{"id":151204,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151204","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/cfb4b12132f01627e8b242f8d40728e80915613d02a5e1dcc5dab72e655c1c94dfe90f7597316d845ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"萬美玲","委員發言時間":"09:12:06 - 09:23:40","影片長度":"00:11:34","會議時間":"2024-04-17T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第8次全體委員會議（事由：邀請教育部部長潘文忠列席就「教改30年廣設大學及技專升格如今面臨整併退場之問題及對策」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n（4月17日及18日二天一次會））","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第8次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":8,"committees":[22],"id":"委員會-11-1-22-8"},"date":"2024-04-17","duration":694,"end_time":"2024-04-17T09:23:40+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-17T09:12:06+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":82,"blocks":[["萬委員美玲：（9時12分）謝謝召委。有請潘文忠部長。"],["主席：好，請部長。"],["潘部長文忠：委員早。"],["萬委員美玲：部長早。部長，我想您是中華民國史上任期最長的教育部長，這兩天新任的教育部長公布之後，您目前的心情如何？"],["潘部長文忠：非常祝福新的內閣，包含新任的教育部長，我相信未來一定可以讓臺灣的教育繼續進步。"],["萬委員美玲：所以就是充滿祝福？"],["潘部長文忠：是。"],["萬委員美玲：那您自己內心的心情呢？"],["潘部長文忠：如願以償。"],["萬委員美玲：如願以償。好，可以過一點自己想要的生活了嘛？"],["潘部長文忠：是。"],["萬委員美玲：好。我想7年的時間其實很長，不管是功勞、苦勞，我相信都有。我想請教您，在這7年當中，您為教育的付出，心中可曾有藍綠之分？可曾有過用意識形態來為教育領域服務？"],["潘部長文忠：我跟委員報告，因為委員長期不管在地方、中央都在關注教育……"],["萬委員美玲：有還是沒有？"],["潘部長文忠：我自己本身就是一個教育人，在處理或面對相關議題，我是從教育的角度出發。"],["萬委員美玲：所以您不曾在心裡面有一絲用意識形態來做教育？"],["潘部長文忠：這是我一向的原則。"],["萬委員美玲：很好。我們看到新公布的教育部長叫做鄭英耀，過去他曾經擔任過本土獨派社團台灣南社的副社長，也擔任過民進黨智庫新境界文教基金會的董事。大家都知道其實他在政黨意識上長期以來是非常清楚，既然擔任過本土獨派社團的副社長，現在接教育部長，當然會令教育現場的很多人擔憂。現在你即將要在520跟他做交接，這個交接的清單有沒有什麼重點？然後你有沒有什麼要叮囑他的？以及剛才你有說到，在意識形態上你過去從來都沒有過，在這件事情上，你有沒有打算好好叮嚀他？"],["潘部長文忠：謝謝委員關心。我想新內閣的組成，我們應該給予祝福跟尊重，我相信新閣揆、新總統也都做過詳細的評估；而在業務移交的部分，我想那就是教育的事務了，這方面我一定會跟同仁把現在做的進度，還有委員們經常反映的問題、還要繼續努力的部分來做好交接工作。"],["萬委員美玲：好，您覺得他會做得比你好嗎？"],["潘部長文忠：我們祝福。"],["萬委員美玲：祝福他，但應該是不會超越你吧？"],["潘部長文忠：教育工作一棒接一棒，沒有所謂好不好，我們希望能夠真心地為臺灣孩子的教育來努力。"],["萬委員美玲：好，很好！我想每一個人對教育都是從心出發、要為教育好，但是我們真的不希望把這個意識形態帶進來，因為教育是不應該有分的！所以在交接的過程當中，我們也希望部長把你今天說過的，沒有用藍綠之分、也沒有用意識形態，但是教育上還有很多、很多要繼續完成的延續性政策能夠好好交接。","第二個，也就是今天我們來談私校退場的問題，我們看到這幾天李遠哲──也就是過去教改會的召集人，他最近出書了，他說的其中一句話很經典：碩博士滿街跑不是我的錯、廣設大學也跟我無關。這看起來就是此地無銀三百兩，突然自己來講這個話，可見他就是認為其實教改……其實從各方的撻伐都知道他是失敗的！我們看到教改來到現在，我們可以看到大學文憑的貶值、學用落差的問題以及私校退場等等，您認為在這30年的教改當中，廣設大學政策是對的還是錯的？"],["潘部長文忠：跟委員報告，30年前有當時的時空，為什麼我把它詳細整理在今天的資料？也是希望讓委員一併參考。當時我自己任教過，真的是大班大校！當時的時空去思考這個問題一定是必要，到今天我們真的回到比較小班小校；當時受高等教育的機會也確實比較不足，我想委員都知道當時大概只有百分之二十幾的入學率。"],["萬委員美玲：好。部長，我能夠認同您說有當時的時空背景，但是我必須要講，當時有當時的時空背景，但是教育政策絕對不是短視，就在當初那個時候我們就決定了這麼長遠的事情。當然您今天已經要卸任了，我希望下一任的教育部長或是任何一個還在教育部服務的同仁，我們在制定任何政策的時候，政策是延續性的、是長遠的，絕對沒有當下這件事情！","另外，私校退場以後當然衍生出非常多問題，今天本席要跟您討論學生跟教職員的權益，現在根據教育部的統計，去年跟今年適用私校退場條例的學校總共有7所，和春、中州科大、台灣首府大學在去年停辦了，大概有330位學生有安置到其他學校就讀；今年還有大同技術學院、環球科技大學、明道、東方設計大學等4個大學，預估學生人數大概還有1,035人左右。部長，你們是不是已經做好準備要協助這1,000個學生找到新學校就讀？"],["潘部長文忠：跟委員報告，這就是我們當時拜託大院一定要通過退場條例的原因。因為這當中會有一個非常明確的處理機制，包含設立基金，原因就是希望，第一個，學生就近入學，儘量能夠尊重他的需求……"],["萬委員美玲：部長，因為這個條例我們一起修的，所以我們兩個都很清楚，不用重複。我現在只是要問，在這個條例出來以後，現在還有一千多個學生，有沒有把握把他們安置得很好？"],["潘部長文忠：委員，為什麼教育部會直接進到學校、跟學生召開座談會，也請學校能夠事先瞭解學生比較適切合理的需求……"],["萬委員美玲：有沒有把握這1,000個學生可以安置得很好？"],["潘部長文忠：委員，我們一定用最大的力量，因為從過去也不是一所學校……"],["萬委員美玲：部長，我想請教您一下，現在你們列為預警的學校還有幾所？"],["潘部長文忠：應該是2所左右。"],["萬委員美玲：那現在列為專輔的學校還有幾所？"],["潘部長文忠：大專校院目前沒有專輔學校。"],["萬委員美玲：沒有，好。那我看到兩個問題，第一個問題，現在坊間都在講至少還有60個學校會退場，但你現在的資料是預警學校只有2間、專輔學校沒有，這到底是粉飾太平，還有未爆彈在後面？還是這麼樂觀、後面不會再有退場的學校了？","這衍生出來兩個問題，第一個是您剛剛所說的，這些學生如果今天是大一或大二就再往別的學校安置，有沒有可能到那個學校，結果它成為大家口中所說要退場的60個學校之一，所以他要經過第二次再安置，我覺得這對學生來說十分不公平！大學四年要被轉出1次就已經很慘了，還要再第2次！弱轉弱的情況之下造成2次，母校在哪裡都不知道；第二個，學校教職人員還有722人，目前是透過高階人力躍升平臺跟私校獎補助來安置這些老師，但是本席看到高階人力躍升平臺跟私校獎補助的成效都不是很好，你能不能簡單說明一下？"],["潘部長文忠：剛才委員提到的學生安置，我們會持續來努力，如果我們掌握到預警的學校，在安置的過程就不會讓孩子先過去，因為這個風險高，這是我跟委員報告的一個原則。"],["萬委員美玲：但現在預警學校只有2所，我希望部長520之前再好好盤點一次，到底還有多少學校可能會觸及到預警跟專輔這條線，要把這個數據交出來，不要粉飾太平交給下一個部長，然後造成未爆彈，這樣不好！","我想我們還是來討論一下，第一個，我剛剛講到老師的部分，大概還有七百多個老師，透過高階人力躍升平臺的協助其實不大；另外透過私校獎補助，也就是我們希望現在、現有的私校可以聘任從退場學校出來的這些老師們，那我們給他獎補助。我請教一下，目前有多少退場學校的老師透過私校獎補助被別的私校聘任？"],["潘部長文忠：委員，同仁給我的資料是10位。"],["萬委員美玲：部長，關於這個數字，我跟你講其實真的很可怕！這個數字是從109年有學校開始退場以後就開始計算，到現在為止退場學校的老師有404位，扣掉183位是退休的，也就是還有221個老師是待業的。但是你看看私校裡頭總共只有6個學校申請、只聘了10個老師，可見私校獎補助對現在退場老師的幫助真的非常低啊！部長，我想要請教您，你們現在對於這些退場學校的老師及教職員權益要怎麼維護？"],["潘部長文忠：跟委員報告，為什麼成立基金？就是當他要離退的時候，不要讓學校老師都領不到任何優離、優退的相關資源，由基金直接代墊，這是第一個作法；第二個，剛才委員一直關心、也是教育部關心的，當然這個難度滿高，因為多數學校都面對同樣的問題，其實這些年很少學校在擴大規模。"],["萬委員美玲：對嘛！所以部長我跟你說……"],["潘部長文忠：所以我們也在往產業發展……"],["萬委員美玲：這一些退場學校教職員要進國立學校是非常難的，私立學校有很多都自身難保。所以問題我們兩個今天都點出來了，希望520你要卸任之前再去思考一下怎麼樣協助這些退場學校的老師們，好不好？"],["潘部長文忠：好。"],["萬委員美玲：最後，我要跟你討論現在大漢技術學院的退場，因為我的時間不夠，我只能把問題提出來，會後跟我回復一下。我們現在看起來其實大漢的學校體質無虞，可是因為私校退場條例非常嚴苛，他很擔心以後校產會被充公，所以現在看起來有一點點惡意地用私校法就自己退場了，我想你們是不是在他申請之後還是要嚴審一下！如果體制健全的學校用要私校法退場跟體制不健全的學校被私校退場條例退場，這兩者之間我覺得教育部要嚴格掌控一下，尤其是因為私校退場條例訂得太嚴苛了，那現在會不會有學校因為擔心後續如果變預警或專輔以後校產完全被沒收，所以提早要把校產變私產。關於大漢的退場事件，怎麼樣保障老師跟學生的權益，會後針對這個個案看能不能由司長來我辦公室跟我做個說明，好不好？"],["潘部長文忠：好，詳細資料我們再跟委員說明。只是跟委員報告，因為他們校內的程序等等都還在進行中，他也還沒正式提出停辦的計畫；如果提出來，教育部也有一個嚴謹的審查過程。"],["萬委員美玲：為了師生的權益，這個案子一定要嚴審，好不好？"],["潘部長文忠：是！委員，這一定是我們的態度。"],["萬委員美玲：好，謝謝。"],["潘部長文忠：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝。接下來請洪孟楷委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":166,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-8","speakers":["柯志恩","萬美玲","洪孟楷","郭昱晴","陳培瑜","吳沛憶","林倩綺","陳秀寳","羅廷瑋","葛如鈞","林宜瑾","張雅琳","葉元之","吳春城","范雲","張嘉郡","羅智強","徐欣瑩","牛煦庭","廖偉翔","莊瑞雄","劉建國","王鴻薇","陳冠廷"],"page_start":99,"meetingDate":["2024-04-17"],"gazette_id":"1133001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1133001_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第8次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請教育部部長潘文忠列席就「教改30年廣設大學及技專升格如今面臨整併退場之問題及對策」\n進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":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00:01:29,491\n我們看到新公布的教育部長鄭英耀過去他曾經擔任過本土獨派社團臺灣南社的副社長也擔任過民進黨智庫新境界文教基金會的董事大家都知道其實他在政黨意識上面長期以來是非常的清楚既然也擔任過本土獨派的一個社團\n\n5\n00:01:50,922 --> 00:02:10,130\n現在藉著這個教育部長當然會令很多這個教育現場的很多人來擔憂那不曉得現在你即將要在520要跟他做一個交接了那這個交接的清單有沒有什麼重點然後你有沒有什麼要叮囑他的以及剛才你有沒有說到在意識形態上你從來過去從來都沒有過在這件事情上你要有沒有打算好好叮嚀他\n\n6\n00:02:11,811 --> 00:02:13,252\n好,您覺得他會做得比你好嗎?祝福他,但是應該是不會超越你吧?\n\n7\n00:02:41,812 --> 00:03:03,425\n教育工作一棒接一棒這個沒有所謂好不好只是我們希望能夠真心的為台灣孩子的教育來做努力我想每一個人對教育都是重新出發要為教育好但是我們真的不希望把這個意識形態帶進來因為教育是不應該有分的所以我想在交界的過程當中我們也希望部長把您今天說過的\n\n8\n00:03:04,486 --> 00:03:31,812\n沒有用藍綠之分也沒有用意識形態但是教育上有很多很多還要繼續完成延續性的政策能夠好好做一個交接那麼第二個呢也就是今天我們來談這個私校退場的一個問題那我們看到這幾天李遠澤也是過去的教改會的一個召集人他最近出書了他說其中一句話很經典說博士滿街跑不是我的錯廣設大學也跟我無關這看起來就是本來\n\n9\n00:03:34,212 --> 00:03:55,417\n此例無疑三百兩突然自己來講這個話可見呢他就是認為其實教改其實各方的這個撻伐都知道其實它是失敗的那現在我們看到教改來到現在我們可以看到大學文憑的貶值啦這個學用落差的問題啦私校退場等等那您認為就是說在這個30年的教改這廣設大學政策是對的還是錯的\n\n10\n00:03:56,910 --> 00:04:23,369\n跟委員報告30年前有當時的時空確實在今天的資料我為什麼詳細的把它整理也是希望讓委員一併的來參考那當時我自己認教過真的是大班大校那當時的時空去思考這個問題一定是必要到今天我們真的回到比較小班小校那當時受高等教育的機會也確實比較不足所以呢當時我想委員公都知道我們大概只有20幾%的入學率\n\n11\n00:04:24,770 --> 00:04:48,202\n我想部長我能夠認同您說有當時的時空背景但是呢我們必須要講當時有當時的時空背景但是教育政策絕對不是短視就在當時那個時候我們就決定了這麼長遠的事情所以我覺得當然您今天已經要卸任了我是希望其實下一任的教育部長或者是任何一個還在教育部服務的這些同仁我們在制定任何政策的時候政策是延續性的是長遠的絕對沒有當下這件事情\n\n12\n00:04:50,623 --> 00:04:51,023\n4月17日及18日二天一次會．．萬美玲\n\n13\n00:05:14,738 --> 00:05:31,065\n大同技術學院環球科技大學明道東方設計大學等4個大學那大概預估這個學生人數還有大概1035人左右那部長我們是不是已經有做好準備要來協助這1000個學生去找到新的學校就讀\n\n14\n00:05:32,793 --> 00:05:33,253\n學生就近入學\n\n15\n00:05:49,900 --> 00:06:15,818\n部長我想因為這個條例我們一起修的所以我們倆都很清楚不用重複我現在只是要問說這個條例出來以後現在還有一千多個學生有沒有把握把他們安置得很好委員這個為什麼教育部會直接進到學校跟學生召開座談會也請學校能夠事先去瞭解學生比較適切合理的需求有沒有把握這一千個學生可以安置得很好我們一定用最大的力量因為從過去也不是一所學校部長我想請教您一下現在我們列為預警的學校還有幾所\n\n16\n00:06:20,762 --> 00:06:26,566\n應該是兩所左右我們現在列為專輔的學校還有幾所?大專校院目前沒有專輔學校我看到兩個問題第一個問題是現在坊間都在講說我們至少還有60個學校會退場但是你現在的資料是\n\n17\n00:06:36,872 --> 00:06:37,132\n議員提出的問題\n\n18\n00:07:14,020 --> 00:07:32,234\n第二學校教職人員722人目前我們是透過高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助來安置這些老師但是本席看到高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助的成效都不是很好你能不能簡單說明一下\n\n19\n00:07:34,726 --> 00:07:47,976\n剛才委員提到那個學生安置我們會持續的來努力那如果我們掌握到的比如預警的學校在安置的過程就不會讓孩子先過去因為這個風險高這是我跟委員報告的一個原則但你現在這個預警學校只有兩所我是希望部長520之前我希望你再好好地去盤點一次到底還有多少學校可能會觸及到預警跟專輔這個線那把這個數據要交出來那不要這樣粉飾太平交給下一個這個部長然後未報待以後就不好\n\n20\n00:08:03,567 --> 00:08:20,428\n但是我想我們還是來討論一下第一個我剛剛講到說我們的老師的部分大概還有700多個老師透過高階人力躍升平台的這個協助其實不大那另外透過私校獎補助就是說我們希望現在現有的私校可以去聘任\n\n21\n00:08:20,868 --> 00:08:33,294\n那從退場學校出來的這些老師們那我們給他講補助我請教一下目前有多少退場的這些學校的老師有透過私校講補助被別的私校來聘任的有多少\n\n22\n00:08:35,770 --> 00:08:47,155\n委員通常給我的資料是10位10位好部長這個數字我跟你講其實真的很可怕你這個數字是從109年有學校開始退場以後就開始計算那到現在為止我們整個退場的學校的老師有404位那扣掉221位是待業的\n\n23\n00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:02,162\n總共只有6個學校申請執聘了10個老師可見私校獎補助這個對我們現在退場的老師的幫助真的非常的低所以部長我想要請教您我們現在對於這些退場的學校老師跟教職人的權益你要怎麼去維護\n\n24\n00:09:22,030 --> 00:09:39,105\n跟委員報告如果當然為什麼成立基金就是說當他要離退的時候不要讓學校老師都領不到任何憂離憂退的這些相關的資源有基金直接代付代電這個是第一個做法那第二個剛才委員一直關心也是教育部當然這個我說難度蠻高因為多數的學校都面對同樣的問題其實這些年是很少學校在擴大\n\n25\n00:09:45,350 --> 00:09:49,013\n所以部長我跟你說這些退場學校的教職員要進國立學校是非常難的私立學校有很多的自身難保所以問題我們兩間都點出來了希望520你要卸任之前再去思考一下怎麼樣來協助這些退場學校的老師們好不好\n\n26\n00:10:04,467 --> 00:10:11,951\n最後10秒鐘可能再多一點點我要跟你討論我們現在大漢技術學院的退場因為我的時間不夠我只能把問題提出來會後跟我回覆一下我們看起來現在大漢其實他學校體質是無餘的可是因為我們私校退場條例非常嚴苛他很擔心他以後的校產會被充公所以現在看起來有一點點惡意用私校法那麼自己就去退場了\n\n27\n00:10:29,941 --> 00:10:39,066\n所以我想我們是不是在他申請之後我們還是要去嚴審一下現在到底如果說這個體制是健全的學校用私校法來去退場跟體制不健全的學校被私校退場條例去退場這兩者之間我覺得教育部要嚴格掌控一下尤其是因為你們私校退場條例訂得太嚴苛了那現在會不會會不會有學校因為擔心後續他如果變獄警或專輔以後校產完全被沒收所以提早\n\n28\n00:10:58,916 --> 00:11:02,759\n我們在詳細資料再跟委員報告就是說因為他們校內的程序等等都還在進行中他也還沒提出正式停辦的計畫那如果提出來教育部也有一個嚴謹的審查過程\n\n29\n00:11:24,395 --> 00:11:26,219\n為了施政的權益這個案子一定要嚴審\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n1101\t8302\t響鐘\n13303\t18867\t教育部長,您是中華民國史上任期最長的教育部長。在這兩天我們新任的教育部長公布之後,您目前的心情如何?非常祝福新任的教育部長。我相信以這個未來一定可以讓臺灣……所以就是充滿祝福?\n39423\t64769\t您自己內心的心情呢?如願以償可以過一點自己想要的生活了嗎?我想七年的時間其實很長不管是功勞苦勞我相信都有但我想請教您在這七年當中您為教育的付出心中可曾有藍綠之分?可曾有過用意識形態下去為我們的教育領域來做服務?\n65669\t68372\t所以您不曾在戲裡面有一絲用意識形態來做教育很好\n84508\t89491\t我們看到新公布的教育部長鄭英耀過去他曾經擔任過本土獨派社團臺灣南社的副社長也擔任過民進黨智庫新境界文教基金會的董事大家都知道其實他在政黨意識上面長期以來是非常的清楚既然也擔任過本土獨派的一個社團\n110922\t130130\t現在藉著這個教育部長當然會令很多這個教育現場的很多人來擔憂那不曉得現在你即將要在520要跟他做一個交接了那這個交接的清單有沒有什麼重點然後你有沒有什麼要叮囑他的以及剛才你有沒有說到在意識形態上你從來過去從來都沒有過在這件事情上你要有沒有打算好好叮嚀他\n131811\t133252\t好,您覺得他會做得比你好嗎?祝福他,但是應該是不會超越你吧?\n161812\t183425\t教育工作一棒接一棒 這個沒有所謂好不好只是我們希望能夠真心的為台灣孩子的教育來做努力我想每一個人對教育都是重新出發要為教育好但是我們真的不希望把這個意識形態帶進來因為教育是不應該有分的所以我想在交界的過程當中我們也希望部長把您今天說過的\n184486\t211812\t沒有用藍綠之分也沒有用意識形態但是教育上有很多很多還要繼續完成延續性的政策能夠好好做一個交接那麼第二個呢也就是今天我們來談這個私校退場的一個問題那我們看到這幾天李遠澤也是過去的教改會的一個召集人他最近出書了他說其中一句話很經典說博士滿街跑不是我的錯廣設大學也跟我無關這看起來就是本來\n214212\t235417\t此例無疑三百兩突然自己來講這個話可見呢他就是認為其實教改其實各方的這個撻伐都知道其實它是失敗的那現在我們看到教改來到現在我們可以看到大學文憑的貶值啦這個學用落差的問題啦私校退場等等那您認為就是說在這個30年的教改這廣設大學政策是對的還是錯的\n236910\t263369\t跟委員報告30年前有當時的時空確實在今天的資料我為什麼詳細的把它整理也是希望讓委員一併的來參考那當時我自己認教過真的是大班大校那當時的時空去思考這個問題一定是必要到今天我們真的回到比較小班小校那當時受高等教育的機會也確實比較不足所以呢當時我想委員公都知道我們大概只有20幾%的入學率\n264770\t288202\t我想部長我能夠認同您說有當時的時空背景但是呢我們必須要講當時有當時的時空背景但是教育政策絕對不是短視就在當時那個時候我們就決定了這麼長遠的事情所以我覺得當然您今天已經要卸任了我是希望其實下一任的教育部長或者是任何一個還在教育部服務的這些同仁我們在制定任何政策的時候政策是延續性的是長遠的絕對沒有當下這件事情\n290623\t291023\t4月17日及18日二天一次會．．萬美玲\n314738\t331065\t大同技術學院環球科技大學明道東方設計大學等4個大學那大概預估這個學生人數還有大概1035人左右那部長我們是不是已經有做好準備要來協助這1000個學生去找到新的學校就讀\n332793\t333253\t學生就近入學\n349900\t375818\t部長我想因為這個條例我們一起修的所以我們倆都很清楚不用重複我現在只是要問說這個條例出來以後現在還有一千多個學生有沒有把握把他們安置得很好委員這個為什麼教育部會直接進到學校跟學生召開座談會也請學校能夠事先去瞭解學生比較適切合理的需求有沒有把握這一千個學生可以安置得很好我們一定用最大的力量因為從過去也不是一所學校部長我想請教您一下現在我們列為預警的學校還有幾所\n380762\t386566\t應該是兩所左右我們現在列為專輔的學校還有幾所?大專校院目前沒有專輔學校我看到兩個問題第一個問題是現在坊間都在講說我們至少還有60個學校會退場但是你現在的資料是\n396872\t397132\t議員提出的問題\n413712\t433780\t．．\n434020\t452234\t第二 學校教職人員722人目前我們是透過高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助來安置這些老師但是本席看到高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助的成效都不是很好你能不能簡單說明一下\n454726\t467976\t剛才委員提到那個學生安置我們會持續的來努力那如果我們掌握到的比如預警的學校在安置的過程就不會讓孩子先過去因為這個風險高這是我跟委員報告的一個原則但你現在這個預警學校只有兩所我是希望部長520之前我希望你再好好地去盤點一次到底還有多少學校可能會觸及到預警跟專輔這個線那把這個數據要交出來那不要這樣粉飾太平交給下一個這個部長然後未報待以後就不好\n483567\t500428\t但是我想我們還是來討論一下第一個我剛剛講到說我們的老師的部分大概還有700多個老師透過高階人力躍升平台的這個協助其實不大那另外透過私校獎補助就是說我們希望現在現有的私校可以去聘任\n500868\t513294\t那從退場學校出來的這些老師們那我們給他講補助我請教一下目前有多少退場的這些學校的老師有透過私校講補助被別的私校來聘任的有多少\n515770\t527155\t委員通常給我的資料是10位10位好部長這個數字我跟你講其實真的很可怕你這個數字是從109年有學校開始退場以後就開始計算那到現在為止我們整個退場的學校的老師有404位那扣掉221位是待業的\n538080\t542162\t總共只有6個學校申請執聘了10個老師可見私校獎補助這個對我們現在退場的老師的幫助真的非常的低所以部長我想要請教您我們現在對於這些退場的學校老師跟教職人的權益你要怎麼去維護\n562030\t579105\t跟委員報告如果當然為什麼成立基金就是說當他要離退的時候不要讓學校老師都領不到任何憂離憂退的這些相關的資源有基金直接代付代電這個是第一個做法那第二個剛才委員一直關心也是教育部當然這個我說難度蠻高因為多數的學校都面對同樣的問題其實這些年是很少學校在擴大\n585350\t589013\t所以部長我跟你說這些退場學校的教職員要進國立學校是非常難的私立學校有很多的自身難保所以問題我們兩間都點出來了希望520你要卸任之前再去思考一下怎麼樣來協助這些退場學校的老師們好不好\n604467\t611951\t最後10秒鐘可能再多一點點我要跟你討論我們現在大漢技術學院的退場因為我的時間不夠我只能把問題提出來會後跟我回覆一下我們看起來現在大漢其實他學校體質是無餘的可是因為我們私校退場條例非常嚴苛他很擔心他以後的校產會被充公所以現在看起來有一點點惡意用私校法那麼自己就去退場了\n629941\t639066\t所以我想我們是不是在他申請之後我們還是要去嚴審一下現在到底如果說這個體制是健全的學校用私校法來去退場跟體制不健全的學校被私校退場條例去退場這兩者之間我覺得教育部要嚴格掌控一下尤其是因為你們私校退場條例訂得太嚴苛了那現在會不會會不會有學校因為擔心後續他如果變獄警或專輔以後校產完全被沒收所以提早\n658916\t662759\t我們在詳細資料再跟委員報告就是說因為他們校內的程序等等都還在進行中他也還沒提出正式停辦的計畫那如果提出來教育部也有一個嚴謹的審查過程\n684395\t686219\t為了施政的權益這個案子一定要嚴審\n","txt":"響鐘\n教育部長,您是中華民國史上任期最長的教育部長。在這兩天我們新任的教育部長公布之後,您目前的心情如何?非常祝福新任的教育部長。我相信以這個未來一定可以讓臺灣……所以就是充滿祝福?\n您自己內心的心情呢?如願以償可以過一點自己想要的生活了嗎?我想七年的時間其實很長不管是功勞苦勞我相信都有但我想請教您在這七年當中您為教育的付出心中可曾有藍綠之分?可曾有過用意識形態下去為我們的教育領域來做服務?\n所以您不曾在戲裡面有一絲用意識形態來做教育很好\n我們看到新公布的教育部長鄭英耀過去他曾經擔任過本土獨派社團臺灣南社的副社長也擔任過民進黨智庫新境界文教基金會的董事大家都知道其實他在政黨意識上面長期以來是非常的清楚既然也擔任過本土獨派的一個社團\n現在藉著這個教育部長當然會令很多這個教育現場的很多人來擔憂那不曉得現在你即將要在520要跟他做一個交接了那這個交接的清單有沒有什麼重點然後你有沒有什麼要叮囑他的以及剛才你有沒有說到在意識形態上你從來過去從來都沒有過在這件事情上你要有沒有打算好好叮嚀他\n好,您覺得他會做得比你好嗎?祝福他,但是應該是不會超越你吧?\n教育工作一棒接一棒 這個沒有所謂好不好只是我們希望能夠真心的為台灣孩子的教育來做努力我想每一個人對教育都是重新出發要為教育好但是我們真的不希望把這個意識形態帶進來因為教育是不應該有分的所以我想在交界的過程當中我們也希望部長把您今天說過的\n沒有用藍綠之分也沒有用意識形態但是教育上有很多很多還要繼續完成延續性的政策能夠好好做一個交接那麼第二個呢也就是今天我們來談這個私校退場的一個問題那我們看到這幾天李遠澤也是過去的教改會的一個召集人他最近出書了他說其中一句話很經典說博士滿街跑不是我的錯廣設大學也跟我無關這看起來就是本來\n此例無疑三百兩突然自己來講這個話可見呢他就是認為其實教改其實各方的這個撻伐都知道其實它是失敗的那現在我們看到教改來到現在我們可以看到大學文憑的貶值啦這個學用落差的問題啦私校退場等等那您認為就是說在這個30年的教改這廣設大學政策是對的還是錯的\n跟委員報告30年前有當時的時空確實在今天的資料我為什麼詳細的把它整理也是希望讓委員一併的來參考那當時我自己認教過真的是大班大校那當時的時空去思考這個問題一定是必要到今天我們真的回到比較小班小校那當時受高等教育的機會也確實比較不足所以呢當時我想委員公都知道我們大概只有20幾%的入學率\n我想部長我能夠認同您說有當時的時空背景但是呢我們必須要講當時有當時的時空背景但是教育政策絕對不是短視就在當時那個時候我們就決定了這麼長遠的事情所以我覺得當然您今天已經要卸任了我是希望其實下一任的教育部長或者是任何一個還在教育部服務的這些同仁我們在制定任何政策的時候政策是延續性的是長遠的絕對沒有當下這件事情\n4月17日及18日二天一次會．．萬美玲\n大同技術學院環球科技大學明道東方設計大學等4個大學那大概預估這個學生人數還有大概1035人左右那部長我們是不是已經有做好準備要來協助這1000個學生去找到新的學校就讀\n學生就近入學\n部長我想因為這個條例我們一起修的所以我們倆都很清楚不用重複我現在只是要問說這個條例出來以後現在還有一千多個學生有沒有把握把他們安置得很好委員這個為什麼教育部會直接進到學校跟學生召開座談會也請學校能夠事先去瞭解學生比較適切合理的需求有沒有把握這一千個學生可以安置得很好我們一定用最大的力量因為從過去也不是一所學校部長我想請教您一下現在我們列為預警的學校還有幾所\n應該是兩所左右我們現在列為專輔的學校還有幾所?大專校院目前沒有專輔學校我看到兩個問題第一個問題是現在坊間都在講說我們至少還有60個學校會退場但是你現在的資料是\n議員提出的問題\n．．\n第二 學校教職人員722人目前我們是透過高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助來安置這些老師但是本席看到高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助的成效都不是很好你能不能簡單說明一下\n剛才委員提到那個學生安置我們會持續的來努力那如果我們掌握到的比如預警的學校在安置的過程就不會讓孩子先過去因為這個風險高這是我跟委員報告的一個原則但你現在這個預警學校只有兩所我是希望部長520之前我希望你再好好地去盤點一次到底還有多少學校可能會觸及到預警跟專輔這個線那把這個數據要交出來那不要這樣粉飾太平交給下一個這個部長然後未報待以後就不好\n但是我想我們還是來討論一下第一個我剛剛講到說我們的老師的部分大概還有700多個老師透過高階人力躍升平台的這個協助其實不大那另外透過私校獎補助就是說我們希望現在現有的私校可以去聘任\n那從退場學校出來的這些老師們那我們給他講補助我請教一下目前有多少退場的這些學校的老師有透過私校講補助被別的私校來聘任的有多少\n委員通常給我的資料是10位10位好部長這個數字我跟你講其實真的很可怕你這個數字是從109年有學校開始退場以後就開始計算那到現在為止我們整個退場的學校的老師有404位那扣掉221位是待業的\n總共只有6個學校申請執聘了10個老師可見私校獎補助這個對我們現在退場的老師的幫助真的非常的低所以部長我想要請教您我們現在對於這些退場的學校老師跟教職人的權益你要怎麼去維護\n跟委員報告如果當然為什麼成立基金就是說當他要離退的時候不要讓學校老師都領不到任何憂離憂退的這些相關的資源有基金直接代付代電這個是第一個做法那第二個剛才委員一直關心也是教育部當然這個我說難度蠻高因為多數的學校都面對同樣的問題其實這些年是很少學校在擴大\n所以部長我跟你說這些退場學校的教職員要進國立學校是非常難的私立學校有很多的自身難保所以問題我們兩間都點出來了希望520你要卸任之前再去思考一下怎麼樣來協助這些退場學校的老師們好不好\n最後10秒鐘可能再多一點點我要跟你討論我們現在大漢技術學院的退場因為我的時間不夠我只能把問題提出來會後跟我回覆一下我們看起來現在大漢其實他學校體質是無餘的可是因為我們私校退場條例非常嚴苛他很擔心他以後的校產會被充公所以現在看起來有一點點惡意用私校法那麼自己就去退場了\n所以我想我們是不是在他申請之後我們還是要去嚴審一下現在到底如果說這個體制是健全的學校用私校法來去退場跟體制不健全的學校被私校退場條例去退場這兩者之間我覺得教育部要嚴格掌控一下尤其是因為你們私校退場條例訂得太嚴苛了那現在會不會會不會有學校因為擔心後續他如果變獄警或專輔以後校產完全被沒收所以提早\n我們在詳細資料再跟委員報告就是說因為他們校內的程序等等都還在進行中他也還沒提出正式停辦的計畫那如果提出來教育部也有一個嚴謹的審查過程\n為了施政的權益這個案子一定要嚴審\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:13.303 --> 00:18.867\n教育部長,您是中華民國史上任期最長的教育部長。在這兩天我們新任的教育部長公布之後,您目前的心情如何?非常祝福新任的教育部長。我相信以這個未來一定可以讓臺灣……所以就是充滿祝福?\n\n00:39.423 --> 01:04.769\n您自己內心的心情呢?如願以償可以過一點自己想要的生活了嗎?我想七年的時間其實很長不管是功勞苦勞我相信都有但我想請教您在這七年當中您為教育的付出心中可曾有藍綠之分?可曾有過用意識形態下去為我們的教育領域來做服務?\n\n01:05.669 --> 01:08.372\n所以您不曾在戲裡面有一絲用意識形態來做教育很好\n\n01:24.508 --> 01:29.491\n我們看到新公布的教育部長鄭英耀過去他曾經擔任過本土獨派社團臺灣南社的副社長也擔任過民進黨智庫新境界文教基金會的董事大家都知道其實他在政黨意識上面長期以來是非常的清楚既然也擔任過本土獨派的一個社團\n\n01:50.922 --> 02:10.130\n現在藉著這個教育部長當然會令很多這個教育現場的很多人來擔憂那不曉得現在你即將要在520要跟他做一個交接了那這個交接的清單有沒有什麼重點然後你有沒有什麼要叮囑他的以及剛才你有沒有說到在意識形態上你從來過去從來都沒有過在這件事情上你要有沒有打算好好叮嚀他\n\n02:11.811 --> 02:13.252\n好,您覺得他會做得比你好嗎?祝福他,但是應該是不會超越你吧?\n\n02:41.812 --> 03:03.425\n教育工作一棒接一棒這個沒有所謂好不好只是我們希望能夠真心的為台灣孩子的教育來做努力我想每一個人對教育都是重新出發要為教育好但是我們真的不希望把這個意識形態帶進來因為教育是不應該有分的所以我想在交界的過程當中我們也希望部長把您今天說過的\n\n03:04.486 --> 03:31.812\n沒有用藍綠之分也沒有用意識形態但是教育上有很多很多還要繼續完成延續性的政策能夠好好做一個交接那麼第二個呢也就是今天我們來談這個私校退場的一個問題那我們看到這幾天李遠澤也是過去的教改會的一個召集人他最近出書了他說其中一句話很經典說博士滿街跑不是我的錯廣設大學也跟我無關這看起來就是本來\n\n03:34.212 --> 03:55.417\n此例無疑三百兩突然自己來講這個話可見呢他就是認為其實教改其實各方的這個撻伐都知道其實它是失敗的那現在我們看到教改來到現在我們可以看到大學文憑的貶值啦這個學用落差的問題啦私校退場等等那您認為就是說在這個30年的教改這廣設大學政策是對的還是錯的\n\n03:56.910 --> 04:23.369\n跟委員報告30年前有當時的時空確實在今天的資料我為什麼詳細的把它整理也是希望讓委員一併的來參考那當時我自己認教過真的是大班大校那當時的時空去思考這個問題一定是必要到今天我們真的回到比較小班小校那當時受高等教育的機會也確實比較不足所以呢當時我想委員公都知道我們大概只有20幾%的入學率\n\n04:24.770 --> 04:48.202\n我想部長我能夠認同您說有當時的時空背景但是呢我們必須要講當時有當時的時空背景但是教育政策絕對不是短視就在當時那個時候我們就決定了這麼長遠的事情所以我覺得當然您今天已經要卸任了我是希望其實下一任的教育部長或者是任何一個還在教育部服務的這些同仁我們在制定任何政策的時候政策是延續性的是長遠的絕對沒有當下這件事情\n\n04:50.623 --> 04:51.023\n4月17日及18日二天一次會．．萬美玲\n\n05:14.738 --> 05:31.065\n大同技術學院環球科技大學明道東方設計大學等4個大學那大概預估這個學生人數還有大概1035人左右那部長我們是不是已經有做好準備要來協助這1000個學生去找到新的學校就讀\n\n05:32.793 --> 05:33.253\n學生就近入學\n\n05:49.900 --> 06:15.818\n部長我想因為這個條例我們一起修的所以我們倆都很清楚不用重複我現在只是要問說這個條例出來以後現在還有一千多個學生有沒有把握把他們安置得很好委員這個為什麼教育部會直接進到學校跟學生召開座談會也請學校能夠事先去瞭解學生比較適切合理的需求有沒有把握這一千個學生可以安置得很好我們一定用最大的力量因為從過去也不是一所學校部長我想請教您一下現在我們列為預警的學校還有幾所\n\n06:20.762 --> 06:26.566\n應該是兩所左右我們現在列為專輔的學校還有幾所?大專校院目前沒有專輔學校我看到兩個問題第一個問題是現在坊間都在講說我們至少還有60個學校會退場但是你現在的資料是\n\n06:36.872 --> 06:37.132\n議員提出的問題\n\n07:14.020 --> 07:32.234\n第二學校教職人員722人目前我們是透過高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助來安置這些老師但是本席看到高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助的成效都不是很好你能不能簡單說明一下\n\n07:34.726 --> 07:47.976\n剛才委員提到那個學生安置我們會持續的來努力那如果我們掌握到的比如預警的學校在安置的過程就不會讓孩子先過去因為這個風險高這是我跟委員報告的一個原則但你現在這個預警學校只有兩所我是希望部長520之前我希望你再好好地去盤點一次到底還有多少學校可能會觸及到預警跟專輔這個線那把這個數據要交出來那不要這樣粉飾太平交給下一個這個部長然後未報待以後就不好\n\n08:03.567 --> 08:20.428\n但是我想我們還是來討論一下第一個我剛剛講到說我們的老師的部分大概還有700多個老師透過高階人力躍升平台的這個協助其實不大那另外透過私校獎補助就是說我們希望現在現有的私校可以去聘任\n\n08:20.868 --> 08:33.294\n那從退場學校出來的這些老師們那我們給他講補助我請教一下目前有多少退場的這些學校的老師有透過私校講補助被別的私校來聘任的有多少\n\n08:35.770 --> 08:47.155\n委員通常給我的資料是10位10位好部長這個數字我跟你講其實真的很可怕你這個數字是從109年有學校開始退場以後就開始計算那到現在為止我們整個退場的學校的老師有404位那扣掉221位是待業的\n\n08:58.080 --> 09:02.162\n總共只有6個學校申請執聘了10個老師可見私校獎補助這個對我們現在退場的老師的幫助真的非常的低所以部長我想要請教您我們現在對於這些退場的學校老師跟教職人的權益你要怎麼去維護\n\n09:22.030 --> 09:39.105\n跟委員報告如果當然為什麼成立基金就是說當他要離退的時候不要讓學校老師都領不到任何憂離憂退的這些相關的資源有基金直接代付代電這個是第一個做法那第二個剛才委員一直關心也是教育部當然這個我說難度蠻高因為多數的學校都面對同樣的問題其實這些年是很少學校在擴大\n\n09:45.350 --> 09:49.013\n所以部長我跟你說這些退場學校的教職員要進國立學校是非常難的私立學校有很多的自身難保所以問題我們兩間都點出來了希望520你要卸任之前再去思考一下怎麼樣來協助這些退場學校的老師們好不好\n\n10:04.467 --> 10:11.951\n最後10秒鐘可能再多一點點我要跟你討論我們現在大漢技術學院的退場因為我的時間不夠我只能把問題提出來會後跟我回覆一下我們看起來現在大漢其實他學校體質是無餘的可是因為我們私校退場條例非常嚴苛他很擔心他以後的校產會被充公所以現在看起來有一點點惡意用私校法那麼自己就去退場了\n\n10:29.941 --> 10:39.066\n所以我想我們是不是在他申請之後我們還是要去嚴審一下現在到底如果說這個體制是健全的學校用私校法來去退場跟體制不健全的學校被私校退場條例去退場這兩者之間我覺得教育部要嚴格掌控一下尤其是因為你們私校退場條例訂得太嚴苛了那現在會不會會不會有學校因為擔心後續他如果變獄警或專輔以後校產完全被沒收所以提早\n\n10:58.916 --> 11:02.759\n我們在詳細資料再跟委員報告就是說因為他們校內的程序等等都還在進行中他也還沒提出正式停辦的計畫那如果提出來教育部也有一個嚴謹的審查過程\n\n11:24.395 --> 11:26.219\n為了施政的權益這個案子一定要嚴審\n\n","segments":[{"start":1.101,"end":8.302,"text":"響鐘"},{"start":13.303,"end":18.867,"text":"教育部長,您是中華民國史上任期最長的教育部長。在這兩天我們新任的教育部長公布之後,您目前的心情如何?非常祝福新任的教育部長。我相信以這個未來一定可以讓臺灣……所以就是充滿祝福?"},{"start":39.423,"end":64.769,"text":"您自己內心的心情呢?如願以償可以過一點自己想要的生活了嗎?我想七年的時間其實很長不管是功勞苦勞我相信都有但我想請教您在這七年當中您為教育的付出心中可曾有藍綠之分?可曾有過用意識形態下去為我們的教育領域來做服務?"},{"start":65.669,"end":68.372,"text":"所以您不曾在戲裡面有一絲用意識形態來做教育很好"},{"start":84.508,"end":89.491,"text":"我們看到新公布的教育部長鄭英耀過去他曾經擔任過本土獨派社團臺灣南社的副社長也擔任過民進黨智庫新境界文教基金會的董事大家都知道其實他在政黨意識上面長期以來是非常的清楚既然也擔任過本土獨派的一個社團"},{"start":110.922,"end":130.13,"text":"現在藉著這個教育部長當然會令很多這個教育現場的很多人來擔憂那不曉得現在你即將要在520要跟他做一個交接了那這個交接的清單有沒有什麼重點然後你有沒有什麼要叮囑他的以及剛才你有沒有說到在意識形態上你從來過去從來都沒有過在這件事情上你要有沒有打算好好叮嚀他"},{"start":131.811,"end":133.252,"text":"好,您覺得他會做得比你好嗎?祝福他,但是應該是不會超越你吧?"},{"start":161.812,"end":183.425,"text":"教育工作一棒接一棒 這個沒有所謂好不好只是我們希望能夠真心的為台灣孩子的教育來做努力我想每一個人對教育都是重新出發要為教育好但是我們真的不希望把這個意識形態帶進來因為教育是不應該有分的所以我想在交界的過程當中我們也希望部長把您今天說過的"},{"start":184.486,"end":211.812,"text":"沒有用藍綠之分也沒有用意識形態但是教育上有很多很多還要繼續完成延續性的政策能夠好好做一個交接那麼第二個呢也就是今天我們來談這個私校退場的一個問題那我們看到這幾天李遠澤也是過去的教改會的一個召集人他最近出書了他說其中一句話很經典說博士滿街跑不是我的錯廣設大學也跟我無關這看起來就是本來"},{"start":214.212,"end":235.417,"text":"此例無疑三百兩突然自己來講這個話可見呢他就是認為其實教改其實各方的這個撻伐都知道其實它是失敗的那現在我們看到教改來到現在我們可以看到大學文憑的貶值啦這個學用落差的問題啦私校退場等等那您認為就是說在這個30年的教改這廣設大學政策是對的還是錯的"},{"start":236.91,"end":263.369,"text":"跟委員報告30年前有當時的時空確實在今天的資料我為什麼詳細的把它整理也是希望讓委員一併的來參考那當時我自己認教過真的是大班大校那當時的時空去思考這個問題一定是必要到今天我們真的回到比較小班小校那當時受高等教育的機會也確實比較不足所以呢當時我想委員公都知道我們大概只有20幾%的入學率"},{"start":264.77,"end":288.202,"text":"我想部長我能夠認同您說有當時的時空背景但是呢我們必須要講當時有當時的時空背景但是教育政策絕對不是短視就在當時那個時候我們就決定了這麼長遠的事情所以我覺得當然您今天已經要卸任了我是希望其實下一任的教育部長或者是任何一個還在教育部服務的這些同仁我們在制定任何政策的時候政策是延續性的是長遠的絕對沒有當下這件事情"},{"start":290.623,"end":291.023,"text":"4月17日及18日二天一次會．．萬美玲"},{"start":314.738,"end":331.065,"text":"大同技術學院環球科技大學明道東方設計大學等4個大學那大概預估這個學生人數還有大概1035人左右那部長我們是不是已經有做好準備要來協助這1000個學生去找到新的學校就讀"},{"start":332.793,"end":333.253,"text":"學生就近入學"},{"start":349.9,"end":375.818,"text":"部長我想因為這個條例我們一起修的所以我們倆都很清楚不用重複我現在只是要問說這個條例出來以後現在還有一千多個學生有沒有把握把他們安置得很好委員這個為什麼教育部會直接進到學校跟學生召開座談會也請學校能夠事先去瞭解學生比較適切合理的需求有沒有把握這一千個學生可以安置得很好我們一定用最大的力量因為從過去也不是一所學校部長我想請教您一下現在我們列為預警的學校還有幾所"},{"start":380.762,"end":386.566,"text":"應該是兩所左右我們現在列為專輔的學校還有幾所?大專校院目前沒有專輔學校我看到兩個問題第一個問題是現在坊間都在講說我們至少還有60個學校會退場但是你現在的資料是"},{"start":396.872,"end":397.132,"text":"議員提出的問題"},{"start":413.712,"end":433.78,"text":"．．"},{"start":434.02,"end":452.234,"text":"第二 學校教職人員722人目前我們是透過高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助來安置這些老師但是本席看到高階人力躍升平台及私校獎補助的成效都不是很好你能不能簡單說明一下"},{"start":454.726,"end":467.976,"text":"剛才委員提到那個學生安置我們會持續的來努力那如果我們掌握到的比如預警的學校在安置的過程就不會讓孩子先過去因為這個風險高這是我跟委員報告的一個原則但你現在這個預警學校只有兩所我是希望部長520之前我希望你再好好地去盤點一次到底還有多少學校可能會觸及到預警跟專輔這個線那把這個數據要交出來那不要這樣粉飾太平交給下一個這個部長然後未報待以後就不好"},{"start":483.567,"end":500.428,"text":"但是我想我們還是來討論一下第一個我剛剛講到說我們的老師的部分大概還有700多個老師透過高階人力躍升平台的這個協助其實不大那另外透過私校獎補助就是說我們希望現在現有的私校可以去聘任"},{"start":500.868,"end":513.294,"text":"那從退場學校出來的這些老師們那我們給他講補助我請教一下目前有多少退場的這些學校的老師有透過私校講補助被別的私校來聘任的有多少"},{"start":515.77,"end":527.155,"text":"委員通常給我的資料是10位10位好部長這個數字我跟你講其實真的很可怕你這個數字是從109年有學校開始退場以後就開始計算那到現在為止我們整個退場的學校的老師有404位那扣掉221位是待業的"},{"start":538.08,"end":542.162,"text":"總共只有6個學校申請執聘了10個老師可見私校獎補助這個對我們現在退場的老師的幫助真的非常的低所以部長我想要請教您我們現在對於這些退場的學校老師跟教職人的權益你要怎麼去維護"},{"start":562.03,"end":579.105,"text":"跟委員報告如果當然為什麼成立基金就是說當他要離退的時候不要讓學校老師都領不到任何憂離憂退的這些相關的資源有基金直接代付代電這個是第一個做法那第二個剛才委員一直關心也是教育部當然這個我說難度蠻高因為多數的學校都面對同樣的問題其實這些年是很少學校在擴大"},{"start":585.35,"end":589.013,"text":"所以部長我跟你說這些退場學校的教職員要進國立學校是非常難的私立學校有很多的自身難保所以問題我們兩間都點出來了希望520你要卸任之前再去思考一下怎麼樣來協助這些退場學校的老師們好不好"},{"start":604.467,"end":611.951,"text":"最後10秒鐘可能再多一點點我要跟你討論我們現在大漢技術學院的退場因為我的時間不夠我只能把問題提出來會後跟我回覆一下我們看起來現在大漢其實他學校體質是無餘的可是因為我們私校退場條例非常嚴苛他很擔心他以後的校產會被充公所以現在看起來有一點點惡意用私校法那麼自己就去退場了"},{"start":629.941,"end":639.066,"text":"所以我想我們是不是在他申請之後我們還是要去嚴審一下現在到底如果說這個體制是健全的學校用私校法來去退場跟體制不健全的學校被私校退場條例去退場這兩者之間我覺得教育部要嚴格掌控一下尤其是因為你們私校退場條例訂得太嚴苛了那現在會不會會不會有學校因為擔心後續他如果變獄警或專輔以後校產完全被沒收所以提早"},{"start":658.916,"end":662.759,"text":"我們在詳細資料再跟委員報告就是說因為他們校內的程序等等都還在進行中他也還沒提出正式停辦的計畫那如果提出來教育部也有一個嚴謹的審查過程"},{"start":684.395,"end":686.219,"text":"為了施政的權益這個案子一定要嚴審"}]}}}}