{"id":151917,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151917","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/75811ef35c27466bc8fa74738a9a4d4c1853afabeb86d4497f5010e6307119190303f983ebd4ce0e5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"羅美玲","委員發言時間":"09:20:54 - 09:30:34","影片長度":"00:09:40","會議時間":"2024-05-01T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第16次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國家安全局局長蔡明彥、行政院國土安全辦公室報告「如何強化國家關鍵基礎設施之韌性，以因應國安新型態風險威脅」，並備質詢。）","date":"2024-05-01","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第16次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":16,"committees":[35],"id":"委員會-11-1-35-16"},"duration":580,"end_time":"2024-05-01T09:30:34+08:00","start_time":"2024-05-01T09:20:54+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":119,"blocks":[["羅委員美玲：（9時20分）謝謝主席，有請國土辦林主任。"],["主席：請國土辦林主任。"],["羅委員美玲：主任好。不管國安局的報告或者是國土辦的報告都有特別提到，像國際戰事、恐怖活動攻擊關鍵基礎建設就可以達到震懾民心，影響社會安定；另外我們也看到國安局報告中還提到藉由人員潛伏，以裡應外合的方式竊取設施機敏資訊，伺機破壞設施運作等等。臺灣對於這些，我想我們都已經有一些預留，就是說我們可能會有一些想法，所以我們才會有所謂的CI安全防護計畫嘛，我想在我們的CI安全防護計畫裡面，核電廠絕對是重中之重，對不對？因為核電廠其實含有核廢料的問題，為什麼我會特別提到核電廠？在2022年烏俄戰爭發生的時候，俄羅斯占領了車諾比核電廠，那時候就發生有人進到實驗室裡面搶走不少放射性核廢料，引起國際上的一陣緊張，大家都很擔心這些放射性核廢料如果落入恐怖分子的手上，可能會製造一些所謂髒彈的生化武器，我想國土辦應該都有注意到這方面的問題。臺灣有核電廠也有核廢料，我不曉得在我們的CI安全防護計畫裡面，這個部分是不是也是屬於我們有留意到、注意到，或是也有一些防範計畫？我想請問林主任。"],["林主任傑：謝謝委員的提醒，當然能源設施是關鍵基礎設施的一環，核能更是其中的一部分，所以相關電廠的一些防護，我們都有相關的防護計畫，從它的脆弱點到它的整個生命週期，從它的營運到相關廢棄的一些管理，包含核安會、台電公司跟經濟部都有相關的防護計畫，國土辦這邊也會定期的去做相關的督導跟訪視，以瞭解他們落實的情形。"],["羅委員美玲：是。"],["林主任傑：委員剛剛提到核廢料管理的部分，我們也會作為相關注意事項來持續的提醒。"],["羅委員美玲：因為我們今天的題目有提到國安新型態的風險威脅，我想核廢料應該也是屬於國安新型態風險威脅之一，因為我們看到俄烏戰爭有發生車諾比實驗室一些核廢料被竊取的事情，它所衍生的可能還是國安的問題；另外，巴西Goiania事故到今年9月也已經37週年了。這一連串的事件讓我們很擔心，因為臺灣有核電廠，所可能衍生的不單單只有放射性的問題，可能衍生的是未來臺海如果發生戰爭的話，很可能我們的核電廠會是在攻擊當中很重要的一點。再來，比如核廢料的處理也是我們所要擔心的，因為我有看到臺灣的核廢料到目前為止的處理方式還是一再的卡關，我們可以看到核一、核二的乾貯計畫什麼時候能夠啟用還是一個未知數，核廢料的處理問題到目前還是未解，所以讓我們覺得未來如果發生戰爭的話，核廢料可能是我們特別要去注意的，尤其是國土辦應該要嚴格去督促相關單位，這樣才能夠充分保障國人的生命財產的安全。","我今天會提到烏俄戰爭中車諾比實驗室的核廢料被竊的這件事情，最主要是要提醒國土辦，臺灣可能也會發生相同的事件，因為經濟學人說全球最危險的地方就是臺灣，這個部分可能就是要特別來審慎思考。另外，我在相關報告裡面有看到，大家都會注意到一些裡應外合的問題，這是讓我們覺得需要相關單位特別留意、注意的地方。以上這個部分是要特別提醒國土辦，要注意到國際上曾經發生的事情，我們臺灣也要來做一個反思。請林主任先回座。","接下來我要請國安局蔡局長。"],["主席：請蔡局長。"],["蔡局長明彥：謝謝主席。委員早。"],["羅委員美玲：局長，接下來的這個問題其實我有請教過外交部，可是我還是覺得這個問題應該是屬於國安局的問題。之前我們的準副總統蕭美琴3月份的時候到歐洲去訪問，就發生有中國駐外武官尾隨的狀況。再來，在2023年我們蔡英文總統出訪友邦過境美國的時候，中國也動員了中國的僑民來做進行抗議、騷擾，那時候局長說中國有發走路工，一天是200美元。諸如此類，我們元首出訪的時候都會發生類似這種被騷擾或是被抗議的問題，我想請教國安局，畢竟元首的維安還是你們主要的工作，我想請教的就是，未來如果有類似這種狀況的話，國安局要如何加強跟完善我們正副總統的維安工作？尤其很多國家我們並沒有執法權，像這種騷擾事件或攻擊事件如果發生的話，我們要如何加強保護我們元首的維安工作？"],["蔡局長明彥：謝謝委員，就我們的元首或是我們的安維對象在出訪期間的相關維安工作是國安局主要的責任，所以一般在行程規劃的過程當中，我們大概就會派出我們的前置人員來瞭解可能維安對象到國外訪問的定點有哪些，先做必要的現勘，也會在現勘之後做好完備的安維整備計畫，再來提供相關的人力配置，以確保這次的出訪行程可以萬全。另外，在過程當中我們也都跟當地的警察部門及安全部門保持非常密切的聯繫，在現場的相關交通動線以及不同場地的維安部署都會有密切的合作計畫。當然，最重要的還是情資的掌握，假如當地有任何可能會威脅到我們安維對象安全的任何情資，我們一定會在第一時間通報並做必要的應處。","至於委員剛剛所提到的蕭女士在歐洲訪問期間的狀況，簡單跟委員說明一下，當時的狀況並沒有造成車隊的騷擾，主要是有所謂的不明車輛在從機場移動到飯店的過程當中想要尾隨車隊，可是當他開始要尾隨車隊的時候，就已經被我們的維安人員跟當地的警力發現了，第一時間就把他排除掉了，所以並沒有造成任何的驚擾現象，這也反映到我們安維計畫相關整備還算相當的完備了。"],["羅委員美玲：OK，像之前蔡英文總統出訪友邦過境美國的時候，中國那時候發動了所謂的中國僑民，之後我們有看到一些報導，他們所謂的中國僑民其實還是參雜了很多海外警察站的一些成員在裡面，這些海外警察站其實很多都是中國前軍人或情報人員所組成，像這個情資你們有沒有有所掌握？"],["蔡局長明彥：有，正如委員所講的，我們重要的國家元首在過境美國期間，我們確實有感受到中共在當地駐館的相關人員有去動員一些親中的僑團來進行一些陳抗活動，正如剛剛有跟委員報告的，對於這方面的情資，不只是我們局裡面由我們海外的工作人員來做必要的掌蒐，我們跟當地的……"],["羅委員美玲：他們似乎不是單純的僑民吧？是不是？"],["蔡局長明彥：對，我們跟當地的警方及調查單位也都有掌握相關的資訊，這也是為什麼我們在我們的維安對象到達現場之前，對當地大概的情資狀況都能夠掌握的相當不錯的主要原因，因為赴外訪問最重要的就是跟國際合作友方的相關對口部門建立互信、加強合作，應處各種可能的狀況，這確實是外訪期間最重要的工作。"],["羅委員美玲：是，我知道我們的元首要出訪其實很不容易，所以在國安、維安的部分還是要請國安局多加留意。以上，謝謝。"],["蔡局長明彥：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝。接下來請陳永康委員上臺質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":50,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-35-16","speakers":["馬文君","羅美玲","陳永康","徐巧芯","林楚茵","沈伯洋","王定宇","陳冠廷","洪申翰","王鴻薇","洪孟楷","黃國昌","鍾佳濱","楊瓊瓔","林憶君","黃仁","邱志偉","羅智強"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-05-01"],"gazette_id":"1133601","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1133601_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第16次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請國家安全局局長蔡明彥、行政院國土安全辦公室報告「如何強化國家關鍵基礎設施之韌性，\n以因應國安新型態風險威脅」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1133601_00001"}},"transcript":{"id":"151917","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/151917","tool":"pyannote","id":"151917-pyannote"},"job_id":"KUMLkEGseCtgkTmB","queued_at":"2024-05-31 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00:00:04,793\n謝謝主席有請國土辦林主任請國土辦林主任主任不管是說我們國安局的報告或是我們國土辦的報告裏面都有特別提到就是說像國際戰事、恐怖活動其實攻擊關鍵基礎建設就可以達到這個政策、這個民心影響到這個社會的安定\n\n2\n00:00:29,012 --> 00:00:48,640\n當然我們還有看到就是我們國安局這邊還有提到說那也有人員的潛伏那理應外合呢去起這個設施機敏的這個資訊或是刺激破壞設施的這個運作等等那台灣對於這個這些我想我們都已經有一些\n\n3\n00:00:50,657 --> 00:00:52,799\n我會特別提到這個核電廠在2022年烏俄戰爭發生的時候其實俄羅斯那時佔領了這個車諾比這個核電廠\n\n4\n00:01:20,598 --> 00:01:20,638\n羅美玲議員\n\n5\n00:01:36,667 --> 00:01:36,727\n林主任\n\n6\n00:02:07,355 --> 00:02:27,269\n謝謝委員的提醒那這個當然這個能源的設施是關鍵基礎設施的一環那核能更是其中的一部分所以相關的這個電廠的一些防護我們都有一些相關的一些防護計畫從它的脆弱點到它的整個生命週期從它的\n\n7\n00:02:28,089 --> 00:02:28,850\n委員會委員會委員會委員會\n\n8\n00:02:53,564 --> 00:03:01,432\n對,因為我們今天的題目有提到說國安新型態的風險威脅我想這個核廢料我想應該也是屬於這個國安新型態的風險威脅之一因為我們有看到俄烏戰爭所發生車諾比事件這個有些核廢料被竊取的這個事情那它衍生的可能就是還是國安的這個問題\n\n9\n00:03:17,869 --> 00:03:33,745\n巴西的Goyania事故已經到今年9月要發生已經是有37週年了所以這一連串的事件讓我們很擔心就是說因為台灣有核電廠可能衍生的不單單只有放射性的問題可能衍生的是未來跟戰爭\n\n10\n00:03:35,327 --> 00:03:35,367\n羅美玲議員\n\n11\n00:03:51,510 --> 00:03:53,771\n臺灣的核廢料到目前為止它的這個處理的方式還是一再的這個卡關我們可以看到說合一合二的這個乾淨計劃那什麼時候呢能夠啟用那還是一個未知數像我們核廢料其實處理的問題到目前還是未解雖然我們覺得說那未來如果發生\n\n12\n00:04:13,160 --> 00:04:13,180\n吳俄戰爭\n\n13\n00:04:28,647 --> 00:04:33,169\n蔡明彥、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長\n\n14\n00:04:57,780 --> 00:04:58,200\n謝謝主席委員長\n\n15\n00:05:26,397 --> 00:05:26,577\n蔡英文議員\n\n16\n00:05:50,293 --> 00:05:50,993\n國安局長蔡明彥\n\n17\n00:06:17,687 --> 00:06:39,671\n主要的這個工作我想請教就是說未來未來如果說有類似這種狀況的話我們國安局要如何加強跟完善我們正副總統的這個違安的這個工作尤其很多國家我們並沒有執法權像這種騷擾事件或公職事件如果發生的話我們要如何加強保護我們元首的這個違安的這個工作\n\n18\n00:06:40,011 --> 00:07:02,329\n好,謝謝委員那就我們的元首或是我們的安危對象在出訪期間那相關的維安工作是國安局主要的責任所以一般在行程規劃的過程當中我們大概就會派出我們的前置人員來瞭解可能維安對象到國外訪問的定點有哪些做必要的先刊那也會在先刊之後做好完備的安危的整備計畫那再來\n\n19\n00:07:05,211 --> 00:07:21,142\n提供相關的一個人力的配置來確保這一次的出訪行程可以萬全那另外在過程當中我們也都跟當地的警察部門跟安全部門保持非常密切的聯繫在現場的相關的交通的動線以及不同場地的一個維安部署\n\n20\n00:07:21,502 --> 00:07:23,703\n至於委員剛剛所提到的蕭女士在歐洲訪問期間的狀況簡單跟委員說明一下當時的狀況並沒有造成車隊的一個騷擾\n\n21\n00:07:47,299 --> 00:08:08,990\n主要是有所謂的不明的車輛在從機場移動到飯店的過程當中他有想要尾隨車隊可是當他開始要尾隨車隊的話就已經被我們的維安人員跟當地的警力給發現了第一時間就把他排除掉了所以並沒有造成任何的金字老現象那這也反映到我們安危計畫相關的整備還算相關的完備\n\n22\n00:08:12,593 --> 00:08:36,728\n蔡英文總統出訪有幫到過境美國的時候那中國那時候發動的是他們所謂的中國僑民那之後我們有看到一些報導就是說他們所謂的中國僑民其實還是參雜了很多海外警察站的一些成員在裡面那這些海外警察站其實很多都是中國前軍人或情報人員所組成那像這個情資我們有沒有有所掌握\n\n23\n00:08:37,188 --> 00:08:38,489\n他們似乎不是單純的僑名\n\n24\n00:09:02,124 --> 00:09:26,156\n對,我們跟當地的警方也都還有調查單位也都掌握相關的資訊這也是為什麼我們在可能我們的維安對象到達現場之前當地的大概的情資狀況都能夠掌握得相當不錯的主要原因因為赴外訪問最重要的就是跟國際合作友方的相關對口部門建立起互信拿來加強合作,應足各種可能的狀況這確實是外訪期間最重要的工作\n\n25\n00:09:26,596 --> 00:09:26,816\n主席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n650\t4793\t謝謝主席 有請國土辦林主任請國土辦林主任主任 不管是說我們國安局的報告或是我們國土辦的報告裏面都有特別提到就是說像國際戰事、恐怖活動其實攻擊關鍵基礎建設就可以達到這個政策、這個民心影響到這個社會的安定\n29012\t48640\t當然我們還有看到就是我們國安局這邊還有提到說那也有人員的潛伏那理應外合呢去起這個設施機敏的這個資訊或是刺激破壞設施的這個運作等等那台灣對於這個這些我想我們都已經有一些\n50657\t52799\t我會特別提到這個核電廠在2022年烏俄戰爭發生的時候其實俄羅斯那時佔領了這個車諾比這個核電廠\n80598\t80638\t羅美玲議員\n96667\t96727\t林主任\n127355\t147269\t謝謝委員的提醒那這個當然這個能源的設施是關鍵基礎設施的一環那核能更是其中的一部分所以相關的這個電廠的一些防護我們都有一些相關的一些防護計畫從它的脆弱點到它的整個生命週期從它的\n148089\t148850\t委員會委員會委員會委員會\n173564\t181432\t對,因為我們今天的題目有提到說國安新型態的風險威脅我想這個核廢料我想應該也是屬於這個國安新型態的風險威脅之一因為我們有看到俄烏戰爭所發生車諾比事件這個有些核廢料被竊取的這個事情那它衍生的可能就是還是國安的這個問題\n197869\t213745\t巴西的Goyania事故已經到今年9月要發生已經是有37週年了所以這一連串的事件讓我們很擔心就是說因為台灣有核電廠可能衍生的不單單只有放射性的問題可能衍生的是未來跟戰爭\n215327\t215367\t羅美玲議員\n231510\t233771\t臺灣的核廢料到目前為止它的這個處理的方式還是一再的這個卡關我們可以看到說合一合二的這個乾淨計劃那什麼時候呢能夠啟用那還是一個未知數像我們核廢料其實處理的問題到目前還是未解雖然我們覺得說那未來如果發生\n253160\t253180\t吳俄戰爭\n268647\t273169\t蔡明彥、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長\n297780\t298200\t謝謝主席委員長\n326397\t326577\t蔡英文議員\n350293\t350993\t國安局長蔡明彥\n377687\t399671\t主要的這個工作我想請教就是說未來未來如果說有類似這種狀況的話我們國安局要如何加強跟完善我們正副總統的這個違安的這個工作尤其很多國家我們並沒有執法權像這種騷擾事件或公職事件如果發生的話我們要如何加強保護我們元首的這個違安的這個工作\n400011\t422329\t好,謝謝委員那就我們的元首或是我們的安危對象在出訪期間那相關的維安工作是國安局主要的責任所以一般在行程規劃的過程當中我們大概就會派出我們的前置人員來瞭解可能維安對象到國外訪問的定點有哪些做必要的先刊那也會在先刊之後做好完備的安危的整備計畫那再來\n425211\t441142\t提供相關的一個人力的配置來確保這一次的出訪行程可以萬全那另外在過程當中我們也都跟當地的警察部門跟安全部門保持非常密切的聯繫在現場的相關的交通的動線以及不同場地的一個維安部署\n441502\t443703\t至於委員剛剛所提到的蕭女士在歐洲訪問期間的狀況簡單跟委員說明一下當時的狀況並沒有造成車隊的一個騷擾\n467299\t488990\t主要是有所謂的不明的車輛在從機場移動到飯店的過程當中他有想要尾隨車隊可是當他開始要尾隨車隊的話就已經被我們的維安人員跟當地的警力給發現了第一時間就把他排除掉了所以並沒有造成任何的金字老現象那這也反映到我們安危計畫相關的整備還算相關的完備\n492593\t516728\t蔡英文總統出訪有幫到過境美國的時候那中國那時候發動的是他們所謂的中國僑民那之後我們有看到一些報導就是說他們所謂的中國僑民其實還是參雜了很多海外警察站的一些成員在裡面那這些海外警察站其實很多都是中國前軍人或情報人員所組成那像這個情資我們有沒有有所掌握\n517188\t518489\t他們似乎不是單純的僑名\n542124\t566156\t對,我們跟當地的警方也都還有調查單位也都掌握相關的資訊這也是為什麼我們在可能我們的維安對象到達現場之前當地的大概的情資狀況都能夠掌握得相當不錯的主要原因因為赴外訪問最重要的就是跟國際合作友方的相關對口部門建立起互信拿來加強合作,應足各種可能的狀況這確實是外訪期間最重要的工作\n566596\t566816\t主席\n","txt":"謝謝主席 有請國土辦林主任請國土辦林主任主任 不管是說我們國安局的報告或是我們國土辦的報告裏面都有特別提到就是說像國際戰事、恐怖活動其實攻擊關鍵基礎建設就可以達到這個政策、這個民心影響到這個社會的安定\n當然我們還有看到就是我們國安局這邊還有提到說那也有人員的潛伏那理應外合呢去起這個設施機敏的這個資訊或是刺激破壞設施的這個運作等等那台灣對於這個這些我想我們都已經有一些\n我會特別提到這個核電廠在2022年烏俄戰爭發生的時候其實俄羅斯那時佔領了這個車諾比這個核電廠\n羅美玲議員\n林主任\n謝謝委員的提醒那這個當然這個能源的設施是關鍵基礎設施的一環那核能更是其中的一部分所以相關的這個電廠的一些防護我們都有一些相關的一些防護計畫從它的脆弱點到它的整個生命週期從它的\n委員會委員會委員會委員會\n對,因為我們今天的題目有提到說國安新型態的風險威脅我想這個核廢料我想應該也是屬於這個國安新型態的風險威脅之一因為我們有看到俄烏戰爭所發生車諾比事件這個有些核廢料被竊取的這個事情那它衍生的可能就是還是國安的這個問題\n巴西的Goyania事故已經到今年9月要發生已經是有37週年了所以這一連串的事件讓我們很擔心就是說因為台灣有核電廠可能衍生的不單單只有放射性的問題可能衍生的是未來跟戰爭\n羅美玲議員\n臺灣的核廢料到目前為止它的這個處理的方式還是一再的這個卡關我們可以看到說合一合二的這個乾淨計劃那什麼時候呢能夠啟用那還是一個未知數像我們核廢料其實處理的問題到目前還是未解雖然我們覺得說那未來如果發生\n吳俄戰爭\n蔡明彥、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長\n謝謝主席委員長\n蔡英文議員\n國安局長蔡明彥\n主要的這個工作我想請教就是說未來未來如果說有類似這種狀況的話我們國安局要如何加強跟完善我們正副總統的這個違安的這個工作尤其很多國家我們並沒有執法權像這種騷擾事件或公職事件如果發生的話我們要如何加強保護我們元首的這個違安的這個工作\n好,謝謝委員那就我們的元首或是我們的安危對象在出訪期間那相關的維安工作是國安局主要的責任所以一般在行程規劃的過程當中我們大概就會派出我們的前置人員來瞭解可能維安對象到國外訪問的定點有哪些做必要的先刊那也會在先刊之後做好完備的安危的整備計畫那再來\n提供相關的一個人力的配置來確保這一次的出訪行程可以萬全那另外在過程當中我們也都跟當地的警察部門跟安全部門保持非常密切的聯繫在現場的相關的交通的動線以及不同場地的一個維安部署\n至於委員剛剛所提到的蕭女士在歐洲訪問期間的狀況簡單跟委員說明一下當時的狀況並沒有造成車隊的一個騷擾\n主要是有所謂的不明的車輛在從機場移動到飯店的過程當中他有想要尾隨車隊可是當他開始要尾隨車隊的話就已經被我們的維安人員跟當地的警力給發現了第一時間就把他排除掉了所以並沒有造成任何的金字老現象那這也反映到我們安危計畫相關的整備還算相關的完備\n蔡英文總統出訪有幫到過境美國的時候那中國那時候發動的是他們所謂的中國僑民那之後我們有看到一些報導就是說他們所謂的中國僑民其實還是參雜了很多海外警察站的一些成員在裡面那這些海外警察站其實很多都是中國前軍人或情報人員所組成那像這個情資我們有沒有有所掌握\n他們似乎不是單純的僑名\n對,我們跟當地的警方也都還有調查單位也都掌握相關的資訊這也是為什麼我們在可能我們的維安對象到達現場之前當地的大概的情資狀況都能夠掌握得相當不錯的主要原因因為赴外訪問最重要的就是跟國際合作友方的相關對口部門建立起互信拿來加強合作,應足各種可能的狀況這確實是外訪期間最重要的工作\n主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.650 --> 00:04.793\n謝謝主席有請國土辦林主任請國土辦林主任主任不管是說我們國安局的報告或是我們國土辦的報告裏面都有特別提到就是說像國際戰事、恐怖活動其實攻擊關鍵基礎建設就可以達到這個政策、這個民心影響到這個社會的安定\n\n00:29.012 --> 00:48.640\n當然我們還有看到就是我們國安局這邊還有提到說那也有人員的潛伏那理應外合呢去起這個設施機敏的這個資訊或是刺激破壞設施的這個運作等等那台灣對於這個這些我想我們都已經有一些\n\n00:50.657 --> 00:52.799\n我會特別提到這個核電廠在2022年烏俄戰爭發生的時候其實俄羅斯那時佔領了這個車諾比這個核電廠\n\n01:20.598 --> 01:20.638\n羅美玲議員\n\n01:36.667 --> 01:36.727\n林主任\n\n02:07.355 --> 02:27.269\n謝謝委員的提醒那這個當然這個能源的設施是關鍵基礎設施的一環那核能更是其中的一部分所以相關的這個電廠的一些防護我們都有一些相關的一些防護計畫從它的脆弱點到它的整個生命週期從它的\n\n02:28.089 --> 02:28.850\n委員會委員會委員會委員會\n\n02:53.564 --> 03:01.432\n對,因為我們今天的題目有提到說國安新型態的風險威脅我想這個核廢料我想應該也是屬於這個國安新型態的風險威脅之一因為我們有看到俄烏戰爭所發生車諾比事件這個有些核廢料被竊取的這個事情那它衍生的可能就是還是國安的這個問題\n\n03:17.869 --> 03:33.745\n巴西的Goyania事故已經到今年9月要發生已經是有37週年了所以這一連串的事件讓我們很擔心就是說因為台灣有核電廠可能衍生的不單單只有放射性的問題可能衍生的是未來跟戰爭\n\n03:35.327 --> 03:35.367\n羅美玲議員\n\n03:51.510 --> 03:53.771\n臺灣的核廢料到目前為止它的這個處理的方式還是一再的這個卡關我們可以看到說合一合二的這個乾淨計劃那什麼時候呢能夠啟用那還是一個未知數像我們核廢料其實處理的問題到目前還是未解雖然我們覺得說那未來如果發生\n\n04:13.160 --> 04:13.180\n吳俄戰爭\n\n04:28.647 --> 04:33.169\n蔡明彥、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長\n\n04:57.780 --> 04:58.200\n謝謝主席委員長\n\n05:26.397 --> 05:26.577\n蔡英文議員\n\n05:50.293 --> 05:50.993\n國安局長蔡明彥\n\n06:17.687 --> 06:39.671\n主要的這個工作我想請教就是說未來未來如果說有類似這種狀況的話我們國安局要如何加強跟完善我們正副總統的這個違安的這個工作尤其很多國家我們並沒有執法權像這種騷擾事件或公職事件如果發生的話我們要如何加強保護我們元首的這個違安的這個工作\n\n06:40.011 --> 07:02.329\n好,謝謝委員那就我們的元首或是我們的安危對象在出訪期間那相關的維安工作是國安局主要的責任所以一般在行程規劃的過程當中我們大概就會派出我們的前置人員來瞭解可能維安對象到國外訪問的定點有哪些做必要的先刊那也會在先刊之後做好完備的安危的整備計畫那再來\n\n07:05.211 --> 07:21.142\n提供相關的一個人力的配置來確保這一次的出訪行程可以萬全那另外在過程當中我們也都跟當地的警察部門跟安全部門保持非常密切的聯繫在現場的相關的交通的動線以及不同場地的一個維安部署\n\n07:21.502 --> 07:23.703\n至於委員剛剛所提到的蕭女士在歐洲訪問期間的狀況簡單跟委員說明一下當時的狀況並沒有造成車隊的一個騷擾\n\n07:47.299 --> 08:08.990\n主要是有所謂的不明的車輛在從機場移動到飯店的過程當中他有想要尾隨車隊可是當他開始要尾隨車隊的話就已經被我們的維安人員跟當地的警力給發現了第一時間就把他排除掉了所以並沒有造成任何的金字老現象那這也反映到我們安危計畫相關的整備還算相關的完備\n\n08:12.593 --> 08:36.728\n蔡英文總統出訪有幫到過境美國的時候那中國那時候發動的是他們所謂的中國僑民那之後我們有看到一些報導就是說他們所謂的中國僑民其實還是參雜了很多海外警察站的一些成員在裡面那這些海外警察站其實很多都是中國前軍人或情報人員所組成那像這個情資我們有沒有有所掌握\n\n08:37.188 --> 08:38.489\n他們似乎不是單純的僑名\n\n09:02.124 --> 09:26.156\n對,我們跟當地的警方也都還有調查單位也都掌握相關的資訊這也是為什麼我們在可能我們的維安對象到達現場之前當地的大概的情資狀況都能夠掌握得相當不錯的主要原因因為赴外訪問最重要的就是跟國際合作友方的相關對口部門建立起互信拿來加強合作,應足各種可能的狀況這確實是外訪期間最重要的工作\n\n09:26.596 --> 09:26.816\n主席\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.65,"end":4.793,"text":"謝謝主席 有請國土辦林主任請國土辦林主任主任 不管是說我們國安局的報告或是我們國土辦的報告裏面都有特別提到就是說像國際戰事、恐怖活動其實攻擊關鍵基礎建設就可以達到這個政策、這個民心影響到這個社會的安定"},{"start":29.012,"end":48.64,"text":"當然我們還有看到就是我們國安局這邊還有提到說那也有人員的潛伏那理應外合呢去起這個設施機敏的這個資訊或是刺激破壞設施的這個運作等等那台灣對於這個這些我想我們都已經有一些"},{"start":50.657,"end":52.799,"text":"我會特別提到這個核電廠在2022年烏俄戰爭發生的時候其實俄羅斯那時佔領了這個車諾比這個核電廠"},{"start":80.598,"end":80.638,"text":"羅美玲議員"},{"start":96.667,"end":96.727,"text":"林主任"},{"start":127.355,"end":147.269,"text":"謝謝委員的提醒那這個當然這個能源的設施是關鍵基礎設施的一環那核能更是其中的一部分所以相關的這個電廠的一些防護我們都有一些相關的一些防護計畫從它的脆弱點到它的整個生命週期從它的"},{"start":148.089,"end":148.85,"text":"委員會委員會委員會委員會"},{"start":173.564,"end":181.432,"text":"對,因為我們今天的題目有提到說國安新型態的風險威脅我想這個核廢料我想應該也是屬於這個國安新型態的風險威脅之一因為我們有看到俄烏戰爭所發生車諾比事件這個有些核廢料被竊取的這個事情那它衍生的可能就是還是國安的這個問題"},{"start":197.869,"end":213.745,"text":"巴西的Goyania事故已經到今年9月要發生已經是有37週年了所以這一連串的事件讓我們很擔心就是說因為台灣有核電廠可能衍生的不單單只有放射性的問題可能衍生的是未來跟戰爭"},{"start":215.327,"end":215.367,"text":"羅美玲議員"},{"start":231.51,"end":233.771,"text":"臺灣的核廢料到目前為止它的這個處理的方式還是一再的這個卡關我們可以看到說合一合二的這個乾淨計劃那什麼時候呢能夠啟用那還是一個未知數像我們核廢料其實處理的問題到目前還是未解雖然我們覺得說那未來如果發生"},{"start":253.16,"end":253.18,"text":"吳俄戰爭"},{"start":268.647,"end":273.169,"text":"蔡明彥、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長蔡明彬、行政院國土安全局局長"},{"start":297.78,"end":298.2,"text":"謝謝主席委員長"},{"start":326.397,"end":326.577,"text":"蔡英文議員"},{"start":350.293,"end":350.993,"text":"國安局長蔡明彥"},{"start":377.687,"end":399.671,"text":"主要的這個工作我想請教就是說未來未來如果說有類似這種狀況的話我們國安局要如何加強跟完善我們正副總統的這個違安的這個工作尤其很多國家我們並沒有執法權像這種騷擾事件或公職事件如果發生的話我們要如何加強保護我們元首的這個違安的這個工作"},{"start":400.011,"end":422.329,"text":"好,謝謝委員那就我們的元首或是我們的安危對象在出訪期間那相關的維安工作是國安局主要的責任所以一般在行程規劃的過程當中我們大概就會派出我們的前置人員來瞭解可能維安對象到國外訪問的定點有哪些做必要的先刊那也會在先刊之後做好完備的安危的整備計畫那再來"},{"start":425.211,"end":441.142,"text":"提供相關的一個人力的配置來確保這一次的出訪行程可以萬全那另外在過程當中我們也都跟當地的警察部門跟安全部門保持非常密切的聯繫在現場的相關的交通的動線以及不同場地的一個維安部署"},{"start":441.502,"end":443.703,"text":"至於委員剛剛所提到的蕭女士在歐洲訪問期間的狀況簡單跟委員說明一下當時的狀況並沒有造成車隊的一個騷擾"},{"start":467.299,"end":488.99,"text":"主要是有所謂的不明的車輛在從機場移動到飯店的過程當中他有想要尾隨車隊可是當他開始要尾隨車隊的話就已經被我們的維安人員跟當地的警力給發現了第一時間就把他排除掉了所以並沒有造成任何的金字老現象那這也反映到我們安危計畫相關的整備還算相關的完備"},{"start":492.593,"end":516.728,"text":"蔡英文總統出訪有幫到過境美國的時候那中國那時候發動的是他們所謂的中國僑民那之後我們有看到一些報導就是說他們所謂的中國僑民其實還是參雜了很多海外警察站的一些成員在裡面那這些海外警察站其實很多都是中國前軍人或情報人員所組成那像這個情資我們有沒有有所掌握"},{"start":517.188,"end":518.489,"text":"他們似乎不是單純的僑名"},{"start":542.124,"end":566.156,"text":"對,我們跟當地的警方也都還有調查單位也都掌握相關的資訊這也是為什麼我們在可能我們的維安對象到達現場之前當地的大概的情資狀況都能夠掌握得相當不錯的主要原因因為赴外訪問最重要的就是跟國際合作友方的相關對口部門建立起互信拿來加強合作,應足各種可能的狀況這確實是外訪期間最重要的工作"},{"start":566.596,"end":566.816,"text":"主席"}]}}}}