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631.25, \"end\": 632.151, \"score\": 0.858}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 632.151, \"end\": 632.511, \"score\": 0.805}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 632.511, \"end\": 632.751, \"score\": 0.803}, {\"word\": \"去\", \"start\": 632.751, \"end\": 632.991, \"score\": 0.909}, {\"word\": \"精\", \"start\": 632.991, \"end\": 633.011, \"score\": 0.515}, {\"word\": \"進\"}, {\"word\": \"主\", \"start\": 634.032, \"end\": 634.154, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"席\", \"start\": 634.154, \"end\": 634.174, \"score\": 0.0}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:06,931 --> 00:00:11,634\n謝謝主席,有請我們司法院秘書長、法務部黃某信次長、委員長、還有次長\n\n2\n00:00:19,898 --> 00:00:44,581\n最近尤其是我們今天在討論整個特赦案這個總統行使特赦那這個部分我相信大家正反意見都會有但是總統特赦這應該是算總統專屬的特權這個憲法這樣的一個明定那我想中華民國過去一共幾次特赦\n\n3\n00:00:48,837 --> 00:01:03,566\n1937年國民政府臨生特赦西安事變的策劃者張學良1961年蔣中正前總統特赦蔡興犯下過失致死但曾從事嫡後工作立下戰功\n\n4\n00:01:05,647 --> 00:01:20,477\n1965年蔣中正特赦台大教授彭明敏1990年520前總統李登輝特赦美麗島事件受刑者林鴻軒、李秀蓮、程菊、姚家文、黃信介、張俊宏、林奕雄、施敏德、許信良等人\n\n5\n00:01:34,566 --> 00:01:50,582\n公權那第五個就是在2000年的時候在國際人權日這個特赦公運運動者曾茂興還有受冤獄的蘇炳坤以及19位因為宗教而拒服兵役者2007年6月21號特赦白名炸彈客楊魯門\n\n6\n00:01:54,810 --> 00:02:22,270\n第七個,2021年520特赦獵捕野生動物觸法的布農族原住民獵人王光祿第八個,就是在兩年前2022年4月20日特赦國軍前少將參謀長韓玉平跟他的侍從事張玉生兩個人因為漢光演習加菜金這個核銷餐費2880塊被依這個貪污自罪條例去分別判處了四年六個月跟一年的一個徒刑\n\n7\n00:02:22,910 --> 00:02:42,603\n我提這八個案例就是在講說從過去台灣特赦的歷史來看今天假如要特赦前總統那當然沒有問題總統的特權所以針對特赦的對象會發生疑慮那在本席看來就不是法律問題了\n\n8\n00:02:44,184 --> 00:02:54,274\n所有的會去執行的人、判刑有罪的人尤其是判刑確定的人才有這個特色的問題嘛那都是一審、二審甚至於有的還有三審\n\n9\n00:02:55,629 --> 00:03:17,755\n那法律途徑已經窮盡了以後一二三審、審計制度設計完以後有再審的去再審有非常上訴的去非常上訴全部都走完了法律程序其實就已經結束了嘛那就是這個時候為什麼給總統這樣的一個特色的一個權利啊就是讓他去考量站在總統的高度\n\n10\n00:03:18,322 --> 00:03:35,415\n他如何去看待如何來彌平整個社會這樣的一個爭議所以啊幾乎都是政治判斷我在從第8屆第9屆第10屆進入到現在第10屆阿扁這個議題啊我從來都不避諱啊我就是停扁我都認為要特赦\n\n11\n00:03:41,311 --> 00:03:59,840\n政反意見誰不知道會有誰不知道社會上都有壓力跟衝擊大家都知道但就像我們阿扁講的政治案件就是政治解決政治案件確定了以後你如何去透過法律來討回公道所以我還是大方的承認我就是支持這個特赦從以現在來看的話\n\n12\n00:04:04,079 --> 00:04:26,225\n法律你確定的案件就已經結束我就會去尊重總統的一個他自己的一個判斷從過去我舉的例子來看那從來都不是法律問題那都是完全是政治的一個判斷以上那另外我要來就教我們這個可能就跟秘書長我給你回應一下我這樣說不知道對不對這個\n\n13\n00:04:32,783 --> 00:05:01,214\n你也不好意思說我說錯了尊重委員的說法我說錯了我的人是這樣嗎我錯了你也要吐槽我沒插到啊法律見解本來就有人會不一樣啊這個地方就是論理嘛你有你的理那就是社會公平嘛我總不會胡說八道說這個法律我故意去扭曲做解釋這就不對了嘛我舉這個八個案例來跟你講就是所有的東西都是窮盡一切司法的一個途徑到最後用政治去做判斷嘛\n\n14\n00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:21,690\n這個就叫做特赦啦!這個就叫做特赦啦!不然沒有說吼!法律都規定那個地方規定在那個地方啊總統特別大這個是憲法規定的給他這個總統專屬的特權只是說社會上要如何去非難去做一個評價那是另外一件事\n\n15\n00:05:22,850 --> 00:05:49,648\n秘書長請回我要請教次長的就是說次長我要請教你就是說這個講起來就沉重了這位期裡面可能就是最後一次的一個質詢那我要在這個地方做一個提醒就是說三年前發生的那個太魯閣出軌的一個事件那上個禮拜母親節的前夕在隧道裡面又發現了遺害那三年前的事故在305還在事故的地點發現遺害這個民眾\n\n16\n00:05:52,947 --> 00:06:15,402\n這我們從媒體上在看到我們也都會覺得說現場在採證的時候那當然一定是不夠仔細民眾第一個想法一定是如此我相信法務部你也不好意思去做任何的一個辯解因為就在更久之前你看那個2018所發生的普悠瑪事件的車廂竟然在5年後就是去年的9月也去發現了遺害跟遺留物\n\n17\n00:06:18,063 --> 00:06:43,743\n這個我們可以理解整個搜救的一個現場裡面難度是很高誰也不願意發生這種事我相信我們檢警人員他們也不管從檢察官或者辨識人員甚至搜救小組每個人到了現場都是努力再去協助現場的一個清理可是社長我要講的就是可是畢竟受害者的家屬我們如果站在他們的角度去看的話\n\n18\n00:06:45,377 --> 00:06:50,341\n這個他們會想說我已經過那麼多年了人也都圓滿、錄斂、安葬就算DNA比對找到遺害現在怎麼處理都不對啊那還要家屬拿著放到\n\n19\n00:07:04,302 --> 00:07:32,749\n納古塔這個不僅僅是一種忌諱對這種往生者跟家屬的一個不尊重尤其是讓他們再去想起這種傷心的一個往事所以我要請教次長就是說有沒有針對類似的事情這種事情我們去做內部的一個檢討比如說如何再加速恢復現場跟整個完整的一個搜救的一個清理取得一個比較好的平衡我們就不希望這種事情\n\n20\n00:07:33,609 --> 00:07:34,509\n發生這種事對家屬也好對我們國家也好當然是一個不好的事情\n\n21\n00:07:50,815 --> 00:08:10,534\n我們本部也自認為該檢討就是應該要檢討這涉及到相驗發生的時候檢察官的相驗工作跟相關的目的主管機關行政機關的行政分工的問題事後這個案子發生之後我們的確在個案上我們也做檢討通案上我們也修正了我們一個重大相驗案件的一個內部的一個要點\n\n22\n00:08:11,195 --> 00:08:37,920\n我們把要點做修正之後我們訂了一定的SOB流程要求我們檢察官如何的在重大案件發生之後相關案件發生之後如何跟行政機關如何對接如何的協調事後如何的交接交接這相關的章政務處理完善之後才可以結束這個個案這要點我們在去年就修了做一個設定的修了社長這不要開玩笑了你看病人現在醫院很怕出錯\n\n23\n00:08:39,073 --> 00:09:05,796\n因為現在我們譬如開始一直搞哪一個流程黃謀信來不然也簡單要問一個生日幾號生日當時搞一個譬如說檢察官也是一樣監事人員也是一樣你們把它定下來以後憑經驗是好事但有時候現場凌亂甚至於在緊急狀況的時候每一個人所謂的重不重要判斷會不一樣你都覺得SOP都定義很高一樣來第一人\n\n24\n00:09:07,256 --> 00:09:07,496\n發言委員：莊瑞雄\n\n25\n00:09:37,796 --> 00:09:44,018\n要站在人家樓上站著不然就開始再嚥嚥嚥嚥那不是要在鈴鼓塔都要放進去嗎?在鈴鼓塔呢?處長那要開錢是不是?一般民眾你說叫他去就把骨頭紅都放進去不可能嘛不然你也要叫一個法師來傳一個聖禮當然那更怪是自己的親人那個不是什麼壞事只是也沒有必要在多年後增加這樣的一個困擾嘛\n\n26\n00:10:04,904 --> 00:10:33,011\n花錢又困擾最主要是民眾也傷心那我們在行政部門的部分我們這種事情沒有辦法完全預測不會發生什麼事要發生不知道總是整個流程把它確定下來這個讓民眾會覺得說政府對我來講的話比較溫暖政府對我來講的話他的行政部門在工作是很細緻的這個我要求改進好不好我們再去精進\n\n27\n00:10:34,032 --> 00:10:34,174\n主席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6931\t11634\t謝謝主席,有請我們司法院秘書長、法務部黃某信次長、委員長、還有次長\n19898\t44581\t最近尤其是我們今天在討論整個特赦案這個總統行使特赦那這個部分我相信大家正反意見都會有但是總統特赦這應該是算總統專屬的特權這個憲法這樣的一個明定那我想中華民國過去一共幾次特赦\n48837\t63566\t1937年國民政府臨生特赦西安事變的策劃者張學良1961年蔣中正前總統特赦蔡興犯下過失致死但曾從事嫡後工作立下戰功\n65647\t80477\t1965年蔣中正特赦台大教授彭明敏1990年520前總統李登輝特赦美麗島事件受刑者林鴻軒、李秀蓮、程菊、姚家文、黃信介、張俊宏、林奕雄、施敏德、許信良等人\n94566\t110582\t公權那第五個就是在2000年的時候在國際人權日這個特赦公運運動者曾茂興還有受冤獄的蘇炳坤以及19位因為宗教而拒服兵役者2007年6月21號特赦白名炸彈客楊魯門\n114810\t142270\t第七個,2021年520特赦獵捕野生動物觸法的布農族原住民獵人王光祿第八個,就是在兩年前2022年4月20日特赦國軍前少將參謀長韓玉平跟他的侍從事張玉生兩個人因為漢光演習加菜金這個核銷餐費2880塊被依這個貪污自罪條例去分別判處了四年六個月跟一年的一個徒刑\n142910\t162603\t我提這八個案例就是在講說從過去台灣特赦的歷史來看今天假如要特赦前總統那當然沒有問題總統的特權所以針對特赦的對象會發生疑慮那在本席看來就不是法律問題了\n164184\t174274\t所有的會去執行的人、判刑有罪的人尤其是判刑確定的人才有這個特色的問題嘛那都是一審、二審甚至於有的還有三審\n175629\t197755\t那法律途徑已經窮盡了以後一二三審、審計制度設計完以後有再審的去再審有非常上訴的去非常上訴全部都走完了法律程序其實就已經結束了嘛那就是這個時候為什麼給總統這樣的一個特色的一個權利啊就是讓他去考量站在總統的高度\n198322\t215415\t他如何去看待如何來彌平整個社會這樣的一個爭議所以啊幾乎都是政治判斷我在從第8屆第9屆第10屆進入到現在第10屆阿扁這個議題啊我從來都不避諱啊我就是停扁我都認為要特赦\n221311\t239840\t政反意見誰不知道會有誰不知道社會上都有壓力跟衝擊大家都知道但就像我們阿扁講的政治案件就是政治解決政治案件確定了以後你如何去透過法律來討回公道所以我還是大方的承認我就是支持這個特赦從以現在來看的話\n244079\t266225\t法律你確定的案件就已經結束我就會去尊重總統的一個他自己的一個判斷從過去我舉的例子來看那從來都不是法律問題那都是完全是政治的一個判斷以上那另外我要來就教我們這個可能就跟秘書長我給你回應一下我這樣說不知道對不對這個\n272783\t301214\t你也不好意思說我說錯了尊重委員的說法我說錯了我的人是這樣嗎我錯了你也要吐槽我沒插到啊法律見解本來就有人會不一樣啊這個地方就是論理嘛你有你的理那就是社會公平嘛我總不會胡說八道說這個法律我故意去扭曲做解釋這就不對了嘛我舉這個八個案例來跟你講就是所有的東西都是窮盡一切司法的一個途徑到最後用政治去做判斷嘛\n302760\t321690\t這個就叫做特赦啦!這個就叫做特赦啦!不然沒有說 吼!法律都規定那個地方 規定在那個地方啊 總統特別大 這個是憲法規定的給他這個總統專屬的特權只是說 社會上要如何去非難 去做一個評價 那是另外一件事\n322850\t349648\t秘書長請回我要請教次長的就是說次長我要請教你就是說這個講起來就沉重了這位期裡面可能就是最後一次的一個質詢那我要在這個地方做一個提醒就是說三年前發生的那個太魯閣出軌的一個事件那上個禮拜母親節的前夕在隧道裡面又發現了遺害那三年前的事故在305還在事故的地點發現遺害這個民眾\n352947\t375402\t這我們從媒體上在看到我們也都會覺得說現場在採證的時候那當然一定是不夠仔細民眾第一個想法一定是如此我相信法務部你也不好意思去做任何的一個辯解因為就在更久之前你看那個2018所發生的普悠瑪事件的車廂竟然在5年後就是去年的9月也去發現了遺害跟遺留物\n378063\t403743\t這個我們可以理解整個搜救的一個現場裡面難度是很高誰也不願意發生這種事我相信我們檢警人員他們也不管從檢察官或者辨識人員甚至搜救小組每個人到了現場都是努力再去協助現場的一個清理可是 社長我要講的就是可是畢竟受害者的家屬我們如果站在他們的角度去看的話\n405377\t410341\t這個他們會想說我已經過那麼多年了人也都圓滿、錄斂、安葬就算DNA比對找到遺害現在怎麼處理都不對啊那還要家屬拿著放到\n424302\t452749\t納古塔這個不僅僅是一種忌諱對這種往生者跟家屬的一個不尊重尤其是讓他們再去想起這種傷心的一個往事所以我要請教次長就是說有沒有針對類似的事情這種事情我們去做內部的一個檢討比如說如何再加速恢復現場跟整個完整的一個搜救的一個清理取得一個比較好的平衡我們就不希望這種事情\n453609\t454509\t發生這種事對家屬也好對我們國家也好當然是一個不好的事情\n470815\t490534\t我們本部也自認為該檢討就是應該要檢討這涉及到相驗發生的時候檢察官的相驗工作跟相關的目的主管機關行政機關的行政分工的問題事後這個案子發生之後我們的確在個案上我們也做檢討通案上我們也修正了我們一個重大相驗案件的一個內部的一個要點\n491195\t517920\t我們把要點做修正之後我們訂了一定的SOB流程要求我們檢察官如何的在重大案件發生之後相關案件發生之後如何跟行政機關如何對接如何的協調事後如何的交接交接這相關的章政務處理完善之後才可以結束這個個案這要點我們在去年就修了做一個設定的修了社長這不要開玩笑了你看病人現在醫院很怕出錯\n519073\t545796\t因為現在我們譬如開始一直搞哪一個流程黃謀信來不然也簡單要問一個生日幾號生日當時搞一個譬如說檢察官也是一樣監事人員也是一樣你們把它定下來以後憑經驗是好事但有時候現場凌亂甚至於在緊急狀況的時候每一個人所謂的重不重要判斷會不一樣你都覺得SOP都定義很高一樣來第一人\n547256\t547496\t發言委員：莊瑞雄\n577796\t584018\t要站在人家樓上站著不然就開始再嚥嚥嚥嚥那不是要在鈴鼓塔都要放進去嗎?在鈴鼓塔呢?處長那要開錢是不是?一般民眾你說叫他去就把骨頭紅都放進去不可能嘛不然你也要叫一個法師來傳一個聖禮當然那更怪是自己的親人那個不是什麼壞事只是也沒有必要在多年後增加這樣的一個困擾嘛\n604904\t633011\t花錢又困擾最主要是民眾也傷心那我們在行政部門的部分我們這種事情沒有辦法完全預測不會發生什麼事要發生不知道總是整個流程把它確定下來這個讓民眾會覺得說政府對我來講的話比較溫暖政府對我來講的話他的行政部門在工作是很細緻的這個我要求改進好不好我們再去精進\n634032\t634174\t主席\n","txt":"謝謝主席,有請我們司法院秘書長、法務部黃某信次長、委員長、還有次長\n最近尤其是我們今天在討論整個特赦案這個總統行使特赦那這個部分我相信大家正反意見都會有但是總統特赦這應該是算總統專屬的特權這個憲法這樣的一個明定那我想中華民國過去一共幾次特赦\n1937年國民政府臨生特赦西安事變的策劃者張學良1961年蔣中正前總統特赦蔡興犯下過失致死但曾從事嫡後工作立下戰功\n1965年蔣中正特赦台大教授彭明敏1990年520前總統李登輝特赦美麗島事件受刑者林鴻軒、李秀蓮、程菊、姚家文、黃信介、張俊宏、林奕雄、施敏德、許信良等人\n公權那第五個就是在2000年的時候在國際人權日這個特赦公運運動者曾茂興還有受冤獄的蘇炳坤以及19位因為宗教而拒服兵役者2007年6月21號特赦白名炸彈客楊魯門\n第七個,2021年520特赦獵捕野生動物觸法的布農族原住民獵人王光祿第八個,就是在兩年前2022年4月20日特赦國軍前少將參謀長韓玉平跟他的侍從事張玉生兩個人因為漢光演習加菜金這個核銷餐費2880塊被依這個貪污自罪條例去分別判處了四年六個月跟一年的一個徒刑\n我提這八個案例就是在講說從過去台灣特赦的歷史來看今天假如要特赦前總統那當然沒有問題總統的特權所以針對特赦的對象會發生疑慮那在本席看來就不是法律問題了\n所有的會去執行的人、判刑有罪的人尤其是判刑確定的人才有這個特色的問題嘛那都是一審、二審甚至於有的還有三審\n那法律途徑已經窮盡了以後一二三審、審計制度設計完以後有再審的去再審有非常上訴的去非常上訴全部都走完了法律程序其實就已經結束了嘛那就是這個時候為什麼給總統這樣的一個特色的一個權利啊就是讓他去考量站在總統的高度\n他如何去看待如何來彌平整個社會這樣的一個爭議所以啊幾乎都是政治判斷我在從第8屆第9屆第10屆進入到現在第10屆阿扁這個議題啊我從來都不避諱啊我就是停扁我都認為要特赦\n政反意見誰不知道會有誰不知道社會上都有壓力跟衝擊大家都知道但就像我們阿扁講的政治案件就是政治解決政治案件確定了以後你如何去透過法律來討回公道所以我還是大方的承認我就是支持這個特赦從以現在來看的話\n法律你確定的案件就已經結束我就會去尊重總統的一個他自己的一個判斷從過去我舉的例子來看那從來都不是法律問題那都是完全是政治的一個判斷以上那另外我要來就教我們這個可能就跟秘書長我給你回應一下我這樣說不知道對不對這個\n你也不好意思說我說錯了尊重委員的說法我說錯了我的人是這樣嗎我錯了你也要吐槽我沒插到啊法律見解本來就有人會不一樣啊這個地方就是論理嘛你有你的理那就是社會公平嘛我總不會胡說八道說這個法律我故意去扭曲做解釋這就不對了嘛我舉這個八個案例來跟你講就是所有的東西都是窮盡一切司法的一個途徑到最後用政治去做判斷嘛\n這個就叫做特赦啦!這個就叫做特赦啦!不然沒有說 吼!法律都規定那個地方 規定在那個地方啊 總統特別大 這個是憲法規定的給他這個總統專屬的特權只是說 社會上要如何去非難 去做一個評價 那是另外一件事\n秘書長請回我要請教次長的就是說次長我要請教你就是說這個講起來就沉重了這位期裡面可能就是最後一次的一個質詢那我要在這個地方做一個提醒就是說三年前發生的那個太魯閣出軌的一個事件那上個禮拜母親節的前夕在隧道裡面又發現了遺害那三年前的事故在305還在事故的地點發現遺害這個民眾\n這我們從媒體上在看到我們也都會覺得說現場在採證的時候那當然一定是不夠仔細民眾第一個想法一定是如此我相信法務部你也不好意思去做任何的一個辯解因為就在更久之前你看那個2018所發生的普悠瑪事件的車廂竟然在5年後就是去年的9月也去發現了遺害跟遺留物\n這個我們可以理解整個搜救的一個現場裡面難度是很高誰也不願意發生這種事我相信我們檢警人員他們也不管從檢察官或者辨識人員甚至搜救小組每個人到了現場都是努力再去協助現場的一個清理可是 社長我要講的就是可是畢竟受害者的家屬我們如果站在他們的角度去看的話\n這個他們會想說我已經過那麼多年了人也都圓滿、錄斂、安葬就算DNA比對找到遺害現在怎麼處理都不對啊那還要家屬拿著放到\n納古塔這個不僅僅是一種忌諱對這種往生者跟家屬的一個不尊重尤其是讓他們再去想起這種傷心的一個往事所以我要請教次長就是說有沒有針對類似的事情這種事情我們去做內部的一個檢討比如說如何再加速恢復現場跟整個完整的一個搜救的一個清理取得一個比較好的平衡我們就不希望這種事情\n發生這種事對家屬也好對我們國家也好當然是一個不好的事情\n我們本部也自認為該檢討就是應該要檢討這涉及到相驗發生的時候檢察官的相驗工作跟相關的目的主管機關行政機關的行政分工的問題事後這個案子發生之後我們的確在個案上我們也做檢討通案上我們也修正了我們一個重大相驗案件的一個內部的一個要點\n我們把要點做修正之後我們訂了一定的SOB流程要求我們檢察官如何的在重大案件發生之後相關案件發生之後如何跟行政機關如何對接如何的協調事後如何的交接交接這相關的章政務處理完善之後才可以結束這個個案這要點我們在去年就修了做一個設定的修了社長這不要開玩笑了你看病人現在醫院很怕出錯\n因為現在我們譬如開始一直搞哪一個流程黃謀信來不然也簡單要問一個生日幾號生日當時搞一個譬如說檢察官也是一樣監事人員也是一樣你們把它定下來以後憑經驗是好事但有時候現場凌亂甚至於在緊急狀況的時候每一個人所謂的重不重要判斷會不一樣你都覺得SOP都定義很高一樣來第一人\n發言委員：莊瑞雄\n要站在人家樓上站著不然就開始再嚥嚥嚥嚥那不是要在鈴鼓塔都要放進去嗎?在鈴鼓塔呢?處長那要開錢是不是?一般民眾你說叫他去就把骨頭紅都放進去不可能嘛不然你也要叫一個法師來傳一個聖禮當然那更怪是自己的親人那個不是什麼壞事只是也沒有必要在多年後增加這樣的一個困擾嘛\n花錢又困擾最主要是民眾也傷心那我們在行政部門的部分我們這種事情沒有辦法完全預測不會發生什麼事要發生不知道總是整個流程把它確定下來這個讓民眾會覺得說政府對我來講的話比較溫暖政府對我來講的話他的行政部門在工作是很細緻的這個我要求改進好不好我們再去精進\n主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.931 --> 00:11.634\n謝謝主席,有請我們司法院秘書長、法務部黃某信次長、委員長、還有次長\n\n00:19.898 --> 00:44.581\n最近尤其是我們今天在討論整個特赦案這個總統行使特赦那這個部分我相信大家正反意見都會有但是總統特赦這應該是算總統專屬的特權這個憲法這樣的一個明定那我想中華民國過去一共幾次特赦\n\n00:48.837 --> 01:03.566\n1937年國民政府臨生特赦西安事變的策劃者張學良1961年蔣中正前總統特赦蔡興犯下過失致死但曾從事嫡後工作立下戰功\n\n01:05.647 --> 01:20.477\n1965年蔣中正特赦台大教授彭明敏1990年520前總統李登輝特赦美麗島事件受刑者林鴻軒、李秀蓮、程菊、姚家文、黃信介、張俊宏、林奕雄、施敏德、許信良等人\n\n01:34.566 --> 01:50.582\n公權那第五個就是在2000年的時候在國際人權日這個特赦公運運動者曾茂興還有受冤獄的蘇炳坤以及19位因為宗教而拒服兵役者2007年6月21號特赦白名炸彈客楊魯門\n\n01:54.810 --> 02:22.270\n第七個,2021年520特赦獵捕野生動物觸法的布農族原住民獵人王光祿第八個,就是在兩年前2022年4月20日特赦國軍前少將參謀長韓玉平跟他的侍從事張玉生兩個人因為漢光演習加菜金這個核銷餐費2880塊被依這個貪污自罪條例去分別判處了四年六個月跟一年的一個徒刑\n\n02:22.910 --> 02:42.603\n我提這八個案例就是在講說從過去台灣特赦的歷史來看今天假如要特赦前總統那當然沒有問題總統的特權所以針對特赦的對象會發生疑慮那在本席看來就不是法律問題了\n\n02:44.184 --> 02:54.274\n所有的會去執行的人、判刑有罪的人尤其是判刑確定的人才有這個特色的問題嘛那都是一審、二審甚至於有的還有三審\n\n02:55.629 --> 03:17.755\n那法律途徑已經窮盡了以後一二三審、審計制度設計完以後有再審的去再審有非常上訴的去非常上訴全部都走完了法律程序其實就已經結束了嘛那就是這個時候為什麼給總統這樣的一個特色的一個權利啊就是讓他去考量站在總統的高度\n\n03:18.322 --> 03:35.415\n他如何去看待如何來彌平整個社會這樣的一個爭議所以啊幾乎都是政治判斷我在從第8屆第9屆第10屆進入到現在第10屆阿扁這個議題啊我從來都不避諱啊我就是停扁我都認為要特赦\n\n03:41.311 --> 03:59.840\n政反意見誰不知道會有誰不知道社會上都有壓力跟衝擊大家都知道但就像我們阿扁講的政治案件就是政治解決政治案件確定了以後你如何去透過法律來討回公道所以我還是大方的承認我就是支持這個特赦從以現在來看的話\n\n04:04.079 --> 04:26.225\n法律你確定的案件就已經結束我就會去尊重總統的一個他自己的一個判斷從過去我舉的例子來看那從來都不是法律問題那都是完全是政治的一個判斷以上那另外我要來就教我們這個可能就跟秘書長我給你回應一下我這樣說不知道對不對這個\n\n04:32.783 --> 05:01.214\n你也不好意思說我說錯了尊重委員的說法我說錯了我的人是這樣嗎我錯了你也要吐槽我沒插到啊法律見解本來就有人會不一樣啊這個地方就是論理嘛你有你的理那就是社會公平嘛我總不會胡說八道說這個法律我故意去扭曲做解釋這就不對了嘛我舉這個八個案例來跟你講就是所有的東西都是窮盡一切司法的一個途徑到最後用政治去做判斷嘛\n\n05:02.760 --> 05:21.690\n這個就叫做特赦啦!這個就叫做特赦啦!不然沒有說吼!法律都規定那個地方規定在那個地方啊總統特別大這個是憲法規定的給他這個總統專屬的特權只是說社會上要如何去非難去做一個評價那是另外一件事\n\n05:22.850 --> 05:49.648\n秘書長請回我要請教次長的就是說次長我要請教你就是說這個講起來就沉重了這位期裡面可能就是最後一次的一個質詢那我要在這個地方做一個提醒就是說三年前發生的那個太魯閣出軌的一個事件那上個禮拜母親節的前夕在隧道裡面又發現了遺害那三年前的事故在305還在事故的地點發現遺害這個民眾\n\n05:52.947 --> 06:15.402\n這我們從媒體上在看到我們也都會覺得說現場在採證的時候那當然一定是不夠仔細民眾第一個想法一定是如此我相信法務部你也不好意思去做任何的一個辯解因為就在更久之前你看那個2018所發生的普悠瑪事件的車廂竟然在5年後就是去年的9月也去發現了遺害跟遺留物\n\n06:18.063 --> 06:43.743\n這個我們可以理解整個搜救的一個現場裡面難度是很高誰也不願意發生這種事我相信我們檢警人員他們也不管從檢察官或者辨識人員甚至搜救小組每個人到了現場都是努力再去協助現場的一個清理可是社長我要講的就是可是畢竟受害者的家屬我們如果站在他們的角度去看的話\n\n06:45.377 --> 06:50.341\n這個他們會想說我已經過那麼多年了人也都圓滿、錄斂、安葬就算DNA比對找到遺害現在怎麼處理都不對啊那還要家屬拿著放到\n\n07:04.302 --> 07:32.749\n納古塔這個不僅僅是一種忌諱對這種往生者跟家屬的一個不尊重尤其是讓他們再去想起這種傷心的一個往事所以我要請教次長就是說有沒有針對類似的事情這種事情我們去做內部的一個檢討比如說如何再加速恢復現場跟整個完整的一個搜救的一個清理取得一個比較好的平衡我們就不希望這種事情\n\n07:33.609 --> 07:34.509\n發生這種事對家屬也好對我們國家也好當然是一個不好的事情\n\n07:50.815 --> 08:10.534\n我們本部也自認為該檢討就是應該要檢討這涉及到相驗發生的時候檢察官的相驗工作跟相關的目的主管機關行政機關的行政分工的問題事後這個案子發生之後我們的確在個案上我們也做檢討通案上我們也修正了我們一個重大相驗案件的一個內部的一個要點\n\n08:11.195 --> 08:37.920\n我們把要點做修正之後我們訂了一定的SOB流程要求我們檢察官如何的在重大案件發生之後相關案件發生之後如何跟行政機關如何對接如何的協調事後如何的交接交接這相關的章政務處理完善之後才可以結束這個個案這要點我們在去年就修了做一個設定的修了社長這不要開玩笑了你看病人現在醫院很怕出錯\n\n08:39.073 --> 09:05.796\n因為現在我們譬如開始一直搞哪一個流程黃謀信來不然也簡單要問一個生日幾號生日當時搞一個譬如說檢察官也是一樣監事人員也是一樣你們把它定下來以後憑經驗是好事但有時候現場凌亂甚至於在緊急狀況的時候每一個人所謂的重不重要判斷會不一樣你都覺得SOP都定義很高一樣來第一人\n\n09:07.256 --> 09:07.496\n發言委員：莊瑞雄\n\n09:37.796 --> 09:44.018\n要站在人家樓上站著不然就開始再嚥嚥嚥嚥那不是要在鈴鼓塔都要放進去嗎?在鈴鼓塔呢?處長那要開錢是不是?一般民眾你說叫他去就把骨頭紅都放進去不可能嘛不然你也要叫一個法師來傳一個聖禮當然那更怪是自己的親人那個不是什麼壞事只是也沒有必要在多年後增加這樣的一個困擾嘛\n\n10:04.904 --> 10:33.011\n花錢又困擾最主要是民眾也傷心那我們在行政部門的部分我們這種事情沒有辦法完全預測不會發生什麼事要發生不知道總是整個流程把它確定下來這個讓民眾會覺得說政府對我來講的話比較溫暖政府對我來講的話他的行政部門在工作是很細緻的這個我要求改進好不好我們再去精進\n\n10:34.032 --> 10:34.174\n主席\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.931,"end":11.634,"text":"謝謝主席,有請我們司法院秘書長、法務部黃某信次長、委員長、還有次長"},{"start":19.898,"end":44.581,"text":"最近尤其是我們今天在討論整個特赦案這個總統行使特赦那這個部分我相信大家正反意見都會有但是總統特赦這應該是算總統專屬的特權這個憲法這樣的一個明定那我想中華民國過去一共幾次特赦"},{"start":48.837,"end":63.566,"text":"1937年國民政府臨生特赦西安事變的策劃者張學良1961年蔣中正前總統特赦蔡興犯下過失致死但曾從事嫡後工作立下戰功"},{"start":65.647,"end":80.477,"text":"1965年蔣中正特赦台大教授彭明敏1990年520前總統李登輝特赦美麗島事件受刑者林鴻軒、李秀蓮、程菊、姚家文、黃信介、張俊宏、林奕雄、施敏德、許信良等人"},{"start":94.566,"end":110.582,"text":"公權那第五個就是在2000年的時候在國際人權日這個特赦公運運動者曾茂興還有受冤獄的蘇炳坤以及19位因為宗教而拒服兵役者2007年6月21號特赦白名炸彈客楊魯門"},{"start":114.81,"end":142.27,"text":"第七個,2021年520特赦獵捕野生動物觸法的布農族原住民獵人王光祿第八個,就是在兩年前2022年4月20日特赦國軍前少將參謀長韓玉平跟他的侍從事張玉生兩個人因為漢光演習加菜金這個核銷餐費2880塊被依這個貪污自罪條例去分別判處了四年六個月跟一年的一個徒刑"},{"start":142.91,"end":162.603,"text":"我提這八個案例就是在講說從過去台灣特赦的歷史來看今天假如要特赦前總統那當然沒有問題總統的特權所以針對特赦的對象會發生疑慮那在本席看來就不是法律問題了"},{"start":164.184,"end":174.274,"text":"所有的會去執行的人、判刑有罪的人尤其是判刑確定的人才有這個特色的問題嘛那都是一審、二審甚至於有的還有三審"},{"start":175.629,"end":197.755,"text":"那法律途徑已經窮盡了以後一二三審、審計制度設計完以後有再審的去再審有非常上訴的去非常上訴全部都走完了法律程序其實就已經結束了嘛那就是這個時候為什麼給總統這樣的一個特色的一個權利啊就是讓他去考量站在總統的高度"},{"start":198.322,"end":215.415,"text":"他如何去看待如何來彌平整個社會這樣的一個爭議所以啊幾乎都是政治判斷我在從第8屆第9屆第10屆進入到現在第10屆阿扁這個議題啊我從來都不避諱啊我就是停扁我都認為要特赦"},{"start":221.311,"end":239.84,"text":"政反意見誰不知道會有誰不知道社會上都有壓力跟衝擊大家都知道但就像我們阿扁講的政治案件就是政治解決政治案件確定了以後你如何去透過法律來討回公道所以我還是大方的承認我就是支持這個特赦從以現在來看的話"},{"start":244.079,"end":266.225,"text":"法律你確定的案件就已經結束我就會去尊重總統的一個他自己的一個判斷從過去我舉的例子來看那從來都不是法律問題那都是完全是政治的一個判斷以上那另外我要來就教我們這個可能就跟秘書長我給你回應一下我這樣說不知道對不對這個"},{"start":272.783,"end":301.214,"text":"你也不好意思說我說錯了尊重委員的說法我說錯了我的人是這樣嗎我錯了你也要吐槽我沒插到啊法律見解本來就有人會不一樣啊這個地方就是論理嘛你有你的理那就是社會公平嘛我總不會胡說八道說這個法律我故意去扭曲做解釋這就不對了嘛我舉這個八個案例來跟你講就是所有的東西都是窮盡一切司法的一個途徑到最後用政治去做判斷嘛"},{"start":302.76,"end":321.69,"text":"這個就叫做特赦啦!這個就叫做特赦啦!不然沒有說 吼!法律都規定那個地方 規定在那個地方啊 總統特別大 這個是憲法規定的給他這個總統專屬的特權只是說 社會上要如何去非難 去做一個評價 那是另外一件事"},{"start":322.85,"end":349.648,"text":"秘書長請回我要請教次長的就是說次長我要請教你就是說這個講起來就沉重了這位期裡面可能就是最後一次的一個質詢那我要在這個地方做一個提醒就是說三年前發生的那個太魯閣出軌的一個事件那上個禮拜母親節的前夕在隧道裡面又發現了遺害那三年前的事故在305還在事故的地點發現遺害這個民眾"},{"start":352.947,"end":375.402,"text":"這我們從媒體上在看到我們也都會覺得說現場在採證的時候那當然一定是不夠仔細民眾第一個想法一定是如此我相信法務部你也不好意思去做任何的一個辯解因為就在更久之前你看那個2018所發生的普悠瑪事件的車廂竟然在5年後就是去年的9月也去發現了遺害跟遺留物"},{"start":378.063,"end":403.743,"text":"這個我們可以理解整個搜救的一個現場裡面難度是很高誰也不願意發生這種事我相信我們檢警人員他們也不管從檢察官或者辨識人員甚至搜救小組每個人到了現場都是努力再去協助現場的一個清理可是 社長我要講的就是可是畢竟受害者的家屬我們如果站在他們的角度去看的話"},{"start":405.377,"end":410.341,"text":"這個他們會想說我已經過那麼多年了人也都圓滿、錄斂、安葬就算DNA比對找到遺害現在怎麼處理都不對啊那還要家屬拿著放到"},{"start":424.302,"end":452.749,"text":"納古塔這個不僅僅是一種忌諱對這種往生者跟家屬的一個不尊重尤其是讓他們再去想起這種傷心的一個往事所以我要請教次長就是說有沒有針對類似的事情這種事情我們去做內部的一個檢討比如說如何再加速恢復現場跟整個完整的一個搜救的一個清理取得一個比較好的平衡我們就不希望這種事情"},{"start":453.609,"end":454.509,"text":"發生這種事對家屬也好對我們國家也好當然是一個不好的事情"},{"start":470.815,"end":490.534,"text":"我們本部也自認為該檢討就是應該要檢討這涉及到相驗發生的時候檢察官的相驗工作跟相關的目的主管機關行政機關的行政分工的問題事後這個案子發生之後我們的確在個案上我們也做檢討通案上我們也修正了我們一個重大相驗案件的一個內部的一個要點"},{"start":491.195,"end":517.92,"text":"我們把要點做修正之後我們訂了一定的SOB流程要求我們檢察官如何的在重大案件發生之後相關案件發生之後如何跟行政機關如何對接如何的協調事後如何的交接交接這相關的章政務處理完善之後才可以結束這個個案這要點我們在去年就修了做一個設定的修了社長這不要開玩笑了你看病人現在醫院很怕出錯"},{"start":519.073,"end":545.796,"text":"因為現在我們譬如開始一直搞哪一個流程黃謀信來不然也簡單要問一個生日幾號生日當時搞一個譬如說檢察官也是一樣監事人員也是一樣你們把它定下來以後憑經驗是好事但有時候現場凌亂甚至於在緊急狀況的時候每一個人所謂的重不重要判斷會不一樣你都覺得SOP都定義很高一樣來第一人"},{"start":547.256,"end":547.496,"text":"發言委員：莊瑞雄"},{"start":577.796,"end":584.018,"text":"要站在人家樓上站著不然就開始再嚥嚥嚥嚥那不是要在鈴鼓塔都要放進去嗎?在鈴鼓塔呢?處長那要開錢是不是?一般民眾你說叫他去就把骨頭紅都放進去不可能嘛不然你也要叫一個法師來傳一個聖禮當然那更怪是自己的親人那個不是什麼壞事只是也沒有必要在多年後增加這樣的一個困擾嘛"},{"start":604.904,"end":633.011,"text":"花錢又困擾最主要是民眾也傷心那我們在行政部門的部分我們這種事情沒有辦法完全預測不會發生什麼事要發生不知道總是整個流程把它確定下來這個讓民眾會覺得說政府對我來講的話比較溫暖政府對我來講的話他的行政部門在工作是很細緻的這個我要求改進好不好我們再去精進"},{"start":634.032,"end":634.174,"text":"主席"}]}}}}