{"id":152133,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/152133","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/6f015fe8e6787db1cf7fe29199348e700cbbe991ada1931c55be169921a0a7175436eb6fd3cf38f45ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"范雲","委員發言時間":"12:38:10 - 12:46:17","影片長度":"00:08:07","會議時間":"2024-05-02T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第10次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請教育部列席就「『偏遠地區學校教育發展條例』施行迄今之成效及檢討」進行專題報告，並備質詢。\n二、審查(一)委員柯志恩等18人擬具「偏遠地區學校教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案」案。(二)委員魯明哲等24人擬具「偏遠地區學校教育發展條例第十六條條文修正草案」案。(三)委員馬文君等17人擬具「偏遠地區學校教育發展條例第十六條及第十九條條文修正草案」案。(四)委員盧縣一等20人擬具「偏遠地區學校教育發展條例第八條、第十二條及第二十一條條文修正草案」案。\n(僅進行詢答)【4月29日及5月2日二天一次會】）","date":"2024-05-02","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第10次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":10,"committees":[22],"id":"委員會-11-1-22-10"},"duration":487,"end_time":"2024-05-02T12:46:17+08:00","start_time":"2024-05-02T12:38:10+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":999,"blocks":[["范委員雲：（12時38分）謝謝召委，有請部長。"],["主席：有請部長。"],["潘部長文忠：范委員好。"],["范委員雲：部長午安，謝謝部長在之前我為花蓮服務的時候，也都非常關心花蓮偏遠教育的各種設施。今天召委安排這個主題，主要是偏遠地區這個部分想要修法跟師資的問題，剛剛我聽了滿多你對委員的詢答，我想您應該會同意偏遠地區目前師資還是很不足夠吧？"],["潘部長文忠：我應該這樣子說，偏遠地區在招聘老師是有碰到困難，以目前我們師資的培育量，也就是儲備量，對應於這個缺額其實是超過的，只是說他們有沒有意願就任。這幾年，應該說連續3年，我們要求地方政府要正式提出專職的正式缺額，每年大概有四千多到五千位，這裡面還要把偏鄉學校的缺額開出來，雖然不是說完全怎麼樣，但是讓偏鄉找得到老師。"],["范委員雲：雖然是找得到老師，但是從跟教育部的索資裡面看這個資料，第一個，從2017年看起來其實流動率是下降的，但是如果看流動率的話，國小的部分，偏鄉地區的流動率比一般地區的國小高，國中的部分更是嚴重，所以如果就優先來講的話，偏遠地區國中的流動率是相當高，至少比起一般地區高滿多的。"],["潘部長文忠：一定會比一般地區高。"],["范委員雲：但是也要肯定的是，從2018年底開始，其實是有在慢慢下降。但是我們辦公室跟教育部索資，這是我們從你們的資料中自己做的圖，代理教師的部分，淺色是一般地區，深色是偏遠地區，綠色是小學，棕色是國中，真的是偏遠地區代理教師的比例比全國高很多，國中小總人數是4,600人，等於偏遠地區大概是每4位教師就有1位代理教師，當然我們了解這一定會對教育及學生的學習有影響。","回來看目前的解方，去年教育部有報告過，教育部做了很多的努力，包含制定偏遠條例經費補助培育公費生等。今天我想針對偏遠條例第八條第二項的規定來討論，簡單來講就是長期任教偏遠地區的代理教師可以免費參加師培課，取得教師證，也就是可以讓他們參加特別開設的學士後學分班取得正式教師證，據此提高偏遠地區學校的教學品質，也提高教師的勞動權益，我覺得這是很好的設計。可是我想部長應該了解目前實際的情形，我們看了一下實際情形，其實全台灣去年只有臺南大學有開課，開1班，收60個人，部長知道哪裡有問題嗎？只有收60個人，我們剛剛講的代理教師是四千多人。"],["潘部長文忠：跟委員報告，因為條例在當時也是一個鼓勵，我們有建議專聘教師的制度，有做一些跟久任相關的規範，也有用公費做師培並有機會取得。"],["范委員雲：了解。"],["潘部長文忠：確實在源頭就是這幾年因為我們大量釋出正式教師缺額，縣市也辦甄選，所以變成在執行正式教師專聘的人數透過數字看得出來比較不夠，所以就會衍生這樣的資格去參與師培人數就不是那麼多。"],["范委員雲：我想這裡面還是有一些環環相扣的問題，至少就這個部分我看到的是學分班分成兩大類，一類是偏遠地區免費參加，另外一類也就是第2類、第3類是各校自聘的無證代理教師自費參加。整個學分班目前開辦的時間說實在的也不長，只有3年，那我們現在看到110年、112年的資訊，屬於第1類免費的人數都很少。就我的理解，我覺得這部分，第1個，只有開國小的學分班，可是我前面給部長看到的國中教師的流動率、代理教師的比例是更高的，所以不知道為什麼只有開國小；第二個，它又規定如果沒有第1類人員就不開班，實際上第1類人員全臺只剩澎湖縣有，112年第1類報名者只有3人。就這個部分來講，部長是不是可以考慮一下，我從這個部分的了解，第一個，未來應該要加開中學的類科。因為至少從前面來講，不管是就流動率或是代理教師的比例，國中都比國小嚴重。第二個，符合資格的自費者為什麼不能單獨報名？為什麼一定要有公費者才能開班？這是第二個我要請部長去理解的，不需要一定要綁公費者才能開班。第三個，教育部應該要評估，現行自費者搭配久留偏遠服務配套，是否可提供公費之可能性？我覺得這樣可能就會更完善，讓這個方式更符合我們期待的公共利益。"],["潘部長文忠：剛才司長有提到中學的部分會在113學年度開班，不會只有小學，這個表示第一個……"],["范委員雲：過去幾年為什麼沒有開中學，只有開小學？"],["潘部長文忠：當時數量確實不是非常足夠，現在已經走了一段時間，應該比較穩定。至於學校自辦甄選跟我們原來有的專聘制度，專聘制度正是條例裡面很重要的精神，它就是結合久任的概念然後給激勵，當然自聘的數量跟時間要不要再擴大規模，召委也提了這個修法概念，我是想說是不是允許教育部要整體評估一個量，因為現在我們掌握到的全部師資培育量、儲備量其實是又大過於滿多未來開缺的可能性。"],["范委員雲：了解。"],["潘部長文忠：所以在這裡面怎麼斟酌，讓偏遠留得下來……"],["范委員雲：所以如果是偏遠地區有需要的話，是不是能夠有這些相關條件的評估？"],["潘部長文忠：對，這個要綜整看，比較不宜說全面開放或怎麼樣，如果能夠增加一些對偏鄉有意義的師資留任之下，對於自辦能不能有適度的條件，我想我們在這上面來斟酌，也不至於說儲備量過大。"],["范委員雲：我其實就是希望教育部做一個謹慎的評估，就是現行自費者如果搭配久留偏遠服務配套的話，那就評估是不是有公費的可能性，好不好？"],["潘部長文忠：我覺得這樣的斟酌會比較可行。"],["范委員雲：第一個，您剛剛講了，馬上就會開，第二個跟第三個的部分是不是可以在一個月之內給我辦公室一個你們的初步評估報告，好嗎？"],["潘部長文忠：一個月可以，謝謝。"],["范委員雲：謝謝潘部長。"],["主席：謝謝兩位。","接下來請楊瓊瓔委員、楊瓊瓔委員、楊瓊瓔委員。","請邱志偉委員，質詢時間4分鐘。"],["邱委員志偉：4分鐘喔？"],["主席：4分鐘。"],["邱委員志偉：我很準時。"],["主席：好，謝謝。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":378,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-10","speakers":["柯志恩","盧縣一","萬美玲","洪孟楷","葛如鈞","吳沛憶","林宜瑾","陳培瑜","葉元之","郭昱晴","陳秀寳","羅廷瑋","張雅琳","吳春城","林倩綺","徐富癸","何欣純","黃仁","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","鍾佳濱","范雲","邱志偉","黃珊珊","劉建國"],"page_start":311,"meetingDate":["2024-05-02"],"gazette_id":"1133901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1133901_00006"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第10次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、邀請教育部列席就「『偏遠地區學校教育發展條例』施行迄今之成效及檢討」進行專題報\n告，並備質詢；二、審查(一)委員柯志恩等18人擬具「偏遠地區學校教育發展條例第八條條文修\n正草案」案、(二)委員魯明哲等24人擬具「偏遠地區學校教育發展條例第十六條條文修正草案」\n案、( 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00:00:37,774\n部長午安謝謝部長之前我在為花蓮服務的時候也都非常關心花蓮的偏遠教育的各種設施今天因為召委安排這個主題主要是偏遠地區這個部分想要修法跟施肢的問題剛剛我聽了蠻多您對委員的選答我想您應該會同意就是偏遠地區目前施肢還是很不足夠吧\n\n3\n00:00:39,260 --> 00:01:00,366\n我應該這樣子說偏遠地區在招聘老師是有碰到困難那以目前我們的師資的培育量就是儲備量其實看對應於這個缺額其實是超過只是說他們有沒有意願到那這幾年這應該說連續三年我們是要求地方政府要釋放要正式提出專職的\n\n4\n00:01:01,886 --> 00:01:30,063\n教育發展條例第八條條文修正式缺額每年大概有4000多位到5000這個裡面還要把偏鄉學校的缺額開出來這個等於有一點點雖然也不是完全說怎麼樣但是讓偏鄉是找得到老師那找得到老師但是我想我們是從耳根教育部的所資裡面看這個資料第一個就是你看起來就是從2017年其實這個圖是那個流動率那流動率是下降的\n\n5\n00:01:30,983 --> 00:01:33,185\n學校教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案例第八條條文修正草案案例\n\n6\n00:01:57,119 --> 00:02:13,944\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會\n\n7\n00:02:27,268 --> 00:02:50,242\n當然我們了解這一定會對教育對學生的學習有影響我們再回來看目前的解方去年教育部有報告過教育部做了很多的努力包含制定偏遠條例經費補助培育公費生等等今天我想針對偏遠條例第八條第二項的規定\n\n8\n00:02:51,863 --> 00:02:53,585\n教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案。\n\n9\n00:03:14,426 --> 00:03:17,929\n全台灣去年只有台南大學開一班收60個人部長知道哪裡有問題嗎只有收60個人我們剛講那個代理教室是4000多人\n\n10\n00:03:40,388 --> 00:03:59,033\n公文報告因為在條例當時就也是一個鼓勵我們有建立那個專聘教師的制度有做一些比較也是跟就是9任有相關的規範但也有給這個他們可以用公費去做後面施培有機會取得\n\n11\n00:03:59,733 --> 00:04:19,870\n所以這個確實在源頭就是這幾年因為我們大量釋出正式教師缺額縣市也辦甄選所以變成在執行專聘教師的這部分的人數是相對的因為數字可以看得出來是比較不夠所以就會衍生說就是這樣的資格去參與施培人數就不是那麼多了\n\n12\n00:04:20,748 --> 00:04:21,988\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第18條文修正草案案。\n\n13\n00:04:40,194 --> 00:04:50,419\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會\n\n14\n00:04:58,882 --> 00:05:19,989\n只有開國小學分班,但是我前面給部長看到的國中教師的流動率、代理教師比率就是更高的,所以不知道為什麼只有開國小。第二個,他又規定如果沒有第一類人員就不開班。實際上第一類人員全台只剩澎湖縣有,112年的第一類報名者只有3人。\n\n15\n00:05:23,370 --> 00:05:23,650\n公費者才能開班\n\n16\n00:05:53,690 --> 00:06:11,477\n第二、要請部長理解不需要一定要綁公費者才能開班第三、教育部應該評估現行自費者是否搭配久留偏遠服務的配套是否可以提供公費之可能性讓這方式更符合我們期待的公共利益\n\n17\n00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:22,544\n國中中學的部分會在1、1、3學年度開班,不會只有小學。過去幾年為什麼沒有開中學?因為當時的數量確實不是非常足夠。現在已經走了一段時間,應該比較穩定,國中應該。\n\n18\n00:06:36,801 --> 00:06:44,666\n那至於自費應該說學校自辦甄選的跟我們原來有一個專聘制度專聘制度這是條例裡面一個很重要的精神它就是結合9任的概念然後給激勵那當然自聘的這個數量跟時間要不要再有一個規模擴大因為柯昭惟這邊也提了這個修法的概念我是說是不是允許教育部要整體評估一個量\n\n19\n00:07:06,121 --> 00:07:20,274\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會\n\n20\n00:07:21,135 --> 00:07:25,299\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第12屆第13屆第14屆第14屆第15屆第16屆第17屆第18屆第18屆第18屆第19屆第19屆第20屆第20屆第21屆第21屆第22屆第21屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22\n\n21\n00:07:41,795 --> 00:08:05,655\n我其實就是希望教育部做一個謹慎的評估就是現行自費者如果搭配九流偏遠服務配套的話那就評估是不是有一個公費的可能性好不好我覺得這樣的斟酌會比較可行第一個您剛講馬上就會開了嘛那二跟三的部分是不是可以在一個月之內給我辦公室一個你們的初步評估報告好嗎可以一個月好謝謝潘部長\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n3660\t5890\t教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會\n10919\t37774\t部長午安謝謝部長之前我在為花蓮服務的時候也都非常關心花蓮的偏遠教育的各種設施今天因為召委安排這個主題主要是偏遠地區這個部分想要修法跟施肢的問題剛剛我聽了蠻多您對委員的選答我想您應該會同意就是偏遠地區目前施肢還是很不足夠吧\n39260\t60366\t我應該這樣子說偏遠地區在招聘老師是有碰到困難那以目前我們的師資的培育量就是儲備量其實看對應於這個缺額其實是超過只是說他們有沒有意願到那這幾年這應該說連續三年我們是要求地方政府要釋放要正式提出專職的\n61886\t90063\t教育發展條例第八條條文修正式缺額每年大概有4000多位到5000這個裡面還要把偏鄉學校的缺額開出來這個等於有一點點雖然也不是完全說怎麼樣但是讓偏鄉是找得到老師那找得到老師但是我想我們是從耳根教育部的所資裡面看這個資料第一個就是你看起來就是從2017年其實這個圖是那個流動率那流動率是下降的\n90983\t93185\t學校教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案例第八條條文修正草案案例\n117119\t133944\t教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會\n147268\t170242\t當然我們了解這一定會對教育對學生的學習有影響我們再回來看目前的解方去年教育部有報告過教育部做了很多的努力包含制定偏遠條例經費補助培育公費生等等今天我想針對偏遠條例第八條第二項的規定\n171863\t173585\t教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案。\n194426\t197929\t全台灣去年只有台南大學開一班收60個人部長知道哪裡有問題嗎只有收60個人我們剛講那個代理教室是4000多人\n220388\t239033\t公文報告因為在條例當時就也是一個鼓勵我們有建立那個專聘教師的制度有做一些比較也是跟就是9任有相關的規範但也有給這個他們可以用公費去做後面施培有機會取得\n239733\t259870\t所以這個確實在源頭就是這幾年因為我們大量釋出正式教師缺額縣市也辦甄選所以變成在執行專聘教師的這部分的人數是相對的因為數字可以看得出來是比較不夠所以就會衍生說就是這樣的資格去參與施培人數就不是那麼多了\n260748\t261988\t教育及文化委員會第11屆第18條文修正草案案。\n280194\t290419\t教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會\n298882\t319989\t只有開國小學分班,但是我前面給部長看到的國中教師的流動率、代理教師比率就是更高的,所以不知道為什麼只有開國小。第二個,他又規定如果沒有第一類人員就不開班。實際上第一類人員全台只剩澎湖縣有,112年的第一類報名者只有3人。\n323370\t323650\t公費者才能開班\n353690\t371477\t第二、要請部長理解不需要一定要綁公費者才能開班第三、教育部應該評估現行自費者是否搭配久留偏遠服務的配套是否可以提供公費之可能性讓這方式更符合我們期待的公共利益\n379040\t382544\t國中中學的部分會在1、1、3學年度開班,不會只有小學。過去幾年為什麼沒有開中學?因為當時的數量確實不是非常足夠。現在已經走了一段時間,應該比較穩定,國中應該。\n396801\t404666\t那至於自費應該說學校自辦甄選的跟我們原來有一個專聘制度專聘制度這是條例裡面一個很重要的精神它就是結合9任的概念然後給激勵那當然自聘的這個數量跟時間要不要再有一個規模擴大因為柯昭惟這邊也提了這個修法的概念我是說是不是允許教育部要整體評估一個量\n426121\t440274\t教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會\n441135\t445299\t教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第12屆第13屆第14屆第14屆第15屆第16屆第17屆第18屆第18屆第18屆第19屆第19屆第20屆第20屆第21屆第21屆第22屆第21屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22\n461795\t485655\t我其實就是希望教育部做一個謹慎的評估就是現行自費者如果搭配九流偏遠服務配套的話那就評估是不是有一個公費的可能性好不好我覺得這樣的斟酌會比較可行第一個您剛講馬上就會開了嘛那二跟三的部分是不是可以在一個月之內給我辦公室一個你們的初步評估報告好嗎可以一個月好謝謝潘部長\n","txt":"教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會\n部長午安謝謝部長之前我在為花蓮服務的時候也都非常關心花蓮的偏遠教育的各種設施今天因為召委安排這個主題主要是偏遠地區這個部分想要修法跟施肢的問題剛剛我聽了蠻多您對委員的選答我想您應該會同意就是偏遠地區目前施肢還是很不足夠吧\n我應該這樣子說偏遠地區在招聘老師是有碰到困難那以目前我們的師資的培育量就是儲備量其實看對應於這個缺額其實是超過只是說他們有沒有意願到那這幾年這應該說連續三年我們是要求地方政府要釋放要正式提出專職的\n教育發展條例第八條條文修正式缺額每年大概有4000多位到5000這個裡面還要把偏鄉學校的缺額開出來這個等於有一點點雖然也不是完全說怎麼樣但是讓偏鄉是找得到老師那找得到老師但是我想我們是從耳根教育部的所資裡面看這個資料第一個就是你看起來就是從2017年其實這個圖是那個流動率那流動率是下降的\n學校教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案例第八條條文修正草案案例\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會\n當然我們了解這一定會對教育對學生的學習有影響我們再回來看目前的解方去年教育部有報告過教育部做了很多的努力包含制定偏遠條例經費補助培育公費生等等今天我想針對偏遠條例第八條第二項的規定\n教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案。\n全台灣去年只有台南大學開一班收60個人部長知道哪裡有問題嗎只有收60個人我們剛講那個代理教室是4000多人\n公文報告因為在條例當時就也是一個鼓勵我們有建立那個專聘教師的制度有做一些比較也是跟就是9任有相關的規範但也有給這個他們可以用公費去做後面施培有機會取得\n所以這個確實在源頭就是這幾年因為我們大量釋出正式教師缺額縣市也辦甄選所以變成在執行專聘教師的這部分的人數是相對的因為數字可以看得出來是比較不夠所以就會衍生說就是這樣的資格去參與施培人數就不是那麼多了\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第18條文修正草案案。\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會\n只有開國小學分班,但是我前面給部長看到的國中教師的流動率、代理教師比率就是更高的,所以不知道為什麼只有開國小。第二個,他又規定如果沒有第一類人員就不開班。實際上第一類人員全台只剩澎湖縣有,112年的第一類報名者只有3人。\n公費者才能開班\n第二、要請部長理解不需要一定要綁公費者才能開班第三、教育部應該評估現行自費者是否搭配久留偏遠服務的配套是否可以提供公費之可能性讓這方式更符合我們期待的公共利益\n國中中學的部分會在1、1、3學年度開班,不會只有小學。過去幾年為什麼沒有開中學?因為當時的數量確實不是非常足夠。現在已經走了一段時間,應該比較穩定,國中應該。\n那至於自費應該說學校自辦甄選的跟我們原來有一個專聘制度專聘制度這是條例裡面一個很重要的精神它就是結合9任的概念然後給激勵那當然自聘的這個數量跟時間要不要再有一個規模擴大因為柯昭惟這邊也提了這個修法的概念我是說是不是允許教育部要整體評估一個量\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第12屆第13屆第14屆第14屆第15屆第16屆第17屆第18屆第18屆第18屆第19屆第19屆第20屆第20屆第21屆第21屆第22屆第21屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22\n我其實就是希望教育部做一個謹慎的評估就是現行自費者如果搭配九流偏遠服務配套的話那就評估是不是有一個公費的可能性好不好我覺得這樣的斟酌會比較可行第一個您剛講馬上就會開了嘛那二跟三的部分是不是可以在一個月之內給我辦公室一個你們的初步評估報告好嗎可以一個月好謝謝潘部長\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:03.660 --> 00:05.890\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會\n\n00:10.919 --> 00:37.774\n部長午安謝謝部長之前我在為花蓮服務的時候也都非常關心花蓮的偏遠教育的各種設施今天因為召委安排這個主題主要是偏遠地區這個部分想要修法跟施肢的問題剛剛我聽了蠻多您對委員的選答我想您應該會同意就是偏遠地區目前施肢還是很不足夠吧\n\n00:39.260 --> 01:00.366\n我應該這樣子說偏遠地區在招聘老師是有碰到困難那以目前我們的師資的培育量就是儲備量其實看對應於這個缺額其實是超過只是說他們有沒有意願到那這幾年這應該說連續三年我們是要求地方政府要釋放要正式提出專職的\n\n01:01.886 --> 01:30.063\n教育發展條例第八條條文修正式缺額每年大概有4000多位到5000這個裡面還要把偏鄉學校的缺額開出來這個等於有一點點雖然也不是完全說怎麼樣但是讓偏鄉是找得到老師那找得到老師但是我想我們是從耳根教育部的所資裡面看這個資料第一個就是你看起來就是從2017年其實這個圖是那個流動率那流動率是下降的\n\n01:30.983 --> 01:33.185\n學校教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案例第八條條文修正草案案例\n\n01:57.119 --> 02:13.944\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會\n\n02:27.268 --> 02:50.242\n當然我們了解這一定會對教育對學生的學習有影響我們再回來看目前的解方去年教育部有報告過教育部做了很多的努力包含制定偏遠條例經費補助培育公費生等等今天我想針對偏遠條例第八條第二項的規定\n\n02:51.863 --> 02:53.585\n教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案。\n\n03:14.426 --> 03:17.929\n全台灣去年只有台南大學開一班收60個人部長知道哪裡有問題嗎只有收60個人我們剛講那個代理教室是4000多人\n\n03:40.388 --> 03:59.033\n公文報告因為在條例當時就也是一個鼓勵我們有建立那個專聘教師的制度有做一些比較也是跟就是9任有相關的規範但也有給這個他們可以用公費去做後面施培有機會取得\n\n03:59.733 --> 04:19.870\n所以這個確實在源頭就是這幾年因為我們大量釋出正式教師缺額縣市也辦甄選所以變成在執行專聘教師的這部分的人數是相對的因為數字可以看得出來是比較不夠所以就會衍生說就是這樣的資格去參與施培人數就不是那麼多了\n\n04:20.748 --> 04:21.988\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第18條文修正草案案。\n\n04:40.194 --> 04:50.419\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會\n\n04:58.882 --> 05:19.989\n只有開國小學分班,但是我前面給部長看到的國中教師的流動率、代理教師比率就是更高的,所以不知道為什麼只有開國小。第二個,他又規定如果沒有第一類人員就不開班。實際上第一類人員全台只剩澎湖縣有,112年的第一類報名者只有3人。\n\n05:23.370 --> 05:23.650\n公費者才能開班\n\n05:53.690 --> 06:11.477\n第二、要請部長理解不需要一定要綁公費者才能開班第三、教育部應該評估現行自費者是否搭配久留偏遠服務的配套是否可以提供公費之可能性讓這方式更符合我們期待的公共利益\n\n06:19.040 --> 06:22.544\n國中中學的部分會在1、1、3學年度開班,不會只有小學。過去幾年為什麼沒有開中學?因為當時的數量確實不是非常足夠。現在已經走了一段時間,應該比較穩定,國中應該。\n\n06:36.801 --> 06:44.666\n那至於自費應該說學校自辦甄選的跟我們原來有一個專聘制度專聘制度這是條例裡面一個很重要的精神它就是結合9任的概念然後給激勵那當然自聘的這個數量跟時間要不要再有一個規模擴大因為柯昭惟這邊也提了這個修法的概念我是說是不是允許教育部要整體評估一個量\n\n07:06.121 --> 07:20.274\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會\n\n07:21.135 --> 07:25.299\n教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第12屆第13屆第14屆第14屆第15屆第16屆第17屆第18屆第18屆第18屆第19屆第19屆第20屆第20屆第21屆第21屆第22屆第21屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22\n\n07:41.795 --> 08:05.655\n我其實就是希望教育部做一個謹慎的評估就是現行自費者如果搭配九流偏遠服務配套的話那就評估是不是有一個公費的可能性好不好我覺得這樣的斟酌會比較可行第一個您剛講馬上就會開了嘛那二跟三的部分是不是可以在一個月之內給我辦公室一個你們的初步評估報告好嗎可以一個月好謝謝潘部長\n\n","segments":[{"start":3.66,"end":5.89,"text":"教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會"},{"start":10.919,"end":37.774,"text":"部長午安謝謝部長之前我在為花蓮服務的時候也都非常關心花蓮的偏遠教育的各種設施今天因為召委安排這個主題主要是偏遠地區這個部分想要修法跟施肢的問題剛剛我聽了蠻多您對委員的選答我想您應該會同意就是偏遠地區目前施肢還是很不足夠吧"},{"start":39.26,"end":60.366,"text":"我應該這樣子說偏遠地區在招聘老師是有碰到困難那以目前我們的師資的培育量就是儲備量其實看對應於這個缺額其實是超過只是說他們有沒有意願到那這幾年這應該說連續三年我們是要求地方政府要釋放要正式提出專職的"},{"start":61.886,"end":90.063,"text":"教育發展條例第八條條文修正式缺額每年大概有4000多位到5000這個裡面還要把偏鄉學校的缺額開出來這個等於有一點點雖然也不是完全說怎麼樣但是讓偏鄉是找得到老師那找得到老師但是我想我們是從耳根教育部的所資裡面看這個資料第一個就是你看起來就是從2017年其實這個圖是那個流動率那流動率是下降的"},{"start":90.983,"end":93.185,"text":"學校教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案例第八條條文修正草案案例"},{"start":117.119,"end":133.944,"text":"教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會"},{"start":147.268,"end":170.242,"text":"當然我們了解這一定會對教育對學生的學習有影響我們再回來看目前的解方去年教育部有報告過教育部做了很多的努力包含制定偏遠條例經費補助培育公費生等等今天我想針對偏遠條例第八條第二項的規定"},{"start":171.863,"end":173.585,"text":"教育發展條例第八條條文修正草案案。"},{"start":194.426,"end":197.929,"text":"全台灣去年只有台南大學開一班收60個人部長知道哪裡有問題嗎只有收60個人我們剛講那個代理教室是4000多人"},{"start":220.388,"end":239.033,"text":"公文報告因為在條例當時就也是一個鼓勵我們有建立那個專聘教師的制度有做一些比較也是跟就是9任有相關的規範但也有給這個他們可以用公費去做後面施培有機會取得"},{"start":239.733,"end":259.87,"text":"所以這個確實在源頭就是這幾年因為我們大量釋出正式教師缺額縣市也辦甄選所以變成在執行專聘教師的這部分的人數是相對的因為數字可以看得出來是比較不夠所以就會衍生說就是這樣的資格去參與施培人數就不是那麼多了"},{"start":260.748,"end":261.988,"text":"教育及文化委員會第11屆第18條文修正草案案。"},{"start":280.194,"end":290.419,"text":"教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會"},{"start":298.882,"end":319.989,"text":"只有開國小學分班,但是我前面給部長看到的國中教師的流動率、代理教師比率就是更高的,所以不知道為什麼只有開國小。第二個,他又規定如果沒有第一類人員就不開班。實際上第一類人員全台只剩澎湖縣有,112年的第一類報名者只有3人。"},{"start":323.37,"end":323.65,"text":"公費者才能開班"},{"start":353.69,"end":371.477,"text":"第二、要請部長理解不需要一定要綁公費者才能開班第三、教育部應該評估現行自費者是否搭配久留偏遠服務的配套是否可以提供公費之可能性讓這方式更符合我們期待的公共利益"},{"start":379.04,"end":382.544,"text":"國中中學的部分會在1、1、3學年度開班,不會只有小學。過去幾年為什麼沒有開中學?因為當時的數量確實不是非常足夠。現在已經走了一段時間,應該比較穩定,國中應該。"},{"start":396.801,"end":404.666,"text":"那至於自費應該說學校自辦甄選的跟我們原來有一個專聘制度專聘制度這是條例裡面一個很重要的精神它就是結合9任的概念然後給激勵那當然自聘的這個數量跟時間要不要再有一個規模擴大因為柯昭惟這邊也提了這個修法的概念我是說是不是允許教育部要整體評估一個量"},{"start":426.121,"end":440.274,"text":"教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第2會期教育及文化委員會第3會期教育及文化委員會第4會期教育及文化委員會第5會期教育及文化委員會第6會期教育及文化委員會第7會期教育及文化委員會第8會期教育及文化委員會第9會期教育及文化委員會第10會期教育及文化委員會第11會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第12會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第13會期教育及文化委員會第14會期教育及文化委員會第14會"},{"start":441.135,"end":445.299,"text":"教育及文化委員會第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第12屆第13屆第14屆第14屆第15屆第16屆第17屆第18屆第18屆第18屆第19屆第19屆第20屆第20屆第21屆第21屆第22屆第21屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22屆第22"},{"start":461.795,"end":485.655,"text":"我其實就是希望教育部做一個謹慎的評估就是現行自費者如果搭配九流偏遠服務配套的話那就評估是不是有一個公費的可能性好不好我覺得這樣的斟酌會比較可行第一個您剛講馬上就會開了嘛那二跟三的部分是不是可以在一個月之內給我辦公室一個你們的初步評估報告好嗎可以一個月好謝謝潘部長"}]}}}}