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了，為什麼我們還是沒有辦法？"],["王總經理耀庭：跟委員報告，這次最主要是因為地震之後的一些機組陸陸續續故障，內傷的關係陸陸續續故障，它不會一次發生。這個狀況之下，15號當天是下午半個小時之內同時發生兩部，應該講4部，總共4部機組同時沒有電送出來，這個在台電送電歷史……"],["謝委員衣鳯：哪4部啊？"],["王總經理耀庭：在大潭電廠的8號機110萬瓩，然後明潭有3部的抽蓄發電機，因為它送電出來有一個很重要的設備叫做Bus（匯流排），因為地震搖晃了之後在15號當天造成它短路，所以3部機組的電也送不出來，就是同時發生而且在這麼短時間內，又是我用電最緊的、最多負載的時候發生。所以是連續兩個衝擊、重擊台電……"],["謝委員衣鳯：所以你這一次的備載都沒有用到核電？我看到都是柴油，就是台積電的自備的36萬瓩的柴油發電……"],["王總經理耀庭：所以我們的備轉……"],["謝委員衣鳯：還有核二、核三的柴油發電機？"],["王總經理耀庭：是。我們等於在備轉的準備方面，會有一道又一道的防線，就是預防剛剛講到15號當天發生的這麼重大的衝擊，都是為這個在做準備。這一次就是台電被重擊，但是因為我們的備轉容量是夠的，所以我們有守住，即使發生了這個事，我們的備轉容量率還有3%，就是這樣子。所以我很感謝同仁，大家這麼努力預防危機。"],["謝委員衣鳯：對，可是我想要理解的是，如果我們備轉的容量夠，為什麼需要用到這麼多的柴油發電機，還要用到台積電的？"],["王總經理耀庭：因為我們還要再預留3%在最後，萬一還有下一個重擊台電的事故發生的時候，我們還要能守住不限電，所以我們先把其他的部分先用掉，留100萬瓩的餘裕容量在那邊，大概是這個目的。"],["謝委員衣鳯：還有，我有看到我們用了台積電自備的36萬瓩的柴油發電機，根據台電111年度的永續報告書裡面，台積電強調自己使用再生能源是達到預設的標準喔！但是在2019到2022年，他們直接使用天然氣、柴油的是8.61億度到13.36億度耶！如果我們真的是沒有缺電，真的是穩定供電的話，為什麼台積電會使用柴油跟天然氣，而不是使用再生能源？"],["王總經理耀庭：跟委員報告，在2021那段時間，主要是因為國內的景氣非常好，尤其是中美的問題之後很多臺商回來，所以那個時候的用電量突然暴增，我們增加了大概6%的用電量，從來沒有過這麼大的一個用電量。在那個時候，在某一些情境之下，然後台電的機組又有故障，所以那時候、那幾年有請台積電出來協助。"],["謝委員衣鳯：可是未來有可能還是有訂單你也期待產業的訂單好嘛！在產業訂單好的情況下，如果我們沒有辦法穩定供電，代表我們電力是不足的，是不是？"],["王總經理耀庭：其實這幾年台電在電力方面一直持續建設，森霸是IPP，不是台電的電廠，它最近已經在試運轉，包括我們在臺中也有兩部機組，興達也有3部機組正在興建，這些量持續興建，就是為了因應未來用電的成長而準備，台電都會在前面5年、10年之間，為了預備未來的用電需求一直努力。"],["謝委員衣鳯：好，我還想請問王部長。"],["王部長美花：是，委員好。"],["謝委員衣鳯：王部長，你要卸任了，要跟你恭喜還是要跟你歡送？你給自己打幾分？"],["王部長美花：沒有打分數的問題，就是做好每一天的工作。"],["謝委員衣鳯：你沒有打分數。你對未來新任的部長有什麼期許？"],["王部長美花：我們非常感謝他願意承擔這樣的重責大任，對臺灣未來的經濟發展一定很有幫助。"],["謝委員衣鳯：是嗎？"],["王部長美花：是。"],["謝委員衣鳯：他是對半導體最瞭解的部長，你對他瞭解的程度怎麼樣？"],["王部長美花：我們後續會……"],["謝委員衣鳯：你可以比較，有什麼關係？反正你要卸任了。"],["王部長美花：沒有，我們後續會把業務好好的交接給新的部長。"],["謝委員衣鳯：你看到了台積電永續報告，他們在2019到2022年，使用天然氣跟柴油是8.6億度到13.36億度，代表對台積電來講，能源穩定的問題非常重要。它在臺灣出口的GDP占非常重要的比例，所以我認為怎麼樣讓臺灣的電力可以穩定是非常重要的議題，尤其是在這一次的大停電之後，部長會怎麼樣期許？"],["王部長美花：確實大家都很關心電力，這個部分怎麼樣做好電力供給，我們也會跟新部長做好交接。現在我們正在做的電源開發，或者是因應產業界新的需求，怎麼樣搭配提早準備等等，我們一定都會說明。"],["謝委員衣鳯：我們今天還有審核後端基金，這4年來我一直在想，我也問王總經理，到底我們的核燃料棒現在是核廢料嗎？怎麼樣重新再利用？國際間已經有先進的科技可以重新再利用，對於相關的議題台電有沒有進行研究？"],["王總經理耀庭：台電持續關注國際上最新的科技應用，就像委員提到的，這些已經用過的核燃料的這些廢料可不可以再精進？當然國外也在做這方面的研究，一旦有突破、有成果，我們也會照這個……"],["謝委員衣鳯：你們有沒有追蹤，進一步瞭解我們的核廢料是不是可以重新再利用？畢竟這些東西都影響到居民，怎麼樣減輕居民對於過去我們使用核電造成的壓力？未來繼續使用核電的時候，我們才可以解決核廢料的問題，是不是？"],["王總經理耀庭：是，我們現在在核二、核一廠區要蓋中期的核廢料貯存場，我們會把已經用過的燃料棒放在那個地方，一旦未來技術有如委員說的，可以把這些廢燃料再濃縮然後再利用，這些技術一旦成熟，我們馬上就會做後續的一些處置跟運用。"],["謝委員衣鳯：好，謝謝。"],["王總經理耀庭：謝謝。"],["主席：接下來請邱志偉委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":412,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-19-8","speakers":["楊瓊瓔","林岱樺","張嘉郡","賴瑞隆","邱議瑩","張啓楷","鄭正鈐","呂玉玲","鄭天財Sra 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{\"word\": \"。\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 483.442, \"end\": 483.562, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 483.562, \"end\": 483.582, \"score\": 0.115}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 483.582, \"end\": 483.662, \"score\": 0.665}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 483.662, \"end\": 483.782, \"score\": 0.831}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 483.782, \"end\": 483.802, \"score\": 0.002}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 483.802, \"end\": 483.822, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 485.683, \"end\": 502.75, \"text\": \"請問您們有沒有去追蹤進一步的來瞭解說我們的核廢料是不是可以重新再用畢竟這些東西都是影響到居民嗎那怎麼樣子減輕居民對於過去我們使用\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"您\", \"start\": 485.683, \"end\": 485.904, \"score\": 0.814}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 485.904, \"end\": 486.004, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 486.004, \"end\": 486.124, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 486.124, \"end\": 486.244, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"去\", 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\"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,149 --> 00:00:10,071\n我們請謝衣鳯委員因為我們沒有休息所以如果行政部門有需要請自行謝謝主席我想要請台電的總經理我們再請王總經理\n\n2\n00:00:30,622 --> 00:00:56,950\n黃總我想要請問一下就是我們在2021年跟我們2022年的停電就是事件的專案報告裡面你已經說明了我們夜間的就是因為太陽能電力的供應下降所以你們就是要想辦法讓夜間的電力的彈性可以恢復可是為什麼現在到了今年已經2023了\n\n3\n00:00:59,051 --> 00:01:03,681\n我們還是沒有辦法是不是?\n\n4\n00:01:03,681 --> 00:01:05,865\n2024跟委員報告齁這次最主要是因為\n\n5\n00:01:07,062 --> 00:01:29,190\n地震之後的一些機組陸陸續續故障陸陸續續內傷不關系陸陸續續故障他不會是發生那這個狀況之下在15號當天是下午同時他半個小時之內發生的兩部應該講四部總共四部機組同時沒有電送出來這是個在台電送電的意思\n\n6\n00:01:30,430 --> 00:01:54,870\n在那個我的大潭電廠的8號機110萬千瓦然後呢在明潭的有三部的抽蓄發電機那是因為它的送電出來一個很重要的一個設備叫做BUS那個BUS呢因為地震搖晃了之後就在那個15號當天造成它短路所以它那個三部機組的電也送不出來就是同時發生而且在這麼短又是我用電最緊的時候最多的\n\n7\n00:01:55,530 --> 00:02:20,075\n負載的時候它發生所以那是一個連續兩個重擊台電的一個一個一個所以你這次的備載都沒有用到核電我看到都是柴油就是台積電的自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電所以我們的備轉方面還有核二核三的柴油發電機是我們等於是說在備轉的準備方面呢是會一道又一道的防線就是預防剛剛講到15號當天發生的這麼重重大的衝擊\n\n8\n00:02:22,876 --> 00:02:26,357\n可是我想要理解的是如果說我們備轉的容量夠那為什麼需要用到就是說這麼多的柴油發電機還要用到台積電的\n\n9\n00:02:52,113 --> 00:03:08,249\n因為我們還要預留3%在最後萬一還有下一個的重極台電的一個事故發生的時候我們還要能守住不限電所以我們先把其他的部分先用掉留100萬千瓦的餘裕容量在那邊大概是這個目的\n\n10\n00:03:10,911 --> 00:03:29,597\n我有看到我們用了台積電自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電機但是根據台電111年度的永續報告書裡面台積電強調自己使用再生能源是達到預設的標準\n\n11\n00:03:31,457 --> 00:03:59,919\n但是在2019到2022年他們直接使用天然氣柴油的是8.61億度到13.36億度那如果我們說我們真的是沒有缺電真的是穩定供電的話為什麼台積電會使用那個柴油跟天然氣而不是使用再生能源\n\n12\n00:04:00,359 --> 00:04:26,702\n好跟委員報告在2021那段時間主要是因為國內的景氣非常的好尤其是中美的問題之後很多台商回來所以那個時候的用電量突然暴增我們增加了大概6%的用電量從來沒有過這麼大的一個用電量所以在那個時候在某一些情境之下然後台電的機組又有故障所以那時候那幾年有請台積電出來協助\n\n13\n00:04:27,523 --> 00:04:27,683\n發言委員\n\n14\n00:04:45,634 --> 00:05:07,010\n所以跟委員報告其實這幾年臺電的電力一直在持續的建設包括像最近森巴,森巴是IPP不是臺電的電廠它已經在最近在試運轉了然後包括我們的臺中也有兩部機組新達也有三部機組正在興建所以我們這些量持續的在興建就是為了因應未來的用電的成長而在準備當中\n\n15\n00:05:08,471 --> 00:05:16,999\n臺電都會在前面5年10年之間就在預備未來的用電需求一直在努力那我還想請問王部長王部長你要卸任了這要跟你恭喜還是要跟你歡送啊?你給自己打幾分?\n\n16\n00:05:34,469 --> 00:06:00,009\n沒有打分數的問題就是做好每一天的工作你沒有打分數喔你對未來的那個我們新任的部長有什麼期許我們非常感謝他願意來承擔這樣的一個重責大任那對台灣的未來的經濟發展一定很有幫助是嗎他是對於我們半導體最瞭解的部長你覺得你跟他瞭解的程度是怎樣\n\n17\n00:06:00,829 --> 00:06:05,393\n臺積電的永續報告裡面他們在2019年到2022年他們使用天然氣跟柴油是8.6億度到13.36億度那代表了對於臺積電來講\n\n18\n00:06:28,757 --> 00:06:47,645\n能源穩定的問題是非常重要的那它佔了台灣出口的GDP非常重要的比例我認為怎麼樣子讓台灣的電力可以穩定是非常重要的議題尤其是在這一次的大停電之後那部長你會怎麼樣期許他\n\n19\n00:06:48,705 --> 00:06:56,871\n我們確實這個電力的部分大家都很關心那我想這個部分怎麼樣做好電力的供給我們也會跟新部長做好交接現在我們正在做的電源的開發也好或者因應產業界有新的需求我們怎麼樣搭配要提早準備等等我們一定都會去做說明我們今天還有審就是核後端的那個基金是\n\n20\n00:07:14,804 --> 00:07:42,255\n但是我其實在這四年來我一直在想那我也有問王總經理到底對於我們的核燃料棒現在是核廢料嗎怎麼樣子重新再利用那國際間已經有先進的科技可以重新再利用那對於相關的議題臺電有沒有進行相關的研究來\n\n21\n00:07:44,741 --> 00:08:03,822\n向委員報告齁,臺電持續在關注上國際上最新的科技的應用,就像委員提到的這些已經用過核燃料的這些廢料可不可以再精進的部分,那當然國外也在做這方面研究,那只要一旦有突破有成果,我們也會照這個成果。那你們有沒有去\n\n22\n00:08:05,683 --> 00:08:22,750\n請問您們有沒有去追蹤進一步的來瞭解說我們的核廢料是不是可以重新再用畢竟這些東西都是影響到居民嗎那怎麼樣子減輕居民對於過去我們使用\n\n23\n00:08:24,931 --> 00:08:48,668\n合電這樣子的一個壓力那未來如果我們繼續使用核電的時候我們才可以就是說解決核廢料的問題是不是是跟委員報告我們現在在核二、核一場場區要蓋中間的中期的這個核廢料的儲存場在那個儲存場我們會把已經用過的燃料棒放在那個地方\n\n24\n00:08:49,088 --> 00:09:02,593\n那一旦未來技術有如委員說的他可以再把這些燃料、廢燃料再濃縮然後再利用那這些技術但成熟這些我們就馬上就會有做後續的一些處置和應用好謝謝喔\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n149\t10071\t我們請謝衣鳯委員因為我們沒有休息所以如果行政部門有需要請自行謝謝主席我想要請台電的總經理我們再請王總經理\n30622\t56950\t黃總我想要請問一下就是我們在2021年跟我們2022年的停電就是事件的專案報告裡面你已經說明了我們夜間的就是因為太陽能電力的供應下降所以你們就是要想辦法讓夜間的電力的彈性可以恢復可是為什麼現在到了今年已經2023了\n59051\t63681\t我們還是沒有辦法是不是?\n63681\t65865\t2024跟委員報告齁這次最主要是因為\n67062\t89190\t地震之後的一些機組陸陸續續故障陸陸續續內傷不關系陸陸續續故障他不會是發生那這個狀況之下在15號當天是下午同時他半個小時之內發生的兩部應該講四部總共四部機組同時沒有電送出來這是個在台電送電的意思\n90430\t114870\t在那個我的大潭電廠的8號機110萬千瓦然後呢在明潭的有三部的抽蓄發電機那是因為它的送電出來一個很重要的一個設備叫做BUS那個BUS呢因為地震搖晃了之後就在那個15號當天造成它短路所以它那個三部機組的電也送不出來就是同時發生而且在這麼短又是我用電最緊的時候最多的\n115530\t140075\t負載的時候它發生所以那是一個連續兩個重擊台電的一個一個一個所以你這次的備載都沒有用到核電我看到都是柴油就是台積電的自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電所以我們的備轉方面還有核二核三的柴油發電機是我們等於是說在備轉的準備方面呢是會一道又一道的防線就是預防剛剛講到15號當天發生的這麼重重大的衝擊\n142876\t146357\t可是我想要理解的是如果說我們備轉的容量夠那為什麼需要用到就是說這麼多的柴油發電機還要用到台積電的\n172113\t188249\t因為我們還要預留3%在最後萬一還有下一個的重極台電的一個事故發生的時候我們還要能守住不限電所以我們先把其他的部分先用掉留100萬千瓦的餘裕容量在那邊大概是這個目的\n190911\t209597\t我有看到我們用了台積電自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電機但是根據台電111年度的永續報告書裡面台積電強調自己使用再生能源是達到預設的標準\n211457\t239919\t但是在2019到2022年他們直接使用天然氣柴油的是8.61億度到13.36億度那如果我們說我們真的是沒有缺電真的是穩定供電的話為什麼台積電會使用那個柴油跟天然氣而不是使用再生能源\n240359\t266702\t好 跟委員報告在2021那段時間主要是因為國內的景氣非常的好尤其是中美的問題之後很多台商回來所以那個時候的用電量突然暴增我們增加了大概6%的用電量從來沒有過這麼大的一個用電量所以在那個時候在某一些情境之下然後台電的機組又有故障所以那時候那幾年有請台積電出來協助\n267523\t267683\t發言委員\n285634\t307010\t所以跟委員報告其實這幾年臺電的電力一直在持續的建設包括像最近森巴,森巴是IPP不是臺電的電廠它已經在最近在試運轉了然後包括我們的臺中也有兩部機組新達也有三部機組正在興建所以我們這些量持續的在興建就是為了因應未來的用電的成長而在準備當中\n308471\t316999\t臺電都會在前面5年10年之間就在預備未來的用電需求一直在努力那我還想請問王部長王部長你要卸任了這要跟你恭喜還是要跟你歡送啊?你給自己打幾分?\n334469\t360009\t沒有打分數的問題就是做好每一天的工作你沒有打分數喔你對未來的那個我們新任的部長有什麼期許我們非常感謝他願意來承擔這樣的一個重責大任那對台灣的未來的經濟發展一定很有幫助是嗎他是對於我們半導體最瞭解的部長你覺得你跟他瞭解的程度是怎樣\n360829\t365393\t臺積電的永續報告裡面他們在2019年到2022年他們使用天然氣跟柴油是8.6億度到13.36億度那代表了對於臺積電來講\n388757\t407645\t能源穩定的問題是非常重要的那它佔了台灣出口的GDP非常重要的比例我認為怎麼樣子讓台灣的電力可以穩定是非常重要的議題尤其是在這一次的大停電之後那部長你會怎麼樣期許他\n408705\t416871\t我們確實這個電力的部分大家都很關心那我想這個部分怎麼樣做好電力的供給我們也會跟新部長做好交接現在我們正在做的電源的開發也好或者因應產業界有新的需求我們怎麼樣搭配要提早準備等等我們一定都會去做說明我們今天還有審就是核後端的那個基金是\n434804\t462255\t但是我其實在這四年來我一直在想那我也有問王總經理到底對於我們的核燃料棒現在是核廢料嗎怎麼樣子重新再利用那國際間已經有先進的科技可以重新再利用那對於相關的議題臺電有沒有進行相關的研究來\n464741\t483822\t向委員報告齁,臺電持續在關注上國際上最新的科技的應用,就像委員提到的這些已經用過核燃料的這些廢料可不可以再精進的部分,那當然國外也在做這方面研究,那只要一旦有突破有成果,我們也會照這個成果。 那你們有沒有去\n485683\t502750\t請問您們有沒有去追蹤進一步的來瞭解說我們的核廢料是不是可以重新再用畢竟這些東西都是影響到居民嗎那怎麼樣子減輕居民對於過去我們使用\n504931\t528668\t合電這樣子的一個壓力那未來如果我們繼續使用核電的時候我們才可以就是說解決核廢料的問題是不是是跟委員報告我們現在在核二、核一場場區要蓋中間的中期的這個核廢料的儲存場在那個儲存場我們會把已經用過的燃料棒放在那個地方\n529088\t542593\t那一旦未來技術有如委員說的他可以再把這些燃料、廢燃料再濃縮然後再利用那這些技術但成熟這些我們就馬上就會有做後續的一些處置和應用好 謝謝喔\n","txt":"我們請謝衣鳯委員因為我們沒有休息所以如果行政部門有需要請自行謝謝主席我想要請台電的總經理我們再請王總經理\n黃總我想要請問一下就是我們在2021年跟我們2022年的停電就是事件的專案報告裡面你已經說明了我們夜間的就是因為太陽能電力的供應下降所以你們就是要想辦法讓夜間的電力的彈性可以恢復可是為什麼現在到了今年已經2023了\n我們還是沒有辦法是不是?\n2024跟委員報告齁這次最主要是因為\n地震之後的一些機組陸陸續續故障陸陸續續內傷不關系陸陸續續故障他不會是發生那這個狀況之下在15號當天是下午同時他半個小時之內發生的兩部應該講四部總共四部機組同時沒有電送出來這是個在台電送電的意思\n在那個我的大潭電廠的8號機110萬千瓦然後呢在明潭的有三部的抽蓄發電機那是因為它的送電出來一個很重要的一個設備叫做BUS那個BUS呢因為地震搖晃了之後就在那個15號當天造成它短路所以它那個三部機組的電也送不出來就是同時發生而且在這麼短又是我用電最緊的時候最多的\n負載的時候它發生所以那是一個連續兩個重擊台電的一個一個一個所以你這次的備載都沒有用到核電我看到都是柴油就是台積電的自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電所以我們的備轉方面還有核二核三的柴油發電機是我們等於是說在備轉的準備方面呢是會一道又一道的防線就是預防剛剛講到15號當天發生的這麼重重大的衝擊\n可是我想要理解的是如果說我們備轉的容量夠那為什麼需要用到就是說這麼多的柴油發電機還要用到台積電的\n因為我們還要預留3%在最後萬一還有下一個的重極台電的一個事故發生的時候我們還要能守住不限電所以我們先把其他的部分先用掉留100萬千瓦的餘裕容量在那邊大概是這個目的\n我有看到我們用了台積電自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電機但是根據台電111年度的永續報告書裡面台積電強調自己使用再生能源是達到預設的標準\n但是在2019到2022年他們直接使用天然氣柴油的是8.61億度到13.36億度那如果我們說我們真的是沒有缺電真的是穩定供電的話為什麼台積電會使用那個柴油跟天然氣而不是使用再生能源\n好 跟委員報告在2021那段時間主要是因為國內的景氣非常的好尤其是中美的問題之後很多台商回來所以那個時候的用電量突然暴增我們增加了大概6%的用電量從來沒有過這麼大的一個用電量所以在那個時候在某一些情境之下然後台電的機組又有故障所以那時候那幾年有請台積電出來協助\n發言委員\n所以跟委員報告其實這幾年臺電的電力一直在持續的建設包括像最近森巴,森巴是IPP不是臺電的電廠它已經在最近在試運轉了然後包括我們的臺中也有兩部機組新達也有三部機組正在興建所以我們這些量持續的在興建就是為了因應未來的用電的成長而在準備當中\n臺電都會在前面5年10年之間就在預備未來的用電需求一直在努力那我還想請問王部長王部長你要卸任了這要跟你恭喜還是要跟你歡送啊?你給自己打幾分?\n沒有打分數的問題就是做好每一天的工作你沒有打分數喔你對未來的那個我們新任的部長有什麼期許我們非常感謝他願意來承擔這樣的一個重責大任那對台灣的未來的經濟發展一定很有幫助是嗎他是對於我們半導體最瞭解的部長你覺得你跟他瞭解的程度是怎樣\n臺積電的永續報告裡面他們在2019年到2022年他們使用天然氣跟柴油是8.6億度到13.36億度那代表了對於臺積電來講\n能源穩定的問題是非常重要的那它佔了台灣出口的GDP非常重要的比例我認為怎麼樣子讓台灣的電力可以穩定是非常重要的議題尤其是在這一次的大停電之後那部長你會怎麼樣期許他\n我們確實這個電力的部分大家都很關心那我想這個部分怎麼樣做好電力的供給我們也會跟新部長做好交接現在我們正在做的電源的開發也好或者因應產業界有新的需求我們怎麼樣搭配要提早準備等等我們一定都會去做說明我們今天還有審就是核後端的那個基金是\n但是我其實在這四年來我一直在想那我也有問王總經理到底對於我們的核燃料棒現在是核廢料嗎怎麼樣子重新再利用那國際間已經有先進的科技可以重新再利用那對於相關的議題臺電有沒有進行相關的研究來\n向委員報告齁,臺電持續在關注上國際上最新的科技的應用,就像委員提到的這些已經用過核燃料的這些廢料可不可以再精進的部分,那當然國外也在做這方面研究,那只要一旦有突破有成果,我們也會照這個成果。 那你們有沒有去\n請問您們有沒有去追蹤進一步的來瞭解說我們的核廢料是不是可以重新再用畢竟這些東西都是影響到居民嗎那怎麼樣子減輕居民對於過去我們使用\n合電這樣子的一個壓力那未來如果我們繼續使用核電的時候我們才可以就是說解決核廢料的問題是不是是跟委員報告我們現在在核二、核一場場區要蓋中間的中期的這個核廢料的儲存場在那個儲存場我們會把已經用過的燃料棒放在那個地方\n那一旦未來技術有如委員說的他可以再把這些燃料、廢燃料再濃縮然後再利用那這些技術但成熟這些我們就馬上就會有做後續的一些處置和應用好 謝謝喔\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.149 --> 00:10.071\n我們請謝衣鳯委員因為我們沒有休息所以如果行政部門有需要請自行謝謝主席我想要請台電的總經理我們再請王總經理\n\n00:30.622 --> 00:56.950\n黃總我想要請問一下就是我們在2021年跟我們2022年的停電就是事件的專案報告裡面你已經說明了我們夜間的就是因為太陽能電力的供應下降所以你們就是要想辦法讓夜間的電力的彈性可以恢復可是為什麼現在到了今年已經2023了\n\n00:59.051 --> 01:03.681\n我們還是沒有辦法是不是?\n\n01:03.681 --> 01:05.865\n2024跟委員報告齁這次最主要是因為\n\n01:07.062 --> 01:29.190\n地震之後的一些機組陸陸續續故障陸陸續續內傷不關系陸陸續續故障他不會是發生那這個狀況之下在15號當天是下午同時他半個小時之內發生的兩部應該講四部總共四部機組同時沒有電送出來這是個在台電送電的意思\n\n01:30.430 --> 01:54.870\n在那個我的大潭電廠的8號機110萬千瓦然後呢在明潭的有三部的抽蓄發電機那是因為它的送電出來一個很重要的一個設備叫做BUS那個BUS呢因為地震搖晃了之後就在那個15號當天造成它短路所以它那個三部機組的電也送不出來就是同時發生而且在這麼短又是我用電最緊的時候最多的\n\n01:55.530 --> 02:20.075\n負載的時候它發生所以那是一個連續兩個重擊台電的一個一個一個所以你這次的備載都沒有用到核電我看到都是柴油就是台積電的自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電所以我們的備轉方面還有核二核三的柴油發電機是我們等於是說在備轉的準備方面呢是會一道又一道的防線就是預防剛剛講到15號當天發生的這麼重重大的衝擊\n\n02:22.876 --> 02:26.357\n可是我想要理解的是如果說我們備轉的容量夠那為什麼需要用到就是說這麼多的柴油發電機還要用到台積電的\n\n02:52.113 --> 03:08.249\n因為我們還要預留3%在最後萬一還有下一個的重極台電的一個事故發生的時候我們還要能守住不限電所以我們先把其他的部分先用掉留100萬千瓦的餘裕容量在那邊大概是這個目的\n\n03:10.911 --> 03:29.597\n我有看到我們用了台積電自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電機但是根據台電111年度的永續報告書裡面台積電強調自己使用再生能源是達到預設的標準\n\n03:31.457 --> 03:59.919\n但是在2019到2022年他們直接使用天然氣柴油的是8.61億度到13.36億度那如果我們說我們真的是沒有缺電真的是穩定供電的話為什麼台積電會使用那個柴油跟天然氣而不是使用再生能源\n\n04:00.359 --> 04:26.702\n好跟委員報告在2021那段時間主要是因為國內的景氣非常的好尤其是中美的問題之後很多台商回來所以那個時候的用電量突然暴增我們增加了大概6%的用電量從來沒有過這麼大的一個用電量所以在那個時候在某一些情境之下然後台電的機組又有故障所以那時候那幾年有請台積電出來協助\n\n04:27.523 --> 04:27.683\n發言委員\n\n04:45.634 --> 05:07.010\n所以跟委員報告其實這幾年臺電的電力一直在持續的建設包括像最近森巴,森巴是IPP不是臺電的電廠它已經在最近在試運轉了然後包括我們的臺中也有兩部機組新達也有三部機組正在興建所以我們這些量持續的在興建就是為了因應未來的用電的成長而在準備當中\n\n05:08.471 --> 05:16.999\n臺電都會在前面5年10年之間就在預備未來的用電需求一直在努力那我還想請問王部長王部長你要卸任了這要跟你恭喜還是要跟你歡送啊?你給自己打幾分?\n\n05:34.469 --> 06:00.009\n沒有打分數的問題就是做好每一天的工作你沒有打分數喔你對未來的那個我們新任的部長有什麼期許我們非常感謝他願意來承擔這樣的一個重責大任那對台灣的未來的經濟發展一定很有幫助是嗎他是對於我們半導體最瞭解的部長你覺得你跟他瞭解的程度是怎樣\n\n06:00.829 --> 06:05.393\n臺積電的永續報告裡面他們在2019年到2022年他們使用天然氣跟柴油是8.6億度到13.36億度那代表了對於臺積電來講\n\n06:28.757 --> 06:47.645\n能源穩定的問題是非常重要的那它佔了台灣出口的GDP非常重要的比例我認為怎麼樣子讓台灣的電力可以穩定是非常重要的議題尤其是在這一次的大停電之後那部長你會怎麼樣期許他\n\n06:48.705 --> 06:56.871\n我們確實這個電力的部分大家都很關心那我想這個部分怎麼樣做好電力的供給我們也會跟新部長做好交接現在我們正在做的電源的開發也好或者因應產業界有新的需求我們怎麼樣搭配要提早準備等等我們一定都會去做說明我們今天還有審就是核後端的那個基金是\n\n07:14.804 --> 07:42.255\n但是我其實在這四年來我一直在想那我也有問王總經理到底對於我們的核燃料棒現在是核廢料嗎怎麼樣子重新再利用那國際間已經有先進的科技可以重新再利用那對於相關的議題臺電有沒有進行相關的研究來\n\n07:44.741 --> 08:03.822\n向委員報告齁,臺電持續在關注上國際上最新的科技的應用,就像委員提到的這些已經用過核燃料的這些廢料可不可以再精進的部分,那當然國外也在做這方面研究,那只要一旦有突破有成果,我們也會照這個成果。那你們有沒有去\n\n08:05.683 --> 08:22.750\n請問您們有沒有去追蹤進一步的來瞭解說我們的核廢料是不是可以重新再用畢竟這些東西都是影響到居民嗎那怎麼樣子減輕居民對於過去我們使用\n\n08:24.931 --> 08:48.668\n合電這樣子的一個壓力那未來如果我們繼續使用核電的時候我們才可以就是說解決核廢料的問題是不是是跟委員報告我們現在在核二、核一場場區要蓋中間的中期的這個核廢料的儲存場在那個儲存場我們會把已經用過的燃料棒放在那個地方\n\n08:49.088 --> 09:02.593\n那一旦未來技術有如委員說的他可以再把這些燃料、廢燃料再濃縮然後再利用那這些技術但成熟這些我們就馬上就會有做後續的一些處置和應用好謝謝喔\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.149,"end":10.071,"text":"我們請謝衣鳯委員因為我們沒有休息所以如果行政部門有需要請自行謝謝主席我想要請台電的總經理我們再請王總經理"},{"start":30.622,"end":56.95,"text":"黃總我想要請問一下就是我們在2021年跟我們2022年的停電就是事件的專案報告裡面你已經說明了我們夜間的就是因為太陽能電力的供應下降所以你們就是要想辦法讓夜間的電力的彈性可以恢復可是為什麼現在到了今年已經2023了"},{"start":59.051,"end":63.681,"text":"我們還是沒有辦法是不是?"},{"start":63.681,"end":65.865,"text":"2024跟委員報告齁這次最主要是因為"},{"start":67.062,"end":89.19,"text":"地震之後的一些機組陸陸續續故障陸陸續續內傷不關系陸陸續續故障他不會是發生那這個狀況之下在15號當天是下午同時他半個小時之內發生的兩部應該講四部總共四部機組同時沒有電送出來這是個在台電送電的意思"},{"start":90.43,"end":114.87,"text":"在那個我的大潭電廠的8號機110萬千瓦然後呢在明潭的有三部的抽蓄發電機那是因為它的送電出來一個很重要的一個設備叫做BUS那個BUS呢因為地震搖晃了之後就在那個15號當天造成它短路所以它那個三部機組的電也送不出來就是同時發生而且在這麼短又是我用電最緊的時候最多的"},{"start":115.53,"end":140.075,"text":"負載的時候它發生所以那是一個連續兩個重擊台電的一個一個一個所以你這次的備載都沒有用到核電我看到都是柴油就是台積電的自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電所以我們的備轉方面還有核二核三的柴油發電機是我們等於是說在備轉的準備方面呢是會一道又一道的防線就是預防剛剛講到15號當天發生的這麼重重大的衝擊"},{"start":142.876,"end":146.357,"text":"可是我想要理解的是如果說我們備轉的容量夠那為什麼需要用到就是說這麼多的柴油發電機還要用到台積電的"},{"start":172.113,"end":188.249,"text":"因為我們還要預留3%在最後萬一還有下一個的重極台電的一個事故發生的時候我們還要能守住不限電所以我們先把其他的部分先用掉留100萬千瓦的餘裕容量在那邊大概是這個目的"},{"start":190.911,"end":209.597,"text":"我有看到我們用了台積電自備的36萬千瓦的柴油發電機但是根據台電111年度的永續報告書裡面台積電強調自己使用再生能源是達到預設的標準"},{"start":211.457,"end":239.919,"text":"但是在2019到2022年他們直接使用天然氣柴油的是8.61億度到13.36億度那如果我們說我們真的是沒有缺電真的是穩定供電的話為什麼台積電會使用那個柴油跟天然氣而不是使用再生能源"},{"start":240.359,"end":266.702,"text":"好 跟委員報告在2021那段時間主要是因為國內的景氣非常的好尤其是中美的問題之後很多台商回來所以那個時候的用電量突然暴增我們增加了大概6%的用電量從來沒有過這麼大的一個用電量所以在那個時候在某一些情境之下然後台電的機組又有故障所以那時候那幾年有請台積電出來協助"},{"start":267.523,"end":267.683,"text":"發言委員"},{"start":285.634,"end":307.01,"text":"所以跟委員報告其實這幾年臺電的電力一直在持續的建設包括像最近森巴,森巴是IPP不是臺電的電廠它已經在最近在試運轉了然後包括我們的臺中也有兩部機組新達也有三部機組正在興建所以我們這些量持續的在興建就是為了因應未來的用電的成長而在準備當中"},{"start":308.471,"end":316.999,"text":"臺電都會在前面5年10年之間就在預備未來的用電需求一直在努力那我還想請問王部長王部長你要卸任了這要跟你恭喜還是要跟你歡送啊?你給自己打幾分?"},{"start":334.469,"end":360.009,"text":"沒有打分數的問題就是做好每一天的工作你沒有打分數喔你對未來的那個我們新任的部長有什麼期許我們非常感謝他願意來承擔這樣的一個重責大任那對台灣的未來的經濟發展一定很有幫助是嗎他是對於我們半導體最瞭解的部長你覺得你跟他瞭解的程度是怎樣"},{"start":360.829,"end":365.393,"text":"臺積電的永續報告裡面他們在2019年到2022年他們使用天然氣跟柴油是8.6億度到13.36億度那代表了對於臺積電來講"},{"start":388.757,"end":407.645,"text":"能源穩定的問題是非常重要的那它佔了台灣出口的GDP非常重要的比例我認為怎麼樣子讓台灣的電力可以穩定是非常重要的議題尤其是在這一次的大停電之後那部長你會怎麼樣期許他"},{"start":408.705,"end":416.871,"text":"我們確實這個電力的部分大家都很關心那我想這個部分怎麼樣做好電力的供給我們也會跟新部長做好交接現在我們正在做的電源的開發也好或者因應產業界有新的需求我們怎麼樣搭配要提早準備等等我們一定都會去做說明我們今天還有審就是核後端的那個基金是"},{"start":434.804,"end":462.255,"text":"但是我其實在這四年來我一直在想那我也有問王總經理到底對於我們的核燃料棒現在是核廢料嗎怎麼樣子重新再利用那國際間已經有先進的科技可以重新再利用那對於相關的議題臺電有沒有進行相關的研究來"},{"start":464.741,"end":483.822,"text":"向委員報告齁,臺電持續在關注上國際上最新的科技的應用,就像委員提到的這些已經用過核燃料的這些廢料可不可以再精進的部分,那當然國外也在做這方面研究,那只要一旦有突破有成果,我們也會照這個成果。 那你們有沒有去"},{"start":485.683,"end":502.75,"text":"請問您們有沒有去追蹤進一步的來瞭解說我們的核廢料是不是可以重新再用畢竟這些東西都是影響到居民嗎那怎麼樣子減輕居民對於過去我們使用"},{"start":504.931,"end":528.668,"text":"合電這樣子的一個壓力那未來如果我們繼續使用核電的時候我們才可以就是說解決核廢料的問題是不是是跟委員報告我們現在在核二、核一場場區要蓋中間的中期的這個核廢料的儲存場在那個儲存場我們會把已經用過的燃料棒放在那個地方"},{"start":529.088,"end":542.593,"text":"那一旦未來技術有如委員說的他可以再把這些燃料、廢燃料再濃縮然後再利用那這些技術但成熟這些我們就馬上就會有做後續的一些處置和應用好 謝謝喔"}]}}}}