{"id":151605,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151605","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/534e6c42fa7aedb353936cbf16b2d555a8d86c0863c2f2caeadb1108e4b844329c2ab639a50d16805ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"張嘉郡","委員發言時間":"09:43:30 - 09:52:53","影片長度":"00:09:23","會議時間":"2024-04-24T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第9次全體委員會議（事由：一、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關經濟部及所屬主管預算凍結案等21案。\n二、審查：\n（一）行政院函請審議「工廠管理輔導法第二十八條之十四、第三十一條及第三十九條條文修正草案」案。\n（二）本院委員黃捷等17人擬具「工廠管理輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（三）本院委員黃建賓等17人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第二十八條之十四、第三十一條及第三十九條條文修正草案」案。\n（四）本院委員林思銘等23人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第二十二條及第二十九條條文修正草案」案。\n（五）本院委員王美惠等18人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第三十一條條文修正草案」案。\n（六）本院委員邱議瑩等16人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第三十一條條文修正草案」案。\n（七）本院委員蔡易餘等20人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第二十八條之十四、第三十一條及第三十九條條文修正草案」案。\n（八）本院委員馬文君等18人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第二十八條之十四及第三十一條條文修正草案」案。\n（九）本院委員鍾佳濱等17人擬具「工廠管理輔導法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（十）本院委員楊瓊瓔等16人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第二十八條之十四、第三十一條及第三十九條條文修正草案」案。\n（十一）本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「工廠管理輔導法第二十八條之十四、第三十一條及第三十九條條文修正草案」案。\n【4月24日及25日二天一次會】）","date":"2024-04-24","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第9次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":9,"committees":[19],"id":"委員會-11-1-19-9"},"duration":563,"end_time":"2024-04-24T09:52:53+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-24T09:43:30+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":209,"blocks":[["張委員嘉郡：（9時43分）主席，我想請部長。"],["主席：有請部長，謝謝。"],["張委員嘉郡：部長，這幾天您的時尚形象引起很多討論，但我覺得這對我們女性從政人員是一個非常大的鼓勵，就是不只專業，還可以美麗。","新舊內閣即將交接，部長為國戮力從公40年，經濟部長顯然應該不會是您的終點，所以很多報導都在分析您的下一步，包括政委，甚至中油、台電、中鋼的董座都被討論到，如果部長未來被邀請去擔任這三大國營事業的董座，請問部長有沒有意願？"],["王部長美花：我沒有接收到這樣的訊息，我想也不適合。"],["張委員嘉郡：再請問部長，中油、台電、中鋼這三大國營企業的董座未來會全部替換嗎？"],["王部長美花：這個要由新的政府來決定。"],["張委員嘉郡：所以您都還沒有耳聞？"],["王部長美花：我不瞭解。"],["張委員嘉郡：到目前為止都沒有耳聞？"],["王部長美花：是，我不瞭解。"],["張委員嘉郡：那您會不會同意說，這三大國營企業的董座都應該是專業凌駕政治考量呢？"],["王部長美花：一定會用專業來考量。"],["張委員嘉郡：千萬不能用政治考量或者是用酬庸來超越專業考量，這一點是本席想要提醒的。"],["王部長美花：我想新政府一定是這樣的想法。"],["張委員嘉郡：接下來本席想要問，4月20日台電發了一份聲明，內文寫著：不該把台電作為政治攻防工具，少數人滑著3C產品，卻對台電酸言酸語，對台電人不公平。其實我也知道台電的基層人員非常辛苦，這個本席完全認同也完全支持台電的確是非常努力，但是台電總經理王耀庭為此請辭。今天台電沒有派員列席，但是我要請問部長，作為台電的主管機關，你認為台電是政策決策者還是政策執行者？"],["王部長美花：台電當然是政策的執行者。"],["張委員嘉郡：是！所以我們都知道台電雖然負責全國的供電，但它只是供電政策的執行單位，那麼請問部長，您覺得經濟部是臺灣供電政策的決策單位嗎？"],["王部長美花：我們當然是決策的其中一環。"],["張委員嘉郡：其中一環？"],["王部長美花：是。"],["張委員嘉郡：所以您也不是決策者？"],["王部長美花：因為整個電力的部分當然是整個院裡面會就整個國家的需求來做決策。"],["張委員嘉郡：其實我覺得部長針對這件事情相當誠實，就是您只是決策的一環，因為我認為真正的決策單位甚至連經濟部都不是。現在臺灣的能源政策都是為了服膺於民進黨的非核黨綱！民進黨的行動黨綱第64條寫得很清楚，反對新設核能發電機組、限期關閉現有核電廠。這個指導方向的源頭代表著台電的大量虧損、全民漲電價、全民買單，都是因為民進黨的非核黨綱。您同不同意？"],["王部長美花：我不同意。其實我們澄清過非常多次，這確實是俄烏戰爭之後國際能源價格……"],["張委員嘉郡：為了非核黨綱，廢棄了便宜的核能，使用煤碳又怕被批評製造溫室氣體，所以只好選擇天然氣，但是天然氣價格高昂、儲存不易，更容易因國際局勢變動而有價格波動，這就是剛才部長所講的，所以俄烏戰爭爆發之後，天然氣價格大漲，我們臺灣的發電成本也漲了好幾倍，所以過去這段時間以來，社會上的批評聲音都是針對能源政策。現在臺灣的能源政策是政治凌駕專業的結果，逆勢而為當然使得許多文官都會心寒而離開。所以我認為王耀庭的請辭雖然表面上是說不忍台電被批評，但是部長你清楚、王耀庭也很清楚，如果錯誤的能源政策不有所改正的話，再換100個總經理也沒有用啊！再換部長也沒有用啊！王耀庭是從基層做起的文官，他請辭的真正意涵就是在向即將上任的賴總統和卓院長表達非常明確的訊息：再不改正能源政策，台電也不願意再為民進黨背這個黑鍋。這才是王耀庭請辭的真正意涵……"],["王部長美花：不是，完全不是！"],["張委員嘉郡：不曉得我們的部長認不認同？"],["王部長美花：完全不是，總經理也說得非常清楚，因為大家沒有辦法就事論事，對於地震之後的機組故障以及相關的設備壞掉這個部分，都被講成是缺電，我想這是他……"],["張委員嘉郡：接下來我要請部長看一下本席出示的資料，就是最近國際上有智庫單位對我們臺灣的能源政策提出建議，日本的全國性報紙《日本經濟新聞》4月22日刊登的頭條是「Taiwan's Lai needs to rethink nuclear shutdown plan」，說賴清德應該重新檢討非核政策。這個你同意嗎？"],["王部長美花：我想各個意見我們都尊重，新的政府對現在我們臺灣相關的供電問題……"],["張委員嘉郡：美國華盛頓智庫全球台灣研究中心研究員Jordan McGillis撰寫分析臺灣核能政策的文章說，因為半導體的發展，臺灣是亞洲人均耗電最高的地區，但臺灣的電力供應顯然並沒有跟上腳步；民進黨極力推動非核家園，導致核電從2011年的42百萬瓦到2022年僅剩24百萬瓦，雖然2018年公投大家都希望以核養綠，但蔡英文總統跟賴清德仍然持續要推動非核政策；再生能源到現在也遙遙無期。連反核最力、去年已經完全無核化的德國現在也開始討論要重啟核電。我記得上次問部長，7月開始核三就要準備退役，當時部長回答說會如期退役，經過這段時間，我再以同樣的問題來問部長，不曉得您現在的答案為何？"],["王部長美花：有關核電要延役，我想委員也很清楚，第一個是要能做科學的討論，第二個是核能的安全，第三個是按照現行規定，核電運轉40年就是要停止，討論很多……"],["張委員嘉郡：所以它是有討論空間的嘛！"],["王部長美花：還有核後端的核廢的處理，我想這個都需要臺灣社會的共識。"],["張委員嘉郡：是要專業討論啊！包括和碩董事長童子賢，他同時也是民進黨新境界文教基金會的副董事長，而董事長就是賴清德總統。童子賢董事長近日發表演講的時候提到缺電，他說自己反核30年，現在想法改變了，他認為地球暖化才是公敵，核能不是，所以他改變了30年來的反核立場。一個反核30年的人，想法都會改變，國際上的潮流也興起重啟核能，這一點希望經濟部一定要用專業超越政治考量。","其實民進黨的政策也是會轉彎的！2016年之前，民進黨也反對萊豬啊，2020年它反而開放萊豬進口；包括2015年反對開放福島食品進口，2022年也開放了；包括2005年的不分區立委蔡英文，他就說臺灣必須靠電能帶動經濟，核四一定要興建，結果2011年蔡英文主席又重提非核家園。所以其實討論的空間是有的，這一點部長同意嗎？"],["王部長美花：所有這些剛才委員在講的，包括日本的食品跟豬，都是要用科學的依據、國際的標準來做。相關的能源部分，我們也尊重大家的意見，立法院有很多討論，我們都尊重。"],["張委員嘉郡：好，謝謝部長，祝福部長！"],["主席（邱委員議瑩）：謝謝張嘉郡委員的發言。","接下來我們請鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":186,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-19-9","speakers":["邱議瑩","黃建賓","楊瓊瓔","張啓楷","林思銘","林岱樺","張嘉郡","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","陳亭妃","呂玉玲","賴瑞隆","邱志偉","鄭正鈐","謝衣鳯","蔡易餘","何欣純","黃國昌","洪孟楷","黃捷","羅智強","牛煦庭","陳超明","鍾佳濱","陳冠廷","王美惠"],"page_start":115,"meetingDate":["2024-04-24"],"gazette_id":"1133301","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1133301_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第9次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、處理或審查113年度中央政府總預算有關經濟部及所屬主管預算凍結案等 21案；二、審查：\n(一)行政院函請審議「工廠管理輔導法第二十八條之十四、第三十一條及第三十九條條文修正草\n案」案、(二)本院委員黃捷等17人擬具「工廠管理輔導法部分條文修正草案」案、(三)本院委員\n黃建賓等 17 人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第二十八條之十四、第三十一條及第三十九條條文修正草\n案」案、(四)本院委員林思銘等23人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第二十二條及第二十九條條文修正草\n案」案、(五)本院委員王美惠等18人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第三十一條條文修正草案」案、(六)\n本院委員邱議瑩等16人擬具「工廠管理輔導法第三十一條條文修正草案」案、(七)本院委員蔡易\n餘等20 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\"負責整個電力的部分當然會有到整個院裡面會有整個國家的需求其實我覺得部長你是針對這件事情你是相當誠實就是您只是決策的一環因為我認為真正的決策單位甚至連經濟部都不是現在臺灣的\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"負\", \"start\": 169.934, \"end\": 170.934, \"score\": 0.942}, {\"word\": \"責\"}, {\"word\": \"整\", \"start\": 170.934, \"end\": 171.955, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"電\"}, {\"word\": \"力\", \"start\": 171.955, \"end\": 172.135, \"score\": 0.806}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 172.135, \"end\": 172.295, \"score\": 0.823}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 172.295, \"end\": 172.455, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 172.455, \"end\": 172.775, \"score\": 0.859}, {\"word\": \"當\"}, {\"word\": \"然\", \"start\": 172.775, \"end\": 173.235, \"score\": 0.722}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 173.235, \"end\": 173.755, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 173.755, \"end\": 173.995, \"score\": 0.895}, {\"word\": \"整\", \"start\": 173.995, \"end\": 174.316, \"score\": 0.852}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"院\", \"start\": 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{\"word\": \"本\", \"start\": 251.846, \"end\": 251.866, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 251.866, \"end\": 251.886, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"漲\"}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 251.886, \"end\": 251.906, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 251.906, \"end\": 251.926, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"幾\"}, {\"word\": \"倍\", \"start\": 251.926, \"end\": 251.946, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 251.946, \"end\": 252.006, \"score\": 0.667}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 252.006, \"end\": 252.026, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"過\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 252.026, \"end\": 252.046, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"段\", \"start\": 252.046, \"end\": 252.106, \"score\": 0.577}, {\"word\": \"時\"}, {\"word\": \"間\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"社\", \"start\": 252.106, \"end\": 252.126, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 252.126, \"end\": 252.226, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 252.226, 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\"end\": 252.887, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"源\", \"start\": 252.887, \"end\": 252.987, \"score\": 0.795}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 252.987, \"end\": 253.067, \"score\": 0.61}, {\"word\": \"策\", \"start\": 253.067, \"end\": 253.087, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 253.087, \"end\": 253.107, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 253.107, \"end\": 253.467, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"治\", \"start\": 253.467, \"end\": 253.487, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"凌\", \"start\": 253.487, \"end\": 253.607, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"駕\"}, {\"word\": \"專\"}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 253.607, \"end\": 253.627, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"結\"}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 253.627, \"end\": 253.647, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 269.033, \"end\": 285.635, \"text\": \"逆勢而為當然使得許多文官都會心寒而離開啊。」所以我認為這個王耀廷的請辭雖然表面上是說不忍台電被批評但部長你清楚王耀廷也很清楚如果錯誤的能源政策不由所改動的話\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"逆\", \"start\": 269.033, \"end\": 269.574, \"score\": 0.743}, {\"word\": \"勢\"}, {\"word\": \"而\", \"start\": 269.574, \"end\": 270.115, \"score\": 0.711}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"當\"}, {\"word\": \"然\", \"start\": 270.115, \"end\": 270.315, \"score\": 0.695}, {\"word\": \"使\", \"start\": 270.315, \"end\": 270.515, \"score\": 0.709}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 270.515, \"end\": 270.695, \"score\": 0.85}, {\"word\": \"許\", \"start\": 270.695, \"end\": 270.896, \"score\": 0.781}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 270.896, \"end\": 271.096, \"score\": 0.847}, {\"word\": \"文\", \"start\": 271.096, \"end\": 271.316, \"score\": 0.821}, {\"word\": \"官\", \"start\": 271.316, \"end\": 271.516, \"score\": 0.827}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 271.516, \"end\": 271.797, \"score\": 0.733}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"心\", \"start\": 271.797, \"end\": 271.997, \"score\": 0.707}, {\"word\": \"寒\", \"start\": 271.997, \"end\": 272.177, \"score\": 0.776}, {\"word\": \"而\", \"start\": 272.177, \"end\": 272.718, \"score\": 0.79}, {\"word\": \"離\"}, {\"word\": \"開\"}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 272.718, \"end\": 273.259, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"。\"}, {\"word\": \"」\"}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 273.259, \"end\": 273.359, \"score\": 0.803}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 273.359, \"end\": 273.459, \"score\": 0.24}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 273.459, \"end\": 274.38, \"score\": 0.722}, {\"word\": \"認\"}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"王\", \"start\": 274.38, \"end\": 274.6, \"score\": 0.85}, {\"word\": \"耀\", \"start\": 274.6, \"end\": 274.801, \"score\": 0.774}, {\"word\": \"廷\", \"start\": 274.801, \"end\": 274.941, \"score\": 0.687}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 274.941, \"end\": 276.082, \"score\": 0.83}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"辭\"}, {\"word\": \"雖\"}, {\"word\": \"然\", \"start\": 276.082, \"end\": 276.403, \"score\": 0.811}, {\"word\": \"表\", \"start\": 276.403, \"end\": 276.663, \"score\": 0.763}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 276.663, \"end\": 276.883, \"score\": 0.85}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 276.883, \"end\": 277.164, \"score\": 0.785}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 277.164, \"end\": 277.704, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 277.704, \"end\": 277.885, \"score\": 0.845}, {\"word\": \"忍\", \"start\": 277.885, \"end\": 278.145, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 278.145, \"end\": 278.546, \"score\": 0.694}, {\"word\": \"電\"}, {\"word\": \"被\", \"start\": 278.546, \"end\": 278.726, \"score\": 0.734}, {\"word\": \"批\", \"start\": 278.726, \"end\": 279.447, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"評\"}, {\"word\": \"但\", \"start\": 279.447, \"end\": 279.627, \"score\": 0.669}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 279.627, \"end\": 279.967, \"score\": 0.67}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 279.967, \"end\": 280.108, \"score\": 0.6}, {\"word\": \"清\", \"start\": 280.108, \"end\": 280.368, \"score\": 0.737}, {\"word\": \"楚\", \"start\": 280.368, \"end\": 280.808, \"score\": 0.893}, {\"word\": \"王\", \"start\": 280.808, \"end\": 281.089, \"score\": 0.718}, {\"word\": \"耀\", \"start\": 281.089, \"end\": 281.309, \"score\": 0.686}, {\"word\": \"廷\", \"start\": 281.309, \"end\": 281.469, \"score\": 0.72}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 281.469, \"end\": 281.63, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 281.63, \"end\": 281.85, \"score\": 0.711}, {\"word\": \"清\", \"start\": 281.85, \"end\": 282.07, \"score\": 0.881}, {\"word\": \"楚\", \"start\": 282.07, \"end\": 282.511, \"score\": 0.946}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 282.511, \"end\": 282.811, \"score\": 0.721}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 282.811, \"end\": 283.452, \"score\": 0.73}, {\"word\": \"錯\"}, {\"word\": \"誤\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 283.452, \"end\": 283.592, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 283.592, \"end\": 283.772, \"score\": 0.771}, {\"word\": \"源\", \"start\": 283.772, \"end\": 284.013, \"score\": 0.752}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 284.013, \"end\": 284.313, \"score\": 0.773}, {\"word\": \"策\", \"start\": 284.313, \"end\": 284.633, \"score\": 0.791}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 284.633, \"end\": 284.854, \"score\": 0.748}, {\"word\": \"由\", \"start\": 284.854, \"end\": 285.174, \"score\": 0.794}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 285.174, \"end\": 285.455, \"score\": 0.86}, {\"word\": \"改\", \"start\": 285.455, \"end\": 285.615, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 285.615, \"end\": 285.635, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"話\"}]}, {\"start\": 286.656, \"end\": 313.662, \"text\": \"再換一百個總經理也沒有用啊再換部長也沒有用啊王耀廷他是從基層做起的文官他的請辭真正的意涵就是在向即將上任的賴總統跟卓院長表達非常明確的訊息就是如果再不改正能源政策台電也不願意再為民進黨背這個黑鍋這才是王耀廷請辭的真正意涵不曉得不曉得我們的部長\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 286.656, \"end\": 287.076, \"score\": 0.71}, {\"word\": \"換\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 287.076, \"end\": 287.256, \"score\": 0.627}, {\"word\": \"百\", \"start\": 287.256, \"end\": 287.976, \"score\": 0.694}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"理\", \"start\": 287.976, \"end\": 288.096, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 288.096, \"end\": 288.256, \"score\": 0.854}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 288.256, \"end\": 288.396, \"score\": 0.796}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 288.396, \"end\": 288.556, \"score\": 0.844}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 288.556, \"end\": 288.737, \"score\": 0.818}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 288.737, \"end\": 289.277, \"score\": 0.876}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 289.277, \"end\": 289.677, \"score\": 0.536}, {\"word\": \"換\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 289.677, \"end\": 290.017, \"score\": 0.685}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"也\", \"start\": 290.017, \"end\": 290.117, \"score\": 0.869}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 290.117, \"end\": 290.257, \"score\": 0.569}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 290.257, \"end\": 290.417, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 290.417, \"end\": 290.637, \"score\": 0.815}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 290.637, \"end\": 291.177, \"score\": 0.874}, {\"word\": \"王\", \"start\": 291.177, \"end\": 291.377, \"score\": 0.784}, {\"word\": \"耀\", \"start\": 291.377, \"end\": 291.557, \"score\": 0.503}, {\"word\": \"廷\", \"start\": 291.557, \"end\": 291.697, \"score\": 0.675}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 291.697, \"end\": 291.857, \"score\": 0.765}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 291.857, \"end\": 292.237, \"score\": 0.809}, {\"word\": \"從\"}, {\"word\": \"基\", \"start\": 292.237, \"end\": 292.617, \"score\": 0.796}, {\"word\": \"層\"}, {\"word\": \"做\", \"start\": 292.617, \"end\": 292.837, \"score\": 0.804}, {\"word\": \"起\", \"start\": 292.837, \"end\": 292.978, \"score\": 0.655}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 292.978, \"end\": 293.118, \"score\": 0.801}, {\"word\": \"文\", \"start\": 293.118, \"end\": 293.358, \"score\": 0.849}, {\"word\": \"官\", \"start\": 293.358, \"end\": 293.978, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 293.978, \"end\": 294.378, \"score\": 0.852}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 294.378, \"end\": 295.078, \"score\": 0.756}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"辭\"}, {\"word\": \"真\", \"start\": 295.078, \"end\": 295.378, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"正\", \"start\": 295.378, \"end\": 295.558, \"score\": 0.77}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 295.558, \"end\": 295.658, \"score\": 0.713}, {\"word\": \"意\", \"start\": 295.658, \"end\": 295.838, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"涵\", \"start\": 295.838, \"end\": 296.198, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 296.198, \"end\": 296.438, \"score\": 0.82}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 296.438, \"end\": 296.638, \"score\": 0.748}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 296.638, \"end\": 296.838, \"score\": 0.838}, {\"word\": \"向\", \"start\": 296.838, \"end\": 297.359, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"即\", \"start\": 297.359, \"end\": 297.959, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"將\"}, {\"word\": \"上\", \"start\": 297.959, \"end\": 298.179, \"score\": 0.835}, {\"word\": \"任\", \"start\": 298.179, \"end\": 298.359, \"score\": 0.757}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 298.359, 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\"start\": 312.482, \"end\": 312.702, \"score\": 0.814}, {\"word\": \"正\", \"start\": 312.702, \"end\": 312.902, \"score\": 0.741}, {\"word\": \"意\", \"start\": 312.902, \"end\": 313.062, \"score\": 0.679}, {\"word\": \"涵\", \"start\": 313.062, \"end\": 313.082, \"score\": 0.005}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 313.082, \"end\": 313.242, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"曉\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 313.242, \"end\": 313.262, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 313.262, \"end\": 313.282, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"曉\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 313.282, \"end\": 313.502, \"score\": 0.764}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 313.502, \"end\": 313.622, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 313.622, \"end\": 313.642, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 313.642, \"end\": 313.662, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"長\"}]}, {\"start\": 316.663, \"end\": 331.211, \"text\": \"認不認同?完全不是,這個他已經總經理也說得非常清楚那因為大家沒有辦法就事論事對於地震之後的機組故障以及相關的壞掉的這個部分接下來我再請部長看這個是就是說最近國際上有智庫單位對我們臺灣的能源政策也提出建議這個日本的全國性的報紙\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"認\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 316.663, \"end\": 316.983, \"score\": 0.716}, {\"word\": \"認\"}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 316.983, \"end\": 317.524, \"score\": 0.714}, {\"word\": \"?\"}, {\"word\": \"完\", \"start\": 317.524, \"end\": 317.724, \"score\": 0.716}, {\"word\": \"全\", \"start\": 317.724, \"end\": 317.924, \"score\": 0.687}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 317.924, \"end\": 318.064, \"score\": 0.823}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 318.064, \"end\": 318.784, \"score\": 0.814}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 318.784, \"end\": 318.984, \"score\": 0.848}, {\"word\": \"已\", \"start\": 318.984, \"end\": 319.865, \"score\": 0.821}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"總\"}, {\"word\": \"經\"}, {\"word\": \"理\", \"start\": 319.865, \"end\": 319.965, \"score\": 0.972}, {\"word\": \"也\", 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0.75}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 562.824, \"end\": 562.844, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"。\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,220 --> 00:00:10,611\n當家軍委員質詢,謝謝。主席,我想請部長。有請部長,謝謝。\n\n2\n00:00:14,512 --> 00:00:29,357\n部長這幾天您的時尚形象引起很多的討論但是我覺得這對我們女性從政人員是一個非常大的鼓勵就是說不只專業還可以美麗新舊內閣即將交接部長為國陸力從功40年經濟部長顯然應該不會是您的終點現在很多報導都在分析您的下一步\n\n3\n00:00:41,761 --> 00:01:09,129\n包括政委甚至中油、台電、中鋼的董作都被討論。如果部長未來被邀請去擔任這三大國營事業的董作,請問部長有沒有意願?我沒有接受這樣的訊息,我想也不適合。那再請問部長,請問一下中油、台電、中鋼這三大國營企業的董作未來會全部替換嗎?\n\n4\n00:01:10,229 --> 00:01:12,310\n三大國營企業的動作都應該是專業凌駕政治考量呢?\n\n5\n00:01:27,018 --> 00:01:35,624\n一定會用專業來考量,千萬不能夠用政治考量或者是用酬庸來超越專業的考量。」\n\n6\n00:01:42,369 --> 00:02:08,132\n就是本席想要問四月二十日臺電發了一聲一張新聞內文寫著說不該把臺電作為政治工房的工具少數人滑著3C產品卻對臺電酸言酸語對臺電人不公平那其實我也知道說臺電的基層人員非常辛苦這個本席完全都認同也完全支持說臺電的確是非常努力但是呢臺電\n\n7\n00:02:10,054 --> 00:02:22,465\n總經理王耀廷為此請辭。今天台電沒有來,但我要請問部長,作為台電的主管機關,你認為台電是政策決策者還是政策執行者?」\n\n8\n00:02:24,831 --> 00:02:48,994\n臺電當然是政策的執行者是所以我們都知道臺電雖然負責全國的供電但他只是供電政策的執行單位那麼請問部長您覺得經濟部是臺灣供電政策的決策單位嗎我們當然是決策的其中一環是其中一環所以你也不是決策者\n\n9\n00:02:49,934 --> 00:03:00,818\n負責整個電力的部分當然會有到整個院裡面會有整個國家的需求其實我覺得部長你是針對這件事情你是相當誠實就是您只是決策的一環因為我認為真正的決策單位甚至連經濟部都不是現在臺灣的\n\n10\n00:03:11,021 --> 00:03:24,888\n政策、能源政策都是為了服膺於民進黨的非核檔綱。民進黨的行動檔綱第六十四條就寫得很清楚反對新設核能發電機組限期關閉現有的核電廠\n\n11\n00:03:28,089 --> 00:03:32,250\n那這個指導方向的源頭代表著臺電的大量虧損全民漲電價全民買單都是因為民進黨的非核檔綱您同不同意我不同意齁這個我們其實澄清過非常多次那這個確實是惡霧戰爭之後的國際等等人家為了非核檔綱廢棄了\n\n12\n00:03:53,911 --> 00:03:58,975\n便宜的核能煤炭又怕被批評製造溫室氣體所以只好選擇天然氣但是天然氣價格高昂儲存不易更容易受到這個國際局勢的這個變動波動這就剛才部長所講的\n\n13\n00:04:11,286 --> 00:04:13,647\n所以二五戰爭爆發之後天然氣價格大漲我們台灣的這個發電成本也漲了好幾倍所以過去這段時間來社會上的批評聲音都是針對能源政策現在台灣的能源政策是政治凌駕專業的結果\n\n14\n00:04:29,033 --> 00:04:45,635\n逆勢而為當然使得許多文官都會心寒而離開啊。」所以我認為這個王耀廷的請辭雖然表面上是說不忍台電被批評但部長你清楚王耀廷也很清楚如果錯誤的能源政策不由所改動的話\n\n15\n00:04:46,656 --> 00:05:13,662\n再換一百個總經理也沒有用啊再換部長也沒有用啊王耀廷他是從基層做起的文官他的請辭真正的意涵就是在向即將上任的賴總統跟卓院長表達非常明確的訊息就是如果再不改正能源政策台電也不願意再為民進黨背這個黑鍋這才是王耀廷請辭的真正意涵不曉得不曉得我們的部長\n\n16\n00:05:16,663 --> 00:05:31,211\n認不認同?完全不是,這個他已經總經理也說得非常清楚那因為大家沒有辦法就事論事對於地震之後的機組故障以及相關的壞掉的這個部分接下來我再請部長看這個是就是說最近國際上有智庫單位對我們臺灣的能源政策也提出建議這個日本的全國性的報紙\n\n17\n00:05:42,317 --> 00:05:53,812\n這個日本經濟新聞在四月二十二號他就刊登了。他的頭條就寫說Taiwan'slineneedstorethinknuclearshutdownplan他說賴清德應該重新檢討非核政策這個你同意嗎?\n\n18\n00:05:57,536 --> 00:06:07,787\n我相信各個意見我們都尊重那我想新的政府我們對我們現在的這個臺灣的這個相關的問題這個華盛頓的智庫的全球臺灣研究中心研究員就是這個JordanMargulis他也分析臺灣的核能政策文章他就說因為半導體的發展臺灣是\n\n19\n00:06:20,820 --> 00:06:25,105\n亞洲人均耗電最高的地區但臺灣的電力供應顯然並沒有跟上腳步民進黨極力推的非核家園導致核電從2011年42百萬瓦到2022年的24百萬瓦\n\n20\n00:06:38,942 --> 00:06:52,908\n就是雖然這個2018的公投大家都希望說核電以核養綠但是蔡英文總統跟賴清德仍然持續要推動這個非核政策那再生能源到現在也遙遙無期所以現在\n\n21\n00:06:57,070 --> 00:07:16,201\n連最反核最得利的德國到去年他已經完全無核化了現在也開始討論要重啟核電那我記得上一次問部長7月開始核三就要準備退役當時部長回答說會如期退役那經過這段時間我同樣的問題問部長不曉得您現在的答案為何\n\n22\n00:07:22,524 --> 00:07:27,027\n我想核電要延續那委員也很清楚那第一個這個要能夠這個科學的討論第二個核能的安全第三個相關的現在的規定核電這個運轉40年按照現在的規定它就是要停止所以它是有討論空間的嗎它是有討論空間的還有核後端的核廢的處理我想這個都需要台灣社會的共識\n\n23\n00:07:48,978 --> 00:08:03,124\n專業討論,包括合術董事長童子賢,他同時也是民進黨新境界文教基金會的副董事長,而董事長就是賴清德總統。他近日發表演講的時候提到缺點,他說他反核三十年,\n\n24\n00:08:03,584 --> 00:08:28,583\n但是想法改變了他認為地球暖化才是公敵何能不是所以他改變了三十年來的反核立場一個反核三十年的人想法都會改變國際上的潮流也興起重啟核能這一點希望經濟部一定要用專業超越這個政治考量因為民進黨的政策也是會轉彎的2016年前民進黨也反對萊豬2020年\n\n25\n00:08:33,727 --> 00:08:35,970\n開板開放來租包括2015年這個反對開放輔導這個食品進口2022年也是開放了輔導食品進口包括說2005年那時候的不分區立委蔡英文他就說\n\n26\n00:08:49,389 --> 00:09:01,857\n台灣必須靠電能帶動經濟,核四一定要興建,結果2011年蔡英文主席又重提非核家園,所以其實討論的空間是有的,這一點部長同意嗎?\n\n27\n00:09:19,249 --> 00:09:22,844\n第二十八條之十四、第三十一條條文修正草案案。\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n220\t10611\t當家軍委員質詢,謝謝。主席,我想請部長。有請部長,謝謝。\n14512\t29357\t部長這幾天您的時尚形象引起很多的討論但是我覺得這對我們女性從政人員是一個非常大的鼓勵就是說不只專業還可以美麗新舊內閣即將交接部長為國陸力從功40年經濟部長顯然應該不會是您的終點現在很多報導都在分析您的下一步\n41761\t69129\t包括政委甚至中油、台電、中鋼的董作都被討論。如果部長未來被邀請去擔任這三大國營事業的董作,請問部長有沒有意願?我沒有接受這樣的訊息,我想也不適合。那再請問部長,請問一下中油、台電、中鋼這三大國營企業的董作未來會全部替換嗎?\n70229\t72310\t三大國營企業的動作都應該是專業凌駕政治考量呢?\n87018\t95624\t一定會用專業來考量,千萬不能夠用政治考量或者是用酬庸來超越專業的考量。」\n102369\t128132\t就是本席想要問四月二十日臺電發了一聲一張新聞內文寫著說不該把臺電作為政治工房的工具少數人滑著3C產品卻對臺電酸言酸語對臺電人不公平那其實我也知道說臺電的基層人員非常辛苦這個本席完全都認同也完全支持說臺電的確是非常努力但是呢臺電\n130054\t142465\t總經理王耀廷為此請辭。今天台電沒有來,但我要請問部長,作為台電的主管機關,你認為台電是政策決策者還是政策執行者?」\n144831\t168994\t臺電當然是政策的執行者是所以我們都知道臺電雖然負責全國的供電但他只是供電政策的執行單位那麼請問部長您覺得經濟部是臺灣供電政策的決策單位嗎我們當然是決策的其中一環是其中一環所以你也不是決策者\n169934\t180818\t負責整個電力的部分當然會有到整個院裡面會有整個國家的需求其實我覺得部長你是針對這件事情你是相當誠實就是您只是決策的一環因為我認為真正的決策單位甚至連經濟部都不是現在臺灣的\n191021\t204888\t政策、能源政策都是為了服膺於民進黨的非核檔綱。民進黨的行動檔綱第六十四條就寫得很清楚反對新設核能發電機組限期關閉現有的核電廠\n208089\t212250\t那這個指導方向的源頭代表著臺電的大量虧損全民漲電價全民買單都是因為民進黨的非核檔綱您同不同意我不同意齁這個我們其實澄清過非常多次那這個確實是惡霧戰爭之後的國際等等人家為了非核檔綱廢棄了\n233911\t238975\t便宜的核能煤炭又怕被批評製造溫室氣體所以只好選擇天然氣但是天然氣價格高昂儲存不易更容易受到這個國際局勢的這個變動波動這就剛才部長所講的\n251286\t253647\t所以二五戰爭爆發之後天然氣價格大漲我們台灣的這個發電成本也漲了好幾倍所以過去這段時間來社會上的批評聲音都是針對能源政策現在台灣的能源政策是政治凌駕專業的結果\n269033\t285635\t逆勢而為當然使得許多文官都會心寒而離開啊。」所以我認為這個王耀廷的請辭雖然表面上是說不忍台電被批評但部長你清楚王耀廷也很清楚如果錯誤的能源政策不由所改動的話\n286656\t313662\t再換一百個總經理也沒有用啊再換部長也沒有用啊王耀廷他是從基層做起的文官他的請辭真正的意涵就是在向即將上任的賴總統跟卓院長表達非常明確的訊息就是如果再不改正能源政策台電也不願意再為民進黨背這個黑鍋這才是王耀廷請辭的真正意涵不曉得不曉得我們的部長\n316663\t331211\t認不認同?完全不是,這個他已經總經理也說得非常清楚那因為大家沒有辦法就事論事對於地震之後的機組故障以及相關的壞掉的這個部分接下來我再請部長看這個是就是說最近國際上有智庫單位對我們臺灣的能源政策也提出建議這個日本的全國性的報紙\n342317\t353812\t這個日本經濟新聞在四月二十二號他就刊登了。他的頭條就寫說Taiwan's line needs to rethink nuclear shutdown plan他說賴清德應該重新檢討非核政策這個你同意嗎?\n357536\t367787\t我相信各個意見我們都尊重那我想新的政府我們對我們現在的這個臺灣的這個相關的問題這個華盛頓的智庫的全球臺灣研究中心研究員就是這個Jordan Margulis他也分析臺灣的核能政策文章他就說因為半導體的發展臺灣是\n380820\t385105\t亞洲人均耗電最高的地區但臺灣的電力供應顯然並沒有跟上腳步民進黨極力推的非核家園導致核電從2011年42百萬瓦到2022年的24百萬瓦\n398942\t412908\t就是雖然這個2018的公投大家都希望說核電以核養綠但是蔡英文總統跟賴清德仍然持續要推動這個非核政策那再生能源到現在也遙遙無期所以現在\n417070\t436201\t連最反核最得利的德國到去年他已經完全無核化了現在也開始討論要重啟核電那我記得上一次問部長7月開始核三就要準備退役當時部長回答說會如期退役那經過這段時間我同樣的問題問部長不曉得您現在的答案為何\n442524\t447027\t我想核電要延續那委員也很清楚那第一個這個要能夠這個科學的討論第二個核能的安全第三個相關的現在的規定核電這個運轉40年按照現在的規定它就是要停止所以它是有討論空間的嗎它是有討論空間的還有核後端的核廢的處理我想這個都需要台灣社會的共識\n468978\t483124\t專業討論,包括合術董事長童子賢,他同時也是民進黨新境界文教基金會的副董事長,而董事長就是賴清德總統。他近日發表演講的時候提到缺點,他說他反核三十年,\n483584\t508583\t但是想法改變了他認為地球暖化才是公敵何能不是所以他改變了三十年來的反核立場一個反核三十年的人想法都會改變國際上的潮流也興起重啟核能這一點希望經濟部一定要用專業超越這個政治考量因為民進黨的政策也是會轉彎的2016年前民進黨也反對萊豬2020年\n513727\t515970\t開板開放來租包括2015年這個反對開放輔導這個食品進口2022年也是開放了輔導食品進口包括說2005年那時候的不分區立委蔡英文他就說\n529389\t541857\t台灣必須靠電能帶動經濟,核四一定要興建,結果2011年蔡英文主席又重提非核家園,所以其實討論的空間是有的,這一點部長同意嗎?\n559249\t562844\t第二十八條之十四、第三十一條條文修正草案案。\n","txt":"當家軍委員質詢,謝謝。主席,我想請部長。有請部長,謝謝。\n部長這幾天您的時尚形象引起很多的討論但是我覺得這對我們女性從政人員是一個非常大的鼓勵就是說不只專業還可以美麗新舊內閣即將交接部長為國陸力從功40年經濟部長顯然應該不會是您的終點現在很多報導都在分析您的下一步\n包括政委甚至中油、台電、中鋼的董作都被討論。如果部長未來被邀請去擔任這三大國營事業的董作,請問部長有沒有意願?我沒有接受這樣的訊息,我想也不適合。那再請問部長,請問一下中油、台電、中鋼這三大國營企業的董作未來會全部替換嗎?\n三大國營企業的動作都應該是專業凌駕政治考量呢?\n一定會用專業來考量,千萬不能夠用政治考量或者是用酬庸來超越專業的考量。」\n就是本席想要問四月二十日臺電發了一聲一張新聞內文寫著說不該把臺電作為政治工房的工具少數人滑著3C產品卻對臺電酸言酸語對臺電人不公平那其實我也知道說臺電的基層人員非常辛苦這個本席完全都認同也完全支持說臺電的確是非常努力但是呢臺電\n總經理王耀廷為此請辭。今天台電沒有來,但我要請問部長,作為台電的主管機關,你認為台電是政策決策者還是政策執行者?」\n臺電當然是政策的執行者是所以我們都知道臺電雖然負責全國的供電但他只是供電政策的執行單位那麼請問部長您覺得經濟部是臺灣供電政策的決策單位嗎我們當然是決策的其中一環是其中一環所以你也不是決策者\n負責整個電力的部分當然會有到整個院裡面會有整個國家的需求其實我覺得部長你是針對這件事情你是相當誠實就是您只是決策的一環因為我認為真正的決策單位甚至連經濟部都不是現在臺灣的\n政策、能源政策都是為了服膺於民進黨的非核檔綱。民進黨的行動檔綱第六十四條就寫得很清楚反對新設核能發電機組限期關閉現有的核電廠\n那這個指導方向的源頭代表著臺電的大量虧損全民漲電價全民買單都是因為民進黨的非核檔綱您同不同意我不同意齁這個我們其實澄清過非常多次那這個確實是惡霧戰爭之後的國際等等人家為了非核檔綱廢棄了\n便宜的核能煤炭又怕被批評製造溫室氣體所以只好選擇天然氣但是天然氣價格高昂儲存不易更容易受到這個國際局勢的這個變動波動這就剛才部長所講的\n所以二五戰爭爆發之後天然氣價格大漲我們台灣的這個發電成本也漲了好幾倍所以過去這段時間來社會上的批評聲音都是針對能源政策現在台灣的能源政策是政治凌駕專業的結果\n逆勢而為當然使得許多文官都會心寒而離開啊。」所以我認為這個王耀廷的請辭雖然表面上是說不忍台電被批評但部長你清楚王耀廷也很清楚如果錯誤的能源政策不由所改動的話\n再換一百個總經理也沒有用啊再換部長也沒有用啊王耀廷他是從基層做起的文官他的請辭真正的意涵就是在向即將上任的賴總統跟卓院長表達非常明確的訊息就是如果再不改正能源政策台電也不願意再為民進黨背這個黑鍋這才是王耀廷請辭的真正意涵不曉得不曉得我們的部長\n認不認同?完全不是,這個他已經總經理也說得非常清楚那因為大家沒有辦法就事論事對於地震之後的機組故障以及相關的壞掉的這個部分接下來我再請部長看這個是就是說最近國際上有智庫單位對我們臺灣的能源政策也提出建議這個日本的全國性的報紙\n這個日本經濟新聞在四月二十二號他就刊登了。他的頭條就寫說Taiwan's line needs to rethink nuclear shutdown plan他說賴清德應該重新檢討非核政策這個你同意嗎?\n我相信各個意見我們都尊重那我想新的政府我們對我們現在的這個臺灣的這個相關的問題這個華盛頓的智庫的全球臺灣研究中心研究員就是這個Jordan Margulis他也分析臺灣的核能政策文章他就說因為半導體的發展臺灣是\n亞洲人均耗電最高的地區但臺灣的電力供應顯然並沒有跟上腳步民進黨極力推的非核家園導致核電從2011年42百萬瓦到2022年的24百萬瓦\n就是雖然這個2018的公投大家都希望說核電以核養綠但是蔡英文總統跟賴清德仍然持續要推動這個非核政策那再生能源到現在也遙遙無期所以現在\n連最反核最得利的德國到去年他已經完全無核化了現在也開始討論要重啟核電那我記得上一次問部長7月開始核三就要準備退役當時部長回答說會如期退役那經過這段時間我同樣的問題問部長不曉得您現在的答案為何\n我想核電要延續那委員也很清楚那第一個這個要能夠這個科學的討論第二個核能的安全第三個相關的現在的規定核電這個運轉40年按照現在的規定它就是要停止所以它是有討論空間的嗎它是有討論空間的還有核後端的核廢的處理我想這個都需要台灣社會的共識\n專業討論,包括合術董事長童子賢,他同時也是民進黨新境界文教基金會的副董事長,而董事長就是賴清德總統。他近日發表演講的時候提到缺點,他說他反核三十年,\n但是想法改變了他認為地球暖化才是公敵何能不是所以他改變了三十年來的反核立場一個反核三十年的人想法都會改變國際上的潮流也興起重啟核能這一點希望經濟部一定要用專業超越這個政治考量因為民進黨的政策也是會轉彎的2016年前民進黨也反對萊豬2020年\n開板開放來租包括2015年這個反對開放輔導這個食品進口2022年也是開放了輔導食品進口包括說2005年那時候的不分區立委蔡英文他就說\n台灣必須靠電能帶動經濟,核四一定要興建,結果2011年蔡英文主席又重提非核家園,所以其實討論的空間是有的,這一點部長同意嗎?\n第二十八條之十四、第三十一條條文修正草案案。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.220 --> 00:10.611\n當家軍委員質詢,謝謝。主席,我想請部長。有請部長,謝謝。\n\n00:14.512 --> 00:29.357\n部長這幾天您的時尚形象引起很多的討論但是我覺得這對我們女性從政人員是一個非常大的鼓勵就是說不只專業還可以美麗新舊內閣即將交接部長為國陸力從功40年經濟部長顯然應該不會是您的終點現在很多報導都在分析您的下一步\n\n00:41.761 --> 01:09.129\n包括政委甚至中油、台電、中鋼的董作都被討論。如果部長未來被邀請去擔任這三大國營事業的董作,請問部長有沒有意願?我沒有接受這樣的訊息,我想也不適合。那再請問部長,請問一下中油、台電、中鋼這三大國營企業的董作未來會全部替換嗎?\n\n01:10.229 --> 01:12.310\n三大國營企業的動作都應該是專業凌駕政治考量呢?\n\n01:27.018 --> 01:35.624\n一定會用專業來考量,千萬不能夠用政治考量或者是用酬庸來超越專業的考量。」\n\n01:42.369 --> 02:08.132\n就是本席想要問四月二十日臺電發了一聲一張新聞內文寫著說不該把臺電作為政治工房的工具少數人滑著3C產品卻對臺電酸言酸語對臺電人不公平那其實我也知道說臺電的基層人員非常辛苦這個本席完全都認同也完全支持說臺電的確是非常努力但是呢臺電\n\n02:10.054 --> 02:22.465\n總經理王耀廷為此請辭。今天台電沒有來,但我要請問部長,作為台電的主管機關,你認為台電是政策決策者還是政策執行者?」\n\n02:24.831 --> 02:48.994\n臺電當然是政策的執行者是所以我們都知道臺電雖然負責全國的供電但他只是供電政策的執行單位那麼請問部長您覺得經濟部是臺灣供電政策的決策單位嗎我們當然是決策的其中一環是其中一環所以你也不是決策者\n\n02:49.934 --> 03:00.818\n負責整個電力的部分當然會有到整個院裡面會有整個國家的需求其實我覺得部長你是針對這件事情你是相當誠實就是您只是決策的一環因為我認為真正的決策單位甚至連經濟部都不是現在臺灣的\n\n03:11.021 --> 03:24.888\n政策、能源政策都是為了服膺於民進黨的非核檔綱。民進黨的行動檔綱第六十四條就寫得很清楚反對新設核能發電機組限期關閉現有的核電廠\n\n03:28.089 --> 03:32.250\n那這個指導方向的源頭代表著臺電的大量虧損全民漲電價全民買單都是因為民進黨的非核檔綱您同不同意我不同意齁這個我們其實澄清過非常多次那這個確實是惡霧戰爭之後的國際等等人家為了非核檔綱廢棄了\n\n03:53.911 --> 03:58.975\n便宜的核能煤炭又怕被批評製造溫室氣體所以只好選擇天然氣但是天然氣價格高昂儲存不易更容易受到這個國際局勢的這個變動波動這就剛才部長所講的\n\n04:11.286 --> 04:13.647\n所以二五戰爭爆發之後天然氣價格大漲我們台灣的這個發電成本也漲了好幾倍所以過去這段時間來社會上的批評聲音都是針對能源政策現在台灣的能源政策是政治凌駕專業的結果\n\n04:29.033 --> 04:45.635\n逆勢而為當然使得許多文官都會心寒而離開啊。」所以我認為這個王耀廷的請辭雖然表面上是說不忍台電被批評但部長你清楚王耀廷也很清楚如果錯誤的能源政策不由所改動的話\n\n04:46.656 --> 05:13.662\n再換一百個總經理也沒有用啊再換部長也沒有用啊王耀廷他是從基層做起的文官他的請辭真正的意涵就是在向即將上任的賴總統跟卓院長表達非常明確的訊息就是如果再不改正能源政策台電也不願意再為民進黨背這個黑鍋這才是王耀廷請辭的真正意涵不曉得不曉得我們的部長\n\n05:16.663 --> 05:31.211\n認不認同?完全不是,這個他已經總經理也說得非常清楚那因為大家沒有辦法就事論事對於地震之後的機組故障以及相關的壞掉的這個部分接下來我再請部長看這個是就是說最近國際上有智庫單位對我們臺灣的能源政策也提出建議這個日本的全國性的報紙\n\n05:42.317 --> 05:53.812\n這個日本經濟新聞在四月二十二號他就刊登了。他的頭條就寫說Taiwan'slineneedstorethinknuclearshutdownplan他說賴清德應該重新檢討非核政策這個你同意嗎?\n\n05:57.536 --> 06:07.787\n我相信各個意見我們都尊重那我想新的政府我們對我們現在的這個臺灣的這個相關的問題這個華盛頓的智庫的全球臺灣研究中心研究員就是這個JordanMargulis他也分析臺灣的核能政策文章他就說因為半導體的發展臺灣是\n\n06:20.820 --> 06:25.105\n亞洲人均耗電最高的地區但臺灣的電力供應顯然並沒有跟上腳步民進黨極力推的非核家園導致核電從2011年42百萬瓦到2022年的24百萬瓦\n\n06:38.942 --> 06:52.908\n就是雖然這個2018的公投大家都希望說核電以核養綠但是蔡英文總統跟賴清德仍然持續要推動這個非核政策那再生能源到現在也遙遙無期所以現在\n\n06:57.070 --> 07:16.201\n連最反核最得利的德國到去年他已經完全無核化了現在也開始討論要重啟核電那我記得上一次問部長7月開始核三就要準備退役當時部長回答說會如期退役那經過這段時間我同樣的問題問部長不曉得您現在的答案為何\n\n07:22.524 --> 07:27.027\n我想核電要延續那委員也很清楚那第一個這個要能夠這個科學的討論第二個核能的安全第三個相關的現在的規定核電這個運轉40年按照現在的規定它就是要停止所以它是有討論空間的嗎它是有討論空間的還有核後端的核廢的處理我想這個都需要台灣社會的共識\n\n07:48.978 --> 08:03.124\n專業討論,包括合術董事長童子賢,他同時也是民進黨新境界文教基金會的副董事長,而董事長就是賴清德總統。他近日發表演講的時候提到缺點,他說他反核三十年,\n\n08:03.584 --> 08:28.583\n但是想法改變了他認為地球暖化才是公敵何能不是所以他改變了三十年來的反核立場一個反核三十年的人想法都會改變國際上的潮流也興起重啟核能這一點希望經濟部一定要用專業超越這個政治考量因為民進黨的政策也是會轉彎的2016年前民進黨也反對萊豬2020年\n\n08:33.727 --> 08:35.970\n開板開放來租包括2015年這個反對開放輔導這個食品進口2022年也是開放了輔導食品進口包括說2005年那時候的不分區立委蔡英文他就說\n\n08:49.389 --> 09:01.857\n台灣必須靠電能帶動經濟,核四一定要興建,結果2011年蔡英文主席又重提非核家園,所以其實討論的空間是有的,這一點部長同意嗎?\n\n09:19.249 --> 09:22.844\n第二十八條之十四、第三十一條條文修正草案案。\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.22,"end":10.611,"text":"當家軍委員質詢,謝謝。主席,我想請部長。有請部長,謝謝。"},{"start":14.512,"end":29.357,"text":"部長這幾天您的時尚形象引起很多的討論但是我覺得這對我們女性從政人員是一個非常大的鼓勵就是說不只專業還可以美麗新舊內閣即將交接部長為國陸力從功40年經濟部長顯然應該不會是您的終點現在很多報導都在分析您的下一步"},{"start":41.761,"end":69.129,"text":"包括政委甚至中油、台電、中鋼的董作都被討論。如果部長未來被邀請去擔任這三大國營事業的董作,請問部長有沒有意願?我沒有接受這樣的訊息,我想也不適合。那再請問部長,請問一下中油、台電、中鋼這三大國營企業的董作未來會全部替換嗎?"},{"start":70.229,"end":72.31,"text":"三大國營企業的動作都應該是專業凌駕政治考量呢?"},{"start":87.018,"end":95.624,"text":"一定會用專業來考量,千萬不能夠用政治考量或者是用酬庸來超越專業的考量。」"},{"start":102.369,"end":128.132,"text":"就是本席想要問四月二十日臺電發了一聲一張新聞內文寫著說不該把臺電作為政治工房的工具少數人滑著3C產品卻對臺電酸言酸語對臺電人不公平那其實我也知道說臺電的基層人員非常辛苦這個本席完全都認同也完全支持說臺電的確是非常努力但是呢臺電"},{"start":130.054,"end":142.465,"text":"總經理王耀廷為此請辭。今天台電沒有來,但我要請問部長,作為台電的主管機關,你認為台電是政策決策者還是政策執行者?」"},{"start":144.831,"end":168.994,"text":"臺電當然是政策的執行者是所以我們都知道臺電雖然負責全國的供電但他只是供電政策的執行單位那麼請問部長您覺得經濟部是臺灣供電政策的決策單位嗎我們當然是決策的其中一環是其中一環所以你也不是決策者"},{"start":169.934,"end":180.818,"text":"負責整個電力的部分當然會有到整個院裡面會有整個國家的需求其實我覺得部長你是針對這件事情你是相當誠實就是您只是決策的一環因為我認為真正的決策單位甚至連經濟部都不是現在臺灣的"},{"start":191.021,"end":204.888,"text":"政策、能源政策都是為了服膺於民進黨的非核檔綱。民進黨的行動檔綱第六十四條就寫得很清楚反對新設核能發電機組限期關閉現有的核電廠"},{"start":208.089,"end":212.25,"text":"那這個指導方向的源頭代表著臺電的大量虧損全民漲電價全民買單都是因為民進黨的非核檔綱您同不同意我不同意齁這個我們其實澄清過非常多次那這個確實是惡霧戰爭之後的國際等等人家為了非核檔綱廢棄了"},{"start":233.911,"end":238.975,"text":"便宜的核能煤炭又怕被批評製造溫室氣體所以只好選擇天然氣但是天然氣價格高昂儲存不易更容易受到這個國際局勢的這個變動波動這就剛才部長所講的"},{"start":251.286,"end":253.647,"text":"所以二五戰爭爆發之後天然氣價格大漲我們台灣的這個發電成本也漲了好幾倍所以過去這段時間來社會上的批評聲音都是針對能源政策現在台灣的能源政策是政治凌駕專業的結果"},{"start":269.033,"end":285.635,"text":"逆勢而為當然使得許多文官都會心寒而離開啊。」所以我認為這個王耀廷的請辭雖然表面上是說不忍台電被批評但部長你清楚王耀廷也很清楚如果錯誤的能源政策不由所改動的話"},{"start":286.656,"end":313.662,"text":"再換一百個總經理也沒有用啊再換部長也沒有用啊王耀廷他是從基層做起的文官他的請辭真正的意涵就是在向即將上任的賴總統跟卓院長表達非常明確的訊息就是如果再不改正能源政策台電也不願意再為民進黨背這個黑鍋這才是王耀廷請辭的真正意涵不曉得不曉得我們的部長"},{"start":316.663,"end":331.211,"text":"認不認同?完全不是,這個他已經總經理也說得非常清楚那因為大家沒有辦法就事論事對於地震之後的機組故障以及相關的壞掉的這個部分接下來我再請部長看這個是就是說最近國際上有智庫單位對我們臺灣的能源政策也提出建議這個日本的全國性的報紙"},{"start":342.317,"end":353.812,"text":"這個日本經濟新聞在四月二十二號他就刊登了。他的頭條就寫說Taiwan's line needs to rethink nuclear shutdown plan他說賴清德應該重新檢討非核政策這個你同意嗎?"},{"start":357.536,"end":367.787,"text":"我相信各個意見我們都尊重那我想新的政府我們對我們現在的這個臺灣的這個相關的問題這個華盛頓的智庫的全球臺灣研究中心研究員就是這個Jordan Margulis他也分析臺灣的核能政策文章他就說因為半導體的發展臺灣是"},{"start":380.82,"end":385.105,"text":"亞洲人均耗電最高的地區但臺灣的電力供應顯然並沒有跟上腳步民進黨極力推的非核家園導致核電從2011年42百萬瓦到2022年的24百萬瓦"},{"start":398.942,"end":412.908,"text":"就是雖然這個2018的公投大家都希望說核電以核養綠但是蔡英文總統跟賴清德仍然持續要推動這個非核政策那再生能源到現在也遙遙無期所以現在"},{"start":417.07,"end":436.201,"text":"連最反核最得利的德國到去年他已經完全無核化了現在也開始討論要重啟核電那我記得上一次問部長7月開始核三就要準備退役當時部長回答說會如期退役那經過這段時間我同樣的問題問部長不曉得您現在的答案為何"},{"start":442.524,"end":447.027,"text":"我想核電要延續那委員也很清楚那第一個這個要能夠這個科學的討論第二個核能的安全第三個相關的現在的規定核電這個運轉40年按照現在的規定它就是要停止所以它是有討論空間的嗎它是有討論空間的還有核後端的核廢的處理我想這個都需要台灣社會的共識"},{"start":468.978,"end":483.124,"text":"專業討論,包括合術董事長童子賢,他同時也是民進黨新境界文教基金會的副董事長,而董事長就是賴清德總統。他近日發表演講的時候提到缺點,他說他反核三十年,"},{"start":483.584,"end":508.583,"text":"但是想法改變了他認為地球暖化才是公敵何能不是所以他改變了三十年來的反核立場一個反核三十年的人想法都會改變國際上的潮流也興起重啟核能這一點希望經濟部一定要用專業超越這個政治考量因為民進黨的政策也是會轉彎的2016年前民進黨也反對萊豬2020年"},{"start":513.727,"end":515.97,"text":"開板開放來租包括2015年這個反對開放輔導這個食品進口2022年也是開放了輔導食品進口包括說2005年那時候的不分區立委蔡英文他就說"},{"start":529.389,"end":541.857,"text":"台灣必須靠電能帶動經濟,核四一定要興建,結果2011年蔡英文主席又重提非核家園,所以其實討論的空間是有的,這一點部長同意嗎?"},{"start":559.249,"end":562.844,"text":"第二十八條之十四、第三十一條條文修正草案案。"}]}}}}