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Kacaw委員：對。"],["主席：次長請。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：常次。部長休息一下。"],["主席：鄭天財委員非常體貼，次長就讓你問。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：今天審查陸海空軍懲罰法、軍人權益事件處理法草案。陸海空軍懲罰法是承襲民國19年當時的體例，這個確實要大修特修。但是我看你們花了很長的時間開了會議，然後送到立法院的條文，我再談一下，這裡面特別提到「軍人應受懲罰行為區分『勤務上』與『勤務外』」，這是正確的方向。正確的方向，應該要這樣做。","就以這兩條，現行條文第十五條跟現在行政院版送來的第六條相較，原來第十五條現行條文「現役軍人有下列違失行為之一者，應受懲罰」，有好幾款；現在送來的第六條修正版「軍人非執行勤務而有下列行為之一者，為勤務外違紀行為，仍應受懲罰」，列了7款。請問「仍應受懲罰」，違反這7款要如何懲罰？"],["沈司長世偉：我是法律司司長，跟委員報告，這就是懲罰的事由。第六條規範的是勤務外，譬如他放假在外面，如果故意觸犯刑事法律，他放假在外面吸毒、酒駕、實施性騷擾等等，都可以當作懲罰的事由。現行條文第十五條列了很多款次，我們也查考了一些資料，從民國3年的什麼海軍艦艇規則、陸軍的等等規則，最多有到六十、七十款的，列了非常多，其實是列不完的。所以以後的規範就是，第五條就是勤務內的，你在執勤的時候、在營區的時候該遵守的紀律，怠忽職責，那都是懲罰的事由，我不用一一地列舉走路丟垃圾，或是隨地吐痰、不遵守飯廳秩序或不怎麼樣等，我列不完，在勤務內的我就用勤務內的方式來處罰。如果是勤務外的，你不是執勤，放假回家、休假，但是你不可以去觸犯我們國家的法律，不可以在營外吸毒、不可以酒駕、不可以性騷擾。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：對啊！如何懲罰？"],["沈司長世偉：就是按照裡面的相關規定，查完了之後由權責長官來做懲罰，輕的直接就懲罰，重的會聽一聽那個懲罰諮詢會的意見，權責長官來做處罰。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：次長、司長，問題就在這裡，既然要修法就要修得完備，怎麼樣的情形要撤職、怎麼樣的情形要記過還是要罰站或者做什麼，所以還是要回到你相關的授權規定，沒有授權啦！你訂在一些行政規則或者要點、注意事項裡面，目前的作法還是跟過去一樣啊！尤其涉及到撤職是很嚴重的，所以不應該訂一些相關的行政規則去決定，甚至於這個會議，你們叫做什麼？審議會……"],["沈司長世偉：諮詢會。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：諮詢會來決定，所以這個部分還要再精進，尤其是涉及到撤職，對不對？"],["沈司長世偉：是，我瞭解委員你的意思。"],["鄭天財Sra Kacaw委員：像你們現在酒駕當然不應該，本來就有相關的法律去處理，但要達到是不是撤職，你們應該要明定，尤其撤職這個部分涉及到的部分，過去比較少討論。因為是軍人，基本上還是涉及到工作權，所以這個部分請次長還有法律事務司，怎麼樣把陸海空軍懲罰法未來再繼續地修正，好不好？"],["楊次長基榮：我們下去會繼續努力。謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝鄭天財委員，我們後面會開公聽會，可以邀請你來參與、提供寶貴意見。司長請回、次長請回。","接下來進行詢答委員是沈發惠委員、沈發惠委員、沈發惠委員不在。","許宇甄委員、許宇甄委員、許宇甄委員不在。","萬美玲委員、萬美玲委員、萬美玲委員不在。","鄭正鈐委員、鄭正鈐委員、鄭正鈐委員不在。","接下來進行詢答的委員是吳宗憲委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":304,"meet_id":"聯席會議-11-1-35,36-1","speakers":["王定宇","馬文君","林楚茵","沈伯洋","黃國昌","羅美玲","黃仁","徐巧芯","陳永康","陳俊宇","羅智強","林思銘","洪申翰","翁曉玲","陳冠廷","吳思瑤","林憶君","鄭天財Sra 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1.0}, {\"word\": \"潛\"}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 305.001, \"end\": 305.021, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"。\"}, {\"word\": \"」\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,269 --> 00:00:28,086\n主席、各位委員,有請次長,還有法律事務司司長。那個陸昌赤嘛。對,次長請。昌赤。部長休息一下。這個政經事務委員非常體貼。這個次長就讓你問。好。好,今天審查這個陸海空軍懲罰法,還有這個軍人權益事件處理法的草案。\n\n2\n00:00:31,839 --> 00:00:56,006\n這個陸海空軍懲罰法這個從過去是承襲這個民國19年當時的體力這個確實是要大修特修但是我今天看了這個今天你們花了很長的時間開了會議然後送到立法院的條文我這個再談一下\n\n3\n00:01:01,644 --> 00:01:22,274\n這裏面特別提到軍人應受懲罰行為7分情務上與情務外,這是正確的方向,應該要這樣做。我們看這個,就以這兩條,就第15條,現行條文第15條跟現在行政院版送來的第6條,\n\n4\n00:01:24,637 --> 00:01:52,016\n這個原來的第15條,現行條文,現役軍人有下列情形下列為私行為之一者,應受懲罰。這有好幾款的部分。這裡面現在送來的第6條的修正版。軍人非執行勤務而有下列行為之一者,為勤務外違紀行為,人應受懲罰。列了這個7款。\n\n5\n00:01:55,069 --> 00:02:20,877\n請問一下,這個人因受懲罰違反這個期款要如何懲罰?方委員,我是法律司司長,跟委員報告,這就是懲罰的事由。第6條規範的是勤務外,譬如說他放假在外面,他如果故意觸犯刑事法律,如果他放假在外面去吸毒,如果去酒駕,如果去實施性騷擾等等,\n\n6\n00:02:22,097 --> 00:02:37,226\n都可以當作懲罰了事由。」也就是說我們過去有就是現行條1到第15條它列了很多的款次我們也有去查考了一些資料從民國三年的什麼海軍艦艇規則、陸軍的等等規則有最多到六、七十款的\n\n7\n00:02:37,846 --> 00:02:38,747\n審查行政院徐巧芯等20人擬具\n\n8\n00:02:56,601 --> 00:03:20,589\n在勤務內的,你就用勤務內的方式來處罰。如果是勤務外的,你不是執勤,你放假回家,你休假,但是你不可以去觸犯我們國家的法律,你不可以在營外吸毒,不可以酒駕,不可以性騷擾,等等。如何懲罰?就是按著裡面的相關的規定,查完了之後由權責長官來做懲罰。輕的直接就懲罰,重的會聽一聽那個懲罰諮詢會的意見。是,權責長官來做處罰。\n\n9\n00:03:25,620 --> 00:03:38,650\n事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。\n\n10\n00:03:56,331 --> 00:04:17,866\n授權的規定,沒有授權你定在一些行政規則裡面或是一些要點注意事項裡面目前的做法還是跟過去一樣尤其是涉及到撤職涉及到撤職是一個很嚴重的\n\n11\n00:04:18,775 --> 00:04:39,942\n所以不應該在定一些相關的這些行政規則裡面來去決定。甚至由這個會議,你們叫什麼?審議會?諮詢會來去決定。所以這個部分還要再精進,尤其是涉及到撤職。是,我了解你的意思。\n\n12\n00:04:42,083 --> 00:04:44,984\n處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n\n13\n00:05:04,180 --> 00:05:05,021\n還是有涉及到工作潛能。」\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n269\t28086\t主席、各位委員,有請次長,還有法律事務司司長。那個陸昌赤嘛。對,次長請。昌赤。部長休息一下。這個政經事務委員非常體貼。這個次長就讓你問。好。好,今天審查這個陸海空軍懲罰法,還有這個軍人權益事件處理法的草案。\n31839\t56006\t這個陸海空軍懲罰法這個從過去是承襲這個民國19年當時的體力這個確實是要大修特修但是我今天看了這個今天你們花了很長的時間開了會議然後送到立法院的條文我這個再談一下\n61644\t82274\t這裏面特別提到軍人應受懲罰行為7分情務上與情務外,這是正確的方向,應該要這樣做。我們看這個,就以這兩條,就第15條,現行條文第15條跟現在行政院版送來的第6條,\n84637\t112016\t這個原來的第15條,現行條文,現役軍人有下列情形下列為私行為之一者,應受懲罰。這有好幾款的部分。這裡面現在送來的第6條的修正版。軍人非執行勤務而有下列行為之一者,為勤務外違紀行為,人應受懲罰。列了這個7款。\n115069\t140877\t請問一下,這個人因受懲罰違反這個期款要如何懲罰?方委員,我是法律司司長,跟委員報告,這就是懲罰的事由。第6條規範的是勤務外,譬如說他放假在外面,他如果故意觸犯刑事法律,如果他放假在外面去吸毒,如果去酒駕,如果去實施性騷擾等等,\n142097\t157226\t都可以當作懲罰了事由。」也就是說我們過去有就是現行條1到第15條它列了很多的款次我們也有去查考了一些資料從民國三年的什麼海軍艦艇規則、陸軍的等等規則有最多到六、七十款的\n157846\t158747\t審查行政院徐巧芯等20人擬具\n176601\t200589\t在勤務內的,你就用勤務內的方式來處罰。如果是勤務外的,你不是執勤,你放假回家,你休假,但是你不可以去觸犯我們國家的法律,你不可以在營外吸毒,不可以酒駕,不可以性騷擾,等等。如何懲罰?就是按著裡面的相關的規定,查完了之後由權責長官來做懲罰。輕的直接就懲罰,重的會聽一聽那個懲罰諮詢會的意見。是,權責長官來做處罰。\n205620\t218650\t事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。\n236331\t257866\t授權的規定,沒有授權你定在一些行政規則裡面或是一些要點注意事項裡面目前的做法還是跟過去一樣尤其是涉及到撤職涉及到撤職是一個很嚴重的\n258775\t279942\t所以不應該在定一些相關的這些行政規則裡面來去決定。甚至由這個會議,你們叫什麼?審議會?諮詢會來去決定。所以這個部分還要再精進,尤其是涉及到撤職。是,我了解你的意思。\n282083\t284984\t處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n304180\t305021\t還是有涉及到工作潛能。」\n","txt":"主席、各位委員,有請次長,還有法律事務司司長。那個陸昌赤嘛。對,次長請。昌赤。部長休息一下。這個政經事務委員非常體貼。這個次長就讓你問。好。好,今天審查這個陸海空軍懲罰法,還有這個軍人權益事件處理法的草案。\n這個陸海空軍懲罰法這個從過去是承襲這個民國19年當時的體力這個確實是要大修特修但是我今天看了這個今天你們花了很長的時間開了會議然後送到立法院的條文我這個再談一下\n這裏面特別提到軍人應受懲罰行為7分情務上與情務外,這是正確的方向,應該要這樣做。我們看這個,就以這兩條,就第15條,現行條文第15條跟現在行政院版送來的第6條,\n這個原來的第15條,現行條文,現役軍人有下列情形下列為私行為之一者,應受懲罰。這有好幾款的部分。這裡面現在送來的第6條的修正版。軍人非執行勤務而有下列行為之一者,為勤務外違紀行為,人應受懲罰。列了這個7款。\n請問一下,這個人因受懲罰違反這個期款要如何懲罰?方委員,我是法律司司長,跟委員報告,這就是懲罰的事由。第6條規範的是勤務外,譬如說他放假在外面,他如果故意觸犯刑事法律,如果他放假在外面去吸毒,如果去酒駕,如果去實施性騷擾等等,\n都可以當作懲罰了事由。」也就是說我們過去有就是現行條1到第15條它列了很多的款次我們也有去查考了一些資料從民國三年的什麼海軍艦艇規則、陸軍的等等規則有最多到六、七十款的\n審查行政院徐巧芯等20人擬具\n在勤務內的,你就用勤務內的方式來處罰。如果是勤務外的,你不是執勤,你放假回家,你休假,但是你不可以去觸犯我們國家的法律,你不可以在營外吸毒,不可以酒駕,不可以性騷擾,等等。如何懲罰?就是按著裡面的相關的規定,查完了之後由權責長官來做懲罰。輕的直接就懲罰,重的會聽一聽那個懲罰諮詢會的意見。是,權責長官來做處罰。\n事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。\n授權的規定,沒有授權你定在一些行政規則裡面或是一些要點注意事項裡面目前的做法還是跟過去一樣尤其是涉及到撤職涉及到撤職是一個很嚴重的\n所以不應該在定一些相關的這些行政規則裡面來去決定。甚至由這個會議,你們叫什麼?審議會?諮詢會來去決定。所以這個部分還要再精進,尤其是涉及到撤職。是,我了解你的意思。\n處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n還是有涉及到工作潛能。」\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.269 --> 00:28.086\n主席、各位委員,有請次長,還有法律事務司司長。那個陸昌赤嘛。對,次長請。昌赤。部長休息一下。這個政經事務委員非常體貼。這個次長就讓你問。好。好,今天審查這個陸海空軍懲罰法,還有這個軍人權益事件處理法的草案。\n\n00:31.839 --> 00:56.006\n這個陸海空軍懲罰法這個從過去是承襲這個民國19年當時的體力這個確實是要大修特修但是我今天看了這個今天你們花了很長的時間開了會議然後送到立法院的條文我這個再談一下\n\n01:01.644 --> 01:22.274\n這裏面特別提到軍人應受懲罰行為7分情務上與情務外,這是正確的方向,應該要這樣做。我們看這個,就以這兩條,就第15條,現行條文第15條跟現在行政院版送來的第6條,\n\n01:24.637 --> 01:52.016\n這個原來的第15條,現行條文,現役軍人有下列情形下列為私行為之一者,應受懲罰。這有好幾款的部分。這裡面現在送來的第6條的修正版。軍人非執行勤務而有下列行為之一者,為勤務外違紀行為,人應受懲罰。列了這個7款。\n\n01:55.069 --> 02:20.877\n請問一下,這個人因受懲罰違反這個期款要如何懲罰?方委員,我是法律司司長,跟委員報告,這就是懲罰的事由。第6條規範的是勤務外,譬如說他放假在外面,他如果故意觸犯刑事法律,如果他放假在外面去吸毒,如果去酒駕,如果去實施性騷擾等等,\n\n02:22.097 --> 02:37.226\n都可以當作懲罰了事由。」也就是說我們過去有就是現行條1到第15條它列了很多的款次我們也有去查考了一些資料從民國三年的什麼海軍艦艇規則、陸軍的等等規則有最多到六、七十款的\n\n02:37.846 --> 02:38.747\n審查行政院徐巧芯等20人擬具\n\n02:56.601 --> 03:20.589\n在勤務內的,你就用勤務內的方式來處罰。如果是勤務外的,你不是執勤,你放假回家,你休假,但是你不可以去觸犯我們國家的法律,你不可以在營外吸毒,不可以酒駕,不可以性騷擾,等等。如何懲罰?就是按著裡面的相關的規定,查完了之後由權責長官來做懲罰。輕的直接就懲罰,重的會聽一聽那個懲罰諮詢會的意見。是,權責長官來做處罰。\n\n03:25.620 --> 03:38.650\n事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。\n\n03:56.331 --> 04:17.866\n授權的規定,沒有授權你定在一些行政規則裡面或是一些要點注意事項裡面目前的做法還是跟過去一樣尤其是涉及到撤職涉及到撤職是一個很嚴重的\n\n04:18.775 --> 04:39.942\n所以不應該在定一些相關的這些行政規則裡面來去決定。甚至由這個會議,你們叫什麼?審議會?諮詢會來去決定。所以這個部分還要再精進,尤其是涉及到撤職。是,我了解你的意思。\n\n04:42.083 --> 04:44.984\n處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具\n\n05:04.180 --> 05:05.021\n還是有涉及到工作潛能。」\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.269,"end":28.086,"text":"主席、各位委員,有請次長,還有法律事務司司長。那個陸昌赤嘛。對,次長請。昌赤。部長休息一下。這個政經事務委員非常體貼。這個次長就讓你問。好。好,今天審查這個陸海空軍懲罰法,還有這個軍人權益事件處理法的草案。"},{"start":31.839,"end":56.006,"text":"這個陸海空軍懲罰法這個從過去是承襲這個民國19年當時的體力這個確實是要大修特修但是我今天看了這個今天你們花了很長的時間開了會議然後送到立法院的條文我這個再談一下"},{"start":61.644,"end":82.274,"text":"這裏面特別提到軍人應受懲罰行為7分情務上與情務外,這是正確的方向,應該要這樣做。我們看這個,就以這兩條,就第15條,現行條文第15條跟現在行政院版送來的第6條,"},{"start":84.637,"end":112.016,"text":"這個原來的第15條,現行條文,現役軍人有下列情形下列為私行為之一者,應受懲罰。這有好幾款的部分。這裡面現在送來的第6條的修正版。軍人非執行勤務而有下列行為之一者,為勤務外違紀行為,人應受懲罰。列了這個7款。"},{"start":115.069,"end":140.877,"text":"請問一下,這個人因受懲罰違反這個期款要如何懲罰?方委員,我是法律司司長,跟委員報告,這就是懲罰的事由。第6條規範的是勤務外,譬如說他放假在外面,他如果故意觸犯刑事法律,如果他放假在外面去吸毒,如果去酒駕,如果去實施性騷擾等等,"},{"start":142.097,"end":157.226,"text":"都可以當作懲罰了事由。」也就是說我們過去有就是現行條1到第15條它列了很多的款次我們也有去查考了一些資料從民國三年的什麼海軍艦艇規則、陸軍的等等規則有最多到六、七十款的"},{"start":157.846,"end":158.747,"text":"審查行政院徐巧芯等20人擬具"},{"start":176.601,"end":200.589,"text":"在勤務內的,你就用勤務內的方式來處罰。如果是勤務外的,你不是執勤,你放假回家,你休假,但是你不可以去觸犯我們國家的法律,你不可以在營外吸毒,不可以酒駕,不可以性騷擾,等等。如何懲罰?就是按著裡面的相關的規定,查完了之後由權責長官來做懲罰。輕的直接就懲罰,重的會聽一聽那個懲罰諮詢會的意見。是,權責長官來做處罰。"},{"start":205.62,"end":218.65,"text":"事件處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。四、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。五、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具《陸海空軍懲罰法》案。"},{"start":236.331,"end":257.866,"text":"授權的規定,沒有授權你定在一些行政規則裡面或是一些要點注意事項裡面目前的做法還是跟過去一樣尤其是涉及到撤職涉及到撤職是一個很嚴重的"},{"start":258.775,"end":279.942,"text":"所以不應該在定一些相關的這些行政規則裡面來去決定。甚至由這個會議,你們叫什麼?審議會?諮詢會來去決定。所以這個部分還要再精進,尤其是涉及到撤職。是,我了解你的意思。"},{"start":282.083,"end":284.984,"text":"處理法草案案。三、審查本院委員徐巧芯等20人擬具"},{"start":304.18,"end":305.021,"text":"還是有涉及到工作潛能。」"}]}}}}