{"id":151733,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151733","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/37a05b44d500ce15170e4179158d32dac97d93183120460dc68e374cd8c4bed095bd5f1704c9299c5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"涂權吉","委員發言時間":"10:12:15 - 10:25:12","影片長度":"00:12:57","會議時間":"2024-04-25T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長、法務部、原住民族委員會、內政部、衛生福利部就「就業服務法上路逾三十年，針對就業促進、歧視禁止、外國勞動力權益保障等面向進行全面檢視」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n【4月22日、24日及25日三天一次會】）","date":"2024-04-25","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":13,"committees":[26],"id":"委員會-11-1-26-13"},"duration":777,"end_time":"2024-04-25T10:25:12+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-25T10:12:15+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":507,"blocks":[["涂委員權吉：（10時12分）謝謝主席。再麻煩請許部長。"],["主席：請許部長。"],["許部長銘春：涂委員好。"],["涂委員權吉：許部長，4月15日我們在立法院召開記者會，因為在移民署於今年3月介入調查後，將兩位肯亞籍專業表演人士鑑別為人口販運被害人。部長知道這個案子嗎？"],["許部長銘春：我知道，我們有掌握，而且我們在第一時間就有掌握了。"],["涂委員權吉：當初在引進時是以白領移工，也就是專業表演的藝術人才引進，後來才發現，在他們來到後，就被仲介帶到臺南某個遊樂場工作，還被帶到桃園的一個農場無償勞動，甚至被仲介逼迫，借錢度日。雖然這兩個肯亞籍外勞有打電話向1955投訴，可是臺南市府派員去查卻查無不法。針對這部分，不知道部長有沒有什麼看法？"],["許部長銘春：我覺得可能對工作內容沒有很詳細去核對，這部分他們應該要再……"],["涂委員權吉：但以我們所看到的來說，當初仲介是以運動藝術專業表演人員、白領移工引入，可是來到後，做的卻是藍領工作，與工作項目不符合。"],["許部長銘春：也就是從事許可以外的工作。"],["涂委員權吉：對，從事許可以外的工作。"],["許部長銘春：這是違法的！"],["涂委員權吉：對。後來我們才發現，這所謂的白領移工、表演藝術人員居然沒有最低工資保障！是不是這樣？"],["蔡署長孟良：跟委員報告，他其實有達到最低工資，只是外界質疑白領用最低工資……"],["涂委員權吉：白領是四萬多，對不對？"],["蔡署長孟良：跟委員報告，以四萬多來說，目前在法律上是像工程師之類的；至於表演藝術工作，依照文化部現在所定的資格，它不是以薪資，而是以專業……"],["涂委員權吉：我們要凸顯的是，由於沒有最低工資的保障，所以其實他領的錢非常得少，但是居然沒有違法！"],["蔡署長孟良：跟委員報告，他還是要符合最低基本工資，他還是符合的。"],["涂委員權吉：但是沒有符合最低白領的基本工資，是不是這樣？"],["許部長銘春：他不是屬於專技人員的白領，如果是專技人員的白領要四萬多。按照文化部規定，他是以演藝表演的專業資格進來的，並沒有要求說要給到四萬多。不過一定要給到基本工資，不然……"],["涂委員權吉：就是最低的基本工資，但低於一般白領的基本工資，是不是這樣？"],["許部長銘春：對。"],["涂委員權吉：沒關係。在4月15日的記者會上，兩位肯亞人士親自現身說法，針對這部分，我們來看一下記者會上所提出的違法情事。就像剛剛部長所說，他從事許可外的工作，所以違反就業服務法；而且強迫勞動，違反了勞基法；未投保勞保，違反了勞工保險條例；也沒有投保健保，違反了全民健保法；而且沒有提繳退休金，違反勞工退休條例；不僅如此，還扣留他的護照，所以違反人口販運防制法，也是違反我們的法令！最主要的是，限制人身自由，這其實已經觸及刑法！我想請問部長，針對他們在記者會上所陳述的這些事項若都屬實，且違反了這麼多法令的話，部長，你覺得這問題嚴重嗎？"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，當然嚴重，一共違反了七項！我們一條一條去檢視其行為，該依法處理、依法裁罰，甚至有刑責問題的，都必須一一處理！"],["涂委員權吉：我們又發現另外一個問題，因為他有打1955申訴，臺南市勞工局也派員稽查、檢查，結果居然回復說雇主無指派許可外工作，這就是查緝的結果。針對這部分，移民署其實已經證實是許可外工作，不過臺南市勞工局仍說沒有強迫勞動，且有給付基本工資。依據兩位肯亞人的說明是，連基本工資都沒有領到，移民署也證實護照確實被扣留，不知道為什麼臺南市勞工局稽查後會說，護照是自行保管？針對以上各點，不知道勞發署與職安署到底有沒有介入調查？"],["許部長銘春：跟委員說明，這個案子我們有跟臺南市勞工局聯繫，他們現在也在做業務檢討。譬如查訪結果，為什麼會跟兩位肯亞籍人士後來所講的不一致？所以訪查技巧、訪查方式應該怎麼精進？這些我認為他們應該再做處理。"],["涂委員權吉：這件事對我們來講也很不可思議！他已經打1955求救了，而勞工局也去稽查，也碰到這兩位，沒想到稽查結果是完全合法，完全沒有違法事項！針對這部分問題，我希望勞動部要重視……"],["許部長銘春：我們會持續來關注這個案子。"],["涂委員權吉：這兩個肯亞人根本就是假白領真藍領！目前有八萬多的逃逸外勞，卻一直看不到勞動部提出完善的改善計畫。說實在話，我們當初就講引進印度移工等等固然是為了解決國內的勞工問題，但針對印度移工的文化、語言、生活差異，還有男尊女卑等等的觀念差異，我覺得勞動部應該要提出完善的計畫，不然我擔心一旦大量引進印度移工，到時候反而造成更多外勞逃逸！"],["許部長銘春：會，這個我們會謹慎，也會持續召開諮詢會議，就這些大家所關注的議題跟大家對話，並瞭解後續及相關需求該怎麼做，這些我們都會好好來規劃處理。"],["涂委員權吉：當然，許部長這幾年來很辛苦，不知後續新任的部長何佩珊上來之後，有沒有辦法接續並處理這些業務？"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，應該沒有問題，以他的能力跟經驗，我想他一定可以把後續的一些工作……因為有些工作都是持續的，我想何部長沒有問題。"],["涂委員權吉：我還是要請部長去瞭解一下，其實我們昨天還打電話給勞發署，詢問兩位肯亞人的後續處理問題，但勞發署好像沒有聯繫當事人，也沒有針對4月15日勞團在記者會上所提出的違法事項一一去查核，看他們說的到底是不是屬實？我想這部分勞動部真的還是要去瞭解一下。而且我們認為後續針對這些白領的部分是不是可以抽打電話來查詢，瞭解他有沒有在許可外的工作，我認為這些工作應該不難，我們應該去抽查、去瞭解實際的狀況。"],["蔡署長孟良：跟委員報告，第一、我們第一時間馬上跟勞工局、移民署、專勤隊介入這個個案，而且馬上進入安置保護階段，因為他是人口販運被害人，所以後續整個的協助，我們會全程來處理；第二、就是剛剛委員提到的，他所涉及的每一個違法行為，我們現在已經請勞工局每一項去查證，查證屬實之後，我們就依法來裁罰；最後就是預防，因為勞團有提到未來會不會有這種假白領、真藍領，我們內部現在在整合，要建立一些預防跟未來的管控機制，相關的高風險對象，當然我們會提高審查。"],["涂委員權吉：好，我希望這部分還是要多重視一下。還有針對現在的基本工資，很多的工會、勞工朋友跟我們說，當然蔡英文政府基本工資連六年調漲，可是據我們瞭解……"],["許部長銘春：連八年。"],["涂委員權吉：沒關係，重點是基本工資雖然連續調漲，可是後來我們瞭解勞工整體的實質薪資好像並沒有因為基本工調漲而調漲，也就是說薪資在調漲，但是物價上漲的幅度卻超過調薪的幅度，所以基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲好像是有出入的，並沒有帶動我們整體的生活，也就是實質薪資並沒有跟著基本工資去做調漲。"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，因為實質薪資主要是因為這幾年疫情還有俄烏戰爭、以哈戰爭這些國際因素、經濟情勢，造成物價通膨，當然會讓大家感受好像薪資追不上物價的速度，但是勞動部對於弱勢勞工、邊際勞工的最低工資，我們是持續的在提升，希望保障他最低的經濟生活，也希望這樣能夠帶動一般薪資提升，呼籲企業能夠跟勞工分享經濟果實。"],["涂委員權吉：所以基本工資的調漲也是希望帶動實質經常性薪資調漲，也希望讓勞工的生活可以過得更好，可是後來有很多勞工朋友跟我們陳情，因為沒有脫鉤的問題，他們說基本工資的調漲其實幾乎都是在調漲移工的工資，我們本勞的薪資可以說一、二十年幾乎都沒有調漲，因為他們領的並不是基本工資，領取基本工資的幾乎都是移工，所以變成基本工資的調漲一直都是調到移工工資，對於本勞薪資的調漲並沒有實質上的幫助。"],["許部長銘春：報告委員，我可以把數據給你，我們每年調升基本工資，本國人受益的就有兩百萬人以上，這個我可以給你。事實上法律並沒有規定移工進來要用基本工資聘他，其實是本外勞一致原則、平等對待原則，照理說他做的工作如果跟本國勞工一樣，應該是一樣的待遇，只是說大家用基本工資，那不能說基本工資只調到移工。"],["涂委員權吉：所以，部長，你也稍微瞭解一下，因為根據我們這個數據，你看基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲是有差異的，你說連八年基本工資調漲，可是實質經常性的薪資的調幅從110年到112年不但沒有漲，反而是調降的，所以這一部分，我希望勞動部重視，去瞭解一下。"],["許部長銘春：好，謝謝。"],["主席（黃委員秀芳）：謝謝涂權吉委員。","現在宣告：在蘇清泉委員質詢結束後休息10分鐘。","現在請王正旭委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":424,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-26-13","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","林月琴","王育敏","陳菁徽","邱鎮軍","涂權吉","王正旭","蘇清泉","鄭天財Sra 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\"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"實\"}, {\"word\": \"質\"}, {\"word\": \"薪\", \"start\": 746.274, \"end\": 746.394, \"score\": 0.781}, {\"word\": \"資\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 746.394, \"end\": 746.414, \"score\": 0.22}, {\"word\": \"調\"}, {\"word\": \"漲\"}, {\"word\": \"齁\"}, {\"word\": \"好\", \"start\": 754.48, \"end\": 754.54, \"score\": 0.664}, {\"word\": \",\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"圖\"}, {\"word\": \"全\", \"start\": 754.54, \"end\": 754.64, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"集\", \"start\": 754.64, \"end\": 754.72, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 754.72, \"end\": 754.74, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"。\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:13,133 --> 00:00:15,974\n好,謝謝主席那再麻煩請我們許部長有請許部長\n\n2\n00:00:22,914 --> 00:00:48,033\n徐部長在4月15日我們在立法院有開了一個記者會就是有關於有兩位肯亞籍的專業表演人士那因為被我們移民署介入調查在今年3月的時候他已經被鑑別為人口販運被害人那這個案子不知道部長知道這個案子嗎我知道我們有掌握我們第一時間就有掌握了\n\n3\n00:00:48,693 --> 00:01:05,333\n對,因為這個部分我們是覺得說他當初他是在被引進的時候是以百里以公是我們的專業表演的藝術人才然後後來我們才發現事實上他來到的時候都常常被仲介帶到\n\n4\n00:01:06,454 --> 00:01:35,894\n像也帶到臺南的某個遊樂場去從事遊樂工作後來也被帶到我們桃園有一個農場去無償做勞動而且甚至還被仲介逼迫然後借錢度日那當然後來這兩個肯亞籍外勞也有打電話投訴到1955然後可是臺南市府派員去查去查無不法那不知道針對這一部分部長有沒有什麼看法\n\n5\n00:01:38,369 --> 00:02:02,547\n可是看到的是他當初仲介來是以運動藝術專業表演人白領移工可是他來到卻是做我們藍領的工作而且跟他的工作其實根本是不符合的\n\n6\n00:02:03,027 --> 00:02:15,204\n對,從事許可以外的工作這是違法的對,後來我們才發現居然這個百里移工他這個表演藝術人居然沒有最低工資的保障\n\n7\n00:02:16,744 --> 00:02:42,270\n是不是這樣?有嗎?跟委員報告他其實是有達到最低工資只是說這個最低工資外界質疑說白領用最低工資白領是4萬多嘛對不對?跟委員報告因為4萬多現在目前在法律上是像類似工程師啊類似那表演藝術工作依照文化部現在所定的資格他不是以薪資他是以他的專業我們要凸顯這部分就是說他沒有最低工資的保障\n\n8\n00:02:43,030 --> 00:02:55,464\n所以其實他領的錢非常的少但是居然沒有違法他還是要符合最低基本工資他還是符合的沒有符合最低白領的基本工資嘛是不是這樣\n\n9\n00:02:57,927 --> 00:03:15,634\n他不是屬於專技人員的白領啊。如果專技人員白領要4萬多嘛。那他按照文化部他是屬於演藝表演這種專業資格進來的。他沒有像那個要求說要給到4萬多,但是他一定要給到基本工資。就是最低的基本工資。對。\n\n10\n00:03:17,114 --> 00:03:43,920\n低於一般白領的基本工資嗎?是不是這樣?對啦應該應該好沒關係那我們針對這一部分我們想了解一下那如果像4月15號那一天記者會因為兩位肯亞人士也親自現身說法那我們來看一下針對他這一部分我們看一下我們針對他提出在記者會提出的違法情勢跳下一頁\n\n11\n00:03:45,360 --> 00:04:11,853\n針對這部分就像剛剛部長有提他在許可外工作那就違反了我們就業服務法而且他是強迫勞動又違反了我們的勞基法然後他也未投保勞保那違反了我們勞工保險條例也沒有投保健保那也違反了全民健保法而且他也沒有提繳退休金那針對我們勞工退休條例也是違反了\n\n12\n00:04:12,333 --> 00:04:39,568\n而且他這一部分還是被扣留了他的護照那在我們人口販運防治法也是違反我們的法令而且最主要他還限制他的人身自由那其實已經觸及到刑法那我想請問一下部長針對這以上他們記者會所陳述這些事實如果屬實的話你看看他違反了這麼多法令那針對這部分部長覺得嚴重嗎?\n\n13\n00:04:41,289 --> 00:04:44,092\n我們台南市的勞工局居然去稽查、檢查\n\n14\n00:05:08,332 --> 00:05:22,550\n回覆．他的回覆居然是說顧主無只派許可外工作．他去查緝的結果．所以他針對這部分．而且移民署已經證實他這是許可外工作．還有他也．\n\n15\n00:05:23,834 --> 00:05:49,927\n台南勞工局也說他沒有強迫勞動而且有給付基本工資可是依據肯亞他們說明他連基本工資都沒有領到然後移民署也證實他這個護照確實被扣留可是不知道為什麼台南勞工局去稽查說他的護照是自行保管良好那針對以上我不知道我們勞發署跟治安署這一部分到底有沒有去介入調查\n\n16\n00:05:50,267 --> 00:05:51,248\n所以我覺得這個事情其實\n\n17\n00:06:14,803 --> 00:06:33,693\n對我們來講我們覺得不可思議他已經打1955去求救了結果勞工局也去稽查也碰到他們兩位居然稽查的結果是說完全都合法完全沒有違法的事項所以我們針對這部分我希望勞動部要重視這兩個肯亞根本就是假白領、真藍領\n\n18\n00:06:38,075 --> 00:06:53,265\n那而且我們一直說我們現在針對目前有8萬多的逃逸外勞我一直也看不到勞動部提出一個完善的改善計畫而且針對這一部分我們現在說實在話那時候我們也有講\n\n19\n00:06:54,285 --> 00:07:21,558\n當然引進印度移工等等當然是因為解決我們國內勞工的問題但是我真的希望我們針對印度移工的部分在文化、語言、生活差異還有男尊女卑等等的觀念差異之下我覺得應該要提出一個完善的計畫不然我擔心這個印度移工大量的引進到時候反而造成更多的逃逸的外勞\n\n20\n00:07:23,559 --> 00:07:50,828\n會這個我們會謹慎那我們也會持續的開這個諮詢會議就這些大家所關注的議題跟大家對話那也了解後續的部分大家有一些需求要怎麼做這個我們都會好好來規劃處理對我也希望我們當然我們許部長這幾年來也很辛苦但是我也知道說我們後續新任部長何沛山那不知道他上來之後有沒有辦法接續這些業務去做處理\n\n21\n00:07:52,688 --> 00:08:02,968\n報告委應該沒有問題啦以他的能力跟經驗我想他一定可以把後續的一些工作因為有些工作都是持續的嘛我想何部長這沒有問題\n\n22\n00:08:04,298 --> 00:08:14,770\n那我請部長還是要去了解一下因為在這之前我們昨天其實還針對打電話給勞發署去詢問針對這後續這肯亞的問題我們問好像勞發署也沒有去聯繫這個當事人然後也沒有去查核這4月15日\n\n23\n00:08:25,602 --> 00:08:40,393\n這個勞團記者會他所開的所提出的違法事項有沒有去一一去查核他們說的到底是不是屬實那我希望這部分勞動部真的還是要去了解一下而且我們認為後續是不是\n\n24\n00:08:41,554 --> 00:08:54,468\n針對這些白領的部分我們是不是可以抽打這個電話來查詢然後瞭解他是不是有沒有在許可外的工作我認為這些工作應該不難我覺得我們應該要去抽查去了解這實際的狀況\n\n25\n00:08:56,070 --> 00:09:09,866\n是不是跟委員報告,我們第一個時間這個個案馬上跟勞工局還有專勤隊、移民署專勤隊其實就立刻去介入而且馬上進入到我們的安置保護現在因為他是人口關係被害的人,所以後續整個的一些協助我們會全程來處理\n\n26\n00:09:10,987 --> 00:09:11,607\n好,我希望這一部分還是要多重視一下\n\n27\n00:09:39,930 --> 00:09:58,996\n還有針對我們現在我們基本的工資那有很多的工會勞工朋友有在跟我們提起他說當然我們蔡英文政府針對這幾年說基本工資連6年調漲可是據我們瞭解這基本工資連8年調漲沒關係重點是基本工資這連續的調漲可是後來我們瞭解他整體勞工\n\n28\n00:10:09,700 --> 00:10:33,006\n勞工這個整體的實質薪資好像並不是因為基本工資調漲而去做調漲也就是說這個薪資在調漲但是我們的物價上漲卻是超過這個幅度所以基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲好像是有出入的並沒有帶動我們整體的生活也就是實質薪資並沒有跟著基本工資去做調漲\n\n29\n00:10:33,917 --> 00:10:51,033\n報告委員,因為實質薪資它主要是因為這幾年因為疫情還有俄烏戰爭、以哈戰爭這些國際因素、經濟情勢造成物價通膨這個當然會讓大家感受說好像薪資追不上物價的速度\n\n30\n00:10:51,713 --> 00:11:15,388\n但是持續來提升以勞動部負責我們是弱勢勞工、邊境勞工他的最低工資我們是持續的在提升希望保障他的這個最低的這個保障經濟生活的保障那也希望這樣能夠帶動一般的薪資能夠提升然後經濟果實呼籲企業經濟果實能夠供\n\n31\n00:11:17,469 --> 00:11:32,971\n所以我們基本工資的調漲也是希望帶動我們實質經常性的薪資能夠去做這個調漲也希望說讓我們勞工的生活可以過得更好可是後來有很多勞工朋友跟我們來陳情就是說因為\n\n32\n00:11:34,552 --> 00:11:58,961\n這個沒有脫鉤的問題他說基本工資的調漲其實幾乎都是調漲在我們的移工我們的本勞他說他們可以說是一二十年的薪資幾乎都沒有調漲他說因為他們領的並不是基本工資基本工資領取幾乎大部分都是移工所以變成說基本工資的調漲他說都是一直調到這個移工對於本勞的調漲並沒有實質上的幫助\n\n33\n00:12:01,182 --> 00:12:18,008\n我可以把數據給你我們每年調升基本工資本國人受益的數字就有兩百萬以上這個我可以給你那事實上法律並沒有規定移工進來要用基本工資聘他他其實進來本外勞\n\n34\n00:12:19,188 --> 00:12:26,414\n一致原則平等對待人的照理說他做的工作如果跟本國一樣應該是一樣的待遇所以部長你也你也稍微瞭解一下對對因為根據我們這數據齁你看這基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲齁\n\n35\n00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:34,740\n好,謝謝圖全集委員。\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n13133\t15974\t好,謝謝主席那再麻煩請我們許部長有請許部長\n22914\t48033\t徐部長在4月15日我們在立法院有開了一個記者會就是有關於有兩位肯亞籍的專業表演人士那因為被我們移民署介入調查在今年3月的時候他已經被鑑別為人口販運被害人那這個案子不知道部長知道這個案子嗎我知道我們有掌握我們第一時間就有掌握了\n48693\t65333\t對,因為這個部分我們是覺得說他當初他是在被引進的時候是以百里以公是我們的專業表演的藝術人才然後後來我們才發現事實上他來到的時候都常常被仲介帶到\n66454\t95894\t像也帶到臺南的某個遊樂場去從事遊樂工作後來也被帶到我們桃園有一個農場去無償做勞動而且甚至還被仲介逼迫然後借錢度日那當然後來這兩個肯亞籍外勞也有打電話投訴到1955然後可是臺南市府派員去查去查無不法那不知道針對這一部分部長有沒有什麼看法\n98369\t122547\t可是看到的是他當初仲介來是以運動藝術專業表演人白領移工可是他來到卻是做我們藍領的工作而且跟他的工作其實根本是不符合的\n123027\t135204\t對,從事許可以外的工作這是違法的對,後來我們才發現居然這個百里移工他這個表演藝術人居然沒有最低工資的保障\n136744\t162270\t是不是這樣?有嗎?跟委員報告他其實是有達到最低工資只是說這個最低工資外界質疑說白領用最低工資白領是4萬多嘛對不對?跟委員報告因為4萬多現在目前在法律上是像類似工程師啊類似那表演藝術工作依照文化部現在所定的資格他不是以薪資他是以他的專業我們要凸顯這部分就是說他沒有最低工資的保障\n163030\t175464\t所以其實他領的錢非常的少但是居然沒有違法他還是要符合最低基本工資他還是符合的沒有符合最低白領的基本工資嘛是不是這樣\n177927\t195634\t他不是屬於專技人員的白領啊。如果專技人員白領要4萬多嘛。那他按照文化部他是屬於演藝表演這種專業資格進來的。他沒有像那個要求說要給到4萬多,但是他一定要給到基本工資。就是最低的基本工資。對。\n197114\t223920\t低於一般白領的基本工資嗎?是不是這樣?對啦應該應該好沒關係那我們針對這一部分我們想了解一下那如果像4月15號那一天記者會因為兩位肯亞人士也親自現身說法那我們來看一下針對他這一部分我們看一下我們針對他提出在記者會提出的違法情勢跳下一頁\n225360\t251853\t針對這部分就像剛剛部長有提他在許可外工作那就違反了我們就業服務法而且他是強迫勞動又違反了我們的勞基法然後他也未投保勞保那違反了我們勞工保險條例也沒有投保健保那也違反了全民健保法而且他也沒有提繳退休金那針對我們勞工退休條例也是違反了\n252333\t279568\t而且他這一部分還是被扣留了他的護照那在我們人口販運防治法也是違反我們的法令而且最主要他還限制他的人身自由那其實已經觸及到刑法那我想請問一下部長針對這以上他們記者會所陳述這些事實如果屬實的話你看看他違反了這麼多法令那針對這部分部長覺得嚴重嗎?\n281289\t284092\t我們台南市的勞工局居然去稽查、檢查\n308332\t322550\t回覆．他的回覆居然是說顧主無只派許可外工作．他去查緝的結果．所以他針對這部分．而且移民署已經證實他這是許可外工作．還有他也．\n323834\t349927\t台南勞工局也說他沒有強迫勞動而且有給付基本工資可是依據肯亞他們說明他連基本工資都沒有領到然後移民署也證實他這個護照確實被扣留可是不知道為什麼台南勞工局去稽查說他的護照是自行保管良好那針對以上我不知道我們勞發署跟治安署這一部分到底有沒有去介入調查\n350267\t351248\t所以我覺得這個事情其實\n374803\t393693\t對我們來講我們覺得不可思議他已經打1955去求救了結果勞工局也去稽查也碰到他們兩位居然稽查的結果是說完全都合法完全沒有違法的事項所以我們針對這部分我希望勞動部要重視這兩個肯亞根本就是假白領、真藍領\n398075\t413265\t那而且我們一直說我們現在針對目前有8萬多的逃逸外勞我一直也看不到勞動部提出一個完善的改善計畫而且針對這一部分我們現在說實在話那時候我們也有講\n414285\t441558\t當然引進印度移工等等當然是因為解決我們國內勞工的問題但是我真的希望我們針對印度移工的部分在文化、語言、生活差異還有男尊女卑等等的觀念差異之下我覺得應該要提出一個完善的計畫不然我擔心這個印度移工大量的引進到時候反而造成更多的逃逸的外勞\n443559\t470828\t會 這個我們會謹慎那我們也會持續的開這個諮詢會議就這些大家所關注的議題跟大家對話那也了解後續的部分大家有一些需求要怎麼做這個我們都會好好來規劃處理對 我也希望我們當然我們許部長這幾年來也很辛苦但是我也知道說我們後續新任部長何沛山那不知道他上來之後有沒有辦法接續這些業務去做處理\n472688\t482968\t報告委應該沒有問題啦以他的能力跟經驗我想他一定可以把後續的一些工作因為有些工作都是持續的嘛我想何部長這沒有問題\n484298\t494770\t那我請部長還是要去了解一下因為在這之前我們昨天其實還針對打電話給勞發署去詢問針對這後續這肯亞的問題我們問好像勞發署也沒有去聯繫這個當事人然後也沒有去查核這4月15日\n505602\t520393\t這個勞團記者會他所開的所提出的違法事項有沒有去一一去查核他們說的到底是不是屬實那我希望這部分勞動部真的還是要去了解一下而且我們認為後續是不是\n521554\t534468\t針對這些白領的部分我們是不是可以抽打這個電話來查詢然後瞭解他是不是有沒有在許可外的工作我認為這些工作應該不難我覺得我們應該要去抽查去了解這實際的狀況\n536070\t549866\t是不是跟委員報告,我們第一個時間這個個案馬上跟勞工局還有專勤隊、移民署專勤隊其實就立刻去介入而且馬上進入到我們的安置保護現在因為他是人口關係被害的人,所以後續整個的一些協助我們會全程來處理\n550987\t551607\t好,我希望這一部分還是要多重視一下\n579930\t598996\t還有針對我們現在我們基本的工資那有很多的工會勞工朋友有在跟我們提起他說當然我們蔡英文政府針對這幾年說基本工資連6年調漲可是據我們瞭解這基本工資連8年調漲沒關係重點是基本工資這連續的調漲可是後來我們瞭解他整體勞工\n609700\t633006\t勞工這個整體的實質薪資好像並不是因為基本工資調漲而去做調漲也就是說這個薪資在調漲但是我們的物價上漲卻是超過這個幅度所以基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲好像是有出入的並沒有帶動我們整體的生活也就是實質薪資並沒有跟著基本工資去做調漲\n633917\t651033\t報告委員,因為實質薪資它主要是因為這幾年因為疫情還有俄烏戰爭、以哈戰爭這些國際因素、經濟情勢造成物價通膨這個當然會讓大家感受說好像薪資追不上物價的速度\n651713\t675388\t但是持續來提升以勞動部負責我們是弱勢勞工、邊境勞工他的最低工資我們是持續的在提升希望保障他的這個最低的這個保障經濟生活的保障那也希望這樣能夠帶動一般的薪資能夠提升然後經濟果實呼籲企業經濟果實能夠供\n677469\t692971\t所以我們基本工資的調漲也是希望帶動我們實質經常性的薪資能夠去做這個調漲也希望說讓我們勞工的生活可以過得更好可是後來有很多勞工朋友跟我們來陳情就是說因為\n694552\t718961\t這個沒有脫鉤的問題他說基本工資的調漲其實幾乎都是調漲在我們的移工我們的本勞他說他們可以說是一二十年的薪資幾乎都沒有調漲他說因為他們領的並不是基本工資基本工資領取幾乎大部分都是移工所以變成說基本工資的調漲他說都是一直調到這個移工對於本勞的調漲並沒有實質上的幫助\n721182\t738008\t我可以把數據給你我們每年調升基本工資本國人受益的數字就有兩百萬以上這個我可以給你那事實上法律並沒有規定移工進來要用基本工資聘他他其實進來本外勞\n739188\t746414\t一致原則平等對待人的照理說他做的工作如果跟本國一樣應該是一樣的待遇所以部長你也你也稍微瞭解一下對對因為根據我們這數據齁你看這基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲齁\n754480\t754740\t好,謝謝圖全集委員。\n","txt":"好,謝謝主席那再麻煩請我們許部長有請許部長\n徐部長在4月15日我們在立法院有開了一個記者會就是有關於有兩位肯亞籍的專業表演人士那因為被我們移民署介入調查在今年3月的時候他已經被鑑別為人口販運被害人那這個案子不知道部長知道這個案子嗎我知道我們有掌握我們第一時間就有掌握了\n對,因為這個部分我們是覺得說他當初他是在被引進的時候是以百里以公是我們的專業表演的藝術人才然後後來我們才發現事實上他來到的時候都常常被仲介帶到\n像也帶到臺南的某個遊樂場去從事遊樂工作後來也被帶到我們桃園有一個農場去無償做勞動而且甚至還被仲介逼迫然後借錢度日那當然後來這兩個肯亞籍外勞也有打電話投訴到1955然後可是臺南市府派員去查去查無不法那不知道針對這一部分部長有沒有什麼看法\n可是看到的是他當初仲介來是以運動藝術專業表演人白領移工可是他來到卻是做我們藍領的工作而且跟他的工作其實根本是不符合的\n對,從事許可以外的工作這是違法的對,後來我們才發現居然這個百里移工他這個表演藝術人居然沒有最低工資的保障\n是不是這樣?有嗎?跟委員報告他其實是有達到最低工資只是說這個最低工資外界質疑說白領用最低工資白領是4萬多嘛對不對?跟委員報告因為4萬多現在目前在法律上是像類似工程師啊類似那表演藝術工作依照文化部現在所定的資格他不是以薪資他是以他的專業我們要凸顯這部分就是說他沒有最低工資的保障\n所以其實他領的錢非常的少但是居然沒有違法他還是要符合最低基本工資他還是符合的沒有符合最低白領的基本工資嘛是不是這樣\n他不是屬於專技人員的白領啊。如果專技人員白領要4萬多嘛。那他按照文化部他是屬於演藝表演這種專業資格進來的。他沒有像那個要求說要給到4萬多,但是他一定要給到基本工資。就是最低的基本工資。對。\n低於一般白領的基本工資嗎?是不是這樣?對啦應該應該好沒關係那我們針對這一部分我們想了解一下那如果像4月15號那一天記者會因為兩位肯亞人士也親自現身說法那我們來看一下針對他這一部分我們看一下我們針對他提出在記者會提出的違法情勢跳下一頁\n針對這部分就像剛剛部長有提他在許可外工作那就違反了我們就業服務法而且他是強迫勞動又違反了我們的勞基法然後他也未投保勞保那違反了我們勞工保險條例也沒有投保健保那也違反了全民健保法而且他也沒有提繳退休金那針對我們勞工退休條例也是違反了\n而且他這一部分還是被扣留了他的護照那在我們人口販運防治法也是違反我們的法令而且最主要他還限制他的人身自由那其實已經觸及到刑法那我想請問一下部長針對這以上他們記者會所陳述這些事實如果屬實的話你看看他違反了這麼多法令那針對這部分部長覺得嚴重嗎?\n我們台南市的勞工局居然去稽查、檢查\n回覆．他的回覆居然是說顧主無只派許可外工作．他去查緝的結果．所以他針對這部分．而且移民署已經證實他這是許可外工作．還有他也．\n台南勞工局也說他沒有強迫勞動而且有給付基本工資可是依據肯亞他們說明他連基本工資都沒有領到然後移民署也證實他這個護照確實被扣留可是不知道為什麼台南勞工局去稽查說他的護照是自行保管良好那針對以上我不知道我們勞發署跟治安署這一部分到底有沒有去介入調查\n所以我覺得這個事情其實\n對我們來講我們覺得不可思議他已經打1955去求救了結果勞工局也去稽查也碰到他們兩位居然稽查的結果是說完全都合法完全沒有違法的事項所以我們針對這部分我希望勞動部要重視這兩個肯亞根本就是假白領、真藍領\n那而且我們一直說我們現在針對目前有8萬多的逃逸外勞我一直也看不到勞動部提出一個完善的改善計畫而且針對這一部分我們現在說實在話那時候我們也有講\n當然引進印度移工等等當然是因為解決我們國內勞工的問題但是我真的希望我們針對印度移工的部分在文化、語言、生活差異還有男尊女卑等等的觀念差異之下我覺得應該要提出一個完善的計畫不然我擔心這個印度移工大量的引進到時候反而造成更多的逃逸的外勞\n會 這個我們會謹慎那我們也會持續的開這個諮詢會議就這些大家所關注的議題跟大家對話那也了解後續的部分大家有一些需求要怎麼做這個我們都會好好來規劃處理對 我也希望我們當然我們許部長這幾年來也很辛苦但是我也知道說我們後續新任部長何沛山那不知道他上來之後有沒有辦法接續這些業務去做處理\n報告委應該沒有問題啦以他的能力跟經驗我想他一定可以把後續的一些工作因為有些工作都是持續的嘛我想何部長這沒有問題\n那我請部長還是要去了解一下因為在這之前我們昨天其實還針對打電話給勞發署去詢問針對這後續這肯亞的問題我們問好像勞發署也沒有去聯繫這個當事人然後也沒有去查核這4月15日\n這個勞團記者會他所開的所提出的違法事項有沒有去一一去查核他們說的到底是不是屬實那我希望這部分勞動部真的還是要去了解一下而且我們認為後續是不是\n針對這些白領的部分我們是不是可以抽打這個電話來查詢然後瞭解他是不是有沒有在許可外的工作我認為這些工作應該不難我覺得我們應該要去抽查去了解這實際的狀況\n是不是跟委員報告,我們第一個時間這個個案馬上跟勞工局還有專勤隊、移民署專勤隊其實就立刻去介入而且馬上進入到我們的安置保護現在因為他是人口關係被害的人,所以後續整個的一些協助我們會全程來處理\n好,我希望這一部分還是要多重視一下\n還有針對我們現在我們基本的工資那有很多的工會勞工朋友有在跟我們提起他說當然我們蔡英文政府針對這幾年說基本工資連6年調漲可是據我們瞭解這基本工資連8年調漲沒關係重點是基本工資這連續的調漲可是後來我們瞭解他整體勞工\n勞工這個整體的實質薪資好像並不是因為基本工資調漲而去做調漲也就是說這個薪資在調漲但是我們的物價上漲卻是超過這個幅度所以基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲好像是有出入的並沒有帶動我們整體的生活也就是實質薪資並沒有跟著基本工資去做調漲\n報告委員,因為實質薪資它主要是因為這幾年因為疫情還有俄烏戰爭、以哈戰爭這些國際因素、經濟情勢造成物價通膨這個當然會讓大家感受說好像薪資追不上物價的速度\n但是持續來提升以勞動部負責我們是弱勢勞工、邊境勞工他的最低工資我們是持續的在提升希望保障他的這個最低的這個保障經濟生活的保障那也希望這樣能夠帶動一般的薪資能夠提升然後經濟果實呼籲企業經濟果實能夠供\n所以我們基本工資的調漲也是希望帶動我們實質經常性的薪資能夠去做這個調漲也希望說讓我們勞工的生活可以過得更好可是後來有很多勞工朋友跟我們來陳情就是說因為\n這個沒有脫鉤的問題他說基本工資的調漲其實幾乎都是調漲在我們的移工我們的本勞他說他們可以說是一二十年的薪資幾乎都沒有調漲他說因為他們領的並不是基本工資基本工資領取幾乎大部分都是移工所以變成說基本工資的調漲他說都是一直調到這個移工對於本勞的調漲並沒有實質上的幫助\n我可以把數據給你我們每年調升基本工資本國人受益的數字就有兩百萬以上這個我可以給你那事實上法律並沒有規定移工進來要用基本工資聘他他其實進來本外勞\n一致原則平等對待人的照理說他做的工作如果跟本國一樣應該是一樣的待遇所以部長你也你也稍微瞭解一下對對因為根據我們這數據齁你看這基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲齁\n好,謝謝圖全集委員。\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:13.133 --> 00:15.974\n好,謝謝主席那再麻煩請我們許部長有請許部長\n\n00:22.914 --> 00:48.033\n徐部長在4月15日我們在立法院有開了一個記者會就是有關於有兩位肯亞籍的專業表演人士那因為被我們移民署介入調查在今年3月的時候他已經被鑑別為人口販運被害人那這個案子不知道部長知道這個案子嗎我知道我們有掌握我們第一時間就有掌握了\n\n00:48.693 --> 01:05.333\n對,因為這個部分我們是覺得說他當初他是在被引進的時候是以百里以公是我們的專業表演的藝術人才然後後來我們才發現事實上他來到的時候都常常被仲介帶到\n\n01:06.454 --> 01:35.894\n像也帶到臺南的某個遊樂場去從事遊樂工作後來也被帶到我們桃園有一個農場去無償做勞動而且甚至還被仲介逼迫然後借錢度日那當然後來這兩個肯亞籍外勞也有打電話投訴到1955然後可是臺南市府派員去查去查無不法那不知道針對這一部分部長有沒有什麼看法\n\n01:38.369 --> 02:02.547\n可是看到的是他當初仲介來是以運動藝術專業表演人白領移工可是他來到卻是做我們藍領的工作而且跟他的工作其實根本是不符合的\n\n02:03.027 --> 02:15.204\n對,從事許可以外的工作這是違法的對,後來我們才發現居然這個百里移工他這個表演藝術人居然沒有最低工資的保障\n\n02:16.744 --> 02:42.270\n是不是這樣?有嗎?跟委員報告他其實是有達到最低工資只是說這個最低工資外界質疑說白領用最低工資白領是4萬多嘛對不對?跟委員報告因為4萬多現在目前在法律上是像類似工程師啊類似那表演藝術工作依照文化部現在所定的資格他不是以薪資他是以他的專業我們要凸顯這部分就是說他沒有最低工資的保障\n\n02:43.030 --> 02:55.464\n所以其實他領的錢非常的少但是居然沒有違法他還是要符合最低基本工資他還是符合的沒有符合最低白領的基本工資嘛是不是這樣\n\n02:57.927 --> 03:15.634\n他不是屬於專技人員的白領啊。如果專技人員白領要4萬多嘛。那他按照文化部他是屬於演藝表演這種專業資格進來的。他沒有像那個要求說要給到4萬多,但是他一定要給到基本工資。就是最低的基本工資。對。\n\n03:17.114 --> 03:43.920\n低於一般白領的基本工資嗎?是不是這樣?對啦應該應該好沒關係那我們針對這一部分我們想了解一下那如果像4月15號那一天記者會因為兩位肯亞人士也親自現身說法那我們來看一下針對他這一部分我們看一下我們針對他提出在記者會提出的違法情勢跳下一頁\n\n03:45.360 --> 04:11.853\n針對這部分就像剛剛部長有提他在許可外工作那就違反了我們就業服務法而且他是強迫勞動又違反了我們的勞基法然後他也未投保勞保那違反了我們勞工保險條例也沒有投保健保那也違反了全民健保法而且他也沒有提繳退休金那針對我們勞工退休條例也是違反了\n\n04:12.333 --> 04:39.568\n而且他這一部分還是被扣留了他的護照那在我們人口販運防治法也是違反我們的法令而且最主要他還限制他的人身自由那其實已經觸及到刑法那我想請問一下部長針對這以上他們記者會所陳述這些事實如果屬實的話你看看他違反了這麼多法令那針對這部分部長覺得嚴重嗎?\n\n04:41.289 --> 04:44.092\n我們台南市的勞工局居然去稽查、檢查\n\n05:08.332 --> 05:22.550\n回覆．他的回覆居然是說顧主無只派許可外工作．他去查緝的結果．所以他針對這部分．而且移民署已經證實他這是許可外工作．還有他也．\n\n05:23.834 --> 05:49.927\n台南勞工局也說他沒有強迫勞動而且有給付基本工資可是依據肯亞他們說明他連基本工資都沒有領到然後移民署也證實他這個護照確實被扣留可是不知道為什麼台南勞工局去稽查說他的護照是自行保管良好那針對以上我不知道我們勞發署跟治安署這一部分到底有沒有去介入調查\n\n05:50.267 --> 05:51.248\n所以我覺得這個事情其實\n\n06:14.803 --> 06:33.693\n對我們來講我們覺得不可思議他已經打1955去求救了結果勞工局也去稽查也碰到他們兩位居然稽查的結果是說完全都合法完全沒有違法的事項所以我們針對這部分我希望勞動部要重視這兩個肯亞根本就是假白領、真藍領\n\n06:38.075 --> 06:53.265\n那而且我們一直說我們現在針對目前有8萬多的逃逸外勞我一直也看不到勞動部提出一個完善的改善計畫而且針對這一部分我們現在說實在話那時候我們也有講\n\n06:54.285 --> 07:21.558\n當然引進印度移工等等當然是因為解決我們國內勞工的問題但是我真的希望我們針對印度移工的部分在文化、語言、生活差異還有男尊女卑等等的觀念差異之下我覺得應該要提出一個完善的計畫不然我擔心這個印度移工大量的引進到時候反而造成更多的逃逸的外勞\n\n07:23.559 --> 07:50.828\n會這個我們會謹慎那我們也會持續的開這個諮詢會議就這些大家所關注的議題跟大家對話那也了解後續的部分大家有一些需求要怎麼做這個我們都會好好來規劃處理對我也希望我們當然我們許部長這幾年來也很辛苦但是我也知道說我們後續新任部長何沛山那不知道他上來之後有沒有辦法接續這些業務去做處理\n\n07:52.688 --> 08:02.968\n報告委應該沒有問題啦以他的能力跟經驗我想他一定可以把後續的一些工作因為有些工作都是持續的嘛我想何部長這沒有問題\n\n08:04.298 --> 08:14.770\n那我請部長還是要去了解一下因為在這之前我們昨天其實還針對打電話給勞發署去詢問針對這後續這肯亞的問題我們問好像勞發署也沒有去聯繫這個當事人然後也沒有去查核這4月15日\n\n08:25.602 --> 08:40.393\n這個勞團記者會他所開的所提出的違法事項有沒有去一一去查核他們說的到底是不是屬實那我希望這部分勞動部真的還是要去了解一下而且我們認為後續是不是\n\n08:41.554 --> 08:54.468\n針對這些白領的部分我們是不是可以抽打這個電話來查詢然後瞭解他是不是有沒有在許可外的工作我認為這些工作應該不難我覺得我們應該要去抽查去了解這實際的狀況\n\n08:56.070 --> 09:09.866\n是不是跟委員報告,我們第一個時間這個個案馬上跟勞工局還有專勤隊、移民署專勤隊其實就立刻去介入而且馬上進入到我們的安置保護現在因為他是人口關係被害的人,所以後續整個的一些協助我們會全程來處理\n\n09:10.987 --> 09:11.607\n好,我希望這一部分還是要多重視一下\n\n09:39.930 --> 09:58.996\n還有針對我們現在我們基本的工資那有很多的工會勞工朋友有在跟我們提起他說當然我們蔡英文政府針對這幾年說基本工資連6年調漲可是據我們瞭解這基本工資連8年調漲沒關係重點是基本工資這連續的調漲可是後來我們瞭解他整體勞工\n\n10:09.700 --> 10:33.006\n勞工這個整體的實質薪資好像並不是因為基本工資調漲而去做調漲也就是說這個薪資在調漲但是我們的物價上漲卻是超過這個幅度所以基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲好像是有出入的並沒有帶動我們整體的生活也就是實質薪資並沒有跟著基本工資去做調漲\n\n10:33.917 --> 10:51.033\n報告委員,因為實質薪資它主要是因為這幾年因為疫情還有俄烏戰爭、以哈戰爭這些國際因素、經濟情勢造成物價通膨這個當然會讓大家感受說好像薪資追不上物價的速度\n\n10:51.713 --> 11:15.388\n但是持續來提升以勞動部負責我們是弱勢勞工、邊境勞工他的最低工資我們是持續的在提升希望保障他的這個最低的這個保障經濟生活的保障那也希望這樣能夠帶動一般的薪資能夠提升然後經濟果實呼籲企業經濟果實能夠供\n\n11:17.469 --> 11:32.971\n所以我們基本工資的調漲也是希望帶動我們實質經常性的薪資能夠去做這個調漲也希望說讓我們勞工的生活可以過得更好可是後來有很多勞工朋友跟我們來陳情就是說因為\n\n11:34.552 --> 11:58.961\n這個沒有脫鉤的問題他說基本工資的調漲其實幾乎都是調漲在我們的移工我們的本勞他說他們可以說是一二十年的薪資幾乎都沒有調漲他說因為他們領的並不是基本工資基本工資領取幾乎大部分都是移工所以變成說基本工資的調漲他說都是一直調到這個移工對於本勞的調漲並沒有實質上的幫助\n\n12:01.182 --> 12:18.008\n我可以把數據給你我們每年調升基本工資本國人受益的數字就有兩百萬以上這個我可以給你那事實上法律並沒有規定移工進來要用基本工資聘他他其實進來本外勞\n\n12:19.188 --> 12:26.414\n一致原則平等對待人的照理說他做的工作如果跟本國一樣應該是一樣的待遇所以部長你也你也稍微瞭解一下對對因為根據我們這數據齁你看這基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲齁\n\n12:34.480 --> 12:34.740\n好,謝謝圖全集委員。\n\n","segments":[{"start":13.133,"end":15.974,"text":"好,謝謝主席那再麻煩請我們許部長有請許部長"},{"start":22.914,"end":48.033,"text":"徐部長在4月15日我們在立法院有開了一個記者會就是有關於有兩位肯亞籍的專業表演人士那因為被我們移民署介入調查在今年3月的時候他已經被鑑別為人口販運被害人那這個案子不知道部長知道這個案子嗎我知道我們有掌握我們第一時間就有掌握了"},{"start":48.693,"end":65.333,"text":"對,因為這個部分我們是覺得說他當初他是在被引進的時候是以百里以公是我們的專業表演的藝術人才然後後來我們才發現事實上他來到的時候都常常被仲介帶到"},{"start":66.454,"end":95.894,"text":"像也帶到臺南的某個遊樂場去從事遊樂工作後來也被帶到我們桃園有一個農場去無償做勞動而且甚至還被仲介逼迫然後借錢度日那當然後來這兩個肯亞籍外勞也有打電話投訴到1955然後可是臺南市府派員去查去查無不法那不知道針對這一部分部長有沒有什麼看法"},{"start":98.369,"end":122.547,"text":"可是看到的是他當初仲介來是以運動藝術專業表演人白領移工可是他來到卻是做我們藍領的工作而且跟他的工作其實根本是不符合的"},{"start":123.027,"end":135.204,"text":"對,從事許可以外的工作這是違法的對,後來我們才發現居然這個百里移工他這個表演藝術人居然沒有最低工資的保障"},{"start":136.744,"end":162.27,"text":"是不是這樣?有嗎?跟委員報告他其實是有達到最低工資只是說這個最低工資外界質疑說白領用最低工資白領是4萬多嘛對不對?跟委員報告因為4萬多現在目前在法律上是像類似工程師啊類似那表演藝術工作依照文化部現在所定的資格他不是以薪資他是以他的專業我們要凸顯這部分就是說他沒有最低工資的保障"},{"start":163.03,"end":175.464,"text":"所以其實他領的錢非常的少但是居然沒有違法他還是要符合最低基本工資他還是符合的沒有符合最低白領的基本工資嘛是不是這樣"},{"start":177.927,"end":195.634,"text":"他不是屬於專技人員的白領啊。如果專技人員白領要4萬多嘛。那他按照文化部他是屬於演藝表演這種專業資格進來的。他沒有像那個要求說要給到4萬多,但是他一定要給到基本工資。就是最低的基本工資。對。"},{"start":197.114,"end":223.92,"text":"低於一般白領的基本工資嗎?是不是這樣?對啦應該應該好沒關係那我們針對這一部分我們想了解一下那如果像4月15號那一天記者會因為兩位肯亞人士也親自現身說法那我們來看一下針對他這一部分我們看一下我們針對他提出在記者會提出的違法情勢跳下一頁"},{"start":225.36,"end":251.853,"text":"針對這部分就像剛剛部長有提他在許可外工作那就違反了我們就業服務法而且他是強迫勞動又違反了我們的勞基法然後他也未投保勞保那違反了我們勞工保險條例也沒有投保健保那也違反了全民健保法而且他也沒有提繳退休金那針對我們勞工退休條例也是違反了"},{"start":252.333,"end":279.568,"text":"而且他這一部分還是被扣留了他的護照那在我們人口販運防治法也是違反我們的法令而且最主要他還限制他的人身自由那其實已經觸及到刑法那我想請問一下部長針對這以上他們記者會所陳述這些事實如果屬實的話你看看他違反了這麼多法令那針對這部分部長覺得嚴重嗎?"},{"start":281.289,"end":284.092,"text":"我們台南市的勞工局居然去稽查、檢查"},{"start":308.332,"end":322.55,"text":"回覆．他的回覆居然是說顧主無只派許可外工作．他去查緝的結果．所以他針對這部分．而且移民署已經證實他這是許可外工作．還有他也．"},{"start":323.834,"end":349.927,"text":"台南勞工局也說他沒有強迫勞動而且有給付基本工資可是依據肯亞他們說明他連基本工資都沒有領到然後移民署也證實他這個護照確實被扣留可是不知道為什麼台南勞工局去稽查說他的護照是自行保管良好那針對以上我不知道我們勞發署跟治安署這一部分到底有沒有去介入調查"},{"start":350.267,"end":351.248,"text":"所以我覺得這個事情其實"},{"start":374.803,"end":393.693,"text":"對我們來講我們覺得不可思議他已經打1955去求救了結果勞工局也去稽查也碰到他們兩位居然稽查的結果是說完全都合法完全沒有違法的事項所以我們針對這部分我希望勞動部要重視這兩個肯亞根本就是假白領、真藍領"},{"start":398.075,"end":413.265,"text":"那而且我們一直說我們現在針對目前有8萬多的逃逸外勞我一直也看不到勞動部提出一個完善的改善計畫而且針對這一部分我們現在說實在話那時候我們也有講"},{"start":414.285,"end":441.558,"text":"當然引進印度移工等等當然是因為解決我們國內勞工的問題但是我真的希望我們針對印度移工的部分在文化、語言、生活差異還有男尊女卑等等的觀念差異之下我覺得應該要提出一個完善的計畫不然我擔心這個印度移工大量的引進到時候反而造成更多的逃逸的外勞"},{"start":443.559,"end":470.828,"text":"會 這個我們會謹慎那我們也會持續的開這個諮詢會議就這些大家所關注的議題跟大家對話那也了解後續的部分大家有一些需求要怎麼做這個我們都會好好來規劃處理對 我也希望我們當然我們許部長這幾年來也很辛苦但是我也知道說我們後續新任部長何沛山那不知道他上來之後有沒有辦法接續這些業務去做處理"},{"start":472.688,"end":482.968,"text":"報告委應該沒有問題啦以他的能力跟經驗我想他一定可以把後續的一些工作因為有些工作都是持續的嘛我想何部長這沒有問題"},{"start":484.298,"end":494.77,"text":"那我請部長還是要去了解一下因為在這之前我們昨天其實還針對打電話給勞發署去詢問針對這後續這肯亞的問題我們問好像勞發署也沒有去聯繫這個當事人然後也沒有去查核這4月15日"},{"start":505.602,"end":520.393,"text":"這個勞團記者會他所開的所提出的違法事項有沒有去一一去查核他們說的到底是不是屬實那我希望這部分勞動部真的還是要去了解一下而且我們認為後續是不是"},{"start":521.554,"end":534.468,"text":"針對這些白領的部分我們是不是可以抽打這個電話來查詢然後瞭解他是不是有沒有在許可外的工作我認為這些工作應該不難我覺得我們應該要去抽查去了解這實際的狀況"},{"start":536.07,"end":549.866,"text":"是不是跟委員報告,我們第一個時間這個個案馬上跟勞工局還有專勤隊、移民署專勤隊其實就立刻去介入而且馬上進入到我們的安置保護現在因為他是人口關係被害的人,所以後續整個的一些協助我們會全程來處理"},{"start":550.987,"end":551.607,"text":"好,我希望這一部分還是要多重視一下"},{"start":579.93,"end":598.996,"text":"還有針對我們現在我們基本的工資那有很多的工會勞工朋友有在跟我們提起他說當然我們蔡英文政府針對這幾年說基本工資連6年調漲可是據我們瞭解這基本工資連8年調漲沒關係重點是基本工資這連續的調漲可是後來我們瞭解他整體勞工"},{"start":609.7,"end":633.006,"text":"勞工這個整體的實質薪資好像並不是因為基本工資調漲而去做調漲也就是說這個薪資在調漲但是我們的物價上漲卻是超過這個幅度所以基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲好像是有出入的並沒有帶動我們整體的生活也就是實質薪資並沒有跟著基本工資去做調漲"},{"start":633.917,"end":651.033,"text":"報告委員,因為實質薪資它主要是因為這幾年因為疫情還有俄烏戰爭、以哈戰爭這些國際因素、經濟情勢造成物價通膨這個當然會讓大家感受說好像薪資追不上物價的速度"},{"start":651.713,"end":675.388,"text":"但是持續來提升以勞動部負責我們是弱勢勞工、邊境勞工他的最低工資我們是持續的在提升希望保障他的這個最低的這個保障經濟生活的保障那也希望這樣能夠帶動一般的薪資能夠提升然後經濟果實呼籲企業經濟果實能夠供"},{"start":677.469,"end":692.971,"text":"所以我們基本工資的調漲也是希望帶動我們實質經常性的薪資能夠去做這個調漲也希望說讓我們勞工的生活可以過得更好可是後來有很多勞工朋友跟我們來陳情就是說因為"},{"start":694.552,"end":718.961,"text":"這個沒有脫鉤的問題他說基本工資的調漲其實幾乎都是調漲在我們的移工我們的本勞他說他們可以說是一二十年的薪資幾乎都沒有調漲他說因為他們領的並不是基本工資基本工資領取幾乎大部分都是移工所以變成說基本工資的調漲他說都是一直調到這個移工對於本勞的調漲並沒有實質上的幫助"},{"start":721.182,"end":738.008,"text":"我可以把數據給你我們每年調升基本工資本國人受益的數字就有兩百萬以上這個我可以給你那事實上法律並沒有規定移工進來要用基本工資聘他他其實進來本外勞"},{"start":739.188,"end":746.414,"text":"一致原則平等對待人的照理說他做的工作如果跟本國一樣應該是一樣的待遇所以部長你也你也稍微瞭解一下對對因為根據我們這數據齁你看這基本工資跟實質薪資的調漲齁"},{"start":754.48,"end":754.74,"text":"好,謝謝圖全集委員。"}]}}}}