{"id":150723,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150723","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/01d093d00f1a07c076dd38d06cf64d7d9e1c65aef640d3e3f8ba9b0039caa7a6d5b1ff11865c5e7f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"沈發惠","委員發言時間":"10:23:39 - 10:34:59","影片長度":"00:11:20","會議時間":"2024-04-01T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第11次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查\n（一）台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（二）委員楊瓊瓔等20人擬具「立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（三）委員傅崐萁等52人擬具「立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（四）委員吳宗憲等16人擬具「立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（五）委員吳宗憲等17人擬具「立法院職權行使法第十七條條文修正草案」案。\n（六）委員傅崐萁等52人擬具「立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（七）委員吳宗憲等17人擬具「立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（八）委員翁曉玲等16人擬具「立法院職權行使法第十五條、第二十九條及第四十四條條文修正草案」案。\n（九）委員傅崐萁等52人擬具「立法院職權行使法第十五條之一、第十五條之二及第十五條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（十）委員翁曉玲等16人擬具「立法院職權行使法第十五條之一、第十五條之二及第十五條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（十一）委員吳宗憲等16人擬具「立法院職權行使法第十五條之一、第十五條之二及第十五條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（十二）委員賴瑞隆等17人擬具「立法院職權行使法第十五條之二條文修正草案」案。\n（十三）委員賴士葆等20人擬具「立法院職權行使法增訂部分條文草案」案。\n（十四）委員吳宗憲等18人擬具「立法院職權行使法第二十五條及第二十六條條文修正草案」案。\n（十五）委員翁曉玲等18人擬具「立法院職權行使法第二十五條條文修正草案」案。\n二、審查\n（一）委員傅崐萁等52人擬具「中華民國刑法增訂第五章之一章名、第一百四十一條之一及第一百四十一條之二條文草案」案。\n（二）委員翁曉玲等19人擬具「中華民國刑法增訂第一百四十條之一條文草案」案。\n三、審查\n（一）委員羅智強等20人擬具「立法委員互選院長副院長辦法第一條條文修正草案」案。\n（二）台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「立法委員互選院長副院長辦法第一條及第一條之一條文修正草案」案。\n（三）委員魯明哲等24人擬具「立法委員互選院長副院長辦法第一條條文修正草案」案。\n【第一案（四）、（五）、（七）、（十一）至（十五）及第二案（二）各黨團若未提出不復議同意書，則不予審查】\n【僅進行詢答】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第11次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":11,"committees":[36],"id":"委員會-11-1-36-11"},"date":"2024-04-01","duration":680,"end_time":"2024-04-01T10:34:59+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-01T10:23:39+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":363,"blocks":[["沈委員發惠：（10時23分）主席、各位同仁。今天我們最後進入詢答的部分，針對立法院職權行使法相關的修正草案進入討論，在討論之前，包括我們剛剛程序發言的大意，在一個立法委員職權行使法的草案裡面事實上牽涉非常多的議題，這個議題我們如果一一討論，時間是真的不太夠，我有看各個單位所提出來的書面報告，主席，是不是先請立法院的周秘書長？"],["主席：好，麻煩周秘書長。"],["周秘書長萬來：沈委員好。"],["沈委員發惠：周秘書長好。我看你的書面報告有做一些整理，就現有今天審查的20個法案所提出來的內容，你把它分門別類。"],["周秘書長萬來：對，分成四大部分。"],["沈委員發惠：對，有關於總統國情報告的、有人事同意權的、有緊急命令的追認，這些都是不同的議題，有總統彈劾的問題、有質詢的規範，就是剛剛其他委員所關注的質詢規範，還有立法院的調查權、聽證權，還有有關質詢的規範是不是要由刑法來規範，這個也是一個議題，另外比較小的有正副院長選舉。秘書長，你所整理的這些部分是針對目前這20個案子來做整理，因為我們的案子還沒有進來，民進黨有提一個草案，秘書長不曉得有沒有看過民進黨的草案？"],["周秘書長萬來：我大概看過一個印的新聞稿，有部分對於強化我們的幕僚也有一些規範，但是條文裡面……"],["沈委員發惠：草案你還沒有看到？"],["周秘書長萬來：還沒看到，可能程序會還沒排吧！"],["沈委員發惠：對，要等程序會排了之後，不過我在程序會之前可能可以先送一份給秘書長參考。"],["周秘書長萬來：謝謝。"],["沈委員發惠：也就是民進黨也有一份有關立法院職權行使法的草案。我看了今天議程所列的這20個草案跟我們民進黨所提的草案，其實民進黨所提的草案還有一些議題是沒有涵蓋在這20個草案裡面的，也就是周秘書長你很精心整理出來的這些議題裡面，民進黨事實上有一些內容並不在你整理的範圍內，有包括對於黨團協商法制效力的一些規範、有關於國會議員自律的部分、有關於強化秘密會議保密的相關規定，另外有關資深幕僚跟專業能量的一些規定，也有有關性別平等反對歧視的一些相關規定，這個都在民進黨的草案裡面，它也是立法委員職權行使法的一部分。","我大概整理了各黨的草案，我簡單講一下，民進黨的草案大概最重要的精神都是在國會自律，就是我們在有關立法院職權行使法的部分都是國會自律的部分占比較多，那國民黨的草案呢？大概就是立法院權力的擴張，我這樣歸類，對不對？我們剛剛所講的這些議題，目前這20個草案大部分都是權力的擴張、增加，對不對？"],["周秘書長萬來：要這樣說明，因為當時職權行使法在處理的時候，長官叫我負責這個地方是以釋字第325號解釋為基礎，後來釋字第585號解釋以後，立法院的調查權已經稍微擴大……"],["沈委員發惠：對，585號有做一些限制……"],["周秘書長萬來：擴大以後，現行的法規裡面並沒有配合，所以才會……"],["沈委員發惠：但是它也做了一些限制，對不對？"],["周秘書長萬來：對。"],["沈委員發惠：585號不是只有擴大調查權……"],["周秘書長萬來：它的立法調查權就不限於只有文件調閱。"],["沈委員發惠：對，不只調閱，還有調查權，但是585號解釋裡面對調查權的範圍也做了一些限縮跟規範，對不對？585號是這樣啦！我的理解沒有錯。","我在這邊也是希望本委員會的各位同仁，事實上立法院職權行使法絕對不只是現在這些議題，民進黨所提出的草案裡面有關國會自律的部分，我認為應該納入我們整個修法過程中一併討論，才不會讓社會覺得，我們在討論20案，大家吵了半天，結果全部都是立法院自我權力擴張的條文。我目前看到的都是在現有的立法院職權行使法之外，再去新增新的職權，都是立法院權力的擴張，這部分我是希望本委員會在審查的時候能夠把民進黨有關國會自律的部分一併納入審查。","我列出來我們剛剛所討論的部分，裡面爭議點這麼多，還好兩個禮拜前，我們今天的會議主席、我們召委有安排了針對總統國情報告的專案報告，所以那個議題我們可以深入討論。事實上，上次我們用一天的時間討論總統來立法院國情報告的議題，但是其他的議題我們現在呼嚕轟隆地把它弄成一包在今天詢答完，禮拜三再開一場公聽會3個小時，扣掉主席致詞、扣掉做結論，大概2個小時要談這麼多問題，要談人事同意權、要談緊急命令、要談總統彈劾、要談質詢規範、要談立法院調查權、聽證權、要談藐視國會罪、要談立法院正副議長選舉。所以我是覺得這樣子的整個立法過程實在是過於匆促，即便我們召委認為這個東西討論了20年了，所以不用再開公聽會，但是我想公聽會有公聽會的價值，我們立法院的法案都有屆期不連續，上一屆開的公聽會在這一屆有沒有效力？這個又是另外一個問題，這一屆我們本身要立法者，你說上一屆、2016年開過幾次公聽會，2016年我不是立法委員，那時候我只是新北市議員而已，那現在我在公聽會裡面要表達意見，卻沒有這個公聽會，這個是屆期不連續的一個基本概念。","所以我是再一次地希望，我們在進入法條審查之前，能夠針對剛剛所講的這些議題，犖犖大者很多啦！光是大家這次所討論的，我講兩個，第一個，有關藐視國會罪，用刑法來規範質詢，說反質詢必須要以藐視國會罪論處，反質詢這種字眼，秘書長，你號稱活字典，「反質詢」它法律的定義是什麼？"],["周秘書長萬來：這個「反質詢」就比較含混啦！所以……"],["沈委員發惠：有沒有哪個法律定義什麼叫反質詢？"],["周秘書長萬來：沒有，但是在職權行使法裡……"],["沈委員發惠：人家說：委員，你今天吃飽了沒？他說你反質詢……"],["周秘書長萬來：第二十四條、第二十五條規定的質詢範圍，他溢出這個範圍來加以解釋，就可能會……"],["沈委員發惠：按照這個立法結果，這個是藐視國會罪，這個是要課以刑責的。我今天如果上臺問說：「委員，不知道你吃飽沒？」這樣就算反質詢。「委員，剛剛你所問的問題我沒有聽清楚，請問你可以再說一遍嗎？」這算不算反質詢？因為法律沒有規範嘛！所以我實在搞不清楚什麼叫做反質詢。活字典請說明，我剛剛這樣算不算反質詢？"],["周秘書長萬來：針對這個地方在我報告裡面的第3頁、第4頁有稍微做個說明，質詢制度每一個國家有不同的規範……"],["沈委員發惠：對，有各種不同的規範，你現在說要把反質詢課以刑責，那在法律裡面對反質詢就要有明確的定義，這個不是所有念法律系的人的第一課，不要說法律系啦！法學序論裡面就有了，這個刑責沒有法律的明確性，到底什麼叫反質詢，你沒有去定義，然後要課以刑責，我覺得這個是荒天下之大謬，這部分我覺得還是拜託本委員會委員在審查的時候真的能夠三思啦！這種事不是喊爽的，這種是科以刑責的。不只是這些，裡面還有很多，我覺得如果我們能夠針對這些議題好好地召開幾場公聽會，我想還有很多的問題，包括聽證會，我們現在把調閱的人包括到所有公私法人，公法人、私法人、人民團體都必須要來，而且來了還可以送刑責，我們人事同意權說，人家還沒有同意他當什麼委員，他還只是一個國民，他來了我們就說：「你如果說謊，我就要科以刑責。」我覺得這些都是值得在公聽會裡面好好討論的，針對這些部分，懇請本委員會所有同仁要好好思考，這個與政黨的立場無關，我們針對這麼大的議題雖然過去20年有討論，但是我認為由這一屆委員大家共同透過一些公聽會的方式來形成一些共識是有必要的，以上。"],["周秘書長萬來：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝。","接下來請陳俊宇委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":202,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-36-11","speakers":["吳宗憲","鍾佳濱","吳思瑤","莊瑞雄","沈發惠","翁曉玲","羅智強","林思銘","柯建銘","陳俊宇","傅崐萁","黃國昌","鄭天財Sra 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0.799}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 652.521, \"end\": 652.601, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"送\", \"start\": 652.601, \"end\": 652.621, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"五\", \"start\": 654.275, \"end\": 654.295, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"（\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 654.295, \"end\": 654.315, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:14,029 --> 00:00:41,190\n主席各位同仁我想今天我們最後現在進入這個詢答的部分針對這個立法院職權行使法相關的修正草案進入討論我想在這個討論之前包括我們剛剛程序發言的大議大概在一個立法委員行使法的這個草案裡面事實上牽涉非常多的議題\n\n2\n00:01:10,225 --> 00:01:23,701\n四位好周秘書長好我看你的書面報告你有做一些整理就現有的今天所審查的20個法案所提出來的這個內容你把它做分門別類有這個\n\n3\n00:01:27,305 --> 00:01:35,276\n關於總統國情報告的有人事同意權的有緊急命令的追認這些都是不同的議題有總統彈劾的問題有這個諮詢的規範這是剛剛其他委員他們所關注的諮詢規範\n\n4\n00:01:46,350 --> 00:01:49,794\n還有這個立法院的調查權、聽證權還有這個有關質詢的規範是不是要由刑法來規範這個也是一個議題那這個另外比較小的政府議長\n\n5\n00:02:05,239 --> 00:02:19,160\n這個秘書長你所整理的這些部分是針對目前的這個20個案子來做整理的齁那這個我不知道秘書長因為這個我們這個案子還沒有進來齁民進黨有提一個草案這部分秘書長不知道有沒有有沒有看過民進黨的法案\n\n6\n00:02:19,420 --> 00:02:40,970\n我只看到大概印了一個新聞稿我看過啦。因為有部分的對於強化我們的幕僚啊。也有一些規範啦。但是條文裡面８立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．你還沒有看到．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．我覺得這個我們．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．當我們送進．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．沒有程序會可能還沒排吧．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．等程序會排了之後．立法院職權行使法\n\n7\n00:02:44,091 --> 00:03:05,463\n那這個民進黨也有一份我們的草案有關立法院職權行使法的草案那我就看了目前我們今天議程所列的這20個草案跟我民進黨所提的草案其實民進黨所提的草案還有一些議題是目前沒有涵蓋在這20個\n\n8\n00:03:28,932 --> 00:03:57,740\n有關於這個強化秘密會議的保密的相關的規定這個有另外有關資深幕僚跟專業能量的部分的一些規定也有這個有關這個反對性別這個有關性別平等的反對歧視的一些相關的規定這個都在民進黨的草案裡面他也是立法院職權行使法的一部分那所以我這樣大概整理的看的就是說現在這個這個各黨的草案大概其實我簡單大略講一下就是就是\n\n9\n00:03:59,226 --> 00:04:18,656\n民眾黨的草案大概最重要的精神都是在國會自律就是我們在有關這個立法委員立法院職權行使法的部分都是國會自律的部分佔比較多那國民黨的草案呢大概就是立法院權力的擴張我這樣歸類對不對我們剛剛所講的這些議題\n\n10\n00:04:22,101 --> 00:04:39,867\n目前我們的這些20個草案大部分都是權力的擴張增加對不對因為這樣說明因為325號因為當時職權行使法在處理的時候我長官叫我負責這個地方的時候是以325號解釋為基礎\n\n11\n00:04:43,589 --> 00:04:58,261\n五、八、五號解釋以後立法院的這個調查權它是已經稍微擴大。對,這要擴大以後,現行的法規裡面並沒有配合。但是他也做了一些限制嘛對不對。五、八、五號他不是只有說擴大。\n\n12\n00:04:59,002 --> 00:05:02,445\n五八五號的解釋裡面對於調查權的範圍他也做了一些一些限縮跟規範對不對對五八五號是這樣對我的理解沒有錯了齁那所以\n\n13\n00:05:20,100 --> 00:05:37,110\n我在這邊也是跟本委員會的各位同仁也是希望說這個事實上立法院職權行使法它絕對不只是現在這些議題民進黨所提出的草案裡面有關國會自律的部分我認為應該一併\n\n14\n00:05:39,127 --> 00:05:39,367\n委員楊瓊瓔等52人擬具\n\n15\n00:05:51,685 --> 00:06:09,333\n的條文我目前看到的都是在現有的這個立法院職權行使法之外再去新的職權都是立法院擴張這部分我是希望說本委員在審查的時候能夠一併把民進黨有關國會自律的部分一併納入審查那這個\n\n16\n00:06:12,150 --> 00:06:33,128\n就目前齁其實剛剛所講的我們列出來我們剛剛所討論的光這個爭議點這麼多還好還好我們兩個禮拜前我們這個今天的會議主席齁我們的召委有安排了針對這個總統國情報告的專案報告所以那個議題我們可以深入討論事實上上次我們用一天的時間討論這個總統來立法院國情報告的議題嘛對不對\n\n17\n00:06:37,432 --> 00:06:51,743\n但是其他的議題我們現在呼嚕呼呼轟隆的把它弄成一包那在在在在今天巡達完禮拜三再開一場公聽會三個小時扣掉主席致詞扣掉做結論大概兩個小時每個委員大概大概要要談這麼多問題要談人事同意權要談緊急命令要談總統彈劾要談質詢規範要談這個這個立法院調查權聽證權要談藐視國會罪要談立法院政府議長選舉\n\n18\n00:07:04,778 --> 00:07:25,398\n所以我是我是是覺得說這樣子的整個立法過程實在是有過於衝觸了齁即便即便這個這個我們召委認為說這個東西討論了20年了所以不用再開公聽會但是我想公聽會有公公聽會的價值我們法案立法院法案都有屆期不連續上屆開的公聽會在這一屆\n\n19\n00:07:27,708 --> 00:07:40,917\n這一屆有沒有效率這個這又是另外一個問題這一屆我們本身我們要立法者上一屆你說你說2016年開過幾次公聽會2016年我不是立法委員我那時候只是新北市議員而已那我現在我在公聽會裡面我要表達意見我沒有給我這個公聽會\n\n20\n00:07:44,501 --> 00:08:02,007\n這個是基本這個屆期不連續的一個基本概念所以我是再一次的希望說我們在進入法條審查之前我們能夠針對剛剛所講的這些議題盈盈大哲很多這個我光就來提這個我們大家所討論的\n\n21\n00:08:05,540 --> 00:08:10,501\n講兩個第一個有關這個藐視國會罪齁用刑法來規範這個質詢齁說反質詢必須要是藐視國會必須要以藐視國會罪論處這個反質詢這種字眼齁有這個秘書長你你你你號稱活字典反質詢他有法律的定義是什麼\n\n22\n00:08:30,014 --> 00:08:36,354\n因為這個反諮詢就比較含困啦。所以...所以...有沒有哪一個法律定義說什麼叫反諮詢?\n\n23\n00:08:37,321 --> 00:08:39,582\n五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五\n\n24\n00:09:08,337 --> 00:09:21,822\n委員剛剛你所問的問題我沒有聽清楚請問你可以再說一遍嗎這算不算反質詢來我們因為法律沒有規範嘛所以我實在搞不清楚什麼叫做反質詢來侯志廉我們說明我剛剛這樣算不算反質詢\n\n25\n00:09:23,030 --> 00:09:37,531\n所以在我的報告裡面針對這一個地方在我報告在3月第3月第4月有稍微做個說明這一個執行制度每個國家有他不同的這一種規範\n\n26\n00:09:39,593 --> 00:10:00,138\n對有各種不同的規範那你現在說要把反質詢納入納入這個用可以刑責那你就要你就法律裡面就要對反質詢你要有明確的定義啊這個不是所有念法律系的人第一課法不要說法律系啦法學序論裡面就有了這個這個這個完全你這個刑責沒有法律的明確性\n\n27\n00:10:01,889 --> 00:10:23,008\n到底什麼叫反質詢,你沒有去定義,然後要刻以刑責。我覺得這個是荒天下的大謬。這部分我覺得還是要拜託本委員會委員在審查的時候,能夠真的三思的。這種事不是寒爽的。這種刻以刑責的。這個不只是這些啦,裡面還有很多\n\n28\n00:10:24,104 --> 00:10:52,621\n很多我覺得我我覺得如果我們能夠針對這些議題好好召開幾個公聽會我在還有很多的問題包括我們聽證會我們現在把這個這個調閱人包括到所有公司法人公法人司法人人民團體都必須要來而且來了還可以送行者我們人事同意權說人家還沒有同意他當當當什麼委員他還只是一個一個一個國民來了說你若說謊我要把你送\n\n29\n00:10:54,275 --> 00:10:54,315\n五（委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n14029\t41190\t主席各位同仁我想今天我們最後現在進入這個詢答的部分針對這個立法院職權行使法相關的修正草案進入討論我想在這個討論之前包括我們剛剛程序發言的大議大概在一個立法委員行使法的這個草案裡面事實上牽涉非常多的議題\n42824\t63933\t議員楊瓊瓊\n70225\t83701\t四位好周秘書長好我看你的書面報告你有做一些整理就現有的今天所審查的20個法案所提出來的這個內容你把它做分門別類有這個\n87305\t95276\t關於總統國情報告的有人事同意權的有緊急命令的追認這些都是不同的議題有總統彈劾的問題有這個諮詢的規範這是剛剛其他委員他們所關注的諮詢規範\n106350\t109794\t還有這個立法院的調查權、聽證權還有這個有關質詢的規範是不是要由刑法來規範這個也是一個議題那這個另外比較小的政府議長\n125239\t139160\t這個秘書長你所整理的這些部分是針對目前的這個20個案子來做整理的齁那這個我不知道秘書長因為這個我們這個案子還沒有進來齁民進黨有提一個草案這部分秘書長不知道有沒有有沒有看過民進黨的法案\n139420\t160970\t我只看到大概印了一個新聞稿我看過啦。因為有部分的對於強化我們的幕僚啊。也有一些規範啦。但是條文裡面８立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．你還沒有看到．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．我覺得這個我們．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．當我們送進．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．沒有程序會可能還沒排吧．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．等程序會排了之後．立法院職權行使法\n164091\t185463\t那這個民進黨也有一份我們的草案有關立法院職權行使法的草案那我就看了目前我們今天議程所列的這20個草案跟我民進黨所提的草案其實民進黨所提的草案還有一些議題是目前沒有涵蓋在這20個\n188865\t208712\t議員楊瓊瓊\n208932\t237740\t有關於這個強化秘密會議的保密的相關的規定這個有另外有關資深幕僚跟專業能量的部分的一些規定也有這個有關這個反對性別這個有關性別平等的反對歧視的一些相關的規定這個都在民進黨的草案裡面他也是立法院職權行使法的一部分那所以我這樣大概整理的看的就是說現在這個這個各黨的草案大概其實我簡單大略講一下就是就是\n239226\t258656\t民眾黨的草案大概最重要的精神都是在國會自律就是我們在有關這個立法委員立法院職權行使法的部分都是國會自律的部分佔比較多那國民黨的草案呢大概就是立法院權力的擴張我這樣歸類對不對我們剛剛所講的這些議題\n262101\t279867\t目前我們的這些20個草案大部分都是權力的擴張增加對不對因為這樣說明因為325號因為當時職權行使法在處理的時候我長官叫我負責這個地方的時候是以325號解釋為基礎\n283589\t298261\t五、八、五號解釋以後立法院的這個調查權它是已經稍微擴大。對,這要擴大以後,現行的法規裡面並沒有配合。但是他也做了一些限制嘛對不對。五、八、五號他不是只有說擴大。\n299002\t302445\t五八五號的解釋裡面對於調查權的範圍他也做了一些一些限縮跟規範對不對對五八五號是這樣對我的理解沒有錯了齁那所以\n320100\t337110\t我在這邊也是跟本委員會的各位同仁也是希望說這個事實上立法院職權行使法它絕對不只是現在這些議題民進黨所提出的草案裡面有關國會自律的部分我認為應該一併\n339127\t339367\t委員楊瓊瓔等52人擬具\n351685\t369333\t的條文我目前看到的都是在現有的這個立法院職權行使法之外再去新的職權都是立法院擴張這部分我是希望說本委員在審查的時候能夠一併把民進黨有關國會自律的部分一併納入審查那這個\n372150\t393128\t就目前齁其實剛剛所講的我們列出來我們剛剛所討論的光這個爭議點這麼多還好還好我們兩個禮拜前我們這個今天的會議主席齁我們的召委有安排了針對這個總統國情報告的專案報告所以那個議題我們可以深入討論事實上上次我們用一天的時間討論這個總統來立法院國情報告的議題嘛對不對\n397432\t411743\t但是其他的議題我們現在呼嚕呼呼轟隆的把它弄成一包那在在在在今天巡達完禮拜三再開一場公聽會三個小時扣掉主席致詞扣掉做結論大概兩個小時每個委員大概大概要要談這麼多問題要談人事同意權要談緊急命令要談總統彈劾要談質詢規範要談這個這個立法院調查權聽證權要談藐視國會罪要談立法院政府議長選舉\n424778\t445398\t所以我是我是是覺得說這樣子的整個立法過程實在是有過於衝觸了齁即便即便這個這個我們召委認為說這個東西討論了20年了所以不用再開公聽會但是我想公聽會有公公聽會的價值我們法案立法院法案都有屆期不連續上屆開的公聽會在這一屆\n447708\t460917\t這一屆有沒有效率這個這又是另外一個問題這一屆我們本身我們要立法者上一屆你說你說2016年開過幾次公聽會2016年我不是立法委員我那時候只是新北市議員而已那我現在我在公聽會裡面我要表達意見我沒有給我這個公聽會\n464501\t482007\t這個是基本這個屆期不連續的一個基本概念所以我是再一次的希望說我們在進入法條審查之前我們能夠針對剛剛所講的這些議題盈盈大哲很多這個我光就來提這個我們大家所討論的\n485540\t490501\t講兩個第一個有關這個藐視國會罪齁用刑法來規範這個質詢齁說反質詢必須要是藐視國會必須要以藐視國會罪論處這個反質詢這種字眼齁有這個秘書長你你你你號稱活字典反質詢他有法律的定義是什麼\n510014\t516354\t因為這個反諮詢就比較含困啦。所以...所以... 有沒有哪一個法律定義說什麼叫反諮詢?\n517321\t519582\t五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五\n548337\t561822\t委員剛剛你所問的問題我沒有聽清楚請問你可以再說一遍嗎這算不算反質詢來我們因為法律沒有規範嘛所以我實在搞不清楚什麼叫做反質詢來侯志廉我們說明我剛剛這樣算不算反質詢\n563030\t577531\t所以在我的報告裡面針對這一個地方在我報告在3月第3月第4月有稍微做個說明這一個執行制度每個國家有他不同的這一種規範\n579593\t600138\t對有各種不同的規範那你現在說要把反質詢納入納入這個用可以刑責那你就要你就法律裡面就要對反質詢你要有明確的定義啊這個不是所有念法律系的人第一課法不要說法律系啦法學序論裡面就有了這個這個這個完全你這個刑責沒有法律的明確性\n601889\t623008\t到底什麼叫反質詢,你沒有去定義,然後要刻以刑責。我覺得這個是荒天下的大謬。這部分我覺得還是要拜託本委員會委員在審查的時候,能夠真的三思的。這種事不是寒爽的。這種刻以刑責的。這個不只是這些啦,裡面還有很多\n624104\t652621\t很多我覺得我我覺得如果我們能夠針對這些議題好好召開幾個公聽會我在還有很多的問題包括我們聽證會我們現在把這個這個調閱人包括到所有公司法人公法人司法人人民團體都必須要來而且來了還可以送行者我們人事同意權說人家還沒有同意他當當當什麼委員他還只是一個一個一個國民來了說你若說謊我要把你送\n654275\t654315\t五（委員\n","txt":"主席各位同仁我想今天我們最後現在進入這個詢答的部分針對這個立法院職權行使法相關的修正草案進入討論我想在這個討論之前包括我們剛剛程序發言的大議大概在一個立法委員行使法的這個草案裡面事實上牽涉非常多的議題\n議員楊瓊瓊\n四位好周秘書長好我看你的書面報告你有做一些整理就現有的今天所審查的20個法案所提出來的這個內容你把它做分門別類有這個\n關於總統國情報告的有人事同意權的有緊急命令的追認這些都是不同的議題有總統彈劾的問題有這個諮詢的規範這是剛剛其他委員他們所關注的諮詢規範\n還有這個立法院的調查權、聽證權還有這個有關質詢的規範是不是要由刑法來規範這個也是一個議題那這個另外比較小的政府議長\n這個秘書長你所整理的這些部分是針對目前的這個20個案子來做整理的齁那這個我不知道秘書長因為這個我們這個案子還沒有進來齁民進黨有提一個草案這部分秘書長不知道有沒有有沒有看過民進黨的法案\n我只看到大概印了一個新聞稿我看過啦。因為有部分的對於強化我們的幕僚啊。也有一些規範啦。但是條文裡面８立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．你還沒有看到．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．我覺得這個我們．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．當我們送進．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．沒有程序會可能還沒排吧．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．等程序會排了之後．立法院職權行使法\n那這個民進黨也有一份我們的草案有關立法院職權行使法的草案那我就看了目前我們今天議程所列的這20個草案跟我民進黨所提的草案其實民進黨所提的草案還有一些議題是目前沒有涵蓋在這20個\n議員楊瓊瓊\n有關於這個強化秘密會議的保密的相關的規定這個有另外有關資深幕僚跟專業能量的部分的一些規定也有這個有關這個反對性別這個有關性別平等的反對歧視的一些相關的規定這個都在民進黨的草案裡面他也是立法院職權行使法的一部分那所以我這樣大概整理的看的就是說現在這個這個各黨的草案大概其實我簡單大略講一下就是就是\n民眾黨的草案大概最重要的精神都是在國會自律就是我們在有關這個立法委員立法院職權行使法的部分都是國會自律的部分佔比較多那國民黨的草案呢大概就是立法院權力的擴張我這樣歸類對不對我們剛剛所講的這些議題\n目前我們的這些20個草案大部分都是權力的擴張增加對不對因為這樣說明因為325號因為當時職權行使法在處理的時候我長官叫我負責這個地方的時候是以325號解釋為基礎\n五、八、五號解釋以後立法院的這個調查權它是已經稍微擴大。對,這要擴大以後,現行的法規裡面並沒有配合。但是他也做了一些限制嘛對不對。五、八、五號他不是只有說擴大。\n五八五號的解釋裡面對於調查權的範圍他也做了一些一些限縮跟規範對不對對五八五號是這樣對我的理解沒有錯了齁那所以\n我在這邊也是跟本委員會的各位同仁也是希望說這個事實上立法院職權行使法它絕對不只是現在這些議題民進黨所提出的草案裡面有關國會自律的部分我認為應該一併\n委員楊瓊瓔等52人擬具\n的條文我目前看到的都是在現有的這個立法院職權行使法之外再去新的職權都是立法院擴張這部分我是希望說本委員在審查的時候能夠一併把民進黨有關國會自律的部分一併納入審查那這個\n就目前齁其實剛剛所講的我們列出來我們剛剛所討論的光這個爭議點這麼多還好還好我們兩個禮拜前我們這個今天的會議主席齁我們的召委有安排了針對這個總統國情報告的專案報告所以那個議題我們可以深入討論事實上上次我們用一天的時間討論這個總統來立法院國情報告的議題嘛對不對\n但是其他的議題我們現在呼嚕呼呼轟隆的把它弄成一包那在在在在今天巡達完禮拜三再開一場公聽會三個小時扣掉主席致詞扣掉做結論大概兩個小時每個委員大概大概要要談這麼多問題要談人事同意權要談緊急命令要談總統彈劾要談質詢規範要談這個這個立法院調查權聽證權要談藐視國會罪要談立法院政府議長選舉\n所以我是我是是覺得說這樣子的整個立法過程實在是有過於衝觸了齁即便即便這個這個我們召委認為說這個東西討論了20年了所以不用再開公聽會但是我想公聽會有公公聽會的價值我們法案立法院法案都有屆期不連續上屆開的公聽會在這一屆\n這一屆有沒有效率這個這又是另外一個問題這一屆我們本身我們要立法者上一屆你說你說2016年開過幾次公聽會2016年我不是立法委員我那時候只是新北市議員而已那我現在我在公聽會裡面我要表達意見我沒有給我這個公聽會\n這個是基本這個屆期不連續的一個基本概念所以我是再一次的希望說我們在進入法條審查之前我們能夠針對剛剛所講的這些議題盈盈大哲很多這個我光就來提這個我們大家所討論的\n講兩個第一個有關這個藐視國會罪齁用刑法來規範這個質詢齁說反質詢必須要是藐視國會必須要以藐視國會罪論處這個反質詢這種字眼齁有這個秘書長你你你你號稱活字典反質詢他有法律的定義是什麼\n因為這個反諮詢就比較含困啦。所以...所以... 有沒有哪一個法律定義說什麼叫反諮詢?\n五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五\n委員剛剛你所問的問題我沒有聽清楚請問你可以再說一遍嗎這算不算反質詢來我們因為法律沒有規範嘛所以我實在搞不清楚什麼叫做反質詢來侯志廉我們說明我剛剛這樣算不算反質詢\n所以在我的報告裡面針對這一個地方在我報告在3月第3月第4月有稍微做個說明這一個執行制度每個國家有他不同的這一種規範\n對有各種不同的規範那你現在說要把反質詢納入納入這個用可以刑責那你就要你就法律裡面就要對反質詢你要有明確的定義啊這個不是所有念法律系的人第一課法不要說法律系啦法學序論裡面就有了這個這個這個完全你這個刑責沒有法律的明確性\n到底什麼叫反質詢,你沒有去定義,然後要刻以刑責。我覺得這個是荒天下的大謬。這部分我覺得還是要拜託本委員會委員在審查的時候,能夠真的三思的。這種事不是寒爽的。這種刻以刑責的。這個不只是這些啦,裡面還有很多\n很多我覺得我我覺得如果我們能夠針對這些議題好好召開幾個公聽會我在還有很多的問題包括我們聽證會我們現在把這個這個調閱人包括到所有公司法人公法人司法人人民團體都必須要來而且來了還可以送行者我們人事同意權說人家還沒有同意他當當當什麼委員他還只是一個一個一個國民來了說你若說謊我要把你送\n五（委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:14.029 --> 00:41.190\n主席各位同仁我想今天我們最後現在進入這個詢答的部分針對這個立法院職權行使法相關的修正草案進入討論我想在這個討論之前包括我們剛剛程序發言的大議大概在一個立法委員行使法的這個草案裡面事實上牽涉非常多的議題\n\n01:10.225 --> 01:23.701\n四位好周秘書長好我看你的書面報告你有做一些整理就現有的今天所審查的20個法案所提出來的這個內容你把它做分門別類有這個\n\n01:27.305 --> 01:35.276\n關於總統國情報告的有人事同意權的有緊急命令的追認這些都是不同的議題有總統彈劾的問題有這個諮詢的規範這是剛剛其他委員他們所關注的諮詢規範\n\n01:46.350 --> 01:49.794\n還有這個立法院的調查權、聽證權還有這個有關質詢的規範是不是要由刑法來規範這個也是一個議題那這個另外比較小的政府議長\n\n02:05.239 --> 02:19.160\n這個秘書長你所整理的這些部分是針對目前的這個20個案子來做整理的齁那這個我不知道秘書長因為這個我們這個案子還沒有進來齁民進黨有提一個草案這部分秘書長不知道有沒有有沒有看過民進黨的法案\n\n02:19.420 --> 02:40.970\n我只看到大概印了一個新聞稿我看過啦。因為有部分的對於強化我們的幕僚啊。也有一些規範啦。但是條文裡面８立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．你還沒有看到．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．我覺得這個我們．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．當我們送進．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．沒有程序會可能還沒排吧．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．等程序會排了之後．立法院職權行使法\n\n02:44.091 --> 03:05.463\n那這個民進黨也有一份我們的草案有關立法院職權行使法的草案那我就看了目前我們今天議程所列的這20個草案跟我民進黨所提的草案其實民進黨所提的草案還有一些議題是目前沒有涵蓋在這20個\n\n03:28.932 --> 03:57.740\n有關於這個強化秘密會議的保密的相關的規定這個有另外有關資深幕僚跟專業能量的部分的一些規定也有這個有關這個反對性別這個有關性別平等的反對歧視的一些相關的規定這個都在民進黨的草案裡面他也是立法院職權行使法的一部分那所以我這樣大概整理的看的就是說現在這個這個各黨的草案大概其實我簡單大略講一下就是就是\n\n03:59.226 --> 04:18.656\n民眾黨的草案大概最重要的精神都是在國會自律就是我們在有關這個立法委員立法院職權行使法的部分都是國會自律的部分佔比較多那國民黨的草案呢大概就是立法院權力的擴張我這樣歸類對不對我們剛剛所講的這些議題\n\n04:22.101 --> 04:39.867\n目前我們的這些20個草案大部分都是權力的擴張增加對不對因為這樣說明因為325號因為當時職權行使法在處理的時候我長官叫我負責這個地方的時候是以325號解釋為基礎\n\n04:43.589 --> 04:58.261\n五、八、五號解釋以後立法院的這個調查權它是已經稍微擴大。對,這要擴大以後,現行的法規裡面並沒有配合。但是他也做了一些限制嘛對不對。五、八、五號他不是只有說擴大。\n\n04:59.002 --> 05:02.445\n五八五號的解釋裡面對於調查權的範圍他也做了一些一些限縮跟規範對不對對五八五號是這樣對我的理解沒有錯了齁那所以\n\n05:20.100 --> 05:37.110\n我在這邊也是跟本委員會的各位同仁也是希望說這個事實上立法院職權行使法它絕對不只是現在這些議題民進黨所提出的草案裡面有關國會自律的部分我認為應該一併\n\n05:39.127 --> 05:39.367\n委員楊瓊瓔等52人擬具\n\n05:51.685 --> 06:09.333\n的條文我目前看到的都是在現有的這個立法院職權行使法之外再去新的職權都是立法院擴張這部分我是希望說本委員在審查的時候能夠一併把民進黨有關國會自律的部分一併納入審查那這個\n\n06:12.150 --> 06:33.128\n就目前齁其實剛剛所講的我們列出來我們剛剛所討論的光這個爭議點這麼多還好還好我們兩個禮拜前我們這個今天的會議主席齁我們的召委有安排了針對這個總統國情報告的專案報告所以那個議題我們可以深入討論事實上上次我們用一天的時間討論這個總統來立法院國情報告的議題嘛對不對\n\n06:37.432 --> 06:51.743\n但是其他的議題我們現在呼嚕呼呼轟隆的把它弄成一包那在在在在今天巡達完禮拜三再開一場公聽會三個小時扣掉主席致詞扣掉做結論大概兩個小時每個委員大概大概要要談這麼多問題要談人事同意權要談緊急命令要談總統彈劾要談質詢規範要談這個這個立法院調查權聽證權要談藐視國會罪要談立法院政府議長選舉\n\n07:04.778 --> 07:25.398\n所以我是我是是覺得說這樣子的整個立法過程實在是有過於衝觸了齁即便即便這個這個我們召委認為說這個東西討論了20年了所以不用再開公聽會但是我想公聽會有公公聽會的價值我們法案立法院法案都有屆期不連續上屆開的公聽會在這一屆\n\n07:27.708 --> 07:40.917\n這一屆有沒有效率這個這又是另外一個問題這一屆我們本身我們要立法者上一屆你說你說2016年開過幾次公聽會2016年我不是立法委員我那時候只是新北市議員而已那我現在我在公聽會裡面我要表達意見我沒有給我這個公聽會\n\n07:44.501 --> 08:02.007\n這個是基本這個屆期不連續的一個基本概念所以我是再一次的希望說我們在進入法條審查之前我們能夠針對剛剛所講的這些議題盈盈大哲很多這個我光就來提這個我們大家所討論的\n\n08:05.540 --> 08:10.501\n講兩個第一個有關這個藐視國會罪齁用刑法來規範這個質詢齁說反質詢必須要是藐視國會必須要以藐視國會罪論處這個反質詢這種字眼齁有這個秘書長你你你你號稱活字典反質詢他有法律的定義是什麼\n\n08:30.014 --> 08:36.354\n因為這個反諮詢就比較含困啦。所以...所以...有沒有哪一個法律定義說什麼叫反諮詢?\n\n08:37.321 --> 08:39.582\n五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五\n\n09:08.337 --> 09:21.822\n委員剛剛你所問的問題我沒有聽清楚請問你可以再說一遍嗎這算不算反質詢來我們因為法律沒有規範嘛所以我實在搞不清楚什麼叫做反質詢來侯志廉我們說明我剛剛這樣算不算反質詢\n\n09:23.030 --> 09:37.531\n所以在我的報告裡面針對這一個地方在我報告在3月第3月第4月有稍微做個說明這一個執行制度每個國家有他不同的這一種規範\n\n09:39.593 --> 10:00.138\n對有各種不同的規範那你現在說要把反質詢納入納入這個用可以刑責那你就要你就法律裡面就要對反質詢你要有明確的定義啊這個不是所有念法律系的人第一課法不要說法律系啦法學序論裡面就有了這個這個這個完全你這個刑責沒有法律的明確性\n\n10:01.889 --> 10:23.008\n到底什麼叫反質詢,你沒有去定義,然後要刻以刑責。我覺得這個是荒天下的大謬。這部分我覺得還是要拜託本委員會委員在審查的時候,能夠真的三思的。這種事不是寒爽的。這種刻以刑責的。這個不只是這些啦,裡面還有很多\n\n10:24.104 --> 10:52.621\n很多我覺得我我覺得如果我們能夠針對這些議題好好召開幾個公聽會我在還有很多的問題包括我們聽證會我們現在把這個這個調閱人包括到所有公司法人公法人司法人人民團體都必須要來而且來了還可以送行者我們人事同意權說人家還沒有同意他當當當什麼委員他還只是一個一個一個國民來了說你若說謊我要把你送\n\n10:54.275 --> 10:54.315\n五（委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":14.029,"end":41.19,"text":"主席各位同仁我想今天我們最後現在進入這個詢答的部分針對這個立法院職權行使法相關的修正草案進入討論我想在這個討論之前包括我們剛剛程序發言的大議大概在一個立法委員行使法的這個草案裡面事實上牽涉非常多的議題"},{"start":42.824,"end":63.933,"text":"議員楊瓊瓊"},{"start":70.225,"end":83.701,"text":"四位好周秘書長好我看你的書面報告你有做一些整理就現有的今天所審查的20個法案所提出來的這個內容你把它做分門別類有這個"},{"start":87.305,"end":95.276,"text":"關於總統國情報告的有人事同意權的有緊急命令的追認這些都是不同的議題有總統彈劾的問題有這個諮詢的規範這是剛剛其他委員他們所關注的諮詢規範"},{"start":106.35,"end":109.794,"text":"還有這個立法院的調查權、聽證權還有這個有關質詢的規範是不是要由刑法來規範這個也是一個議題那這個另外比較小的政府議長"},{"start":125.239,"end":139.16,"text":"這個秘書長你所整理的這些部分是針對目前的這個20個案子來做整理的齁那這個我不知道秘書長因為這個我們這個案子還沒有進來齁民進黨有提一個草案這部分秘書長不知道有沒有有沒有看過民進黨的法案"},{"start":139.42,"end":160.97,"text":"我只看到大概印了一個新聞稿我看過啦。因為有部分的對於強化我們的幕僚啊。也有一些規範啦。但是條文裡面８立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．你還沒有看到．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．我覺得這個我們．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．當我們送進．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．沒有程序會可能還沒排吧．立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案．等程序會排了之後．立法院職權行使法"},{"start":164.091,"end":185.463,"text":"那這個民進黨也有一份我們的草案有關立法院職權行使法的草案那我就看了目前我們今天議程所列的這20個草案跟我民進黨所提的草案其實民進黨所提的草案還有一些議題是目前沒有涵蓋在這20個"},{"start":188.865,"end":208.712,"text":"議員楊瓊瓊"},{"start":208.932,"end":237.74,"text":"有關於這個強化秘密會議的保密的相關的規定這個有另外有關資深幕僚跟專業能量的部分的一些規定也有這個有關這個反對性別這個有關性別平等的反對歧視的一些相關的規定這個都在民進黨的草案裡面他也是立法院職權行使法的一部分那所以我這樣大概整理的看的就是說現在這個這個各黨的草案大概其實我簡單大略講一下就是就是"},{"start":239.226,"end":258.656,"text":"民眾黨的草案大概最重要的精神都是在國會自律就是我們在有關這個立法委員立法院職權行使法的部分都是國會自律的部分佔比較多那國民黨的草案呢大概就是立法院權力的擴張我這樣歸類對不對我們剛剛所講的這些議題"},{"start":262.101,"end":279.867,"text":"目前我們的這些20個草案大部分都是權力的擴張增加對不對因為這樣說明因為325號因為當時職權行使法在處理的時候我長官叫我負責這個地方的時候是以325號解釋為基礎"},{"start":283.589,"end":298.261,"text":"五、八、五號解釋以後立法院的這個調查權它是已經稍微擴大。對,這要擴大以後,現行的法規裡面並沒有配合。但是他也做了一些限制嘛對不對。五、八、五號他不是只有說擴大。"},{"start":299.002,"end":302.445,"text":"五八五號的解釋裡面對於調查權的範圍他也做了一些一些限縮跟規範對不對對五八五號是這樣對我的理解沒有錯了齁那所以"},{"start":320.1,"end":337.11,"text":"我在這邊也是跟本委員會的各位同仁也是希望說這個事實上立法院職權行使法它絕對不只是現在這些議題民進黨所提出的草案裡面有關國會自律的部分我認為應該一併"},{"start":339.127,"end":339.367,"text":"委員楊瓊瓔等52人擬具"},{"start":351.685,"end":369.333,"text":"的條文我目前看到的都是在現有的這個立法院職權行使法之外再去新的職權都是立法院擴張這部分我是希望說本委員在審查的時候能夠一併把民進黨有關國會自律的部分一併納入審查那這個"},{"start":372.15,"end":393.128,"text":"就目前齁其實剛剛所講的我們列出來我們剛剛所討論的光這個爭議點這麼多還好還好我們兩個禮拜前我們這個今天的會議主席齁我們的召委有安排了針對這個總統國情報告的專案報告所以那個議題我們可以深入討論事實上上次我們用一天的時間討論這個總統來立法院國情報告的議題嘛對不對"},{"start":397.432,"end":411.743,"text":"但是其他的議題我們現在呼嚕呼呼轟隆的把它弄成一包那在在在在今天巡達完禮拜三再開一場公聽會三個小時扣掉主席致詞扣掉做結論大概兩個小時每個委員大概大概要要談這麼多問題要談人事同意權要談緊急命令要談總統彈劾要談質詢規範要談這個這個立法院調查權聽證權要談藐視國會罪要談立法院政府議長選舉"},{"start":424.778,"end":445.398,"text":"所以我是我是是覺得說這樣子的整個立法過程實在是有過於衝觸了齁即便即便這個這個我們召委認為說這個東西討論了20年了所以不用再開公聽會但是我想公聽會有公公聽會的價值我們法案立法院法案都有屆期不連續上屆開的公聽會在這一屆"},{"start":447.708,"end":460.917,"text":"這一屆有沒有效率這個這又是另外一個問題這一屆我們本身我們要立法者上一屆你說你說2016年開過幾次公聽會2016年我不是立法委員我那時候只是新北市議員而已那我現在我在公聽會裡面我要表達意見我沒有給我這個公聽會"},{"start":464.501,"end":482.007,"text":"這個是基本這個屆期不連續的一個基本概念所以我是再一次的希望說我們在進入法條審查之前我們能夠針對剛剛所講的這些議題盈盈大哲很多這個我光就來提這個我們大家所討論的"},{"start":485.54,"end":490.501,"text":"講兩個第一個有關這個藐視國會罪齁用刑法來規範這個質詢齁說反質詢必須要是藐視國會必須要以藐視國會罪論處這個反質詢這種字眼齁有這個秘書長你你你你號稱活字典反質詢他有法律的定義是什麼"},{"start":510.014,"end":516.354,"text":"因為這個反諮詢就比較含困啦。所以...所以... 有沒有哪一個法律定義說什麼叫反諮詢?"},{"start":517.321,"end":519.582,"text":"五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五﹗五"},{"start":548.337,"end":561.822,"text":"委員剛剛你所問的問題我沒有聽清楚請問你可以再說一遍嗎這算不算反質詢來我們因為法律沒有規範嘛所以我實在搞不清楚什麼叫做反質詢來侯志廉我們說明我剛剛這樣算不算反質詢"},{"start":563.03,"end":577.531,"text":"所以在我的報告裡面針對這一個地方在我報告在3月第3月第4月有稍微做個說明這一個執行制度每個國家有他不同的這一種規範"},{"start":579.593,"end":600.138,"text":"對有各種不同的規範那你現在說要把反質詢納入納入這個用可以刑責那你就要你就法律裡面就要對反質詢你要有明確的定義啊這個不是所有念法律系的人第一課法不要說法律系啦法學序論裡面就有了這個這個這個完全你這個刑責沒有法律的明確性"},{"start":601.889,"end":623.008,"text":"到底什麼叫反質詢,你沒有去定義,然後要刻以刑責。我覺得這個是荒天下的大謬。這部分我覺得還是要拜託本委員會委員在審查的時候,能夠真的三思的。這種事不是寒爽的。這種刻以刑責的。這個不只是這些啦,裡面還有很多"},{"start":624.104,"end":652.621,"text":"很多我覺得我我覺得如果我們能夠針對這些議題好好召開幾個公聽會我在還有很多的問題包括我們聽證會我們現在把這個這個調閱人包括到所有公司法人公法人司法人人民團體都必須要來而且來了還可以送行者我們人事同意權說人家還沒有同意他當當當什麼委員他還只是一個一個一個國民來了說你若說謊我要把你送"},{"start":654.275,"end":654.315,"text":"五（委員"}]}}}}