{"id":150782,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150782","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/01d093d00f1a07c07e3f92bbf8f760d782ad73e3a9acf4eaf8ba9b0039caa7a64c71a6ad5e9dab055ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"洪孟楷","委員發言時間":"12:04:45 - 12:13:30","影片長度":"00:08:45","會議時間":"2024-04-01T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期交通委員會第6次全體委員會議（事由：邀請交通部部長王國材就「極端氣候災防預警暨汛期防汛準備辦理情形」進行專題報告，並備質詢。）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期交通委員會第6次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":6,"committees":[23],"id":"委員會-11-1-23-6"},"date":"2024-04-01","duration":525,"end_time":"2024-04-01T12:13:30+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-01T12:04:45+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":842,"blocks":[["洪委員孟楷：（12時4分）謝謝主席，麻煩請王國材部長。"],["主席：有請王部長。"],["王部長國材：洪委員好。"],["洪委員孟楷：部長我想先確認一下，本席這邊有聽到現在無人機的採購好像是大家動輒得咎，就是逢中必反到一個無限上綱，所以只要有Made in China的都不行，甚至是很多部會可能要採購無人機的時候會面臨無廠商投標，或者是可能廠商用一樣的型號但是可能掛其他國家，反而價格翻兩、三倍，有沒有這樣的情況？"],["王部長國材：的確我們現在的採購是禁止採購有大陸製的……"],["洪委員孟楷：是大陸品牌就不行，還是裡面零件有大陸的就不行？"],["王部長國材：現在包括關鍵零組件也不行。"],["洪委員孟楷：關鍵零組件也不行？"],["王部長國材：是。"],["洪委員孟楷：最近這樣子一整年下來有沒有……因為不管是交通部邊坡巡視、橋梁巡視，其實很多地方都需要無人機，甚至氣象局觀測這些相關的也都需要無人機啊。"],["何局長淑萍：報告委員，有關無人機採購部分在政府採購規範的範本裡面是有訂定有關政府採購部分有大陸製的不行。"],["洪委員孟楷：大陸製不行嘛，那零件咧？"],["何局長淑萍：零件部分其實有設定機關可以擇定，就是可以定或不定，依據它採購的性質。"],["洪委員孟楷：你們身為中央主管機關，因為無人機照理講還是交通部民航局這邊來做管理吧？"],["何局長淑萍：是，我們有無人機管理系統。"],["洪委員孟楷：因為本席聽到、接獲很多，甚至有部會在講，因為這樣子逢中必反，很多其實是同一個型號，它可能變成到第三國去做一個過水，一樣型號反而要賣貴兩三、倍啊！變成廠商就用比較貴的價格來賣我們，全世界的市場只有我們臺灣要買，因為我們臺灣是不能用Made in China的，但其實是一樣的型號，有沒有發生這樣的情況？有沒有去了解？"],["何局長淑萍：這個部分我們可能要再了解，主要因為是認大陸廠牌，那是政府採購，如果是民間企業要用的部分是沒有在……"],["洪委員孟楷：我們現在不是講民間企業，我們現在講的是公部門的採購。"],["何局長淑萍：是，公部門。"],["洪委員孟楷：所以現在是不是有很多公部門要採購無人機都沒有辦法，無機可採、沒有廠商投標？"],["何局長淑萍：其實事實上交通部也有採購無人機，不過它就不是大陸製的，有一部分……"],["洪委員孟楷：有沒有採購比較貴？"],["王部長國材：現在包括採購還有展演我們都要求很嚴格，就是不能有大陸製，事實上剛才那個關鍵零組件也不行，我想這部分等於是國家的一個政策，我們就以這樣的……"],["洪委員孟楷：不是啊，陳建仁院長也講啊，有看到陳建仁院長去視察時，看到無人機上面有Made in China，院長不是也講不用太吹毛求疵，院長講的話好像跟部長講的話不一樣。部長，本席這邊在要求民航局給本席一個相關資料，好不好？到底你們現在的規範、還有採購無人機部分，你剛有講到有採購無人機，你的採購價格部分也請給本席一個資料，可以嗎？"],["王部長國材：好，可以。"],["洪委員孟楷：好。部長，再來跟你請教，今天上午你也有講到1,200萬的觀光人次往下修了，變成1,000萬，你坦言是陸客團客不來，對不對？"],["王部長國材：對。"],["洪委員孟楷：1,200萬下修成1,000萬是什麼概念？兩成哪、兩成！本來一年365天有365天可以做生意，現在可能只剩300天了，因為有60天沒有辦法做生意，就沒生意啊，那我們的飯店、旅遊、住宿、觀光、餐飲、運輸業者就叫苦連天了！請教部長，自由行跟團客對我們國內市場來講最大的差異跟最大關鍵性在哪裡？"],["王部長國材：團客部分一般會跟旅宿、遊覽車等等，所以我覺得影響的層面比較大；自由行他就自己訂，所以對旅行社而言，團客的影響比較大。"],["洪委員孟楷：部長，移動的範圍嘛！"],["王部長國材：移動範圍，對。"],["洪委員孟楷：其實部長講到重點，團客跟自由行影響最廣就是中南部的旅遊市場啦，講白一點，自由行相對來講他是在雙北地區或是大都會地區，大眾運輸工具比較方便的地方自由行的旅客會比較多，但是團客因為他可能有住宿、有運輸、有遊覽車業者，他可以規劃全臺的旅行，所以對整個中南部市場而言，團客沒來影響是比較廣的，是吧？"],["周署長永暉：跟委員報告，這就是我們希望從遊客的部分，希望他能夠往中南部走，所以我們有些策略，譬如包括高鐵買一送一這種策略都是。"],["洪委員孟楷：署長，現在重點是源頭沒來，你再怎麼樣策略、怎麼變都沒有辦法。"],["周署長永暉：是，我們去年……"],["洪委員孟楷：所以這次部長就已經講了，1,200萬要下修為1,000萬，我們要講的是這1,000萬能不能達到，連業者、觀光業者也都覺得非常辛苦，我們有沒有更積極的措施？部長，上禮拜本席在這邊也跟您請教過，你也講2023年來臺第一名的國外旅客是港澳地區，本席也講了，你也不要說這個好像讓大家覺得香港地區的朋友你不歡迎他，但除此之外到底我們還有沒有什麼方式可以幫助觀光業者？還是我們就雙手一攤？"],["王部長國材：事實上應該不會，我們第一季大概200萬，現在數量一直在增加，這個意思是如果用200萬來講就是800萬，然後開始增加，我想這個部分我們還是有信心，現在……"],["洪委員孟楷：有什麼信心？"],["王部長國材：我跟委員報告……"],["洪委員孟楷：你現在自己都講第一季只有200萬，這樣子四季也只有800萬，連1,000萬都達不到！"],["王部長國材：可是我們一直在增加……"],["洪委員孟楷：你今年1月1日時信誓旦旦講1,200萬，1,200萬數字是誰喊的？也是你觀光署、也是你交通部，不是嗎？"],["王部長國材：但是的確今年年初發生太多狀況，讓我們對於中國大陸本來的預期發生改變。"],["洪委員孟楷：所以現在是不是政治意識形態還是會影響到國內的旅遊市場？"],["王部長國材：給委員說明一下，現在等於他們200萬沒過來，那我們現在團客也不讓他們去……"],["洪委員孟楷：你原本預期陸客來臺有多少人？"],["王部長國材：就是200萬到250萬。"],["洪委員孟楷：疫情期間陸客來臺多少人？"],["王部長國材：大概270萬。"],["洪委員孟楷：陸客在疫情期間、疫情之前。"],["王部長國材：之前270萬。"],["周署長永暉：271萬。"],["洪委員孟楷：最高有到多少人？"],["王部長國材：400萬。"],["洪委員孟楷：是啊！"],["王部長國材：很久，400萬。"],["洪委員孟楷：不是很久啊，也就這幾年的事情。"],["周署長永暉：沒有，是很久，大概8年前。"],["洪委員孟楷：但是就在民進黨政府上任之後逐步下降，所以部長……"],["王部長國材：可是我們釋出很多善意……"],["洪委員孟楷：部長、署長，本席在這邊要的是幫我們的觀光業者發聲，如果你自己也改口了，也不過才幾個月時間、3個月不到，我剛剛還去翻，你在1月1號媒體採訪的時候說1,200萬、我們要捍衛有尊嚴的市場；不到3個月改口變成1,000萬，這些業者要怎麼準備？我都不想講所有業者叫苦連天，他們自己在想都覺得將帥無能、累死三軍，很多觀光業者甚至也覺得可能不是交通部、可能不是觀光署的問題，但重點是你如果是政治意識形態綁住的話，大家就永遠都沒有活路。你身為主管機關，能不能真真正正的想出一些辦法以及用專業來講話，不要每一次都是政治意識形態綁架，可以嗎？"],["王部長國材：我跟委員報告，我們現在釋出善意了，現在球在對方，只要對方有善意，整個就會全部解決。"],["主席：這個部長會後再跟委員這邊做個答復好不好？時間到了。"],["洪委員孟楷：加油啦，真的，本席還是希望，520即將到來，大家沸沸揚揚講你是待觀察名單，當然我一直說如果可以用專業來講話的話，至少我們溝通起來會比較順暢。"],["王部長國材：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝洪委員的發言。","下一位請陳俊宇委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":122,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-23-6","speakers":["李昆澤","徐富癸","林國成","林沛祥","蔡其昌","魯明哲","邱若華","何欣純","陳素月","許智傑","林俊憲","陳雪生","游顥","廖先翔","林德福","洪孟楷","陳俊宇","蔡易餘","邱志偉","黃健豪","顏寬恒"],"page_start":63,"meetingDate":["2024-04-01"],"gazette_id":"1132301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1132301_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期交通委員會第6次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請交通部部長王國材就「極端氣候災防預警暨汛期防汛準備辦理情形」進行專題報告，並備質\n詢","agenda_id":"1132301_00002"}},"transcript":{"id":"150782","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150782","tool":"pyannote","id":"150782-pyannote"},"job_id":"lSOTfGfBgQdoVWg4","queued_at":"2024-06-01 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\"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:01,596 --> 00:00:03,061\n主席謝謝麻煩請王國材部長有請部長\n\n2\n00:00:09,024 --> 00:00:36,100\n部長我想先確認一下本席這邊有聽到是說現在這個無人機的一個採購好像是說大家動輒得咎就是這個逢中必反到一個無限上綱所以只要MadeinChina這個都不行那甚至講是說很多部會他可能要採購無人機的時候會面臨說無廠商投標或者是說可能廠商用別一樣的型號但是他可能掛其他的國家反而\n\n3\n00:00:36,520 --> 00:00:38,422\n大陸品牌就不行還是裡面有零件有大陸就不行\n\n4\n00:00:52,379 --> 00:01:08,235\n現在包括關鍵零組件也不行關鍵零組件也不行那有沒有最近這樣子一整年下來因為不管是交通部我們邊坡巡視橋樑的巡視其實很多地方都需要無人機甚至氣象局觀測這些相關也都需要無人機啊\n\n5\n00:01:09,333 --> 00:01:24,782\n報告委員有關那個無人機的政府採購的部分在那個政府採購規範的一個那個範本裡面他是有去訂定說有關政府採購的部分大陸製的是不行大陸製不行嗎那零件勒\n\n6\n00:01:25,262 --> 00:01:40,991\n那零件的部分其實他是有設定說那個機關可以責定就是說可以定或不定依據他採購的性質那我們身為中央主管機關因為無人機照理講還是我們交通部這民航局這邊來做一個管理吧\n\n7\n00:01:41,631 --> 00:02:08,306\n是就是我們無人機有管理系統因為本席聽到接獲到很多甚至有部會都在講是說因為這樣子逢中必反很多其同一個型號他可能變成是到第三國去做一個過水反而一樣的型號賣貴兩三倍就變成是廠商就用比較貴的一個價格來賣我們那全世界的市場只有我們台灣要買因為我們台灣是不能MadeinChina但一樣的型號\n\n8\n00:02:09,306 --> 00:02:24,075\n有沒有發生這樣的情況有沒有去了解這個部分我們可能要再了解那主要因為是任大陸廠牌那是政府採購那如果是民間企業他要用的部分這個部分是沒有在我們現在不是講民間企業我們現在講的是公部門公部門的採購\n\n9\n00:02:25,916 --> 00:02:39,344\n所以說現在是不是有很多公部門要採購無人機都沒有無機可採沒有廠商投標其實事實上在交通部的部分也有採購也有採購無人機那不過他就不是大陸製的有一部分\n\n10\n00:02:42,249 --> 00:03:08,027\n現在包括採購還有展演我們現在都要求很嚴格那這個就是不能有大陸事實上剛才那個關鍵零組件也不行所以我想說這部分是等於國家的一個政策我們就以這樣陳建仁院長也講說有看到陳建仁院長不是去視察所以有看到那個無人機上面有MadeinChina院長不也講是說不用太吹毛求疵\n\n11\n00:03:09,397 --> 00:03:33,499\n那院長講的話好像就跟我們部長講的話不一樣部長本席這邊在要求我們民航局給本席一個相關資料好不好到底你們現在的一個規範那還有有沒有你們採購無人機你剛剛有講到是說我們這邊有採購無人機嘛你的這個採購價格的部分也請給本席一個資料可以嗎可以部長再來跟你請教今天上午你也有講到\n\n12\n00:03:34,460 --> 00:03:46,236\n一千兩百萬的觀光人次往下修了變成一千萬你坦言是入客團客不來對不對一千兩百萬下修成一千萬是什麼概念兩成啊\n\n13\n00:03:48,126 --> 00:04:10,081\n本來一年365天有365天可以做生意現在可能只剩300天了因為有60天沒有辦法做生意啊都沒生意啊那對於我們飯店旅遊住宿觀光餐飲運輸業者就叫苦連天了而且部長請教您自由行跟團客最大的差別對我們國內市場來講最大的差異跟最大關鍵性在哪裡\n\n14\n00:04:12,094 --> 00:04:15,856\n部長移動的範圍嗎?其實部長講到重點團客跟自由行影響最廣就是中南部的旅遊市場啦講白一點\n\n15\n00:04:37,905 --> 00:04:57,852\n自由行來做相對來講他在雙北地區或是大都會地區大眾運輸工具比較方便的地方自由行的旅客會比較多但是團客因為他可以有住宿有運輸有遊覽車業者所以他可以規劃全台的一個旅行所以對整個中南部市場團客沒來影響是比較廣的\n\n16\n00:04:59,587 --> 00:05:17,437\n這個跟委員報告一下這就是我們希望能夠從遊客的部分能夠往中南部走所以我們有些策略譬如說包括買高鐵買一送一這種策略都是組長現在重點是源頭沒來你再怎麼樣策略怎麼變都沒有辦法\n\n17\n00:05:18,277 --> 00:05:38,406\n所以說這是部長就已經講了他一千兩百萬要銷售一千萬那我們講是說連這一千萬能不能達到業者觀光業者也都覺得說非常辛苦我們有沒有更積極的措施部長上禮拜本席在這邊也跟您請教過您也講是說我們第一名的2023年第一名的國外旅客來的是港澳地區\n\n18\n00:05:40,002 --> 00:05:51,953\n本席也講了你也不要講是說這個好像讓大家覺得是說香港地區的朋友你不歡迎他但除此之外到底我們還有沒有什麼方式可以幫助觀光業者還是我們就雙手一攤\n\n19\n00:05:54,699 --> 00:06:16,897\n我們第一季大概200萬嘛那現在數量一直在增加這意思說這個如果用200萬來講就是800然後開始增加我想說這個部分我們是還是有信心現在有什麼信心我跟委員報告你現在你自己都講就是說第一季只有200萬到四季這樣子也只有800萬連1000萬都達不到你今年1月1號都信誓旦旦講說1200萬1200萬數字誰喊的\n\n20\n00:06:19,599 --> 00:06:20,800\n所以我們現在是不是政治意識形態還是影響到國內的旅遊市場\n\n21\n00:06:37,989 --> 00:07:01,969\n你原本預期入客來台有多少人?就是200到250萬疫情期間入客來台多少人?大概270萬入客疫情期間疫情之前之前270萬最高有到多少人?400萬\n\n22\n00:07:03,370 --> 00:07:05,172\n但是就在於民進黨政府上任之後逐步下降\n\n23\n00:07:15,020 --> 00:07:39,395\n所以部長署長本席還是在這邊我們要的是幫我們的觀光業者來發聲如果說你自己也改口了也不過才幾個月時間欸三個月不到啊1月1號的時候我剛剛還去翻你1月1號的時候媒體受訪的時候1200萬我們要捍衛有尊嚴的市場不到三個月改口變成1000萬\n\n24\n00:07:40,967 --> 00:08:00,158\n那這些業者他準備怎麼準備我都不想講說所有業者叫苦連天他們自己在想是說他們都覺得說降帥無能累死三軍啊很多觀光業者甚至也覺得說可能不是我們交通部可能不是觀光署的問題那但是重點是你如果說你甚至意識形態綁住的話你永遠大家都沒有活路\n\n25\n00:08:01,508 --> 00:08:26,655\n你身為主管機關能不能真真正正的想出一些辦法以及用專業來講話不要每一次都是政治意識形態綁架可以嗎我跟委員報告我們現在釋出善意啊現在求在對方真的求在對方只要對方有善意我們就會整個就會全部解決這個部長再跟委員這邊做個答覆好不好加油啦真的本期還是希望喔\n\n26\n00:08:27,575 --> 00:08:27,835\n陳俊宇委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1596\t3061\t主席謝謝麻煩請王國材部長有請部長\n9024\t36100\t部長我想先確認一下本席這邊有聽到是說現在這個無人機的一個採購好像是說大家動輒得咎就是這個逢中必反到一個無限上綱所以只要Made in China這個都不行那甚至講是說很多部會他可能要採購無人機的時候會面臨說無廠商投標或者是說可能廠商用別一樣的型號但是他可能掛其他的國家反而\n36520\t38422\t大陸品牌就不行還是裡面有零件有大陸就不行\n52379\t68235\t現在包括關鍵零組件也不行關鍵零組件也不行那有沒有最近這樣子一整年下來因為不管是交通部我們邊坡巡視橋樑的巡視其實很多地方都需要無人機甚至氣象局觀測這些相關也都需要無人機啊\n69333\t84782\t報告委員有關那個無人機的政府採購的部分在那個政府採購規範的一個那個範本裡面他是有去訂定說有關政府採購的部分大陸製的是不行大陸製不行嗎那零件勒\n85262\t100991\t那零件的部分其實他是有設定說那個機關可以責定就是說可以定或不定依據他採購的性質那我們身為中央主管機關因為無人機照理講還是我們交通部這民航局這邊來做一個管理吧\n101631\t128306\t是就是我們無人機有管理系統因為本席聽到接獲到很多甚至有部會都在講是說因為這樣子逢中必反很多其同一個型號他可能變成是到第三國去做一個過水反而一樣的型號賣貴兩三倍就變成是廠商就用比較貴的一個價格來賣我們那全世界的市場只有我們台灣要買因為我們台灣是不能Made in China但一樣的型號\n129306\t144075\t有沒有發生這樣的情況有沒有去了解這個部分我們可能要再了解那主要因為是任大陸廠牌那是政府採購那如果是民間企業他要用的部分這個部分是沒有在我們現在不是講民間企業我們現在講的是公部門公部門的採購\n145916\t159344\t所以說現在是不是有很多公部門要採購無人機都沒有無機可採沒有廠商投標其實事實上在交通部的部分也有採購也有採購無人機那不過他就不是大陸製的有一部分\n162249\t188027\t現在包括採購還有展演我們現在都要求很嚴格那這個就是不能有大陸事實上剛才那個關鍵零組件也不行所以我想說這部分是等於國家的一個政策我們就以這樣陳建仁院長也講說有看到陳建仁院長不是去視察所以有看到那個無人機上面有Made in China院長不也講是說不用太吹毛求疵\n189397\t213499\t那院長講的話好像就跟我們部長講的話不一樣部長本席這邊在要求我們民航局給本席一個相關資料好不好到底你們現在的一個規範那還有有沒有你們採購無人機你剛剛有講到是說我們這邊有採購無人機嘛你的這個採購價格的部分也請給本席一個資料可以嗎可以部長再來跟你請教今天上午你也有講到\n214460\t226236\t一千兩百萬的觀光人次往下修了變成一千萬你坦言是入客團客不來對不對一千兩百萬下修成一千萬是什麼概念兩成啊\n228126\t250081\t本來一年365天有365天可以做生意現在可能只剩300天了因為有60天沒有辦法做生意啊都沒生意啊那對於我們飯店旅遊住宿觀光餐飲運輸業者就叫苦連天了而且部長請教您自由行跟團客最大的差別對我們國內市場來講最大的差異跟最大關鍵性在哪裡\n252094\t255856\t部長移動的範圍嗎?其實部長講到重點團客跟自由行影響最廣就是中南部的旅遊市場啦講白一點\n277905\t297852\t自由行來做相對來講他在雙北地區或是大都會地區大眾運輸工具比較方便的地方自由行的旅客會比較多但是團客因為他可以有住宿有運輸有遊覽車業者所以他可以規劃全台的一個旅行所以對整個中南部市場團客沒來影響是比較廣的\n299587\t317437\t這個跟委員報告一下這就是我們希望能夠從遊客的部分能夠往中南部走所以我們有些策略譬如說包括買高鐵買一送一這種策略都是組長現在重點是源頭沒來你再怎麼樣策略怎麼變都沒有辦法\n318277\t338406\t所以說這是部長就已經講了他一千兩百萬要銷售一千萬那我們講是說連這一千萬能不能達到業者觀光業者也都覺得說非常辛苦我們有沒有更積極的措施部長上禮拜本席在這邊也跟您請教過您也講是說我們第一名的2023年第一名的國外旅客來的是港澳地區\n340002\t351953\t本席也講了你也不要講是說這個好像讓大家覺得是說香港地區的朋友你不歡迎他但除此之外到底我們還有沒有什麼方式可以幫助觀光業者還是我們就雙手一攤\n354699\t376897\t我們第一季大概200萬嘛那現在數量一直在增加這意思說這個如果用200萬來講就是800然後開始增加我想說這個部分我們是還是有信心現在有什麼信心我跟委員報告你現在你自己都講就是說第一季只有200萬到四季這樣子也只有800萬連1000萬都達不到你今年1月1號都信誓旦旦講說1200萬1200萬數字誰喊的\n379599\t380800\t所以我們現在是不是政治意識形態還是影響到國內的旅遊市場\n397989\t421969\t你原本預期入客來台有多少人?就是200到250萬疫情期間入客來台多少人?大概270萬入客 疫情期間 疫情之前之前270萬最高有到多少人?400萬\n423370\t425172\t但是就在於民進黨政府上任之後逐步下降\n435020\t459395\t所以部長 署長本席還是在這邊我們要的是幫我們的觀光業者來發聲如果說你自己也改口了也不過才幾個月時間欸三個月不到啊1月1號的時候我剛剛還去翻你1月1號的時候媒體受訪的時候1200萬我們要捍衛有尊嚴的市場不到三個月改口變成1000萬\n460967\t480158\t那這些業者他準備怎麼準備我都不想講說所有業者叫苦連天他們自己在想是說他們都覺得說降帥無能累死三軍啊很多觀光業者甚至也覺得說可能不是我們交通部可能不是觀光署的問題那但是重點是你如果說你甚至意識形態綁住的話你永遠大家都沒有活路\n481508\t506655\t你身為主管機關能不能真真正正的想出一些辦法以及用專業來講話不要每一次都是政治意識形態綁架可以嗎我跟委員報告我們現在釋出善意啊現在求在對方真的求在對方只要對方有善意我們就會整個就會全部解決這個部長再跟委員這邊做個答覆好不好加油啦真的本期還是希望喔\n507575\t507835\t陳俊宇委員\n","txt":"主席謝謝麻煩請王國材部長有請部長\n部長我想先確認一下本席這邊有聽到是說現在這個無人機的一個採購好像是說大家動輒得咎就是這個逢中必反到一個無限上綱所以只要Made in China這個都不行那甚至講是說很多部會他可能要採購無人機的時候會面臨說無廠商投標或者是說可能廠商用別一樣的型號但是他可能掛其他的國家反而\n大陸品牌就不行還是裡面有零件有大陸就不行\n現在包括關鍵零組件也不行關鍵零組件也不行那有沒有最近這樣子一整年下來因為不管是交通部我們邊坡巡視橋樑的巡視其實很多地方都需要無人機甚至氣象局觀測這些相關也都需要無人機啊\n報告委員有關那個無人機的政府採購的部分在那個政府採購規範的一個那個範本裡面他是有去訂定說有關政府採購的部分大陸製的是不行大陸製不行嗎那零件勒\n那零件的部分其實他是有設定說那個機關可以責定就是說可以定或不定依據他採購的性質那我們身為中央主管機關因為無人機照理講還是我們交通部這民航局這邊來做一個管理吧\n是就是我們無人機有管理系統因為本席聽到接獲到很多甚至有部會都在講是說因為這樣子逢中必反很多其同一個型號他可能變成是到第三國去做一個過水反而一樣的型號賣貴兩三倍就變成是廠商就用比較貴的一個價格來賣我們那全世界的市場只有我們台灣要買因為我們台灣是不能Made in China但一樣的型號\n有沒有發生這樣的情況有沒有去了解這個部分我們可能要再了解那主要因為是任大陸廠牌那是政府採購那如果是民間企業他要用的部分這個部分是沒有在我們現在不是講民間企業我們現在講的是公部門公部門的採購\n所以說現在是不是有很多公部門要採購無人機都沒有無機可採沒有廠商投標其實事實上在交通部的部分也有採購也有採購無人機那不過他就不是大陸製的有一部分\n現在包括採購還有展演我們現在都要求很嚴格那這個就是不能有大陸事實上剛才那個關鍵零組件也不行所以我想說這部分是等於國家的一個政策我們就以這樣陳建仁院長也講說有看到陳建仁院長不是去視察所以有看到那個無人機上面有Made in China院長不也講是說不用太吹毛求疵\n那院長講的話好像就跟我們部長講的話不一樣部長本席這邊在要求我們民航局給本席一個相關資料好不好到底你們現在的一個規範那還有有沒有你們採購無人機你剛剛有講到是說我們這邊有採購無人機嘛你的這個採購價格的部分也請給本席一個資料可以嗎可以部長再來跟你請教今天上午你也有講到\n一千兩百萬的觀光人次往下修了變成一千萬你坦言是入客團客不來對不對一千兩百萬下修成一千萬是什麼概念兩成啊\n本來一年365天有365天可以做生意現在可能只剩300天了因為有60天沒有辦法做生意啊都沒生意啊那對於我們飯店旅遊住宿觀光餐飲運輸業者就叫苦連天了而且部長請教您自由行跟團客最大的差別對我們國內市場來講最大的差異跟最大關鍵性在哪裡\n部長移動的範圍嗎?其實部長講到重點團客跟自由行影響最廣就是中南部的旅遊市場啦講白一點\n自由行來做相對來講他在雙北地區或是大都會地區大眾運輸工具比較方便的地方自由行的旅客會比較多但是團客因為他可以有住宿有運輸有遊覽車業者所以他可以規劃全台的一個旅行所以對整個中南部市場團客沒來影響是比較廣的\n這個跟委員報告一下這就是我們希望能夠從遊客的部分能夠往中南部走所以我們有些策略譬如說包括買高鐵買一送一這種策略都是組長現在重點是源頭沒來你再怎麼樣策略怎麼變都沒有辦法\n所以說這是部長就已經講了他一千兩百萬要銷售一千萬那我們講是說連這一千萬能不能達到業者觀光業者也都覺得說非常辛苦我們有沒有更積極的措施部長上禮拜本席在這邊也跟您請教過您也講是說我們第一名的2023年第一名的國外旅客來的是港澳地區\n本席也講了你也不要講是說這個好像讓大家覺得是說香港地區的朋友你不歡迎他但除此之外到底我們還有沒有什麼方式可以幫助觀光業者還是我們就雙手一攤\n我們第一季大概200萬嘛那現在數量一直在增加這意思說這個如果用200萬來講就是800然後開始增加我想說這個部分我們是還是有信心現在有什麼信心我跟委員報告你現在你自己都講就是說第一季只有200萬到四季這樣子也只有800萬連1000萬都達不到你今年1月1號都信誓旦旦講說1200萬1200萬數字誰喊的\n所以我們現在是不是政治意識形態還是影響到國內的旅遊市場\n你原本預期入客來台有多少人?就是200到250萬疫情期間入客來台多少人?大概270萬入客 疫情期間 疫情之前之前270萬最高有到多少人?400萬\n但是就在於民進黨政府上任之後逐步下降\n所以部長 署長本席還是在這邊我們要的是幫我們的觀光業者來發聲如果說你自己也改口了也不過才幾個月時間欸三個月不到啊1月1號的時候我剛剛還去翻你1月1號的時候媒體受訪的時候1200萬我們要捍衛有尊嚴的市場不到三個月改口變成1000萬\n那這些業者他準備怎麼準備我都不想講說所有業者叫苦連天他們自己在想是說他們都覺得說降帥無能累死三軍啊很多觀光業者甚至也覺得說可能不是我們交通部可能不是觀光署的問題那但是重點是你如果說你甚至意識形態綁住的話你永遠大家都沒有活路\n你身為主管機關能不能真真正正的想出一些辦法以及用專業來講話不要每一次都是政治意識形態綁架可以嗎我跟委員報告我們現在釋出善意啊現在求在對方真的求在對方只要對方有善意我們就會整個就會全部解決這個部長再跟委員這邊做個答覆好不好加油啦真的本期還是希望喔\n陳俊宇委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:01.596 --> 00:03.061\n主席謝謝麻煩請王國材部長有請部長\n\n00:09.024 --> 00:36.100\n部長我想先確認一下本席這邊有聽到是說現在這個無人機的一個採購好像是說大家動輒得咎就是這個逢中必反到一個無限上綱所以只要MadeinChina這個都不行那甚至講是說很多部會他可能要採購無人機的時候會面臨說無廠商投標或者是說可能廠商用別一樣的型號但是他可能掛其他的國家反而\n\n00:36.520 --> 00:38.422\n大陸品牌就不行還是裡面有零件有大陸就不行\n\n00:52.379 --> 01:08.235\n現在包括關鍵零組件也不行關鍵零組件也不行那有沒有最近這樣子一整年下來因為不管是交通部我們邊坡巡視橋樑的巡視其實很多地方都需要無人機甚至氣象局觀測這些相關也都需要無人機啊\n\n01:09.333 --> 01:24.782\n報告委員有關那個無人機的政府採購的部分在那個政府採購規範的一個那個範本裡面他是有去訂定說有關政府採購的部分大陸製的是不行大陸製不行嗎那零件勒\n\n01:25.262 --> 01:40.991\n那零件的部分其實他是有設定說那個機關可以責定就是說可以定或不定依據他採購的性質那我們身為中央主管機關因為無人機照理講還是我們交通部這民航局這邊來做一個管理吧\n\n01:41.631 --> 02:08.306\n是就是我們無人機有管理系統因為本席聽到接獲到很多甚至有部會都在講是說因為這樣子逢中必反很多其同一個型號他可能變成是到第三國去做一個過水反而一樣的型號賣貴兩三倍就變成是廠商就用比較貴的一個價格來賣我們那全世界的市場只有我們台灣要買因為我們台灣是不能MadeinChina但一樣的型號\n\n02:09.306 --> 02:24.075\n有沒有發生這樣的情況有沒有去了解這個部分我們可能要再了解那主要因為是任大陸廠牌那是政府採購那如果是民間企業他要用的部分這個部分是沒有在我們現在不是講民間企業我們現在講的是公部門公部門的採購\n\n02:25.916 --> 02:39.344\n所以說現在是不是有很多公部門要採購無人機都沒有無機可採沒有廠商投標其實事實上在交通部的部分也有採購也有採購無人機那不過他就不是大陸製的有一部分\n\n02:42.249 --> 03:08.027\n現在包括採購還有展演我們現在都要求很嚴格那這個就是不能有大陸事實上剛才那個關鍵零組件也不行所以我想說這部分是等於國家的一個政策我們就以這樣陳建仁院長也講說有看到陳建仁院長不是去視察所以有看到那個無人機上面有MadeinChina院長不也講是說不用太吹毛求疵\n\n03:09.397 --> 03:33.499\n那院長講的話好像就跟我們部長講的話不一樣部長本席這邊在要求我們民航局給本席一個相關資料好不好到底你們現在的一個規範那還有有沒有你們採購無人機你剛剛有講到是說我們這邊有採購無人機嘛你的這個採購價格的部分也請給本席一個資料可以嗎可以部長再來跟你請教今天上午你也有講到\n\n03:34.460 --> 03:46.236\n一千兩百萬的觀光人次往下修了變成一千萬你坦言是入客團客不來對不對一千兩百萬下修成一千萬是什麼概念兩成啊\n\n03:48.126 --> 04:10.081\n本來一年365天有365天可以做生意現在可能只剩300天了因為有60天沒有辦法做生意啊都沒生意啊那對於我們飯店旅遊住宿觀光餐飲運輸業者就叫苦連天了而且部長請教您自由行跟團客最大的差別對我們國內市場來講最大的差異跟最大關鍵性在哪裡\n\n04:12.094 --> 04:15.856\n部長移動的範圍嗎?其實部長講到重點團客跟自由行影響最廣就是中南部的旅遊市場啦講白一點\n\n04:37.905 --> 04:57.852\n自由行來做相對來講他在雙北地區或是大都會地區大眾運輸工具比較方便的地方自由行的旅客會比較多但是團客因為他可以有住宿有運輸有遊覽車業者所以他可以規劃全台的一個旅行所以對整個中南部市場團客沒來影響是比較廣的\n\n04:59.587 --> 05:17.437\n這個跟委員報告一下這就是我們希望能夠從遊客的部分能夠往中南部走所以我們有些策略譬如說包括買高鐵買一送一這種策略都是組長現在重點是源頭沒來你再怎麼樣策略怎麼變都沒有辦法\n\n05:18.277 --> 05:38.406\n所以說這是部長就已經講了他一千兩百萬要銷售一千萬那我們講是說連這一千萬能不能達到業者觀光業者也都覺得說非常辛苦我們有沒有更積極的措施部長上禮拜本席在這邊也跟您請教過您也講是說我們第一名的2023年第一名的國外旅客來的是港澳地區\n\n05:40.002 --> 05:51.953\n本席也講了你也不要講是說這個好像讓大家覺得是說香港地區的朋友你不歡迎他但除此之外到底我們還有沒有什麼方式可以幫助觀光業者還是我們就雙手一攤\n\n05:54.699 --> 06:16.897\n我們第一季大概200萬嘛那現在數量一直在增加這意思說這個如果用200萬來講就是800然後開始增加我想說這個部分我們是還是有信心現在有什麼信心我跟委員報告你現在你自己都講就是說第一季只有200萬到四季這樣子也只有800萬連1000萬都達不到你今年1月1號都信誓旦旦講說1200萬1200萬數字誰喊的\n\n06:19.599 --> 06:20.800\n所以我們現在是不是政治意識形態還是影響到國內的旅遊市場\n\n06:37.989 --> 07:01.969\n你原本預期入客來台有多少人?就是200到250萬疫情期間入客來台多少人?大概270萬入客疫情期間疫情之前之前270萬最高有到多少人?400萬\n\n07:03.370 --> 07:05.172\n但是就在於民進黨政府上任之後逐步下降\n\n07:15.020 --> 07:39.395\n所以部長署長本席還是在這邊我們要的是幫我們的觀光業者來發聲如果說你自己也改口了也不過才幾個月時間欸三個月不到啊1月1號的時候我剛剛還去翻你1月1號的時候媒體受訪的時候1200萬我們要捍衛有尊嚴的市場不到三個月改口變成1000萬\n\n07:40.967 --> 08:00.158\n那這些業者他準備怎麼準備我都不想講說所有業者叫苦連天他們自己在想是說他們都覺得說降帥無能累死三軍啊很多觀光業者甚至也覺得說可能不是我們交通部可能不是觀光署的問題那但是重點是你如果說你甚至意識形態綁住的話你永遠大家都沒有活路\n\n08:01.508 --> 08:26.655\n你身為主管機關能不能真真正正的想出一些辦法以及用專業來講話不要每一次都是政治意識形態綁架可以嗎我跟委員報告我們現在釋出善意啊現在求在對方真的求在對方只要對方有善意我們就會整個就會全部解決這個部長再跟委員這邊做個答覆好不好加油啦真的本期還是希望喔\n\n08:27.575 --> 08:27.835\n陳俊宇委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.596,"end":3.061,"text":"主席謝謝麻煩請王國材部長有請部長"},{"start":9.024,"end":36.1,"text":"部長我想先確認一下本席這邊有聽到是說現在這個無人機的一個採購好像是說大家動輒得咎就是這個逢中必反到一個無限上綱所以只要Made in China這個都不行那甚至講是說很多部會他可能要採購無人機的時候會面臨說無廠商投標或者是說可能廠商用別一樣的型號但是他可能掛其他的國家反而"},{"start":36.52,"end":38.422,"text":"大陸品牌就不行還是裡面有零件有大陸就不行"},{"start":52.379,"end":68.235,"text":"現在包括關鍵零組件也不行關鍵零組件也不行那有沒有最近這樣子一整年下來因為不管是交通部我們邊坡巡視橋樑的巡視其實很多地方都需要無人機甚至氣象局觀測這些相關也都需要無人機啊"},{"start":69.333,"end":84.782,"text":"報告委員有關那個無人機的政府採購的部分在那個政府採購規範的一個那個範本裡面他是有去訂定說有關政府採購的部分大陸製的是不行大陸製不行嗎那零件勒"},{"start":85.262,"end":100.991,"text":"那零件的部分其實他是有設定說那個機關可以責定就是說可以定或不定依據他採購的性質那我們身為中央主管機關因為無人機照理講還是我們交通部這民航局這邊來做一個管理吧"},{"start":101.631,"end":128.306,"text":"是就是我們無人機有管理系統因為本席聽到接獲到很多甚至有部會都在講是說因為這樣子逢中必反很多其同一個型號他可能變成是到第三國去做一個過水反而一樣的型號賣貴兩三倍就變成是廠商就用比較貴的一個價格來賣我們那全世界的市場只有我們台灣要買因為我們台灣是不能Made in China但一樣的型號"},{"start":129.306,"end":144.075,"text":"有沒有發生這樣的情況有沒有去了解這個部分我們可能要再了解那主要因為是任大陸廠牌那是政府採購那如果是民間企業他要用的部分這個部分是沒有在我們現在不是講民間企業我們現在講的是公部門公部門的採購"},{"start":145.916,"end":159.344,"text":"所以說現在是不是有很多公部門要採購無人機都沒有無機可採沒有廠商投標其實事實上在交通部的部分也有採購也有採購無人機那不過他就不是大陸製的有一部分"},{"start":162.249,"end":188.027,"text":"現在包括採購還有展演我們現在都要求很嚴格那這個就是不能有大陸事實上剛才那個關鍵零組件也不行所以我想說這部分是等於國家的一個政策我們就以這樣陳建仁院長也講說有看到陳建仁院長不是去視察所以有看到那個無人機上面有Made in China院長不也講是說不用太吹毛求疵"},{"start":189.397,"end":213.499,"text":"那院長講的話好像就跟我們部長講的話不一樣部長本席這邊在要求我們民航局給本席一個相關資料好不好到底你們現在的一個規範那還有有沒有你們採購無人機你剛剛有講到是說我們這邊有採購無人機嘛你的這個採購價格的部分也請給本席一個資料可以嗎可以部長再來跟你請教今天上午你也有講到"},{"start":214.46,"end":226.236,"text":"一千兩百萬的觀光人次往下修了變成一千萬你坦言是入客團客不來對不對一千兩百萬下修成一千萬是什麼概念兩成啊"},{"start":228.126,"end":250.081,"text":"本來一年365天有365天可以做生意現在可能只剩300天了因為有60天沒有辦法做生意啊都沒生意啊那對於我們飯店旅遊住宿觀光餐飲運輸業者就叫苦連天了而且部長請教您自由行跟團客最大的差別對我們國內市場來講最大的差異跟最大關鍵性在哪裡"},{"start":252.094,"end":255.856,"text":"部長移動的範圍嗎?其實部長講到重點團客跟自由行影響最廣就是中南部的旅遊市場啦講白一點"},{"start":277.905,"end":297.852,"text":"自由行來做相對來講他在雙北地區或是大都會地區大眾運輸工具比較方便的地方自由行的旅客會比較多但是團客因為他可以有住宿有運輸有遊覽車業者所以他可以規劃全台的一個旅行所以對整個中南部市場團客沒來影響是比較廣的"},{"start":299.587,"end":317.437,"text":"這個跟委員報告一下這就是我們希望能夠從遊客的部分能夠往中南部走所以我們有些策略譬如說包括買高鐵買一送一這種策略都是組長現在重點是源頭沒來你再怎麼樣策略怎麼變都沒有辦法"},{"start":318.277,"end":338.406,"text":"所以說這是部長就已經講了他一千兩百萬要銷售一千萬那我們講是說連這一千萬能不能達到業者觀光業者也都覺得說非常辛苦我們有沒有更積極的措施部長上禮拜本席在這邊也跟您請教過您也講是說我們第一名的2023年第一名的國外旅客來的是港澳地區"},{"start":340.002,"end":351.953,"text":"本席也講了你也不要講是說這個好像讓大家覺得是說香港地區的朋友你不歡迎他但除此之外到底我們還有沒有什麼方式可以幫助觀光業者還是我們就雙手一攤"},{"start":354.699,"end":376.897,"text":"我們第一季大概200萬嘛那現在數量一直在增加這意思說這個如果用200萬來講就是800然後開始增加我想說這個部分我們是還是有信心現在有什麼信心我跟委員報告你現在你自己都講就是說第一季只有200萬到四季這樣子也只有800萬連1000萬都達不到你今年1月1號都信誓旦旦講說1200萬1200萬數字誰喊的"},{"start":379.599,"end":380.8,"text":"所以我們現在是不是政治意識形態還是影響到國內的旅遊市場"},{"start":397.989,"end":421.969,"text":"你原本預期入客來台有多少人?就是200到250萬疫情期間入客來台多少人?大概270萬入客 疫情期間 疫情之前之前270萬最高有到多少人?400萬"},{"start":423.37,"end":425.172,"text":"但是就在於民進黨政府上任之後逐步下降"},{"start":435.02,"end":459.395,"text":"所以部長 署長本席還是在這邊我們要的是幫我們的觀光業者來發聲如果說你自己也改口了也不過才幾個月時間欸三個月不到啊1月1號的時候我剛剛還去翻你1月1號的時候媒體受訪的時候1200萬我們要捍衛有尊嚴的市場不到三個月改口變成1000萬"},{"start":460.967,"end":480.158,"text":"那這些業者他準備怎麼準備我都不想講說所有業者叫苦連天他們自己在想是說他們都覺得說降帥無能累死三軍啊很多觀光業者甚至也覺得說可能不是我們交通部可能不是觀光署的問題那但是重點是你如果說你甚至意識形態綁住的話你永遠大家都沒有活路"},{"start":481.508,"end":506.655,"text":"你身為主管機關能不能真真正正的想出一些辦法以及用專業來講話不要每一次都是政治意識形態綁架可以嗎我跟委員報告我們現在釋出善意啊現在求在對方真的求在對方只要對方有善意我們就會整個就會全部解決這個部長再跟委員這邊做個答覆好不好加油啦真的本期還是希望喔"},{"start":507.575,"end":507.835,"text":"陳俊宇委員"}]}}}}