{"id":151739,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151739","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/37a05b44d500ce15eee26d8646aef285e44e652c0c420c23c68e374cd8c4bed03b67dac7242888a95ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"沈伯洋","委員發言時間":"10:37:10 - 10:44:00","影片長度":"00:06:50","會議時間":"2024-04-25T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第17次全體委員會議（事由：一、繼續審查\n（一）民進黨黨團擬具「立法院組織法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（二）委員高金素梅等23人擬具「立法院組織法第三十二條條文修正草案」案。\n（三）委員賴瑞隆等16人擬具「立法院組織法第三條、第五條及第三十二條條文修正草案」案。\n（四）委員高金素梅等17人擬具「立法院組織法第三十三條條文修正草案」案。\n二、繼續審查\n（一）民進黨黨團擬具「立法委員行為法第七條之一及第三十條條文修正草案」案。\n（二）委員賴瑞隆等16人擬具「立法委員行為法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（三）委員范雲等18人擬具「立法委員行為法第七條條文修正草案」案。\n三、繼續審查\n（一）民進黨黨團擬具「立法院議事規則第四十七條、第四十八條及第五十二條條文修正草案」案。\n（二）委員賴瑞隆等16人擬具「立法院議事規則第九條、第二十二條及第五十條條文修正草案」案。\n四、\n（一）繼續審查民進黨黨團擬具「立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（二）繼續審查委員呂玉玲等17人擬具「立法院職權行使法第十五條之一條文修正草案」案。\n（三）繼續審查委員呂玉玲等16人擬具「立法院職權行使法增訂第二十八條之三及第二十八條之四條文草案」案。\n（四）繼續審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具「立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（五）繼續審查委員翁曉玲等17人擬具「立法院職權行使法部分條文修正草案」案。\n（六）審查委員羅智強等22人擬具「立法院職權行使法第二十五條條文修正草案」案。\n【第四案（六）如經院會復議，則不予審查】）","date":"2024-04-25","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第17次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":17,"committees":[36],"id":"委員會-11-1-36-17"},"duration":410,"end_time":"2024-04-25T10:44:00+08:00","start_time":"2024-04-25T10:37:10+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":453,"blocks":[["沈委員伯洋：（10時37分）有請周秘書長還有資訊處處長。"],["主席：請周秘書長跟資訊處處長。"],["周秘書長萬來：沈委員好。"],["沈委員伯洋：你好。資訊處的我最後問，所以前面可以先休息一下。我知道周秘書長針對這些事情，有很多必須謹守中立的原則，所以有一些問題我只能問一個大概。我們今天好不容易可能可以進入逐條，之前要逐條的過程當中一直沒有辦法進去，我終於知道為什麼，顯然……我坐在這邊才短短1個小時，造謠的造謠，法律搞不清楚的法律搞不清楚，資安搞不清楚的搞不清楚，這種狀況太多了，我現在才發現原來不進入逐條可能最主要的原因在這裡。","第一個我先提到散會這件事情，假設打籃球、比賽到一半，裁判直接宣布6比0，這樣的球賽打不下去，這也是為什麼那時候民進黨提出散會這件事情。但是後來國民黨提出散會是什麼原因？是打球打到一半自己說不打了，我要走掉了，不管怎麼做，他們的重點都只是要讓會議沒有辦法往下進行。剛剛羅智強委員一直說我們走掉，不讓這個散會繼續是獨裁，他自己沒有搞清楚到底什麼才叫獨裁，不進入逐條、不進入討論，然後回去剪抖音影片，這完全不是國會議事堂應該做的事情，直接做a答b很顯然是他的專長。","第二個，關於說謊這件事情，也就是藐視國會，雖然不在今天的討論裡面，但是我剛剛聽到羅委員一直提到2016年的版本，說我們並沒有把說謊納進來，那就是因為前面調查權的範圍不夠限縮，也不夠明確，我們根本搞不清楚說謊的定義在哪裡，所以只好先不把它放進去。這就連結到像剛剛黃國昌委員提到的，他說今天是機關跟機構，為什麼不直接處罰人，要處罰機關跟機構？道理很簡單，因為如果在質詢的時候，機關跟機構造假，造假的人不一定是站在那邊講話的人，他可能只是被推出來的，就好像那一天吳宗憲委員被推出來之後，只好把會議進行很快速的run過去，背後是傅崐萁。我們真正應該讓機關、機構負責，讓他們把真正的行為人找出來，這才是處罰最好的方式。我一直都認為他並沒有瞭解到底進行的方式是什麼，他只想要讓站在那一邊的官員能夠被「釘」，能夠被處罰，到時候再剪成影片。像我們剛剛前面提的散會，他不斷地把我們提出散會申請這件事情剪成短影片，然後介紹給大家，說我們民進黨是怎麼樣干擾，這完全是錯誤的資訊。","接下來我還要提到，我還是要肯定黃國昌委員一點，他剛剛提到有人把中國的資金、詐騙什麼帶進來，我不知道黃國昌委員原來那麼想要管制去中國這件事情，這叫風險管控。為什麼中國的詐騙集團能夠進來？就是因為這些人能夠接觸。如果有人跟中國的黨政軍、詐騙集團接觸，這個要不要控管？這個風險很高。我提出一個法案，說這個要控管，為什麼國民黨跟民眾黨在程序委員會就要直接把這個封殺掉？剛剛不是說很關心這個問題嗎？這個是不分黨派的，又不是只有規範國民黨的委員跟民眾黨的委員？民進黨的委員一樣要受到規範，不是嗎？一個那麼重要的規範、一個高風險管控的規範，為什麼能夠在程序委員會就把它擋下來？這個不合理，所以我想問一下秘書長，現在在程序委員會直接把這個法案拿掉，會不會讓我們以後都沒有辦法提案？"],["周秘書長萬來：提案權並沒有受影響，程序委員會把這個法案暫緩，以前程序委員會的例子很多，有前例在，像一個法案送到院會被退回程序委員會。這裡面的例……"],["沈委員伯洋：對，但是我們現在是報告事項被拿走。"],["周秘書長萬來：我瞭解，暫緩的例子以前……我離開九年多，以前在程序委員會確實有暫緩的……"],["沈委員伯洋：有五千多次。"],["周秘書長萬來：有這一個例子，我是跟沈委員這樣報告。"],["沈委員伯洋：好，謝謝秘書長。我最後問一下資安處，現在我們提到它跟資訊安全有關，非常重要的一點是因為IT跟資安。現在外面的大公司比較喜歡分開，很大的原因是因為IT，譬如說它委託某一家公司幫忙，這一家公司如果同時做資安的話，反而會形成資安的漏洞，所以會希望能夠把它拆開，至於拆開到底要放在同一個地方，還是要分成兩個處？這都可以討論，很明顯的是，這一定會有人力需求，所以我們在後面有特別強調人力需求這件事情。接下來想要問的是，如果依照現在資訊安全處的這個判斷，你們比較希望把資安放在這裡面，並擴充人力，兩邊如果有合作的廠商要分開，還是要把它直接獨立出來變成一個處？怎樣對你們來講比較方便或者比較好做？"],["鄭處長輝彬：整個機制目前的話，像銀行就是把它切開；政府機關大部分是把整個資安跟資訊合在一起，然後成立獨立的一個科。不過我們資訊處的角色，當然成立處、成立科或是維持現狀，目前還是尊重委員整個合議的結果，我們可以配合委員合議的結果，做相關工作的調整跟整個任務的分派。"],["沈委員伯洋：好，沒有問題，這兩個方向應該都可行，重點是它必須要獨立，因為資安如果跟IT混在一起，會造成很大的資安上的問題。","非本委員會是5分鐘，對不對？好，那我先講到這邊。謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝沈委員，謝謝秘書長。","接下來有請吳委員思瑤發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":160,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-36-17","speakers":["鍾佳濱","范雲","羅智強","陳俊宇","沈伯洋","沈發惠","莊瑞雄","黃國昌","林思銘","吳思瑤","柯建銘","鄭天財Sra 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0.869}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 210.292, \"end\": 210.412, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"知\", \"start\": 210.412, \"end\": 210.552, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"道\", \"start\": 210.552, \"end\": 210.712, \"score\": 0.799}, {\"word\": \"原\", \"start\": 210.712, \"end\": 211.252, \"score\": 0.839}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"黃\"}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"昌\", \"start\": 211.252, \"end\": 211.412, \"score\": 0.825}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 211.412, \"end\": 212.113, \"score\": 0.92}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 212.113, \"end\": 212.633, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 212.633, \"end\": 212.873, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 212.873, \"end\": 213.113, \"score\": 0.83}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 213.113, \"end\": 213.553, \"score\": 0.867}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 213.553, \"end\": 213.833, \"score\": 0.96}, {\"word\": \"管\", \"start\": 213.833, \"end\": 214.093, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"制\", \"start\": 214.093, \"end\": 214.573, \"score\": 0.849}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 214.573, \"end\": 214.774, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 214.774, \"end\": 215.274, \"score\": 0.861}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"件\", \"start\": 215.274, \"end\": 215.474, \"score\": 0.904}, {\"word\": \"事\", \"start\": 215.474, \"end\": 215.634, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 215.634, \"end\": 215.654, \"score\": 0.963}]}, {\"start\": 216.634, \"end\": 240.967, \"text\": \"這就是這叫風險管控嘛為什麼今天詐騙集團能夠進來中國的詐騙集團能夠進來就是因為這些人能夠接觸啊所以如果今天有人跟中國的黨政軍跟詐騙集團有接觸這個要不要控管這個風險很高嘛欸那我提出了一個法案說這個要控管那為什麼民國民黨跟民眾黨在程序委員會就要直接把這個封殺掉剛剛不是說很關心這個問題嗎這個是不分黨派的啊\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 216.634, \"end\": 216.814, \"score\": 0.964}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 216.814, \"end\": 217.455, \"score\": 0.869}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"叫\", \"start\": 217.455, \"end\": 217.655, \"score\": 0.896}, {\"word\": \"風\"}, {\"word\": \"險\"}, {\"word\": \"管\", \"start\": 217.655, \"end\": 217.855, \"score\": 0.952}, {\"word\": \"控\", \"start\": 217.855, \"end\": 218.055, \"score\": 0.858}, {\"word\": \"嘛\", \"start\": 218.055, \"end\": 218.715, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 218.715, \"end\": 218.995, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 218.995, \"end\": 219.115, \"score\": 0.737}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 219.115, \"end\": 219.596, \"score\": 0.914}, {\"word\": \"詐\"}, {\"word\": \"騙\"}, {\"word\": \"集\", \"start\": 219.596, \"end\": 219.876, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"團\"}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 219.876, \"end\": 220.516, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 220.516, \"end\": 220.796, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 220.796, \"end\": 221.217, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"詐\"}, {\"word\": \"騙\"}, {\"word\": \"集\", \"start\": 221.217, \"end\": 221.457, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"團\"}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 221.457, \"end\": 222.317, \"score\": 0.921}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 222.317, \"end\": 222.517, \"score\": 0.973}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 222.517, \"end\": 222.597, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 222.597, \"end\": 222.957, \"score\": 0.886}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"些\", \"start\": 222.957, \"end\": 223.098, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 223.098, \"end\": 223.298, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"能\", \"start\": 223.298, \"end\": 223.438, \"score\": 0.857}, {\"word\": \"夠\"}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 223.438, \"end\": 223.798, \"score\": 0.849}, {\"word\": \"觸\"}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 223.798, \"end\": 224.438, \"score\": 0.925}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 224.438, \"end\": 224.538, \"score\": 0.795}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 224.538, \"end\": 224.618, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 224.618, \"end\": 224.798, \"score\": 0.977}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 224.798, \"end\": 224.939, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"今\", \"start\": 224.939, \"end\": 225.039, \"score\": 0.797}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 225.039, \"end\": 225.199, \"score\": 0.887}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 225.199, \"end\": 225.359, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"人\", \"start\": 225.359, \"end\": 225.539, \"score\": 0.976}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 225.539, \"end\": 225.719, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 225.719, \"end\": 226.059, \"score\": 0.927}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 226.059, \"end\": 226.399, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"黨\"}, {\"word\": \"政\", \"start\": 226.399, \"end\": 226.799, \"score\": 0.896}, {\"word\": \"軍\"}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 226.799, \"end\": 227.3, \"score\": 0.91}, {\"word\": \"詐\"}, {\"word\": \"騙\"}, {\"word\": \"集\", \"start\": 227.3, \"end\": 227.58, 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{\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 231.602, \"end\": 231.762, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"提\", \"start\": 231.762, \"end\": 231.942, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"出\", \"start\": 231.942, \"end\": 232.082, \"score\": 0.954}, {\"word\": \"了\", \"start\": 232.082, \"end\": 232.182, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 232.182, \"end\": 232.422, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"法\", \"start\": 232.422, \"end\": 232.522, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 232.522, \"end\": 233.023, \"score\": 0.873}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 233.023, \"end\": 233.203, \"score\": 0.888}, {\"word\": \"控\", \"start\": 233.203, \"end\": 233.443, \"score\": 0.955}, {\"word\": \"管\", \"start\": 233.443, \"end\": 233.883, \"score\": 0.931}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 233.883, \"end\": 234.223, \"score\": 0.84}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"什\", \"start\": 234.223, \"end\": 234.604, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"麼\"}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 234.604, \"end\": 234.924, \"score\": 0.878}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 234.924, \"end\": 235.344, \"score\": 0.937}, {\"word\": \"黨\"}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 235.344, \"end\": 235.464, \"score\": 0.847}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 235.464, \"end\": 236.004, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"眾\"}, {\"word\": \"黨\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 236.004, \"end\": 236.184, \"score\": 0.993}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 236.184, \"end\": 236.384, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"序\", \"start\": 236.384, \"end\": 236.585, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 236.585, \"end\": 237.365, \"score\": 0.919}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 237.365, \"end\": 237.465, \"score\": 0.963}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 237.465, \"end\": 237.625, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"直\", \"start\": 237.625, \"end\": 237.745, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"接\", \"start\": 237.745, \"end\": 237.905, \"score\": 0.962}, {\"word\": \"把\", \"start\": 237.905, \"end\": 238.265, \"score\": 0.88}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"封\", \"start\": 238.265, \"end\": 238.626, \"score\": 0.838}, {\"word\": \"殺\"}, {\"word\": \"掉\", \"start\": 238.626, \"end\": 239.466, \"score\": 0.894}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"剛\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 239.466, \"end\": 239.546, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 239.546, \"end\": 239.786, \"score\": 0.803}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"很\", \"start\": 239.786, \"end\": 240.186, \"score\": 0.948}, {\"word\": \"關\"}, {\"word\": \"心\", \"start\": 240.186, \"end\": 240.387, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"題\"}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 240.387, \"end\": 240.487, \"score\": 0.795}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 240.487, \"end\": 240.607, \"score\": 0.832}, {\"word\": \"分\", \"start\": 240.607, \"end\": 240.807, \"score\": 0.859}, {\"word\": \"黨\"}, {\"word\": \"派\", \"start\": 240.807, \"end\": 240.927, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 240.927, \"end\": 240.947, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"啊\", \"start\": 240.947, \"end\": 240.967, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 243.468, \"end\": 266.776, \"text\": \"這個又不是只有規範國民黨的委員跟民眾黨的委員民進黨的委員一樣要受到規範不是嗎所以一個那麼重要的規範一個高風險管控的規範為什麼能夠在程序委員會就把他擋下來這個不合理嘛所以我想問一下秘書長就是我們現在在程序委員會直接把這個法案拿掉這樣會不會讓我們以後都沒有辦法做提案\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"又\", \"start\": 243.468, \"end\": 243.588, \"score\": 0.979}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 243.588, \"end\": 243.668, \"score\": 0.997}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 243.668, \"end\": 243.828, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"只\", \"start\": 243.828, \"end\": 243.928, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"有\", \"start\": 243.928, \"end\": 244.468, \"score\": 0.879}, {\"word\": \"規\"}, {\"word\": \"範\"}, {\"word\": \"國\"}, {\"word\": \"民\", \"start\": 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\"會\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 255.852, \"end\": 255.992, \"score\": 0.99}, {\"word\": \"把\", \"start\": 255.992, \"end\": 256.092, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"他\", \"start\": 256.092, \"end\": 256.412, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"擋\"}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 256.412, \"end\": 257.213, \"score\": 0.87}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 257.213, \"end\": 257.353, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"合\", \"start\": 257.353, \"end\": 257.573, \"score\": 0.989}, {\"word\": \"理\", \"start\": 257.573, \"end\": 257.733, \"score\": 0.856}, {\"word\": \"嘛\", \"start\": 257.733, \"end\": 258.273, \"score\": 0.943}, {\"word\": \"所\", \"start\": 258.273, \"end\": 258.333, \"score\": 0.667}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 258.333, \"end\": 258.393, \"score\": 0.657}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 258.393, \"end\": 258.493, \"score\": 0.603}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 258.493, \"end\": 258.793, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"問\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 258.793, \"end\": 258.893, \"score\": 0.998}, {\"word\": \"下\", \"start\": 258.893, \"end\": 259.173, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"秘\", \"start\": 259.173, \"end\": 259.674, \"score\": 0.915}, {\"word\": \"書\"}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"就\", \"start\": 259.674, \"end\": 259.814, \"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 259.814, \"end\": 260.314, \"score\": 0.999}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 260.314, \"end\": 260.794, \"score\": 0.906}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"現\"}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 260.794, \"end\": 261.254, \"score\": 0.986}, {\"word\": \"在\", \"start\": 261.254, \"end\": 261.454, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"程\", \"start\": 261.454, \"end\": 261.694, \"score\": 0.967}, {\"word\": \"序\", \"start\": 261.694, \"end\": 261.914, \"score\": 0.981}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 261.914, \"end\": 262.775, \"score\": 0.929}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"直\", \"start\": 262.775, \"end\": 262.995, 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\"start\": 392.74, \"end\": 392.86, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"告\", \"start\": 392.86, \"end\": 392.88, \"score\": 0.001}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,069 --> 00:00:00,389\n請周秘書長跟資訊處處長\n\n2\n00:00:22,323 --> 00:00:49,757\n三位好你好資訊處的我最後問所以前面可以先休息一下我知道周秘書長其實針對這些事情很多事你必須也是謹守中立的原則所以有一些問題我大概只是問一個大概我現在因為我們今天好不容易可能可以進入竹條我們之前在要做竹條的過程當中一直沒有辦法進去我今天終於知道為什麼了為什麼因為\n\n3\n00:00:51,077 --> 00:01:18,896\n顯然要嘛就是我才短短坐在這邊一個小時造謠的造謠法律搞不清楚的法律搞不清楚資安搞不清楚的搞不清楚這種狀況太多了所以我現在才發現原來不進入主條可能最主要的原因是在於這裡第一個我先提到就是上會這件事情像假設我們今天打籃球打比賽打到一半裁判直接宣布6比0那這樣的球賽打不下去所以這也是為什麼那時候民進黨提出上會這件事情\n\n4\n00:01:19,716 --> 00:01:36,131\n但是後來國民黨提出散會是什麼是今天打球打到一半他們自己說我不打了我要走掉了所以他們不管怎麼做他們的重點都只是要讓會議沒有辦法往下進行所以剛剛這個羅志強委員一直在講說我們這個什麼走掉我們今天不讓這個散會繼續是獨裁\n\n5\n00:01:37,853 --> 00:02:06,058\n他自己沒有搞清楚到底什麼才叫做獨裁不進入主條、不進入討論然後回去剪抖音影片這完全不是一個國會議事堂我們應該做的事情直接做A答B很顯然是他的專長第二個就是關於說謊這件事情也就是藐視國會藐視國會雖然不在今天的討論裡面但是我剛剛聽到羅委員一直提到2016年的版本說我今天並沒有把說謊拉近那就是因為前面調查權的範圍不夠\n\n6\n00:02:07,418 --> 00:02:08,399\n條文修正草案案。\n\n7\n00:02:30,114 --> 00:02:54,008\n造假的人不一定是站在那邊講話的那一個人他可能只是被推出來的嘛就好像那天吳宗憲委員被推出來之後結果只好把這個會議的進行很快速的亂過去這背後是傅坤祺嘛所以我們真正應該是要讓機關機構來負責然後讓他們去把真正的行為人找出來這才是處罰的最好的方式嘛\n\n8\n00:02:54,688 --> 00:03:16,587\n所以我一直都認為說就是他並沒有去了解我們現在到底進行的方式是什麼他只想要讓站在那一邊的那個官員能夠被定能夠被處罰然後到時候再剪成影片然後呢像我們剛剛前面提的散會的不斷的把我們提出散會申請這件事情剪成短影片然後介紹給大家說我們民進黨是怎麼樣的干擾這完全是錯誤的資訊\n\n9\n00:03:18,408 --> 00:03:35,654\n然後接下來我還要提到但是我還是要肯定黃國昌委員一點就是他剛剛提到就是剛剛我們他說有這個人他這個把中國的這個資金詐騙什麼帶進來啊所以原來我不知道原來黃國昌委員那麼的想要去管制去中國這件事情\n\n10\n00:03:36,634 --> 00:04:00,967\n這就是這叫風險管控嘛為什麼今天詐騙集團能夠進來中國的詐騙集團能夠進來就是因為這些人能夠接觸啊所以如果今天有人跟中國的黨政軍跟詐騙集團有接觸這個要不要控管這個風險很高嘛欸那我提出了一個法案說這個要控管那為什麼民國民黨跟民眾黨在程序委員會就要直接把這個封殺掉剛剛不是說很關心這個問題嗎這個是不分黨派的啊\n\n11\n00:04:03,468 --> 00:04:26,776\n這個又不是只有規範國民黨的委員跟民眾黨的委員民進黨的委員一樣要受到規範不是嗎所以一個那麼重要的規範一個高風險管控的規範為什麼能夠在程序委員會就把他擋下來這個不合理嘛所以我想問一下秘書長就是我們現在在程序委員會直接把這個法案拿掉這樣會不會讓我們以後都沒有辦法做提案\n\n12\n00:04:29,440 --> 00:04:34,281\n提案權並沒有受影響,程序委員會把法案暫緩。\n\n13\n00:04:44,105 --> 00:04:47,486\n條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條\n\n14\n00:05:11,135 --> 00:05:11,595\n條文修正草案\n\n15\n00:05:32,330 --> 00:06:00,713\n還是說要分成兩個處我覺得這都可以討論但很明顯的是這一定會有人力的需求所以我們在後面有特別去強調就是說人力需求這件事情那接下來呢想要問的就是如果依照現在資訊安全處的判斷你們是比較希望還是把資安放在這個裡面那人力擴充然後讓他們兩邊如果有合作的這個廠商他要分開還是說要把他直接獨立出來變成一個處怎樣對你們來講是比較方便的或者說比較好做的\n\n16\n00:06:02,499 --> 00:06:31,859\n報告委員那個因為整個機制的話根據目前的話像銀行部分的話他就是把它切開嘛好像目前政府機關的話大部分是把整個資安跟資訊是合在一起然後把它成立獨立的科啦不然我們資訊處的角色的話當然成立處或成立科或是維持現狀的話我們目前的話還是尊重委員整個合意的結果我們可以配合委員合意的結果的話來做相關工作的一個調整跟跟整個任務的一個分派\n\n17\n00:06:32,620 --> 00:06:32,880\n條文宣告\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n69\t389\t請周秘書長跟資訊處處長\n22323\t49757\t三位好你好資訊處的我最後問所以前面可以先休息一下我知道周秘書長其實針對這些事情很多事你必須也是謹守中立的原則所以有一些問題我大概只是問一個大概我現在因為我們今天好不容易可能可以進入竹條我們之前在要做竹條的過程當中一直沒有辦法進去我今天終於知道為什麼了為什麼因為\n51077\t78896\t顯然要嘛就是我才短短坐在這邊一個小時造謠的造謠法律搞不清楚的法律搞不清楚資安搞不清楚的搞不清楚這種狀況太多了所以我現在才發現原來不進入主條可能最主要的原因是在於這裡第一個我先提到就是上會這件事情像假設我們今天打籃球打比賽打到一半裁判直接宣布6比0那這樣的球賽打不下去所以這也是為什麼那時候民進黨提出上會這件事情\n79716\t96131\t但是後來國民黨提出散會是什麼是今天打球打到一半他們自己說我不打了我要走掉了所以他們不管怎麼做他們的重點都只是要讓會議沒有辦法往下進行所以剛剛這個羅志強委員一直在講說我們這個什麼走掉我們今天不讓這個散會繼續是獨裁\n97853\t126058\t他自己沒有搞清楚到底什麼才叫做獨裁不進入主條、不進入討論然後回去剪抖音影片這完全不是一個國會議事堂我們應該做的事情直接做A答B很顯然是他的專長第二個就是關於說謊這件事情也就是藐視國會藐視國會雖然不在今天的討論裡面但是我剛剛聽到羅委員一直提到2016年的版本說我今天並沒有把說謊拉近那就是因為前面調查權的範圍不夠\n127418\t128399\t條文修正草案案 。\n150114\t174008\t造假的人不一定是站在那邊講話的那一個人他可能只是被推出來的嘛就好像那天吳宗憲委員被推出來之後結果只好把這個會議的進行很快速的亂過去這背後是傅坤祺嘛所以我們真正應該是要讓機關機構來負責然後讓他們去把真正的行為人找出來這才是處罰的最好的方式嘛\n174688\t196587\t所以我一直都認為說就是他並沒有去了解我們現在到底進行的方式是什麼他只想要讓站在那一邊的那個官員能夠被定能夠被處罰然後到時候再剪成影片然後呢像我們剛剛前面提的散會的不斷的把我們提出散會申請這件事情剪成短影片然後介紹給大家說我們民進黨是怎麼樣的干擾這完全是錯誤的資訊\n198408\t215654\t然後接下來我還要提到但是我還是要肯定黃國昌委員一點就是他剛剛提到就是剛剛我們他說有這個人他這個把中國的這個資金詐騙什麼帶進來啊所以原來我不知道原來黃國昌委員那麼的想要去管制去中國這件事情\n216634\t240967\t這就是這叫風險管控嘛為什麼今天詐騙集團能夠進來中國的詐騙集團能夠進來就是因為這些人能夠接觸啊所以如果今天有人跟中國的黨政軍跟詐騙集團有接觸這個要不要控管這個風險很高嘛欸那我提出了一個法案說這個要控管那為什麼民國民黨跟民眾黨在程序委員會就要直接把這個封殺掉剛剛不是說很關心這個問題嗎這個是不分黨派的啊\n243468\t266776\t這個又不是只有規範國民黨的委員跟民眾黨的委員民進黨的委員一樣要受到規範不是嗎所以一個那麼重要的規範一個高風險管控的規範為什麼能夠在程序委員會就把他擋下來這個不合理嘛所以我想問一下秘書長就是我們現在在程序委員會直接把這個法案拿掉這樣會不會讓我們以後都沒有辦法做提案\n269440\t274281\t提案權並沒有受影響,程序委員會把法案暫緩。\n284105\t287486\t條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條\n311135\t311595\t條文修正草案\n332330\t360713\t還是說要分成兩個處我覺得這都可以討論但很明顯的是這一定會有人力的需求所以我們在後面有特別去強調就是說人力需求這件事情那接下來呢想要問的就是如果依照現在資訊安全處的判斷你們是比較希望還是把資安放在這個裡面那人力擴充然後讓他們兩邊如果有合作的這個廠商他要分開還是說要把他直接獨立出來變成一個處怎樣對你們來講是比較方便的或者說比較好做的\n362499\t391859\t報告委員那個因為整個機制的話根據目前的話像銀行部分的話他就是把它切開嘛好像目前政府機關的話大部分是把整個資安跟資訊是合在一起然後把它成立獨立的科啦不然我們資訊處的角色的話當然成立處或成立科或是維持現狀的話我們目前的話還是尊重委員整個合意的結果我們可以配合委員合意的結果的話來做相關工作的一個調整跟跟整個任務的一個分派\n392620\t392880\t條文宣告\n","txt":"請周秘書長跟資訊處處長\n三位好你好資訊處的我最後問所以前面可以先休息一下我知道周秘書長其實針對這些事情很多事你必須也是謹守中立的原則所以有一些問題我大概只是問一個大概我現在因為我們今天好不容易可能可以進入竹條我們之前在要做竹條的過程當中一直沒有辦法進去我今天終於知道為什麼了為什麼因為\n顯然要嘛就是我才短短坐在這邊一個小時造謠的造謠法律搞不清楚的法律搞不清楚資安搞不清楚的搞不清楚這種狀況太多了所以我現在才發現原來不進入主條可能最主要的原因是在於這裡第一個我先提到就是上會這件事情像假設我們今天打籃球打比賽打到一半裁判直接宣布6比0那這樣的球賽打不下去所以這也是為什麼那時候民進黨提出上會這件事情\n但是後來國民黨提出散會是什麼是今天打球打到一半他們自己說我不打了我要走掉了所以他們不管怎麼做他們的重點都只是要讓會議沒有辦法往下進行所以剛剛這個羅志強委員一直在講說我們這個什麼走掉我們今天不讓這個散會繼續是獨裁\n他自己沒有搞清楚到底什麼才叫做獨裁不進入主條、不進入討論然後回去剪抖音影片這完全不是一個國會議事堂我們應該做的事情直接做A答B很顯然是他的專長第二個就是關於說謊這件事情也就是藐視國會藐視國會雖然不在今天的討論裡面但是我剛剛聽到羅委員一直提到2016年的版本說我今天並沒有把說謊拉近那就是因為前面調查權的範圍不夠\n條文修正草案案 。\n造假的人不一定是站在那邊講話的那一個人他可能只是被推出來的嘛就好像那天吳宗憲委員被推出來之後結果只好把這個會議的進行很快速的亂過去這背後是傅坤祺嘛所以我們真正應該是要讓機關機構來負責然後讓他們去把真正的行為人找出來這才是處罰的最好的方式嘛\n所以我一直都認為說就是他並沒有去了解我們現在到底進行的方式是什麼他只想要讓站在那一邊的那個官員能夠被定能夠被處罰然後到時候再剪成影片然後呢像我們剛剛前面提的散會的不斷的把我們提出散會申請這件事情剪成短影片然後介紹給大家說我們民進黨是怎麼樣的干擾這完全是錯誤的資訊\n然後接下來我還要提到但是我還是要肯定黃國昌委員一點就是他剛剛提到就是剛剛我們他說有這個人他這個把中國的這個資金詐騙什麼帶進來啊所以原來我不知道原來黃國昌委員那麼的想要去管制去中國這件事情\n這就是這叫風險管控嘛為什麼今天詐騙集團能夠進來中國的詐騙集團能夠進來就是因為這些人能夠接觸啊所以如果今天有人跟中國的黨政軍跟詐騙集團有接觸這個要不要控管這個風險很高嘛欸那我提出了一個法案說這個要控管那為什麼民國民黨跟民眾黨在程序委員會就要直接把這個封殺掉剛剛不是說很關心這個問題嗎這個是不分黨派的啊\n這個又不是只有規範國民黨的委員跟民眾黨的委員民進黨的委員一樣要受到規範不是嗎所以一個那麼重要的規範一個高風險管控的規範為什麼能夠在程序委員會就把他擋下來這個不合理嘛所以我想問一下秘書長就是我們現在在程序委員會直接把這個法案拿掉這樣會不會讓我們以後都沒有辦法做提案\n提案權並沒有受影響,程序委員會把法案暫緩。\n條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條\n條文修正草案\n還是說要分成兩個處我覺得這都可以討論但很明顯的是這一定會有人力的需求所以我們在後面有特別去強調就是說人力需求這件事情那接下來呢想要問的就是如果依照現在資訊安全處的判斷你們是比較希望還是把資安放在這個裡面那人力擴充然後讓他們兩邊如果有合作的這個廠商他要分開還是說要把他直接獨立出來變成一個處怎樣對你們來講是比較方便的或者說比較好做的\n報告委員那個因為整個機制的話根據目前的話像銀行部分的話他就是把它切開嘛好像目前政府機關的話大部分是把整個資安跟資訊是合在一起然後把它成立獨立的科啦不然我們資訊處的角色的話當然成立處或成立科或是維持現狀的話我們目前的話還是尊重委員整個合意的結果我們可以配合委員合意的結果的話來做相關工作的一個調整跟跟整個任務的一個分派\n條文宣告\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.069 --> 00:00.389\n請周秘書長跟資訊處處長\n\n00:22.323 --> 00:49.757\n三位好你好資訊處的我最後問所以前面可以先休息一下我知道周秘書長其實針對這些事情很多事你必須也是謹守中立的原則所以有一些問題我大概只是問一個大概我現在因為我們今天好不容易可能可以進入竹條我們之前在要做竹條的過程當中一直沒有辦法進去我今天終於知道為什麼了為什麼因為\n\n00:51.077 --> 01:18.896\n顯然要嘛就是我才短短坐在這邊一個小時造謠的造謠法律搞不清楚的法律搞不清楚資安搞不清楚的搞不清楚這種狀況太多了所以我現在才發現原來不進入主條可能最主要的原因是在於這裡第一個我先提到就是上會這件事情像假設我們今天打籃球打比賽打到一半裁判直接宣布6比0那這樣的球賽打不下去所以這也是為什麼那時候民進黨提出上會這件事情\n\n01:19.716 --> 01:36.131\n但是後來國民黨提出散會是什麼是今天打球打到一半他們自己說我不打了我要走掉了所以他們不管怎麼做他們的重點都只是要讓會議沒有辦法往下進行所以剛剛這個羅志強委員一直在講說我們這個什麼走掉我們今天不讓這個散會繼續是獨裁\n\n01:37.853 --> 02:06.058\n他自己沒有搞清楚到底什麼才叫做獨裁不進入主條、不進入討論然後回去剪抖音影片這完全不是一個國會議事堂我們應該做的事情直接做A答B很顯然是他的專長第二個就是關於說謊這件事情也就是藐視國會藐視國會雖然不在今天的討論裡面但是我剛剛聽到羅委員一直提到2016年的版本說我今天並沒有把說謊拉近那就是因為前面調查權的範圍不夠\n\n02:07.418 --> 02:08.399\n條文修正草案案。\n\n02:30.114 --> 02:54.008\n造假的人不一定是站在那邊講話的那一個人他可能只是被推出來的嘛就好像那天吳宗憲委員被推出來之後結果只好把這個會議的進行很快速的亂過去這背後是傅坤祺嘛所以我們真正應該是要讓機關機構來負責然後讓他們去把真正的行為人找出來這才是處罰的最好的方式嘛\n\n02:54.688 --> 03:16.587\n所以我一直都認為說就是他並沒有去了解我們現在到底進行的方式是什麼他只想要讓站在那一邊的那個官員能夠被定能夠被處罰然後到時候再剪成影片然後呢像我們剛剛前面提的散會的不斷的把我們提出散會申請這件事情剪成短影片然後介紹給大家說我們民進黨是怎麼樣的干擾這完全是錯誤的資訊\n\n03:18.408 --> 03:35.654\n然後接下來我還要提到但是我還是要肯定黃國昌委員一點就是他剛剛提到就是剛剛我們他說有這個人他這個把中國的這個資金詐騙什麼帶進來啊所以原來我不知道原來黃國昌委員那麼的想要去管制去中國這件事情\n\n03:36.634 --> 04:00.967\n這就是這叫風險管控嘛為什麼今天詐騙集團能夠進來中國的詐騙集團能夠進來就是因為這些人能夠接觸啊所以如果今天有人跟中國的黨政軍跟詐騙集團有接觸這個要不要控管這個風險很高嘛欸那我提出了一個法案說這個要控管那為什麼民國民黨跟民眾黨在程序委員會就要直接把這個封殺掉剛剛不是說很關心這個問題嗎這個是不分黨派的啊\n\n04:03.468 --> 04:26.776\n這個又不是只有規範國民黨的委員跟民眾黨的委員民進黨的委員一樣要受到規範不是嗎所以一個那麼重要的規範一個高風險管控的規範為什麼能夠在程序委員會就把他擋下來這個不合理嘛所以我想問一下秘書長就是我們現在在程序委員會直接把這個法案拿掉這樣會不會讓我們以後都沒有辦法做提案\n\n04:29.440 --> 04:34.281\n提案權並沒有受影響,程序委員會把法案暫緩。\n\n04:44.105 --> 04:47.486\n條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條\n\n05:11.135 --> 05:11.595\n條文修正草案\n\n05:32.330 --> 06:00.713\n還是說要分成兩個處我覺得這都可以討論但很明顯的是這一定會有人力的需求所以我們在後面有特別去強調就是說人力需求這件事情那接下來呢想要問的就是如果依照現在資訊安全處的判斷你們是比較希望還是把資安放在這個裡面那人力擴充然後讓他們兩邊如果有合作的這個廠商他要分開還是說要把他直接獨立出來變成一個處怎樣對你們來講是比較方便的或者說比較好做的\n\n06:02.499 --> 06:31.859\n報告委員那個因為整個機制的話根據目前的話像銀行部分的話他就是把它切開嘛好像目前政府機關的話大部分是把整個資安跟資訊是合在一起然後把它成立獨立的科啦不然我們資訊處的角色的話當然成立處或成立科或是維持現狀的話我們目前的話還是尊重委員整個合意的結果我們可以配合委員合意的結果的話來做相關工作的一個調整跟跟整個任務的一個分派\n\n06:32.620 --> 06:32.880\n條文宣告\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.069,"end":0.389,"text":"請周秘書長跟資訊處處長"},{"start":22.323,"end":49.757,"text":"三位好你好資訊處的我最後問所以前面可以先休息一下我知道周秘書長其實針對這些事情很多事你必須也是謹守中立的原則所以有一些問題我大概只是問一個大概我現在因為我們今天好不容易可能可以進入竹條我們之前在要做竹條的過程當中一直沒有辦法進去我今天終於知道為什麼了為什麼因為"},{"start":51.077,"end":78.896,"text":"顯然要嘛就是我才短短坐在這邊一個小時造謠的造謠法律搞不清楚的法律搞不清楚資安搞不清楚的搞不清楚這種狀況太多了所以我現在才發現原來不進入主條可能最主要的原因是在於這裡第一個我先提到就是上會這件事情像假設我們今天打籃球打比賽打到一半裁判直接宣布6比0那這樣的球賽打不下去所以這也是為什麼那時候民進黨提出上會這件事情"},{"start":79.716,"end":96.131,"text":"但是後來國民黨提出散會是什麼是今天打球打到一半他們自己說我不打了我要走掉了所以他們不管怎麼做他們的重點都只是要讓會議沒有辦法往下進行所以剛剛這個羅志強委員一直在講說我們這個什麼走掉我們今天不讓這個散會繼續是獨裁"},{"start":97.853,"end":126.058,"text":"他自己沒有搞清楚到底什麼才叫做獨裁不進入主條、不進入討論然後回去剪抖音影片這完全不是一個國會議事堂我們應該做的事情直接做A答B很顯然是他的專長第二個就是關於說謊這件事情也就是藐視國會藐視國會雖然不在今天的討論裡面但是我剛剛聽到羅委員一直提到2016年的版本說我今天並沒有把說謊拉近那就是因為前面調查權的範圍不夠"},{"start":127.418,"end":128.399,"text":"條文修正草案案 。"},{"start":150.114,"end":174.008,"text":"造假的人不一定是站在那邊講話的那一個人他可能只是被推出來的嘛就好像那天吳宗憲委員被推出來之後結果只好把這個會議的進行很快速的亂過去這背後是傅坤祺嘛所以我們真正應該是要讓機關機構來負責然後讓他們去把真正的行為人找出來這才是處罰的最好的方式嘛"},{"start":174.688,"end":196.587,"text":"所以我一直都認為說就是他並沒有去了解我們現在到底進行的方式是什麼他只想要讓站在那一邊的那個官員能夠被定能夠被處罰然後到時候再剪成影片然後呢像我們剛剛前面提的散會的不斷的把我們提出散會申請這件事情剪成短影片然後介紹給大家說我們民進黨是怎麼樣的干擾這完全是錯誤的資訊"},{"start":198.408,"end":215.654,"text":"然後接下來我還要提到但是我還是要肯定黃國昌委員一點就是他剛剛提到就是剛剛我們他說有這個人他這個把中國的這個資金詐騙什麼帶進來啊所以原來我不知道原來黃國昌委員那麼的想要去管制去中國這件事情"},{"start":216.634,"end":240.967,"text":"這就是這叫風險管控嘛為什麼今天詐騙集團能夠進來中國的詐騙集團能夠進來就是因為這些人能夠接觸啊所以如果今天有人跟中國的黨政軍跟詐騙集團有接觸這個要不要控管這個風險很高嘛欸那我提出了一個法案說這個要控管那為什麼民國民黨跟民眾黨在程序委員會就要直接把這個封殺掉剛剛不是說很關心這個問題嗎這個是不分黨派的啊"},{"start":243.468,"end":266.776,"text":"這個又不是只有規範國民黨的委員跟民眾黨的委員民進黨的委員一樣要受到規範不是嗎所以一個那麼重要的規範一個高風險管控的規範為什麼能夠在程序委員會就把他擋下來這個不合理嘛所以我想問一下秘書長就是我們現在在程序委員會直接把這個法案拿掉這樣會不會讓我們以後都沒有辦法做提案"},{"start":269.44,"end":274.281,"text":"提案權並沒有受影響,程序委員會把法案暫緩。"},{"start":284.105,"end":287.486,"text":"條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條文修正草案．立法院組織法部分條"},{"start":311.135,"end":311.595,"text":"條文修正草案"},{"start":332.33,"end":360.713,"text":"還是說要分成兩個處我覺得這都可以討論但很明顯的是這一定會有人力的需求所以我們在後面有特別去強調就是說人力需求這件事情那接下來呢想要問的就是如果依照現在資訊安全處的判斷你們是比較希望還是把資安放在這個裡面那人力擴充然後讓他們兩邊如果有合作的這個廠商他要分開還是說要把他直接獨立出來變成一個處怎樣對你們來講是比較方便的或者說比較好做的"},{"start":362.499,"end":391.859,"text":"報告委員那個因為整個機制的話根據目前的話像銀行部分的話他就是把它切開嘛好像目前政府機關的話大部分是把整個資安跟資訊是合在一起然後把它成立獨立的科啦不然我們資訊處的角色的話當然成立處或成立科或是維持現狀的話我們目前的話還是尊重委員整個合意的結果我們可以配合委員合意的結果的話來做相關工作的一個調整跟跟整個任務的一個分派"},{"start":392.62,"end":392.88,"text":"條文宣告"}]}}}}