{"id":151087,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151087","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/3f8a1755e5400c0e4bd9a218d14770744a895f5f60d28b50f8ba9b0039caa7a61c0234b0a221b0dd5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林楚茵","委員發言時間":"09:29:04 - 09:39:49","影片長度":"00:10:45","會議時間":"2024-04-15T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第12次全體委員會議（事由：邀請外交部部長吳釗燮報告「我國國際合作發展具體成效暨未來目標」，並備質詢。）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第12次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":12,"committees":[35],"id":"委員會-11-1-35-12"},"date":"2024-04-15","duration":645,"end_time":"2024-04-15T09:39:49+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-15T09:29:04+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":100,"blocks":[["林委員楚茵：（9時29分）謝謝主席。主席，有請吳釗燮部長。"],["主席：請吳部長。"],["吳部長釗燮：委員好。"],["林委員楚茵：部長早安。"],["吳部長釗燮：早。"],["林委員楚茵：我們知道剛剛連媒體都非常關注520接下來的人事部分，但是不論如何，我都希望還能夠繼續在外交及國防委員會繼續質詢你，因為部長對於臺灣整體所面臨的全球環境應該如何因應，其實是非常資深，也非常瞭解，但是面對中國對於臺灣的國際打壓，本席這一趟去了越南參加世界臺商會回來之後更有感，當然，在過程當中也許我們沒有第一線接觸，但是部長一定非常地感同身受，我先從未來的準副總統在捷克行遭到中國武官跟蹤這件事情講起。隨著520的接近，我相信一定有許多外交上面的阻礙正在無形的發生，但是並沒有展現出來，就以媒體在4月7號的報導所提到的，中國武官尾隨我們未來的蕭美琴副總統，以這個國際的角度來看，我來唸一個香港資深評論鍾劍華教授的說法，他說以現代的科技，要跟蹤需要用這樣的方式嗎？還是說你一定要讓對方知道我正在跟蹤你？甚至於差點釀成撞車事件讓媒體來披露，所以他們懷疑其實這是一種無形的壓力，要讓這個無形的壓力現形。我想問部長，從事情發生到現在，目前外交部的掌握跟瞭解是如何？就像剛剛沈伯洋委員也特別提到的，就是外交人員在國外所受到的人身安全威脅，但是這個除了外交人員本身應該要有維護安全的能力，或者是常識之外，如果像這種其實挑明了就是一種挑釁，甚至於想要進而製造事端的時候，外交部到底要如何因應？而現在有關準蕭副總統的這個事件，到底是一個什麼狀況？"],["吳部長釗燮：非常謝謝委員。有關在捷克發生的這個事情，我們也不斷地在跟捷克的相關政府部門尋求瞭解、尋求澄清，也有一些說明，這個跟媒體說明的大致上是相符的，我想捷克是對我們非常友好的國家，對於外交人員的這些作法，他們的確是不予認同，但是實際的這個作為必須要由捷克的相關政府部門去處理，我們就不過度涉入，但是一件很重要的事情是，中國外交部門這種戰狼式的作為，不管是對於我們的訪賓，或者是對於我們外交人員在參與活動時的這種跟蹤、騷擾，或是很大規模的抗議，甚至有一次在一些國家就引起肢體衝突等等，這些事情我們都要非常小心地去面對，我想我們的外交人員都有這種警戒、那種很高度的警惕性，碰到該爭取我們相關權益的時候，我們絕對不會退縮。有關其他國家跟蹤、騷擾的這些事情，他們也都會回報總部，由總部這邊來加以思考，看接下來要怎麼樣處理。"],["林委員楚茵：部長，如果是以數字或事件來做統計的話，隨著戰狼外交的興起，在國際當中，我們所遇到的這種接近衝突性的行為，過去可能只是暗示性，或是沒有那麼顯性，但是像蕭副總統，準副總統所遇到的這樣的一個狀況，在比例上是不是增加的？"],["吳部長釗燮：在過去一段時間，我們的確看到中國的外交人員對我們施加的壓力有增加的趨勢，但是在最近這一段時間，我沒有辦法確定說到底有多少時間，但是最近這一段時間，我們感受到的這種直接的壓力，似乎是在減輕當中，但還是必須要有更多的資訊才能夠讓我們有比較好的分析。"],["林委員楚茵：好，因為畢竟我們許多的友邦，其實只是友善之邦，我們並沒有實質上的外交關係，所以我要直接地問，像這樣子的話，當我們一些重要的部長，甚至像這種以準總統的身分到其他友邦去的時候，在安全的維護上或是人力上面是充足的嗎？包括第一線的外交人員，他們在安全上是充足的嗎？"],["吳部長釗燮：目前看起來應該是不會有問題，因為如果是比較高層的話，他們出去應該是會有安全人員，這個是由我們相關的情治單位來提供的，人力應該是相當地充沛，如果說真正層級很高的話，到其他國家去的時候，也必須要跟其他國家的相關單位來密切地配合，我想那種維護人身安全的能量應該是不成問題的。"],["林委員楚茵：好。另外，我們上個禮拜剛從越南回來，參加全球臺商的聚會，那麼其實在當天外交部晚宴的時候，我是第一個到的立法委員，到現場的時候我就發現非常奇怪，就是三個主桌居然都沒有出現桌牌，這個跟過去我們在參加臺商會的活動是不太一樣的，當時他們只是稍微輕輕地點了一下說，因為桌牌出了一些狀況，所以沒有出現桌牌，事後我們才知道是因為國旗的出現，就是桌牌上面出現了我們中華民國的國旗，所以突然間在晚會要開始的前半小時就消失了。部長，在我們回來之後，將近一個禮拜了，您怎麼來看這一次在越南這樣的狀況？甚至媒體也披露了，原本算是我們世界台商會的榮譽總會長江啟臣副院長，他的簽證甚至下不來，這些都是存在的，是中國伸手來打壓嗎？還是我們跟越南的關係不夠密切？"],["吳部長釗燮：這個事情有幾個層面可以來說明，第一個層面是，我們的世界台商總會到越南去召開年會，應該有差不多1,000人左右世界級的臺商要去那邊開會，越南政府原本是非常歡迎的，因為臺商到那邊去，可能會去尋求到那邊投資或者是貿易的機會，這個對越南政府來講也是非常重要的事情。但是，第二點，中國的那個壓力的確是很龐大，雖然越南政府剛開始的時候是歡迎的，但是因為中國的壓力實在是大到越南政府都沒有辦法去承受的時候，有很多的事情就受到限縮，才會有委員剛剛所說的這些狀況。除了中國這種對我們去那邊臺商活動的打壓之外，我們也可以看到，中國的打壓是不分國內政黨的，像江啟臣副院長，他是國民黨籍的，但是他就受到打壓，他甚至連簽證都沒有辦法拿到。我們有去力洽，但還是沒有辦法，越南政府的態度是說，他們受到的這種壓力是很大的。"],["林委員楚茵：可是副院長事實上是民意代表，所以連副院長……"],["吳部長釗燮：他是用另外一個名義，就是世界台商總會榮譽總會長的這個名義。"],["林委員楚茵：也同樣無法？"],["吳部長釗燮：對，也同樣受到影響，所以我們可以看得出來，中國是透過各式各樣不同的名義、方式，對我們臺灣的國際空間進行打壓，對於一般民眾或者是企業界的活動，他們也會打壓，這個是我們要認知的，所以我們臺灣要更加自立自強。"],["林委員楚茵：好，但是對外交部來講，接下來大概就是520，這可能是外交部最重要的一個工作之一，那麼如果就部長您所言的，中國面對臺灣的打壓是方方面面的，而且戰狼外交持續升級，那麼會不會也是因為520接近？現在在各個外交的部分，包括我們的外賓，現在據傳邀訪的至少有800位，但是在這樣的過程當中，以外交部來說，目前進行的工作有沒有感受到中國給予的壓力？"],["吳部長釗燮：目前有關520外賓的部分，我們是比較沒有感受到壓力，尤其是友邦國家參與的狀況非常地踴躍，也因為外賓來的層級很高、團很多，非常地踴躍，所以外交部這邊協助的能量我們是擔心不足，還要從其他的單位，甚至是從海外調回可以支援的人力來協助520相關的安排。目前從海外來的團數，應該是超過40團，可能人數還不到八百，大概四百多、五百左右。不管怎麼樣，我們在這次的520可以感受到來自世界各地的慶賀團要到這邊來慶賀我們臺灣這個非常重要的民主時間點。"],["林委員楚茵：部長，所以最後可以大概確定我們在這一次的520當中，會有多少國家、有多少的外賓？你們目前有數字嗎？"],["吳部長釗燮：我剛剛所說的就是，應該是有四十幾團，目前是有四百多人。"],["林委員楚茵：好，我們其實可以感受到啦！就是我前面所提到的，520將近，不論是從蕭準副總統在捷克所遇到的狀況，或者是我們到越南去，在世界台商總會年會所遇到的狀況，我相信都是希望給520，我們未來的賴清德準總統的一個施壓，但是可以看到外交部在過去這些年來，在部長的帶領之下，確實是讓臺灣被世界看到，讓臺灣成為了世界的臺灣，我相信在520後應該還是可以繼續成為世界的民主好朋友，謝謝。"],["吳部長釗燮：謝謝委員，我們繼續努力。"],["主席：好，謝謝。接下來請羅美玲委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":122,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-35-12","speakers":["馬文君","沈伯洋","林楚茵","羅美玲","王定宇","陳冠廷","洪申翰","林憶君","賴士葆","黃國昌","王鴻薇","牛煦庭","洪孟楷","張啓楷","徐巧芯","陳永康","黃仁"],"page_start":73,"meetingDate":["2024-04-15"],"gazette_id":"1132701","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1132701_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第12次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請外交部部長吳釗燮報告「我國國際合作發展具體成效暨未來目標」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1132701_00002"}},"transcript":{"id":"151087","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151087","tool":"pyannote","id":"151087-pyannote"},"job_id":"FIbLE3FjF3aHhvcS","queued_at":"2024-06-01 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\"start\": 19.495, \"end\": 19.755, \"score\": 0.726}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 19.755, \"end\": 20.135, \"score\": 0.793}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"外\", \"start\": 20.135, \"end\": 20.255, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"交\", \"start\": 20.255, \"end\": 20.576, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"防\", \"start\": 20.576, \"end\": 20.696, \"score\": 0.814}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 20.696, \"end\": 20.816, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"繼\"}, {\"word\": \"續\"}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 20.816, \"end\": 22.538, \"score\": 0.837}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 22.538, \"end\": 23.079, \"score\": 0.742}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"於\", \"start\": 23.079, \"end\": 23.259, \"score\": 0.855}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 23.259, \"end\": 23.479, \"score\": 0.76}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 23.479, \"end\": 23.639, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"整\", \"start\": 23.639, \"end\": 24.06, \"score\": 0.771}, {\"word\": \"體\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 24.06, \"end\": 24.961, \"score\": 0.801}, {\"word\": \"臺\"}, {\"word\": \"灣\"}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 24.961, \"end\": 25.101, \"score\": 0.716}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 25.101, \"end\": 25.502, \"score\": 0.73}, {\"word\": \"臨\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 25.502, \"end\": 25.902, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"全\", \"start\": 25.902, \"end\": 26.182, \"score\": 0.771}, {\"word\": \"球\", \"start\": 26.182, \"end\": 26.543, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 26.543, \"end\": 26.703, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 26.703, \"end\": 27.023, \"score\": 0.804}, {\"word\": \"應\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 27.023, \"end\": 27.123, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 27.123, \"end\": 27.564, \"score\": 0.841}, {\"word\": \"環\"}, {\"word\": \"境\", \"start\": 27.564, \"end\": 27.744, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 27.744, \"end\": 28.024, \"score\": 0.793}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 28.024, \"end\": 28.425, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"非\", \"start\": 28.425, \"end\": 28.505, \"score\": 0.676}, {\"word\": \"常\", \"start\": 28.505, \"end\": 28.805, \"score\": 0.663}, {\"word\": \"資\"}, {\"word\": \"深\", \"start\": 28.805, \"end\": 28.945, \"score\": 0.6}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 28.945, \"end\": 29.046, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"非\", \"start\": 29.046, \"end\": 29.146, \"score\": 0.787}, {\"word\": \"常\", \"start\": 29.146, \"end\": 29.286, \"score\": 0.688}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 29.286, \"end\": 29.386, \"score\": 0.908}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 29.386, \"end\": 29.706, \"score\": 0.809}, {\"word\": \"解\", \"start\": 29.706, \"end\": 29.726, \"score\": 0.799}]}, {\"start\": 30.407, \"end\": 54.204, \"text\": \"那麼但是其實面對中國對於台灣的這個國際的打壓本席這一趟去了越南參加世界台商會回來之後更有感那麼當然在過程當中也許我們沒有第一線接觸但是部長一定非常的感同身受我先從我們的未來的準副總統在捷克行遭到中國武官跟蹤這件事情講起隨著520的加緊\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 30.407, \"end\": 30.647, \"score\": 0.525}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 30.647, \"end\": 30.867, \"score\": 0.737}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 30.867, \"end\": 31.108, \"score\": 0.708}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 31.108, \"end\": 31.488, \"score\": 0.781}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 31.488, \"end\": 32.228, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 32.228, \"end\": 32.909, \"score\": 0.881}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"於\", \"start\": 32.909, \"end\": 33.149, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 33.149, \"end\": 34.01, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"灣\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 34.01, \"end\": 34.67, \"score\": 0.58}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"際\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", 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\"start\": 38.213, \"end\": 38.313, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"商\", \"start\": 38.313, \"end\": 38.573, \"score\": 0.576}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"回\", \"start\": 38.573, \"end\": 38.853, \"score\": 0.696}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 38.853, \"end\": 38.993, \"score\": 0.798}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 38.993, \"end\": 39.453, \"score\": 0.805}, {\"word\": \"更\", \"start\": 39.453, \"end\": 39.694, \"score\": 0.728}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 39.694, \"end\": 39.954, \"score\": 0.863}, {\"word\": \"感\", \"start\": 39.954, \"end\": 40.474, \"score\": 0.859}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 40.474, \"end\": 40.874, \"score\": 0.654}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"當\"}, {\"word\": \"然\", \"start\": 40.874, \"end\": 40.995, \"score\": 0.59}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 40.995, \"end\": 41.335, \"score\": 0.604}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 41.335, \"end\": 41.755, \"score\": 0.786}, {\"word\": \"當\"}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 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{\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 49.641, \"end\": 49.821, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"準\", \"start\": 49.821, \"end\": 50.041, \"score\": 0.712}, {\"word\": \"副\", \"start\": 50.041, \"end\": 50.681, \"score\": 0.734}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 50.681, \"end\": 51.142, \"score\": 0.811}, {\"word\": \"捷\", \"start\": 51.142, \"end\": 51.362, \"score\": 0.679}, {\"word\": \"克\", \"start\": 51.362, \"end\": 51.582, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"行\", \"start\": 51.582, \"end\": 51.822, \"score\": 0.849}, {\"word\": \"遭\", \"start\": 51.822, \"end\": 52.022, \"score\": 0.85}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 52.022, \"end\": 52.222, \"score\": 0.738}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 52.222, \"end\": 52.683, \"score\": 0.791}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"武\", \"start\": 52.683, \"end\": 52.903, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"官\", \"start\": 52.903, \"end\": 53.143, \"score\": 0.705}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 53.143, \"end\": 53.663, \"score\": 0.739}, {\"word\": \"蹤\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"件\", \"start\": 53.663, \"end\": 53.844, \"score\": 0.595}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 53.844, \"end\": 53.984, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 53.984, \"end\": 54.084, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"講\"}, {\"word\": \"起\", \"start\": 54.084, \"end\": 54.104, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"隨\"}, {\"word\": \"著\", \"start\": 54.104, \"end\": 54.124, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"5\"}, {\"word\": \"2\"}, {\"word\": \"0\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 54.124, \"end\": 54.184, \"score\": 0.517}, {\"word\": \"加\", \"start\": 54.184, \"end\": 54.204, \"score\": 0.002}, {\"word\": \"緊\"}]}, {\"start\": 58.426, \"end\": 70.211, \"text\": \"我相信一定有許多外交上面的阻礙正在無形的但是並沒有展現出來就以媒體在4月7號的報導提到的中國五官尾隨我們未來的副總統蕭美琴副總統那麼\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 58.426, \"end\": 58.586, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 58.586, \"end\": 58.867, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"信\", \"start\": 58.867, \"end\": 59.307, 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\"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"4\"}, {\"word\": \"月\", \"start\": 66.209, \"end\": 66.729, \"score\": 0.757}, {\"word\": \"7\"}, {\"word\": \"號\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 66.729, \"end\": 67.57, \"score\": 0.86}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"導\"}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 67.57, \"end\": 67.71, \"score\": 0.827}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 67.71, \"end\": 67.85, \"score\": 0.78}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 67.85, \"end\": 67.99, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 67.99, \"end\": 68.41, \"score\": 0.945}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"五\", \"start\": 68.41, \"end\": 68.59, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"官\", \"start\": 68.59, \"end\": 68.83, \"score\": 0.767}, {\"word\": \"尾\", \"start\": 68.83, \"end\": 69.33, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"隨\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 69.33, \"end\": 69.591, \"score\": 0.63}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"未\", \"start\": 69.591, \"end\": 69.871, \"score\": 0.774}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 69.871, \"end\": 69.971, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"副\", \"start\": 69.971, \"end\": 69.991, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"蕭\"}, {\"word\": \"美\", \"start\": 69.991, \"end\": 70.011, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"琴\", \"start\": 70.011, \"end\": 70.031, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"副\", \"start\": 70.031, \"end\": 70.191, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 70.191, \"end\": 70.211, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}]}, {\"start\": 74.212, \"end\": 92.416, \"text\": \"以這個國際的角度來看我來念一個是香港資深評論這個鍾建華教授的說法他說以現代的科技要跟蹤需要用這樣的方式嗎還是說你一定要讓對方知道我正在跟蹤你甚至於差點釀成撞車事件讓媒體來披露所以他們懷疑其實這是一種無形的壓力讓這無形的壓力現行\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 74.212, \"end\": 75.572, \"score\": 0.805}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"際\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 75.572, \"end\": 75.732, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"角\", \"start\": 75.732, \"end\": 76.012, \"score\": 0.785}, 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\"但是第二點就是說中國的那個壓力的確是很龐大那雖然說越南政府剛開始的時候是歡迎但是因為中國的壓力實在是大到越南政府都沒有辦法去承受的時候所以有很多的事情就受到限縮了那才會有委員剛剛所說的這些狀況那除了\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 428.415, \"end\": 428.615, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 428.615, \"end\": 428.875, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"第\", \"start\": 428.875, \"end\": 428.996, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"二\", \"start\": 428.996, \"end\": 429.356, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"點\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 429.356, \"end\": 429.516, \"score\": 0.884}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 429.516, \"end\": 429.916, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 429.916, \"end\": 430.416, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 430.416, \"end\": 430.676, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 430.676, \"end\": 431.197, \"score\": 0.918}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"壓\"}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 431.197, \"end\": 431.417, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 431.417, 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{\"word\": \"候\", \"start\": 441.923, \"end\": 442.123, \"score\": 0.951}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 442.123, \"end\": 442.303, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 442.303, \"end\": 442.443, \"score\": 0.866}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 442.443, \"end\": 442.583, \"score\": 0.924}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 442.583, \"end\": 442.723, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 442.723, \"end\": 442.863, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 442.863, \"end\": 442.983, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 442.983, \"end\": 443.143, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 443.143, \"end\": 443.323, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 443.323, \"end\": 443.604, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"受\", \"start\": 443.604, \"end\": 443.784, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 443.784, \"end\": 444.104, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"限\", \"start\": 444.104, \"end\": 444.664, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"縮\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 444.664, \"end\": 445.445, \"score\": 0.934}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 445.445, \"end\": 445.805, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"才\", \"start\": 445.805, \"end\": 446.085, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 446.085, \"end\": 446.405, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 446.405, \"end\": 446.505, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 446.505, \"end\": 446.605, \"score\": 0.611}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 446.605, \"end\": 446.625, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 446.625, \"end\": 446.685, \"score\": 0.657}, {\"word\": \"狀\"}, {\"word\": \"況\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 446.685, \"end\": 446.805, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"除\", \"start\": 446.805, \"end\": 446.825, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 446.825, \"end\": 446.845, \"score\": 0.002}]}, {\"start\": 450.047, \"end\": 477.081, \"text\": \"中國的這種對我們去那邊的這個台商的活動的打壓之外那我們也可以看到就是中國的打壓他是不分我們國內的這個政黨那像那個江啟臣副院長他是國民黨籍的但是他就受到打壓他甚至是那個連簽證都沒有辦法拿到那我們有去立洽但是還是沒有辦法那越南政府的態度就是說他們受到這種壓力是很大的\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 450.047, \"end\": 450.547, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 450.547, \"end\": 451.828, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"種\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 451.828, \"end\": 452.148, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 452.148, \"end\": 452.308, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 452.308, \"end\": 452.669, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"邊\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 452.669, \"end\": 453.069, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 453.069, \"end\": 453.269, \"score\": 0.98}, {\"word\": \"商\", \"start\": 453.269, \"end\": 453.869, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 453.869, \"end\": 454.209, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"活\", \"start\": 454.209, \"end\": 454.509, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 454.509, \"end\": 454.63, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"打\", \"start\": 454.63, \"end\": 455.01, \"score\": 0.936}, {\"word\": \"壓\"}, {\"word\": \"之\", \"start\": 455.01, \"end\": 455.17, \"score\": 0.881}, {\"word\": \"外\", \"start\": 455.17, \"end\": 455.83, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 455.83, \"end\": 456.01, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 456.01, \"end\": 456.17, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 456.17, \"end\": 456.31, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 456.31, \"end\": 456.41, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 456.41, \"end\": 456.49, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"看\", \"start\": 456.49, \"end\": 456.631, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 456.631, \"end\": 456.791, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 456.791, \"end\": 456.911, 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{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 461.353, \"end\": 461.513, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"像\", \"start\": 461.513, \"end\": 461.713, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 461.713, \"end\": 462.133, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"江\", \"start\": 462.133, \"end\": 462.534, \"score\": 0.903}, {\"word\": \"啟\"}, {\"word\": \"臣\", \"start\": 462.534, \"end\": 462.814, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"副\", \"start\": 462.814, \"end\": 462.974, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 462.974, \"end\": 463.374, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 463.374, \"end\": 463.534, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 463.534, \"end\": 463.914, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 463.914, \"end\": 464.254, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"黨\"}, {\"word\": \"籍\", \"start\": 464.254, \"end\": 464.455, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 464.455, \"end\": 464.635, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 464.635, \"end\": 464.795, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 464.795, \"end\": 465.075, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 465.075, \"end\": 465.255, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 465.255, \"end\": 465.555, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"受\", \"start\": 465.555, \"end\": 465.695, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 465.695, \"end\": 465.835, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"打\", \"start\": 465.835, \"end\": 466.155, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"壓\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 466.155, \"end\": 466.315, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"甚\", \"start\": 466.315, \"end\": 466.496, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"至\", \"start\": 466.496, \"end\": 466.696, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 466.696, \"end\": 467.376, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 467.376, \"end\": 468.837, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"連\"}, {\"word\": \"簽\"}, {\"word\": \"證\"}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 468.837, \"end\": 469.157, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 469.157, \"end\": 469.257, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 469.257, \"end\": 469.517, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"辦\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 469.517, \"end\": 469.677, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"拿\", \"start\": 469.677, \"end\": 469.897, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 469.897, \"end\": 470.237, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 470.237, \"end\": 470.438, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 470.438, \"end\": 470.658, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 470.658, \"end\": 470.838, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 470.838, \"end\": 471.058, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"立\", \"start\": 471.058, \"end\": 471.478, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"洽\"}, {\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 471.478, \"end\": 471.618, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 471.618, \"end\": 471.958, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 471.958, \"end\": 472.078, \"score\": 0.959}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 472.078, \"end\": 472.178, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 472.178, \"end\": 472.479, \"score\": 0.933}, {\"word\": \"辦\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 472.479, \"end\": 472.919, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 472.919, \"end\": 473.139, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"越\", \"start\": 473.139, \"end\": 473.279, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"南\", \"start\": 473.279, \"end\": 473.439, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 473.439, \"end\": 473.599, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"府\", \"start\": 473.599, \"end\": 473.719, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 473.719, \"end\": 473.979, \"score\": 0.923}, {\"word\": \"態\"}, {\"word\": \"度\", \"start\": 473.979, \"end\": 474.119, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 474.119, \"end\": 474.259, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 474.259, \"end\": 474.64, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 474.64, \"end\": 474.98, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"受\", \"start\": 474.98, \"end\": 475.14, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 475.14, \"end\": 475.96, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"種\"}, {\"word\": \"壓\"}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 475.96, \"end\": 476.2, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 476.2, \"end\": 476.581, \"score\": 0.978}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 476.581, \"end\": 476.841, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 476.841, \"end\": 477.061, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 477.061, \"end\": 477.081, \"score\": 0.068}]}, {\"start\": 477.281, \"end\": 505.185, \"text\": \"可是副院長事實上是民意代表所以連副院長他用另外一個名義就是臺商世界臺商總會的那個榮譽總會長的這個名義也同樣無法同樣受到這個影響所以我們可以看得出來就是說中國是透過各式各樣不同的這個民意方式對我們臺灣的這個國際空間進行打壓對於一般民眾或者是說企業界的這個活動他們也會打壓那這個是我們要認知的所以我們臺灣要更加自立自強\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 477.281, \"end\": 477.381, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 477.381, \"end\": 477.541, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"副\", \"start\": 477.541, \"end\": 477.721, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 477.721, \"end\": 478.142, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 478.142, \"end\": 478.362, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 478.362, \"end\": 478.542, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 478.542, \"end\": 478.662, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 478.662, \"end\": 478.842, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"意\", \"start\": 478.842, \"end\": 479.063, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"代\", \"start\": 479.063, \"end\": 479.323, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"表\", \"start\": 479.323, \"end\": 479.923, \"score\": 0.916}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 479.923, \"end\": 480.063, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 480.063, \"end\": 480.484, \"score\": 0.842}, {\"word\": \"連\"}, {\"word\": 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\"start\": 625.377, \"end\": 625.397, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 627.159, \"end\": 627.259, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 627.259, \"end\": 627.319, \"score\": 0.341}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"繼\"}, {\"word\": \"續\"}, {\"word\": \"努\", \"start\": 627.319, \"end\": 627.439, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 627.439, \"end\": 627.459, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,089 --> 00:00:01,833\n主席有請吳釗燮吳部長請吳部長委員好\n\n2\n00:00:10,404 --> 00:00:29,726\n部長早安我們知道這個520剛剛連媒體都非常關注接下來的人事的部分但是不論如何我都希望這個還能夠繼續在我們的這個外交國防委員會來繼續質詢因為部長對於我們的整體的臺灣所面臨的這全球所因應的這些環境其實是非常資深也非常的了解\n\n3\n00:00:30,407 --> 00:00:54,204\n那麼但是其實面對中國對於台灣的這個國際的打壓本席這一趟去了越南參加世界台商會回來之後更有感那麼當然在過程當中也許我們沒有第一線接觸但是部長一定非常的感同身受我先從我們的未來的準副總統在捷克行遭到中國武官跟蹤這件事情講起隨著520的加緊\n\n4\n00:00:58,426 --> 00:01:10,211\n我相信一定有許多外交上面的阻礙正在無形的但是並沒有展現出來就以媒體在4月7號的報導提到的中國五官尾隨我們未來的副總統蕭美琴副總統那麼\n\n5\n00:01:14,212 --> 00:01:32,416\n以這個國際的角度來看我來念一個是香港資深評論這個鍾建華教授的說法他說以現代的科技要跟蹤需要用這樣的方式嗎還是說你一定要讓對方知道我正在跟蹤你甚至於差點釀成撞車事件讓媒體來披露所以他們懷疑其實這是一種無形的壓力讓這無形的壓力現行\n\n6\n00:01:41,798 --> 00:02:00,589\n那我想問部長從事情發生到現在了那麼目前外交部的掌握跟了解是如何就像剛剛沈博安委員也特別提到的就是外交人員在國外所受到的人身的安全但是這個除了外交人員本身應該要有的安全的能力\n\n7\n00:02:01,109 --> 00:02:01,830\n而現在有關於准肖副總統的這個事件到底是一個什麼狀況?\n\n8\n00:02:17,701 --> 00:02:42,543\n非常謝謝委員有關於在捷克發生的這個事情我們也不斷地在跟捷克的相關政府部門在尋求了解尋求澄清也有一些說明那這個跟媒體說明的大致上是相符的那我想那個捷克是對我們非常友好的國家對於這種相關的外交人員的這些做法的確他們是不予認同\n\n9\n00:02:43,824 --> 00:03:02,991\n但實際的作為必須由捷克相關政府部門去處理,我們就不過度涉入。但是一件事情很重要的,就是中國的外交部門這種戰狼式的作為,不管是對於我們的訪兵,或者是對於我們外交人員在參與活動的時候的這種\n\n10\n00:03:04,872 --> 00:03:05,233\n李卓人議員\n\n11\n00:03:20,856 --> 00:03:37,612\n警戒那種很高度的這種警惕性啦噴到我們該爭取我們的相關的權益的時候我們絕對不會退收那有關於那種其他國家跟蹤騷擾的這些事情那他們也都會報回總部由總部這邊來加以思考看接下來要怎麼樣處理\n\n12\n00:03:39,251 --> 00:04:05,078\n所以部長如果是以數字或事件來做統計的話是不是真的隨著就是說戰狼外交的興起那麼在國際當中我們所遇到的這種接近衝突性的過去可能只是暗示性或是沒有那麼顯性但是像蕭副總統準副總統所遇到的這樣的一個狀況是不是在比例上是增加的\n\n13\n00:04:06,059 --> 00:04:32,248\n在過去一段時間我們的確有看到那個中國的外交人員對我們的這個壓力是有增加的這個趨勢但是在最近這一段時間我沒有辦法確定說到底有多少時間但是最近這一段時間我們感受到的就是這種直接的這種壓力的這個狀況似乎是在減輕當中但是還必須要去有更多的這些資訊才能夠讓我們有比較好的這種分析\n\n14\n00:04:32,808 --> 00:04:59,181\n因為畢竟我們在許多的友邦其實只是友善之邦但是我們並沒有真正的所謂實質上面的外交關係所以我要直接的問那麼這樣子的話當我們的重要的一些部長甚至於像這種以準總統的身份到其他友邦去的時候在安全的維護上或是人力上面是充足的嗎?包括於第一線的外交人員他們的安全上面是充足的嗎?\n\n15\n00:05:00,218 --> 00:05:25,284\n目前看起來應該是不會有問題因為如果說比較高層的話他們出去的話應該是會有這種安全人員那這個是由我們的相關的情勢單位來提供的那應該是人力相當的充沛那如果說真正成績很高的話到其他國家去的時候也必須要跟其他國家的這個相關的單位來密切的這個配合那我想這些\n\n16\n00:05:27,549 --> 00:05:30,839\n維護人身安全的這種能量應該是不成問題\n\n17\n00:05:32,639 --> 00:05:57,950\n好那麼另外當然就是我們上個禮拜剛從這個越南回來參加這個全球台商的聚會喔那麼確實其實在當天外交部的晚宴的時候到現場的時候我是第一個到的立法委員那麼當時我就發現非常奇怪就是居然三個主桌都沒有出現桌牌這個跟過去我們在參加這個台商會的活動是不太一樣的當時他們只是稍微輕輕的點了一下說因為桌牌出了一些狀況\n\n18\n00:05:59,807 --> 00:06:16,397\n所以沒有出現桌牌後來事後我們才知道說因為國因為國旗的出現就是桌牌上面出現了我們中華民國的國旗所以突然間在晚會要開始的前半小時就消失了那麼部長在我們回來之後的一個將近一個禮拜了\n\n19\n00:06:17,538 --> 00:06:28,444\n那麼您怎麼來看這一次同樣的在越南這樣的國家甚至於包括這個媒體也披露了原本是算是我們世界台商會的榮譽總會長的江啟臣副院長他的簽證甚至於下不來這些都是存在的中國伸手來打壓嗎還是我們跟越南的關係不夠密切\n\n20\n00:06:39,858 --> 00:07:07,595\n這個事情有幾個層面可以來做說明那第一個層面就是說我們的世界台商總會到越南去開這種年會那我們應該有差不多1000人左右的世界級的這種台商要去那邊開會那越南政府原本是非常歡迎的因為這個台商到那邊去可能會去尋求到那邊投資或者是做貿易的這些機會這個對越南政府來講也是非常重要的事情\n\n21\n00:07:08,415 --> 00:07:26,845\n但是第二點就是說中國的那個壓力的確是很龐大那雖然說越南政府剛開始的時候是歡迎但是因為中國的壓力實在是大到越南政府都沒有辦法去承受的時候所以有很多的事情就受到限縮了那才會有委員剛剛所說的這些狀況那除了\n\n22\n00:07:30,047 --> 00:07:57,081\n中國的這種對我們去那邊的這個台商的活動的打壓之外那我們也可以看到就是中國的打壓他是不分我們國內的這個政黨那像那個江啟臣副院長他是國民黨籍的但是他就受到打壓他甚至是那個連簽證都沒有辦法拿到那我們有去立洽但是還是沒有辦法那越南政府的態度就是說他們受到這種壓力是很大的\n\n23\n00:07:57,281 --> 00:08:25,185\n可是副院長事實上是民意代表所以連副院長他用另外一個名義就是臺商世界臺商總會的那個榮譽總會長的這個名義也同樣無法同樣受到這個影響所以我們可以看得出來就是說中國是透過各式各樣不同的這個民意方式對我們臺灣的這個國際空間進行打壓對於一般民眾或者是說企業界的這個活動他們也會打壓那這個是我們要認知的所以我們臺灣要更加自立自強\n\n24\n00:08:25,805 --> 00:08:47,557\n好但是呢面對外交部來講現在大概就是接下來520可能是外交部最重要的一個工作之一喔那麼如果就部長您所言的中國面對台灣的這樣的一個打壓是方方面面而且戰狼外交持續升級那麼會不會也是因為520接近現在在各個外交的部分包括我們的外賓現在的其實邀訪據傳\n\n25\n00:08:50,859 --> 00:08:53,542\n目前有關於520的這個外賓的部分我們是比較沒有感受到的壓力尤其是來自於友邦國家友邦國家參與的那個狀況非常的踴躍那也因為外賓來的那個成績很高團很多\n\n26\n00:09:15,903 --> 00:09:31,717\n非常的踴躍所以我們外交部這邊的那個協助的這個能量我們是擔心不足所以還還要從其他的單位甚至是從海外調回那個可以支援的這個人力來協助這種520的相關的這個安排那目前從海外來的這個團數應該是超過40團\n\n27\n00:09:37,382 --> 00:09:40,964\n那所以說部長最後大概可以確定在520之前我們在這一次的520當中會有多少的國家那多少的外賓目前有個數字嗎?\n\n28\n00:10:05,055 --> 00:10:25,397\n我剛剛所說的就是說應該是有40幾團那目前是有400多人好那麼我們其實可以感受到啦就是我前面所要提問的就是520要將近那麼不論是從蕭准副總統在捷克所遇到的狀況或者是我們到越南去世界臺灣遇到的狀況我相信都是希望給520我們未來的\n\n29\n00:10:27,159 --> 00:10:27,459\n謝謝委員我們繼續努力\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n89\t1833\t主席有請吳釗燮吳部長請吳部長委員好\n10404\t29726\t部長早安我們知道這個520剛剛連媒體都非常關注接下來的人事的部分但是不論如何我都希望這個還能夠繼續在我們的這個外交國防委員會來繼續質詢因為部長對於我們的整體的臺灣所面臨的這全球所因應的這些環境其實是非常資深也非常的了解\n30407\t54204\t那麼但是其實面對中國對於台灣的這個國際的打壓本席這一趟去了越南參加世界台商會回來之後更有感那麼當然在過程當中也許我們沒有第一線接觸但是部長一定非常的感同身受我先從我們的未來的準副總統在捷克行遭到中國武官跟蹤這件事情講起隨著520的加緊\n58426\t70211\t我相信一定有許多外交上面的阻礙正在無形的但是並沒有展現出來就以媒體在4月7號的報導提到的中國五官尾隨我們未來的副總統蕭美琴副總統那麼\n74212\t92416\t以這個國際的角度來看我來念一個是香港資深評論這個鍾建華教授的說法他說以現代的科技要跟蹤需要用這樣的方式嗎還是說你一定要讓對方知道我正在跟蹤你甚至於差點釀成撞車事件讓媒體來披露所以他們懷疑其實這是一種無形的壓力讓這無形的壓力現行\n101798\t120589\t那我想問部長從事情發生到現在了那麼目前外交部的掌握跟了解是如何就像剛剛沈博安委員也特別提到的就是外交人員在國外所受到的人身的安全但是這個除了外交人員本身應該要有的安全的能力\n121109\t121830\t而現在有關於准肖副總統的這個事件到底是一個什麼狀況?\n137701\t162543\t非常謝謝委員有關於在捷克發生的這個事情我們也不斷地在跟捷克的相關政府部門在尋求了解尋求澄清也有一些說明那這個跟媒體說明的大致上是相符的那我想那個捷克是對我們非常友好的國家對於這種相關的外交人員的這些做法的確他們是不予認同\n163824\t182991\t但實際的作為必須由捷克相關政府部門去處理,我們就不過度涉入。但是一件事情很重要的,就是中國的外交部門這種戰狼式的作為,不管是對於我們的訪兵,或者是對於我們外交人員在參與活動的時候的這種\n184872\t185233\t李卓人議員\n200856\t217612\t警戒那種很高度的這種警惕性啦噴到我們該爭取我們的相關的權益的時候我們絕對不會退收那有關於那種其他國家跟蹤騷擾的這些事情那他們也都會報回總部由總部這邊來加以思考看接下來要怎麼樣處理\n219251\t245078\t所以部長如果是以數字或事件來做統計的話是不是真的隨著就是說戰狼外交的興起那麼在國際當中我們所遇到的這種接近衝突性的過去可能只是暗示性或是沒有那麼顯性但是像蕭副總統準副總統所遇到的這樣的一個狀況是不是在比例上是增加的\n246059\t272248\t在過去一段時間我們的確有看到那個中國的外交人員對我們的這個壓力是有增加的這個趨勢但是在最近這一段時間我沒有辦法確定說到底有多少時間但是最近這一段時間我們感受到的就是這種直接的這種壓力的這個狀況似乎是在減輕當中但是還必須要去有更多的這些資訊才能夠讓我們有比較好的這種分析\n272808\t299181\t因為畢竟我們在許多的友邦其實只是友善之邦但是我們並沒有真正的所謂實質上面的外交關係所以我要直接的問那麼這樣子的話當我們的重要的一些部長甚至於像這種以準總統的身份到其他友邦去的時候在安全的維護上或是人力上面是充足的嗎?包括於第一線的外交人員他們的安全上面是充足的嗎?\n300218\t325284\t目前看起來應該是不會有問題因為如果說比較高層的話他們出去的話應該是會有這種安全人員那這個是由我們的相關的情勢單位來提供的那應該是人力相當的充沛那如果說真正成績很高的話到其他國家去的時候也必須要跟其他國家的這個相關的單位來密切的這個配合那我想這些\n327549\t330839\t維護人身安全的這種能量應該是不成問題\n332639\t357950\t好 那麼另外當然就是我們上個禮拜剛從這個越南回來參加這個全球台商的聚會喔那麼確實其實在當天外交部的晚宴的時候到現場的時候我是第一個到的立法委員那麼當時我就發現非常奇怪就是居然三個主桌都沒有出現桌牌這個跟過去我們在參加這個台商會的活動是不太一樣的當時他們只是稍微輕輕的點了一下說因為桌牌出了一些狀況\n359807\t376397\t所以沒有出現桌牌後來事後我們才知道說因為國因為國旗的出現就是桌牌上面出現了我們中華民國的國旗所以突然間在晚會要開始的前半小時就消失了那麼部長在我們回來之後的一個將近一個禮拜了\n377538\t388444\t那麼您怎麼來看這一次同樣的在越南這樣的國家甚至於包括這個媒體也披露了原本是算是我們世界台商會的榮譽總會長的江啟臣副院長他的簽證甚至於下不來這些都是存在的中國伸手來打壓嗎還是我們跟越南的關係不夠密切\n399858\t427595\t這個事情有幾個層面可以來做說明那第一個層面就是說我們的世界台商總會到越南去開這種年會那我們應該有差不多1000人左右的世界級的這種台商要去那邊開會那越南政府原本是非常歡迎的因為這個台商到那邊去可能會去尋求到那邊投資或者是做貿易的這些機會這個對越南政府來講也是非常重要的事情\n428415\t446845\t但是第二點就是說中國的那個壓力的確是很龐大那雖然說越南政府剛開始的時候是歡迎但是因為中國的壓力實在是大到越南政府都沒有辦法去承受的時候所以有很多的事情就受到限縮了那才會有委員剛剛所說的這些狀況那除了\n450047\t477081\t中國的這種對我們去那邊的這個台商的活動的打壓之外那我們也可以看到就是中國的打壓他是不分我們國內的這個政黨那像那個江啟臣副院長他是國民黨籍的但是他就受到打壓他甚至是那個連簽證都沒有辦法拿到那我們有去立洽但是還是沒有辦法那越南政府的態度就是說他們受到這種壓力是很大的\n477281\t505185\t可是副院長事實上是民意代表所以連副院長他用另外一個名義就是臺商世界臺商總會的那個榮譽總會長的這個名義也同樣無法同樣受到這個影響所以我們可以看得出來就是說中國是透過各式各樣不同的這個民意方式對我們臺灣的這個國際空間進行打壓對於一般民眾或者是說企業界的這個活動他們也會打壓那這個是我們要認知的所以我們臺灣要更加自立自強\n505805\t527557\t好但是呢面對外交部來講現在大概就是接下來520可能是外交部最重要的一個工作之一喔那麼如果就部長您所言的中國面對台灣的這樣的一個打壓是方方面面而且戰狼外交持續升級那麼會不會也是因為520接近現在在各個外交的部分包括我們的外賓現在的其實邀訪據傳\n530859\t533542\t目前有關於520的這個外賓的部分我們是比較沒有感受到的壓力尤其是來自於友邦國家友邦國家參與的那個狀況非常的踴躍那也因為外賓來的那個成績很高團很多\n555903\t571717\t非常的踴躍所以我們外交部這邊的那個協助的這個能量我們是擔心不足所以還還要從其他的單位甚至是從海外調回那個可以支援的這個人力來協助這種520的相關的這個安排那目前從海外來的這個團數應該是超過40團\n577382\t580964\t那所以說部長最後大概可以確定在520之前我們在這一次的520當中會有多少的國家那多少的外賓目前有個數字嗎?\n605055\t625397\t我剛剛所說的就是說應該是有40幾團那目前是有400多人好 那麼我們其實可以感受到啦就是我前面所要提問的就是520要將近那麼不論是從蕭准副總統在捷克所遇到的狀況或者是我們到越南去世界臺灣遇到的狀況我相信都是希望給520我們未來的\n627159\t627459\t謝謝委員 我們繼續努力\n","txt":"主席有請吳釗燮吳部長請吳部長委員好\n部長早安我們知道這個520剛剛連媒體都非常關注接下來的人事的部分但是不論如何我都希望這個還能夠繼續在我們的這個外交國防委員會來繼續質詢因為部長對於我們的整體的臺灣所面臨的這全球所因應的這些環境其實是非常資深也非常的了解\n那麼但是其實面對中國對於台灣的這個國際的打壓本席這一趟去了越南參加世界台商會回來之後更有感那麼當然在過程當中也許我們沒有第一線接觸但是部長一定非常的感同身受我先從我們的未來的準副總統在捷克行遭到中國武官跟蹤這件事情講起隨著520的加緊\n我相信一定有許多外交上面的阻礙正在無形的但是並沒有展現出來就以媒體在4月7號的報導提到的中國五官尾隨我們未來的副總統蕭美琴副總統那麼\n以這個國際的角度來看我來念一個是香港資深評論這個鍾建華教授的說法他說以現代的科技要跟蹤需要用這樣的方式嗎還是說你一定要讓對方知道我正在跟蹤你甚至於差點釀成撞車事件讓媒體來披露所以他們懷疑其實這是一種無形的壓力讓這無形的壓力現行\n那我想問部長從事情發生到現在了那麼目前外交部的掌握跟了解是如何就像剛剛沈博安委員也特別提到的就是外交人員在國外所受到的人身的安全但是這個除了外交人員本身應該要有的安全的能力\n而現在有關於准肖副總統的這個事件到底是一個什麼狀況?\n非常謝謝委員有關於在捷克發生的這個事情我們也不斷地在跟捷克的相關政府部門在尋求了解尋求澄清也有一些說明那這個跟媒體說明的大致上是相符的那我想那個捷克是對我們非常友好的國家對於這種相關的外交人員的這些做法的確他們是不予認同\n但實際的作為必須由捷克相關政府部門去處理,我們就不過度涉入。但是一件事情很重要的,就是中國的外交部門這種戰狼式的作為,不管是對於我們的訪兵,或者是對於我們外交人員在參與活動的時候的這種\n李卓人議員\n警戒那種很高度的這種警惕性啦噴到我們該爭取我們的相關的權益的時候我們絕對不會退收那有關於那種其他國家跟蹤騷擾的這些事情那他們也都會報回總部由總部這邊來加以思考看接下來要怎麼樣處理\n所以部長如果是以數字或事件來做統計的話是不是真的隨著就是說戰狼外交的興起那麼在國際當中我們所遇到的這種接近衝突性的過去可能只是暗示性或是沒有那麼顯性但是像蕭副總統準副總統所遇到的這樣的一個狀況是不是在比例上是增加的\n在過去一段時間我們的確有看到那個中國的外交人員對我們的這個壓力是有增加的這個趨勢但是在最近這一段時間我沒有辦法確定說到底有多少時間但是最近這一段時間我們感受到的就是這種直接的這種壓力的這個狀況似乎是在減輕當中但是還必須要去有更多的這些資訊才能夠讓我們有比較好的這種分析\n因為畢竟我們在許多的友邦其實只是友善之邦但是我們並沒有真正的所謂實質上面的外交關係所以我要直接的問那麼這樣子的話當我們的重要的一些部長甚至於像這種以準總統的身份到其他友邦去的時候在安全的維護上或是人力上面是充足的嗎?包括於第一線的外交人員他們的安全上面是充足的嗎?\n目前看起來應該是不會有問題因為如果說比較高層的話他們出去的話應該是會有這種安全人員那這個是由我們的相關的情勢單位來提供的那應該是人力相當的充沛那如果說真正成績很高的話到其他國家去的時候也必須要跟其他國家的這個相關的單位來密切的這個配合那我想這些\n維護人身安全的這種能量應該是不成問題\n好 那麼另外當然就是我們上個禮拜剛從這個越南回來參加這個全球台商的聚會喔那麼確實其實在當天外交部的晚宴的時候到現場的時候我是第一個到的立法委員那麼當時我就發現非常奇怪就是居然三個主桌都沒有出現桌牌這個跟過去我們在參加這個台商會的活動是不太一樣的當時他們只是稍微輕輕的點了一下說因為桌牌出了一些狀況\n所以沒有出現桌牌後來事後我們才知道說因為國因為國旗的出現就是桌牌上面出現了我們中華民國的國旗所以突然間在晚會要開始的前半小時就消失了那麼部長在我們回來之後的一個將近一個禮拜了\n那麼您怎麼來看這一次同樣的在越南這樣的國家甚至於包括這個媒體也披露了原本是算是我們世界台商會的榮譽總會長的江啟臣副院長他的簽證甚至於下不來這些都是存在的中國伸手來打壓嗎還是我們跟越南的關係不夠密切\n這個事情有幾個層面可以來做說明那第一個層面就是說我們的世界台商總會到越南去開這種年會那我們應該有差不多1000人左右的世界級的這種台商要去那邊開會那越南政府原本是非常歡迎的因為這個台商到那邊去可能會去尋求到那邊投資或者是做貿易的這些機會這個對越南政府來講也是非常重要的事情\n但是第二點就是說中國的那個壓力的確是很龐大那雖然說越南政府剛開始的時候是歡迎但是因為中國的壓力實在是大到越南政府都沒有辦法去承受的時候所以有很多的事情就受到限縮了那才會有委員剛剛所說的這些狀況那除了\n中國的這種對我們去那邊的這個台商的活動的打壓之外那我們也可以看到就是中國的打壓他是不分我們國內的這個政黨那像那個江啟臣副院長他是國民黨籍的但是他就受到打壓他甚至是那個連簽證都沒有辦法拿到那我們有去立洽但是還是沒有辦法那越南政府的態度就是說他們受到這種壓力是很大的\n可是副院長事實上是民意代表所以連副院長他用另外一個名義就是臺商世界臺商總會的那個榮譽總會長的這個名義也同樣無法同樣受到這個影響所以我們可以看得出來就是說中國是透過各式各樣不同的這個民意方式對我們臺灣的這個國際空間進行打壓對於一般民眾或者是說企業界的這個活動他們也會打壓那這個是我們要認知的所以我們臺灣要更加自立自強\n好但是呢面對外交部來講現在大概就是接下來520可能是外交部最重要的一個工作之一喔那麼如果就部長您所言的中國面對台灣的這樣的一個打壓是方方面面而且戰狼外交持續升級那麼會不會也是因為520接近現在在各個外交的部分包括我們的外賓現在的其實邀訪據傳\n目前有關於520的這個外賓的部分我們是比較沒有感受到的壓力尤其是來自於友邦國家友邦國家參與的那個狀況非常的踴躍那也因為外賓來的那個成績很高團很多\n非常的踴躍所以我們外交部這邊的那個協助的這個能量我們是擔心不足所以還還要從其他的單位甚至是從海外調回那個可以支援的這個人力來協助這種520的相關的這個安排那目前從海外來的這個團數應該是超過40團\n那所以說部長最後大概可以確定在520之前我們在這一次的520當中會有多少的國家那多少的外賓目前有個數字嗎?\n我剛剛所說的就是說應該是有40幾團那目前是有400多人好 那麼我們其實可以感受到啦就是我前面所要提問的就是520要將近那麼不論是從蕭准副總統在捷克所遇到的狀況或者是我們到越南去世界臺灣遇到的狀況我相信都是希望給520我們未來的\n謝謝委員 我們繼續努力\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.089 --> 00:01.833\n主席有請吳釗燮吳部長請吳部長委員好\n\n00:10.404 --> 00:29.726\n部長早安我們知道這個520剛剛連媒體都非常關注接下來的人事的部分但是不論如何我都希望這個還能夠繼續在我們的這個外交國防委員會來繼續質詢因為部長對於我們的整體的臺灣所面臨的這全球所因應的這些環境其實是非常資深也非常的了解\n\n00:30.407 --> 00:54.204\n那麼但是其實面對中國對於台灣的這個國際的打壓本席這一趟去了越南參加世界台商會回來之後更有感那麼當然在過程當中也許我們沒有第一線接觸但是部長一定非常的感同身受我先從我們的未來的準副總統在捷克行遭到中國武官跟蹤這件事情講起隨著520的加緊\n\n00:58.426 --> 01:10.211\n我相信一定有許多外交上面的阻礙正在無形的但是並沒有展現出來就以媒體在4月7號的報導提到的中國五官尾隨我們未來的副總統蕭美琴副總統那麼\n\n01:14.212 --> 01:32.416\n以這個國際的角度來看我來念一個是香港資深評論這個鍾建華教授的說法他說以現代的科技要跟蹤需要用這樣的方式嗎還是說你一定要讓對方知道我正在跟蹤你甚至於差點釀成撞車事件讓媒體來披露所以他們懷疑其實這是一種無形的壓力讓這無形的壓力現行\n\n01:41.798 --> 02:00.589\n那我想問部長從事情發生到現在了那麼目前外交部的掌握跟了解是如何就像剛剛沈博安委員也特別提到的就是外交人員在國外所受到的人身的安全但是這個除了外交人員本身應該要有的安全的能力\n\n02:01.109 --> 02:01.830\n而現在有關於准肖副總統的這個事件到底是一個什麼狀況?\n\n02:17.701 --> 02:42.543\n非常謝謝委員有關於在捷克發生的這個事情我們也不斷地在跟捷克的相關政府部門在尋求了解尋求澄清也有一些說明那這個跟媒體說明的大致上是相符的那我想那個捷克是對我們非常友好的國家對於這種相關的外交人員的這些做法的確他們是不予認同\n\n02:43.824 --> 03:02.991\n但實際的作為必須由捷克相關政府部門去處理,我們就不過度涉入。但是一件事情很重要的,就是中國的外交部門這種戰狼式的作為,不管是對於我們的訪兵,或者是對於我們外交人員在參與活動的時候的這種\n\n03:04.872 --> 03:05.233\n李卓人議員\n\n03:20.856 --> 03:37.612\n警戒那種很高度的這種警惕性啦噴到我們該爭取我們的相關的權益的時候我們絕對不會退收那有關於那種其他國家跟蹤騷擾的這些事情那他們也都會報回總部由總部這邊來加以思考看接下來要怎麼樣處理\n\n03:39.251 --> 04:05.078\n所以部長如果是以數字或事件來做統計的話是不是真的隨著就是說戰狼外交的興起那麼在國際當中我們所遇到的這種接近衝突性的過去可能只是暗示性或是沒有那麼顯性但是像蕭副總統準副總統所遇到的這樣的一個狀況是不是在比例上是增加的\n\n04:06.059 --> 04:32.248\n在過去一段時間我們的確有看到那個中國的外交人員對我們的這個壓力是有增加的這個趨勢但是在最近這一段時間我沒有辦法確定說到底有多少時間但是最近這一段時間我們感受到的就是這種直接的這種壓力的這個狀況似乎是在減輕當中但是還必須要去有更多的這些資訊才能夠讓我們有比較好的這種分析\n\n04:32.808 --> 04:59.181\n因為畢竟我們在許多的友邦其實只是友善之邦但是我們並沒有真正的所謂實質上面的外交關係所以我要直接的問那麼這樣子的話當我們的重要的一些部長甚至於像這種以準總統的身份到其他友邦去的時候在安全的維護上或是人力上面是充足的嗎?包括於第一線的外交人員他們的安全上面是充足的嗎?\n\n05:00.218 --> 05:25.284\n目前看起來應該是不會有問題因為如果說比較高層的話他們出去的話應該是會有這種安全人員那這個是由我們的相關的情勢單位來提供的那應該是人力相當的充沛那如果說真正成績很高的話到其他國家去的時候也必須要跟其他國家的這個相關的單位來密切的這個配合那我想這些\n\n05:27.549 --> 05:30.839\n維護人身安全的這種能量應該是不成問題\n\n05:32.639 --> 05:57.950\n好那麼另外當然就是我們上個禮拜剛從這個越南回來參加這個全球台商的聚會喔那麼確實其實在當天外交部的晚宴的時候到現場的時候我是第一個到的立法委員那麼當時我就發現非常奇怪就是居然三個主桌都沒有出現桌牌這個跟過去我們在參加這個台商會的活動是不太一樣的當時他們只是稍微輕輕的點了一下說因為桌牌出了一些狀況\n\n05:59.807 --> 06:16.397\n所以沒有出現桌牌後來事後我們才知道說因為國因為國旗的出現就是桌牌上面出現了我們中華民國的國旗所以突然間在晚會要開始的前半小時就消失了那麼部長在我們回來之後的一個將近一個禮拜了\n\n06:17.538 --> 06:28.444\n那麼您怎麼來看這一次同樣的在越南這樣的國家甚至於包括這個媒體也披露了原本是算是我們世界台商會的榮譽總會長的江啟臣副院長他的簽證甚至於下不來這些都是存在的中國伸手來打壓嗎還是我們跟越南的關係不夠密切\n\n06:39.858 --> 07:07.595\n這個事情有幾個層面可以來做說明那第一個層面就是說我們的世界台商總會到越南去開這種年會那我們應該有差不多1000人左右的世界級的這種台商要去那邊開會那越南政府原本是非常歡迎的因為這個台商到那邊去可能會去尋求到那邊投資或者是做貿易的這些機會這個對越南政府來講也是非常重要的事情\n\n07:08.415 --> 07:26.845\n但是第二點就是說中國的那個壓力的確是很龐大那雖然說越南政府剛開始的時候是歡迎但是因為中國的壓力實在是大到越南政府都沒有辦法去承受的時候所以有很多的事情就受到限縮了那才會有委員剛剛所說的這些狀況那除了\n\n07:30.047 --> 07:57.081\n中國的這種對我們去那邊的這個台商的活動的打壓之外那我們也可以看到就是中國的打壓他是不分我們國內的這個政黨那像那個江啟臣副院長他是國民黨籍的但是他就受到打壓他甚至是那個連簽證都沒有辦法拿到那我們有去立洽但是還是沒有辦法那越南政府的態度就是說他們受到這種壓力是很大的\n\n07:57.281 --> 08:25.185\n可是副院長事實上是民意代表所以連副院長他用另外一個名義就是臺商世界臺商總會的那個榮譽總會長的這個名義也同樣無法同樣受到這個影響所以我們可以看得出來就是說中國是透過各式各樣不同的這個民意方式對我們臺灣的這個國際空間進行打壓對於一般民眾或者是說企業界的這個活動他們也會打壓那這個是我們要認知的所以我們臺灣要更加自立自強\n\n08:25.805 --> 08:47.557\n好但是呢面對外交部來講現在大概就是接下來520可能是外交部最重要的一個工作之一喔那麼如果就部長您所言的中國面對台灣的這樣的一個打壓是方方面面而且戰狼外交持續升級那麼會不會也是因為520接近現在在各個外交的部分包括我們的外賓現在的其實邀訪據傳\n\n08:50.859 --> 08:53.542\n目前有關於520的這個外賓的部分我們是比較沒有感受到的壓力尤其是來自於友邦國家友邦國家參與的那個狀況非常的踴躍那也因為外賓來的那個成績很高團很多\n\n09:15.903 --> 09:31.717\n非常的踴躍所以我們外交部這邊的那個協助的這個能量我們是擔心不足所以還還要從其他的單位甚至是從海外調回那個可以支援的這個人力來協助這種520的相關的這個安排那目前從海外來的這個團數應該是超過40團\n\n09:37.382 --> 09:40.964\n那所以說部長最後大概可以確定在520之前我們在這一次的520當中會有多少的國家那多少的外賓目前有個數字嗎?\n\n10:05.055 --> 10:25.397\n我剛剛所說的就是說應該是有40幾團那目前是有400多人好那麼我們其實可以感受到啦就是我前面所要提問的就是520要將近那麼不論是從蕭准副總統在捷克所遇到的狀況或者是我們到越南去世界臺灣遇到的狀況我相信都是希望給520我們未來的\n\n10:27.159 --> 10:27.459\n謝謝委員我們繼續努力\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.089,"end":1.833,"text":"主席有請吳釗燮吳部長請吳部長委員好"},{"start":10.404,"end":29.726,"text":"部長早安我們知道這個520剛剛連媒體都非常關注接下來的人事的部分但是不論如何我都希望這個還能夠繼續在我們的這個外交國防委員會來繼續質詢因為部長對於我們的整體的臺灣所面臨的這全球所因應的這些環境其實是非常資深也非常的了解"},{"start":30.407,"end":54.204,"text":"那麼但是其實面對中國對於台灣的這個國際的打壓本席這一趟去了越南參加世界台商會回來之後更有感那麼當然在過程當中也許我們沒有第一線接觸但是部長一定非常的感同身受我先從我們的未來的準副總統在捷克行遭到中國武官跟蹤這件事情講起隨著520的加緊"},{"start":58.426,"end":70.211,"text":"我相信一定有許多外交上面的阻礙正在無形的但是並沒有展現出來就以媒體在4月7號的報導提到的中國五官尾隨我們未來的副總統蕭美琴副總統那麼"},{"start":74.212,"end":92.416,"text":"以這個國際的角度來看我來念一個是香港資深評論這個鍾建華教授的說法他說以現代的科技要跟蹤需要用這樣的方式嗎還是說你一定要讓對方知道我正在跟蹤你甚至於差點釀成撞車事件讓媒體來披露所以他們懷疑其實這是一種無形的壓力讓這無形的壓力現行"},{"start":101.798,"end":120.589,"text":"那我想問部長從事情發生到現在了那麼目前外交部的掌握跟了解是如何就像剛剛沈博安委員也特別提到的就是外交人員在國外所受到的人身的安全但是這個除了外交人員本身應該要有的安全的能力"},{"start":121.109,"end":121.83,"text":"而現在有關於准肖副總統的這個事件到底是一個什麼狀況?"},{"start":137.701,"end":162.543,"text":"非常謝謝委員有關於在捷克發生的這個事情我們也不斷地在跟捷克的相關政府部門在尋求了解尋求澄清也有一些說明那這個跟媒體說明的大致上是相符的那我想那個捷克是對我們非常友好的國家對於這種相關的外交人員的這些做法的確他們是不予認同"},{"start":163.824,"end":182.991,"text":"但實際的作為必須由捷克相關政府部門去處理,我們就不過度涉入。但是一件事情很重要的,就是中國的外交部門這種戰狼式的作為,不管是對於我們的訪兵,或者是對於我們外交人員在參與活動的時候的這種"},{"start":184.872,"end":185.233,"text":"李卓人議員"},{"start":200.856,"end":217.612,"text":"警戒那種很高度的這種警惕性啦噴到我們該爭取我們的相關的權益的時候我們絕對不會退收那有關於那種其他國家跟蹤騷擾的這些事情那他們也都會報回總部由總部這邊來加以思考看接下來要怎麼樣處理"},{"start":219.251,"end":245.078,"text":"所以部長如果是以數字或事件來做統計的話是不是真的隨著就是說戰狼外交的興起那麼在國際當中我們所遇到的這種接近衝突性的過去可能只是暗示性或是沒有那麼顯性但是像蕭副總統準副總統所遇到的這樣的一個狀況是不是在比例上是增加的"},{"start":246.059,"end":272.248,"text":"在過去一段時間我們的確有看到那個中國的外交人員對我們的這個壓力是有增加的這個趨勢但是在最近這一段時間我沒有辦法確定說到底有多少時間但是最近這一段時間我們感受到的就是這種直接的這種壓力的這個狀況似乎是在減輕當中但是還必須要去有更多的這些資訊才能夠讓我們有比較好的這種分析"},{"start":272.808,"end":299.181,"text":"因為畢竟我們在許多的友邦其實只是友善之邦但是我們並沒有真正的所謂實質上面的外交關係所以我要直接的問那麼這樣子的話當我們的重要的一些部長甚至於像這種以準總統的身份到其他友邦去的時候在安全的維護上或是人力上面是充足的嗎?包括於第一線的外交人員他們的安全上面是充足的嗎?"},{"start":300.218,"end":325.284,"text":"目前看起來應該是不會有問題因為如果說比較高層的話他們出去的話應該是會有這種安全人員那這個是由我們的相關的情勢單位來提供的那應該是人力相當的充沛那如果說真正成績很高的話到其他國家去的時候也必須要跟其他國家的這個相關的單位來密切的這個配合那我想這些"},{"start":327.549,"end":330.839,"text":"維護人身安全的這種能量應該是不成問題"},{"start":332.639,"end":357.95,"text":"好 那麼另外當然就是我們上個禮拜剛從這個越南回來參加這個全球台商的聚會喔那麼確實其實在當天外交部的晚宴的時候到現場的時候我是第一個到的立法委員那麼當時我就發現非常奇怪就是居然三個主桌都沒有出現桌牌這個跟過去我們在參加這個台商會的活動是不太一樣的當時他們只是稍微輕輕的點了一下說因為桌牌出了一些狀況"},{"start":359.807,"end":376.397,"text":"所以沒有出現桌牌後來事後我們才知道說因為國因為國旗的出現就是桌牌上面出現了我們中華民國的國旗所以突然間在晚會要開始的前半小時就消失了那麼部長在我們回來之後的一個將近一個禮拜了"},{"start":377.538,"end":388.444,"text":"那麼您怎麼來看這一次同樣的在越南這樣的國家甚至於包括這個媒體也披露了原本是算是我們世界台商會的榮譽總會長的江啟臣副院長他的簽證甚至於下不來這些都是存在的中國伸手來打壓嗎還是我們跟越南的關係不夠密切"},{"start":399.858,"end":427.595,"text":"這個事情有幾個層面可以來做說明那第一個層面就是說我們的世界台商總會到越南去開這種年會那我們應該有差不多1000人左右的世界級的這種台商要去那邊開會那越南政府原本是非常歡迎的因為這個台商到那邊去可能會去尋求到那邊投資或者是做貿易的這些機會這個對越南政府來講也是非常重要的事情"},{"start":428.415,"end":446.845,"text":"但是第二點就是說中國的那個壓力的確是很龐大那雖然說越南政府剛開始的時候是歡迎但是因為中國的壓力實在是大到越南政府都沒有辦法去承受的時候所以有很多的事情就受到限縮了那才會有委員剛剛所說的這些狀況那除了"},{"start":450.047,"end":477.081,"text":"中國的這種對我們去那邊的這個台商的活動的打壓之外那我們也可以看到就是中國的打壓他是不分我們國內的這個政黨那像那個江啟臣副院長他是國民黨籍的但是他就受到打壓他甚至是那個連簽證都沒有辦法拿到那我們有去立洽但是還是沒有辦法那越南政府的態度就是說他們受到這種壓力是很大的"},{"start":477.281,"end":505.185,"text":"可是副院長事實上是民意代表所以連副院長他用另外一個名義就是臺商世界臺商總會的那個榮譽總會長的這個名義也同樣無法同樣受到這個影響所以我們可以看得出來就是說中國是透過各式各樣不同的這個民意方式對我們臺灣的這個國際空間進行打壓對於一般民眾或者是說企業界的這個活動他們也會打壓那這個是我們要認知的所以我們臺灣要更加自立自強"},{"start":505.805,"end":527.557,"text":"好但是呢面對外交部來講現在大概就是接下來520可能是外交部最重要的一個工作之一喔那麼如果就部長您所言的中國面對台灣的這樣的一個打壓是方方面面而且戰狼外交持續升級那麼會不會也是因為520接近現在在各個外交的部分包括我們的外賓現在的其實邀訪據傳"},{"start":530.859,"end":533.542,"text":"目前有關於520的這個外賓的部分我們是比較沒有感受到的壓力尤其是來自於友邦國家友邦國家參與的那個狀況非常的踴躍那也因為外賓來的那個成績很高團很多"},{"start":555.903,"end":571.717,"text":"非常的踴躍所以我們外交部這邊的那個協助的這個能量我們是擔心不足所以還還要從其他的單位甚至是從海外調回那個可以支援的這個人力來協助這種520的相關的這個安排那目前從海外來的這個團數應該是超過40團"},{"start":577.382,"end":580.964,"text":"那所以說部長最後大概可以確定在520之前我們在這一次的520當中會有多少的國家那多少的外賓目前有個數字嗎?"},{"start":605.055,"end":625.397,"text":"我剛剛所說的就是說應該是有40幾團那目前是有400多人好 那麼我們其實可以感受到啦就是我前面所要提問的就是520要將近那麼不論是從蕭准副總統在捷克所遇到的狀況或者是我們到越南去世界臺灣遇到的狀況我相信都是希望給520我們未來的"},{"start":627.159,"end":627.459,"text":"謝謝委員 我們繼續努力"}]}}}}