{"id":151701,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151701","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/534e6c42fa7aedb380f53d8ae09f49fab903698ddfaa754aeadb1108e4b84432cab6589a64c104af5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳瑩","委員發言時間":"13:17:45 - 13:29:27","影片長度":"00:11:42","會議時間":"2024-04-24T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請衛生福利部部長就「家暴零容忍-檢討112年家庭暴力防治法修正施行概況」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n二、邀請衛生福利部部長、國家通訊傳播委員會、數位發展部、內政部警政署、法務部、文化部、金融監督管理委員會就「非法網站創意私房案件，提出兒少性影像防制具體作為、檢討報告，並就兒童及少年性剝削防制條例修正方向」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n【專題報告綜合詢答】\n【4月22日、24日及25日三天一次會】）","date":"2024-04-24","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":13,"committees":[26],"id":"委員會-11-1-26-13"},"duration":702,"end_time":"2024-04-24T13:29:27+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-24T13:17:45+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":1356,"blocks":[["陳委員瑩：（13時18分）謝謝主席，麻煩請薛部長跟心健司。"],["主席：請薛部長。"],["薛部長瑞元：委員好。"],["陳委員瑩：部長好，心健司我好像還沒問過。","部長，之前你有提到依照統計數據的呈現，年輕族群的自殺率有提高的趨勢，所以提出年輕族群心理健康的協助。我要請教一下，部長你知道全國各縣市當中哪個縣市自殺率是最高的嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：目前我可能要查一下資料。"],["陳委員瑩：好，沒關係，我其實都查好了，第一名是苗栗。實際的統計數據有點顛覆我們很多人的想像，因為我想很多人應該都會跟我一樣，覺得在都會區可能生活步調很緊湊，工作壓力、居住環境等等的因素，處於比較高壓，高壓到超過個人可以忍受的範圍，導致憂鬱，甚至自我傷害、最後輕生的狀況，感覺上這個邏輯推論起來是比較高的。","但是我們看一下這個圖，這是去年的新聞，統計2022年自殺率的數據，圖裡黑色底的數據就是高於平均值。我換個方式呈現，我們再看一下這個表，我特別關心花蓮、臺東的部分，我們花蓮、臺東就是前五名。部長你覺得這樣的情形可能的原因是什麼？有哪些？"],["薛部長瑞元：這邊的自殺率是全人口，我們知道這些自殺的個案，其實是以年紀大的佔多數，所以這樣看下去，排名前面可能都是老年化、高齡化的縣，自殺率是比較高的，這也是可以理解。"],["陳委員瑩：為什麼部長會認為特別是老年人的自殺率會比較高？"],["薛部長瑞元：從統計數字來看，的確是這樣。"],["陳委員瑩：你覺得有哪幾個比較可能的原因？"],["薛部長瑞元：比方說久病、在照顧上有問題，或是雙老互相照顧，或者是獨居等等這些原因。"],["陳委員瑩：追究這些原因以外，我想我更注重的是我們的對策是什麼？這個部分，我不曉得衛福部有沒有比較精進的作為？"],["薛部長瑞元：我是不是請司長來回答。"],["陳委員瑩：好。"],["陳司長亮妤：謝謝委員關切這個議題。如同部長補充的，目前全臺灣的數據是65歲以上人口自殺率最高，我們看年輕族群是因為他的自殺率上升最陡，當時是因為這樣的理由。所以最高的還是如同部長所講的，如果這個鄉鎮市的人口分布是比較老化，的確自殺率就會比較高，這是剛剛的一點補充。","關於因應作為，我們目前是結合22縣市，不管是醫事科，還是長照活動或社家署的相關活動，我們大量的做老人憂鬱症篩檢。因為根據去年國衛院的研究，顯示老人自殺的核心議題是他的憂鬱症沒有被篩檢出來，目前臺灣65歲以上的人的憂鬱症盛行率是16%，一般人大概是10%，所以老人的憂鬱症必須要大量被篩檢出來，才可以提早介入、提早治療。心理健康司結合社家署相關的活動，去年我們篩檢了65萬人次，轉介治療的高達四千多人，這是我們的精進作為。"],["陳委員瑩：我是第一次質詢你，所以我讓你多講一點話。","單看一年的數據，可能不太精確。接下來我們再看成功大學「看見健康數據」的資料，它所呈現的是2018年到2020年的統計數據，花蓮也是明顯高於平均值，也是排名在前面；我們臺東更是得到第二名。或許有些專家會說因為偏鄉醫療資源缺乏，醫院的密集度比較低，被搶救機會比較低。其實換句話說，就是在偏鄉醫療資源比較少的地方，可能就是你在那邊自殺成功率比較高啦，換句話講是這樣。雖然這是可能影響的因素，但是我比較想了解造成非都市居民比較容易有憂鬱傾向的因素又是什麼？為什麼我們花東的人比較容易產生尋短的念頭？"],["薛部長瑞元：這可能有幾個因素，第一是物質濫用的問題。"],["陳委員瑩：蛤？"],["薛部長瑞元：物質濫用。"],["陳委員瑩：物質濫用？"],["薛部長瑞元：比如說酒啦，或是其他一些毒品那一類的，這是一個可能的原因。但是在原鄉來講，不見得是主要的原因。另外，就是無業，沒有……"],["陳委員瑩：工作不順利。"],["薛部長瑞元：沒有適當的工作，這也是一個。"],["陳委員瑩：或許沒有適當的壓力排遣的地方，或娛樂的地方，可能也是……"],["薛部長瑞元：也有可能啦，但是通常不會把它當成主要原因。"],["陳委員瑩：我想回歸到我剛剛講的，到底怎麼樣幫助這些人，可能還是最重要的。"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["陳委員瑩：另外還有一個數據，我看到也是非常憂心。我為什麼會特別提這個，是因為我週遭好幾位選民的孩子正當青壯年，20多歲、30歲，都自殺往生了，很遺憾。","依照你們委託製作2030年原住民族健康照護中長程計畫的報告當中，我看到這個資料，為什麼特別是25到44歲的青壯年原住民的自殺死亡率高於全國的數據，高出了將近五成。部長你覺得這是什麼原因，你們因應的對策又是什麼？"],["薛部長瑞元：這個部分其實跟我剛剛的報告有一些關係。"],["陳委員瑩：是有約略提到一些，這個我也了解。"],["薛部長瑞元：在生活上，因為職業的收入不是很穩定的情形，當然會造成生活壓力比較高。"],["陳委員瑩：所以你覺得這在原鄉發生比率也會比較高嗎？"],["薛部長瑞元：因為這裡的統計不是只有原鄉。"],["陳委員瑩：當然，對、沒錯！因為我遇到的實際案例其實都發生在都會區，他們也有不錯的工作，但是他們的工作也是都跟高壓有關係。"],["薛部長瑞元：對。"],["陳委員瑩：好，我想有一個現象，要拜託部長特別注意一下，司長應該接任也沒有太久，我也請你注意一下。我希望你們心健司可以多加加油，因為從2022年成立到現在，其實對於原住民心理健康的這些重要統計數據，你們司裡的同仁一問三不知，可能到最後責任都要司長來扛，甚至部長來扛，我覺得這樣也不是很理想。","我今天秀出來的是衛福部報告裡的東西，我問心健司還有沒有其他更完整的數據，結果呢，你們完全都不知道還有哪些原住民自殺數據的統計，甚至你們有同仁反問我們，這個數據從哪裡來？不就是你們衛福部自己委外的嗎？我不管是不是心健司委外，還是其他單位委外，這些都跟你們的業務有相關，就要主動去把這些數據全部都撈出來啊，對不對？還反問我們這個數據哪裡來，這樣很漏氣。如果連這些數據、趨勢都沒有掌握的話，我想你要有什麼因應的對策，我也很難期待你們今天可以給出什麼滿意的答案。","但是我這樣提，你們也不要太難過。因為原住民相關的問題，我一樣也問過勞動部，曾經有一位勞動部安研所同仁被我問到原住民勞工相關的問題，一開始他也都答不出來，但是他回去發奮圖強，後來跟著他們單位同仁做了很多原住民相關的數據研究統計。所以現在我也謝謝勞動部，特別在受到那樣的刺激之後，發奮圖強，很主動的把所有原住民相關勞工問題的數據，全部都研究得一清二楚，帶動整個勞動部下鄉。不只下鄉，都會區有原住民的地方，他們也會跟我請教，哪裡可以真的找到比較多的原住民，可以做有效的宣導，所以他們也沒有再到工地去發DVD作宣導，錯誤的宣導方式跟地點，這個都是要注意的。","我希望今天這個質詢可以給你們一些良善的刺激，也希望你們可以效法勞動部當初那位安研所的同仁，因為後來他也升官了，也不錯。所以我想在這邊給你們勉勵，謝謝。"],["薛部長瑞元：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝陳瑩委員的發言。","接下來請牛煦庭委員、牛煦庭委員、牛煦庭委員不在。","接下來請蔡易餘委員、蔡易餘委員、蔡易餘委員不在。","接下來請張嘉郡委員、張嘉郡委員、張嘉郡委員不在。","接下來請林楚茵委員、林楚茵委員、林楚茵委員不在。","接下來請鄭正鈐委員、鄭正鈐委員、鄭正鈐委員不在。","接下來請鄭天財委員、鄭天財委員、鄭天財委員不在。","接下來請劉建國委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":346,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-26-13","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","廖偉翔","邱鎮軍","王育敏","涂權吉","王正旭","林淑芬","李坤城","陳亭妃","楊瓊瓔","陳培瑜","黃珊珊","何欣純","黃國昌","李彥秀","洪孟楷","羅智強","徐欣瑩","陳瑩","劉建國","楊曜","盧縣一","蘇清泉","鍾佳濱","牛煦庭"],"page_start":253,"meetingDate":["2024-04-24"],"gazette_id":"1133401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1133401_00004"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請衛生福利部部長就「家暴零容忍─ 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\"text\": \"你們這個司裡面的同仁一問三不知啊所以這個可能到最後責任都要司長來扛甚至部長來扛我覺得這樣也不是很理想那因為齁這個我今天秀出來這個是衛福部報告裡面的東西啊那我問你們就是說信念師說還有沒有其他更完整的數據\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 538.37, \"end\": 539.451, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"司\", \"start\": 539.451, \"end\": 539.811, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"裡\"}, {\"word\": \"面\", \"start\": 539.811, \"end\": 540.512, \"score\": 0.971}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 540.512, \"end\": 540.772, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 540.772, \"end\": 541.032, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"仁\", \"start\": 541.032, \"end\": 541.512, \"score\": 0.958}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 541.512, \"end\": 541.892, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"三\", \"start\": 541.892, \"end\": 542.072, \"score\": 0.982}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 542.072, \"end\": 542.272, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"知\", \"start\": 542.272, \"end\": 542.473, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 542.473, \"end\": 543.413, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 543.413, \"end\": 543.593, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 543.593, \"end\": 544.374, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 544.374, \"end\": 544.514, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 544.514, \"end\": 544.874, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"到\", \"start\": 544.874, \"end\": 545.054, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"最\", \"start\": 545.054, \"end\": 545.374, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"後\", \"start\": 545.374, \"end\": 545.514, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"責\"}, {\"word\": \"任\", \"start\": 545.514, \"end\": 545.714, \"score\": 0.907}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 545.714, \"end\": 545.834, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 545.834, \"end\": 546.015, \"score\": 0.969}, {\"word\": \"司\", \"start\": 546.015, \"end\": 546.535, \"score\": 0.887}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"扛\", \"start\": 546.535, 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550.177, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 550.177, \"end\": 550.297, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 550.297, \"end\": 551.958, \"score\": 0.95}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"齁\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 551.958, \"end\": 552.818, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 552.818, \"end\": 552.918, \"score\": 0.801}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 552.918, \"end\": 553.058, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"秀\", \"start\": 553.058, \"end\": 553.259, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 553.259, \"end\": 553.699, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 553.699, \"end\": 554.019, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"衛\"}, {\"word\": \"福\", \"start\": 554.019, \"end\": 554.179, \"score\": 0.926}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 554.179, \"end\": 554.519, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 554.519, \"end\": 554.759, 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\"start\": 559.002, \"end\": 559.062, \"score\": 0.724}, {\"word\": \"沒\", \"start\": 559.062, \"end\": 559.182, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 559.182, \"end\": 559.322, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 559.322, \"end\": 559.442, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 559.442, \"end\": 559.642, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"更\", \"start\": 559.642, \"end\": 559.802, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"完\", \"start\": 559.802, \"end\": 560.002, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"整\", \"start\": 560.002, \"end\": 560.122, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 560.122, \"end\": 560.142, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"數\"}, {\"word\": \"據\"}]}, {\"start\": 561.403, \"end\": 569.117, \"text\": \"結果呢?你們完全都不知道就是說還有哪些原住民的自殺的這個數據的統計甚至你們有同仁反問我們說你們這個數據從哪裡來?\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"結\"}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 561.403, \"end\": 561.604, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"呢\", \"start\": 561.604, \"end\": 562.886, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"?\"}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 562.886, \"end\": 563.146, \"score\": 0.917}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"完\", \"start\": 563.146, \"end\": 563.327, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"全\", \"start\": 563.327, \"end\": 563.507, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 563.507, \"end\": 563.627, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 563.627, \"end\": 563.767, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"知\", \"start\": 563.767, \"end\": 563.908, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"道\", \"start\": 563.908, \"end\": 564.168, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 564.168, \"end\": 564.389, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 564.389, \"end\": 564.689, \"score\": 0.867}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 564.689, \"end\": 564.809, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"哪\", \"start\": 564.809, \"end\": 564.97, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 564.97, \"end\": 565.13, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"原\", \"start\": 565.13, \"end\": 565.29, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"住\", \"start\": 565.29, \"end\": 565.45, \"score\": 0.991}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 565.45, \"end\": 565.611, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 565.611, \"end\": 565.811, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"自\", \"start\": 565.811, \"end\": 565.931, \"score\": 0.947}, {\"word\": \"殺\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 565.931, \"end\": 566.152, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"數\"}, {\"word\": \"據\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 566.152, \"end\": 567.334, \"score\": 0.971}, {\"word\": \"統\"}, {\"word\": \"計\"}, {\"word\": \"甚\", \"start\": 567.334, \"end\": 567.514, \"score\": 0.889}, {\"word\": \"至\", \"start\": 567.514, \"end\": 567.634, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 567.634, \"end\": 567.674, \"score\": 0.5}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 567.674, \"end\": 567.814, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"同\", \"start\": 567.814, \"end\": 568.095, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"仁\", \"start\": 568.095, \"end\": 568.235, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"反\", \"start\": 568.235, \"end\": 568.335, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 568.335, \"end\": 568.896, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 568.896, \"end\": 569.097, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"數\"}, {\"word\": \"據\"}, {\"word\": \"從\"}, {\"word\": \"哪\", \"start\": 569.097, \"end\": 569.117, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"裡\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"?\"}]}, {\"start\": 575.157, \"end\": 591.363, \"text\": \"不就是你們衛福部委外的嗎?那我不管是不是興建師委外還是其他單位委外的,這些都跟你們的業務有相關,就要主動去把這些數據全部都撈出來啊,對不對?還反問我們說這個數據哪裡來,這樣很漏氣啊\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 575.157, \"end\": 575.257, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 575.257, \"end\": 575.437, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 575.437, \"end\": 575.577, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 575.577, \"end\": 576.858, \"score\": 0.898}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"衛\"}, {\"word\": \"福\", \"start\": 576.858, \"end\": 576.978, \"score\": 0.837}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 576.978, \"end\": 577.138, \"score\": 0.885}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 577.138, \"end\": 577.318, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"外\", \"start\": 577.318, \"end\": 577.538, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 577.538, \"end\": 578.178, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}, {\"word\": \"?\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 578.178, \"end\": 578.298, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 578.298, \"end\": 578.398, \"score\": 0.98}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 578.398, \"end\": 578.558, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"管\", \"start\": 578.558, \"end\": 579.539, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 579.539, \"end\": 579.659, \"score\": 0.843}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 579.659, \"end\": 579.859, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 579.859, \"end\": 580.379, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"興\"}, {\"word\": \"建\", \"start\": 580.379, \"end\": 580.779, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"師\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 580.779, \"end\": 580.919, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"外\", \"start\": 580.919, \"end\": 581.299, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"還\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 581.299, \"end\": 581.479, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 581.479, \"end\": 581.599, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 581.599, \"end\": 581.96, \"score\": 0.94}, {\"word\": \"單\"}, {\"word\": \"位\", \"start\": 581.96, \"end\": 582.12, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 582.12, \"end\": 582.3, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"外\", \"start\": 582.3, \"end\": 582.58, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 582.58, \"end\": 582.9, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 582.9, \"end\": 583.1, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 583.1, \"end\": 583.28, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 583.28, \"end\": 583.44, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"你\", \"start\": 583.44, \"end\": 583.76, \"score\": 0.935}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 583.76, \"end\": 584.2, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"業\"}, {\"word\": \"務\"}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 584.2, \"end\": 584.38, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"相\", \"start\": 584.38, \"end\": 584.961, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 584.961, \"end\": 585.101, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 585.101, \"end\": 585.401, \"score\": 1.0}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 585.401, \"end\": 586.521, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"動\"}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 586.521, \"end\": 586.721, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"把\", \"start\": 586.721, \"end\": 587.121, \"score\": 0.949}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 587.121, \"end\": 588.242, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"數\"}, 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00:00:27,838\n寫主席,麻煩請薛部長跟新建司。請薛部長。委員好。對,部長好。新建司我好像還沒問過。\n\n2\n00:00:30,016 --> 00:00:52,566\n第一部長之前您有提到依照統計數據的呈現年輕族群的自殺率有提高的趨勢所以在提出年輕族群的心理健康的協助所以我要請教一下就是說部長你知道我們全國各縣市當中哪個縣市的自殺率是最高的嗎?\n\n3\n00:00:58,318 --> 00:01:25,136\n因為我目前可能要查一下資料好,那個沒關係我其實都查好了第一名是苗栗那實際的統計數據有點顛覆我們很多人的想像因為我想很多人應該都會跟我一樣覺得說大家就是說在都會區可能生活步調很緊湊那工作壓力、居住環境等等的因素就是處於就比較高壓\n\n4\n00:01:26,758 --> 00:01:41,217\n高壓到超過個人可以忍受的範圍所以導致憂鬱甚至自我傷害最後輕生的狀況感覺上邏輯推論起來是比較高的但是我們看一下這個圖\n\n5\n00:01:43,540 --> 00:01:59,052\n這個是去年的新聞,它統計2022年的這個自殺率的數據那圖裡面的這個黑色底的數據就是高於平均值那我換個方式呈現,我們再看一下這個表\n\n6\n00:02:01,132 --> 00:02:14,391\n我特別再關心一下這個花蓮台東的部分我們花蓮台東呢就是前五名那部長你覺得這樣的情形可能的原因是什麼有哪些\n\n7\n00:02:15,376 --> 00:02:30,293\n當然因為這邊的自殺率是全人口那我們知道說這些自殺的這一個個案的這部分的話其實是以年紀大的為占多數\n\n8\n00:02:31,534 --> 00:02:46,969\n所以,從他這樣看下去的話,排名前面的可能都是老年化的、高年化的這一個線是比較高的啦所以這也是可以來理解對,那所以為什麼特別是這個\n\n9\n00:02:48,670 --> 00:03:04,908\n老年人的部分自查率部長會認為是比較高?從統計數字來看,你覺得有哪幾個比較可能的原因?當然就是說,比如說久病,然後在照顧上面有問題,不管是說\n\n10\n00:03:08,832 --> 00:03:10,713\n雙勞互相照顧、獨居等。」\n\n11\n00:03:30,083 --> 00:03:44,582\n當然我是不是請我們市長來回答?好,謝謝委員關切這個議題,如同部長補充的那目前全台灣的數據是65歲以上的人口是自殺率最高那我們看年輕族群是因為他的自殺率上升最陡\n\n12\n00:03:45,143 --> 00:04:13,736\n所以當時是因為這樣的理由所以最高的還是如同部長講的所以如果說這個鄉鎮市的人口分佈是比較老化的的確它的自殺率就會比較高這是剛剛的一點補充那關於我們的因應作為呢我們目前是結合22縣市不管是醫師科還是我們的長照活動或是社家屬的相關活動我們大量的做老人的憂鬱症篩檢因為根據我們去年國衛院的研究是顯示說老人的自殺呢核心的議題是他的憂鬱症沒有被篩檢出來\n\n13\n00:04:14,676 --> 00:04:38,003\n那目前台灣65歲以上的人他的憂鬱症盛行率是16%一般人大概是10%所以說老人的憂鬱症必須要大量的被篩檢出來才可以提早介入提早治療那我們心理健康司結合社家署相關的活動在去年我們篩檢了65萬人次那我們轉介治療了高達4000多人所以這是我們的經濟作為我也是第一次質詢你所以我讓你多講一點\n\n14\n00:04:39,844 --> 00:04:55,535\n、民主及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會\n\n15\n00:05:09,544 --> 00:05:28,953\n會說因為偏鄉的醫療資源缺乏,醫院密集度比較低,被搶救的機會比較低。」其實換句話說,就是在偏鄉醫療資源比較少的地方,可能就是你在那邊自殺成功率就比較高啦。換句話講是這樣子。\n\n16\n00:05:32,255 --> 00:05:47,796\n雖然這是可能影響的因素但是我比較想了解就是說造成非都市居民比較容易有憂鬱傾向的因素又是什麼那為什麼就是又讓我們這個花東的人比較容易產生尋短的念頭\n\n17\n00:05:50,460 --> 00:06:12,673\n這可能有幾個因素,第一個就是說物質濫用的問題,物質濫用,比如說酒或是其他的一些毒品等等那一類的,這是一個可能的原因,但是在原先來講的話,這不見得是一個主要的原因\n\n18\n00:06:15,474 --> 00:06:31,366\n那另外的話就是無業啦就沒有適當的工作啦這個也是也是一個那或許沒有適當的這個壓力排擠的地方或娛樂的地方可能也是\n\n19\n00:06:32,421 --> 00:06:56,220\n也有可能啦,但是我通常我是沒有把政策算為重要的東西。我想重要就是說回歸到我剛剛講就是說到底怎麼樣幫助這些人可能還是最重要的那另外還有一個數據我看到也是非常憂心因為其實在我為什麼會特別提這個是因為我周遭的選民好幾位\n\n20\n00:06:57,120 --> 00:07:16,655\n他們的孩子也是正當青壯年的二十多歲三十歲那就也是都自殺往生的這很遺憾的那依照你們委託製作2030年原住民足健康照護中長城計劃的報告當中我看到了這個資料\n\n21\n00:07:17,876 --> 00:07:37,387\n那為什麼特別是就是說25到44歲的青壯年的原住民他們的自殺死亡率是高於這個全國的數據高出了將近五成那部長你覺得就是說這個是什麼原因那你們因應的這個對策又是什麼\n\n22\n00:07:39,464 --> 00:08:01,424\n這個部分的話其實跟剛剛我在報告的是有關係啦這有約略有提到一些啦這個我也瞭解有一些關係啦那在這一個生活上面因為職業上面的不是收入讓收入不是很穩定的情形的話當然會\n\n23\n00:08:02,265 --> 00:08:30,897\n造成生活壓力是比較高的。」所以你覺得說這些也是在原鄉發生比率會比較高嗎?這個因為這裡的統計不是只有原鄉當然對沒錯因為我遇到的實際案例其實都發生在都會區他們也有不錯的工作其中的是他們的工作但是也是都跟高壓有關係那我想是\n\n24\n00:08:32,037 --> 00:08:55,949\n是這樣子就是說有一個現象我要拜託部長特別注意一下那司長您剛就是應該接任也沒有太久啦我也請你注意一下因為我希望你們新建司可以多加加油因為從2022年你們成立到現在其實對於原住民的這個心理健康的這個重要的這些統計數據\n\n25\n00:08:58,370 --> 00:09:20,142\n你們這個司裡面的同仁一問三不知啊所以這個可能到最後責任都要司長來扛甚至部長來扛我覺得這樣也不是很理想那因為齁這個我今天秀出來這個是衛福部報告裡面的東西啊那我問你們就是說信念師說還有沒有其他更完整的數據\n\n26\n00:09:21,403 --> 00:09:29,117\n結果呢?你們完全都不知道就是說還有哪些原住民的自殺的這個數據的統計甚至你們有同仁反問我們說你們這個數據從哪裡來?\n\n27\n00:09:35,157 --> 00:09:51,363\n不就是你們衛福部委外的嗎?那我不管是不是興建師委外還是其他單位委外的,這些都跟你們的業務有相關,就要主動去把這些數據全部都撈出來啊,對不對?還反問我們說這個數據哪裡來,這樣很漏氣啊\n\n28\n00:09:55,766 --> 00:10:22,787\n那所以如果說連這些數據都這些數據趨勢都沒有掌握的話那我想說你要怎麼去有什麼因應的對策我也很難今天期待你們有什麼會給出什麼滿意的答案但是我這樣提喔你們也不要太難過因為呢原住民相關的問題一樣的我也問過勞動部的這個曾經有勞動部的這個安研所有一位同仁被我問到原住民這個勞工相關的問題\n\n29\n00:10:24,969 --> 00:10:44,600\n一開始他也是都答不出來但是回去他發憤圖強所以他就後來跟著他們部裡的他們單位同仁做了很多原住民相關的這個數據的研究統計所以現在我也謝謝衛福部那個勞動部就是特別在受到那樣的刺激之後發憤圖強\n\n30\n00:10:46,761 --> 00:11:13,475\n很主動的把所有原住民相關的勞工問題一些數據全部都研究得一清二楚那帶動整個勞動部下鄉或者不只下鄉都會去有原住民的地方他們就都也會跟我們請教說哪裡可以真的找到比較多的原住民可以做有效的宣導所以他們也沒有再到工地去發DVD做宣導了\n\n31\n00:11:14,595 --> 00:11:35,021\n所以錯誤的宣導方式跟這個地點這個都是要注意的所以我希望今天這個質詢呢可以給你們一些良善的刺激那也希望你們可以效法一下這個勞動部當初那位安研所的同仁因為後來他也升官了也不錯所以我想在這邊給你們勉勵謝謝好謝謝陳穎委員的發言接下來請牛徐廷委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n15974\t27838\t寫主席,麻煩請薛部長跟新建司。請薛部長。委員好。對,部長好。新建司我好像還沒問過。\n30016\t52566\t第一部長之前您有提到依照統計數據的呈現年輕族群的自殺率有提高的趨勢所以在提出年輕族群的心理健康的協助所以我要請教一下就是說部長你知道我們全國各縣市當中哪個縣市的自殺率是最高的嗎?\n58318\t85136\t因為我目前可能要查一下資料好,那個沒關係我其實都查好了第一名是苗栗那實際的統計數據有點顛覆我們很多人的想像因為我想很多人應該都會跟我一樣覺得說大家就是說在都會區可能生活步調很緊湊那工作壓力、居住環境等等的因素就是處於就比較高壓\n86758\t101217\t高壓到超過個人可以忍受的範圍所以導致憂鬱甚至自我傷害最後輕生的狀況感覺上邏輯推論起來是比較高的但是我們看一下這個圖\n103540\t119052\t這個是去年的新聞,它統計2022年的這個自殺率的數據那圖裡面的這個黑色底的數據就是高於平均值那我換個方式呈現,我們再看一下這個表\n121132\t134391\t我特別再關心一下這個花蓮台東的部分我們花蓮台東呢就是前五名那部長你覺得這樣的情形可能的原因是什麼有哪些\n135376\t150293\t當然因為這邊的自殺率是全人口那我們知道說這些自殺的這一個個案的這部分的話其實是以年紀大的為占多數\n151534\t166969\t所以,從他這樣看下去的話,排名前面的可能都是老年化的、高年化的這一個線是比較高的啦所以這也是可以來理解對,那所以為什麼特別是這個\n168670\t184908\t老年人的部分自查率部長會認為是比較高?從統計數字來看,你覺得有哪幾個比較可能的原因?當然就是說,比如說久病,然後在照顧上面有問題,不管是說\n188832\t190713\t雙勞互相照顧、獨居等。」\n210083\t224582\t當然我是不是請我們市長來回答?好,謝謝委員關切這個議題,如同部長補充的那目前全台灣的數據是65歲以上的人口是自殺率最高那我們看年輕族群是因為他的自殺率上升最陡\n225143\t253736\t所以當時是因為這樣的理由所以最高的還是如同部長講的所以如果說這個鄉鎮市的人口分佈是比較老化的的確它的自殺率就會比較高這是剛剛的一點補充那關於我們的因應作為呢我們目前是結合22縣市不管是醫師科還是我們的長照活動或是社家屬的相關活動我們大量的做老人的憂鬱症篩檢因為根據我們去年國衛院的研究是顯示說老人的自殺呢核心的議題是他的憂鬱症沒有被篩檢出來\n254676\t278003\t那目前台灣65歲以上的人他的憂鬱症盛行率是16%一般人大概是10%所以說老人的憂鬱症必須要大量的被篩檢出來才可以提早介入提早治療那我們心理健康司結合社家署相關的活動在去年我們篩檢了65萬人次那我們轉介治療了高達4000多人所以這是我們的經濟作為我也是第一次質詢你所以我讓你多講一點\n279844\t295535\t、民主及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會\n309544\t328953\t會說因為偏鄉的醫療資源缺乏,醫院密集度比較低,被搶救的機會比較低。」其實換句話說,就是在偏鄉醫療資源比較少的地方,可能就是你在那邊自殺成功率就比較高啦。換句話講是這樣子。\n332255\t347796\t雖然這是可能影響的因素但是我比較想了解就是說造成非都市居民比較容易有憂鬱傾向的因素又是什麼那為什麼就是又讓我們這個花東的人比較容易產生尋短的念頭\n350460\t372673\t這可能有幾個因素,第一個就是說物質濫用的問題,物質濫用,比如說酒或是其他的一些毒品等等那一類的,這是一個可能的原因,但是在原先來講的話,這不見得是一個主要的原因\n375474\t391366\t那另外的話就是無業啦就沒有適當的工作啦這個也是也是一個那或許沒有適當的這個壓力排擠的地方或娛樂的地方可能也是\n392421\t416220\t也有可能啦,但是我通常我是沒有把政策算為重要的東西。我想重要就是說回歸到我剛剛講就是說到底怎麼樣幫助這些人可能還是最重要的那另外還有一個數據我看到也是非常憂心因為其實在我為什麼會特別提這個是因為我周遭的選民好幾位\n417120\t436655\t他們的孩子也是正當青壯年的二十多歲三十歲那就也是都自殺往生的這很遺憾的那依照你們委託製作2030年原住民足健康照護中長城計劃的報告當中我看到了這個資料\n437876\t457387\t那為什麼特別是就是說25到44歲的青壯年的原住民他們的自殺死亡率是高於這個全國的數據高出了將近五成那部長你覺得就是說這個是什麼原因那你們因應的這個對策又是什麼\n459464\t481424\t這個部分的話其實跟剛剛我在報告的是有關係啦這有約略有提到一些啦這個我也瞭解有一些關係啦那在這一個生活上面因為職業上面的不是收入讓收入不是很穩定的情形的話當然會\n482265\t510897\t造成生活壓力是比較高的。」所以你覺得說這些也是在原鄉發生比率會比較高嗎?這個因為這裡的統計不是只有原鄉當然對沒錯因為我遇到的實際案例其實都發生在都會區他們也有不錯的工作其中的是他們的工作但是也是都跟高壓有關係那我想是\n512037\t535949\t是這樣子就是說有一個現象我要拜託部長特別注意一下那司長您剛就是應該接任也沒有太久啦我也請你注意一下因為我希望你們新建司可以多加加油因為從2022年你們成立到現在其實對於原住民的這個心理健康的這個重要的這些統計數據\n538370\t560142\t你們這個司裡面的同仁一問三不知啊所以這個可能到最後責任都要司長來扛甚至部長來扛我覺得這樣也不是很理想那因為齁這個我今天秀出來這個是衛福部報告裡面的東西啊那我問你們就是說信念師說還有沒有其他更完整的數據\n561403\t569117\t結果呢?你們完全都不知道就是說還有哪些原住民的自殺的這個數據的統計甚至你們有同仁反問我們說你們這個數據從哪裡來?\n575157\t591363\t不就是你們衛福部委外的嗎?那我不管是不是興建師委外還是其他單位委外的,這些都跟你們的業務有相關,就要主動去把這些數據全部都撈出來啊,對不對?還反問我們說這個數據哪裡來,這樣很漏氣啊\n595766\t622787\t那所以如果說連這些數據都這些數據趨勢都沒有掌握的話那我想說你要怎麼去有什麼因應的對策我也很難今天期待你們有什麼會給出什麼滿意的答案但是我這樣提喔你們也不要太難過因為呢原住民相關的問題一樣的我也問過勞動部的這個曾經有勞動部的這個安研所有一位同仁被我問到原住民這個勞工相關的問題\n624969\t644600\t一開始他也是都答不出來但是回去他發憤圖強所以他就後來跟著他們部裡的他們單位同仁做了很多原住民相關的這個數據的研究統計所以現在我也謝謝衛福部那個勞動部就是特別在受到那樣的刺激之後發憤圖強\n646761\t673475\t很主動的把所有原住民相關的勞工問題一些數據全部都研究得一清二楚那帶動整個勞動部下鄉或者不只下鄉都會去有原住民的地方他們就都也會跟我們請教說哪裡可以真的找到比較多的原住民可以做有效的宣導所以他們也沒有再到工地去發DVD做宣導了\n674595\t695021\t所以錯誤的宣導方式跟這個地點這個都是要注意的所以我希望今天這個質詢呢可以給你們一些良善的刺激那也希望你們可以效法一下這個勞動部當初那位安研所的同仁因為後來他也升官了也不錯所以我想在這邊給你們勉勵謝謝好謝謝陳穎委員的發言接下來請牛徐廷委員\n","txt":"寫主席,麻煩請薛部長跟新建司。請薛部長。委員好。對,部長好。新建司我好像還沒問過。\n第一部長之前您有提到依照統計數據的呈現年輕族群的自殺率有提高的趨勢所以在提出年輕族群的心理健康的協助所以我要請教一下就是說部長你知道我們全國各縣市當中哪個縣市的自殺率是最高的嗎?\n因為我目前可能要查一下資料好,那個沒關係我其實都查好了第一名是苗栗那實際的統計數據有點顛覆我們很多人的想像因為我想很多人應該都會跟我一樣覺得說大家就是說在都會區可能生活步調很緊湊那工作壓力、居住環境等等的因素就是處於就比較高壓\n高壓到超過個人可以忍受的範圍所以導致憂鬱甚至自我傷害最後輕生的狀況感覺上邏輯推論起來是比較高的但是我們看一下這個圖\n這個是去年的新聞,它統計2022年的這個自殺率的數據那圖裡面的這個黑色底的數據就是高於平均值那我換個方式呈現,我們再看一下這個表\n我特別再關心一下這個花蓮台東的部分我們花蓮台東呢就是前五名那部長你覺得這樣的情形可能的原因是什麼有哪些\n當然因為這邊的自殺率是全人口那我們知道說這些自殺的這一個個案的這部分的話其實是以年紀大的為占多數\n所以,從他這樣看下去的話,排名前面的可能都是老年化的、高年化的這一個線是比較高的啦所以這也是可以來理解對,那所以為什麼特別是這個\n老年人的部分自查率部長會認為是比較高?從統計數字來看,你覺得有哪幾個比較可能的原因?當然就是說,比如說久病,然後在照顧上面有問題,不管是說\n雙勞互相照顧、獨居等。」\n當然我是不是請我們市長來回答?好,謝謝委員關切這個議題,如同部長補充的那目前全台灣的數據是65歲以上的人口是自殺率最高那我們看年輕族群是因為他的自殺率上升最陡\n所以當時是因為這樣的理由所以最高的還是如同部長講的所以如果說這個鄉鎮市的人口分佈是比較老化的的確它的自殺率就會比較高這是剛剛的一點補充那關於我們的因應作為呢我們目前是結合22縣市不管是醫師科還是我們的長照活動或是社家屬的相關活動我們大量的做老人的憂鬱症篩檢因為根據我們去年國衛院的研究是顯示說老人的自殺呢核心的議題是他的憂鬱症沒有被篩檢出來\n那目前台灣65歲以上的人他的憂鬱症盛行率是16%一般人大概是10%所以說老人的憂鬱症必須要大量的被篩檢出來才可以提早介入提早治療那我們心理健康司結合社家署相關的活動在去年我們篩檢了65萬人次那我們轉介治療了高達4000多人所以這是我們的經濟作為我也是第一次質詢你所以我讓你多講一點\n、民主及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會\n會說因為偏鄉的醫療資源缺乏,醫院密集度比較低,被搶救的機會比較低。」其實換句話說,就是在偏鄉醫療資源比較少的地方,可能就是你在那邊自殺成功率就比較高啦。換句話講是這樣子。\n雖然這是可能影響的因素但是我比較想了解就是說造成非都市居民比較容易有憂鬱傾向的因素又是什麼那為什麼就是又讓我們這個花東的人比較容易產生尋短的念頭\n這可能有幾個因素,第一個就是說物質濫用的問題,物質濫用,比如說酒或是其他的一些毒品等等那一類的,這是一個可能的原因,但是在原先來講的話,這不見得是一個主要的原因\n那另外的話就是無業啦就沒有適當的工作啦這個也是也是一個那或許沒有適當的這個壓力排擠的地方或娛樂的地方可能也是\n也有可能啦,但是我通常我是沒有把政策算為重要的東西。我想重要就是說回歸到我剛剛講就是說到底怎麼樣幫助這些人可能還是最重要的那另外還有一個數據我看到也是非常憂心因為其實在我為什麼會特別提這個是因為我周遭的選民好幾位\n他們的孩子也是正當青壯年的二十多歲三十歲那就也是都自殺往生的這很遺憾的那依照你們委託製作2030年原住民足健康照護中長城計劃的報告當中我看到了這個資料\n那為什麼特別是就是說25到44歲的青壯年的原住民他們的自殺死亡率是高於這個全國的數據高出了將近五成那部長你覺得就是說這個是什麼原因那你們因應的這個對策又是什麼\n這個部分的話其實跟剛剛我在報告的是有關係啦這有約略有提到一些啦這個我也瞭解有一些關係啦那在這一個生活上面因為職業上面的不是收入讓收入不是很穩定的情形的話當然會\n造成生活壓力是比較高的。」所以你覺得說這些也是在原鄉發生比率會比較高嗎?這個因為這裡的統計不是只有原鄉當然對沒錯因為我遇到的實際案例其實都發生在都會區他們也有不錯的工作其中的是他們的工作但是也是都跟高壓有關係那我想是\n是這樣子就是說有一個現象我要拜託部長特別注意一下那司長您剛就是應該接任也沒有太久啦我也請你注意一下因為我希望你們新建司可以多加加油因為從2022年你們成立到現在其實對於原住民的這個心理健康的這個重要的這些統計數據\n你們這個司裡面的同仁一問三不知啊所以這個可能到最後責任都要司長來扛甚至部長來扛我覺得這樣也不是很理想那因為齁這個我今天秀出來這個是衛福部報告裡面的東西啊那我問你們就是說信念師說還有沒有其他更完整的數據\n結果呢?你們完全都不知道就是說還有哪些原住民的自殺的這個數據的統計甚至你們有同仁反問我們說你們這個數據從哪裡來?\n不就是你們衛福部委外的嗎?那我不管是不是興建師委外還是其他單位委外的,這些都跟你們的業務有相關,就要主動去把這些數據全部都撈出來啊,對不對?還反問我們說這個數據哪裡來,這樣很漏氣啊\n那所以如果說連這些數據都這些數據趨勢都沒有掌握的話那我想說你要怎麼去有什麼因應的對策我也很難今天期待你們有什麼會給出什麼滿意的答案但是我這樣提喔你們也不要太難過因為呢原住民相關的問題一樣的我也問過勞動部的這個曾經有勞動部的這個安研所有一位同仁被我問到原住民這個勞工相關的問題\n一開始他也是都答不出來但是回去他發憤圖強所以他就後來跟著他們部裡的他們單位同仁做了很多原住民相關的這個數據的研究統計所以現在我也謝謝衛福部那個勞動部就是特別在受到那樣的刺激之後發憤圖強\n很主動的把所有原住民相關的勞工問題一些數據全部都研究得一清二楚那帶動整個勞動部下鄉或者不只下鄉都會去有原住民的地方他們就都也會跟我們請教說哪裡可以真的找到比較多的原住民可以做有效的宣導所以他們也沒有再到工地去發DVD做宣導了\n所以錯誤的宣導方式跟這個地點這個都是要注意的所以我希望今天這個質詢呢可以給你們一些良善的刺激那也希望你們可以效法一下這個勞動部當初那位安研所的同仁因為後來他也升官了也不錯所以我想在這邊給你們勉勵謝謝好謝謝陳穎委員的發言接下來請牛徐廷委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:15.974 --> 00:27.838\n寫主席,麻煩請薛部長跟新建司。請薛部長。委員好。對,部長好。新建司我好像還沒問過。\n\n00:30.016 --> 00:52.566\n第一部長之前您有提到依照統計數據的呈現年輕族群的自殺率有提高的趨勢所以在提出年輕族群的心理健康的協助所以我要請教一下就是說部長你知道我們全國各縣市當中哪個縣市的自殺率是最高的嗎?\n\n00:58.318 --> 01:25.136\n因為我目前可能要查一下資料好,那個沒關係我其實都查好了第一名是苗栗那實際的統計數據有點顛覆我們很多人的想像因為我想很多人應該都會跟我一樣覺得說大家就是說在都會區可能生活步調很緊湊那工作壓力、居住環境等等的因素就是處於就比較高壓\n\n01:26.758 --> 01:41.217\n高壓到超過個人可以忍受的範圍所以導致憂鬱甚至自我傷害最後輕生的狀況感覺上邏輯推論起來是比較高的但是我們看一下這個圖\n\n01:43.540 --> 01:59.052\n這個是去年的新聞,它統計2022年的這個自殺率的數據那圖裡面的這個黑色底的數據就是高於平均值那我換個方式呈現,我們再看一下這個表\n\n02:01.132 --> 02:14.391\n我特別再關心一下這個花蓮台東的部分我們花蓮台東呢就是前五名那部長你覺得這樣的情形可能的原因是什麼有哪些\n\n02:15.376 --> 02:30.293\n當然因為這邊的自殺率是全人口那我們知道說這些自殺的這一個個案的這部分的話其實是以年紀大的為占多數\n\n02:31.534 --> 02:46.969\n所以,從他這樣看下去的話,排名前面的可能都是老年化的、高年化的這一個線是比較高的啦所以這也是可以來理解對,那所以為什麼特別是這個\n\n02:48.670 --> 03:04.908\n老年人的部分自查率部長會認為是比較高?從統計數字來看,你覺得有哪幾個比較可能的原因?當然就是說,比如說久病,然後在照顧上面有問題,不管是說\n\n03:08.832 --> 03:10.713\n雙勞互相照顧、獨居等。」\n\n03:30.083 --> 03:44.582\n當然我是不是請我們市長來回答?好,謝謝委員關切這個議題,如同部長補充的那目前全台灣的數據是65歲以上的人口是自殺率最高那我們看年輕族群是因為他的自殺率上升最陡\n\n03:45.143 --> 04:13.736\n所以當時是因為這樣的理由所以最高的還是如同部長講的所以如果說這個鄉鎮市的人口分佈是比較老化的的確它的自殺率就會比較高這是剛剛的一點補充那關於我們的因應作為呢我們目前是結合22縣市不管是醫師科還是我們的長照活動或是社家屬的相關活動我們大量的做老人的憂鬱症篩檢因為根據我們去年國衛院的研究是顯示說老人的自殺呢核心的議題是他的憂鬱症沒有被篩檢出來\n\n04:14.676 --> 04:38.003\n那目前台灣65歲以上的人他的憂鬱症盛行率是16%一般人大概是10%所以說老人的憂鬱症必須要大量的被篩檢出來才可以提早介入提早治療那我們心理健康司結合社家署相關的活動在去年我們篩檢了65萬人次那我們轉介治療了高達4000多人所以這是我們的經濟作為我也是第一次質詢你所以我讓你多講一點\n\n04:39.844 --> 04:55.535\n、民主及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會\n\n05:09.544 --> 05:28.953\n會說因為偏鄉的醫療資源缺乏,醫院密集度比較低,被搶救的機會比較低。」其實換句話說,就是在偏鄉醫療資源比較少的地方,可能就是你在那邊自殺成功率就比較高啦。換句話講是這樣子。\n\n05:32.255 --> 05:47.796\n雖然這是可能影響的因素但是我比較想了解就是說造成非都市居民比較容易有憂鬱傾向的因素又是什麼那為什麼就是又讓我們這個花東的人比較容易產生尋短的念頭\n\n05:50.460 --> 06:12.673\n這可能有幾個因素,第一個就是說物質濫用的問題,物質濫用,比如說酒或是其他的一些毒品等等那一類的,這是一個可能的原因,但是在原先來講的話,這不見得是一個主要的原因\n\n06:15.474 --> 06:31.366\n那另外的話就是無業啦就沒有適當的工作啦這個也是也是一個那或許沒有適當的這個壓力排擠的地方或娛樂的地方可能也是\n\n06:32.421 --> 06:56.220\n也有可能啦,但是我通常我是沒有把政策算為重要的東西。我想重要就是說回歸到我剛剛講就是說到底怎麼樣幫助這些人可能還是最重要的那另外還有一個數據我看到也是非常憂心因為其實在我為什麼會特別提這個是因為我周遭的選民好幾位\n\n06:57.120 --> 07:16.655\n他們的孩子也是正當青壯年的二十多歲三十歲那就也是都自殺往生的這很遺憾的那依照你們委託製作2030年原住民足健康照護中長城計劃的報告當中我看到了這個資料\n\n07:17.876 --> 07:37.387\n那為什麼特別是就是說25到44歲的青壯年的原住民他們的自殺死亡率是高於這個全國的數據高出了將近五成那部長你覺得就是說這個是什麼原因那你們因應的這個對策又是什麼\n\n07:39.464 --> 08:01.424\n這個部分的話其實跟剛剛我在報告的是有關係啦這有約略有提到一些啦這個我也瞭解有一些關係啦那在這一個生活上面因為職業上面的不是收入讓收入不是很穩定的情形的話當然會\n\n08:02.265 --> 08:30.897\n造成生活壓力是比較高的。」所以你覺得說這些也是在原鄉發生比率會比較高嗎?這個因為這裡的統計不是只有原鄉當然對沒錯因為我遇到的實際案例其實都發生在都會區他們也有不錯的工作其中的是他們的工作但是也是都跟高壓有關係那我想是\n\n08:32.037 --> 08:55.949\n是這樣子就是說有一個現象我要拜託部長特別注意一下那司長您剛就是應該接任也沒有太久啦我也請你注意一下因為我希望你們新建司可以多加加油因為從2022年你們成立到現在其實對於原住民的這個心理健康的這個重要的這些統計數據\n\n08:58.370 --> 09:20.142\n你們這個司裡面的同仁一問三不知啊所以這個可能到最後責任都要司長來扛甚至部長來扛我覺得這樣也不是很理想那因為齁這個我今天秀出來這個是衛福部報告裡面的東西啊那我問你們就是說信念師說還有沒有其他更完整的數據\n\n09:21.403 --> 09:29.117\n結果呢?你們完全都不知道就是說還有哪些原住民的自殺的這個數據的統計甚至你們有同仁反問我們說你們這個數據從哪裡來?\n\n09:35.157 --> 09:51.363\n不就是你們衛福部委外的嗎?那我不管是不是興建師委外還是其他單位委外的,這些都跟你們的業務有相關,就要主動去把這些數據全部都撈出來啊,對不對?還反問我們說這個數據哪裡來,這樣很漏氣啊\n\n09:55.766 --> 10:22.787\n那所以如果說連這些數據都這些數據趨勢都沒有掌握的話那我想說你要怎麼去有什麼因應的對策我也很難今天期待你們有什麼會給出什麼滿意的答案但是我這樣提喔你們也不要太難過因為呢原住民相關的問題一樣的我也問過勞動部的這個曾經有勞動部的這個安研所有一位同仁被我問到原住民這個勞工相關的問題\n\n10:24.969 --> 10:44.600\n一開始他也是都答不出來但是回去他發憤圖強所以他就後來跟著他們部裡的他們單位同仁做了很多原住民相關的這個數據的研究統計所以現在我也謝謝衛福部那個勞動部就是特別在受到那樣的刺激之後發憤圖強\n\n10:46.761 --> 11:13.475\n很主動的把所有原住民相關的勞工問題一些數據全部都研究得一清二楚那帶動整個勞動部下鄉或者不只下鄉都會去有原住民的地方他們就都也會跟我們請教說哪裡可以真的找到比較多的原住民可以做有效的宣導所以他們也沒有再到工地去發DVD做宣導了\n\n11:14.595 --> 11:35.021\n所以錯誤的宣導方式跟這個地點這個都是要注意的所以我希望今天這個質詢呢可以給你們一些良善的刺激那也希望你們可以效法一下這個勞動部當初那位安研所的同仁因為後來他也升官了也不錯所以我想在這邊給你們勉勵謝謝好謝謝陳穎委員的發言接下來請牛徐廷委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":15.974,"end":27.838,"text":"寫主席,麻煩請薛部長跟新建司。請薛部長。委員好。對,部長好。新建司我好像還沒問過。"},{"start":30.016,"end":52.566,"text":"第一部長之前您有提到依照統計數據的呈現年輕族群的自殺率有提高的趨勢所以在提出年輕族群的心理健康的協助所以我要請教一下就是說部長你知道我們全國各縣市當中哪個縣市的自殺率是最高的嗎?"},{"start":58.318,"end":85.136,"text":"因為我目前可能要查一下資料好,那個沒關係我其實都查好了第一名是苗栗那實際的統計數據有點顛覆我們很多人的想像因為我想很多人應該都會跟我一樣覺得說大家就是說在都會區可能生活步調很緊湊那工作壓力、居住環境等等的因素就是處於就比較高壓"},{"start":86.758,"end":101.217,"text":"高壓到超過個人可以忍受的範圍所以導致憂鬱甚至自我傷害最後輕生的狀況感覺上邏輯推論起來是比較高的但是我們看一下這個圖"},{"start":103.54,"end":119.052,"text":"這個是去年的新聞,它統計2022年的這個自殺率的數據那圖裡面的這個黑色底的數據就是高於平均值那我換個方式呈現,我們再看一下這個表"},{"start":121.132,"end":134.391,"text":"我特別再關心一下這個花蓮台東的部分我們花蓮台東呢就是前五名那部長你覺得這樣的情形可能的原因是什麼有哪些"},{"start":135.376,"end":150.293,"text":"當然因為這邊的自殺率是全人口那我們知道說這些自殺的這一個個案的這部分的話其實是以年紀大的為占多數"},{"start":151.534,"end":166.969,"text":"所以,從他這樣看下去的話,排名前面的可能都是老年化的、高年化的這一個線是比較高的啦所以這也是可以來理解對,那所以為什麼特別是這個"},{"start":168.67,"end":184.908,"text":"老年人的部分自查率部長會認為是比較高?從統計數字來看,你覺得有哪幾個比較可能的原因?當然就是說,比如說久病,然後在照顧上面有問題,不管是說"},{"start":188.832,"end":190.713,"text":"雙勞互相照顧、獨居等。」"},{"start":210.083,"end":224.582,"text":"當然我是不是請我們市長來回答?好,謝謝委員關切這個議題,如同部長補充的那目前全台灣的數據是65歲以上的人口是自殺率最高那我們看年輕族群是因為他的自殺率上升最陡"},{"start":225.143,"end":253.736,"text":"所以當時是因為這樣的理由所以最高的還是如同部長講的所以如果說這個鄉鎮市的人口分佈是比較老化的的確它的自殺率就會比較高這是剛剛的一點補充那關於我們的因應作為呢我們目前是結合22縣市不管是醫師科還是我們的長照活動或是社家屬的相關活動我們大量的做老人的憂鬱症篩檢因為根據我們去年國衛院的研究是顯示說老人的自殺呢核心的議題是他的憂鬱症沒有被篩檢出來"},{"start":254.676,"end":278.003,"text":"那目前台灣65歲以上的人他的憂鬱症盛行率是16%一般人大概是10%所以說老人的憂鬱症必須要大量的被篩檢出來才可以提早介入提早治療那我們心理健康司結合社家署相關的活動在去年我們篩檢了65萬人次那我們轉介治療了高達4000多人所以這是我們的經濟作為我也是第一次質詢你所以我讓你多講一點"},{"start":279.844,"end":295.535,"text":"、民主及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會及社會福利部長、國家通訊管理委員會"},{"start":309.544,"end":328.953,"text":"會說因為偏鄉的醫療資源缺乏,醫院密集度比較低,被搶救的機會比較低。」其實換句話說,就是在偏鄉醫療資源比較少的地方,可能就是你在那邊自殺成功率就比較高啦。換句話講是這樣子。"},{"start":332.255,"end":347.796,"text":"雖然這是可能影響的因素但是我比較想了解就是說造成非都市居民比較容易有憂鬱傾向的因素又是什麼那為什麼就是又讓我們這個花東的人比較容易產生尋短的念頭"},{"start":350.46,"end":372.673,"text":"這可能有幾個因素,第一個就是說物質濫用的問題,物質濫用,比如說酒或是其他的一些毒品等等那一類的,這是一個可能的原因,但是在原先來講的話,這不見得是一個主要的原因"},{"start":375.474,"end":391.366,"text":"那另外的話就是無業啦就沒有適當的工作啦這個也是也是一個那或許沒有適當的這個壓力排擠的地方或娛樂的地方可能也是"},{"start":392.421,"end":416.22,"text":"也有可能啦,但是我通常我是沒有把政策算為重要的東西。我想重要就是說回歸到我剛剛講就是說到底怎麼樣幫助這些人可能還是最重要的那另外還有一個數據我看到也是非常憂心因為其實在我為什麼會特別提這個是因為我周遭的選民好幾位"},{"start":417.12,"end":436.655,"text":"他們的孩子也是正當青壯年的二十多歲三十歲那就也是都自殺往生的這很遺憾的那依照你們委託製作2030年原住民足健康照護中長城計劃的報告當中我看到了這個資料"},{"start":437.876,"end":457.387,"text":"那為什麼特別是就是說25到44歲的青壯年的原住民他們的自殺死亡率是高於這個全國的數據高出了將近五成那部長你覺得就是說這個是什麼原因那你們因應的這個對策又是什麼"},{"start":459.464,"end":481.424,"text":"這個部分的話其實跟剛剛我在報告的是有關係啦這有約略有提到一些啦這個我也瞭解有一些關係啦那在這一個生活上面因為職業上面的不是收入讓收入不是很穩定的情形的話當然會"},{"start":482.265,"end":510.897,"text":"造成生活壓力是比較高的。」所以你覺得說這些也是在原鄉發生比率會比較高嗎?這個因為這裡的統計不是只有原鄉當然對沒錯因為我遇到的實際案例其實都發生在都會區他們也有不錯的工作其中的是他們的工作但是也是都跟高壓有關係那我想是"},{"start":512.037,"end":535.949,"text":"是這樣子就是說有一個現象我要拜託部長特別注意一下那司長您剛就是應該接任也沒有太久啦我也請你注意一下因為我希望你們新建司可以多加加油因為從2022年你們成立到現在其實對於原住民的這個心理健康的這個重要的這些統計數據"},{"start":538.37,"end":560.142,"text":"你們這個司裡面的同仁一問三不知啊所以這個可能到最後責任都要司長來扛甚至部長來扛我覺得這樣也不是很理想那因為齁這個我今天秀出來這個是衛福部報告裡面的東西啊那我問你們就是說信念師說還有沒有其他更完整的數據"},{"start":561.403,"end":569.117,"text":"結果呢?你們完全都不知道就是說還有哪些原住民的自殺的這個數據的統計甚至你們有同仁反問我們說你們這個數據從哪裡來?"},{"start":575.157,"end":591.363,"text":"不就是你們衛福部委外的嗎?那我不管是不是興建師委外還是其他單位委外的,這些都跟你們的業務有相關,就要主動去把這些數據全部都撈出來啊,對不對?還反問我們說這個數據哪裡來,這樣很漏氣啊"},{"start":595.766,"end":622.787,"text":"那所以如果說連這些數據都這些數據趨勢都沒有掌握的話那我想說你要怎麼去有什麼因應的對策我也很難今天期待你們有什麼會給出什麼滿意的答案但是我這樣提喔你們也不要太難過因為呢原住民相關的問題一樣的我也問過勞動部的這個曾經有勞動部的這個安研所有一位同仁被我問到原住民這個勞工相關的問題"},{"start":624.969,"end":644.6,"text":"一開始他也是都答不出來但是回去他發憤圖強所以他就後來跟著他們部裡的他們單位同仁做了很多原住民相關的這個數據的研究統計所以現在我也謝謝衛福部那個勞動部就是特別在受到那樣的刺激之後發憤圖強"},{"start":646.761,"end":673.475,"text":"很主動的把所有原住民相關的勞工問題一些數據全部都研究得一清二楚那帶動整個勞動部下鄉或者不只下鄉都會去有原住民的地方他們就都也會跟我們請教說哪裡可以真的找到比較多的原住民可以做有效的宣導所以他們也沒有再到工地去發DVD做宣導了"},{"start":674.595,"end":695.021,"text":"所以錯誤的宣導方式跟這個地點這個都是要注意的所以我希望今天這個質詢呢可以給你們一些良善的刺激那也希望你們可以效法一下這個勞動部當初那位安研所的同仁因為後來他也升官了也不錯所以我想在這邊給你們勉勵謝謝好謝謝陳穎委員的發言接下來請牛徐廷委員"}]}}}}