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11:23:31","影片長度":"00:06:22","會議時間":"2024-03-28T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第10次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請司法院、法務部、教育部、衛生福利部、內政部警政署就「青少年法治教育與犯罪防制成效」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n二、審查及處理113年度中央政府總預算關於法務部及所屬主管預算凍結項目共6案。\n【其中各案如經院會復議，則不予審查、處理】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第10次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":10,"committees":[36],"id":"委員會-11-1-36-10"},"date":"2024-03-28","duration":382,"end_time":"2024-03-28T11:23:31+08:00","start_time":"2024-03-28T11:17:09+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":1009,"blocks":[["牛委員煦庭：（11時17分）謝謝主席，有請法務部跟警政署。"],["主席：有請法務部長跟警政署周局長。"],["蔡部長清祥：委員好。"],["牛委員煦庭：本席先問一個個案，因為昨天出新聞的敦品中學在本席的選區，這個衝突的背後，個案的處理狀況，聯繫支援的速度還算快，看起來事態是沒有擴大，但是我想從這件事情去問背後發生的原因，我們在這些執行感化教育的學校裡面，平常的人力是否充足？"],["蔡部長清祥：人員確實是不太夠，我們會充分利用現有的人力，也會來爭取增加員額。"],["牛委員煦庭：對，照理來講，作為一個感化教育的執行機關，如果平常的人力是充足的，學生跟老師的比例等等，它應該要比一般的學校有更充足的人力，才能夠完成這樣的政策目標，我想如果在人力充足而且有適當執行情況下，照理來講應該不會發生這種情緒浮躁導致衝突的行為，所以我是擔心說這背後有人力不足跟實際執行效果不彰的問題，這點希望法務部回去做一個深入的瞭解，把這些問題以及可以解決的處遇方式，會後提供一份書面，讓我們瞭解一下狀況可以嗎？"],["蔡部長清祥：可以，謝謝。"],["牛委員煦庭：謝謝部長。再來要討論一下今天是講少輔會，今天應該有滿多委員對這個題目提出意見跟看法，在新制的少輔會上場執行之後，現在看起來是要先走少輔會的流程然後才能轉少年法院嘛，對不對？那以舊制來講，舊制的少輔會就比較單純，也就是警政體系，用管訓的邏輯直接處理嘛，對不對？當然這件事情可能跟現代大家對於人權等等標準有所不合，所以新制就立了新的法，有相關的規定，但現在問題是包含我剛剛坐在下面的時候，我都在想我要叫誰上來備詢，這個新制的少輔會現在到底由誰來主管？"],["周局長幼偉：報告委員，本來新制的少輔會應該是成立在縣市政府底下的一級單位……"],["牛委員煦庭：對，地方嘛？"],["周局長幼偉：但是因為地方自治法沒有辦法再容納新的委員會或者是局處，所以它目前還是在跟警察局少年隊有配合。"],["牛委員煦庭：所以按照法理，這個是交給地方政府處理嘛？然後地方就成立各自的少輔會，委員可能是市長兼任主委、副市長就副主委、局長就……大家就排排坐，是這樣，對不對？"],["周局長幼偉：對。"],["牛委員煦庭：它變成一個類似任務編組的一個方式，大部分是以兼職的方式處理，這是本席的擔心啦！剛剛警政署已經講很清楚，實務上還是交給警察來處理，以現在中央政府的瞭解，各地少輔會這樣的運作模式是順利的嗎？還是其實是換湯不換藥呢？"],["周局長幼偉：目前來講，因為有一個新的想法叫做行政先行……"],["牛委員煦庭：對，行政先行。"],["周局長幼偉：避免偏差行為少年或是一些……"],["牛委員煦庭：等於有一個預防機制在那邊嘛！"],["周局長幼偉：預防機制就是在這裡，目前來講，因為剛開始實施，我們開案數也有一千兩百多件，現在的人力大概兩百六十幾個人，目前來講應該是還好……"],["牛委員煦庭：全國？"],["周局長幼偉：對，全國。"],["牛委員煦庭：兩百六十幾個人力服務多少需要被輔導的少年？"],["周局長幼偉：目前開案數是一千兩百多人。"],["牛委員煦庭：一千兩百多人？"],["周局長幼偉：是。"],["牛委員煦庭：這跟當初立法時期待的數字有沒有落差？"],["周局長幼偉：那當然是一開始，慢慢的會增加，但目前來講就是這個狀況。"],["牛委員煦庭：如果按照法的精神去執行，實際上案量暴增會不會造成基層警力的負擔？"],["周局長幼偉：那當然會啊！"],["牛委員煦庭：其實會喔！"],["周局長幼偉：但我們這個單位還是要跟教育單位，還有社政單位及一些衛福單位配合。"],["牛委員煦庭：這就是本席今天特別要提這個題目的原因，因為新制之後，大家一定就會對於少輔會輔導方面的期待更高，因為這等於就是預防機制，但以現行的組織編制來講，好像很難有權力去整併相關的資源，對不對？實務上到最後還是變成由警察單位來執行輔導對象跟職責，又很難抗拒司法機關的一些請求，我是覺得有一點擔心啦！相關的人力增補跟權責劃分，有沒有更進一步的思考跟考慮呢？"],["周局長幼偉：如果它能夠提升到縣政府的一級單位，這樣可能就會整合更多像社會安全網的資源，他們可能就會做更多事，而不只是限制在警察的預防部分。"],["牛委員煦庭：好，我是覺得還有可議之處啦！慢慢討論嘛！因為新制上路，總是要看執行之後，今天至少也有個初步了，260位人力服務一千多個案量，順著這個部分我們再來持續做觀察。","再來我問一下少輔會移送法院的標準，現在有很明確的標準嗎？"],["周局長幼偉：有，有一定的標準，如果這個少年已經沒有辦法在這個輔導機制裡面，那他會跟……"],["牛委員煦庭：就移送少年法院來處理？"],["周局長幼偉：對，法院會來對接。"],["牛委員煦庭：現在實務上來講，有沒有遇到少年法庭認為移送不當，然後要退回來的？有沒有遇過這種狀況？"],["周局長幼偉：目前並沒有，沒有這樣的案例，我們目前接的案例並沒有這樣的案例，我們接的是已經送矯正學校，他出來，又由少年保護官交給我們輔導的，還有兩個……"],["牛委員煦庭：實務上有沒有因為曝險行為以外觸法，或偏差行為反而導致法庭認為他應該先走少輔會流程，有沒有這樣的狀況？"],["周局長幼偉：這個是有的。"],["牛委員煦庭：這個也是有的？這樣的數量在一千兩百個案例中占多數嗎？"],["周局長幼偉：這不多。"],["牛委員煦庭：不多，大概多少，有數字嗎？"],["周局長幼偉：這部分我們目前沒有相關數據。"],["牛委員煦庭：好，本席要提醒，以人力編制或什麼來講，既然要有輔導的機制先行，我們就不希望像過去一樣換湯不換藥，還是由警政單位來負擔，有的時候也要稍微降低一些警察弟兄的勤務，然後讓更多的其他資源，也許是社政也好，也許是教育的單位來做支援，這部分丟給地方，我希望大家有一個長期追蹤的機制，如果到最後是換湯不換藥，也許我們從法制面再來做檢討，當然如果可以運作順利，各地方政府找出方案當然是最好，這一點我希望中央政府持續追蹤，可以嗎？"],["周局長幼偉：謝謝委員。"],["牛委員煦庭：好，辛苦了，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝牛委員、謝謝部長、謝謝局長。","接下來有請柯委員志恩質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":116,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-36-10","speakers":["鍾佳濱","黃國昌","沈發惠","謝龍介","陳俊宇","莊瑞雄","羅智強","林思銘","沈伯洋","翁曉玲","牛煦庭","柯志恩","羅廷瑋","洪孟楷","傅崐萁","吳思瑤","陳培瑜","張雅琳","吳沛憶","鄭天財Sra 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{\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 142.708, \"end\": 142.848, \"score\": 0.863}, {\"word\": \"警\", \"start\": 142.848, \"end\": 142.948, \"score\": 0.829}, {\"word\": \"察\", \"start\": 142.948, \"end\": 143.148, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"局\", \"start\": 143.148, \"end\": 143.748, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"少\", \"start\": 143.748, \"end\": 143.889, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"年\", \"start\": 143.889, \"end\": 144.149, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"隊\"}, {\"word\": \"友\", \"start\": 144.149, \"end\": 144.369, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"配\", \"start\": 144.369, \"end\": 144.529, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"合\", \"start\": 144.529, \"end\": 144.549, \"score\": 0.952}]}, {\"start\": 145.051, \"end\": 173.567, \"text\": \"所以這個按照法理上應該是交給地方政府處理嘛然後地方各就成立各自的少府會然後委員大概就可能市長兼任這個主委然後副市長就副主委然後這局長就大家就排排座是這樣對不對那它變成一個類似任務編組的一個方式喔然後大部分是以兼職的方式來處理喔這本期擔心啦然後實務上剛剛警政署已經講很清楚它實務上還是交給警察來做處理喔那以現在中央政府的了解喔各地少府會的運作這樣子的模式是順利的嗎\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 145.051, \"end\": 145.691, 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\"還是其實是變成換湯不換藥呢目前來講因為他是有一個新的想法叫做行政先行對行政先行嘛避免這個偏差行為少年或是這個一些他等於有個預防機制在那邊嘛預防機制就是這裡嘛那我們就是目前來講因為剛開始實施那我們看數有1200多件那現在的人力大概260幾個人目前來講應該是還好全國全國對全國的這個260幾個人力服務多少\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 174.728, \"end\": 174.888, \"score\": 0.975}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 174.888, \"end\": 175.108, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 175.108, \"end\": 175.368, \"score\": 0.893}, {\"word\": \"變\"}, {\"word\": \"成\", \"start\": 175.368, \"end\": 175.789, \"score\": 0.842}, {\"word\": \"換\"}, {\"word\": \"湯\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 175.789, \"end\": 176.229, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"換\"}, {\"word\": \"藥\"}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 176.229, \"end\": 176.709, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"目\", \"start\": 176.709, \"end\": 176.949, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"前\", \"start\": 176.949, \"end\": 177.489, \"score\": 0.893}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"講\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 177.489, \"end\": 177.749, 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這個我是覺得還有可疑之處啦但是慢慢討論嘛因為親自上路總是執行之後那今天至少也有個初步了260位人力服務1000多個案量那順著這個大家我們再持續來做觀察再來我問一下就是少府會移送法院的標準現在很明確的標準嗎\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 259.948, \"end\": 260.268, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 260.268, \"end\": 260.429, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 260.429, \"end\": 260.549, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 260.549, \"end\": 260.729, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 260.729, \"end\": 261.129, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 261.129, \"end\": 261.449, \"score\": 0.838}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"它\", \"start\": 261.449, \"end\": 261.669, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 261.669, \"end\": 261.829, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"升\", \"start\": 261.829, \"end\": 261.989, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 261.989, \"end\": 262.65, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"縣\"}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 262.65, 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\"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"續\"}, {\"word\": \"追\", \"start\": 376.88, \"end\": 377.2, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"蹤\"}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 377.2, \"end\": 377.28, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 377.28, \"end\": 377.3, \"score\": 0.592}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}, {\"word\": \"?\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:04,386 --> 00:00:08,811\n法務部長、警政署局長、州局長昨天出新聞的敦炳中學在本席的選區這個衝突的背後\n\n2\n00:00:25,393 --> 00:00:39,280\n各案的處理狀況聯繫資源的速度還算快看起來事態是沒有擴大但是我想從這個事情裡面去問後續背後發生的原因我們在這些執行所謂趕快教育的這些學校裡面平常的人力是否充足\n\n3\n00:00:40,816 --> 00:01:00,189\n人員確實是不太夠,不過我們會充分地來利用現有的人力,也會爭取來增加員額。對,我照理來講,作為一個感化教育執行的機關,比如平常的人力是充足的,學生跟老師的比例以及等等,他應該要比一般的學校更充足的人力,因為\n\n4\n00:01:00,669 --> 00:01:00,789\n提供書面。\n\n5\n00:01:25,724 --> 00:01:41,785\n謝謝部長好再來要討論一下今天是講少婦會今天應該有蠻多委員對這個題目提出意見跟看法現在在新制的少婦會上任這個上場執行之後現在看起來是要先走少婦會的流程然後才能轉少年法\n\n6\n00:01:42,125 --> 00:01:42,505\n新制的少婦會到底由誰來主管?\n\n7\n00:02:08,821 --> 00:02:24,549\n報告委員本來新制的少年委員會應該是成立在這個縣市政府的這個底下的一級單位但是因為地方自治法沒有辦法再容納新的這個委員會或者是局處所以他就在目前還是在跟警察局少年隊友配合\n\n8\n00:02:25,051 --> 00:02:53,567\n所以這個按照法理上應該是交給地方政府處理嘛然後地方各就成立各自的少府會然後委員大概就可能市長兼任這個主委然後副市長就副主委然後這局長就大家就排排座是這樣對不對那它變成一個類似任務編組的一個方式喔然後大部分是以兼職的方式來處理喔這本期擔心啦然後實務上剛剛警政署已經講很清楚它實務上還是交給警察來做處理喔那以現在中央政府的了解喔各地少府會的運作這樣子的模式是順利的嗎\n\n9\n00:02:54,728 --> 00:03:14,977\n還是其實是變成換湯不換藥呢目前來講因為他是有一個新的想法叫做行政先行對行政先行嘛避免這個偏差行為少年或是這個一些他等於有個預防機制在那邊嘛預防機制就是這裡嘛那我們就是目前來講因為剛開始實施那我們看數有1200多件那現在的人力大概260幾個人目前來講應該是還好全國全國對全國的這個260幾個人力服務多少\n\n10\n00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:26,362\n需要被輔導的少年?目前開案數是1200多人。1200多人?\n\n11\n00:03:26,362 --> 00:03:48,011\n是是是。這跟當初立法的時候期待的數字有沒有落差?那當然應該是慢慢的會增加但是目前來講就是這個狀況。如果說按照法的精神去執行的時候實際上這個案量暴增的時候會不會造成基層警力的負擔?那當然會啊。其實會齁?但是其實我們就是這個單位的話還是要跟教育單位還有社政單位還有一些這個衛福單位會有配合。\n\n12\n00:03:49,748 --> 00:04:19,288\n這個就是本集今天特別要提這個這個題目的原因因為新制之後大家就對於少府會有就輔導方面的期待一定是更高的嘛因為我們等於就是預防機制但相關來講以現行的這樣子的一個組織編制好像很難有權力去整併相關的資源對不對你實務上到最後還是變成變成由警察單位來執行輔導對象跟職責這個然後又很難抗拒司法機關的一些請求我是覺得有一點擔心啦相關的這些人力增補跟權責劃分有沒有更進一步的思考跟考慮呢\n\n13\n00:04:19,948 --> 00:04:47,845\n那這是如果是能夠它提升到這個縣政府的一級單位那這個話可能就會整合更多的像社會安全網的這個資源他們可能就會做更多事而不是只是限制在警察這個預防的部分好這個我是覺得還有可疑之處啦但是慢慢討論嘛因為親自上路總是執行之後那今天至少也有個初步了260位人力服務1000多個案量那順著這個大家我們再持續來做觀察再來我問一下就是少府會移送法院的標準現在很明確的標準嗎\n\n14\n00:04:49,013 --> 00:05:03,202\n有他有一定的標準就是說他這個少年的話如果他已經沒有辦法在這個輔導機制裡面那他會跟就移送少年法院來處理對法院會來對決以前實務上來講有沒有遇到少年法庭認為移送不當然後退回來這種\n\n15\n00:05:04,362 --> 00:05:19,972\n有否遇過這種狀況?目前並沒有,沒有這樣的案例。就是我們目前接的案例並沒有這樣的案例。我們接的就是已經受這個角質學校那他出來又有這個少年調查官的部分,他少年保護官的部分來交給我們輔導還有兩個。\n\n16\n00:05:21,874 --> 00:05:42,585\n那實務上有沒有說因為曝險行為以外然後處罰或偏差行為然後反而導致說法庭認為說他應該先走少婦會流程有沒有這樣的狀況這個是有的這個也是有的這樣數量站那1200個案例裡面站多數嗎就不多不多大概多少有數字嗎這個部分是因為我們目前沒有從沒有這個我沒有這個數據\n\n17\n00:05:43,746 --> 00:06:07,414\n好,這本期要提這個就提醒就是說以人力編制或什麼來講我們不希望說既然要有輔導的機制先行我們就不希望他一樣是像過去一樣換當不換藥還是由警政單位來負擔有的時候也要稍微降低一下這個警察弟兄的一些情誤啦然後讓更多的也許是社政也好也許是教育單位來做支援這一部分丟給地方我希望大家有一個長期追蹤的機制\n\n18\n00:06:08,234 --> 00:06:17,300\n如果到最後是換湯不換藥的時候,也許我們從法制面再來做檢討。那當然如果可以運作順利,各地方政府找出方案的話,那當然是最好。這一點我希望中央政府來持續追蹤,可以嗎?\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n4386\t8811\t法務部長、警政署局長、州局長昨天出新聞的敦炳中學在本席的選區這個衝突的背後\n25393\t39280\t各案的處理狀況聯繫資源的速度還算快看起來事態是沒有擴大但是我想從這個事情裡面去問後續背後發生的原因我們在這些執行所謂趕快教育的這些學校裡面平常的人力是否充足\n40816\t60189\t人員確實是不太夠,不過我們會充分地來利用現有的人力,也會爭取來增加員額。對,我照理來講,作為一個感化教育執行的機關,比如平常的人力是充足的,學生跟老師的比例以及等等,他應該要比一般的學校更充足的人力,因為\n60669\t60789\t提供書面。\n85724\t101785\t謝謝部長好再來要討論一下今天是講少婦會今天應該有蠻多委員對這個題目提出意見跟看法現在在新制的少婦會上任這個上場執行之後現在看起來是要先走少婦會的流程然後才能轉少年法\n102125\t102505\t新制的少婦會到底由誰來主管?\n128821\t144549\t報告委員本來新制的少年委員會應該是成立在這個縣市政府的這個底下的一級單位但是因為地方自治法沒有辦法再容納新的這個委員會或者是局處所以他就在目前還是在跟警察局少年隊友配合\n145051\t173567\t所以這個按照法理上應該是交給地方政府處理嘛然後地方各就成立各自的少府會然後委員大概就可能市長兼任這個主委然後副市長就副主委然後這局長就大家就排排座是這樣對不對那它變成一個類似任務編組的一個方式喔然後大部分是以兼職的方式來處理喔這本期擔心啦然後實務上剛剛警政署已經講很清楚它實務上還是交給警察來做處理喔那以現在中央政府的了解喔各地少府會的運作這樣子的模式是順利的嗎\n174728\t194977\t還是其實是變成換湯不換藥呢目前來講因為他是有一個新的想法叫做行政先行對行政先行嘛避免這個偏差行為少年或是這個一些他等於有個預防機制在那邊嘛預防機制就是這裡嘛那我們就是目前來講因為剛開始實施那我們看數有1200多件那現在的人力大概260幾個人目前來講應該是還好全國全國對全國的這個260幾個人力服務多少\n202680\t206362\t需要被輔導的少年?目前開案數是1200多人。1200多人?\n206362\t228011\t是是是。這跟當初立法的時候期待的數字有沒有落差?那當然應該是慢慢的會增加但是目前來講就是這個狀況。如果說按照法的精神去執行的時候實際上這個案量暴增的時候會不會造成基層警力的負擔?那當然會啊。其實會齁?但是其實我們就是這個單位的話還是要跟教育單位還有社政單位還有一些這個衛福單位會有配合。\n229748\t259288\t這個就是本集今天特別要提這個這個題目的原因因為新制之後大家就對於少府會有就輔導方面的期待一定是更高的嘛因為我們等於就是預防機制但相關來講以現行的這樣子的一個組織編制好像很難有權力去整併相關的資源對不對你實務上到最後還是變成變成由警察單位來執行輔導對象跟職責這個然後又很難抗拒司法機關的一些請求我是覺得有一點擔心啦相關的這些人力增補跟權責劃分有沒有更進一步的思考跟考慮呢\n259948\t287845\t那這是如果是能夠它提升到這個縣政府的一級單位那這個話可能就會整合更多的像社會安全網的這個資源他們可能就會做更多事而不是只是限制在警察這個預防的部分好 這個我是覺得還有可疑之處啦但是慢慢討論嘛因為親自上路總是執行之後那今天至少也有個初步了260位人力服務1000多個案量那順著這個大家我們再持續來做觀察再來我問一下就是少府會移送法院的標準現在很明確的標準嗎\n289013\t303202\t有他有一定的標準就是說他這個少年的話如果他已經沒有辦法在這個輔導機制裡面那他會跟就移送少年法院來處理對法院會來對決以前實務上來講有沒有遇到少年法庭認為移送不當然後退回來這種\n304362\t319972\t有否遇過這種狀況?目前並沒有,沒有這樣的案例。就是我們目前接的案例並沒有這樣的案例。我們接的就是已經受這個角質學校那他出來又有這個少年調查官的部分,他少年保護官的部分來交給我們輔導還有兩個。\n321874\t342585\t那實務上有沒有說因為曝險行為以外然後處罰或偏差行為然後反而導致說法庭認為說他應該先走少婦會流程有沒有這樣的狀況這個是有的這個也是有的這樣數量站那1200個案例裡面站多數嗎就不多不多大概多少有數字嗎這個部分是因為我們目前沒有從沒有這個我沒有這個數據\n343746\t367414\t好,這本期要提這個就提醒就是說以人力編制或什麼來講我們不希望說既然要有輔導的機制先行我們就不希望他一樣是像過去一樣換當不換藥還是由警政單位來負擔有的時候也要稍微降低一下這個警察弟兄的一些情誤啦然後讓更多的也許是社政也好也許是教育單位來做支援這一部分丟給地方我希望大家有一個長期追蹤的機制\n368234\t377300\t如果到最後是換湯不換藥的時候,也許我們從法制面再來做檢討。那當然如果可以運作順利,各地方政府找出方案的話,那當然是最好。這一點我希望中央政府來持續追蹤,可以嗎?\n","txt":"法務部長、警政署局長、州局長昨天出新聞的敦炳中學在本席的選區這個衝突的背後\n各案的處理狀況聯繫資源的速度還算快看起來事態是沒有擴大但是我想從這個事情裡面去問後續背後發生的原因我們在這些執行所謂趕快教育的這些學校裡面平常的人力是否充足\n人員確實是不太夠,不過我們會充分地來利用現有的人力,也會爭取來增加員額。對,我照理來講,作為一個感化教育執行的機關,比如平常的人力是充足的,學生跟老師的比例以及等等,他應該要比一般的學校更充足的人力,因為\n提供書面。\n謝謝部長好再來要討論一下今天是講少婦會今天應該有蠻多委員對這個題目提出意見跟看法現在在新制的少婦會上任這個上場執行之後現在看起來是要先走少婦會的流程然後才能轉少年法\n新制的少婦會到底由誰來主管?\n報告委員本來新制的少年委員會應該是成立在這個縣市政府的這個底下的一級單位但是因為地方自治法沒有辦法再容納新的這個委員會或者是局處所以他就在目前還是在跟警察局少年隊友配合\n所以這個按照法理上應該是交給地方政府處理嘛然後地方各就成立各自的少府會然後委員大概就可能市長兼任這個主委然後副市長就副主委然後這局長就大家就排排座是這樣對不對那它變成一個類似任務編組的一個方式喔然後大部分是以兼職的方式來處理喔這本期擔心啦然後實務上剛剛警政署已經講很清楚它實務上還是交給警察來做處理喔那以現在中央政府的了解喔各地少府會的運作這樣子的模式是順利的嗎\n還是其實是變成換湯不換藥呢目前來講因為他是有一個新的想法叫做行政先行對行政先行嘛避免這個偏差行為少年或是這個一些他等於有個預防機制在那邊嘛預防機制就是這裡嘛那我們就是目前來講因為剛開始實施那我們看數有1200多件那現在的人力大概260幾個人目前來講應該是還好全國全國對全國的這個260幾個人力服務多少\n需要被輔導的少年?目前開案數是1200多人。1200多人?\n是是是。這跟當初立法的時候期待的數字有沒有落差?那當然應該是慢慢的會增加但是目前來講就是這個狀況。如果說按照法的精神去執行的時候實際上這個案量暴增的時候會不會造成基層警力的負擔?那當然會啊。其實會齁?但是其實我們就是這個單位的話還是要跟教育單位還有社政單位還有一些這個衛福單位會有配合。\n這個就是本集今天特別要提這個這個題目的原因因為新制之後大家就對於少府會有就輔導方面的期待一定是更高的嘛因為我們等於就是預防機制但相關來講以現行的這樣子的一個組織編制好像很難有權力去整併相關的資源對不對你實務上到最後還是變成變成由警察單位來執行輔導對象跟職責這個然後又很難抗拒司法機關的一些請求我是覺得有一點擔心啦相關的這些人力增補跟權責劃分有沒有更進一步的思考跟考慮呢\n那這是如果是能夠它提升到這個縣政府的一級單位那這個話可能就會整合更多的像社會安全網的這個資源他們可能就會做更多事而不是只是限制在警察這個預防的部分好 這個我是覺得還有可疑之處啦但是慢慢討論嘛因為親自上路總是執行之後那今天至少也有個初步了260位人力服務1000多個案量那順著這個大家我們再持續來做觀察再來我問一下就是少府會移送法院的標準現在很明確的標準嗎\n有他有一定的標準就是說他這個少年的話如果他已經沒有辦法在這個輔導機制裡面那他會跟就移送少年法院來處理對法院會來對決以前實務上來講有沒有遇到少年法庭認為移送不當然後退回來這種\n有否遇過這種狀況?目前並沒有,沒有這樣的案例。就是我們目前接的案例並沒有這樣的案例。我們接的就是已經受這個角質學校那他出來又有這個少年調查官的部分,他少年保護官的部分來交給我們輔導還有兩個。\n那實務上有沒有說因為曝險行為以外然後處罰或偏差行為然後反而導致說法庭認為說他應該先走少婦會流程有沒有這樣的狀況這個是有的這個也是有的這樣數量站那1200個案例裡面站多數嗎就不多不多大概多少有數字嗎這個部分是因為我們目前沒有從沒有這個我沒有這個數據\n好,這本期要提這個就提醒就是說以人力編制或什麼來講我們不希望說既然要有輔導的機制先行我們就不希望他一樣是像過去一樣換當不換藥還是由警政單位來負擔有的時候也要稍微降低一下這個警察弟兄的一些情誤啦然後讓更多的也許是社政也好也許是教育單位來做支援這一部分丟給地方我希望大家有一個長期追蹤的機制\n如果到最後是換湯不換藥的時候,也許我們從法制面再來做檢討。那當然如果可以運作順利,各地方政府找出方案的話,那當然是最好。這一點我希望中央政府來持續追蹤,可以嗎?\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:04.386 --> 00:08.811\n法務部長、警政署局長、州局長昨天出新聞的敦炳中學在本席的選區這個衝突的背後\n\n00:25.393 --> 00:39.280\n各案的處理狀況聯繫資源的速度還算快看起來事態是沒有擴大但是我想從這個事情裡面去問後續背後發生的原因我們在這些執行所謂趕快教育的這些學校裡面平常的人力是否充足\n\n00:40.816 --> 01:00.189\n人員確實是不太夠,不過我們會充分地來利用現有的人力,也會爭取來增加員額。對,我照理來講,作為一個感化教育執行的機關,比如平常的人力是充足的,學生跟老師的比例以及等等,他應該要比一般的學校更充足的人力,因為\n\n01:00.669 --> 01:00.789\n提供書面。\n\n01:25.724 --> 01:41.785\n謝謝部長好再來要討論一下今天是講少婦會今天應該有蠻多委員對這個題目提出意見跟看法現在在新制的少婦會上任這個上場執行之後現在看起來是要先走少婦會的流程然後才能轉少年法\n\n01:42.125 --> 01:42.505\n新制的少婦會到底由誰來主管?\n\n02:08.821 --> 02:24.549\n報告委員本來新制的少年委員會應該是成立在這個縣市政府的這個底下的一級單位但是因為地方自治法沒有辦法再容納新的這個委員會或者是局處所以他就在目前還是在跟警察局少年隊友配合\n\n02:25.051 --> 02:53.567\n所以這個按照法理上應該是交給地方政府處理嘛然後地方各就成立各自的少府會然後委員大概就可能市長兼任這個主委然後副市長就副主委然後這局長就大家就排排座是這樣對不對那它變成一個類似任務編組的一個方式喔然後大部分是以兼職的方式來處理喔這本期擔心啦然後實務上剛剛警政署已經講很清楚它實務上還是交給警察來做處理喔那以現在中央政府的了解喔各地少府會的運作這樣子的模式是順利的嗎\n\n02:54.728 --> 03:14.977\n還是其實是變成換湯不換藥呢目前來講因為他是有一個新的想法叫做行政先行對行政先行嘛避免這個偏差行為少年或是這個一些他等於有個預防機制在那邊嘛預防機制就是這裡嘛那我們就是目前來講因為剛開始實施那我們看數有1200多件那現在的人力大概260幾個人目前來講應該是還好全國全國對全國的這個260幾個人力服務多少\n\n03:22.680 --> 03:26.362\n需要被輔導的少年?目前開案數是1200多人。1200多人?\n\n03:26.362 --> 03:48.011\n是是是。這跟當初立法的時候期待的數字有沒有落差?那當然應該是慢慢的會增加但是目前來講就是這個狀況。如果說按照法的精神去執行的時候實際上這個案量暴增的時候會不會造成基層警力的負擔?那當然會啊。其實會齁?但是其實我們就是這個單位的話還是要跟教育單位還有社政單位還有一些這個衛福單位會有配合。\n\n03:49.748 --> 04:19.288\n這個就是本集今天特別要提這個這個題目的原因因為新制之後大家就對於少府會有就輔導方面的期待一定是更高的嘛因為我們等於就是預防機制但相關來講以現行的這樣子的一個組織編制好像很難有權力去整併相關的資源對不對你實務上到最後還是變成變成由警察單位來執行輔導對象跟職責這個然後又很難抗拒司法機關的一些請求我是覺得有一點擔心啦相關的這些人力增補跟權責劃分有沒有更進一步的思考跟考慮呢\n\n04:19.948 --> 04:47.845\n那這是如果是能夠它提升到這個縣政府的一級單位那這個話可能就會整合更多的像社會安全網的這個資源他們可能就會做更多事而不是只是限制在警察這個預防的部分好這個我是覺得還有可疑之處啦但是慢慢討論嘛因為親自上路總是執行之後那今天至少也有個初步了260位人力服務1000多個案量那順著這個大家我們再持續來做觀察再來我問一下就是少府會移送法院的標準現在很明確的標準嗎\n\n04:49.013 --> 05:03.202\n有他有一定的標準就是說他這個少年的話如果他已經沒有辦法在這個輔導機制裡面那他會跟就移送少年法院來處理對法院會來對決以前實務上來講有沒有遇到少年法庭認為移送不當然後退回來這種\n\n05:04.362 --> 05:19.972\n有否遇過這種狀況?目前並沒有,沒有這樣的案例。就是我們目前接的案例並沒有這樣的案例。我們接的就是已經受這個角質學校那他出來又有這個少年調查官的部分,他少年保護官的部分來交給我們輔導還有兩個。\n\n05:21.874 --> 05:42.585\n那實務上有沒有說因為曝險行為以外然後處罰或偏差行為然後反而導致說法庭認為說他應該先走少婦會流程有沒有這樣的狀況這個是有的這個也是有的這樣數量站那1200個案例裡面站多數嗎就不多不多大概多少有數字嗎這個部分是因為我們目前沒有從沒有這個我沒有這個數據\n\n05:43.746 --> 06:07.414\n好,這本期要提這個就提醒就是說以人力編制或什麼來講我們不希望說既然要有輔導的機制先行我們就不希望他一樣是像過去一樣換當不換藥還是由警政單位來負擔有的時候也要稍微降低一下這個警察弟兄的一些情誤啦然後讓更多的也許是社政也好也許是教育單位來做支援這一部分丟給地方我希望大家有一個長期追蹤的機制\n\n06:08.234 --> 06:17.300\n如果到最後是換湯不換藥的時候,也許我們從法制面再來做檢討。那當然如果可以運作順利,各地方政府找出方案的話,那當然是最好。這一點我希望中央政府來持續追蹤,可以嗎?\n\n","segments":[{"start":4.386,"end":8.811,"text":"法務部長、警政署局長、州局長昨天出新聞的敦炳中學在本席的選區這個衝突的背後"},{"start":25.393,"end":39.28,"text":"各案的處理狀況聯繫資源的速度還算快看起來事態是沒有擴大但是我想從這個事情裡面去問後續背後發生的原因我們在這些執行所謂趕快教育的這些學校裡面平常的人力是否充足"},{"start":40.816,"end":60.189,"text":"人員確實是不太夠,不過我們會充分地來利用現有的人力,也會爭取來增加員額。對,我照理來講,作為一個感化教育執行的機關,比如平常的人力是充足的,學生跟老師的比例以及等等,他應該要比一般的學校更充足的人力,因為"},{"start":60.669,"end":60.789,"text":"提供書面。"},{"start":85.724,"end":101.785,"text":"謝謝部長好再來要討論一下今天是講少婦會今天應該有蠻多委員對這個題目提出意見跟看法現在在新制的少婦會上任這個上場執行之後現在看起來是要先走少婦會的流程然後才能轉少年法"},{"start":102.125,"end":102.505,"text":"新制的少婦會到底由誰來主管?"},{"start":128.821,"end":144.549,"text":"報告委員本來新制的少年委員會應該是成立在這個縣市政府的這個底下的一級單位但是因為地方自治法沒有辦法再容納新的這個委員會或者是局處所以他就在目前還是在跟警察局少年隊友配合"},{"start":145.051,"end":173.567,"text":"所以這個按照法理上應該是交給地方政府處理嘛然後地方各就成立各自的少府會然後委員大概就可能市長兼任這個主委然後副市長就副主委然後這局長就大家就排排座是這樣對不對那它變成一個類似任務編組的一個方式喔然後大部分是以兼職的方式來處理喔這本期擔心啦然後實務上剛剛警政署已經講很清楚它實務上還是交給警察來做處理喔那以現在中央政府的了解喔各地少府會的運作這樣子的模式是順利的嗎"},{"start":174.728,"end":194.977,"text":"還是其實是變成換湯不換藥呢目前來講因為他是有一個新的想法叫做行政先行對行政先行嘛避免這個偏差行為少年或是這個一些他等於有個預防機制在那邊嘛預防機制就是這裡嘛那我們就是目前來講因為剛開始實施那我們看數有1200多件那現在的人力大概260幾個人目前來講應該是還好全國全國對全國的這個260幾個人力服務多少"},{"start":202.68,"end":206.362,"text":"需要被輔導的少年?目前開案數是1200多人。1200多人?"},{"start":206.362,"end":228.011,"text":"是是是。這跟當初立法的時候期待的數字有沒有落差?那當然應該是慢慢的會增加但是目前來講就是這個狀況。如果說按照法的精神去執行的時候實際上這個案量暴增的時候會不會造成基層警力的負擔?那當然會啊。其實會齁?但是其實我們就是這個單位的話還是要跟教育單位還有社政單位還有一些這個衛福單位會有配合。"},{"start":229.748,"end":259.288,"text":"這個就是本集今天特別要提這個這個題目的原因因為新制之後大家就對於少府會有就輔導方面的期待一定是更高的嘛因為我們等於就是預防機制但相關來講以現行的這樣子的一個組織編制好像很難有權力去整併相關的資源對不對你實務上到最後還是變成變成由警察單位來執行輔導對象跟職責這個然後又很難抗拒司法機關的一些請求我是覺得有一點擔心啦相關的這些人力增補跟權責劃分有沒有更進一步的思考跟考慮呢"},{"start":259.948,"end":287.845,"text":"那這是如果是能夠它提升到這個縣政府的一級單位那這個話可能就會整合更多的像社會安全網的這個資源他們可能就會做更多事而不是只是限制在警察這個預防的部分好 這個我是覺得還有可疑之處啦但是慢慢討論嘛因為親自上路總是執行之後那今天至少也有個初步了260位人力服務1000多個案量那順著這個大家我們再持續來做觀察再來我問一下就是少府會移送法院的標準現在很明確的標準嗎"},{"start":289.013,"end":303.202,"text":"有他有一定的標準就是說他這個少年的話如果他已經沒有辦法在這個輔導機制裡面那他會跟就移送少年法院來處理對法院會來對決以前實務上來講有沒有遇到少年法庭認為移送不當然後退回來這種"},{"start":304.362,"end":319.972,"text":"有否遇過這種狀況?目前並沒有,沒有這樣的案例。就是我們目前接的案例並沒有這樣的案例。我們接的就是已經受這個角質學校那他出來又有這個少年調查官的部分,他少年保護官的部分來交給我們輔導還有兩個。"},{"start":321.874,"end":342.585,"text":"那實務上有沒有說因為曝險行為以外然後處罰或偏差行為然後反而導致說法庭認為說他應該先走少婦會流程有沒有這樣的狀況這個是有的這個也是有的這樣數量站那1200個案例裡面站多數嗎就不多不多大概多少有數字嗎這個部分是因為我們目前沒有從沒有這個我沒有這個數據"},{"start":343.746,"end":367.414,"text":"好,這本期要提這個就提醒就是說以人力編制或什麼來講我們不希望說既然要有輔導的機制先行我們就不希望他一樣是像過去一樣換當不換藥還是由警政單位來負擔有的時候也要稍微降低一下這個警察弟兄的一些情誤啦然後讓更多的也許是社政也好也許是教育單位來做支援這一部分丟給地方我希望大家有一個長期追蹤的機制"},{"start":368.234,"end":377.3,"text":"如果到最後是換湯不換藥的時候,也許我們從法制面再來做檢討。那當然如果可以運作順利,各地方政府找出方案的話,那當然是最好。這一點我希望中央政府來持續追蹤,可以嗎?"}]}}}}