{"id":151658,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151658","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/534e6c42fa7aedb304d9e2fe00367080e793a383c05d564ceadb1108e4b84432581072cc072802035ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳冠廷","委員發言時間":"11:17:03 - 11:25:36","影片長度":"00:08:33","會議時間":"2024-04-24T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防、司法及法制委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：一、審查行政院函請審議「陸海空軍懲罰法修正草案」案。二、審查本院委員徐巧芯等18人擬具「陸海空軍懲罰法部分條文修正草案」案。三、審查行政院函請審議「軍人權益事件處理法草案」案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具「軍人權益事件處理法草案」案。【4月24日及25日二天一次會】）","date":"2024-04-24","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防、司法及法制委員會第1次聯席會議","type":"聯席會議","term":11,"sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":1,"committees":[35,36],"id":"聯席會議-11-1-35,36-1"},"duration":513,"end_time":"2024-04-24T11:25:36+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-24T11:17:03+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":545,"blocks":[["陳委員冠廷：（11時17分）你好，請部長。"],["主席：部長請。"],["邱部長國正：陳委員好。"],["陳委員冠廷：部長好。近期美國對臺灣的軍購案有些延宕，一方面是疫情，一方面是俄烏戰爭，還有可能是中東戰爭的影響，美國國會議員建議讓臺灣自行建造美國設計的武器系統，以解決目前遇到的延宕狀況。Phelim在Politico雜誌上面寫的這篇文章裡面把我們現在面臨的挑戰都有講出來，請問國防部有沒有注意到這些新聞？"],["邱部長國正：這是國防部主要工作之一，所以一定會注意的，我們也有方法催促。"],["陳委員冠廷：是，目前為止美國沒有交付的累計大概還有190億美元的軍售項目，這都是我們迫切所需要的武器，我們都希望能夠儘早掌握。我想請教一下，在Politico這篇文章裡面有提到，我們面臨到的挑戰是在臺生產是一回事，但是有洩密的風險，針對這個部分，大家有沒有檢討要朝什麼樣的方向去克服？"],["邱部長國正：洩密是大家都顧慮的，但我們要怎麼樣來防止洩密案件，這也是我們平常教育訓練工作之一。不光教育訓練，而且還要去督管，管理得當，洩密案件自然會減低，而其他工作推動也自然順遂而行。"],["陳委員冠廷：主要是這是一個對話，我們如果希望能夠有更多在臺生產的武器系統的話，也要說服美國不管是國會或者是執政的executive branch、行政體系，目前這方面的溝通狀態是怎麼樣？有沒有可能未來有機會在一些他們所建議的，包含我看到Gallagher有說空中及水下無人載具在臺灣用他們的系統，然後在臺灣生產，目前溝通的狀況及可能性為何？"],["邱部長國正：的確這個工作不斷在溝通，我們現在有很多國內有產製能力但有些裡面比較機敏的部分不見得有，就要透過這個管道，不過透過這個管道現在會有顧慮，可能有洩密的問題，所以這個東西看要怎麼克服，但是這個工作推動沒有停止過。"],["陳委員冠廷：我想當然可以透過法制上面去補足，包含國安法、國家情報工作法去盤點，這幾次的質詢我們都有提到有許多洩密的案件，要嘛就是判刑過輕，要嘛就是蒐證的關係等等，透過國家情報工作法，我們自己本身也有提案，加強專業法官的知識，甚至有專業法庭的話，能夠把相關的訊息、知識傳達給審理的法官。我想這方面的立法我們是會推動，但是我也希望未來有機會國防部能夠知道，它能夠負責的當然是陸、海、空或者是cyber這種各個不同的軍種，但是其實在法律上面的諮詢、金融上面的諮詢，國防部能夠提供更多的資訊給這一些相關機構，我想這也是非常重要的。"],["邱部長國正：是。"],["陳委員冠廷：因為我們剛才提到接觸的這些密等，我就忍不住想到，最近有一些國防的承包商直接進入軍營裡面，國防承包商進入軍營裡面，當然是有僱用一些非法的勞工。我想請教一下，我們檢討過去國防部營區的這些承包商，有沒有施工人員清冊？有的話，是認車還是認人？還是認章不認人？"],["邱部長國正：我跟委員報告，施工單位有的時候會把工程外包，但外包不是丟給施工單位，我們就不管了，我們也有一個規定，就是勞務要派哪些人、不得派哪些人，這都在條約裡面訂得清清楚楚，但我們現在要編組，我不能夠再去幫你一個一個過濾是不是有違規的人，但我告知你，你如果違規了，我跟這個廠商之間是有罰則的，否則我每一樣事情都要介入的話，我們也受不了。"],["陳委員冠廷：我沒有叫你介入啊，我沒有要請國防部來介入這些個案，我們現在是說怎麼樣釐清進入的人。"],["邱部長國正：對，如果每件事情都要去查證，我們沒有這個能耐，但我們在法規裡面只要定了，是由勞務單位他們去界定，如果逾越了，就接受罰則吧！"],["陳委員冠廷：好，瞭解，如果是這樣的說法，那就這樣做，反正我們都有法律，那就是誰違法，我們再罰嘛。"],["邱部長國正：不是這樣的，委員這樣說好像我就聽命他安排了，有很多例證嘛，你只要有涉及違法事件，軍法該要出面，一樣要出面，我們一樣要抗告，但最後的責任，我們一定會找那個勞務單位。"],["陳委員冠廷：我剛才請教的問題是，軍方在查明人員進入營區單位的時候，他們是認什麼？他們有一個clearance嗎？有一個章嗎？還是他們對於人員的管制有怎麼樣的作法？"],["邱部長國正：他要到營區的時候要有識別證。"],["陳委員冠廷：有識別證嘛，那你們要提供識別證的話，是不是要先做查核？"],["邱部長國正：當然要查核啦！一定要查核。"],["陳委員冠廷：那查核的話，這次就是很不幸剛好有發生這樣的事情，我們未來……"],["邱部長國正：不是，委員提的這個案子我知道，他沒有在營區裡面，它是隔開的，他出入口跟這個營區等等並沒有進去。"],["陳委員冠廷：所以沒有進去營區？"],["邱部長國正：是，我們……"],["陳委員冠廷：所以這件事情是沒有進入營區，在還沒有相關的安全危害時就已經成功地去堵住了，就沒有這件事情，沒有直接影響到安全。好，謝謝。","最後，關於美國通過對臺安全的法案，其中有19億美元是用於補充臺灣的軍事物資，還有20億美元的軍事融資，我想請教部長，這些部分我們未來的規劃大概是什麼樣的方向？"],["邱部長國正：不管用……"],["陳委員冠廷：直接是用在哪個地方？"],["邱部長國正：我請戰規司說明一下。"],["陳委員冠廷：大概規劃的方向。"],["曹副司長定明：跟委員報告，這個部分參議院已經在今天早上9點40分通過了，這是最新的狀況，跟委員做個報告。"],["陳委員冠廷：對。"],["曹副司長定明：19億的部分是指定給美國國防部來做使用，它在法規裡面所律定的範圍是臺灣及區域的夥伴國家，包括回補美國國防部援臺的裝備，以及對臺的軍事服務、軍事教育訓練，這跟剛剛召委這邊所詢問的內容是類似的。"],["陳委員冠廷：好。不好意思召委，讓我問最後一個問題。共軍進入臺海周邊的警示，國防部說有不斷精進、調整公布的方式，現在是避免敵人利用縫隙對我國進行認知作戰，所以取消公布侵擾共機的機型，想請教一下部長，為什麼我們要做這樣子的調整？"],["主席：請摘要回答。"],["邱部長國正：我好像是調整得越來越清楚……好像把它弄得一點點，越界越到哪裡，我就列出來，我不知道那個差別，假如你的左右……"],["陳委員冠廷：過去的話會公布機型，現在基本上不是採這樣的作法，就是取消公布侵擾共機的機型，簡化相關的資訊。我們來看一下，日本方面的話，他們會有一個資訊，不管是摘要這些無人機的機型，還有海軍的這些訊息，或者是中國進入他們警示範圍的部分，都會把它標示出來。我想請教一下，為什麼我們過去會把中共機型的相關資料標示出來，現在沒有？是擔心哪一個部分？"],["邱部長國正：沒有什麼擔憂啦，這個我們以區塊表示，在這個範圍裡面各種機型都有，我還一樣一樣、一架一架列嗎？所以我想委員有這個問題，我們……"],["陳委員冠廷：對，那過去為什麼要列，現在為什麼不列？我的問題只是這個而已。"],["邱部長國正：過去它出來的時候，我們很明確地說就那幾架，但現在數量變多了，反正主戰兵力或者輔戰兵力我們都有掌握，委員要，我們可以提供，沒有講說對外有什麼……"],["陳委員冠廷：我現在是在問原因，不是在問我要不要，謝謝部長。"],["邱部長國正：我不知道委員要不要聽，要聽的話，我派人去跟委員說明。"],["陳委員冠廷：不是，部長，我現在問的是為什麼過去有、現在沒有，我們的目的是為什麼？"],["邱部長國正：因為以前是把這些架次清楚地列出來，它數量不多，可以這樣做，但現在數量變多了，我就以區塊來表達，就是這個原因。"],["陳委員冠廷：謝謝部長，我就是要知道這個原因。"],["邱部長國正：好。"],["主席：謝謝陳冠廷委員。部長，請回。","因為數量增加導致處置不同，不過大家可以討論啦！","我們休息5分鐘，待會繼續開會，請吳思瑤委員備便，抱歉。","休息（11時25分）","繼續開會（11時31分）"],["主席：好，我們繼續開會。","接下來進行詢答的委員是邱志偉委員、邱志偉委員、邱志偉委員不在。","接下來詢答的委員是吳思瑤委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":304,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-1-35,36-1","speakers":["王定宇","馬文君","林楚茵","沈伯洋","黃國昌","羅美玲","黃仁","徐巧芯","陳永康","陳俊宇","羅智強","林思銘","洪申翰","翁曉玲","陳冠廷","吳思瑤","林憶君","鄭天財Sra 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00:01:05,086\n國防部,這是主要工作之一,所以一定會注意。是,那我想我們現在美國累計,目前為止軍售項目大概還有,沒有交付的還有190億美元的這些軍售項目,那這都是我們迫切所需要的武器,那我們都希望能夠儘早來斬獲。我想請教一下,在這邊\n\n5\n00:01:06,147 --> 00:01:30,600\n文章裡面有提到,Politico上面的文章裡面有提到說,我們面臨到的挑戰就是說,在台生產是一回事,但是有洩密的風險,這個部分大家有沒有檢討說什麼樣的方向去克服?我今天講的一個洩密是大家都顧慮的,那我們要怎麼樣來防止洩密案件,這也是平常我們教育訓練工作之一。不光教育訓練,而且還去督管。\n\n6\n00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:33,821\n審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人\n\n7\n00:01:56,954 --> 00:02:24,223\n有沒有可能未來有機會在一些他們所建議的,包含我看蓋拉格有說空中及水下無人的載具這些在台灣這些用他們的這些系統然後在台灣生產,那目前溝通的狀況跟可能性為何?的確這個工作不但在溝通,我們現在有很多那個國內有這個產製的能力,但有些裡面比較機敏的設置不見得有,就要透過這個管道,透過管道才會有顧慮,會有洩密的問題。\n\n8\n00:02:26,664 --> 00:02:51,849\n所以我們就是一開始來克服,但是工作推動沒有停止過,沒有停止過。我想是當然是可以透過法制上面來去補足啦,那包含這個國安法、國家情報工作法,那來去盤點,那我想這幾次的質詢我們都有提到說其實有多許多這種洩密的案件,那他的這一個要嘛就是判刑過輕,要嘛就是修正的關係等等,那我們希望加強\n\n9\n00:02:52,609 --> 00:02:54,530\n審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人\n\n10\n00:03:12,697 --> 00:03:39,959\n能夠負責的當然是陸海空或者是這個Cyber這種各種不同的軍種但是其實跟法律上面諮詢金融上面諮詢我們國防部能夠提供更多資訊給這一些相關的機構我想這也是非常重要的那因為我們剛才提到這個接觸的這些密等我就忍不住想到說最近有一些國防的承包商他直接進入軍營裡面那國防承包商進入軍營裡面那當然是有\n\n11\n00:03:40,920 --> 00:04:01,202\n僱用的一些非法的一些相關的勞工。」我想請教一下,我們檢討過去國防部營區的這些承包的有沒有施工人員清澈?那有的話是認車還是認人?還是認張不認人?我跟委員報告,叫施工單位,它有這個工程外包,但外包不丟給施工單位,我們就不管了。\n\n12\n00:04:01,883 --> 00:04:18,100\n我們也有一個規定,就是勞務要派哪些人,不得派哪些人,這都在條約裡面定的清清楚楚。但我們現在要編組了這樣,我不能再去幫你一個一個過濾,是有違規的。但我告知你,你若違規了,我是有罰則的。\n\n13\n00:04:19,601 --> 00:04:40,395\n這個跟這個廠方之間啊,否則的話我們每一樣事情都要介入的話我沒有叫你介入啊,不然我沒有邀請國防部來介入這些個案,我們現在講說怎麼樣離清進入的但我們沒有說能耐,但我們在法規裡面就要定了,那該由勞務單位他們去界定,那如果預約了就就接受法罰則嘛\n\n14\n00:04:41,836 --> 00:05:04,177\n好,了解了解。如果是這樣的說法,那就這樣做。反正就是有,我們都有法律嘛,那我們就是誰違法我們再罰嘛。不是這樣的,委員會聽名單安排啦,很多例證吧,你只要有涉到違法事件以後,軍法剛要出面一樣出面啦,我們要抗告,但它最後責任,我們一定會找一個老無敵。\n\n15\n00:05:04,837 --> 00:05:20,010\n請教的問題就是說,在軍方在查明這個進入營區的單位的時候,他們是認什麼?認他們的這個,他們有一個clearance嗎?有一個這個章嗎?還是他們的這個能源的這個管制是怎麼樣的做法?\n\n16\n00:05:21,171 --> 00:05:25,334\n事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具«軍人權益事件處理法草案案案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n\n17\n00:05:48,246 --> 00:06:12,771\n沒有直接影響到安全的危害。」好,謝謝。那最後關於這個美國通過對台安全的法案,那其中有19億美元是用於補充台灣的軍事物資,還有21美元的軍事融資。我想請教部長,我們未來的規劃大概是用什麼樣的方向,這些部分?直接是在哪個地方?大概規劃的方向?跟委員報告,這個部分\n\n18\n00:06:15,004 --> 00:06:39,745\n參議院的部分已經在今天早上9點40分也已經通過了這是最新的狀況跟委員做個報告那19例的部分是指定給美國國防部來做使用那它在法規裡面所預定的範圍是臺灣及區域的夥伴國家有包括回補美國防部原台的裝備以及對台的軍事服務軍事教育訓練這跟剛剛那個昭偉這邊所詢問的內容是類似的\n\n19\n00:06:44,650 --> 00:07:01,145\n最後一個問題,共軍進入台海周邊的警示,現在我們國防部有說不斷精進調整工部的方式,現在是避免敵人用縫隙對我國任之作戰,所以取消侵擾共機的進行,想請教一下為什麼部長我們要做這樣子的調整?\n\n20\n00:07:02,206 --> 00:07:06,247\n草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案\n\n21\n00:07:18,351 --> 00:07:40,664\n沒有做這樣的做法,就是取消公布侵擾共機的機型,簡化相關的資訊。」那我們來看一下日本的方面的話,他們會有一個,不管是摘要把這些無人機的機型,還有海軍的這些,或者是中國來進入他們的這個警示範圍的部分,都會把它標示出來。我想請教一下,為什麼我們過去會把中共的機型相關的標示出來,現在沒有,是擔心哪一個部分?\n\n22\n00:07:41,607 --> 00:07:50,691\n徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。六、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。\n\n23\n00:08:11,698 --> 00:08:13,220\n徐巧芯等20人擬具《軍人權》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n336\t1017\t你好,我們請部長來,部長請崇偉好\n13151\t32773\t部長好,那我想近期美國對台灣的這個軍公案有些延宕,一方面是疫情,一方面是俄烏戰爭,還有可能是中東戰爭的影響。那美國國會議員有建議讓台灣自行來建造美國設計的武器系統,來去解決目前遇到的這種延宕的狀況。\n33814\t34234\t國防部有注意到這些新聞嗎?\n45553\t65086\t國防部,這是主要工作之一,所以一定會注意。是,那我想我們現在美國累計,目前為止軍售項目大概還有,沒有交付的還有190億美元的這些軍售項目,那這都是我們迫切所需要的武器,那我們都希望能夠儘早來斬獲。我想請教一下,在這邊\n66147\t90600\t文章裡面有提到,Politico上面的文章裡面有提到說,我們面臨到的挑戰就是說,在台生產是一回事,但是有洩密的風險,這個部分大家有沒有檢討說什麼樣的方向去克服?我今天講的一個洩密是大家都顧慮的,那我們要怎麼樣來防止洩密案件,這也是平常我們教育訓練工作之一。不光教育訓練,而且還去督管。\n91440\t93821\t審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人\n116954\t144223\t有沒有可能未來有機會在一些他們所建議的,包含我看蓋拉格有說空中及水下無人的載具這些在台灣這些用他們的這些系統然後在台灣生產,那目前溝通的狀況跟可能性為何?的確這個工作不但在溝通,我們現在有很多那個國內有這個產製的能力,但有些裡面比較機敏的設置不見得有,就要透過這個管道,透過管道才會有顧慮,會有洩密的問題。\n146664\t171849\t所以我們就是一開始來克服,但是工作推動沒有停止過,沒有停止過。我想是當然是可以透過法制上面來去補足啦,那包含這個國安法、國家情報工作法,那來去盤點,那我想這幾次的質詢我們都有提到說其實有多許多這種洩密的案件,那他的這一個要嘛就是判刑過輕,要嘛就是修正的關係等等,那我們希望加強\n172609\t174530\t審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人\n192697\t219959\t能夠負責的當然是陸海空或者是這個Cyber這種各種不同的軍種但是其實跟法律上面諮詢金融上面諮詢我們國防部能夠提供更多資訊給這一些相關的機構我想這也是非常重要的那因為我們剛才提到這個接觸的這些密等我就忍不住想到說最近有一些國防的承包商他直接進入軍營裡面那國防承包商進入軍營裡面那當然是有\n220920\t241202\t僱用的一些非法的一些相關的勞工。」我想請教一下,我們檢討過去國防部營區的這些承包的有沒有施工人員清澈?那有的話是認車還是認人?還是認張不認人?我跟委員報告,叫施工單位,它有這個工程外包,但外包不丟給施工單位,我們就不管了。\n241883\t258100\t我們也有一個規定,就是勞務要派哪些人,不得派哪些人,這都在條約裡面定的清清楚楚。但我們現在要編組了這樣,我不能再去幫你一個一個過濾,是有違規的。但我告知你,你若違規了,我是有罰則的。\n259601\t280395\t這個跟這個廠方之間啊,否則的話我們每一樣事情都要介入的話我沒有叫你介入啊,不然我沒有邀請國防部來介入這些個案,我們現在講說怎麼樣離清進入的但我們沒有說能耐,但我們在法規裡面就要定了,那該由勞務單位他們去界定,那如果預約了就就接受法罰則嘛\n281836\t304177\t好,了解了解。如果是這樣的說法,那就這樣做。反正就是有,我們都有法律嘛,那我們就是誰違法我們再罰嘛。不是這樣的,委員會聽名單安排啦,很多例證吧,你只要有涉到違法事件以後,軍法剛要出面一樣出面啦,我們要抗告,但它最後責任,我們一定會找一個老無敵。\n304837\t320010\t請教的問題就是說,在軍方在查明這個進入營區的單位的時候,他們是認什麼?認他們的這個,他們有一個clearance嗎?有一個這個章嗎?還是他們的這個能源的這個管制是怎麼樣的做法?\n321171\t325334\t事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具 «軍人權益事件處理法草案案案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n348246\t372771\t沒有直接影響到安全的危害。」好,謝謝。那最後關於這個美國通過對台安全的法案,那其中有19億美元是用於補充台灣的軍事物資,還有21美元的軍事融資。我想請教部長,我們未來的規劃大概是用什麼樣的方向,這些部分?直接是在哪個地方?大概規劃的方向?跟委員報告,這個部分\n375004\t399745\t參議院的部分已經在今天早上9點40分也已經通過了這是最新的狀況跟委員做個報告那19例的部分是指定給美國國防部來做使用那它在法規裡面所預定的範圍是臺灣及區域的夥伴國家有包括回補美國防部原台的裝備以及對台的軍事服務軍事教育訓練這跟剛剛那個昭偉這邊所詢問的內容是類似的\n404650\t421145\t最後一個問題,共軍進入台海周邊的警示,現在我們國防部有說不斷精進調整工部的方式,現在是避免敵人用縫隙對我國任之作戰,所以取消侵擾共機的進行,想請教一下為什麼部長我們要做這樣子的調整?\n422206\t426247\t草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案\n438351\t460664\t沒有做這樣的做法,就是取消公布侵擾共機的機型,簡化相關的資訊。」那我們來看一下日本的方面的話,他們會有一個,不管是摘要把這些無人機的機型,還有海軍的這些,或者是中國來進入他們的這個警示範圍的部分,都會把它標示出來。我想請教一下,為什麼我們過去會把中共的機型相關的標示出來,現在沒有,是擔心哪一個部分?\n461607\t470691\t徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。六、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。\n491698\t493220\t徐巧芯等20人擬具《軍人權》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n","txt":"你好,我們請部長來,部長請崇偉好\n部長好,那我想近期美國對台灣的這個軍公案有些延宕,一方面是疫情,一方面是俄烏戰爭,還有可能是中東戰爭的影響。那美國國會議員有建議讓台灣自行來建造美國設計的武器系統,來去解決目前遇到的這種延宕的狀況。\n國防部有注意到這些新聞嗎?\n國防部,這是主要工作之一,所以一定會注意。是,那我想我們現在美國累計,目前為止軍售項目大概還有,沒有交付的還有190億美元的這些軍售項目,那這都是我們迫切所需要的武器,那我們都希望能夠儘早來斬獲。我想請教一下,在這邊\n文章裡面有提到,Politico上面的文章裡面有提到說,我們面臨到的挑戰就是說,在台生產是一回事,但是有洩密的風險,這個部分大家有沒有檢討說什麼樣的方向去克服?我今天講的一個洩密是大家都顧慮的,那我們要怎麼樣來防止洩密案件,這也是平常我們教育訓練工作之一。不光教育訓練,而且還去督管。\n審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人\n有沒有可能未來有機會在一些他們所建議的,包含我看蓋拉格有說空中及水下無人的載具這些在台灣這些用他們的這些系統然後在台灣生產,那目前溝通的狀況跟可能性為何?的確這個工作不但在溝通,我們現在有很多那個國內有這個產製的能力,但有些裡面比較機敏的設置不見得有,就要透過這個管道,透過管道才會有顧慮,會有洩密的問題。\n所以我們就是一開始來克服,但是工作推動沒有停止過,沒有停止過。我想是當然是可以透過法制上面來去補足啦,那包含這個國安法、國家情報工作法,那來去盤點,那我想這幾次的質詢我們都有提到說其實有多許多這種洩密的案件,那他的這一個要嘛就是判刑過輕,要嘛就是修正的關係等等,那我們希望加強\n審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人\n能夠負責的當然是陸海空或者是這個Cyber這種各種不同的軍種但是其實跟法律上面諮詢金融上面諮詢我們國防部能夠提供更多資訊給這一些相關的機構我想這也是非常重要的那因為我們剛才提到這個接觸的這些密等我就忍不住想到說最近有一些國防的承包商他直接進入軍營裡面那國防承包商進入軍營裡面那當然是有\n僱用的一些非法的一些相關的勞工。」我想請教一下,我們檢討過去國防部營區的這些承包的有沒有施工人員清澈?那有的話是認車還是認人?還是認張不認人?我跟委員報告,叫施工單位,它有這個工程外包,但外包不丟給施工單位,我們就不管了。\n我們也有一個規定,就是勞務要派哪些人,不得派哪些人,這都在條約裡面定的清清楚楚。但我們現在要編組了這樣,我不能再去幫你一個一個過濾,是有違規的。但我告知你,你若違規了,我是有罰則的。\n這個跟這個廠方之間啊,否則的話我們每一樣事情都要介入的話我沒有叫你介入啊,不然我沒有邀請國防部來介入這些個案,我們現在講說怎麼樣離清進入的但我們沒有說能耐,但我們在法規裡面就要定了,那該由勞務單位他們去界定,那如果預約了就就接受法罰則嘛\n好,了解了解。如果是這樣的說法,那就這樣做。反正就是有,我們都有法律嘛,那我們就是誰違法我們再罰嘛。不是這樣的,委員會聽名單安排啦,很多例證吧,你只要有涉到違法事件以後,軍法剛要出面一樣出面啦,我們要抗告,但它最後責任,我們一定會找一個老無敵。\n請教的問題就是說,在軍方在查明這個進入營區的單位的時候,他們是認什麼?認他們的這個,他們有一個clearance嗎?有一個這個章嗎?還是他們的這個能源的這個管制是怎麼樣的做法?\n事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具 «軍人權益事件處理法草案案案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n沒有直接影響到安全的危害。」好,謝謝。那最後關於這個美國通過對台安全的法案,那其中有19億美元是用於補充台灣的軍事物資,還有21美元的軍事融資。我想請教部長,我們未來的規劃大概是用什麼樣的方向,這些部分?直接是在哪個地方?大概規劃的方向?跟委員報告,這個部分\n參議院的部分已經在今天早上9點40分也已經通過了這是最新的狀況跟委員做個報告那19例的部分是指定給美國國防部來做使用那它在法規裡面所預定的範圍是臺灣及區域的夥伴國家有包括回補美國防部原台的裝備以及對台的軍事服務軍事教育訓練這跟剛剛那個昭偉這邊所詢問的內容是類似的\n最後一個問題,共軍進入台海周邊的警示,現在我們國防部有說不斷精進調整工部的方式,現在是避免敵人用縫隙對我國任之作戰,所以取消侵擾共機的進行,想請教一下為什麼部長我們要做這樣子的調整?\n草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案\n沒有做這樣的做法,就是取消公布侵擾共機的機型,簡化相關的資訊。」那我們來看一下日本的方面的話,他們會有一個,不管是摘要把這些無人機的機型,還有海軍的這些,或者是中國來進入他們的這個警示範圍的部分,都會把它標示出來。我想請教一下,為什麼我們過去會把中共的機型相關的標示出來,現在沒有,是擔心哪一個部分?\n徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。六、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。\n徐巧芯等20人擬具《軍人權》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.336 --> 00:01.017\n你好,我們請部長來,部長請崇偉好\n\n00:13.151 --> 00:32.773\n部長好,那我想近期美國對台灣的這個軍公案有些延宕,一方面是疫情,一方面是俄烏戰爭,還有可能是中東戰爭的影響。那美國國會議員有建議讓台灣自行來建造美國設計的武器系統,來去解決目前遇到的這種延宕的狀況。\n\n00:33.814 --> 00:34.234\n國防部有注意到這些新聞嗎?\n\n00:45.553 --> 01:05.086\n國防部,這是主要工作之一,所以一定會注意。是,那我想我們現在美國累計,目前為止軍售項目大概還有,沒有交付的還有190億美元的這些軍售項目,那這都是我們迫切所需要的武器,那我們都希望能夠儘早來斬獲。我想請教一下,在這邊\n\n01:06.147 --> 01:30.600\n文章裡面有提到,Politico上面的文章裡面有提到說,我們面臨到的挑戰就是說,在台生產是一回事,但是有洩密的風險,這個部分大家有沒有檢討說什麼樣的方向去克服?我今天講的一個洩密是大家都顧慮的,那我們要怎麼樣來防止洩密案件,這也是平常我們教育訓練工作之一。不光教育訓練,而且還去督管。\n\n01:31.440 --> 01:33.821\n審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人\n\n01:56.954 --> 02:24.223\n有沒有可能未來有機會在一些他們所建議的,包含我看蓋拉格有說空中及水下無人的載具這些在台灣這些用他們的這些系統然後在台灣生產,那目前溝通的狀況跟可能性為何?的確這個工作不但在溝通,我們現在有很多那個國內有這個產製的能力,但有些裡面比較機敏的設置不見得有,就要透過這個管道,透過管道才會有顧慮,會有洩密的問題。\n\n02:26.664 --> 02:51.849\n所以我們就是一開始來克服,但是工作推動沒有停止過,沒有停止過。我想是當然是可以透過法制上面來去補足啦,那包含這個國安法、國家情報工作法,那來去盤點,那我想這幾次的質詢我們都有提到說其實有多許多這種洩密的案件,那他的這一個要嘛就是判刑過輕,要嘛就是修正的關係等等,那我們希望加強\n\n02:52.609 --> 02:54.530\n審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人\n\n03:12.697 --> 03:39.959\n能夠負責的當然是陸海空或者是這個Cyber這種各種不同的軍種但是其實跟法律上面諮詢金融上面諮詢我們國防部能夠提供更多資訊給這一些相關的機構我想這也是非常重要的那因為我們剛才提到這個接觸的這些密等我就忍不住想到說最近有一些國防的承包商他直接進入軍營裡面那國防承包商進入軍營裡面那當然是有\n\n03:40.920 --> 04:01.202\n僱用的一些非法的一些相關的勞工。」我想請教一下,我們檢討過去國防部營區的這些承包的有沒有施工人員清澈?那有的話是認車還是認人?還是認張不認人?我跟委員報告,叫施工單位,它有這個工程外包,但外包不丟給施工單位,我們就不管了。\n\n04:01.883 --> 04:18.100\n我們也有一個規定,就是勞務要派哪些人,不得派哪些人,這都在條約裡面定的清清楚楚。但我們現在要編組了這樣,我不能再去幫你一個一個過濾,是有違規的。但我告知你,你若違規了,我是有罰則的。\n\n04:19.601 --> 04:40.395\n這個跟這個廠方之間啊,否則的話我們每一樣事情都要介入的話我沒有叫你介入啊,不然我沒有邀請國防部來介入這些個案,我們現在講說怎麼樣離清進入的但我們沒有說能耐,但我們在法規裡面就要定了,那該由勞務單位他們去界定,那如果預約了就就接受法罰則嘛\n\n04:41.836 --> 05:04.177\n好,了解了解。如果是這樣的說法,那就這樣做。反正就是有,我們都有法律嘛,那我們就是誰違法我們再罰嘛。不是這樣的,委員會聽名單安排啦,很多例證吧,你只要有涉到違法事件以後,軍法剛要出面一樣出面啦,我們要抗告,但它最後責任,我們一定會找一個老無敵。\n\n05:04.837 --> 05:20.010\n請教的問題就是說,在軍方在查明這個進入營區的單位的時候,他們是認什麼?認他們的這個,他們有一個clearance嗎?有一個這個章嗎?還是他們的這個能源的這個管制是怎麼樣的做法?\n\n05:21.171 --> 05:25.334\n事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具«軍人權益事件處理法草案案案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n\n05:48.246 --> 06:12.771\n沒有直接影響到安全的危害。」好,謝謝。那最後關於這個美國通過對台安全的法案,那其中有19億美元是用於補充台灣的軍事物資,還有21美元的軍事融資。我想請教部長,我們未來的規劃大概是用什麼樣的方向,這些部分?直接是在哪個地方?大概規劃的方向?跟委員報告,這個部分\n\n06:15.004 --> 06:39.745\n參議院的部分已經在今天早上9點40分也已經通過了這是最新的狀況跟委員做個報告那19例的部分是指定給美國國防部來做使用那它在法規裡面所預定的範圍是臺灣及區域的夥伴國家有包括回補美國防部原台的裝備以及對台的軍事服務軍事教育訓練這跟剛剛那個昭偉這邊所詢問的內容是類似的\n\n06:44.650 --> 07:01.145\n最後一個問題,共軍進入台海周邊的警示,現在我們國防部有說不斷精進調整工部的方式,現在是避免敵人用縫隙對我國任之作戰,所以取消侵擾共機的進行,想請教一下為什麼部長我們要做這樣子的調整?\n\n07:02.206 --> 07:06.247\n草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案\n\n07:18.351 --> 07:40.664\n沒有做這樣的做法,就是取消公布侵擾共機的機型,簡化相關的資訊。」那我們來看一下日本的方面的話,他們會有一個,不管是摘要把這些無人機的機型,還有海軍的這些,或者是中國來進入他們的這個警示範圍的部分,都會把它標示出來。我想請教一下,為什麼我們過去會把中共的機型相關的標示出來,現在沒有,是擔心哪一個部分?\n\n07:41.607 --> 07:50.691\n徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。六、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。\n\n08:11.698 --> 08:13.220\n徐巧芯等20人擬具《軍人權》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.336,"end":1.017,"text":"你好,我們請部長來,部長請崇偉好"},{"start":13.151,"end":32.773,"text":"部長好,那我想近期美國對台灣的這個軍公案有些延宕,一方面是疫情,一方面是俄烏戰爭,還有可能是中東戰爭的影響。那美國國會議員有建議讓台灣自行來建造美國設計的武器系統,來去解決目前遇到的這種延宕的狀況。"},{"start":33.814,"end":34.234,"text":"國防部有注意到這些新聞嗎?"},{"start":45.553,"end":65.086,"text":"國防部,這是主要工作之一,所以一定會注意。是,那我想我們現在美國累計,目前為止軍售項目大概還有,沒有交付的還有190億美元的這些軍售項目,那這都是我們迫切所需要的武器,那我們都希望能夠儘早來斬獲。我想請教一下,在這邊"},{"start":66.147,"end":90.6,"text":"文章裡面有提到,Politico上面的文章裡面有提到說,我們面臨到的挑戰就是說,在台生產是一回事,但是有洩密的風險,這個部分大家有沒有檢討說什麼樣的方向去克服?我今天講的一個洩密是大家都顧慮的,那我們要怎麼樣來防止洩密案件,這也是平常我們教育訓練工作之一。不光教育訓練,而且還去督管。"},{"start":91.44,"end":93.821,"text":"審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人"},{"start":116.954,"end":144.223,"text":"有沒有可能未來有機會在一些他們所建議的,包含我看蓋拉格有說空中及水下無人的載具這些在台灣這些用他們的這些系統然後在台灣生產,那目前溝通的狀況跟可能性為何?的確這個工作不但在溝通,我們現在有很多那個國內有這個產製的能力,但有些裡面比較機敏的設置不見得有,就要透過這個管道,透過管道才會有顧慮,會有洩密的問題。"},{"start":146.664,"end":171.849,"text":"所以我們就是一開始來克服,但是工作推動沒有停止過,沒有停止過。我想是當然是可以透過法制上面來去補足啦,那包含這個國安法、國家情報工作法,那來去盤點,那我想這幾次的質詢我們都有提到說其實有多許多這種洩密的案件,那他的這一個要嘛就是判刑過輕,要嘛就是修正的關係等等,那我們希望加強"},{"start":172.609,"end":174.53,"text":"審查行政院徐巧芯等20人審查行政院徐巧芯等20人"},{"start":192.697,"end":219.959,"text":"能夠負責的當然是陸海空或者是這個Cyber這種各種不同的軍種但是其實跟法律上面諮詢金融上面諮詢我們國防部能夠提供更多資訊給這一些相關的機構我想這也是非常重要的那因為我們剛才提到這個接觸的這些密等我就忍不住想到說最近有一些國防的承包商他直接進入軍營裡面那國防承包商進入軍營裡面那當然是有"},{"start":220.92,"end":241.202,"text":"僱用的一些非法的一些相關的勞工。」我想請教一下,我們檢討過去國防部營區的這些承包的有沒有施工人員清澈?那有的話是認車還是認人?還是認張不認人?我跟委員報告,叫施工單位,它有這個工程外包,但外包不丟給施工單位,我們就不管了。"},{"start":241.883,"end":258.1,"text":"我們也有一個規定,就是勞務要派哪些人,不得派哪些人,這都在條約裡面定的清清楚楚。但我們現在要編組了這樣,我不能再去幫你一個一個過濾,是有違規的。但我告知你,你若違規了,我是有罰則的。"},{"start":259.601,"end":280.395,"text":"這個跟這個廠方之間啊,否則的話我們每一樣事情都要介入的話我沒有叫你介入啊,不然我沒有邀請國防部來介入這些個案,我們現在講說怎麼樣離清進入的但我們沒有說能耐,但我們在法規裡面就要定了,那該由勞務單位他們去界定,那如果預約了就就接受法罰則嘛"},{"start":281.836,"end":304.177,"text":"好,了解了解。如果是這樣的說法,那就這樣做。反正就是有,我們都有法律嘛,那我們就是誰違法我們再罰嘛。不是這樣的,委員會聽名單安排啦,很多例證吧,你只要有涉到違法事件以後,軍法剛要出面一樣出面啦,我們要抗告,但它最後責任,我們一定會找一個老無敵。"},{"start":304.837,"end":320.01,"text":"請教的問題就是說,在軍方在查明這個進入營區的單位的時候,他們是認什麼?認他們的這個,他們有一個clearance嗎?有一個這個章嗎?還是他們的這個能源的這個管制是怎麼樣的做法?"},{"start":321.171,"end":325.334,"text":"事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具 «軍人權益事件處理法草案案案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具"},{"start":348.246,"end":372.771,"text":"沒有直接影響到安全的危害。」好,謝謝。那最後關於這個美國通過對台安全的法案,那其中有19億美元是用於補充台灣的軍事物資,還有21美元的軍事融資。我想請教部長,我們未來的規劃大概是用什麼樣的方向,這些部分?直接是在哪個地方?大概規劃的方向?跟委員報告,這個部分"},{"start":375.004,"end":399.745,"text":"參議院的部分已經在今天早上9點40分也已經通過了這是最新的狀況跟委員做個報告那19例的部分是指定給美國國防部來做使用那它在法規裡面所預定的範圍是臺灣及區域的夥伴國家有包括回補美國防部原台的裝備以及對台的軍事服務軍事教育訓練這跟剛剛那個昭偉這邊所詢問的內容是類似的"},{"start":404.65,"end":421.145,"text":"最後一個問題,共軍進入台海周邊的警示,現在我們國防部有說不斷精進調整工部的方式,現在是避免敵人用縫隙對我國任之作戰,所以取消侵擾共機的進行,想請教一下為什麼部長我們要做這樣子的調整?"},{"start":422.206,"end":426.247,"text":"草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案案件事件處理法草案"},{"start":438.351,"end":460.664,"text":"沒有做這樣的做法,就是取消公布侵擾共機的機型,簡化相關的資訊。」那我們來看一下日本的方面的話,他們會有一個,不管是摘要把這些無人機的機型,還有海軍的這些,或者是中國來進入他們的這個警示範圍的部分,都會把它標示出來。我想請教一下,為什麼我們過去會把中共的機型相關的標示出來,現在沒有,是擔心哪一個部分?"},{"start":461.607,"end":470.691,"text":"徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。六、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。"},{"start":491.698,"end":493.22,"text":"徐巧芯等20人擬具《軍人權》案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具"}]}}}}