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00:01:01,230\n本席認為這樣的一個見解很正常也符合\n\n5\n00:01:26,278 --> 00:01:41,672\n在研發生產成本的一個規律但最後結果卻完全相反所以這就是我們國人所看待為什麼在這樣的一個立場\n\n6\n00:01:42,773 --> 00:01:44,074\n部長,你來說明一下好不好\n\n7\n00:02:08,354 --> 00:02:33,505\n剛剛在這個會議當中有消防委員主委先進做報告這當中不是光是造建一般來講的話有的成品出來後面就量產就源源不斷當然按照這種觀念來講的話它也並沒有錯因為這是同樣東西但我們因為第一次做有些設施配備第二次造建以後這些設施配備不見得是足夠的\n\n8\n00:02:34,525 --> 00:02:55,697\n所以這個議案我比較一個中算以後可能也期望一定要比原來的價格要低但是呢這整體的花費絕對不是像一般講這個多少億除以7這個降的話是真的是有限公餘但委員那邊需要更詳細資料我還是可以派專人再去跟委員做消息\n\n9\n00:02:56,357 --> 00:02:56,817\n這是我們國人所質疑的問題\n\n10\n00:03:17,310 --> 00:03:36,316\n國造潛艦目前第一艘海坤艦都還沒有下水來做運行的一個測試所以你說一下子後續我們後艦的一個建造我就本身有一點疑問什麼疑問有關於國艦國造後艦\n\n11\n00:03:42,011 --> 00:03:56,252\n的建造的規劃國防部本來有什麼想法以下有幾個我想部長你待會我提的這三樣你能不能回答一樣\n\n12\n00:03:57,133 --> 00:04:13,781\n你們當初的見解第一個當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍後觀察海昆艦效能一段時間後再說第二海昆艦交付海軍後\n\n13\n00:04:15,161 --> 00:04:36,590\n隨即編列預算建造後續建．第三,早已設計早就是要提交後建一次編組預算．一次建造．哪一項是你們國防部的意見?我跟委員報告這沒有哪一項定案的因為任何這些出來的油它一定要經過檢測這檢測是哪些單位來檢測使用單位還有這些專業人員一樣一樣過濾完\n\n14\n00:05:02,938 --> 00:05:03,539\n從我們海昆艦的建造\n\n15\n00:05:18,206 --> 00:05:40,355\n我相信你們是站在第一個想法當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍之後觀察海軍這個海昆艦的效能有沒有一定達到他的效能跟效力還有他的攻擊力這是我相信你們國防部應該是這一項為什麼\n\n16\n00:05:42,989 --> 00:06:10,907\n賴清的準總統聽了一次的機密簡報之後就直接的對潛艦國造嚇直到齊這種草率的心態對國清真的好嗎另外現在的海昆艦連試海運試都還沒有先進行這種的射箭後把後劃把的指令國清真的可以接受嗎\n\n17\n00:06:12,078 --> 00:06:35,874\n我跟委員報告真的我覺得不是因為聽了某句話就下一個決心國機國造國境國造目的在哪裡一方面促進我們戰力再一方面也促進我們國內國防工業的一個同步的進步我想這是一個長久考量出來的絕對不是一個臨機的我建議說哎呀不行不行就拉倒了不是這樣子\n\n18\n00:06:36,374 --> 00:06:37,455\n如果早就有這個目標,也應該在海昆艦的建造之後\n\n19\n00:07:03,451 --> 00:07:23,290\n應該不是我們賴清德準總統提出後續七建造一次建造完成你們應該在海昆建造的之後你們提出可行性的報告不是就不就是要這樣子嗎因為你們當初就沒有這個訂建\n\n20\n00:07:24,611 --> 00:07:40,060\n才會有後續今天賴清的第一次聽到簡報之後一次照完這樣的一個合理嗎推論我們用推論來去看待這個事情部長你再回到一次\n\n21\n00:07:41,020 --> 00:07:57,050\n我跟委員報告加上用推論的話那我推我自己我當初一聽到這種國機國造國艦國造我是興奮的不得了因為我從年輕就期望我們國家國軍所使用裝備都我們自己生產出來的\n\n22\n00:07:58,331 --> 00:08:13,766\n我對我來講的話那是我的定論所以想說你要推人家定論我不去做臆測但我跟委員報告我的推論如此何況我們在做當中但是期望歸期望但步驟不能亂\n\n23\n00:08:14,807 --> 00:08:29,446\n所以一定是一步一腳印的所以這個目標是我絕對不可能講我今天可以啊變成多少艘不會這樣子的這我跟委員報告要我講的話我不幫別人去做一個說明但我覺得這整個過程\n\n24\n00:08:30,808 --> 00:08:32,950\n今天我講的這個是一個國人的一個疑問因為我們在國艦國造後建之後\n\n25\n00:08:59,428 --> 00:09:17,167\n這個預算的編列的增加對我們整個國防的預算來講絕對是非常的可觀而且承載了這樣的一個壓力所以今天我們要講的是我們回歸到如果國艦國造的七艘的後艦的狀況舒子穎講的所長\n\n26\n00:09:21,631 --> 00:09:39,037\n他是一個你們智庫裡面最高的一個學者而且他提出的這個概念應該符合常規啊對不對而不是我們看一下後面的數字裡面是400多億所以今天國人為什麼很多對這個國艦國造的疑問就在這裡啊部長\n\n27\n00:09:43,137 --> 00:09:58,783\n我瞭解啊,就是說所以我跟海靖文同仁講的這個就我們要想辦法說明但目前有困難的原因在哪裡?第一個,整體預算多少還未定一個概估第二個,這預算一編裁以後絕對不是把這個預算除以\n\n28\n00:09:59,855 --> 00:10:01,796\n我希望你把你詳細的這一個報告的後期的後見\n\n29\n00:10:26,848 --> 00:10:44,499\n如果評估起來是以舒子怡所提出的是不是你們也可以朝這個方向提供給我一個資料那另外就是我們講說昨天前天那個報紙黃淑光辭棄了潛艦國造的召集人然後改\n\n30\n00:10:45,419 --> 00:10:55,082\n改為現在的先進國防辦公室當然我們不是說黃淑光將來會接這個職位這個是一個臆測未來可能部長是不是接這個先進國造的辦公室的\n\n31\n00:11:07,845 --> 00:11:13,528\n我跟委員講兩點很簡單的第一個國軍幹部我所了解的是包含現階的沒有人在求官的我們很清楚這官方你求來的\n\n32\n00:11:30,515 --> 00:11:33,777\n我並沒有指你喔是未來的國防部長今天會弄一個先進國防事務辦公室這個是不是顧名思義就是部長要擴前\n\n33\n00:11:51,269 --> 00:12:19,025\n沒有我跟委員報告就這個什麼辦公室我跟委員報告我從來沒有聽過真的傳明剛才在外媒體有問我我想我真的一無所知所以我不想答覆不答覆的問題我想這就是一個知識體所以你不要你不要你不要承攬這樣的一個任務我沒有要承攬因為我根本就不知道這件事情預告預告未來部長的權力是不是擴充到這樣的無限\n\n34\n00:12:21,107 --> 00:12:31,682\n對我們整個國防跟國防的軍事確實會有相當的影響以上部長是謝謝委員謝謝\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n790\t10724\t有請邱部長請邱部長部長好 防衛員好\n12762\t31586\t我延續剛剛楚英委員所提的對於前艦後艦的建造的預算不管是媒體或是國人所看待的一個預算未來繼續建造7艘這個7艘裡面就是總預算2800多億2800多億\n38604\t58643\t那當然我們就引述為引述我們國防部的智庫國防安全研究院的重量級的學者蘇紫雲所長之前所說的第一艘潛艦造架包含廠房\n59650\t61230\t本席認為這樣的一個見解很正常也符合\n86278\t101672\t在研發生產成本的一個規律但最後結果卻完全相反所以這就是我們國人所看待為什麼在這樣的一個立場\n102773\t104074\t部長,你來說明一下好不好\n128354\t153505\t剛剛在這個會議當中有消防委員主委先進做報告這當中不是光是造建一般來講的話有的成品出來後面就量產就源源不斷當然按照這種觀念來講的話它也並沒有錯因為這是同樣東西但我們因為第一次做有些設施配備第二次造建以後這些設施配備不見得是足夠的\n154525\t175697\t所以這個議案我比較一個中算以後可能也期望一定要比原來的價格要低但是呢這整體的花費絕對不是像一般講這個多少億除以7這個降的話是真的是有限公餘但委員那邊需要更詳細資料我還是可以派專人再去跟委員做消息\n176357\t176817\t這是我們國人所質疑的問題\n197310\t216316\t國造潛艦目前第一艘海坤艦都還沒有下水來做運行的一個測試所以你說一下子後續我們後艦的一個建造我就本身有一點疑問什麼疑問有關於國艦國造後艦\n222011\t236252\t的建造的規劃國防部本來有什麼想法以下有幾個我想部長你待會我提的這三樣你能不能回答一樣\n237133\t253781\t你們當初的見解第一個當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍後觀察海昆艦效能一段時間後再說第二海昆艦交付海軍後\n255161\t276590\t隨即編列預算建造後續建．第三,早已設計早就是要提交後建一次編組預算．一次建造．哪一項是你們國防部的意見?我跟委員報告這沒有哪一項定案的因為任何這些出來的油它一定要經過檢測這檢測是哪些單位來檢測使用單位還有這些專業人員一樣一樣過濾完\n281852\t302858\t﹗\n302938\t303539\t從我們海昆艦的建造\n318206\t340355\t我相信你們是站在第一個想法當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍之後觀察海軍這個海昆艦的效能有沒有一定達到他的效能跟效力還有他的攻擊力這是我相信你們國防部應該是這一項為什麼\n342989\t370907\t賴清的準總統聽了一次的機密簡報之後就直接的對潛艦國造嚇直到齊這種草率的心態對國清真的好嗎另外現在的海昆艦連試海運試都還沒有先進行這種的射箭後把後劃把的指令國清真的可以接受嗎\n372078\t395874\t我跟委員報告真的我覺得不是因為聽了某句話就下一個決心國機國造國境國造目的在哪裡一方面促進我們戰力再一方面也促進我們國內國防工業的一個同步的進步我想這是一個長久考量出來的絕對不是一個臨機的我建議說哎呀不行不行就拉倒了不是這樣子\n396374\t397455\t如果早就有這個目標,也應該在海昆艦的建造之後\n423451\t443290\t應該不是我們賴清德準總統提出後續七建造一次建造完成你們應該在海昆建造的之後你們提出可行性的報告不是就不就是要這樣子嗎因為你們當初就沒有這個訂建\n444611\t460060\t才會有後續今天賴清的第一次聽到簡報之後一次照完這樣的一個合理嗎推論我們用推論來去看待這個事情部長你再回到一次\n461020\t477050\t我跟委員報告加上用推論的話那我推我自己我當初一聽到這種國機國造國艦國造我是興奮的不得了因為我從年輕就期望我們國家國軍所使用裝備都我們自己生產出來的\n478331\t493766\t我對我來講的話那是我的定論所以想說你要推人家定論我不去做臆測但我跟委員報告我的推論如此何況我們在做當中但是期望歸期望但步驟不能亂\n494807\t509446\t所以一定是一步一腳印的所以這個目標是我絕對不可能講我今天可以啊變成多少艘不會這樣子的這我跟委員報告要我講的話我不幫別人去做一個說明但我覺得這整個過程\n510808\t512950\t今天我講的這個是一個國人的一個疑問因為我們在國艦國造後建之後\n539428\t557167\t這個預算的編列的增加對我們整個國防的預算來講絕對是非常的可觀而且承載了這樣的一個壓力所以今天我們要講的是我們回歸到如果國艦國造的七艘的後艦的狀況舒子穎講的所長\n561631\t579037\t他是一個你們智庫裡面最高的一個學者而且他提出的這個概念應該符合常規啊對不對而不是我們看一下後面的數字裡面是400多億所以今天國人為什麼很多對這個國艦國造的疑問就在這裡啊部長\n583137\t598783\t我瞭解啊,就是說所以我跟海靖文同仁講的這個就我們要想辦法說明但目前有困難的原因在哪裡?第一個,整體預算多少還未定一個概估第二個,這預算一編裁以後絕對不是把這個預算除以\n599855\t601796\t我希望你把你詳細的這一個報告的後期的後見\n626848\t644499\t如果評估起來是以舒子怡所提出的是不是你們也可以朝這個方向提供給我一個資料那另外就是我們講說昨天前天那個報紙黃淑光辭棄了潛艦國造的召集人然後改\n645419\t655082\t改為現在的先進國防辦公室當然我們不是說黃淑光將來會接這個職位這個是一個臆測未來可能部長是不是接這個先進國造的辦公室的\n667845\t673528\t我跟委員講兩點很簡單的第一個國軍幹部我所了解的是包含現階的沒有人在求官的我們很清楚這官方你求來的\n690515\t693777\t我並沒有指你喔是未來的國防部長今天會弄一個先進國防事務辦公室這個是不是顧名思義就是部長要擴前\n711269\t739025\t沒有我跟委員報告就這個什麼辦公室我跟委員報告我從來沒有聽過真的傳明剛才在外媒體有問我我想我真的一無所知所以我不想答覆不答覆的問題我想這就是一個知識體所以你不要你不要你不要承攬這樣的一個任務我沒有要承攬因為我根本就不知道這件事情預告預告未來部長的權力是不是擴充到這樣的無限\n741107\t751682\t對我們整個國防跟國防的軍事確實會有相當的影響以上部長是謝謝委員謝謝\n","txt":"有請邱部長請邱部長部長好 防衛員好\n我延續剛剛楚英委員所提的對於前艦後艦的建造的預算不管是媒體或是國人所看待的一個預算未來繼續建造7艘這個7艘裡面就是總預算2800多億2800多億\n那當然我們就引述為引述我們國防部的智庫國防安全研究院的重量級的學者蘇紫雲所長之前所說的第一艘潛艦造架包含廠房\n本席認為這樣的一個見解很正常也符合\n在研發生產成本的一個規律但最後結果卻完全相反所以這就是我們國人所看待為什麼在這樣的一個立場\n部長,你來說明一下好不好\n剛剛在這個會議當中有消防委員主委先進做報告這當中不是光是造建一般來講的話有的成品出來後面就量產就源源不斷當然按照這種觀念來講的話它也並沒有錯因為這是同樣東西但我們因為第一次做有些設施配備第二次造建以後這些設施配備不見得是足夠的\n所以這個議案我比較一個中算以後可能也期望一定要比原來的價格要低但是呢這整體的花費絕對不是像一般講這個多少億除以7這個降的話是真的是有限公餘但委員那邊需要更詳細資料我還是可以派專人再去跟委員做消息\n這是我們國人所質疑的問題\n國造潛艦目前第一艘海坤艦都還沒有下水來做運行的一個測試所以你說一下子後續我們後艦的一個建造我就本身有一點疑問什麼疑問有關於國艦國造後艦\n的建造的規劃國防部本來有什麼想法以下有幾個我想部長你待會我提的這三樣你能不能回答一樣\n你們當初的見解第一個當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍後觀察海昆艦效能一段時間後再說第二海昆艦交付海軍後\n隨即編列預算建造後續建．第三,早已設計早就是要提交後建一次編組預算．一次建造．哪一項是你們國防部的意見?我跟委員報告這沒有哪一項定案的因為任何這些出來的油它一定要經過檢測這檢測是哪些單位來檢測使用單位還有這些專業人員一樣一樣過濾完\n﹗\n從我們海昆艦的建造\n我相信你們是站在第一個想法當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍之後觀察海軍這個海昆艦的效能有沒有一定達到他的效能跟效力還有他的攻擊力這是我相信你們國防部應該是這一項為什麼\n賴清的準總統聽了一次的機密簡報之後就直接的對潛艦國造嚇直到齊這種草率的心態對國清真的好嗎另外現在的海昆艦連試海運試都還沒有先進行這種的射箭後把後劃把的指令國清真的可以接受嗎\n我跟委員報告真的我覺得不是因為聽了某句話就下一個決心國機國造國境國造目的在哪裡一方面促進我們戰力再一方面也促進我們國內國防工業的一個同步的進步我想這是一個長久考量出來的絕對不是一個臨機的我建議說哎呀不行不行就拉倒了不是這樣子\n如果早就有這個目標,也應該在海昆艦的建造之後\n應該不是我們賴清德準總統提出後續七建造一次建造完成你們應該在海昆建造的之後你們提出可行性的報告不是就不就是要這樣子嗎因為你們當初就沒有這個訂建\n才會有後續今天賴清的第一次聽到簡報之後一次照完這樣的一個合理嗎推論我們用推論來去看待這個事情部長你再回到一次\n我跟委員報告加上用推論的話那我推我自己我當初一聽到這種國機國造國艦國造我是興奮的不得了因為我從年輕就期望我們國家國軍所使用裝備都我們自己生產出來的\n我對我來講的話那是我的定論所以想說你要推人家定論我不去做臆測但我跟委員報告我的推論如此何況我們在做當中但是期望歸期望但步驟不能亂\n所以一定是一步一腳印的所以這個目標是我絕對不可能講我今天可以啊變成多少艘不會這樣子的這我跟委員報告要我講的話我不幫別人去做一個說明但我覺得這整個過程\n今天我講的這個是一個國人的一個疑問因為我們在國艦國造後建之後\n這個預算的編列的增加對我們整個國防的預算來講絕對是非常的可觀而且承載了這樣的一個壓力所以今天我們要講的是我們回歸到如果國艦國造的七艘的後艦的狀況舒子穎講的所長\n他是一個你們智庫裡面最高的一個學者而且他提出的這個概念應該符合常規啊對不對而不是我們看一下後面的數字裡面是400多億所以今天國人為什麼很多對這個國艦國造的疑問就在這裡啊部長\n我瞭解啊,就是說所以我跟海靖文同仁講的這個就我們要想辦法說明但目前有困難的原因在哪裡?第一個,整體預算多少還未定一個概估第二個,這預算一編裁以後絕對不是把這個預算除以\n我希望你把你詳細的這一個報告的後期的後見\n如果評估起來是以舒子怡所提出的是不是你們也可以朝這個方向提供給我一個資料那另外就是我們講說昨天前天那個報紙黃淑光辭棄了潛艦國造的召集人然後改\n改為現在的先進國防辦公室當然我們不是說黃淑光將來會接這個職位這個是一個臆測未來可能部長是不是接這個先進國造的辦公室的\n我跟委員講兩點很簡單的第一個國軍幹部我所了解的是包含現階的沒有人在求官的我們很清楚這官方你求來的\n我並沒有指你喔是未來的國防部長今天會弄一個先進國防事務辦公室這個是不是顧名思義就是部長要擴前\n沒有我跟委員報告就這個什麼辦公室我跟委員報告我從來沒有聽過真的傳明剛才在外媒體有問我我想我真的一無所知所以我不想答覆不答覆的問題我想這就是一個知識體所以你不要你不要你不要承攬這樣的一個任務我沒有要承攬因為我根本就不知道這件事情預告預告未來部長的權力是不是擴充到這樣的無限\n對我們整個國防跟國防的軍事確實會有相當的影響以上部長是謝謝委員謝謝\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.790 --> 00:10.724\n有請邱部長請邱部長部長好防衛員好\n\n00:12.762 --> 00:31.586\n我延續剛剛楚英委員所提的對於前艦後艦的建造的預算不管是媒體或是國人所看待的一個預算未來繼續建造7艘這個7艘裡面就是總預算2800多億2800多億\n\n00:38.604 --> 00:58.643\n那當然我們就引述為引述我們國防部的智庫國防安全研究院的重量級的學者蘇紫雲所長之前所說的第一艘潛艦造架包含廠房\n\n00:59.650 --> 01:01.230\n本席認為這樣的一個見解很正常也符合\n\n01:26.278 --> 01:41.672\n在研發生產成本的一個規律但最後結果卻完全相反所以這就是我們國人所看待為什麼在這樣的一個立場\n\n01:42.773 --> 01:44.074\n部長,你來說明一下好不好\n\n02:08.354 --> 02:33.505\n剛剛在這個會議當中有消防委員主委先進做報告這當中不是光是造建一般來講的話有的成品出來後面就量產就源源不斷當然按照這種觀念來講的話它也並沒有錯因為這是同樣東西但我們因為第一次做有些設施配備第二次造建以後這些設施配備不見得是足夠的\n\n02:34.525 --> 02:55.697\n所以這個議案我比較一個中算以後可能也期望一定要比原來的價格要低但是呢這整體的花費絕對不是像一般講這個多少億除以7這個降的話是真的是有限公餘但委員那邊需要更詳細資料我還是可以派專人再去跟委員做消息\n\n02:56.357 --> 02:56.817\n這是我們國人所質疑的問題\n\n03:17.310 --> 03:36.316\n國造潛艦目前第一艘海坤艦都還沒有下水來做運行的一個測試所以你說一下子後續我們後艦的一個建造我就本身有一點疑問什麼疑問有關於國艦國造後艦\n\n03:42.011 --> 03:56.252\n的建造的規劃國防部本來有什麼想法以下有幾個我想部長你待會我提的這三樣你能不能回答一樣\n\n03:57.133 --> 04:13.781\n你們當初的見解第一個當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍後觀察海昆艦效能一段時間後再說第二海昆艦交付海軍後\n\n04:15.161 --> 04:36.590\n隨即編列預算建造後續建．第三,早已設計早就是要提交後建一次編組預算．一次建造．哪一項是你們國防部的意見?我跟委員報告這沒有哪一項定案的因為任何這些出來的油它一定要經過檢測這檢測是哪些單位來檢測使用單位還有這些專業人員一樣一樣過濾完\n\n05:02.938 --> 05:03.539\n從我們海昆艦的建造\n\n05:18.206 --> 05:40.355\n我相信你們是站在第一個想法當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍之後觀察海軍這個海昆艦的效能有沒有一定達到他的效能跟效力還有他的攻擊力這是我相信你們國防部應該是這一項為什麼\n\n05:42.989 --> 06:10.907\n賴清的準總統聽了一次的機密簡報之後就直接的對潛艦國造嚇直到齊這種草率的心態對國清真的好嗎另外現在的海昆艦連試海運試都還沒有先進行這種的射箭後把後劃把的指令國清真的可以接受嗎\n\n06:12.078 --> 06:35.874\n我跟委員報告真的我覺得不是因為聽了某句話就下一個決心國機國造國境國造目的在哪裡一方面促進我們戰力再一方面也促進我們國內國防工業的一個同步的進步我想這是一個長久考量出來的絕對不是一個臨機的我建議說哎呀不行不行就拉倒了不是這樣子\n\n06:36.374 --> 06:37.455\n如果早就有這個目標,也應該在海昆艦的建造之後\n\n07:03.451 --> 07:23.290\n應該不是我們賴清德準總統提出後續七建造一次建造完成你們應該在海昆建造的之後你們提出可行性的報告不是就不就是要這樣子嗎因為你們當初就沒有這個訂建\n\n07:24.611 --> 07:40.060\n才會有後續今天賴清的第一次聽到簡報之後一次照完這樣的一個合理嗎推論我們用推論來去看待這個事情部長你再回到一次\n\n07:41.020 --> 07:57.050\n我跟委員報告加上用推論的話那我推我自己我當初一聽到這種國機國造國艦國造我是興奮的不得了因為我從年輕就期望我們國家國軍所使用裝備都我們自己生產出來的\n\n07:58.331 --> 08:13.766\n我對我來講的話那是我的定論所以想說你要推人家定論我不去做臆測但我跟委員報告我的推論如此何況我們在做當中但是期望歸期望但步驟不能亂\n\n08:14.807 --> 08:29.446\n所以一定是一步一腳印的所以這個目標是我絕對不可能講我今天可以啊變成多少艘不會這樣子的這我跟委員報告要我講的話我不幫別人去做一個說明但我覺得這整個過程\n\n08:30.808 --> 08:32.950\n今天我講的這個是一個國人的一個疑問因為我們在國艦國造後建之後\n\n08:59.428 --> 09:17.167\n這個預算的編列的增加對我們整個國防的預算來講絕對是非常的可觀而且承載了這樣的一個壓力所以今天我們要講的是我們回歸到如果國艦國造的七艘的後艦的狀況舒子穎講的所長\n\n09:21.631 --> 09:39.037\n他是一個你們智庫裡面最高的一個學者而且他提出的這個概念應該符合常規啊對不對而不是我們看一下後面的數字裡面是400多億所以今天國人為什麼很多對這個國艦國造的疑問就在這裡啊部長\n\n09:43.137 --> 09:58.783\n我瞭解啊,就是說所以我跟海靖文同仁講的這個就我們要想辦法說明但目前有困難的原因在哪裡?第一個,整體預算多少還未定一個概估第二個,這預算一編裁以後絕對不是把這個預算除以\n\n09:59.855 --> 10:01.796\n我希望你把你詳細的這一個報告的後期的後見\n\n10:26.848 --> 10:44.499\n如果評估起來是以舒子怡所提出的是不是你們也可以朝這個方向提供給我一個資料那另外就是我們講說昨天前天那個報紙黃淑光辭棄了潛艦國造的召集人然後改\n\n10:45.419 --> 10:55.082\n改為現在的先進國防辦公室當然我們不是說黃淑光將來會接這個職位這個是一個臆測未來可能部長是不是接這個先進國造的辦公室的\n\n11:07.845 --> 11:13.528\n我跟委員講兩點很簡單的第一個國軍幹部我所了解的是包含現階的沒有人在求官的我們很清楚這官方你求來的\n\n11:30.515 --> 11:33.777\n我並沒有指你喔是未來的國防部長今天會弄一個先進國防事務辦公室這個是不是顧名思義就是部長要擴前\n\n11:51.269 --> 12:19.025\n沒有我跟委員報告就這個什麼辦公室我跟委員報告我從來沒有聽過真的傳明剛才在外媒體有問我我想我真的一無所知所以我不想答覆不答覆的問題我想這就是一個知識體所以你不要你不要你不要承攬這樣的一個任務我沒有要承攬因為我根本就不知道這件事情預告預告未來部長的權力是不是擴充到這樣的無限\n\n12:21.107 --> 12:31.682\n對我們整個國防跟國防的軍事確實會有相當的影響以上部長是謝謝委員謝謝\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.79,"end":10.724,"text":"有請邱部長請邱部長部長好 防衛員好"},{"start":12.762,"end":31.586,"text":"我延續剛剛楚英委員所提的對於前艦後艦的建造的預算不管是媒體或是國人所看待的一個預算未來繼續建造7艘這個7艘裡面就是總預算2800多億2800多億"},{"start":38.604,"end":58.643,"text":"那當然我們就引述為引述我們國防部的智庫國防安全研究院的重量級的學者蘇紫雲所長之前所說的第一艘潛艦造架包含廠房"},{"start":59.65,"end":61.23,"text":"本席認為這樣的一個見解很正常也符合"},{"start":86.278,"end":101.672,"text":"在研發生產成本的一個規律但最後結果卻完全相反所以這就是我們國人所看待為什麼在這樣的一個立場"},{"start":102.773,"end":104.074,"text":"部長,你來說明一下好不好"},{"start":128.354,"end":153.505,"text":"剛剛在這個會議當中有消防委員主委先進做報告這當中不是光是造建一般來講的話有的成品出來後面就量產就源源不斷當然按照這種觀念來講的話它也並沒有錯因為這是同樣東西但我們因為第一次做有些設施配備第二次造建以後這些設施配備不見得是足夠的"},{"start":154.525,"end":175.697,"text":"所以這個議案我比較一個中算以後可能也期望一定要比原來的價格要低但是呢這整體的花費絕對不是像一般講這個多少億除以7這個降的話是真的是有限公餘但委員那邊需要更詳細資料我還是可以派專人再去跟委員做消息"},{"start":176.357,"end":176.817,"text":"這是我們國人所質疑的問題"},{"start":197.31,"end":216.316,"text":"國造潛艦目前第一艘海坤艦都還沒有下水來做運行的一個測試所以你說一下子後續我們後艦的一個建造我就本身有一點疑問什麼疑問有關於國艦國造後艦"},{"start":222.011,"end":236.252,"text":"的建造的規劃國防部本來有什麼想法以下有幾個我想部長你待會我提的這三樣你能不能回答一樣"},{"start":237.133,"end":253.781,"text":"你們當初的見解第一個當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍後觀察海昆艦效能一段時間後再說第二海昆艦交付海軍後"},{"start":255.161,"end":276.59,"text":"隨即編列預算建造後續建．第三,早已設計早就是要提交後建一次編組預算．一次建造．哪一項是你們國防部的意見?我跟委員報告這沒有哪一項定案的因為任何這些出來的油它一定要經過檢測這檢測是哪些單位來檢測使用單位還有這些專業人員一樣一樣過濾完"},{"start":281.852,"end":302.858,"text":"﹗"},{"start":302.938,"end":303.539,"text":"從我們海昆艦的建造"},{"start":318.206,"end":340.355,"text":"我相信你們是站在第一個想法當時沒有定見打算先看海昆艦交付海軍之後觀察海軍這個海昆艦的效能有沒有一定達到他的效能跟效力還有他的攻擊力這是我相信你們國防部應該是這一項為什麼"},{"start":342.989,"end":370.907,"text":"賴清的準總統聽了一次的機密簡報之後就直接的對潛艦國造嚇直到齊這種草率的心態對國清真的好嗎另外現在的海昆艦連試海運試都還沒有先進行這種的射箭後把後劃把的指令國清真的可以接受嗎"},{"start":372.078,"end":395.874,"text":"我跟委員報告真的我覺得不是因為聽了某句話就下一個決心國機國造國境國造目的在哪裡一方面促進我們戰力再一方面也促進我們國內國防工業的一個同步的進步我想這是一個長久考量出來的絕對不是一個臨機的我建議說哎呀不行不行就拉倒了不是這樣子"},{"start":396.374,"end":397.455,"text":"如果早就有這個目標,也應該在海昆艦的建造之後"},{"start":423.451,"end":443.29,"text":"應該不是我們賴清德準總統提出後續七建造一次建造完成你們應該在海昆建造的之後你們提出可行性的報告不是就不就是要這樣子嗎因為你們當初就沒有這個訂建"},{"start":444.611,"end":460.06,"text":"才會有後續今天賴清的第一次聽到簡報之後一次照完這樣的一個合理嗎推論我們用推論來去看待這個事情部長你再回到一次"},{"start":461.02,"end":477.05,"text":"我跟委員報告加上用推論的話那我推我自己我當初一聽到這種國機國造國艦國造我是興奮的不得了因為我從年輕就期望我們國家國軍所使用裝備都我們自己生產出來的"},{"start":478.331,"end":493.766,"text":"我對我來講的話那是我的定論所以想說你要推人家定論我不去做臆測但我跟委員報告我的推論如此何況我們在做當中但是期望歸期望但步驟不能亂"},{"start":494.807,"end":509.446,"text":"所以一定是一步一腳印的所以這個目標是我絕對不可能講我今天可以啊變成多少艘不會這樣子的這我跟委員報告要我講的話我不幫別人去做一個說明但我覺得這整個過程"},{"start":510.808,"end":512.95,"text":"今天我講的這個是一個國人的一個疑問因為我們在國艦國造後建之後"},{"start":539.428,"end":557.167,"text":"這個預算的編列的增加對我們整個國防的預算來講絕對是非常的可觀而且承載了這樣的一個壓力所以今天我們要講的是我們回歸到如果國艦國造的七艘的後艦的狀況舒子穎講的所長"},{"start":561.631,"end":579.037,"text":"他是一個你們智庫裡面最高的一個學者而且他提出的這個概念應該符合常規啊對不對而不是我們看一下後面的數字裡面是400多億所以今天國人為什麼很多對這個國艦國造的疑問就在這裡啊部長"},{"start":583.137,"end":598.783,"text":"我瞭解啊,就是說所以我跟海靖文同仁講的這個就我們要想辦法說明但目前有困難的原因在哪裡?第一個,整體預算多少還未定一個概估第二個,這預算一編裁以後絕對不是把這個預算除以"},{"start":599.855,"end":601.796,"text":"我希望你把你詳細的這一個報告的後期的後見"},{"start":626.848,"end":644.499,"text":"如果評估起來是以舒子怡所提出的是不是你們也可以朝這個方向提供給我一個資料那另外就是我們講說昨天前天那個報紙黃淑光辭棄了潛艦國造的召集人然後改"},{"start":645.419,"end":655.082,"text":"改為現在的先進國防辦公室當然我們不是說黃淑光將來會接這個職位這個是一個臆測未來可能部長是不是接這個先進國造的辦公室的"},{"start":667.845,"end":673.528,"text":"我跟委員講兩點很簡單的第一個國軍幹部我所了解的是包含現階的沒有人在求官的我們很清楚這官方你求來的"},{"start":690.515,"end":693.777,"text":"我並沒有指你喔是未來的國防部長今天會弄一個先進國防事務辦公室這個是不是顧名思義就是部長要擴前"},{"start":711.269,"end":739.025,"text":"沒有我跟委員報告就這個什麼辦公室我跟委員報告我從來沒有聽過真的傳明剛才在外媒體有問我我想我真的一無所知所以我不想答覆不答覆的問題我想這就是一個知識體所以你不要你不要你不要承攬這樣的一個任務我沒有要承攬因為我根本就不知道這件事情預告預告未來部長的權力是不是擴充到這樣的無限"},{"start":741.107,"end":751.682,"text":"對我們整個國防跟國防的軍事確實會有相當的影響以上部長是謝謝委員謝謝"}]}}}}