{"id":151621,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151621","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/534e6c42fa7aedb3596574f37c6acbc8b903698ddfaa754aeadb1108e4b844325dc42cf28b9098b05ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"王育敏","委員發言時間":"10:08:45 - 10:19:35","影片長度":"00:10:50","會議時間":"2024-04-24T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請衛生福利部部長就「家暴零容忍-檢討112年家庭暴力防治法修正施行概況」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n二、邀請衛生福利部部長、國家通訊傳播委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會就「非法網站創意私房案件，提出兒少性影像防制具體作為、檢討報告，並就兒童及少年性剝削防制條例修正方向」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n【專題報告綜合詢答】\n【4月22日、24日及25日三天一次會】）","date":"2024-04-24","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":13,"committees":[26],"id":"委員會-11-1-26-13"},"duration":650,"end_time":"2024-04-24T10:19:35+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-24T10:08:45+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":484,"blocks":[["王委員育敏：（10時8分）謝謝主席，請部長。"],["主席：部長。"],["薛部長瑞元：委員好。"],["王委員育敏：部長好。部長，你現在心情很輕鬆嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：要來立法院都不會很輕鬆。"],["王委員育敏：我想請問你，您對於要接任的邱泰源部長，你自己要不要專業比一比？你覺得你的專業比較強還是他的專業比較強？"],["薛部長瑞元：沒有，這無從比較啦。"],["王委員育敏：不敢比較還是無從比較？"],["薛部長瑞元：不敢比較。"],["王委員育敏：本席覺得你還滿認真的啦，就是什麼事情你都認真以待，這是一個非常好的特質，我當然希望新任的部長也像你一般認真，才扛得起衛福部這麼大的一個部門，因為衛福部的事情真的非常多！","本席首先還是要追一下寶林事件，我覺得寶林事件現在會不會變成無頭公案啊？到目前為止，有一度傳出警方說有重大發現，結果又無疾而終，又沒消沒息，這個案件到目前為止是非常重大的食安事件，從3月到現在已經通報35人，2人死亡，4個人在加護病房，而這4個人的狀況還不見得很樂觀，這麼重大的一個食安事件，到目前為止，完全沒有辦法跟外界交代邦克列酸的源頭在哪裡，一個多月了，到底現在卡在哪裡？部長。"],["薛部長瑞元：目前的話，衛福部這邊能調查的大概已經都調查完畢了，最後的話就是實際上在運作的廚師當時是怎麼樣做的，因為這是檢察機關在調查，檢察官並沒有把這個訊息透露給我們，所以我們也無從知道，現在大概到最後的偵查階段，我們也希望檢察機關如果偵查結束之後，看是否起訴、不起訴等等，案情就能夠比較明朗。"],["王委員育敏：本席覺得在這麼重大事件的偵辦過程當中，衛福部作為主管機關，但是檢調瞭解的內容卻沒有辦法跟你們一起合作，一起針對這些原因大家來反覆地探討，這個是不是有什麼問題？因為你這樣等於兩個是完全脫鉤，你完全沒有辦法掌握到可能的原因，它沒有再回來跟你做一些核對嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：因為這個偵查不公開，如果說檢方沒有主動要把訊息釋出的話，我們也無從去詢問。"],["王委員育敏：今天法務部有人來，對不對？檢察司的郭司長，我覺得針對這樣一個重大的案件應該是要通力合作吧？現在看起來就是各負責一邊，然後拼湊不出來這個圖像，沒辦法給國人交代，司長瞭解這個案件現在的最新狀況嗎？"],["郭司長永發：跟委員報告，這個寶林的案子現在分別由臺北地檢跟士林檢察官在偵辦，士林檢察官因為是有死亡案子、有相驗案子，但不管怎麼講它都是一個偵查案件，那偵查案件就如同剛剛部長講的，因為涉及到偵查秘密的問題，當然檢察官在偵查當中的作為，包括鑑定、包括剛剛委員提問的，有關這些可能的污染源在哪裡……"],["王委員育敏：對，邦克列酸的源頭在哪裡？"],["郭司長永發：其實這可能都會跟衛福部這一邊會有所聯繫，因為那個是個案，個案的偵查細節如何，我們法務部其實不方便進去問它，這個部分臺高檢署也有督導偵辦。"],["王委員育敏：對，我要問的是邦克列酸的源頭是什麼，其實不是要問個案的細節，而這個部分我覺得應該是跨部會，你們都有責任好好地去偵辦，而不是說一句偵辦中，然後好像就沒事了，各做各的，我覺得這樣子要找出這個源頭應該是滿困難，因為到目前為止，一個多月過去了，拼湊不出這個圖像，也沒有辦法給國人一個交代，法務部應該回過頭去檢討，你們常常說一句個案偵查不公開，然後好像所有的人就不可以再往下去瞭解所有的內容，我覺得這樣好像是不對的，這件事情是食安事件，我們要瞭解的是那個源頭，這個不是涉及到個人的刑事案件，這個應該不太一樣吧？"],["郭司長永發：跟委員報告，因為偵查這一個部分一定會跟衛福部合作。"],["王委員育敏：是啊，但是有嗎？你們兩邊有兜嗎？部長，你有得到法務部的訊息嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：有關於這一些科學證據等等的，雙方是有聯繫，這部分我們大概都已經把資料給檢方了，但檢方所調查的，就是那個個人的行為……"],["王委員育敏：他回饋回來……"],["薛部長瑞元：並沒有回饋給我們。"],["王委員育敏：我覺得這一件事情你們還要再去檢討，全國民眾都在等真正的原因是什麼，結果現在快要變無頭公案了，就是不知道到底是什麼，我也希望法務部你們加快，好不好？這個是一個全國高度矚目的食安案件，不是環辦，要趕快用你們團隊的力量，好好去偵辦，好不好？趕快給國人一個交代，這個是關乎到國人食安非常重要的事。","另外一個，回到今天家暴的議題，今天司法院有代表來，是李副廳長，近三年來，這一些保護令的核發件數跟駁回比例，我們可以看到在駁回比例的部分是有升高的情況，照道理來講，這一些保護的案件，當事人就是覺得很有需求才去申請保護令，結果到了司法院之後你們卻駁回，你們有去分析你們駁回的原因是什麼嗎？你看，112年有高達六千多件，如果說他是應該被保護卻被你們駁回，那這個受害者的保護應該要怎麼去落實？這個你們有進一步去瞭解嗎？"],["李副廳長昆霖：謝謝委員。跟委員報告，法官或司法事務官在審理保護令事件的時候，他依照我們的規定還有法律的證據去判斷符不符合，如果符合，就應該核發，如果不符合，當然不符合要件就會駁回，所以這進到法院就一律要看他提出敘明的證據有沒有達到核發的必要性，還有核發的內容是哪一類型保護令的內容，據以保護被害人不再繼續受到家庭暴力。"],["王委員育敏：是，但是現在看起來駁回的案件數有增加的情況，比例也是增加的，你們有沒有去探究是什麼樣的原因？這當中會不會有其實是個別法官認定標準寬鬆不一的情況？然後本來應該要核發，但是因為他比較嚴格，所以他就駁回。","你再看下一張圖，112年各地方保護令的核發率看起來是很不一致的，你可以看到有這種72%的，也有澎湖這種只有47%的，這整個落差你們有去探究嗎？各縣市執行狀況不一的情況。"],["李副廳長昆霖：跟委員報告，個別地院因為案件的類型也不太一樣，所以這個部分我們……"],["王委員育敏：當然不一樣，但是每一個縣市的差異化有這麼大嗎？如果從72%到47%，差異化有這麼大嗎？每一個家庭家暴的原因、成因，然後他需要受到保護令的保護，你不覺得這個落差很大嗎？我現在要問的是司法院你們有沒有認真地去看這件事情？基本上每一個要動用到保護令的都是受害者本身都覺得他非常有需要，他才會採取這樣的動作，或者是社政主管機關也覺得很有需要或是警察機關覺得很有需要才會協助他，結果司法院核發下來的如果都還有百分之十幾駁回，而且是呈現增加的情況，並沒有去核發的話，這就應該好好去檢討。"],["李副廳長昆霖：跟委員報告，我們司法行政有不斷在發函還有藉由……"],["王委員育敏：你們近期有針對這個開過任何會議嗎？跟衛福部去檢討。"],["李副廳長昆霖：我們每三個月……"],["王委員育敏：有針對這件事情討論嗎？"],["李副廳長昆霖：我們曾經有討論過。"],["王委員育敏：曾經是什麼時候？多久以前？如果有的話，把那個報告給本席，我要看你們檢討出來的原因是什麼，而且你們改善的是什麼。"],["李副廳長昆霖：好。"],["王委員育敏：最後一個問題，我要問的是衛福部關於目睹兒少的部分你們現在施行的情況，在你們這個家暴裡面的兒少保護類型，每一年因為家暴案件再通報進來的大概是100件左右，但是民間團體認為這一種每一年將近20萬件的家暴案件，這種目睹兒少可能超過10萬，那這麼大的一個落差，還有你們的服務量，這件事情你們現在的資源夠嗎？有在做嗎？落實的情況好嗎？因為你們今天的報告裡面就只有一句話，就是目睹兒少，我也沒有看到你們呈現的，所以現在衛福部到底有沒有很重視這件事情？這個是在上一波修法裡面民間有特別倡議，希望針對目睹家暴的兒少應該要進一步提供服務，但是我看你們現在所有的業務優先順序上，它還是排在很末端的。"],["薛部長瑞元：這個部分的話，當然也會需要我們跟教育單位之間的協助，因為這些目睹兒少很多都在學齡中……"],["王委員育敏：今天教育單位也沒有來嘛？教育部也沒有任何代表來，這件事情我希望衛福部跟教育部要好好重視，因為這樣的一個心理創傷，它是看不見的傷，但是對他的影響坦白講是很大的，所以如果我們從一個預防的角度來看的話，這一塊我希望你們可以好好重視，好不好？"],["薛部長瑞元：好，謝謝。"],["王委員育敏：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝王委員。接下來請黃秀芳委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":346,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-26-13","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","廖偉翔","邱鎮軍","王育敏","涂權吉","王正旭","林淑芬","李坤城","陳亭妃","楊瓊瓔","陳培瑜","黃珊珊","何欣純","黃國昌","李彥秀","洪孟楷","羅智強","徐欣瑩","陳瑩","劉建國","楊曜","盧縣一","蘇清泉","鍾佳濱","牛煦庭"],"page_start":253,"meetingDate":["2024-04-24"],"gazette_id":"1133401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1133401_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請衛生福利部部長就「家暴零容忍─ 檢討 112年家庭暴力防治法修正施行概況」進行專題\n報告，並備質詢；二、邀請衛生福利部部長、國家通訊傳播委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政\n署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會就「非法網站創意私房案件，提出兒少性影像防制具\n體作為、檢討報告，並就兒童及少年性剝削防制條例修正方向」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1133401_00003"}},"transcript":{"id":"151621","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151621","tool":"pyannote","id":"151621-pyannote"},"job_id":"RDAGabVxB9TXqF2A","queued_at":"2024-05-31 19:12:17","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2024-05-31 19:13:05","msg":"downloading https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151621"},{"time":"2024-05-31 19:13:05","msg":"downloading https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/534e6c42fa7aedb3596574f37c6acbc8b903698ddfaa754ad2ddfac4d3fd9eb769b51f63c6f260655ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8"},{"time":"2024-05-31 19:13:26","msg":"converting mp4 to wav"},{"time":"2024-05-31 19:13:27","msg":"running pyannote"},{"time":"2024-05-31 19:13:39","msg":"status: 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\"我覺得這樣子針對一個重大案件應該是要通力合作吧現在看起來就是各負責一邊然後拼湊不出來這個圖像沒辦法給國人交代市長你瞭解嗎這個案件現在的最新狀況跟委員報告這個隔岸之暴零案子現在分別為由一個臺北地檢跟士林檢察官在偵辦那士林檢察官因為那一邊是有死亡案子他有香菸案子那不管怎麼講他都是一個偵查案件是\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 173.22, \"end\": 173.48, \"score\": 0.671}, {\"word\": \"覺\"}, {\"word\": \"得\", \"start\": 173.48, \"end\": 173.88, \"score\": 0.853}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"樣\"}, {\"word\": \"子\", \"start\": 173.88, \"end\": 174.54, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"針\"}, {\"word\": \"對\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 174.54, \"end\": 174.721, \"score\": 0.823}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"重\", \"start\": 174.721, \"end\": 174.921, \"score\": 0.932}, {\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 174.921, \"end\": 175.081, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 175.081, \"end\": 175.341, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"件\", \"start\": 175.341, \"end\": 176.101, \"score\": 0.81}, {\"word\": \"應\"}, {\"word\": \"該\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 176.101, \"end\": 176.201, \"score\": 0.802}, {\"word\": \"要\", 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{\"word\": \"責\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 179.242, \"end\": 179.542, \"score\": 0.745}, {\"word\": \"邊\"}, {\"word\": \"然\", \"start\": 179.542, \"end\": 179.702, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 179.702, \"end\": 179.882, \"score\": 0.684}, {\"word\": \"拼\", \"start\": 179.882, \"end\": 180.262, \"score\": 0.74}, {\"word\": \"湊\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 180.262, \"end\": 180.403, \"score\": 0.659}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 180.403, \"end\": 181.083, \"score\": 0.742}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"圖\"}, {\"word\": \"像\", \"start\": 181.083, \"end\": 181.263, \"score\": 0.789}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 181.263, \"end\": 181.403, \"score\": 0.77}, {\"word\": \"辦\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 181.403, \"end\": 181.923, \"score\": 0.743}, {\"word\": \"給\"}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 181.923, \"end\": 182.083, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"交\", \"start\": 182.083, \"end\": 182.303, 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\"start\": 196.568, \"end\": 197.088, \"score\": 0.721}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 197.088, \"end\": 197.269, \"score\": 0.655}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 197.269, \"end\": 197.449, \"score\": 0.77}, {\"word\": \"香\", \"start\": 197.449, \"end\": 197.849, \"score\": 0.808}, {\"word\": \"菸\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 197.849, \"end\": 198.089, \"score\": 0.846}, {\"word\": \"子\", \"start\": 198.089, \"end\": 198.529, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 198.529, \"end\": 198.649, \"score\": 0.49}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 198.649, \"end\": 198.789, \"score\": 0.568}, {\"word\": \"管\", \"start\": 198.789, \"end\": 198.949, \"score\": 0.792}, {\"word\": \"怎\", \"start\": 198.949, \"end\": 199.329, \"score\": 0.652}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"講\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 199.329, \"end\": 199.529, \"score\": 0.782}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 199.529, \"end\": 199.729, \"score\": 0.804}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 199.729, \"end\": 199.849, \"score\": 0.848}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 199.849, \"end\": 200.45, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"偵\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 200.45, \"end\": 200.63, \"score\": 0.838}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 200.63, \"end\": 200.87, \"score\": 0.769}, {\"word\": \"件\", \"start\": 200.87, \"end\": 200.89, \"score\": 0.02}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 200.89, \"end\": 200.91, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 201.63, \"end\": 229.262, \"text\": \"那偵查案件就如同剛剛部長講的因為那個涉及到偵查秘密的一個問題那當然檢察官在偵查的一個作為包括鑑定啊包括這個剛剛委員提問的有關於毒品的這些可能污染源在哪裡等等其實這個都會跟衛福部這邊可能會有所聯繫啊因為那個是個案個案的偵查細節如何我們法務部其實是不方便進去去問他了\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 201.63, \"end\": 201.89, \"score\": 0.765}, {\"word\": \"偵\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 201.89, \"end\": 201.97, \"score\": 0.56}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 201.97, \"end\": 202.19, \"score\": 0.881}, {\"word\": \"件\", \"start\": 202.19, \"end\": 202.55, \"score\": 0.922}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 202.55, \"end\": 202.751, \"score\": 0.871}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 202.751, \"end\": 202.911, \"score\": 0.911}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 202.911, \"end\": 203.351, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 203.351, \"end\": 203.851, \"score\": 0.79}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"講\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 203.851, \"end\": 203.951, \"score\": 0.789}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 203.951, \"end\": 204.211, \"score\": 0.849}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 204.211, \"end\": 204.491, \"score\": 0.758}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"涉\", \"start\": 204.491, \"end\": 204.671, \"score\": 0.839}, {\"word\": \"及\", \"start\": 204.671, \"end\": 204.851, \"score\": 0.839}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 204.851, \"end\": 205.312, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"偵\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 205.312, \"end\": 205.512, \"score\": 0.769}, {\"word\": \"秘\", \"start\": 205.512, \"end\": 205.672, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"密\", \"start\": 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\"end\": 222.659, \"score\": 0.777}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 222.659, \"end\": 222.939, \"score\": 0.864}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 222.939, \"end\": 223.279, \"score\": 0.846}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 223.279, \"end\": 223.66, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 223.66, \"end\": 223.86, \"score\": 0.884}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 223.86, \"end\": 224.22, \"score\": 0.938}, {\"word\": \"偵\"}, {\"word\": \"查\", \"start\": 224.22, \"end\": 224.72, \"score\": 0.793}, {\"word\": \"細\"}, {\"word\": \"節\"}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 224.72, \"end\": 224.94, \"score\": 0.789}, {\"word\": \"何\", \"start\": 224.94, \"end\": 225.56, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 225.56, \"end\": 225.8, \"score\": 0.817}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 225.8, \"end\": 226.001, \"score\": 0.868}, {\"word\": \"務\"}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 226.001, \"end\": 226.181, \"score\": 0.733}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 226.181, \"end\": 226.681, \"score\": 0.944}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 226.681, \"end\": 226.901, \"score\": 0.871}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 226.901, \"end\": 227.081, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 227.081, \"end\": 227.361, \"score\": 0.966}, {\"word\": \"便\", \"start\": 227.361, \"end\": 228.201, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 228.201, \"end\": 228.402, \"score\": 0.882}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 228.402, \"end\": 228.982, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 228.982, \"end\": 229.242, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 229.242, \"end\": 229.262, \"score\": 0.171}]}, {\"start\": 229.662, \"end\": 239.287, \"text\": \"那這個部分你的台高檢署也督導在偵辦著對,我要問的是邦克列酸的那個源頭是什麼其實不是要問個案的細節而這個部分我覺得應該是跨部會你們都有責任好好的去偵辦而不是一句說偵辦中然後好像就沒事了然後各做各的我覺得這樣子要找出這個源頭應該是蠻困難因為到目前為止一個多月過去了拼湊不出這個圖像也沒有辦法給國人一個交代\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 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\"end\": 634.838, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 634.838, \"end\": 634.858, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:03,697 --> 00:00:19,580\n好謝謝主席我們請部長部長好部長好部長你現在心情有很輕鬆嗎要來立法院都不會很輕鬆都不會很輕鬆\n\n2\n00:00:22,299 --> 00:00:48,139\n那個我想請問你,您對於這個要接任的邱太元部長你自己要不要專業比一比?你覺得你的專業比較強還是他專業比較強?沒有啦,這無從比較啦無從比較?不敢比較還是無從比較?不敢比較,不敢比較本期是覺得你還蠻認真的啦就是什麼事情你都認真以待這是一個非常好的特質我當然希望新任的部長也有像你一般的認真才扛得起衛福部\n\n3\n00:00:48,799 --> 00:01:03,350\n這麼大的一個部門因為衛福部的事情真的非常多那本期首先還是要追一下那個保齡事件我覺得保齡事件現在會不會變成無頭公案怎麼到目前為止有一度傳出警方說有重大發現\n\n4\n00:01:04,811 --> 00:01:32,104\n結果又無疾而終,又沒消沒息。」那這個案件到目前為止,它是非常重大的死案事件,從3月到現在已經通報35人,2人死亡,4個人在家戶病房,而這4個人的狀況還不見得很樂觀。那這麼重大的一個死案事件,到目前為止,方克烈酸源頭在哪裡?完全沒有辦法給外界一個交代,一個多月了,到底現在卡在哪裡,部長?\n\n5\n00:01:33,406 --> 00:01:45,674\n目前的話衛福部這邊能調查大概已經都調查完畢了最後的話就是實際上在運作的那個廚師當時是怎麼樣做的那因為這個是檢察機關在調查\n\n6\n00:01:52,558 --> 00:02:13,766\n檢察官並沒有把這個訊息透露給我們所以我們也不從知道所以現在大概就最後的這個偵查的階段我們也希望說那個檢察機關如果偵查結束之後那看看是否起訴不起訴等等的話就能夠把案情是比較明朗化\n\n7\n00:02:14,286 --> 00:02:36,557\n本席覺得在這麼重大的事件的偵辦過程當中衛福部作為主管機關但是檢調方面一方面他去了解的那種跟你們沒有辦法一起合作然後一起去針對這些原因反覆的大家去探討這個是不是有什麼問題啊因為你這樣等於是你兩個是完全脫鉤你完全沒有辦法掌握這個到底\n\n8\n00:02:37,297 --> 00:02:51,206\n可能的原因。」那他沒有再回來跟你做一些核對嗎?因為這個偵查不公開,如果說檢方沒有主動要把訊息釋出的話,我們也無從去詢問。今天法務部有人來對不對?檢察司、國司長?\n\n9\n00:02:53,220 --> 00:03:20,910\n我覺得這樣子針對一個重大案件應該是要通力合作吧現在看起來就是各負責一邊然後拼湊不出來這個圖像沒辦法給國人交代市長你瞭解嗎這個案件現在的最新狀況跟委員報告這個隔岸之暴零案子現在分別為由一個臺北地檢跟士林檢察官在偵辦那士林檢察官因為那一邊是有死亡案子他有香菸案子那不管怎麼講他都是一個偵查案件是\n\n10\n00:03:21,630 --> 00:03:49,262\n那偵查案件就如同剛剛部長講的因為那個涉及到偵查秘密的一個問題那當然檢察官在偵查的一個作為包括鑑定啊包括這個剛剛委員提問的有關於毒品的這些可能污染源在哪裡等等其實這個都會跟衛福部這邊可能會有所聯繫啊因為那個是個案個案的偵查細節如何我們法務部其實是不方便進去去問他了\n\n11\n00:03:49,662 --> 00:03:59,287\n那這個部分你的台高檢署也督導在偵辦著對,我要問的是邦克列酸的那個源頭是什麼其實不是要問個案的細節而這個部分我覺得應該是跨部會你們都有責任好好的去偵辦而不是一句說偵辦中然後好像就沒事了然後各做各的我覺得這樣子要找出這個源頭應該是蠻困難因為到目前為止一個多月過去了拼湊不出這個圖像也沒有辦法給國人一個交代\n\n12\n00:04:17,595 --> 00:04:35,336\n這個是法務部你們應該回過頭去檢討你們常常一句說個案偵查不公開然後好像所有的人就不可以再往下去了解所有的內容我覺得這樣好像是不對這件事情是食安事件我們要了解的是那個源頭這個不是涉及到個人的刑事案件這個這應該不太一樣吧\n\n13\n00:04:37,498 --> 00:05:02,758\n跟委員報告,因為這個偵查這一個部分一定會跟衛福部合作是啊,那有嗎?你們兩邊有兜嗎?部長你有得到法務部的訊息嗎?沒有,有關於這一些說科學證據等等這些的話,那雙方是有聯繫所以這部分的話,我們大概都已經把資料給檢方啦當然檢方所調查就是那個個人的選委是沒有回饋給我們啦\n\n14\n00:05:06,020 --> 00:05:21,685\n我覺得這一件事情你們還要再去檢討就是全國民眾在等真正的原因是什麼結果現在快要變無頭公安了就是不知道到底是什麼我也希望法務部你們加快好不好這個是一個全國高度矚目的食安案件不是環辦\n\n15\n00:05:22,765 --> 00:05:37,129\n就是要趕快用你們團隊的量好好去偵辦好不好趕快給國人一個交代這個是關乎到國人食安非常重要的另外一個回到今天家暴的議題這個我們是請今天司法院也有代表來副廳長嗎李副廳長\n\n16\n00:05:40,410 --> 00:06:03,988\n這個近三年來這一些保護令的核發件數跟駁回比例我們可以看到在這個駁回比例的部分是有升高的情況那照道理來講這一些保護的案件當事人可能他就是覺得很有需求才去申請保護令結果到了司法院之後你們駁回你們有去分析你們駁回的原因是什麼嗎你看112年有高達6000多件\n\n17\n00:06:07,370 --> 00:06:15,962\n如果說他是應該保護而被你們駁回那這個受害者他的保護應該要怎麼去落實?這個你們有進一步去了解嗎?好謝謝委員跟委員報告\n\n18\n00:06:20,851 --> 00:06:40,528\n那那個法官在在審理法官或是司法事務官在審理這個保護令的事件的時候他依照我們的規定還有我們的法律的證據去判斷符不符合如果符合就應該要核發如果不符合當然不符合要件當然就會駁回那所以\n\n19\n00:06:41,229 --> 00:06:57,071\n這進段法院就一律是要看他所提出的市民的證據夠不夠達到這個合法的必要性那還有合法的內容是哪一類型的相似的那個保護令的內容來據以保護被害人而不受再繼續受到家庭暴力\n\n20\n00:06:57,532 --> 00:07:16,412\n但是他現在看起來駁回的案件數有增加的情況比例也是增加的情況你們有沒有去探究是什麼樣的原因這當中會不會有即使是個別法官認定的這個標準寬鬆不一的然後本來應該要核發但是因為他比較嚴格所以他就駁回你再看下一張圖\n\n21\n00:07:18,594 --> 00:07:28,426\n這個112年各地方的這個保護令的核發力看起來是很不一致的你可以看到有這種72%的也有這種在這個澎湖只有47%的這個整個的這個落差你們有去探究嗎\n\n22\n00:07:34,270 --> 00:07:40,953\n各縣市執行狀況不一的情況。當然不一樣,但是每一個縣市的差異化有這麼大嗎?如果從72%到47%,差異化有這麼大嗎?每一個家庭的家暴的原因的成因,然後他需要收到保護令的這個保護\n\n23\n00:08:01,421 --> 00:08:24,241\n這個標你不覺得落差很大嗎那你們有沒有我現在要問的是司法院你們有沒有認真的去看待這件事情因為基本上每一個已經要動用到保護令的他都是從受害者本身都覺得他非常的有需要他才會採取這樣的一個動作或者是社政主管機關也覺得很有需要或者是警察覺得很有需要才會協助他結果\n\n24\n00:08:25,262 --> 00:08:44,059\n在這個司法院核發下來的,如果都還有十幾趴,而且是呈現增加的情況,並沒有去核發的話,那這個就是應該好好去檢討啊。」是。跟委員報告,我們司法行政有不斷在發函,還有或者藉由…你們近期有針對這個開過任何會議嗎?跟衛福部去檢討。\n\n25\n00:08:48,402 --> 00:08:50,608\n與民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、\n\n26\n00:08:58,294 --> 00:09:21,915\n如果有把那個報告給本席我要看你們檢討出來的原因是什麼而且你們改善的是什麼另外最後一個問題我要問的是這個衛福部就是有關於目睹兒少的部分你們現在施行的一個情況在你們這個家暴裡面兒少保護類型每一年因為這個家暴案件再通報進來大概是100件左右\n\n27\n00:09:22,415 --> 00:09:47,063\n但是民間團體認為這種我們每一年將近20萬件的家暴案件這種目睹的兒少可能是超過10萬那這麼大的一個落差還有你們的服務量這當中這件事情你們現在的資源夠嗎?有在做嗎?落實的情況好嗎?因為在你們今天的報告裡面就只有一句話就是目睹兒少我也沒有看到\n\n28\n00:09:47,583 --> 00:10:07,788\n你們呈現的。」所以這個到底現在在衛福部裡面有沒有很重視這件事情這個是在上一波修法裡面特別這個民間倡議希望針對目睹這個家暴的兒少應該要進一步提供服務但是我看現在在你們所有的業務優先順序上它還是一個排在很末端的\n\n29\n00:10:08,919 --> 00:10:26,049\n這個部分的話當然也會需要我們跟教育單位之間的協助因為這些目睹的兒少那很多都是在學齡中的今天教育單位也沒有來嗎?教育部也沒有任何代表來?\n\n30\n00:10:27,330 --> 00:10:34,858\n法務部長、國家通訊傳播委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n3697\t19580\t好謝謝主席我們請部長部長好部長好部長你現在心情有很輕鬆嗎要來立法院都不會很輕鬆都不會很輕鬆\n22299\t48139\t那個我想請問你,您對於這個要接任的邱太元部長你自己要不要專業比一比?你覺得你的專業比較強還是他專業比較強?沒有啦,這無從比較啦無從比較?不敢比較還是無從比較?不敢比較,不敢比較本期是覺得你還蠻認真的啦就是什麼事情你都認真以待這是一個非常好的特質我當然希望新任的部長也有像你一般的認真才扛得起衛福部\n48799\t63350\t這麼大的一個部門因為衛福部的事情真的非常多那本期首先還是要追一下那個保齡事件我覺得保齡事件現在會不會變成無頭公案怎麼到目前為止有一度傳出警方說有重大發現\n64811\t92104\t結果又無疾而終,又沒消沒息。」那這個案件到目前為止,它是非常重大的死案事件,從3月到現在已經通報35人,2人死亡,4個人在家戶病房,而這4個人的狀況還不見得很樂觀。那這麼重大的一個死案事件,到目前為止,方克烈酸源頭在哪裡?完全沒有辦法給外界一個交代,一個多月了,到底現在卡在哪裡,部長?\n93406\t105674\t目前的話衛福部這邊能調查大概已經都調查完畢了最後的話就是實際上在運作的那個廚師當時是怎麼樣做的那因為這個是檢察機關在調查\n112558\t133766\t檢察官並沒有把這個訊息透露給我們所以我們也不從知道所以現在大概就最後的這個偵查的階段我們也希望說那個檢察機關如果偵查結束之後那看看是否起訴不起訴等等的話就能夠把案情是比較明朗化\n134286\t156557\t本席覺得在這麼重大的事件的偵辦過程當中衛福部作為主管機關但是檢調方面一方面他去了解的那種跟你們沒有辦法一起合作然後一起去針對這些原因反覆的大家去探討這個是不是有什麼問題啊因為你這樣等於是你兩個是完全脫鉤你完全沒有辦法掌握這個到底\n157297\t171206\t可能的原因。」那他沒有再回來跟你做一些核對嗎?因為這個偵查不公開,如果說檢方沒有主動要把訊息釋出的話,我們也無從去詢問。今天法務部有人來對不對?檢察司、國司長?\n173220\t200910\t我覺得這樣子針對一個重大案件應該是要通力合作吧現在看起來就是各負責一邊然後拼湊不出來這個圖像沒辦法給國人交代市長你瞭解嗎這個案件現在的最新狀況跟委員報告這個隔岸之暴零案子現在分別為由一個臺北地檢跟士林檢察官在偵辦那士林檢察官因為那一邊是有死亡案子他有香菸案子那不管怎麼講他都是一個偵查案件是\n201630\t229262\t那偵查案件就如同剛剛部長講的因為那個涉及到偵查秘密的一個問題那當然檢察官在偵查的一個作為包括鑑定啊包括這個剛剛委員提問的有關於毒品的這些可能污染源在哪裡等等其實這個都會跟衛福部這邊可能會有所聯繫啊因為那個是個案個案的偵查細節如何我們法務部其實是不方便進去去問他了\n229662\t239287\t那這個部分你的台高檢署也督導在偵辦著對,我要問的是邦克列酸的那個源頭是什麼其實不是要問個案的細節而這個部分我覺得應該是跨部會你們都有責任好好的去偵辦而不是一句說偵辦中然後好像就沒事了然後各做各的我覺得這樣子要找出這個源頭應該是蠻困難因為到目前為止一個多月過去了拼湊不出這個圖像也沒有辦法給國人一個交代\n257595\t275336\t這個是法務部你們應該回過頭去檢討你們常常一句說個案偵查不公開然後好像所有的人就不可以再往下去了解所有的內容我覺得這樣好像是不對這件事情是食安事件我們要了解的是那個源頭這個不是涉及到個人的刑事案件這個這應該不太一樣吧\n277498\t302758\t跟委員報告,因為這個偵查這一個部分一定會跟衛福部合作是啊,那有嗎?你們兩邊有兜嗎?部長你有得到法務部的訊息嗎?沒有,有關於這一些說科學證據等等這些的話,那雙方是有聯繫所以這部分的話,我們大概都已經把資料給檢方啦當然檢方所調查就是那個個人的選委是沒有回饋給我們啦\n306020\t321685\t我覺得這一件事情你們還要再去檢討就是全國民眾在等真正的原因是什麼結果現在快要變無頭公安了就是不知道到底是什麼我也希望法務部你們加快好不好這個是一個全國高度矚目的食安案件不是環辦\n322765\t337129\t就是要趕快用你們團隊的量好好去偵辦好不好趕快給國人一個交代這個是關乎到國人食安非常重要的另外一個回到今天家暴的議題這個我們是請今天司法院也有代表來副廳長嗎李副廳長\n340410\t363988\t這個近三年來這一些保護令的核發件數跟駁回比例我們可以看到在這個駁回比例的部分是有升高的情況那照道理來講這一些保護的案件當事人可能他就是覺得很有需求才去申請保護令結果到了司法院之後你們駁回你們有去分析你們駁回的原因是什麼嗎你看112年有高達6000多件\n367370\t375962\t如果說他是應該保護而被你們駁回那這個受害者他的保護應該要怎麼去落實?這個你們有進一步去了解嗎?好 謝謝委員跟委員報告\n380851\t400528\t那那個法官在在審理法官或是司法事務官在審理這個保護令的事件的時候他依照我們的規定還有我們的法律的證據去判斷符不符合如果符合就應該要核發如果不符合當然不符合要件當然就會駁回那所以\n401229\t417071\t這進段法院就一律是要看他所提出的市民的證據夠不夠達到這個合法的必要性那還有合法的內容是哪一類型的相似的那個保護令的內容來據以保護被害人而不受再繼續受到家庭暴力\n417532\t436412\t但是他現在看起來駁回的案件數有增加的情況比例也是增加的情況你們有沒有去探究是什麼樣的原因這當中會不會有即使是個別法官認定的這個標準寬鬆不一的然後本來應該要核發但是因為他比較嚴格所以他就駁回你再看下一張圖\n438594\t448426\t這個112年各地方的這個保護令的核發力看起來是很不一致的你可以看到有這種72%的也有這種在這個澎湖只有47%的這個整個的這個落差你們有去探究嗎\n454270\t460953\t各縣市執行狀況不一的情況。當然不一樣,但是每一個縣市的差異化有這麼大嗎?如果從72%到47%,差異化有這麼大嗎?每一個家庭的家暴的原因的成因,然後他需要收到保護令的這個保護\n481421\t504241\t這個標你不覺得落差很大嗎那你們有沒有我現在要問的是司法院你們有沒有認真的去看待這件事情因為基本上每一個已經要動用到保護令的他都是從受害者本身都覺得他非常的有需要他才會採取這樣的一個動作或者是社政主管機關也覺得很有需要或者是警察覺得很有需要才會協助他結果\n505262\t524059\t在這個司法院核發下來的,如果都還有十幾趴,而且是呈現增加的情況,並沒有去核發的話,那這個就是應該好好去檢討啊。」是。跟委員報告,我們司法行政有不斷在發函,還有或者藉由…你們近期有針對這個開過任何會議嗎?跟衛福部去檢討。\n528402\t530608\t與民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、\n538294\t561915\t如果有把那個報告給本席我要看你們檢討出來的原因是什麼而且你們改善的是什麼另外最後一個問題我要問的是這個衛福部就是有關於目睹兒少的部分你們現在施行的一個情況在你們這個家暴裡面兒少保護類型每一年因為這個家暴案件再通報進來大概是100件左右\n562415\t587063\t但是民間團體認為這種我們每一年將近20萬件的家暴案件這種目睹的兒少可能是超過10萬那這麼大的一個落差還有你們的服務量這當中這件事情你們現在的資源夠嗎?有在做嗎?落實的情況好嗎?因為在你們今天的報告裡面就只有一句話就是目睹兒少我也沒有看到\n587583\t607788\t你們呈現的。」所以這個到底現在在衛福部裡面有沒有很重視這件事情這個是在上一波修法裡面特別這個民間倡議希望針對目睹這個家暴的兒少應該要進一步提供服務但是我看現在在你們所有的業務優先順序上它還是一個排在很末端的\n608919\t626049\t這個部分的話當然也會需要我們跟教育單位之間的協助因為這些目睹的兒少那很多都是在學齡中的今天教育單位也沒有來嗎?教育部也沒有任何代表來?\n627330\t634858\t法務部長、國家通訊傳播委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會\n","txt":"好謝謝主席我們請部長部長好部長好部長你現在心情有很輕鬆嗎要來立法院都不會很輕鬆都不會很輕鬆\n那個我想請問你,您對於這個要接任的邱太元部長你自己要不要專業比一比?你覺得你的專業比較強還是他專業比較強?沒有啦,這無從比較啦無從比較?不敢比較還是無從比較?不敢比較,不敢比較本期是覺得你還蠻認真的啦就是什麼事情你都認真以待這是一個非常好的特質我當然希望新任的部長也有像你一般的認真才扛得起衛福部\n這麼大的一個部門因為衛福部的事情真的非常多那本期首先還是要追一下那個保齡事件我覺得保齡事件現在會不會變成無頭公案怎麼到目前為止有一度傳出警方說有重大發現\n結果又無疾而終,又沒消沒息。」那這個案件到目前為止,它是非常重大的死案事件,從3月到現在已經通報35人,2人死亡,4個人在家戶病房,而這4個人的狀況還不見得很樂觀。那這麼重大的一個死案事件,到目前為止,方克烈酸源頭在哪裡?完全沒有辦法給外界一個交代,一個多月了,到底現在卡在哪裡,部長?\n目前的話衛福部這邊能調查大概已經都調查完畢了最後的話就是實際上在運作的那個廚師當時是怎麼樣做的那因為這個是檢察機關在調查\n檢察官並沒有把這個訊息透露給我們所以我們也不從知道所以現在大概就最後的這個偵查的階段我們也希望說那個檢察機關如果偵查結束之後那看看是否起訴不起訴等等的話就能夠把案情是比較明朗化\n本席覺得在這麼重大的事件的偵辦過程當中衛福部作為主管機關但是檢調方面一方面他去了解的那種跟你們沒有辦法一起合作然後一起去針對這些原因反覆的大家去探討這個是不是有什麼問題啊因為你這樣等於是你兩個是完全脫鉤你完全沒有辦法掌握這個到底\n可能的原因。」那他沒有再回來跟你做一些核對嗎?因為這個偵查不公開,如果說檢方沒有主動要把訊息釋出的話,我們也無從去詢問。今天法務部有人來對不對?檢察司、國司長?\n我覺得這樣子針對一個重大案件應該是要通力合作吧現在看起來就是各負責一邊然後拼湊不出來這個圖像沒辦法給國人交代市長你瞭解嗎這個案件現在的最新狀況跟委員報告這個隔岸之暴零案子現在分別為由一個臺北地檢跟士林檢察官在偵辦那士林檢察官因為那一邊是有死亡案子他有香菸案子那不管怎麼講他都是一個偵查案件是\n那偵查案件就如同剛剛部長講的因為那個涉及到偵查秘密的一個問題那當然檢察官在偵查的一個作為包括鑑定啊包括這個剛剛委員提問的有關於毒品的這些可能污染源在哪裡等等其實這個都會跟衛福部這邊可能會有所聯繫啊因為那個是個案個案的偵查細節如何我們法務部其實是不方便進去去問他了\n那這個部分你的台高檢署也督導在偵辦著對,我要問的是邦克列酸的那個源頭是什麼其實不是要問個案的細節而這個部分我覺得應該是跨部會你們都有責任好好的去偵辦而不是一句說偵辦中然後好像就沒事了然後各做各的我覺得這樣子要找出這個源頭應該是蠻困難因為到目前為止一個多月過去了拼湊不出這個圖像也沒有辦法給國人一個交代\n這個是法務部你們應該回過頭去檢討你們常常一句說個案偵查不公開然後好像所有的人就不可以再往下去了解所有的內容我覺得這樣好像是不對這件事情是食安事件我們要了解的是那個源頭這個不是涉及到個人的刑事案件這個這應該不太一樣吧\n跟委員報告,因為這個偵查這一個部分一定會跟衛福部合作是啊,那有嗎?你們兩邊有兜嗎?部長你有得到法務部的訊息嗎?沒有,有關於這一些說科學證據等等這些的話,那雙方是有聯繫所以這部分的話,我們大概都已經把資料給檢方啦當然檢方所調查就是那個個人的選委是沒有回饋給我們啦\n我覺得這一件事情你們還要再去檢討就是全國民眾在等真正的原因是什麼結果現在快要變無頭公安了就是不知道到底是什麼我也希望法務部你們加快好不好這個是一個全國高度矚目的食安案件不是環辦\n就是要趕快用你們團隊的量好好去偵辦好不好趕快給國人一個交代這個是關乎到國人食安非常重要的另外一個回到今天家暴的議題這個我們是請今天司法院也有代表來副廳長嗎李副廳長\n這個近三年來這一些保護令的核發件數跟駁回比例我們可以看到在這個駁回比例的部分是有升高的情況那照道理來講這一些保護的案件當事人可能他就是覺得很有需求才去申請保護令結果到了司法院之後你們駁回你們有去分析你們駁回的原因是什麼嗎你看112年有高達6000多件\n如果說他是應該保護而被你們駁回那這個受害者他的保護應該要怎麼去落實?這個你們有進一步去了解嗎?好 謝謝委員跟委員報告\n那那個法官在在審理法官或是司法事務官在審理這個保護令的事件的時候他依照我們的規定還有我們的法律的證據去判斷符不符合如果符合就應該要核發如果不符合當然不符合要件當然就會駁回那所以\n這進段法院就一律是要看他所提出的市民的證據夠不夠達到這個合法的必要性那還有合法的內容是哪一類型的相似的那個保護令的內容來據以保護被害人而不受再繼續受到家庭暴力\n但是他現在看起來駁回的案件數有增加的情況比例也是增加的情況你們有沒有去探究是什麼樣的原因這當中會不會有即使是個別法官認定的這個標準寬鬆不一的然後本來應該要核發但是因為他比較嚴格所以他就駁回你再看下一張圖\n這個112年各地方的這個保護令的核發力看起來是很不一致的你可以看到有這種72%的也有這種在這個澎湖只有47%的這個整個的這個落差你們有去探究嗎\n各縣市執行狀況不一的情況。當然不一樣,但是每一個縣市的差異化有這麼大嗎?如果從72%到47%,差異化有這麼大嗎?每一個家庭的家暴的原因的成因,然後他需要收到保護令的這個保護\n這個標你不覺得落差很大嗎那你們有沒有我現在要問的是司法院你們有沒有認真的去看待這件事情因為基本上每一個已經要動用到保護令的他都是從受害者本身都覺得他非常的有需要他才會採取這樣的一個動作或者是社政主管機關也覺得很有需要或者是警察覺得很有需要才會協助他結果\n在這個司法院核發下來的,如果都還有十幾趴,而且是呈現增加的情況,並沒有去核發的話,那這個就是應該好好去檢討啊。」是。跟委員報告,我們司法行政有不斷在發函,還有或者藉由…你們近期有針對這個開過任何會議嗎?跟衛福部去檢討。\n與民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、\n如果有把那個報告給本席我要看你們檢討出來的原因是什麼而且你們改善的是什麼另外最後一個問題我要問的是這個衛福部就是有關於目睹兒少的部分你們現在施行的一個情況在你們這個家暴裡面兒少保護類型每一年因為這個家暴案件再通報進來大概是100件左右\n但是民間團體認為這種我們每一年將近20萬件的家暴案件這種目睹的兒少可能是超過10萬那這麼大的一個落差還有你們的服務量這當中這件事情你們現在的資源夠嗎?有在做嗎?落實的情況好嗎?因為在你們今天的報告裡面就只有一句話就是目睹兒少我也沒有看到\n你們呈現的。」所以這個到底現在在衛福部裡面有沒有很重視這件事情這個是在上一波修法裡面特別這個民間倡議希望針對目睹這個家暴的兒少應該要進一步提供服務但是我看現在在你們所有的業務優先順序上它還是一個排在很末端的\n這個部分的話當然也會需要我們跟教育單位之間的協助因為這些目睹的兒少那很多都是在學齡中的今天教育單位也沒有來嗎?教育部也沒有任何代表來?\n法務部長、國家通訊傳播委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:03.697 --> 00:19.580\n好謝謝主席我們請部長部長好部長好部長你現在心情有很輕鬆嗎要來立法院都不會很輕鬆都不會很輕鬆\n\n00:22.299 --> 00:48.139\n那個我想請問你,您對於這個要接任的邱太元部長你自己要不要專業比一比?你覺得你的專業比較強還是他專業比較強?沒有啦,這無從比較啦無從比較?不敢比較還是無從比較?不敢比較,不敢比較本期是覺得你還蠻認真的啦就是什麼事情你都認真以待這是一個非常好的特質我當然希望新任的部長也有像你一般的認真才扛得起衛福部\n\n00:48.799 --> 01:03.350\n這麼大的一個部門因為衛福部的事情真的非常多那本期首先還是要追一下那個保齡事件我覺得保齡事件現在會不會變成無頭公案怎麼到目前為止有一度傳出警方說有重大發現\n\n01:04.811 --> 01:32.104\n結果又無疾而終,又沒消沒息。」那這個案件到目前為止,它是非常重大的死案事件,從3月到現在已經通報35人,2人死亡,4個人在家戶病房,而這4個人的狀況還不見得很樂觀。那這麼重大的一個死案事件,到目前為止,方克烈酸源頭在哪裡?完全沒有辦法給外界一個交代,一個多月了,到底現在卡在哪裡,部長?\n\n01:33.406 --> 01:45.674\n目前的話衛福部這邊能調查大概已經都調查完畢了最後的話就是實際上在運作的那個廚師當時是怎麼樣做的那因為這個是檢察機關在調查\n\n01:52.558 --> 02:13.766\n檢察官並沒有把這個訊息透露給我們所以我們也不從知道所以現在大概就最後的這個偵查的階段我們也希望說那個檢察機關如果偵查結束之後那看看是否起訴不起訴等等的話就能夠把案情是比較明朗化\n\n02:14.286 --> 02:36.557\n本席覺得在這麼重大的事件的偵辦過程當中衛福部作為主管機關但是檢調方面一方面他去了解的那種跟你們沒有辦法一起合作然後一起去針對這些原因反覆的大家去探討這個是不是有什麼問題啊因為你這樣等於是你兩個是完全脫鉤你完全沒有辦法掌握這個到底\n\n02:37.297 --> 02:51.206\n可能的原因。」那他沒有再回來跟你做一些核對嗎?因為這個偵查不公開,如果說檢方沒有主動要把訊息釋出的話,我們也無從去詢問。今天法務部有人來對不對?檢察司、國司長?\n\n02:53.220 --> 03:20.910\n我覺得這樣子針對一個重大案件應該是要通力合作吧現在看起來就是各負責一邊然後拼湊不出來這個圖像沒辦法給國人交代市長你瞭解嗎這個案件現在的最新狀況跟委員報告這個隔岸之暴零案子現在分別為由一個臺北地檢跟士林檢察官在偵辦那士林檢察官因為那一邊是有死亡案子他有香菸案子那不管怎麼講他都是一個偵查案件是\n\n03:21.630 --> 03:49.262\n那偵查案件就如同剛剛部長講的因為那個涉及到偵查秘密的一個問題那當然檢察官在偵查的一個作為包括鑑定啊包括這個剛剛委員提問的有關於毒品的這些可能污染源在哪裡等等其實這個都會跟衛福部這邊可能會有所聯繫啊因為那個是個案個案的偵查細節如何我們法務部其實是不方便進去去問他了\n\n03:49.662 --> 03:59.287\n那這個部分你的台高檢署也督導在偵辦著對,我要問的是邦克列酸的那個源頭是什麼其實不是要問個案的細節而這個部分我覺得應該是跨部會你們都有責任好好的去偵辦而不是一句說偵辦中然後好像就沒事了然後各做各的我覺得這樣子要找出這個源頭應該是蠻困難因為到目前為止一個多月過去了拼湊不出這個圖像也沒有辦法給國人一個交代\n\n04:17.595 --> 04:35.336\n這個是法務部你們應該回過頭去檢討你們常常一句說個案偵查不公開然後好像所有的人就不可以再往下去了解所有的內容我覺得這樣好像是不對這件事情是食安事件我們要了解的是那個源頭這個不是涉及到個人的刑事案件這個這應該不太一樣吧\n\n04:37.498 --> 05:02.758\n跟委員報告,因為這個偵查這一個部分一定會跟衛福部合作是啊,那有嗎?你們兩邊有兜嗎?部長你有得到法務部的訊息嗎?沒有,有關於這一些說科學證據等等這些的話,那雙方是有聯繫所以這部分的話,我們大概都已經把資料給檢方啦當然檢方所調查就是那個個人的選委是沒有回饋給我們啦\n\n05:06.020 --> 05:21.685\n我覺得這一件事情你們還要再去檢討就是全國民眾在等真正的原因是什麼結果現在快要變無頭公安了就是不知道到底是什麼我也希望法務部你們加快好不好這個是一個全國高度矚目的食安案件不是環辦\n\n05:22.765 --> 05:37.129\n就是要趕快用你們團隊的量好好去偵辦好不好趕快給國人一個交代這個是關乎到國人食安非常重要的另外一個回到今天家暴的議題這個我們是請今天司法院也有代表來副廳長嗎李副廳長\n\n05:40.410 --> 06:03.988\n這個近三年來這一些保護令的核發件數跟駁回比例我們可以看到在這個駁回比例的部分是有升高的情況那照道理來講這一些保護的案件當事人可能他就是覺得很有需求才去申請保護令結果到了司法院之後你們駁回你們有去分析你們駁回的原因是什麼嗎你看112年有高達6000多件\n\n06:07.370 --> 06:15.962\n如果說他是應該保護而被你們駁回那這個受害者他的保護應該要怎麼去落實?這個你們有進一步去了解嗎?好謝謝委員跟委員報告\n\n06:20.851 --> 06:40.528\n那那個法官在在審理法官或是司法事務官在審理這個保護令的事件的時候他依照我們的規定還有我們的法律的證據去判斷符不符合如果符合就應該要核發如果不符合當然不符合要件當然就會駁回那所以\n\n06:41.229 --> 06:57.071\n這進段法院就一律是要看他所提出的市民的證據夠不夠達到這個合法的必要性那還有合法的內容是哪一類型的相似的那個保護令的內容來據以保護被害人而不受再繼續受到家庭暴力\n\n06:57.532 --> 07:16.412\n但是他現在看起來駁回的案件數有增加的情況比例也是增加的情況你們有沒有去探究是什麼樣的原因這當中會不會有即使是個別法官認定的這個標準寬鬆不一的然後本來應該要核發但是因為他比較嚴格所以他就駁回你再看下一張圖\n\n07:18.594 --> 07:28.426\n這個112年各地方的這個保護令的核發力看起來是很不一致的你可以看到有這種72%的也有這種在這個澎湖只有47%的這個整個的這個落差你們有去探究嗎\n\n07:34.270 --> 07:40.953\n各縣市執行狀況不一的情況。當然不一樣,但是每一個縣市的差異化有這麼大嗎?如果從72%到47%,差異化有這麼大嗎?每一個家庭的家暴的原因的成因,然後他需要收到保護令的這個保護\n\n08:01.421 --> 08:24.241\n這個標你不覺得落差很大嗎那你們有沒有我現在要問的是司法院你們有沒有認真的去看待這件事情因為基本上每一個已經要動用到保護令的他都是從受害者本身都覺得他非常的有需要他才會採取這樣的一個動作或者是社政主管機關也覺得很有需要或者是警察覺得很有需要才會協助他結果\n\n08:25.262 --> 08:44.059\n在這個司法院核發下來的,如果都還有十幾趴,而且是呈現增加的情況,並沒有去核發的話,那這個就是應該好好去檢討啊。」是。跟委員報告,我們司法行政有不斷在發函,還有或者藉由…你們近期有針對這個開過任何會議嗎?跟衛福部去檢討。\n\n08:48.402 --> 08:50.608\n與民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、\n\n08:58.294 --> 09:21.915\n如果有把那個報告給本席我要看你們檢討出來的原因是什麼而且你們改善的是什麼另外最後一個問題我要問的是這個衛福部就是有關於目睹兒少的部分你們現在施行的一個情況在你們這個家暴裡面兒少保護類型每一年因為這個家暴案件再通報進來大概是100件左右\n\n09:22.415 --> 09:47.063\n但是民間團體認為這種我們每一年將近20萬件的家暴案件這種目睹的兒少可能是超過10萬那這麼大的一個落差還有你們的服務量這當中這件事情你們現在的資源夠嗎?有在做嗎?落實的情況好嗎?因為在你們今天的報告裡面就只有一句話就是目睹兒少我也沒有看到\n\n09:47.583 --> 10:07.788\n你們呈現的。」所以這個到底現在在衛福部裡面有沒有很重視這件事情這個是在上一波修法裡面特別這個民間倡議希望針對目睹這個家暴的兒少應該要進一步提供服務但是我看現在在你們所有的業務優先順序上它還是一個排在很末端的\n\n10:08.919 --> 10:26.049\n這個部分的話當然也會需要我們跟教育單位之間的協助因為這些目睹的兒少那很多都是在學齡中的今天教育單位也沒有來嗎?教育部也沒有任何代表來?\n\n10:27.330 --> 10:34.858\n法務部長、國家通訊傳播委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會\n\n","segments":[{"start":3.697,"end":19.58,"text":"好謝謝主席我們請部長部長好部長好部長你現在心情有很輕鬆嗎要來立法院都不會很輕鬆都不會很輕鬆"},{"start":22.299,"end":48.139,"text":"那個我想請問你,您對於這個要接任的邱太元部長你自己要不要專業比一比?你覺得你的專業比較強還是他專業比較強?沒有啦,這無從比較啦無從比較?不敢比較還是無從比較?不敢比較,不敢比較本期是覺得你還蠻認真的啦就是什麼事情你都認真以待這是一個非常好的特質我當然希望新任的部長也有像你一般的認真才扛得起衛福部"},{"start":48.799,"end":63.35,"text":"這麼大的一個部門因為衛福部的事情真的非常多那本期首先還是要追一下那個保齡事件我覺得保齡事件現在會不會變成無頭公案怎麼到目前為止有一度傳出警方說有重大發現"},{"start":64.811,"end":92.104,"text":"結果又無疾而終,又沒消沒息。」那這個案件到目前為止,它是非常重大的死案事件,從3月到現在已經通報35人,2人死亡,4個人在家戶病房,而這4個人的狀況還不見得很樂觀。那這麼重大的一個死案事件,到目前為止,方克烈酸源頭在哪裡?完全沒有辦法給外界一個交代,一個多月了,到底現在卡在哪裡,部長?"},{"start":93.406,"end":105.674,"text":"目前的話衛福部這邊能調查大概已經都調查完畢了最後的話就是實際上在運作的那個廚師當時是怎麼樣做的那因為這個是檢察機關在調查"},{"start":112.558,"end":133.766,"text":"檢察官並沒有把這個訊息透露給我們所以我們也不從知道所以現在大概就最後的這個偵查的階段我們也希望說那個檢察機關如果偵查結束之後那看看是否起訴不起訴等等的話就能夠把案情是比較明朗化"},{"start":134.286,"end":156.557,"text":"本席覺得在這麼重大的事件的偵辦過程當中衛福部作為主管機關但是檢調方面一方面他去了解的那種跟你們沒有辦法一起合作然後一起去針對這些原因反覆的大家去探討這個是不是有什麼問題啊因為你這樣等於是你兩個是完全脫鉤你完全沒有辦法掌握這個到底"},{"start":157.297,"end":171.206,"text":"可能的原因。」那他沒有再回來跟你做一些核對嗎?因為這個偵查不公開,如果說檢方沒有主動要把訊息釋出的話,我們也無從去詢問。今天法務部有人來對不對?檢察司、國司長?"},{"start":173.22,"end":200.91,"text":"我覺得這樣子針對一個重大案件應該是要通力合作吧現在看起來就是各負責一邊然後拼湊不出來這個圖像沒辦法給國人交代市長你瞭解嗎這個案件現在的最新狀況跟委員報告這個隔岸之暴零案子現在分別為由一個臺北地檢跟士林檢察官在偵辦那士林檢察官因為那一邊是有死亡案子他有香菸案子那不管怎麼講他都是一個偵查案件是"},{"start":201.63,"end":229.262,"text":"那偵查案件就如同剛剛部長講的因為那個涉及到偵查秘密的一個問題那當然檢察官在偵查的一個作為包括鑑定啊包括這個剛剛委員提問的有關於毒品的這些可能污染源在哪裡等等其實這個都會跟衛福部這邊可能會有所聯繫啊因為那個是個案個案的偵查細節如何我們法務部其實是不方便進去去問他了"},{"start":229.662,"end":239.287,"text":"那這個部分你的台高檢署也督導在偵辦著對,我要問的是邦克列酸的那個源頭是什麼其實不是要問個案的細節而這個部分我覺得應該是跨部會你們都有責任好好的去偵辦而不是一句說偵辦中然後好像就沒事了然後各做各的我覺得這樣子要找出這個源頭應該是蠻困難因為到目前為止一個多月過去了拼湊不出這個圖像也沒有辦法給國人一個交代"},{"start":257.595,"end":275.336,"text":"這個是法務部你們應該回過頭去檢討你們常常一句說個案偵查不公開然後好像所有的人就不可以再往下去了解所有的內容我覺得這樣好像是不對這件事情是食安事件我們要了解的是那個源頭這個不是涉及到個人的刑事案件這個這應該不太一樣吧"},{"start":277.498,"end":302.758,"text":"跟委員報告,因為這個偵查這一個部分一定會跟衛福部合作是啊,那有嗎?你們兩邊有兜嗎?部長你有得到法務部的訊息嗎?沒有,有關於這一些說科學證據等等這些的話,那雙方是有聯繫所以這部分的話,我們大概都已經把資料給檢方啦當然檢方所調查就是那個個人的選委是沒有回饋給我們啦"},{"start":306.02,"end":321.685,"text":"我覺得這一件事情你們還要再去檢討就是全國民眾在等真正的原因是什麼結果現在快要變無頭公安了就是不知道到底是什麼我也希望法務部你們加快好不好這個是一個全國高度矚目的食安案件不是環辦"},{"start":322.765,"end":337.129,"text":"就是要趕快用你們團隊的量好好去偵辦好不好趕快給國人一個交代這個是關乎到國人食安非常重要的另外一個回到今天家暴的議題這個我們是請今天司法院也有代表來副廳長嗎李副廳長"},{"start":340.41,"end":363.988,"text":"這個近三年來這一些保護令的核發件數跟駁回比例我們可以看到在這個駁回比例的部分是有升高的情況那照道理來講這一些保護的案件當事人可能他就是覺得很有需求才去申請保護令結果到了司法院之後你們駁回你們有去分析你們駁回的原因是什麼嗎你看112年有高達6000多件"},{"start":367.37,"end":375.962,"text":"如果說他是應該保護而被你們駁回那這個受害者他的保護應該要怎麼去落實?這個你們有進一步去了解嗎?好 謝謝委員跟委員報告"},{"start":380.851,"end":400.528,"text":"那那個法官在在審理法官或是司法事務官在審理這個保護令的事件的時候他依照我們的規定還有我們的法律的證據去判斷符不符合如果符合就應該要核發如果不符合當然不符合要件當然就會駁回那所以"},{"start":401.229,"end":417.071,"text":"這進段法院就一律是要看他所提出的市民的證據夠不夠達到這個合法的必要性那還有合法的內容是哪一類型的相似的那個保護令的內容來據以保護被害人而不受再繼續受到家庭暴力"},{"start":417.532,"end":436.412,"text":"但是他現在看起來駁回的案件數有增加的情況比例也是增加的情況你們有沒有去探究是什麼樣的原因這當中會不會有即使是個別法官認定的這個標準寬鬆不一的然後本來應該要核發但是因為他比較嚴格所以他就駁回你再看下一張圖"},{"start":438.594,"end":448.426,"text":"這個112年各地方的這個保護令的核發力看起來是很不一致的你可以看到有這種72%的也有這種在這個澎湖只有47%的這個整個的這個落差你們有去探究嗎"},{"start":454.27,"end":460.953,"text":"各縣市執行狀況不一的情況。當然不一樣,但是每一個縣市的差異化有這麼大嗎?如果從72%到47%,差異化有這麼大嗎?每一個家庭的家暴的原因的成因,然後他需要收到保護令的這個保護"},{"start":481.421,"end":504.241,"text":"這個標你不覺得落差很大嗎那你們有沒有我現在要問的是司法院你們有沒有認真的去看待這件事情因為基本上每一個已經要動用到保護令的他都是從受害者本身都覺得他非常的有需要他才會採取這樣的一個動作或者是社政主管機關也覺得很有需要或者是警察覺得很有需要才會協助他結果"},{"start":505.262,"end":524.059,"text":"在這個司法院核發下來的,如果都還有十幾趴,而且是呈現增加的情況,並沒有去核發的話,那這個就是應該好好去檢討啊。」是。跟委員報告,我們司法行政有不斷在發函,還有或者藉由…你們近期有針對這個開過任何會議嗎?跟衛福部去檢討。"},{"start":528.402,"end":530.608,"text":"與民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、民主、"},{"start":538.294,"end":561.915,"text":"如果有把那個報告給本席我要看你們檢討出來的原因是什麼而且你們改善的是什麼另外最後一個問題我要問的是這個衛福部就是有關於目睹兒少的部分你們現在施行的一個情況在你們這個家暴裡面兒少保護類型每一年因為這個家暴案件再通報進來大概是100件左右"},{"start":562.415,"end":587.063,"text":"但是民間團體認為這種我們每一年將近20萬件的家暴案件這種目睹的兒少可能是超過10萬那這麼大的一個落差還有你們的服務量這當中這件事情你們現在的資源夠嗎?有在做嗎?落實的情況好嗎?因為在你們今天的報告裡面就只有一句話就是目睹兒少我也沒有看到"},{"start":587.583,"end":607.788,"text":"你們呈現的。」所以這個到底現在在衛福部裡面有沒有很重視這件事情這個是在上一波修法裡面特別這個民間倡議希望針對目睹這個家暴的兒少應該要進一步提供服務但是我看現在在你們所有的業務優先順序上它還是一個排在很末端的"},{"start":608.919,"end":626.049,"text":"這個部分的話當然也會需要我們跟教育單位之間的協助因為這些目睹的兒少那很多都是在學齡中的今天教育單位也沒有來嗎?教育部也沒有任何代表來?"},{"start":627.33,"end":634.858,"text":"法務部長、國家通訊傳播委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會"}]}}}}