{"id":152627,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/152627","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/069b0cf7e017bc3076cea80316044b25fe2b63d20657b6c6e01ba30ddb4afe0ffb8caee38d4eefd15ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"陳培瑜","委員發言時間":"11:08:04 - 11:13:53","影片長度":"00:05:49","會議時間":"2024-05-16T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第21次全體委員會議（事由：邀請僑務委員會、外交部、國家安全局報告「中共海外統戰工作對我僑務推展與邦交維持之影響及應處作為」，並備質詢。）","date":"2024-05-16","meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第21次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":21,"committees":[35],"id":"委員會-11-1-35-21"},"duration":349,"end_time":"2024-05-16T11:13:53+08:00","start_time":"2024-05-16T11:08:04+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":494,"blocks":[["陳委員培瑜：（11時8分）好，謝謝主席，有請次長。"],["主席：哪一個單位？"],["陳委員培瑜：陳立國常務次長，謝謝。"],["主席：請外交部陳次長，謝謝。"],["陳次長立國：委員好。"],["陳委員培瑜：次長，你好，我時間有限，我就直接跟您切入。關於中國統戰的事情，我就不再多說了，以我自己的專業領域，我來自教育界，專長是語文教育，關於孔子學院，我相信次長你一定非常清楚孔子學院長年滲透這件事情，到了近年，其實很多國家開始有警覺，有意識到孔子學院不只擔負語言交流的任務，其實也擔負了大量的政治責任，對嗎？"],["陳次長立國：是的。"],["陳委員培瑜：好。我們來看一下，在日經亞洲的報導提到，孔子學院逐漸被西方封鎖，可是在東南亞持續發展，我不知道你們有沒有關注到相關的訊息？"],["陳次長立國：一直持續都在關注。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，那你們觀察到以後，有什麼給國人的建議或參考嗎？孔子學院為什麼跑到東南亞大量發展？而它對於東南亞當地，甚至對我們當地臺商，有沒有造成什麼相關的影響？"],["陳次長立國：跟委員報告，像過去這段時間，您也瞭解的，在美國也好，歐洲也好，對於孔子學院的本質、它背後的目的，也有比較深刻的理解，不管是透過法律手段或其他方法，來反制孔子學院散布或傳播對於中方有利的統戰作為。您剛剛提到為什麼會在東南亞看到有這種春風吹又生的情況，的確也是因為幾個因素，第一點，比如說，因為中國持續在這個地方有很多的活動，包括經貿活動、一帶一路，付出很多的努力，希望拉攏這些國家站到他們那一邊去，當然美方也有他們的作為，所以兩者之間的戰略競爭持續在全世界各地進行。您剛剛所提到的後續影響，因為只要有一個地方被遏止了，他們有很多手段去補救，可以改變名稱，換湯不換藥，再重新用別的名義來成立新的組織去運作，所以的確就是會打壓不盡，加上資源不斷，因為中國統戰部的資源一年超過3,000億臺幣，比他們外交部的資源還要多，人手還要更充足。"],["陳委員培瑜：所以回過頭來看，如果臺灣持續推新南向政策，你怎麼看當地臺商或當地學生，甚至是其他各式各樣非正式的交流，我們怎麼來看這個情況？我想要再跟次長您分享，我們看到還有另外一個日經的報導提到，光是蘋果的一台iPhone，其中臺廠供應的零組件占iPhone材料總成本36%，而且這36%的零件都是最有價值的零件，包含高階的核心處理器、5G的數據機，可是如果回頭來看，中國提供的技術跟中國提供的零件相對是低階的，所以最後這篇報導要說的其實就是我要跟次長您說的，他說儘管跟中國的經濟脫鉤不是容易的事情，可是跟臺灣脫鉤更是難上加難，意思就是不可以跟臺灣脫鉤，一旦跟臺灣脫鉤，光是iPhone就會受到很大的影響。你剛剛說它在西方的勢力逐漸消退，但是它在新的地方開始春風吹又生，那我要問，從過去文化的交流或是教育的交流，確實臺灣其實是有一些可以做的事情，除了我剛剛說的，在經濟上我們看到的零件、工業、其他的產業，可是以我自己最熟悉的教育文化產業來說，其實臺灣有很棒的文學作品或相關內容產業，有沒有機會透過你們的管道或是其他的管道去協助，然後增加我們臺灣在當地發聲、曝光的量能？我們用文化去做一種制衡跟對抗，你覺得呢？","我舉一個例子，AIT在宜蘭捐贈了一個美國資料專區的圖書區，放的當然不是大家不喜歡看的那些公務資料、公文資料，也不是政府出版品，就是一批好看的美國圖畫書、童書、成人書、小說，各式各樣的作品都有，甚至因為這個專區，設計了很多活動，其實很多旅外的華人也告訴我們，臺灣有很棒的作家、很棒的內容產業，但是你們有沒有角色、有沒有機會，透過你們的設計或政策，推廣到東南亞去？我們不直接跟孔子學院對戰，因為你剛剛說他們有龐大的預算是落在這個地方，那我們實質上到底還能夠做些什麼？所以我想要提出關於文化出版交流這個部分，甚至像波蘭也曾經送他們很重要的電玩作品給美國前總統歐巴馬，而臺灣也有非常棒的臺灣在地原創的電玩作品，我想要請你回應一下，謝謝。"],["陳次長立國：謝謝委員您剛剛的提問，我們非常贊同，尤其委員剛剛所提到的，不同的角度和層面，來讓我們在各地，尤其東南亞的第一線外交工作，有包含文化外交跟軟實力這個層面，其實這些工作外交部連同其他相關的文化部會、僑委會，還有任何可以出力的部會，都對這個問題非常重視。"],["陳委員培瑜：因為我們時間有限，我們等一下就會趕快下台，但是我要拜託您，我的辦公室之後會跟你們持續討論如何把好看的、有意義的、值得往外推廣的作品，跟教育部、文化部及你們的相關部會，以跨部會的方式，把這些作品做更積極的外溢跟推廣，甚至還有更多的活動或相關的內容產業，因為其實文化部在去年也提出了文化黑潮，確實我們很多內容產製量能越來越好，我相信透過外交部，一定也有相關力量可以協助臺灣這些創作者，好嗎？"],["陳次長立國：我們全力配合。謝謝委員。"],["陳委員培瑜：好，謝謝。我們也會積極追蹤，謝謝主席，謝謝。"],["主席：好，謝謝。","接下來請蔡易餘委員、蔡易餘、蔡易餘委員不在。","請鄭正鈐、鄭正鈐、鄭正鈐委員不在。","請洪孟楷、洪孟楷、洪孟楷委員不在。","請楊瓊瓔委員上台質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":38,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-35-21","speakers":["馬文君","羅美玲","王定宇","林楚茵","黃仁","沈伯洋","陳冠廷","徐巧芯","洪申翰","陳培瑜","楊瓊瓔","林憶君","麥玉珍"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-05-16"],"gazette_id":"1134801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1134801_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期外交及國防委員會第21次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請僑務委員會、外交部、國家安全局報告「中共海外統戰工作對我僑務推展與邦交維持之影響\n及應處作為」，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1134801_00001"}},"transcript":{"id":"152627","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/152627","tool":"pyannote","id":"152627-pyannote"},"job_id":"BaegAyHXx03qIiNv","queued_at":"2024-05-30 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\"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,109 --> 00:00:08,438\n好謝謝主席那有請今天是等一下次長謝謝哪一個單位稱國常務次長謝謝外交部謝謝\n\n2\n00:00:16,170 --> 00:00:40,882\n市長你好我時間有限我就直接跟您切入我想說關於這個中國統戰的事情我就不再多說不過以我自己的專業領域來自教育界然後來自語文教育其實我們發現孔子學院這件事情我相信市長你一定非常清楚那孔子學院長年的滲透這件事情到了近年其實很多國家開始有警覺有意識孔子學院他不只擔負語言交流他其實擔負了大量的政治責任對嗎是的好\n\n3\n00:00:42,763 --> 00:01:06,916\n回頭來看,我們來看一下在日經亞洲的報導提到孔子學院逐漸被西方封鎖可是在東南亞持續發展不知道你們這邊有沒有關注到這個相關訊息一直持續都在關注那你們觀察到你們有什麼相關給國人的建議或參考嗎在這個孔子學院為什麼它跑到東南亞大量的發展而它對東南亞當地甚至對我們當地台商有沒有造成什麼相關的影響\n\n4\n00:01:08,141 --> 00:01:30,057\n跟委員報告的確像過去這段時間您所也瞭解到的在美國也好歐洲也好對於因為孔子學院他的本質他背後的目的有比較深刻的理解不管透過法律手段或其他方法來反制孔子學院來散播或傳播對於中方有利的這些他們的統戰作為\n\n5\n00:01:31,718 --> 00:01:54,270\n所以您剛剛所提到那為什麼會在東南亞看到有這種春風吹又生的情況那的確也是因為第一點比如說因為中國持續在這個地方當然有很多的包括經貿一帶一路很多的努力希望拉攏這些國家能夠站到他那一邊去那麼當然美方也有他的作為所以兩者之間的戰略競爭持續在全世界各地都持續進行\n\n6\n00:01:55,550 --> 00:02:18,698\n您剛所提到的這種後續的影響部分的確因為只要有一個地方被遏止了其實他有很多手段他可以改變名稱他可以換湯不換藥再重新用別的名義去來成立去運作所以的確就是有一種就是說打壓不盡他用各種方式加上他的資源不斷因為中國的這個統戰部他的資源一年超過3000億台幣比他們的外交部的資源還要多人手還要更足\n\n7\n00:02:25,060 --> 00:02:40,152\n所以回過來看,如果台灣持續在推這個新南向政策,你怎麼看我們當地的台上或是當地的學生甚至是其他各式各樣非正式的交流,我們怎麼來看這個情況?怎麼說我想要再跟次長您分享,我們看到還有另外一個日經的報導,它提到說\n\n8\n00:02:41,753 --> 00:03:03,544\n光是蘋果的一台iPhone其中台廠供應的零組件占iPhone材料總成本36%而且這36%的零件都是所謂最有價值的零件包含高階的核心處理器5G的數據機可是如果相關回頭來看那中國提供的技術跟中國提供零件相對是低階的所以他最後這邊報導其實就是我要跟次長您說的\n\n9\n00:03:04,645 --> 00:03:22,686\n他說儘管跟中國的經濟脫鉤不是容易的事情可是跟台灣脫鉤更是難上加難意思就是不可以跟台灣脫鉤一旦跟台灣脫鉤光是iPhone它就會受到多麼大的影響你剛剛說它在西方的勢力逐漸消退但是它在新的地方開始春風吹又生\n\n10\n00:03:23,647 --> 00:03:23,687\n陳培瑜\n\n11\n00:03:39,551 --> 00:03:41,873\n我舉一個例子AIT他們在宜蘭捐贈了一個美國資料專區的圖書區這個圖書呢當然放的不是大家不喜歡看那些公務資料公文資料也不是所謂政府出版品\n\n12\n00:04:06,914 --> 00:04:06,994\n﹚陳培瑜\n\n13\n00:04:26,198 --> 00:04:26,218\n請回應\n\n14\n00:04:50,385 --> 00:05:12,832\n是,謝謝委員您剛剛的提問,我們非常贊同,尤其委員剛剛所提到的不同的角度跟層面來讓我們在尤其東南亞這個第一線的外交工作有包含文化跟外交跟軟實際這個層面,其實這些工作外交部以及連同我們其他包括主管的相關的文化部會、僑委會還有任何可以出力的部會都對這個問題非常重視,而且\n\n15\n00:05:14,693 --> 00:05:19,195\n新南向因為我們時間有限我等一下趕快下台但是我要拜託您我們辦公室之後會跟你們持續討論如何把好看的而且有意義的值得往外推廣跟教育部跟文化部還有你們相關部會、跨部會把這些作品做更積極的外溢跟推廣甚至還有更多的活動或相關的內容產業\n\n16\n00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:35,740\n主席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n109\t8438\t好 謝謝主席那有請今天是等一下次長 謝謝哪一個單位稱國常務次長 謝謝外交部 謝謝\n16170\t40882\t市長你好我時間有限我就直接跟您切入我想說關於這個中國統戰的事情我就不再多說不過以我自己的專業領域來自教育界然後來自語文教育其實我們發現孔子學院這件事情我相信市長你一定非常清楚那孔子學院長年的滲透這件事情到了近年其實很多國家開始有警覺有意識孔子學院他不只擔負語言交流他其實擔負了大量的政治責任對嗎是的好\n42763\t66916\t回頭來看,我們來看一下在日經亞洲的報導提到孔子學院逐漸被西方封鎖可是在東南亞持續發展不知道你們這邊有沒有關注到這個相關訊息一直持續都在關注那你們觀察到你們有什麼相關給國人的建議或參考嗎在這個孔子學院為什麼它跑到東南亞大量的發展而它對東南亞當地甚至對我們當地台商有沒有造成什麼相關的影響\n68141\t90057\t跟委員報告的確像過去這段時間您所也瞭解到的在美國也好歐洲也好對於因為孔子學院他的本質他背後的目的有比較深刻的理解不管透過法律手段或其他方法來反制孔子學院來散播或傳播對於中方有利的這些他們的統戰作為\n91718\t114270\t所以您剛剛所提到那為什麼會在東南亞看到有這種春風吹又生的情況那的確也是因為第一點比如說因為中國持續在這個地方當然有很多的包括經貿一帶一路很多的努力希望拉攏這些國家能夠站到他那一邊去那麼當然美方也有他的作為所以兩者之間的戰略競爭持續在全世界各地都持續進行\n115550\t138698\t您剛所提到的這種後續的影響部分的確因為只要有一個地方被遏止了其實他有很多手段他可以改變名稱他可以換湯不換藥再重新用別的名義去來成立去運作所以的確就是有一種就是說打壓不盡他用各種方式加上他的資源不斷因為中國的這個統戰部他的資源一年超過3000億台幣比他們的外交部的資源還要多人手還要更足\n145060\t160152\t所以回過來看,如果台灣持續在推這個新南向政策,你怎麼看我們當地的台上或是當地的學生甚至是其他各式各樣非正式的交流,我們怎麼來看這個情況?怎麼說我想要再跟次長您分享,我們看到還有另外一個日經的報導,它提到說\n161753\t183544\t光是蘋果的一台iPhone其中台廠供應的零組件占iPhone材料總成本36%而且這36%的零件都是所謂最有價值的零件包含高階的核心處理器5G的數據機可是如果相關回頭來看那中國提供的技術跟中國提供零件相對是低階的所以他最後這邊報導其實就是我要跟次長您說的\n184645\t202686\t他說儘管跟中國的經濟脫鉤不是容易的事情可是跟台灣脫鉤更是難上加難意思就是不可以跟台灣脫鉤一旦跟台灣脫鉤光是iPhone它就會受到多麼大的影響你剛剛說它在西方的勢力逐漸消退但是它在新的地方開始春風吹又生\n203647\t203687\t陳培瑜\n219551\t221873\t我舉一個例子AIT他們在宜蘭捐贈了一個美國資料專區的圖書區這個圖書呢當然放的不是大家不喜歡看那些公務資料公文資料也不是所謂政府出版品\n246914\t246994\t﹚陳培瑜\n266198\t266218\t請回應\n290385\t312832\t是,謝謝委員您剛剛的提問,我們非常贊同,尤其委員剛剛所提到的不同的角度跟層面來讓我們在尤其東南亞這個第一線的外交工作有包含文化跟外交跟軟實際這個層面,其實這些工作外交部以及連同我們其他包括主管的相關的文化部會、僑委會還有任何可以出力的部會都對這個問題非常重視,而且\n314693\t319195\t新南向因為我們時間有限我等一下趕快下台但是我要拜託您我們辦公室之後會跟你們持續討論如何把好看的而且有意義的值得往外推廣跟教育部跟文化部還有你們相關部會、跨部會把這些作品做更積極的外溢跟推廣甚至還有更多的活動或相關的內容產業\n335640\t335740\t主席\n","txt":"好 謝謝主席那有請今天是等一下次長 謝謝哪一個單位稱國常務次長 謝謝外交部 謝謝\n市長你好我時間有限我就直接跟您切入我想說關於這個中國統戰的事情我就不再多說不過以我自己的專業領域來自教育界然後來自語文教育其實我們發現孔子學院這件事情我相信市長你一定非常清楚那孔子學院長年的滲透這件事情到了近年其實很多國家開始有警覺有意識孔子學院他不只擔負語言交流他其實擔負了大量的政治責任對嗎是的好\n回頭來看,我們來看一下在日經亞洲的報導提到孔子學院逐漸被西方封鎖可是在東南亞持續發展不知道你們這邊有沒有關注到這個相關訊息一直持續都在關注那你們觀察到你們有什麼相關給國人的建議或參考嗎在這個孔子學院為什麼它跑到東南亞大量的發展而它對東南亞當地甚至對我們當地台商有沒有造成什麼相關的影響\n跟委員報告的確像過去這段時間您所也瞭解到的在美國也好歐洲也好對於因為孔子學院他的本質他背後的目的有比較深刻的理解不管透過法律手段或其他方法來反制孔子學院來散播或傳播對於中方有利的這些他們的統戰作為\n所以您剛剛所提到那為什麼會在東南亞看到有這種春風吹又生的情況那的確也是因為第一點比如說因為中國持續在這個地方當然有很多的包括經貿一帶一路很多的努力希望拉攏這些國家能夠站到他那一邊去那麼當然美方也有他的作為所以兩者之間的戰略競爭持續在全世界各地都持續進行\n您剛所提到的這種後續的影響部分的確因為只要有一個地方被遏止了其實他有很多手段他可以改變名稱他可以換湯不換藥再重新用別的名義去來成立去運作所以的確就是有一種就是說打壓不盡他用各種方式加上他的資源不斷因為中國的這個統戰部他的資源一年超過3000億台幣比他們的外交部的資源還要多人手還要更足\n所以回過來看,如果台灣持續在推這個新南向政策,你怎麼看我們當地的台上或是當地的學生甚至是其他各式各樣非正式的交流,我們怎麼來看這個情況?怎麼說我想要再跟次長您分享,我們看到還有另外一個日經的報導,它提到說\n光是蘋果的一台iPhone其中台廠供應的零組件占iPhone材料總成本36%而且這36%的零件都是所謂最有價值的零件包含高階的核心處理器5G的數據機可是如果相關回頭來看那中國提供的技術跟中國提供零件相對是低階的所以他最後這邊報導其實就是我要跟次長您說的\n他說儘管跟中國的經濟脫鉤不是容易的事情可是跟台灣脫鉤更是難上加難意思就是不可以跟台灣脫鉤一旦跟台灣脫鉤光是iPhone它就會受到多麼大的影響你剛剛說它在西方的勢力逐漸消退但是它在新的地方開始春風吹又生\n陳培瑜\n我舉一個例子AIT他們在宜蘭捐贈了一個美國資料專區的圖書區這個圖書呢當然放的不是大家不喜歡看那些公務資料公文資料也不是所謂政府出版品\n﹚陳培瑜\n請回應\n是,謝謝委員您剛剛的提問,我們非常贊同,尤其委員剛剛所提到的不同的角度跟層面來讓我們在尤其東南亞這個第一線的外交工作有包含文化跟外交跟軟實際這個層面,其實這些工作外交部以及連同我們其他包括主管的相關的文化部會、僑委會還有任何可以出力的部會都對這個問題非常重視,而且\n新南向因為我們時間有限我等一下趕快下台但是我要拜託您我們辦公室之後會跟你們持續討論如何把好看的而且有意義的值得往外推廣跟教育部跟文化部還有你們相關部會、跨部會把這些作品做更積極的外溢跟推廣甚至還有更多的活動或相關的內容產業\n主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.109 --> 00:08.438\n好謝謝主席那有請今天是等一下次長謝謝哪一個單位稱國常務次長謝謝外交部謝謝\n\n00:16.170 --> 00:40.882\n市長你好我時間有限我就直接跟您切入我想說關於這個中國統戰的事情我就不再多說不過以我自己的專業領域來自教育界然後來自語文教育其實我們發現孔子學院這件事情我相信市長你一定非常清楚那孔子學院長年的滲透這件事情到了近年其實很多國家開始有警覺有意識孔子學院他不只擔負語言交流他其實擔負了大量的政治責任對嗎是的好\n\n00:42.763 --> 01:06.916\n回頭來看,我們來看一下在日經亞洲的報導提到孔子學院逐漸被西方封鎖可是在東南亞持續發展不知道你們這邊有沒有關注到這個相關訊息一直持續都在關注那你們觀察到你們有什麼相關給國人的建議或參考嗎在這個孔子學院為什麼它跑到東南亞大量的發展而它對東南亞當地甚至對我們當地台商有沒有造成什麼相關的影響\n\n01:08.141 --> 01:30.057\n跟委員報告的確像過去這段時間您所也瞭解到的在美國也好歐洲也好對於因為孔子學院他的本質他背後的目的有比較深刻的理解不管透過法律手段或其他方法來反制孔子學院來散播或傳播對於中方有利的這些他們的統戰作為\n\n01:31.718 --> 01:54.270\n所以您剛剛所提到那為什麼會在東南亞看到有這種春風吹又生的情況那的確也是因為第一點比如說因為中國持續在這個地方當然有很多的包括經貿一帶一路很多的努力希望拉攏這些國家能夠站到他那一邊去那麼當然美方也有他的作為所以兩者之間的戰略競爭持續在全世界各地都持續進行\n\n01:55.550 --> 02:18.698\n您剛所提到的這種後續的影響部分的確因為只要有一個地方被遏止了其實他有很多手段他可以改變名稱他可以換湯不換藥再重新用別的名義去來成立去運作所以的確就是有一種就是說打壓不盡他用各種方式加上他的資源不斷因為中國的這個統戰部他的資源一年超過3000億台幣比他們的外交部的資源還要多人手還要更足\n\n02:25.060 --> 02:40.152\n所以回過來看,如果台灣持續在推這個新南向政策,你怎麼看我們當地的台上或是當地的學生甚至是其他各式各樣非正式的交流,我們怎麼來看這個情況?怎麼說我想要再跟次長您分享,我們看到還有另外一個日經的報導,它提到說\n\n02:41.753 --> 03:03.544\n光是蘋果的一台iPhone其中台廠供應的零組件占iPhone材料總成本36%而且這36%的零件都是所謂最有價值的零件包含高階的核心處理器5G的數據機可是如果相關回頭來看那中國提供的技術跟中國提供零件相對是低階的所以他最後這邊報導其實就是我要跟次長您說的\n\n03:04.645 --> 03:22.686\n他說儘管跟中國的經濟脫鉤不是容易的事情可是跟台灣脫鉤更是難上加難意思就是不可以跟台灣脫鉤一旦跟台灣脫鉤光是iPhone它就會受到多麼大的影響你剛剛說它在西方的勢力逐漸消退但是它在新的地方開始春風吹又生\n\n03:23.647 --> 03:23.687\n陳培瑜\n\n03:39.551 --> 03:41.873\n我舉一個例子AIT他們在宜蘭捐贈了一個美國資料專區的圖書區這個圖書呢當然放的不是大家不喜歡看那些公務資料公文資料也不是所謂政府出版品\n\n04:06.914 --> 04:06.994\n﹚陳培瑜\n\n04:26.198 --> 04:26.218\n請回應\n\n04:50.385 --> 05:12.832\n是,謝謝委員您剛剛的提問,我們非常贊同,尤其委員剛剛所提到的不同的角度跟層面來讓我們在尤其東南亞這個第一線的外交工作有包含文化跟外交跟軟實際這個層面,其實這些工作外交部以及連同我們其他包括主管的相關的文化部會、僑委會還有任何可以出力的部會都對這個問題非常重視,而且\n\n05:14.693 --> 05:19.195\n新南向因為我們時間有限我等一下趕快下台但是我要拜託您我們辦公室之後會跟你們持續討論如何把好看的而且有意義的值得往外推廣跟教育部跟文化部還有你們相關部會、跨部會把這些作品做更積極的外溢跟推廣甚至還有更多的活動或相關的內容產業\n\n05:35.640 --> 05:35.740\n主席\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.109,"end":8.438,"text":"好 謝謝主席那有請今天是等一下次長 謝謝哪一個單位稱國常務次長 謝謝外交部 謝謝"},{"start":16.17,"end":40.882,"text":"市長你好我時間有限我就直接跟您切入我想說關於這個中國統戰的事情我就不再多說不過以我自己的專業領域來自教育界然後來自語文教育其實我們發現孔子學院這件事情我相信市長你一定非常清楚那孔子學院長年的滲透這件事情到了近年其實很多國家開始有警覺有意識孔子學院他不只擔負語言交流他其實擔負了大量的政治責任對嗎是的好"},{"start":42.763,"end":66.916,"text":"回頭來看,我們來看一下在日經亞洲的報導提到孔子學院逐漸被西方封鎖可是在東南亞持續發展不知道你們這邊有沒有關注到這個相關訊息一直持續都在關注那你們觀察到你們有什麼相關給國人的建議或參考嗎在這個孔子學院為什麼它跑到東南亞大量的發展而它對東南亞當地甚至對我們當地台商有沒有造成什麼相關的影響"},{"start":68.141,"end":90.057,"text":"跟委員報告的確像過去這段時間您所也瞭解到的在美國也好歐洲也好對於因為孔子學院他的本質他背後的目的有比較深刻的理解不管透過法律手段或其他方法來反制孔子學院來散播或傳播對於中方有利的這些他們的統戰作為"},{"start":91.718,"end":114.27,"text":"所以您剛剛所提到那為什麼會在東南亞看到有這種春風吹又生的情況那的確也是因為第一點比如說因為中國持續在這個地方當然有很多的包括經貿一帶一路很多的努力希望拉攏這些國家能夠站到他那一邊去那麼當然美方也有他的作為所以兩者之間的戰略競爭持續在全世界各地都持續進行"},{"start":115.55,"end":138.698,"text":"您剛所提到的這種後續的影響部分的確因為只要有一個地方被遏止了其實他有很多手段他可以改變名稱他可以換湯不換藥再重新用別的名義去來成立去運作所以的確就是有一種就是說打壓不盡他用各種方式加上他的資源不斷因為中國的這個統戰部他的資源一年超過3000億台幣比他們的外交部的資源還要多人手還要更足"},{"start":145.06,"end":160.152,"text":"所以回過來看,如果台灣持續在推這個新南向政策,你怎麼看我們當地的台上或是當地的學生甚至是其他各式各樣非正式的交流,我們怎麼來看這個情況?怎麼說我想要再跟次長您分享,我們看到還有另外一個日經的報導,它提到說"},{"start":161.753,"end":183.544,"text":"光是蘋果的一台iPhone其中台廠供應的零組件占iPhone材料總成本36%而且這36%的零件都是所謂最有價值的零件包含高階的核心處理器5G的數據機可是如果相關回頭來看那中國提供的技術跟中國提供零件相對是低階的所以他最後這邊報導其實就是我要跟次長您說的"},{"start":184.645,"end":202.686,"text":"他說儘管跟中國的經濟脫鉤不是容易的事情可是跟台灣脫鉤更是難上加難意思就是不可以跟台灣脫鉤一旦跟台灣脫鉤光是iPhone它就會受到多麼大的影響你剛剛說它在西方的勢力逐漸消退但是它在新的地方開始春風吹又生"},{"start":203.647,"end":203.687,"text":"陳培瑜"},{"start":219.551,"end":221.873,"text":"我舉一個例子AIT他們在宜蘭捐贈了一個美國資料專區的圖書區這個圖書呢當然放的不是大家不喜歡看那些公務資料公文資料也不是所謂政府出版品"},{"start":246.914,"end":246.994,"text":"﹚陳培瑜"},{"start":266.198,"end":266.218,"text":"請回應"},{"start":290.385,"end":312.832,"text":"是,謝謝委員您剛剛的提問,我們非常贊同,尤其委員剛剛所提到的不同的角度跟層面來讓我們在尤其東南亞這個第一線的外交工作有包含文化跟外交跟軟實際這個層面,其實這些工作外交部以及連同我們其他包括主管的相關的文化部會、僑委會還有任何可以出力的部會都對這個問題非常重視,而且"},{"start":314.693,"end":319.195,"text":"新南向因為我們時間有限我等一下趕快下台但是我要拜託您我們辦公室之後會跟你們持續討論如何把好看的而且有意義的值得往外推廣跟教育部跟文化部還有你們相關部會、跨部會把這些作品做更積極的外溢跟推廣甚至還有更多的活動或相關的內容產業"},{"start":335.64,"end":335.74,"text":"主席"}]}}}}