的薪資在市場上是還是有"},{"start":435.22,"end":461.121,"text":"有蠻多的這個包括這個一些博士啦一些碩士都願意來投入我們的行列所以因為每個單位的條件都不太一樣像我們進來以後好我了解了好院長我了解了就是剛我聽到說就是你們其實招收員工的狀態還不錯齁但是因為據我有聽到一些消息啦齁就是說是也是有員工離職跳槽啦齁所以我想這個我們"},{"start":461.821,"end":490.538,"text":"我們還是必須在薪資上面的因為剛剛雖然有說我做自籌款的但是我想我們作為一個行政法人我們還是應該要積極的來去面對這個續薪的問題啦我們才能夠把更好的公務人員留在我們的體系裡面那從外面去找到更優秀的人進來因為我們畢竟還是要去面對我們剛剛講的綠能的這個計畫所以呢那再來就是說我想要再確認一件事情我們到底現在公務人員有沒有核能加擠"},{"start":491.811,"end":492.08,"text":"有沒有"},{"start":493.65,"end":521.602,"text":"報告委員我們公務人員因為是由原先改制過來的所以原來的權利公務員的保障的權利還是原來是有的是嗎是有的現在還是有有保障那我因為你們提供給我們的資料是看不出來的而且我們其實從上禮拜四就一直不停的在問這件事情我們希望就是去幫國務院院爭取更優秀人才可是國務院院卻不願意提供還告訴我們公務人員的家籍"},{"start":524.463,"end":548.937,"text":"請問加擠是機密嗎?不是吧?報言這是法人法人上因為他有一些營運上的等於說限制必須有些詳細的薪資目前九成以上的法人大概都拿不到就拿不到詳細的我們初步的薪資這個都是我們都提供了但是很詳細的公務人員這個"},{"start":551.258,"end":567.413,"text":"其他的加級我們當面再跟委員找時間再親自報告我想這個加級如果不是機密的話那我還是希望主委可以回去督導國務院還是要配合相關的監督跟所知但也沒有關係我們還是從其他的地方拿到了這些"},{"start":575.538,"end":601.964,"text":"我想我們還是要去來面對這個問題因為我們改制後我們的待遇還是跟過去的核研所來比我們還是降低了還是回到我的重點我們不但要跟業界競爭人才我們的薪水一定要非常有競爭力所以我也希望這個續薪標準是不是有調整的規劃那是不是可以在下一次董事會就可以來處理這件事情"},{"start":603.264,"end":629.642,"text":"主委請教或是院長請教一下我們薪資像今年院聘的薪資公務員調4%我們調了5%所以事實上我們會檢討逐年會檢討而且我們院聘的人員那個年終的獎金跟績效獎金跟公務人員也不一樣公務人員就是依照公務人員公職的這個年終獎金跟考期獎金所以各有兩套不一樣的制度"},{"start":630.462,"end":648.084,"text":"我想獎金是有沒有錯但是我想因為光這個基本的薪資上面就有一些落差了因為你可以看一下光這個一般開始你看每個月都差兩萬塊一個月都差二十四萬我覺得這件事情我們還是要回去的好好的檢討那不好意思再給我最後一題的時間抱歉"},{"start":649.707,"end":674.825,"text":"最後一題就是在剛剛有委員有問到寒川廢水這件事情就是去年日本8月24號排放了第一次的排放作業那現在已經要排放到第4批了那這件事情非常重要那核安會之前也做了一些檢測也提供了一些國人有關於臨近海域的一些監測狀況來確保國人使用海產的安全那也跟這個海委會農業部來一起合作"},{"start":675.405,"end":703.133,"text":"那過去呢從99年的33個採樣點到現在已經有107個採樣點但是呢我昨天我去看了一下我們目前的海域都是綠燈看起來好像是非常沒有問題的可是我進去看了每一個時間點我發現從107個監測點目前已經累積了137筆的資料包含色和穿的一些監控數據但是現在到了3月底了今年只有35筆"},{"start":706.635,"end":715.077,"text":"日本在去年8月24日執行第一批．其中137筆的資料中．有22筆是在排放前取樣的．甚至有4筆已經是112年的3月5日．是由水事所來取樣．現在已經超過一年了"},{"start":726.98,"end":741.955,"text":"好 那我也知道說 核安會本身沒有船隻啦所以需要別人來幫忙那我想這樣子的監測可能是不夠及時的甚至超過一年沒有更新了我們有沒有可能提升到每季取樣一次或是跟更多的單位來合作來確保國人的安全呢"},{"start":742.755,"end":763.722,"text":"跟委員報告因為船期跟航程的關係其實我們大部分是每一季或每半年來執行取樣甚至有些是到北太平洋是相當大的距離那麼這個部分我們也跟水事所海巡署相關都有一些配合那我們會裡面輻射政策中心"},{"start":764.322,"end":764.462,"text":"謝謝張雅琳"}]}}}}