{"id":151241,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151241","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/cfb4b12132f016276faf2534e0eb08b4b57f63d1b53b7532c5dab72e655c1c9480da92c86ab9bf975ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"涂權吉","委員發言時間":"10:25:38 - 10:37:28","影片長度":"00:11:50","會議時間":"2024-04-17T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第12次全體委員會議（事由：邀請環境部部長、經濟部、行政院國家永續發展委員會就「限塑政策執行成效，及家戶與一般事業廢棄物減量之檢討與策進作為」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n【4月15日及17日二天一次會】）","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第12次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":12,"committees":[26],"id":"委員會-11-1-26-12"},"date":"2024-04-17","duration":710,"end_time":"2024-04-17T10:37:28+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-17T10:25:38+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":617,"blocks":[["涂委員權吉：（10時25分）謝謝主席。麻煩請一下薛部長。"],["主席：請薛部長。"],["邱委員鎮軍：涂委員好。"],["涂委員權吉：薛部長，請問一下一般事業廢棄物減量，也就是大家講的減少家用垃圾，過去像地方政府有推行隨袋徵收，也就是民眾去購買專用垃圾袋，才能把垃圾丟進垃圾車，採取以量計價、減少垃圾製造量的方式，我不知道環境部有沒有針對這個政策進行過檢討評估？"],["薛部長富盛：跟涂委員報告，事實上我們有檢討，因為臺北市率先來實施，根據臺北市的經驗，事實上效果相當好，至少可以減少兩成到三成，現在除了臺北市、新北市也在實施，還有臺中市石岡區，我們的概念基本上是這樣子，分階段、分區域來實施，像桃園也有幾個里，我想涂委員應該也很瞭解，我們也很高興看到桃園市八德區、龜山區有4個里要來推動。所以我們不必再以整個市或者縣，因為那個的確太大，每個地方因地制宜，情況也不一樣，我們就是鼓勵朝這個方向，因為終究要走這個方向。"],["涂委員權吉：在這邊跟薛部長報告一下，其實不是只有減少兩成，針對我們去調查這個報告，臺北市從2000年，從最早的差不多3,000噸，20年過去了，它是每年逐年下降，到現在大概只剩1,000噸，所以它可以達到減量差不多六成，重點是垃圾隨袋徵收有一定相當的效果。"],["薛部長富盛：是，我認同。"],["涂委員權吉：而且顯示從源頭減量有達到非常大的效果，尤其像現在桃園這10年來人口增加幅度非常大，現在已經到兩百三十幾萬人，從2021年來看一般廢棄物的生產量，那個時候是127萬噸，到去年一口氣增加到133萬噸，而且看得出來是成比例一直在增加。目前桃園人也不打算再蓋更多的焚化爐，因為民眾對於空氣污染都是非常反對。民眾不願意興建焚化爐，所以我覺得源頭減量是很重要的，不知道環境部有沒有將此列入重要的政策之一？"],["薛部長富盛：是，這個事實上是我們重要的政策之一，當然我們考量的就是在稍微比較偏鄉的地方這塊的實施上有一些挑戰，所以我們就是找比較都會化的區域，而且當然那個社區或者那個鄰里有自覺，願意來加入隨袋徵收的行列，環境部事實上會給予一些獎勵的措施。"],["涂委員權吉：好，今天本席會提出，主要是因為我們看到這份報告，大概就是簡單的一句話帶過去，好像對隨袋徵收沒有相當重視，我們希望好的政策環境部能夠重視，也希望能夠儘快針對這個評估、推動做出報告，儘快推動好的政策。"],["薛部長富盛：好，謝謝涂委員期許垂詢。"],["涂委員權吉：接下來我們再請部長來看一下大潭電廠排放黑煙的問題，這是民眾陳情出來的，你看一下這個照片，3月30號（3月底）下午3點38分，民眾拍攝到空氣污染、排放黑煙的照片，不知道的人還以為是不是發生事故、發生火災，這個黑煙非常地濃，濃濃的黑煙。然後又再到4月15號，一樣又有民眾拍到排放黑煙，非常嚴重，重點是環保局去稽查，居然說現場及周邊未見濃煙散布，而且最主要這還有發生非常嚴重的巨響達半個小時，可是環保局去稽查居然都說沒有。所以民眾真的覺得不可思議，你看他們都拍下了這些照片、這些證據，而且我們等一下聽一下3公里外震耳欲聾的聲響，我先簡單播放給大家聽一下。","（播放聲音）"],["涂委員權吉：這3公里以外喔！民眾遠遠就可以錄下這個聲響，而且他是看到前面濃煙之後，他去旁邊3公里外還錄到這個震耳欲聾的聲響。針對這一部分，我之前其實有跟部長提過我們桃園觀音大潭電廠還有環科園區空污非常非常地嚴重，而且你看民眾也檢舉，都拍下那麼多照片，然後這個這麼大的聲響，3公里以外都還錄得這麼清楚，不知道到底有沒有改善的方法？"],["薛部長富盛：我跟涂委員報告，我們國家環境研究院現在有發展一個技術，透過光學的方式、科技的方式針對黑煙可以做拍照，然後來分析那裡面到底有沒有一些包括毒化物，以及是不是排放的PM2.5等等有沒有超標，我們來跟……因為正好我們國環院也是在桃園。"],["涂委員權吉：對啊！你剛剛看那個那麼濃的黑煙，你覺得那個空污會標準嗎？"],["薛部長富盛：當然不曉得它只是譬如說一個……就如同我們機車還是汽車，早期啟動的時候開始會突然間冒一個黑煙，瞬時的，接下來就沒了，我不曉得它是持續的還是說……"],["涂委員權吉：所以我希望環境部也跟地方環保局……"],["薛部長富盛：對，跟桃園市政府……"],["涂委員權吉：密切好好地來聯繫一下，因為大潭電廠周邊這些居民他們說如果真的沒辦法改善，希望我們能夠提出遷村的計畫，他說他們反映到覺得已經投降了，而且環保局各單位去都說沒有問題，他說你看這反映到他們覺得已經束手無策。我們也知道大潭電廠這7部機組的排放量就高達933公噸，是我們全桃園最大固定的污染源，而且現在馬上8號機組也要投入。然後桃園大潭電廠也是粒狀污染物的榜首，每年達30萬公噸，甚至超過我們桃園的煉油廠。我知道我們環境部應該有一些科技執法的部分，是不是有建置完善的空氣黑盒子？還是監測、監控，配合無人機，有沒有辦法把這些問題來做一個澈底的改善？"],["薛部長富盛：好，我們來研究看看如何來協助大潭地區大潭電廠排放黑煙的問題，好不好？"],["涂委員權吉：好，這部分希望部長能夠協助來解決，謝謝部長。我想請一下經濟部產業發展署的連署長。"],["薛部長富盛：謝謝涂委員。"],["連署長錦漳：委員好。"],["涂委員權吉：連署長，我請問一下，美商科慕你應該知道吧？你知道這個廠吧！"],["連署長錦漳：是。"],["涂委員權吉：這個外國廠當初要來設廠的時候應該是經過我們經濟部申請登記，對不對？"],["連署長錦漳：如果是外商要來投資要經過我們這邊審查。"],["涂委員權吉：我今天要凸顯一下，因為它在去年7月28號無預警在4天前跟全廠的員工說他們過4天就要關廠。也不知道為什麼這麼急，匆匆忙忙地要去關廠。你看它從2023年8月5號說要開始解僱員工，可是這一連串、這中間，你看2023年10月12號，防火磚砸死2人；然後土壤及地下水檢測報告，又被開罰15萬；後來又因為鹽酸管線破裂，毒死了上萬條的魚，整個大堀溪都被鹽酸嚴重地污染。這一連串的問題，我想瞭解這個工廠歇業申請書，是不是有土壤污染檢測報告提供的必要才能做歇業？"],["連署長錦漳：我跟委員報告，如果是工廠要歇業，要先跟地方政府提出申請，然後根據土污法，因為它只是歇業，沒有要過戶，所以如果它沒有要移轉的時候，土污這一塊是還不用先去做一些檢測證明，因為它只有做歇業。"],["涂委員權吉：好，我這一點凸顯一下，我上次有提過這個工廠歇業申請書，它是針對土污法規範第九條的工廠，如果不在規範內當然不用提供土壤污染檢測報告，可是如果有，同條第一項第二款就規定要提供，可是我不知道為什麼要提這個第三款，說不用提供，等到查到沒有的時候再來開罰。我不知道為什麼要給工廠開這個後門，不用提供這個報告就同意它先歇業？"],["連署長錦漳：這個我要瞭解一下，因為如果我們已經知道它有土壤污染，照理講地方的環保單位就應該要去進行相關的查處，因為這有相關規定是說在什麼條件下要提供這樣的檢測報告或什麼條件下不要，但是如果已經知道的話，我覺得這要處理。"],["涂委員權吉：好，連署長，我希望你們針對這個工廠歇業申請書去瞭解一下。"],["連署長錦漳：好，我們去瞭解。"],["涂委員權吉：我們看起來不知道為什麼要開這個後門。"],["連署長錦漳：好。"],["涂委員權吉：然後你看這個美商科慕造成地方這麼嚴重的影響，我們不希望外商公司來這邊賺到錢、土地賣一賣就跑掉，我們不希望RCA的事件再度重演，打跨國官司等於是不可能的任務，而且勞民傷財，希望我們經濟部在第一時間內……"],["連署長錦漳：我們瞭解完之後再跟委員報告。"],["涂委員權吉：對，希望第一時間能夠重視這個問題，來把關，不要等到問題造成再來亡羊補牢。"],["連署長錦漳：好，我們瞭解完再跟委員報告。"],["涂委員權吉：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝涂委員的質詢。","接下來我們請王正旭委員進行質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":422,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-26-12","speakers":["王育敏","陳菁徽","陳昭姿","林月琴","廖偉翔","盧縣一","邱鎮軍","涂權吉","王正旭","陳瑩","牛煦庭","鄭天財Sra 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686.473, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"詢\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:11,179 --> 00:00:19,527\n好,謝謝主席。那麻煩請一下我們的薛部長。好,請薛部長。好,圖文好。\n\n2\n00:00:20,387 --> 00:00:38,853\n好,薛部長請問一下這個我們一般事業廢棄物減量也就是我們大家講的減少家用垃圾那過去我們向地方政府有推行隨袋徵收也就是民眾去購買專用的垃圾袋才能把這個垃圾丟進垃圾車採取\n\n3\n00:00:41,354 --> 00:00:47,470\n以量計價減少垃圾製造量的方式那這一部分我不知道環境部有沒有針對這個政策進行過檢討評估\n\n4\n00:00:51,105 --> 00:01:18,731\n跟涂權報告事實上我們有檢討因為台北市率先來實施根據台北市的經驗事實上效果也相當好至少可以減少到兩成到三成所以除了現在台北市新北市也在實施台中市的石鋼區我們的概念基本上是這樣子分階段分區域來實施所以像桃園也有幾個里我想涂權應該也很了解那我們也很高興看到桃園市的八德區\n\n5\n00:01:20,212 --> 00:01:42,393\n規篩區有4個里要來推動所以我們不必再以整個市或者縣因為那個的確太大每個地方因地制宜情況也不一樣那我們就是來鼓勵朝這個方向因為這個終究要走這個方向好薛部長在這邊跟薛部長報告一下其實他不是只有減少兩成那針對我們去調查這個報告台北市\n\n6\n00:01:43,053 --> 00:01:43,073\n韓國瑜\n\n7\n00:02:00,287 --> 00:02:16,201\n就是所以這個垃圾垂帶徵收有一定相當的效果而且他這個表示這個源頭減量有達到非常大的效果那尤其像我們現在桃園這10年來人口增加幅度非常大\n\n8\n00:02:16,901 --> 00:02:18,702\n現在已經到230幾萬人我們從2021年看我們這個一般廢棄物的生產量那個時候是127萬噸到去年一口氣增加到133萬噸而且\n\n9\n00:02:32,626 --> 00:02:54,191\n看得出來是成比例一直在增加那目前桃園人也不打算再蓋更多的焚化爐因為民眾對這空氣污染都是非常反對那不願意新建這焚化爐所以源頭減量我覺得這是很重要的不知道我們環境部有沒有針對這個列入重要的政策之一\n\n10\n00:02:54,791 --> 00:03:13,642\n是這個事實上是我們的重要政策之一當然我們考量就是說比較稍微偏鄉的地方在這一塊的實施上有一些挑戰所以我們就是找比較都會化的區域而且當然那個社區或者那個林裡\n\n11\n00:03:14,522 --> 00:03:25,239\n他有這個自覺他願意來來加入這個行業隨帶徵收那環境部事實上是會給予這個一些這個獎勵的一個措施\n\n12\n00:03:27,245 --> 00:03:50,694\n今天會提出主要是因為我們看到這個報告其實大概就是簡單的一句話帶過去所以好像沒有對這個隨帶徵收相當的重視我們希望這個好的政策我們環境部能夠重視也希望能夠盡快針對這個評估推動能夠做出報告盡快把這個好的政策能夠來把它推動\n\n13\n00:03:51,510 --> 00:04:14,586\n好謝謝涂權的這個取喜那接下來我們再請部長來看一下我們這個針對大潭電廠這個排放黑煙這個問題其實這個是民眾澄清出來你看一下這個照片3月30號3月底下午3點38分民眾拍攝到這個\n\n14\n00:04:17,915 --> 00:04:43,524\n空氣污染這個排放這個黑煙這個照片不知道的還以為是不是發生事故發生火災他這個黑煙非常的濃濃濃的黑煙然後又再到4月15號一樣又民眾又拍到這個排放黑煙非常嚴重那重點是環保局去稽查居然說現場及周邊未見濃煙散布\n\n15\n00:04:45,385 --> 00:05:07,962\n而且最主要他這還有發生非常嚴重的巨響打半個小時可是環保局去稽查居然都說沒有所以民眾真的覺得不可思議你看他們都拍下了這些照片這些證據而且我們等一下聽一下我們這個3公里以外鄭榮譽的聲響我先簡單播放一下給大家聽一下\n\n16\n00:05:21,784 --> 00:05:35,457\n這三公里以外您這麼遠遠就可以錄下這個聲響而且他是看到前面龍煙之後他去旁邊三公里以外才錄到這個鄭榮譽的聲響那針對這一部分\n\n17\n00:05:41,463 --> 00:06:07,572\n我想說部長我之前其實我有跟部長提過我們那個桃園觀音大潭電廠還有環科園區這個空非常非常的嚴重而且你看民眾也捲舉都拍下那麼多照片然後這個這麼大的聲響3公里以外都還錄得這麼清楚那不知道說到底有沒有改善的方法那個我跟涂權報告我們國家環境研究院\n\n18\n00:06:09,609 --> 00:06:36,568\n現在有發展一個技術透過光學的方式科技方式去這個針對那個黑煙可以做這個拍照然後來這個分析那裡面到底有沒有這個一些包括毒化物以及是不是排放的PM2.5等等有沒有超標我們來跟因為正好我們國安院也是在這個桃園嘛\n\n19\n00:06:37,288 --> 00:06:54,244\n對啊你剛剛看那個那麼濃的黑煙你覺得那個空汙他會標準嗎當然不曉得就是說他只是啊比如說一個就如我們機車還是汽車早期的啟動的時候開始會突然是冒一個黑煙瞬時的啊接下來就沒有我不曉得他是持續的還是說\n\n20\n00:06:55,165 --> 00:07:11,770\n所以我希望環境部也跟地方環保局密切好好的來聯繫一下因為大潭電廠那周邊這些居民他們說如果真的沒辦法改善希望我們能夠提出千春的計畫他說他們已經\n\n21\n00:07:13,590 --> 00:07:36,745\n反映到覺得已經投降了而且環保局各單位去都說沒有問題他說你看這反映到他們覺得已經束手無策那我們也知道大潭電廠這7部機組這個排放量就高達933公噸是我們全桃園最大固定的污染源而且他現在馬上8號機組也要投入\n\n22\n00:07:37,005 --> 00:08:05,058\n然後桃園大潭電廠也是這個濾狀污染入口的榜首每年達30萬公噸甚至超過我們桃園的煉油廠那真的是不是我知道我們環境部應該有一些科技執法的部分是不是有這個建制完善的空氣黑核子還是這個監測監控配合這個無人機有沒有辦法把這些問題來做一個徹底的改善\n\n23\n00:08:05,589 --> 00:08:25,439\n好,我們來研究看看如何來協助大潭地區這個大潭電廠它排放黑煙的這個問題好不好好,那這部分希望部長能夠協助來解決好,那謝謝部長那我想請一下我們經濟部產業發展署的連署長好,謝謝督委委員好連署長我請問一下美商科目你應該知道吧\n\n24\n00:08:35,168 --> 00:08:37,472\n你知道這個廠吧?那我們這個外國廠他當初要來設廠的時候應該是經過我們經濟部申請登記對不對?\n\n25\n00:08:45,540 --> 00:09:13,920\n他如果是外商要來投資要經過我們這邊審查對那我今天要凸顯一下那因為他在我們去年7月28號吳玉錦在4天前跟全場的員工說他們過4天就要來關廠也不知道為什麼這麼急匆匆忙忙的要去關廠你看他從2023年8月5號說要開始要解雇這員工可是這一連串這中間\n\n26\n00:09:15,101 --> 00:09:35,011\n從我們你看這個2023年10月12號防火磚砸死兩人然後後來又這個檢測土壤地下水檢測報告又被開罰15萬後來又因為鹽酸管蟹破裂毒死了上萬條的魚那整個大窟溪都被這個\n\n27\n00:09:36,112 --> 00:09:50,563\n被這個鹽酸做嚴重的污染這一連串的問題我想了解說他這個工廠歇業申請書是不是有這個土壤污染檢測報告提供的這個必要才能做這個歇業\n\n28\n00:09:51,465 --> 00:10:07,694\n我跟委員報告這是如果是工廠要歇要先跟地方政府提出申請然後根據圖法因為他這個時期沒有要過戶所以沒有如果是他沒有要移轉的時候他這個圖這一塊是還不用先去做一些一些檢測證明\n\n29\n00:10:08,655 --> 00:10:28,696\n因為他只有做卸業欸好那我這一點凸顯一下我上次有來提過這個工廠卸業申請書他針對這個土法規範第9條的工廠他就是說如果不在規範內當然不用提供這個土壤污染檢測報告可是如果有他第二條要規定就要提供\n\n30\n00:10:29,136 --> 00:10:43,382\n可是我不知道為什麼要提這個第三條提第三條說你不用提供等到我查到你沒有的時候我再來開罰你我不知道為什麼要給工廠開這個後門不用提供這個報告就同意他先歇業\n\n31\n00:10:45,780 --> 00:11:04,882\n這個我要了解一下因為如果說我們已經知道他是已經有土壤污染照理講地方的環保單位就應該要去進行這樣相關的查處啦那因為他這有相關規定是說在什麼條件下要提供檢測報告或什麼條件下不要但是如果已經知道的話我覺得這要處理\n\n32\n00:11:05,202 --> 00:11:08,624\n好聯署長我希望齁你們針對這個工廠歇業申請書去了解一下我們看起來不知道為什麼要開這個後門然後你看這個美商科目造成地方這麼嚴重的影響我們不希望齁這個外商公司來這邊賺到錢土地賣賣就跑掉我們不希望這RCA的事件齁\n\n33\n00:11:25,393 --> 00:11:26,473\n接下來我們請王振旭委員進行質詢\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n11179\t19527\t好,謝謝主席。那麻煩請一下我們的薛部長。好,請薛部長。好,圖文好。\n20387\t38853\t好,薛部長請問一下這個我們一般事業廢棄物減量也就是我們大家講的減少家用垃圾那過去我們向地方政府有推行隨袋徵收也就是民眾去購買專用的垃圾袋才能把這個垃圾丟進垃圾車採取\n41354\t47470\t以量計價減少垃圾製造量的方式那這一部分我不知道環境部有沒有針對這個政策進行過檢討評估\n51105\t78731\t跟涂權報告事實上我們有檢討因為台北市率先來實施根據台北市的經驗事實上效果也相當好至少可以減少到兩成到三成所以除了現在台北市新北市也在實施台中市的石鋼區我們的概念基本上是這樣子分階段分區域來實施所以像桃園也有幾個里我想涂權應該也很了解那我們也很高興看到桃園市的八德區\n80212\t102393\t規篩區有4個里要來推動所以我們不必再以整個市或者縣因為那個的確太大每個地方因地制宜情況也不一樣那我們就是來鼓勵朝這個方向因為這個終究要走這個方向好 薛部長在這邊跟薛部長報告一下其實他不是只有減少兩成那針對我們去調查這個報告台北市\n103053\t103073\t韓國瑜\n120287\t136201\t就是所以這個垃圾垂帶徵收有一定相當的效果而且他這個表示這個源頭減量有達到非常大的效果那尤其像我們現在桃園這10年來人口增加幅度非常大\n136901\t138702\t現在已經到230幾萬人我們從2021年看我們這個一般廢棄物的生產量那個時候是127萬噸到去年一口氣增加到133萬噸而且\n152626\t174191\t看得出來是成比例一直在增加那目前桃園人也不打算再蓋更多的焚化爐因為民眾對這空氣污染都是非常反對那不願意新建這焚化爐所以源頭減量我覺得這是很重要的不知道我們環境部有沒有針對這個列入重要的政策之一\n174791\t193642\t是 這個事實上是我們的重要政策之一當然我們考量就是說比較稍微偏鄉的地方在這一塊的實施上有一些挑戰所以我們就是找比較都會化的區域而且當然那個社區或者那個林裡\n194522\t205239\t他有這個自覺他願意來來加入這個行業隨帶徵收那環境部事實上是會給予這個一些這個獎勵的一個措施\n207245\t230694\t今天會提出主要是因為我們看到這個報告其實大概就是簡單的一句話帶過去所以好像沒有對這個隨帶徵收相當的重視我們希望這個好的政策我們環境部能夠重視也希望能夠盡快針對這個評估推動能夠做出報告盡快把這個好的政策能夠來把它推動\n231510\t254586\t好謝謝涂權的這個取喜那接下來我們再請部長來看一下我們這個針對大潭電廠這個排放黑煙這個問題其實這個是民眾澄清出來你看一下這個照片3月30號3月底下午3點38分民眾拍攝到這個\n257915\t283524\t空氣污染這個排放這個黑煙這個照片不知道的還以為是不是發生事故發生火災他這個黑煙非常的濃濃濃的黑煙然後又再到4月15號一樣又民眾又拍到這個排放黑煙非常嚴重那重點是環保局去稽查居然說現場及周邊未見濃煙散布\n285385\t307962\t而且最主要他這還有發生非常嚴重的巨響打半個小時可是環保局去稽查居然都說沒有所以民眾真的覺得不可思議你看他們都拍下了這些照片這些證據而且我們等一下聽一下我們這個3公里以外鄭榮譽的聲響我先簡單播放一下給大家聽一下\n321784\t335457\t這三公里以外您這麼遠遠就可以錄下這個聲響而且他是看到前面龍煙之後他去旁邊三公里以外才錄到這個鄭榮譽的聲響那針對這一部分\n341463\t367572\t我想說部長我之前其實我有跟部長提過我們那個桃園觀音大潭電廠還有環科園區這個空非常非常的嚴重而且你看民眾也捲舉都拍下那麼多照片然後這個這麼大的聲響3公里以外都還錄得這麼清楚那不知道說到底有沒有改善的方法那個我跟涂權報告我們國家環境研究院\n369609\t396568\t現在有發展一個技術透過光學的方式科技方式去這個針對那個黑煙可以做這個拍照然後來這個分析那裡面到底有沒有這個一些包括毒化物以及是不是排放的PM2.5等等有沒有超標我們來跟因為正好我們國安院也是在這個桃園嘛\n397288\t414244\t對啊你剛剛看那個那麼濃的黑煙你覺得那個空汙他會標準嗎當然不曉得就是說他只是啊比如說一個就如我們機車還是汽車早期的啟動的時候開始會突然是冒一個黑煙瞬時的啊接下來就沒有我不曉得他是持續的還是說\n415165\t431770\t所以我希望環境部也跟地方環保局密切好好的來聯繫一下因為大潭電廠那周邊這些居民他們說如果真的沒辦法改善希望我們能夠提出千春的計畫他說他們已經\n433590\t456745\t反映到覺得已經投降了而且環保局各單位去都說沒有問題他說你看這反映到他們覺得已經束手無策那我們也知道大潭電廠這7部機組這個排放量就高達933公噸是我們全桃園最大固定的污染源而且他現在馬上8號機組也要投入\n457005\t485058\t然後桃園大潭電廠也是這個濾狀污染入口的榜首每年達30萬公噸甚至超過我們桃園的煉油廠那真的是不是我知道我們環境部應該有一些科技執法的部分是不是有這個建制完善的空氣黑核子還是這個監測監控配合這個無人機有沒有辦法把這些問題來做一個徹底的改善\n485589\t505439\t好,我們來研究看看如何來協助大潭地區這個大潭電廠它排放黑煙的這個問題好不好好,那這部分希望部長能夠協助來解決好,那謝謝部長那我想請一下我們經濟部產業發展署的連署長好,謝謝督委委員好連署長我請問一下美商科目你應該知道吧\n515168\t517472\t你知道這個廠吧?那我們這個外國廠他當初要來設廠的時候應該是經過我們經濟部申請登記對不對?\n525540\t553920\t他如果是外商要來投資要經過我們這邊審查對那我今天要凸顯一下那因為他在我們去年7月28號吳玉錦在4天前跟全場的員工說他們過4天就要來關廠也不知道為什麼這麼急匆匆忙忙的要去關廠你看他從2023年8月5號說要開始要解雇這員工可是這一連串這中間\n555101\t575011\t從我們你看這個2023年10月12號防火磚砸死兩人然後後來又這個檢測土壤地下水檢測報告又被開罰15萬後來又因為鹽酸管蟹破裂毒死了上萬條的魚那整個大窟溪都被這個\n576112\t590563\t被這個鹽酸做嚴重的污染這一連串的問題我想了解說他這個工廠歇業申請書是不是有這個土壤污染檢測報告提供的這個必要才能做這個歇業\n591465\t607694\t我跟委員報告這是如果是工廠要歇要先跟地方政府提出申請然後根據圖法因為他這個時期沒有要過戶所以沒有如果是他沒有要移轉的時候他這個圖這一塊是還不用先去做一些一些檢測證明\n608655\t628696\t因為他只有做卸業欸好那我這一點凸顯一下我上次有來提過這個工廠卸業申請書他針對這個土法規範第9條的工廠他就是說如果不在規範內當然不用提供這個土壤污染檢測報告可是如果有他第二條要規定就要提供\n629136\t643382\t可是我不知道為什麼要提這個第三條提第三條說你不用提供等到我查到你沒有的時候我再來開罰你我不知道為什麼要給工廠開這個後門不用提供這個報告就同意他先歇業\n645780\t664882\t這個我要了解一下因為如果說我們已經知道他是已經有土壤污染照理講地方的環保單位就應該要去進行這樣相關的查處啦那因為他這有相關規定是說在什麼條件下要提供檢測報告或什麼條件下不要但是如果已經知道的話我覺得這要處理\n665202\t668624\t好聯署長我希望齁你們針對這個工廠歇業申請書去了解一下我們看起來不知道為什麼要開這個後門然後你看這個美商科目造成地方這麼嚴重的影響我們不希望齁這個外商公司來這邊賺到錢土地賣賣就跑掉我們不希望這RCA的事件齁\n685393\t686473\t接下來我們請王振旭委員進行質詢\n","txt":"好,謝謝主席。那麻煩請一下我們的薛部長。好,請薛部長。好,圖文好。\n好,薛部長請問一下這個我們一般事業廢棄物減量也就是我們大家講的減少家用垃圾那過去我們向地方政府有推行隨袋徵收也就是民眾去購買專用的垃圾袋才能把這個垃圾丟進垃圾車採取\n以量計價減少垃圾製造量的方式那這一部分我不知道環境部有沒有針對這個政策進行過檢討評估\n跟涂權報告事實上我們有檢討因為台北市率先來實施根據台北市的經驗事實上效果也相當好至少可以減少到兩成到三成所以除了現在台北市新北市也在實施台中市的石鋼區我們的概念基本上是這樣子分階段分區域來實施所以像桃園也有幾個里我想涂權應該也很了解那我們也很高興看到桃園市的八德區\n規篩區有4個里要來推動所以我們不必再以整個市或者縣因為那個的確太大每個地方因地制宜情況也不一樣那我們就是來鼓勵朝這個方向因為這個終究要走這個方向好 薛部長在這邊跟薛部長報告一下其實他不是只有減少兩成那針對我們去調查這個報告台北市\n韓國瑜\n就是所以這個垃圾垂帶徵收有一定相當的效果而且他這個表示這個源頭減量有達到非常大的效果那尤其像我們現在桃園這10年來人口增加幅度非常大\n現在已經到230幾萬人我們從2021年看我們這個一般廢棄物的生產量那個時候是127萬噸到去年一口氣增加到133萬噸而且\n看得出來是成比例一直在增加那目前桃園人也不打算再蓋更多的焚化爐因為民眾對這空氣污染都是非常反對那不願意新建這焚化爐所以源頭減量我覺得這是很重要的不知道我們環境部有沒有針對這個列入重要的政策之一\n是 這個事實上是我們的重要政策之一當然我們考量就是說比較稍微偏鄉的地方在這一塊的實施上有一些挑戰所以我們就是找比較都會化的區域而且當然那個社區或者那個林裡\n他有這個自覺他願意來來加入這個行業隨帶徵收那環境部事實上是會給予這個一些這個獎勵的一個措施\n今天會提出主要是因為我們看到這個報告其實大概就是簡單的一句話帶過去所以好像沒有對這個隨帶徵收相當的重視我們希望這個好的政策我們環境部能夠重視也希望能夠盡快針對這個評估推動能夠做出報告盡快把這個好的政策能夠來把它推動\n好謝謝涂權的這個取喜那接下來我們再請部長來看一下我們這個針對大潭電廠這個排放黑煙這個問題其實這個是民眾澄清出來你看一下這個照片3月30號3月底下午3點38分民眾拍攝到這個\n空氣污染這個排放這個黑煙這個照片不知道的還以為是不是發生事故發生火災他這個黑煙非常的濃濃濃的黑煙然後又再到4月15號一樣又民眾又拍到這個排放黑煙非常嚴重那重點是環保局去稽查居然說現場及周邊未見濃煙散布\n而且最主要他這還有發生非常嚴重的巨響打半個小時可是環保局去稽查居然都說沒有所以民眾真的覺得不可思議你看他們都拍下了這些照片這些證據而且我們等一下聽一下我們這個3公里以外鄭榮譽的聲響我先簡單播放一下給大家聽一下\n這三公里以外您這麼遠遠就可以錄下這個聲響而且他是看到前面龍煙之後他去旁邊三公里以外才錄到這個鄭榮譽的聲響那針對這一部分\n我想說部長我之前其實我有跟部長提過我們那個桃園觀音大潭電廠還有環科園區這個空非常非常的嚴重而且你看民眾也捲舉都拍下那麼多照片然後這個這麼大的聲響3公里以外都還錄得這麼清楚那不知道說到底有沒有改善的方法那個我跟涂權報告我們國家環境研究院\n現在有發展一個技術透過光學的方式科技方式去這個針對那個黑煙可以做這個拍照然後來這個分析那裡面到底有沒有這個一些包括毒化物以及是不是排放的PM2.5等等有沒有超標我們來跟因為正好我們國安院也是在這個桃園嘛\n對啊你剛剛看那個那麼濃的黑煙你覺得那個空汙他會標準嗎當然不曉得就是說他只是啊比如說一個就如我們機車還是汽車早期的啟動的時候開始會突然是冒一個黑煙瞬時的啊接下來就沒有我不曉得他是持續的還是說\n所以我希望環境部也跟地方環保局密切好好的來聯繫一下因為大潭電廠那周邊這些居民他們說如果真的沒辦法改善希望我們能夠提出千春的計畫他說他們已經\n反映到覺得已經投降了而且環保局各單位去都說沒有問題他說你看這反映到他們覺得已經束手無策那我們也知道大潭電廠這7部機組這個排放量就高達933公噸是我們全桃園最大固定的污染源而且他現在馬上8號機組也要投入\n然後桃園大潭電廠也是這個濾狀污染入口的榜首每年達30萬公噸甚至超過我們桃園的煉油廠那真的是不是我知道我們環境部應該有一些科技執法的部分是不是有這個建制完善的空氣黑核子還是這個監測監控配合這個無人機有沒有辦法把這些問題來做一個徹底的改善\n好,我們來研究看看如何來協助大潭地區這個大潭電廠它排放黑煙的這個問題好不好好,那這部分希望部長能夠協助來解決好,那謝謝部長那我想請一下我們經濟部產業發展署的連署長好,謝謝督委委員好連署長我請問一下美商科目你應該知道吧\n你知道這個廠吧?那我們這個外國廠他當初要來設廠的時候應該是經過我們經濟部申請登記對不對?\n他如果是外商要來投資要經過我們這邊審查對那我今天要凸顯一下那因為他在我們去年7月28號吳玉錦在4天前跟全場的員工說他們過4天就要來關廠也不知道為什麼這麼急匆匆忙忙的要去關廠你看他從2023年8月5號說要開始要解雇這員工可是這一連串這中間\n從我們你看這個2023年10月12號防火磚砸死兩人然後後來又這個檢測土壤地下水檢測報告又被開罰15萬後來又因為鹽酸管蟹破裂毒死了上萬條的魚那整個大窟溪都被這個\n被這個鹽酸做嚴重的污染這一連串的問題我想了解說他這個工廠歇業申請書是不是有這個土壤污染檢測報告提供的這個必要才能做這個歇業\n我跟委員報告這是如果是工廠要歇要先跟地方政府提出申請然後根據圖法因為他這個時期沒有要過戶所以沒有如果是他沒有要移轉的時候他這個圖這一塊是還不用先去做一些一些檢測證明\n因為他只有做卸業欸好那我這一點凸顯一下我上次有來提過這個工廠卸業申請書他針對這個土法規範第9條的工廠他就是說如果不在規範內當然不用提供這個土壤污染檢測報告可是如果有他第二條要規定就要提供\n可是我不知道為什麼要提這個第三條提第三條說你不用提供等到我查到你沒有的時候我再來開罰你我不知道為什麼要給工廠開這個後門不用提供這個報告就同意他先歇業\n這個我要了解一下因為如果說我們已經知道他是已經有土壤污染照理講地方的環保單位就應該要去進行這樣相關的查處啦那因為他這有相關規定是說在什麼條件下要提供檢測報告或什麼條件下不要但是如果已經知道的話我覺得這要處理\n好聯署長我希望齁你們針對這個工廠歇業申請書去了解一下我們看起來不知道為什麼要開這個後門然後你看這個美商科目造成地方這麼嚴重的影響我們不希望齁這個外商公司來這邊賺到錢土地賣賣就跑掉我們不希望這RCA的事件齁\n接下來我們請王振旭委員進行質詢\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:11.179 --> 00:19.527\n好,謝謝主席。那麻煩請一下我們的薛部長。好,請薛部長。好,圖文好。\n\n00:20.387 --> 00:38.853\n好,薛部長請問一下這個我們一般事業廢棄物減量也就是我們大家講的減少家用垃圾那過去我們向地方政府有推行隨袋徵收也就是民眾去購買專用的垃圾袋才能把這個垃圾丟進垃圾車採取\n\n00:41.354 --> 00:47.470\n以量計價減少垃圾製造量的方式那這一部分我不知道環境部有沒有針對這個政策進行過檢討評估\n\n00:51.105 --> 01:18.731\n跟涂權報告事實上我們有檢討因為台北市率先來實施根據台北市的經驗事實上效果也相當好至少可以減少到兩成到三成所以除了現在台北市新北市也在實施台中市的石鋼區我們的概念基本上是這樣子分階段分區域來實施所以像桃園也有幾個里我想涂權應該也很了解那我們也很高興看到桃園市的八德區\n\n01:20.212 --> 01:42.393\n規篩區有4個里要來推動所以我們不必再以整個市或者縣因為那個的確太大每個地方因地制宜情況也不一樣那我們就是來鼓勵朝這個方向因為這個終究要走這個方向好薛部長在這邊跟薛部長報告一下其實他不是只有減少兩成那針對我們去調查這個報告台北市\n\n01:43.053 --> 01:43.073\n韓國瑜\n\n02:00.287 --> 02:16.201\n就是所以這個垃圾垂帶徵收有一定相當的效果而且他這個表示這個源頭減量有達到非常大的效果那尤其像我們現在桃園這10年來人口增加幅度非常大\n\n02:16.901 --> 02:18.702\n現在已經到230幾萬人我們從2021年看我們這個一般廢棄物的生產量那個時候是127萬噸到去年一口氣增加到133萬噸而且\n\n02:32.626 --> 02:54.191\n看得出來是成比例一直在增加那目前桃園人也不打算再蓋更多的焚化爐因為民眾對這空氣污染都是非常反對那不願意新建這焚化爐所以源頭減量我覺得這是很重要的不知道我們環境部有沒有針對這個列入重要的政策之一\n\n02:54.791 --> 03:13.642\n是這個事實上是我們的重要政策之一當然我們考量就是說比較稍微偏鄉的地方在這一塊的實施上有一些挑戰所以我們就是找比較都會化的區域而且當然那個社區或者那個林裡\n\n03:14.522 --> 03:25.239\n他有這個自覺他願意來來加入這個行業隨帶徵收那環境部事實上是會給予這個一些這個獎勵的一個措施\n\n03:27.245 --> 03:50.694\n今天會提出主要是因為我們看到這個報告其實大概就是簡單的一句話帶過去所以好像沒有對這個隨帶徵收相當的重視我們希望這個好的政策我們環境部能夠重視也希望能夠盡快針對這個評估推動能夠做出報告盡快把這個好的政策能夠來把它推動\n\n03:51.510 --> 04:14.586\n好謝謝涂權的這個取喜那接下來我們再請部長來看一下我們這個針對大潭電廠這個排放黑煙這個問題其實這個是民眾澄清出來你看一下這個照片3月30號3月底下午3點38分民眾拍攝到這個\n\n04:17.915 --> 04:43.524\n空氣污染這個排放這個黑煙這個照片不知道的還以為是不是發生事故發生火災他這個黑煙非常的濃濃濃的黑煙然後又再到4月15號一樣又民眾又拍到這個排放黑煙非常嚴重那重點是環保局去稽查居然說現場及周邊未見濃煙散布\n\n04:45.385 --> 05:07.962\n而且最主要他這還有發生非常嚴重的巨響打半個小時可是環保局去稽查居然都說沒有所以民眾真的覺得不可思議你看他們都拍下了這些照片這些證據而且我們等一下聽一下我們這個3公里以外鄭榮譽的聲響我先簡單播放一下給大家聽一下\n\n05:21.784 --> 05:35.457\n這三公里以外您這麼遠遠就可以錄下這個聲響而且他是看到前面龍煙之後他去旁邊三公里以外才錄到這個鄭榮譽的聲響那針對這一部分\n\n05:41.463 --> 06:07.572\n我想說部長我之前其實我有跟部長提過我們那個桃園觀音大潭電廠還有環科園區這個空非常非常的嚴重而且你看民眾也捲舉都拍下那麼多照片然後這個這麼大的聲響3公里以外都還錄得這麼清楚那不知道說到底有沒有改善的方法那個我跟涂權報告我們國家環境研究院\n\n06:09.609 --> 06:36.568\n現在有發展一個技術透過光學的方式科技方式去這個針對那個黑煙可以做這個拍照然後來這個分析那裡面到底有沒有這個一些包括毒化物以及是不是排放的PM2.5等等有沒有超標我們來跟因為正好我們國安院也是在這個桃園嘛\n\n06:37.288 --> 06:54.244\n對啊你剛剛看那個那麼濃的黑煙你覺得那個空汙他會標準嗎當然不曉得就是說他只是啊比如說一個就如我們機車還是汽車早期的啟動的時候開始會突然是冒一個黑煙瞬時的啊接下來就沒有我不曉得他是持續的還是說\n\n06:55.165 --> 07:11.770\n所以我希望環境部也跟地方環保局密切好好的來聯繫一下因為大潭電廠那周邊這些居民他們說如果真的沒辦法改善希望我們能夠提出千春的計畫他說他們已經\n\n07:13.590 --> 07:36.745\n反映到覺得已經投降了而且環保局各單位去都說沒有問題他說你看這反映到他們覺得已經束手無策那我們也知道大潭電廠這7部機組這個排放量就高達933公噸是我們全桃園最大固定的污染源而且他現在馬上8號機組也要投入\n\n07:37.005 --> 08:05.058\n然後桃園大潭電廠也是這個濾狀污染入口的榜首每年達30萬公噸甚至超過我們桃園的煉油廠那真的是不是我知道我們環境部應該有一些科技執法的部分是不是有這個建制完善的空氣黑核子還是這個監測監控配合這個無人機有沒有辦法把這些問題來做一個徹底的改善\n\n08:05.589 --> 08:25.439\n好,我們來研究看看如何來協助大潭地區這個大潭電廠它排放黑煙的這個問題好不好好,那這部分希望部長能夠協助來解決好,那謝謝部長那我想請一下我們經濟部產業發展署的連署長好,謝謝督委委員好連署長我請問一下美商科目你應該知道吧\n\n08:35.168 --> 08:37.472\n你知道這個廠吧?那我們這個外國廠他當初要來設廠的時候應該是經過我們經濟部申請登記對不對?\n\n08:45.540 --> 09:13.920\n他如果是外商要來投資要經過我們這邊審查對那我今天要凸顯一下那因為他在我們去年7月28號吳玉錦在4天前跟全場的員工說他們過4天就要來關廠也不知道為什麼這麼急匆匆忙忙的要去關廠你看他從2023年8月5號說要開始要解雇這員工可是這一連串這中間\n\n09:15.101 --> 09:35.011\n從我們你看這個2023年10月12號防火磚砸死兩人然後後來又這個檢測土壤地下水檢測報告又被開罰15萬後來又因為鹽酸管蟹破裂毒死了上萬條的魚那整個大窟溪都被這個\n\n09:36.112 --> 09:50.563\n被這個鹽酸做嚴重的污染這一連串的問題我想了解說他這個工廠歇業申請書是不是有這個土壤污染檢測報告提供的這個必要才能做這個歇業\n\n09:51.465 --> 10:07.694\n我跟委員報告這是如果是工廠要歇要先跟地方政府提出申請然後根據圖法因為他這個時期沒有要過戶所以沒有如果是他沒有要移轉的時候他這個圖這一塊是還不用先去做一些一些檢測證明\n\n10:08.655 --> 10:28.696\n因為他只有做卸業欸好那我這一點凸顯一下我上次有來提過這個工廠卸業申請書他針對這個土法規範第9條的工廠他就是說如果不在規範內當然不用提供這個土壤污染檢測報告可是如果有他第二條要規定就要提供\n\n10:29.136 --> 10:43.382\n可是我不知道為什麼要提這個第三條提第三條說你不用提供等到我查到你沒有的時候我再來開罰你我不知道為什麼要給工廠開這個後門不用提供這個報告就同意他先歇業\n\n10:45.780 --> 11:04.882\n這個我要了解一下因為如果說我們已經知道他是已經有土壤污染照理講地方的環保單位就應該要去進行這樣相關的查處啦那因為他這有相關規定是說在什麼條件下要提供檢測報告或什麼條件下不要但是如果已經知道的話我覺得這要處理\n\n11:05.202 --> 11:08.624\n好聯署長我希望齁你們針對這個工廠歇業申請書去了解一下我們看起來不知道為什麼要開這個後門然後你看這個美商科目造成地方這麼嚴重的影響我們不希望齁這個外商公司來這邊賺到錢土地賣賣就跑掉我們不希望這RCA的事件齁\n\n11:25.393 --> 11:26.473\n接下來我們請王振旭委員進行質詢\n\n","segments":[{"start":11.179,"end":19.527,"text":"好,謝謝主席。那麻煩請一下我們的薛部長。好,請薛部長。好,圖文好。"},{"start":20.387,"end":38.853,"text":"好,薛部長請問一下這個我們一般事業廢棄物減量也就是我們大家講的減少家用垃圾那過去我們向地方政府有推行隨袋徵收也就是民眾去購買專用的垃圾袋才能把這個垃圾丟進垃圾車採取"},{"start":41.354,"end":47.47,"text":"以量計價減少垃圾製造量的方式那這一部分我不知道環境部有沒有針對這個政策進行過檢討評估"},{"start":51.105,"end":78.731,"text":"跟涂權報告事實上我們有檢討因為台北市率先來實施根據台北市的經驗事實上效果也相當好至少可以減少到兩成到三成所以除了現在台北市新北市也在實施台中市的石鋼區我們的概念基本上是這樣子分階段分區域來實施所以像桃園也有幾個里我想涂權應該也很了解那我們也很高興看到桃園市的八德區"},{"start":80.212,"end":102.393,"text":"規篩區有4個里要來推動所以我們不必再以整個市或者縣因為那個的確太大每個地方因地制宜情況也不一樣那我們就是來鼓勵朝這個方向因為這個終究要走這個方向好 薛部長在這邊跟薛部長報告一下其實他不是只有減少兩成那針對我們去調查這個報告台北市"},{"start":103.053,"end":103.073,"text":"韓國瑜"},{"start":120.287,"end":136.201,"text":"就是所以這個垃圾垂帶徵收有一定相當的效果而且他這個表示這個源頭減量有達到非常大的效果那尤其像我們現在桃園這10年來人口增加幅度非常大"},{"start":136.901,"end":138.702,"text":"現在已經到230幾萬人我們從2021年看我們這個一般廢棄物的生產量那個時候是127萬噸到去年一口氣增加到133萬噸而且"},{"start":152.626,"end":174.191,"text":"看得出來是成比例一直在增加那目前桃園人也不打算再蓋更多的焚化爐因為民眾對這空氣污染都是非常反對那不願意新建這焚化爐所以源頭減量我覺得這是很重要的不知道我們環境部有沒有針對這個列入重要的政策之一"},{"start":174.791,"end":193.642,"text":"是 這個事實上是我們的重要政策之一當然我們考量就是說比較稍微偏鄉的地方在這一塊的實施上有一些挑戰所以我們就是找比較都會化的區域而且當然那個社區或者那個林裡"},{"start":194.522,"end":205.239,"text":"他有這個自覺他願意來來加入這個行業隨帶徵收那環境部事實上是會給予這個一些這個獎勵的一個措施"},{"start":207.245,"end":230.694,"text":"今天會提出主要是因為我們看到這個報告其實大概就是簡單的一句話帶過去所以好像沒有對這個隨帶徵收相當的重視我們希望這個好的政策我們環境部能夠重視也希望能夠盡快針對這個評估推動能夠做出報告盡快把這個好的政策能夠來把它推動"},{"start":231.51,"end":254.586,"text":"好謝謝涂權的這個取喜那接下來我們再請部長來看一下我們這個針對大潭電廠這個排放黑煙這個問題其實這個是民眾澄清出來你看一下這個照片3月30號3月底下午3點38分民眾拍攝到這個"},{"start":257.915,"end":283.524,"text":"空氣污染這個排放這個黑煙這個照片不知道的還以為是不是發生事故發生火災他這個黑煙非常的濃濃濃的黑煙然後又再到4月15號一樣又民眾又拍到這個排放黑煙非常嚴重那重點是環保局去稽查居然說現場及周邊未見濃煙散布"},{"start":285.385,"end":307.962,"text":"而且最主要他這還有發生非常嚴重的巨響打半個小時可是環保局去稽查居然都說沒有所以民眾真的覺得不可思議你看他們都拍下了這些照片這些證據而且我們等一下聽一下我們這個3公里以外鄭榮譽的聲響我先簡單播放一下給大家聽一下"},{"start":321.784,"end":335.457,"text":"這三公里以外您這麼遠遠就可以錄下這個聲響而且他是看到前面龍煙之後他去旁邊三公里以外才錄到這個鄭榮譽的聲響那針對這一部分"},{"start":341.463,"end":367.572,"text":"我想說部長我之前其實我有跟部長提過我們那個桃園觀音大潭電廠還有環科園區這個空非常非常的嚴重而且你看民眾也捲舉都拍下那麼多照片然後這個這麼大的聲響3公里以外都還錄得這麼清楚那不知道說到底有沒有改善的方法那個我跟涂權報告我們國家環境研究院"},{"start":369.609,"end":396.568,"text":"現在有發展一個技術透過光學的方式科技方式去這個針對那個黑煙可以做這個拍照然後來這個分析那裡面到底有沒有這個一些包括毒化物以及是不是排放的PM2.5等等有沒有超標我們來跟因為正好我們國安院也是在這個桃園嘛"},{"start":397.288,"end":414.244,"text":"對啊你剛剛看那個那麼濃的黑煙你覺得那個空汙他會標準嗎當然不曉得就是說他只是啊比如說一個就如我們機車還是汽車早期的啟動的時候開始會突然是冒一個黑煙瞬時的啊接下來就沒有我不曉得他是持續的還是說"},{"start":415.165,"end":431.77,"text":"所以我希望環境部也跟地方環保局密切好好的來聯繫一下因為大潭電廠那周邊這些居民他們說如果真的沒辦法改善希望我們能夠提出千春的計畫他說他們已經"},{"start":433.59,"end":456.745,"text":"反映到覺得已經投降了而且環保局各單位去都說沒有問題他說你看這反映到他們覺得已經束手無策那我們也知道大潭電廠這7部機組這個排放量就高達933公噸是我們全桃園最大固定的污染源而且他現在馬上8號機組也要投入"},{"start":457.005,"end":485.058,"text":"然後桃園大潭電廠也是這個濾狀污染入口的榜首每年達30萬公噸甚至超過我們桃園的煉油廠那真的是不是我知道我們環境部應該有一些科技執法的部分是不是有這個建制完善的空氣黑核子還是這個監測監控配合這個無人機有沒有辦法把這些問題來做一個徹底的改善"},{"start":485.589,"end":505.439,"text":"好,我們來研究看看如何來協助大潭地區這個大潭電廠它排放黑煙的這個問題好不好好,那這部分希望部長能夠協助來解決好,那謝謝部長那我想請一下我們經濟部產業發展署的連署長好,謝謝督委委員好連署長我請問一下美商科目你應該知道吧"},{"start":515.168,"end":517.472,"text":"你知道這個廠吧?那我們這個外國廠他當初要來設廠的時候應該是經過我們經濟部申請登記對不對?"},{"start":525.54,"end":553.92,"text":"他如果是外商要來投資要經過我們這邊審查對那我今天要凸顯一下那因為他在我們去年7月28號吳玉錦在4天前跟全場的員工說他們過4天就要來關廠也不知道為什麼這麼急匆匆忙忙的要去關廠你看他從2023年8月5號說要開始要解雇這員工可是這一連串這中間"},{"start":555.101,"end":575.011,"text":"從我們你看這個2023年10月12號防火磚砸死兩人然後後來又這個檢測土壤地下水檢測報告又被開罰15萬後來又因為鹽酸管蟹破裂毒死了上萬條的魚那整個大窟溪都被這個"},{"start":576.112,"end":590.563,"text":"被這個鹽酸做嚴重的污染這一連串的問題我想了解說他這個工廠歇業申請書是不是有這個土壤污染檢測報告提供的這個必要才能做這個歇業"},{"start":591.465,"end":607.694,"text":"我跟委員報告這是如果是工廠要歇要先跟地方政府提出申請然後根據圖法因為他這個時期沒有要過戶所以沒有如果是他沒有要移轉的時候他這個圖這一塊是還不用先去做一些一些檢測證明"},{"start":608.655,"end":628.696,"text":"因為他只有做卸業欸好那我這一點凸顯一下我上次有來提過這個工廠卸業申請書他針對這個土法規範第9條的工廠他就是說如果不在規範內當然不用提供這個土壤污染檢測報告可是如果有他第二條要規定就要提供"},{"start":629.136,"end":643.382,"text":"可是我不知道為什麼要提這個第三條提第三條說你不用提供等到我查到你沒有的時候我再來開罰你我不知道為什麼要給工廠開這個後門不用提供這個報告就同意他先歇業"},{"start":645.78,"end":664.882,"text":"這個我要了解一下因為如果說我們已經知道他是已經有土壤污染照理講地方的環保單位就應該要去進行這樣相關的查處啦那因為他這有相關規定是說在什麼條件下要提供檢測報告或什麼條件下不要但是如果已經知道的話我覺得這要處理"},{"start":665.202,"end":668.624,"text":"好聯署長我希望齁你們針對這個工廠歇業申請書去了解一下我們看起來不知道為什麼要開這個後門然後你看這個美商科目造成地方這麼嚴重的影響我們不希望齁這個外商公司來這邊賺到錢土地賣賣就跑掉我們不希望這RCA的事件齁"},{"start":685.393,"end":686.473,"text":"接下來我們請王振旭委員進行質詢"}]}}}}