{"id":152572,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/152572","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/069b0cf7e017bc309d48faffa438aa05c1296c2fd5de7bd8e01ba30ddb4afe0f0d1eb0eeb46feded5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"羅智強","委員發言時間":"09:25:45 - 09:29:33","影片長度":"00:03:48","會議時間":"2024-05-16T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第23次全體委員會議（事由：一、併案審查\n（一）委員廖偉翔等18人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（二）委員徐巧芯等17人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條及第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（三）委員馬文君等17人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條及第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（四）委員羅智強等29人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條條文修正草案」案。\n（五）委員黃健豪等19人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（六）委員蔡易餘等17人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（七）委員謝衣鳯等17人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（八）委員洪孟楷等22人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（九）委員徐欣瑩等19人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（十）委員涂權吉等19人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（十一）委員王世堅等22人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條、第三百三十九條之三及第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（十二）委員謝衣鳯等17人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條條文修正草案」案。\n（十三）委員謝衣鳯等16人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（十四）委員陳菁徽等16人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條及第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（十五）委員葉元之等24人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條及第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n（十六）台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案。\n二、併案審查\n（一）委員廖偉翔等18人擬具「揭弊者保護法草案」案。\n（二）委員楊瓊瓔等21人擬具「揭弊者保護法草案」案。\n（三）委員林月琴等17人擬具「公益揭弊者保護法草案」案。\n（四）委員洪孟楷等22人擬具「揭弊者保護法草案」案。\n（五）台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「公益揭弊者保護法草案」案。\n（六）委員徐巧芯等19人擬具「揭弊者保護法草案」案。\n（七）委員吳宗憲等19人擬具「公益揭弊者保護法草案」案。\n【第二案（七）如經院會復議，則不予審查】）","date":"2024-05-16","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第23次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":23,"committees":[36],"id":"委員會-11-1-36-23"},"duration":228,"end_time":"2024-05-16T09:29:33+08:00","start_time":"2024-05-16T09:25:45+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":110,"blocks":[["羅委員智強：（9時25分）反制詐騙人人有責，現在詐騙已經是嚴重到變成國安問題，臺灣的詐騙橫行，已經到讓大家不可思議的地步。大家看到賴清德總統當選人昨天在民進黨中常會拿了一個例子，他說前經濟部長尹啟銘也會被詐騙，表示當過政務官有社會歷練都會被詐騙。我覺得賴清德總統當選人舉的這個例子很好，但是卻舉得不對，講得很好，但舉的例子不對，因為你與其拿馬政府時候的政務官來舉例，你怎麼不拿民進黨新提名的NCC主委，由現任的副主委翁柏宗來做例子不是更好？這位已經在反詐騙當中扮演重要角色，NCC這個機關是非常重要的角色，而他未來也可能擔任更高職務，在2019年就被詐騙了358萬元，如果連反詐單位的領導人都會被詐騙，大家就可以看到現在詐騙有多嚴重。就像賴清德總統當選人舉尹啟銘的例子，尹啟銘的例子是因為他接到詐騙集團說他兒子被綁架，天下父母心啊！關心則亂，所以他誤信了，被詐騙了一百多萬，可是我們反制詐騙重要機關之一的NCC副主委，未來也可能是最高的NCC主委，他也一樣被詐騙了三百多萬元。所以我覺得基本上賴清德舉的例子，如果要讓大家更能夠窺見全貌，也不要只舉尹啟銘的例子，翁柏宗的例子也應該一起舉。","今天我們在這邊談論到修法的問題，其實出發點很簡單，我看到政府部門的報告，大致重點就是對於刑度的部分有一些不同的意見，當然我知道重刑也不一定能夠遏阻現在詐騙的氾濫，但是加重刑罰也確實是方式之一。我的提案有些是針對所謂刑度的地板，有些是針對刑度的天花板，我認為現在很多輕判的狀況，所以可以針對刑度的地板，大家一起來研究是不是修法加重。當然刑度的加重不是萬靈丹，這點我也相信、我也認同啦，可是問題是，除了刑度加重之外，到現在為止，我們政府到底拿出什麼樣的一個方式、什麼樣的一個作為、什麼樣的一個成績來阻遏現在不斷翻倍的詐騙案件、不斷危害到我們所有老百姓的詐騙案件？我沒有看到政府拿出對策出來，都是口號而已啊！打詐辦公室成立以後，只看到詐騙越來越多！所以今天的修法，我覺得只是個起步，希望透過所謂更高嚇阻的刑度，只是在打擊詐騙這工作上，往前多走一步。以上。"],["主席：謝謝。","我們接下來請王世堅委員進行提案說明。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":282,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-36-23","speakers":["吳宗憲","洪孟楷","徐欣瑩","林月琴","黃國昌","羅智強","王世堅","黃健豪","謝龍介","陳俊宇","沈發惠","鍾佳濱","王鴻薇","沈伯洋","林思銘","莊瑞雄","吳思瑤","楊瓊瓔","傅崐萁","賴士葆","牛煦庭","徐巧芯","翁曉玲"],"page_start":39,"meetingDate":["2024-05-16"],"gazette_id":"1134801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1134801_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第23次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、併案審查( 一) 委員廖偉翔等18 人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」\n案、(二)委員徐巧芯等17人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條及第三百三十九條之四條文修正\n草案」案、(三)委員馬文君等17人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條及第三百三十九條之四條\n文修正草案」案、( 四) 委員羅智強等29 人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條條文修正草案」\n案、(五)委員黃健豪等19人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、(六)委\n員蔡易餘等17人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、(七)委員謝衣鳯等\n17 人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、 ( 八 ) 委員洪孟楷等22 人擬具\n「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、(九)委員徐欣瑩等19人擬具「中華民國\n刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、(十)委員涂權吉等19人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百\n三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、 ( 十一) 委員王世堅等22 人擬具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九\n條、第三百三十九條之三及第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、(十二)委員謝衣鳯等17人擬\n具「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條條文修正草案」案、(十三)委員謝衣鳯等16人擬具「中華民國\n刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、(十四)委員陳菁徽等16人擬具「中華民國刑法第三\n百三十九條及第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、(十五)委員葉元之等24人擬具「中華民國\n刑法第三百三十九條及第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案、(十六)台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「中\n華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案」案；二、併案審查 ( 一 ) 委員廖偉翔等18 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\"score\": 0.974}, {\"word\": \"正\", \"start\": 215.017, \"end\": 215.097, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"草\", \"start\": 215.097, \"end\": 215.257, \"score\": 0.875}, {\"word\": \"案\", \"start\": 215.257, \"end\": 215.357, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"．\"}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 215.357, \"end\": 215.457, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"）\"}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 215.457, \"end\": 215.477, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:09,172 --> 00:00:14,375\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．\n\n2\n00:00:37,264 --> 00:01:03,346\n表示當過政務官有社會歷練都會被詐騙。」我覺得賴清德總統當選人這個例子很好啦但是卻舉得不對講得很好但舉的例子不對因為你與其拿馬政府時候的政務官來舉例你怎麼不拿民進黨新提名的NCC主委由現任的副主委翁伯中來做例子不是更好\n\n3\n00:01:04,677 --> 00:01:18,802\n這位已經在反詐騙當中扮演重要角色NCC非常重要角色這個機關而他也未來可能來擔任更高職務在2019年就被詐騙了358萬元如果連反詐的單位的領導人都會被詐騙\n\n4\n00:01:26,903 --> 00:01:34,888\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．\n\n5\n00:01:57,284 --> 00:02:17,079\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第\n\n6\n00:02:25,444 --> 00:02:33,929\n這個對於刑度的部分有一些不同的意見當然我知道縱刑也不一定能夠遏阻現在詐騙的氾濫\n\n7\n00:02:36,527 --> 00:02:41,192\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆\n\n8\n00:02:57,549 --> 00:03:25,883\n當然刑度的加重不是萬靈丹啦這點我也相信我也認同啦可是問題是除了刑度加重之外到現在為止我們政府到底拿出了什麼樣的一個方式什麼樣的一個作為什麼樣一個成績來阻惡現在不斷翻倍翻倍的詐騙的一個案件不斷的危害到我們所有老百姓的一個詐騙的案件我沒有看到政府拿出對策出來啊\n\n9\n00:03:27,492 --> 00:03:35,477\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員徐巧芯等17人擬具:「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n9172\t14375\t民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．\n37264\t63346\t表示當過政務官有社會歷練都會被詐騙。」我覺得賴清德總統當選人這個例子很好啦但是卻舉得不對講得很好但舉的例子不對因為你與其拿馬政府時候的政務官來舉例你怎麼不拿民進黨新提名的NCC主委由現任的副主委翁伯中來做例子不是更好\n64677\t78802\t這位已經在反詐騙當中扮演重要角色NCC非常重要角色這個機關而他也未來可能來擔任更高職務在2019年就被詐騙了358萬元如果連反詐的單位的領導人都會被詐騙\n86903\t94888\t民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．\n117284\t137079\t民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第\n145444\t153929\t這個對於刑度的部分有一些不同的意見當然我知道縱刑也不一定能夠遏阻現在詐騙的氾濫\n156527\t161192\t民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆\n177549\t205883\t當然刑度的加重不是萬靈丹啦這點我也相信我也認同啦可是問題是除了刑度加重之外到現在為止我們政府到底拿出了什麼樣的一個方式什麼樣的一個作為什麼樣一個成績來阻惡現在不斷翻倍翻倍的詐騙的一個案件不斷的危害到我們所有老百姓的一個詐騙的案件我沒有看到政府拿出對策出來啊\n207492\t215477\t民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員徐巧芯等17人擬具:「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員\n","txt":"民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．\n表示當過政務官有社會歷練都會被詐騙。」我覺得賴清德總統當選人這個例子很好啦但是卻舉得不對講得很好但舉的例子不對因為你與其拿馬政府時候的政務官來舉例你怎麼不拿民進黨新提名的NCC主委由現任的副主委翁伯中來做例子不是更好\n這位已經在反詐騙當中扮演重要角色NCC非常重要角色這個機關而他也未來可能來擔任更高職務在2019年就被詐騙了358萬元如果連反詐的單位的領導人都會被詐騙\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第\n這個對於刑度的部分有一些不同的意見當然我知道縱刑也不一定能夠遏阻現在詐騙的氾濫\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆\n當然刑度的加重不是萬靈丹啦這點我也相信我也認同啦可是問題是除了刑度加重之外到現在為止我們政府到底拿出了什麼樣的一個方式什麼樣的一個作為什麼樣一個成績來阻惡現在不斷翻倍翻倍的詐騙的一個案件不斷的危害到我們所有老百姓的一個詐騙的案件我沒有看到政府拿出對策出來啊\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員徐巧芯等17人擬具:「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:09.172 --> 00:14.375\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．\n\n00:37.264 --> 01:03.346\n表示當過政務官有社會歷練都會被詐騙。」我覺得賴清德總統當選人這個例子很好啦但是卻舉得不對講得很好但舉的例子不對因為你與其拿馬政府時候的政務官來舉例你怎麼不拿民進黨新提名的NCC主委由現任的副主委翁伯中來做例子不是更好\n\n01:04.677 --> 01:18.802\n這位已經在反詐騙當中扮演重要角色NCC非常重要角色這個機關而他也未來可能來擔任更高職務在2019年就被詐騙了358萬元如果連反詐的單位的領導人都會被詐騙\n\n01:26.903 --> 01:34.888\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．\n\n01:57.284 --> 02:17.079\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第\n\n02:25.444 --> 02:33.929\n這個對於刑度的部分有一些不同的意見當然我知道縱刑也不一定能夠遏阻現在詐騙的氾濫\n\n02:36.527 --> 02:41.192\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆\n\n02:57.549 --> 03:25.883\n當然刑度的加重不是萬靈丹啦這點我也相信我也認同啦可是問題是除了刑度加重之外到現在為止我們政府到底拿出了什麼樣的一個方式什麼樣的一個作為什麼樣一個成績來阻惡現在不斷翻倍翻倍的詐騙的一個案件不斷的危害到我們所有老百姓的一個詐騙的案件我沒有看到政府拿出對策出來啊\n\n03:27.492 --> 03:35.477\n民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員徐巧芯等17人擬具:「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":9.172,"end":14.375,"text":"民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．"},{"start":37.264,"end":63.346,"text":"表示當過政務官有社會歷練都會被詐騙。」我覺得賴清德總統當選人這個例子很好啦但是卻舉得不對講得很好但舉的例子不對因為你與其拿馬政府時候的政務官來舉例你怎麼不拿民進黨新提名的NCC主委由現任的副主委翁伯中來做例子不是更好"},{"start":64.677,"end":78.802,"text":"這位已經在反詐騙當中扮演重要角色NCC非常重要角色這個機關而他也未來可能來擔任更高職務在2019年就被詐騙了358萬元如果連反詐的單位的領導人都會被詐騙"},{"start":86.903,"end":94.888,"text":"民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．一．"},{"start":117.284,"end":137.079,"text":"民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第"},{"start":145.444,"end":153.929,"text":"這個對於刑度的部分有一些不同的意見當然我知道縱刑也不一定能夠遏阻現在詐騙的氾濫"},{"start":156.527,"end":161.192,"text":"民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第12屆"},{"start":177.549,"end":205.883,"text":"當然刑度的加重不是萬靈丹啦這點我也相信我也認同啦可是問題是除了刑度加重之外到現在為止我們政府到底拿出了什麼樣的一個方式什麼樣的一個作為什麼樣一個成績來阻惡現在不斷翻倍翻倍的詐騙的一個案件不斷的危害到我們所有老百姓的一個詐騙的案件我沒有看到政府拿出對策出來啊"},{"start":207.492,"end":215.477,"text":"民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員徐巧芯等17人擬具:「中華民國刑法第三百三十九條之四條文修正草案．一）委員"}]}}}}