{"id":152783,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/152783","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/ec526bb9f1bdce9dfb4eb1f5c15bcc8c6fc1a8a999f94a213b43bbf2d64d2017b53d9e6741251f855ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林宜瑾","委員發言時間":"10:33:36 - 10:48:31","影片長度":"00:14:55","會議時間":"2024-05-22T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：邀請文化部部長李遠列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。\n【5月22日及23日二天一次會】）","date":"2024-05-22","duration":895,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第13次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":13,"committees":[22],"id":"委員會-11-1-22-13"},"end_time":"2024-05-22T10:48:31+08:00","start_time":"2024-05-22T10:33:36+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":390,"blocks":[["林委員宜瑾：（10時33分）謝謝主席。有請部長。"],["主席：請李部長。"],["林委員宜瑾：部長好。"],["李部長遠：你好。"],["林委員宜瑾：迫不及待安排您今天就來本委員會備詢，基本上也是因為我們很多委員都迫不及待想看見您。平常都在電視上或報章雜誌上看見您，所以我想今天你來擔任文化部長當然是任重道遠。","開門見山，我有一些問題想要跟您請教。部長2006年擔任華視總經理時，批評過公共電視文化事業基金會處處干預華視，導致華視「非公非商」、「四不像」，後來還不惜辭職，捍衛華視的權益。請問部長，為了改善華視經營問題，你現在還有那股衝勁嗎？如果第一步是要處理民股買回，你有說要協調修法等等，具體而言到底該怎麼做才能改善華視目前的狀況？"],["李部長遠：謝謝你問這個問題，讓我有機會稍微更正一下，其實我當初覺得我們都沒有人有經驗怎麼樣把華視捐給公視，華視是35年，公視是8年，從來沒有人做過公廣集團，所以我必須承認，我當時有一直批評，後來我也跟當時的公視總經理──現在在場的胡元輝總經理道歉，因為我的語言非常粗暴，所以我最後是跟他道歉完，做完一任才下來的，我並沒有用辭職來抗議。事隔18年，我們回頭看華視跟公視的關係，第一個，公廣集團又變得更大，然後又多了一個華視新聞頻道，公廣集團本身的人員和經費又不是18年前可以比的，它變得更龐大了。我覺得華視的問題第一個是，今天在臺灣這麼多頻道在競爭的情況下，華視如何成為一個大家都很愛看的電視台，還有華視新聞因為它播報很公正，成為大家很喜歡看的一個華視新聞台是非常重要的。第二個，既然公共廣播集團已經這麼有力量的話，我會希望用各種方式支持公廣集團協助華視壯大。","但是華視面臨的兩個問題都是非常困難的問題，一個就是民股買回，就在我一去的那一年就發生問題，因為在法律上面，民股要買回這件事情沒有說清楚，所以民股要不要賣給公股、賣給公視，或者是華視本身也有能力買回民股都可以，而民股要不要賣不是我們能夠決定的事情。另外一個是附負擔捐贈，當時我面臨兩個問題，就是華視既然沒有享受公共電視的條件，卻要執行公共電視的任務的話，附負擔捐贈是很重要的，可是因為它非公非商，所以附負擔捐贈不能夠捐給它。但是問題也得到解決，就是這幾年來，文化部給了華視器材的整建、修建還有拍電影的費用，我記得加起來大概有7億，這7億是在不同的年份編預算，你也可以把它看成是另外一種附負擔捐贈，比我那個年代好太多了。以上大概就是這樣子。"],["林委員宜瑾：對於華視現在面臨的困境，相信部長上任之後一定會有所改善。但是請教部長，現在華視究竟是商業電視台，還是公共化的無線電視事業？您認為呢？現在的狀況。"],["李部長遠：當初捐給公共電視的時候是希望它能自力更生，它還是可以有商業廣告收入，但是又受到某種限制，就是它跟一般的商業台又不太一樣，它不能有政論節目，也不能有宗教節目……"],["林委員宜瑾：也不能有政治的廣告。"],["李部長遠：對，它是具備公共性質的商業台，所以它本身在界定上就是有點模糊的。我對它的期待就是，它應該就在這樣一個夾縫中，透過公共廣播集團給它更多的資源，成為一個更好的商業台，能夠生產更好的戲劇節目。我們可以回頭看看最近的八點檔或者是……"],["林委員宜瑾：是，很多！"],["李部長遠：都比以前好很多。"],["林委員宜瑾：好，部長講到重點了。如果依公股處理條例第十四條，主管機關本來就「得」編列預算，附負擔捐贈公股占比超過50%的公共化無線電視事業。部長剛剛也提到附負擔捐贈的問題，當然，我們過去都沒有每年編列附負擔捐贈給華視，您剛剛也提到過去有一些預算補助給華視，有點等同於附負擔捐贈的概念，但還是沒有每年去做編列附負擔捐贈的動作，請問您擔任部長之後，未來會不會每年持續編列附負擔捐贈給華視？"],["李部長遠：這好像不是我們文化部想編就可以編，但是因為這個時機非常好，就是我跟胡董事長兩個人做過好幾次公廣集團的同事，我們私下也見過面，非常誠懇地談未來怎麼解決，我想我會想辦法提出一個很好的解決方式，在院會中爭取行政院的支持。"],["林委員宜瑾：瞭解。","另外想跟您討論的是，賴清德總統在就職演說中有提到兩個跟文化部相關的工作面向，我想您應該也聽得很清楚，第一個是轉型正義等改革工作要繼續做下去，第二個是要保有多元族群文化，讓文化永續。可是在文化部今天的業務報告中，我卻看不到任何對於轉型正義的相關規劃，也隻字未提文化部轄下最大的威權違章建築──就是中正紀念堂究竟該如何轉型的問題。請問部長，關於中正紀念堂的轉型，文化部到底要做還是不做？剛剛柯志恩召委也有提到這個問題，可是他也沒有問得很詳細，所以我想跟你做進一步的討論。","這個問題是複雜的，我也不是只有現在才問您，在李永得部長的時代、在史哲部長的時代，我每個部長都問過。當然，我是非常關心這個事情，其實李永得部長當初的回答讓我覺得心有戚戚焉，他認為中正紀念堂百分之百是威權，它的一磚一瓦都是在紀念蔣介石，所以如果面對這樣子的概念，當然轉型正義不是一蹴可幾，所以我們要怎麼樣來逐步進行轉型正義？當然，由國家帶頭崇拜獨裁者確實是荒謬的，也不尊重我們擁有不同歷史記憶的國人，特別是一些政治受難者的家屬。對於要怎麼樣來轉型，我具體建議在堂體的三軍儀隊是不是可以先移到所謂的升降旗臺那裡？因為我們知道現在中正紀念堂就如同您剛剛講的，為很多的觀光、休閒提供一個很好的場域，很多觀光客也常來到中正紀念堂，而三軍儀隊這些展演也是很多觀光客愛看的，可是我們的象徵意義很清楚，他在堂體，他好像還在保護或是擁護所謂的威權，他如果來到升降旗臺，在這個廣場中，是不是就會轉移這類象徵的意義？所以我想請教部長，您怎麼看這個問題？"],["李部長遠：我想這件事我們要跟國防部來溝通，他們已經對外表達，那個儀隊是一種儀式，而不是表演，所以他已經表達說要嘛就撤，要嘛就不撤，他已經不堅持不撤，他就把這個問題丟給我們。這個問題其實我應該這樣講，我覺得從當時蓋了中正紀念堂之後，陳水扁總統上任之後就好像把它降級了，就把儀隊撤掉，然後把大中至正改成自由廣場，可是八年後，馬英九總統上任後，又把中正紀念堂升級，再把三軍儀隊恢復。我覺得三軍儀隊好像工具一般的被大家搬來搬去，從我比較人道的立場來講，他不是一個讓大家在政權轉換中移來移去的，所以我會怎麼做呢？我覺得現在的中正紀念堂跟過去已經不太一樣，為什麼？你走到中正紀念堂裡面，你看到它有一個對於蔣中正從頭到尾的歷史、正面跟負面的展覽，成為一個常設展，而且裡面的照片都變了。第二，已經對外徵求所有人去想像中正紀念堂應該變成什麼樣子，那個展覽我看了很多遍，因為我家就住在隔壁，我連中正紀念堂原來沒有鴿子，到後來有9隻鴿子，到現在鴿子鴿孫都陪伴小孩長大，甚至我還寫過童話，就是中正紀念堂的鴿子。","我覺得它的演變是很自然的演變，就像鴿子從9隻變一大堆一樣，本來有一條杉樹林，大家都不能進去，後來民眾去踩一踩、踩一踩，那個杉樹林就解除了禁令，民眾都可以散步，每天早上九點半都會有一個人站在那邊開始講白色恐怖是怎麼發生的，從九點半講到十點半，然後他講完之後離開。你會很好奇他在白色恐怖裡面扮演什麼角色？他其實認為自己是一個被害者，事實上，從別人的眼光看，他是一個加害者。一切的一切在我們生活中都發生，白色恐怖這件事情，可是我覺得臺灣現在需要的是一種在一個有共識下往下做……"],["林委員宜瑾：當然。"],["李部長遠：因為我覺得以目前這個政治生態，我不想用很強迫的方式，用我覺得對的方式往下做。我有我個人的想法，在我的家族裡面，我的4個舅舅裡面有3個是白色恐怖……但是我不會用我個人的理由去面對這個事情。我們可以從文學作品裡面看到，很多人寫白色恐怖的文學作品，最近有好幾部電影也拍白色恐怖，我覺得像這樣的東西是透過文學、透過音樂、透過電影，讓大家慢慢有共識，認為它不是一個敵對的東西，我是想用這個方式來處理中正紀念堂。"],["林委員宜瑾：轉型正義的意義也是這樣，因為賴清德總統就職，他對轉型正義的工作要持續做，轉型正義的工作是分到每個部會去，在文化部中正紀念堂當然是一個很重要的事情，所以我還是認為，三軍儀隊就算不撤離所謂的中正紀念堂，因為你說政權轉移讓他搬來搬去，但是我還是強烈認為，他應該要移出所謂的堂體，這個象徵意涵是什麼？就是對個人的效忠轉為對國家的忠誠，三軍儀隊本來就是對國家效忠，而不是對個人效忠，所以我想這個是一個轉型正義很重要意義的表徵，所以這個請部長再思考看看。","我想再借一點點時間，剛剛提到語言的問題，因為賴清德總統也有揭示，在文化永續方面，語言的保存是非常重要，剛剛也有委員提到，現在因為我們有客委會、原民會，所以包括客語、原民語都有專責的中央部會，也有對應的專法，但臺語散落在各個部會，包括教育部跟文化部，可是文化部又是國家語言發展法的主責單位，所以在臺語的推廣上面，我覺得文化部責無旁貸，在臺語的部分不曉得部長你有什麼樣的想法？"],["李部長遠：很多人都期待文化部扮演一個推廣臺語的角色，我想這點是毋庸置疑的，而且我上任前已經很多單位來找我，也強調臺語傳承的重要。我個人在成長經驗中是全班唯一不會講臺語的外省第二代，可是我們老師是用臺語上課，所以我後來有能力做一個像鳳飛飛臺語歌謠的策劃者，從不懂臺語，到熱愛臺語，到有能力做出臺語歌謠，所以我對臺語的情感是很深的，這點我想不用擔心，我會開始往下做，至於在什麼時候完成語言研究，因為它涉及到一個組織法，我想我們內部有一點默契會往下推。"],["林委員宜瑾：好，希望文化部未來對於臺語的傳承、復振這個工作要更加加油。"],["李部長遠：是。"],["林委員宜瑾：謝謝部長，謝謝主席。"],["李部長遠：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝林宜瑾召委，部長請回座。"],["主席（林委員宜瑾）：謝謝，再來請張雅琳委員。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":154,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-22-13","speakers":["林宜瑾","萬美玲","柯志恩","洪孟楷","羅廷瑋","葛如鈞","陳秀寳","張雅琳","陳培瑜","郭昱晴","吳春城","范雲","葉元之","吳沛憶","蘇巧慧","林倩綺","楊瓊瓔","麥玉珍","高金素梅","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","張智倫","陳冠廷","林楚茵"],"page_start":85,"meetingDate":["2024-05-22"],"gazette_id":"1135001","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1135001_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第13次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請文化部部長李遠列席報告業務概況，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1135001_000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{\"word\": \"驗\"}, {\"word\": \"中\", \"start\": 843.898, \"end\": 843.918, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"﹚\"}, {\"word\": \"林\", \"start\": 848.576, \"end\": 848.936, \"score\": 0.941}, {\"word\": \"宜\", \"start\": 848.936, \"end\": 849.156, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"瑾\", \"start\": 849.156, \"end\": 849.176, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"李\", \"start\": 873.582, \"end\": 873.682, \"score\": 0.492}, {\"word\": \"展\", \"start\": 873.682, \"end\": 873.942, \"score\": 0.746}, {\"word\": \"昭\", \"start\": 873.942, \"end\": 874.242, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 874.242, \"end\": 874.423, \"score\": 0.782}, {\"word\": \"部\", \"start\": 874.423, \"end\": 874.903, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"長\"}, {\"word\": \"請\"}, {\"word\": \"回\", \"start\": 874.903, \"end\": 875.023, \"score\": 0.762}, {\"word\": \"座\", \"start\": 875.023, \"end\": 875.043, \"score\": 0.005}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,089 --> 00:00:06,293\n提請召委質詢。謝謝主席。謝謝主席。有請部長。請李部長。部長好。你好。\n\n2\n00:00:14,578 --> 00:00:38,612\n嗯,迫不及待安排您今天就來這個委員會備詢基本上是很多的這個委員都迫不及待的想看見您平常都在電視上或在報章早上看見您那所以我想今天你來擔任這個文化部長當然也任重道遠所以我想開門進商我就有一些問題想要跟您請教\n\n3\n00:00:40,013 --> 00:00:54,323\n布長你在2006年時任華視總經理那時候你批評過公共電視文化事業基金會處處干預華視導致華視非工非商那\n\n4\n00:00:56,136 --> 00:01:21,149\n就是不像啦那時候你也不惜這個辭職捍衛華視的權益那想要請教部長為了改善這個華視的經營問題你現在還有那麼那一股衝勁嗎那如果說第一步是要處理民股買回當然你又有說可能要協調修法等等那到底具體而言該怎麼做才能改善這個華視目前的狀況\n\n5\n00:01:24,073 --> 00:01:40,493\n好謝謝你問這個問題讓我有機會稍微更正一下其實我當初我覺得我們都沒有人有經驗是怎麼樣把華視捐給公視華視是35年公視是8年從來沒有人做過一個公款集團所以我必須承認我當時有一直批評\n\n6\n00:01:41,454 --> 00:02:06,417\n然後我也後來跟這個當時的公視總經理現在在場的這個胡英威總經理道歉因為我的語言非常粗暴所以我最後是跟他道歉完做完醫院才下來的我並沒有用辭職來抗議那事隔18年齁我們回頭看這個華視跟公視的關係第一個公安局又變得更大然後又多了一個華視新聞頻道然後本身\n\n7\n00:02:07,503 --> 00:02:07,703\n﹚林宜瑾\n\n8\n00:02:30,908 --> 00:02:52,454\n第二既然公安廣播集團已經這麼有力量的話我會希望用各種方式支持這個公安集團協助華視壯大但是華視面臨的兩個問題都是一個非常困難的問題一個就是民股買回就在我去的那一年就發生問題因為在法律上面民股要買回這件事情\n\n9\n00:02:53,314 --> 00:02:53,634\n林宜瑾議員\n\n10\n00:03:13,897 --> 00:03:14,257\n﹚林宜瑾\n\n11\n00:03:37,264 --> 00:03:37,504\n﹚林宜瑾\n\n12\n00:03:52,544 --> 00:03:53,344\n目前華視是商業電視台還是公共化無線電視事業?\n\n13\n00:04:15,476 --> 00:04:43,354\n當初捐給公共電視的時候是希望他能夠自力更生他還是可以有商業廣告然後有商業廣告收入但是又受到某種限制就是說他跟一般的商業台又不太一樣他不能有政論節目也不能有宗教節目也不能有這個政治的廣告對他具備了公共性質的商業台是是是所以他本身就是一個在界定上有一點模糊的然後我對他的期待就是\n\n14\n00:04:44,773 --> 00:04:44,853\n部長講到重點了\n\n15\n00:05:03,226 --> 00:05:06,689\n就說我們如果依這個公股處理條例第11條主管單位機關本來就得這個編列這個負負擔捐贈給這個所謂的戰股超過50%的這個公共化的無線電視事業所以嘛您剛剛有提到負負擔捐贈的問題那當然過去我們都沒有每年編列負負擔捐贈給\n\n16\n00:05:26,447 --> 00:05:49,262\n華氏那您剛剛也提到過去有一些的預算的補助給華氏有點像等同於負負擔捐贈的這樣概念可是他還是沒有每年去編列負負擔捐贈這是這樣的一個動作所以我想說未來您當部長之後未來您會不會來每年持續編列負負擔捐贈給華氏\n\n17\n00:05:50,723 --> 00:05:50,883\n林宜瑾議員\n\n18\n00:06:09,910 --> 00:06:30,976\n提出一個很好的解決方式在院會上爭取行政院的支持瞭解好那另外想跟你討論就是說賴清德總統就職演說中他有提到兩個很大的跟文化部相關的工作面向第一個我想你應該也聽得很清楚\n\n19\n00:06:31,476 --> 00:06:31,536\n委員會主席\n\n20\n00:06:50,490 --> 00:06:51,591\n關於中正紀念堂的轉型文化部到底做還是不做\n\n21\n00:07:06,200 --> 00:07:32,338\n剛剛柯思恩召委也有提到這個問題可是他當然也沒有問得很詳細那我想再跟你進一步討論說當然這個問題是複雜的那當然我也不是只有現在才問您在李永德部長的時代在史哲的部長時代我每一個部長都問過那當然我是非常關心這個事情那李永德部長其實當初他的回答是讓我覺得\n\n22\n00:07:34,699 --> 00:07:57,272\n和我的新友七七煙他認為中正紀念堂百分之百是威權他的一磚一瓦都是在紀念蔣介石所以如果面對這樣子的概念的話那他的轉型正義當然轉型正義不是一觸可擊所以我們要怎麼樣逐步來轉型正義那當然由國家帶頭崇拜這個獨裁者\n\n23\n00:08:00,234 --> 00:08:00,974\n我具體建議就是說我們是不是在這個所謂的三軍一隊在堂體的三軍一隊\n\n24\n00:08:22,424 --> 00:08:37,808\n是不是可以來先移到所謂的升降騎台那裡因為我們知道現在中正堂就如同您剛講的現在很多的觀光啊那休閒啊這是一個提供很好的場域那很多觀光客其實也常來到中正堂那其實三軍儀隊這些展演也是很多觀光客愛看的\n\n25\n00:08:43,590 --> 00:09:06,615\n可是我們的象徵意義很清楚就是說他在堂體他就是好像還在這個這個保護或這個擁護這個所謂的威權那他如果來到升降騎台在這個廣場中那是不是就是會轉移這個這個這樣的一個意義的象徵所以我想請教部長您怎麼看這個問題\n\n26\n00:09:07,984 --> 00:09:24,493\n我想國安部其實我們這個事情要跟國安部來溝通他們已經對外表達說他那個儀隊是一種儀式而不是表演所以他已經表達說要麽就撤要麽就不撤他已經不堅持不撤他把這問題對給我們那這個問題其實我應該這樣講我覺得中正紀念堂從當時蓋了中正紀念堂之後\n\n27\n00:09:35,778 --> 00:10:02,104\n陳水扁總統上任之後就好像把他降級了然後就把那個儀隊撤掉然後把大中資政改成自由廣場可是8年後馬英九總統上任後又把總統新常升級然後再把三軍儀隊全部回復你不覺得我覺得三軍儀隊好像工具一般的被大家搬來搬去從我比較人道立場來講他不是一個讓大家\n\n28\n00:10:03,044 --> 00:10:03,284\n李宜瑾\n\n29\n00:10:27,267 --> 00:10:53,673\n已經對外徵求了所有人去想像中中正經驗堂應該變成什麼樣子那那個展覽我看了很多遍因為我家就住在隔壁我連中正經驗堂原來沒有鴿子到後來有九隻鴿子到現在鴿子鴿孫我都陪伴小孩長大甚至我還寫過童話就是中正經驗堂的鴿子我覺得它的演變是很自然的演變就像鴿子從九隻變一大堆一樣本來有一條山樹林\n\n30\n00:10:55,134 --> 00:11:22,586\n大家都不能進去的後來民眾去踩一踩踩一踩那個山樹林就被人解除了禁令民眾都可以散步每天早上九點半都會有一個人站在那邊開始講白色恐怖是怎麼發生的九點半講到十點半然後他講完之後離開你會很好奇他在白色恐怖裡面扮演什麼角色他其實認為自己是一個被害者那事實上從別人眼光看他是一個加害者\n\n31\n00:11:23,766 --> 00:11:46,774\n一切的一切在我們生活中都發生還是恐怖這件事情那可是我覺得台灣現在需要的是一種在一個有共識下往下做當然因為我覺得以目前這個政治生態我不想用很強迫的方式用我覺得對的方式往下做我有我個人的想法是我的家族裡面有\n\n32\n00:11:47,748 --> 00:11:52,946\n我舅舅有四個裡面有三個是白色恐怖但是我不會用我個人的理由去面對這個事情\n\n33\n00:11:55,281 --> 00:11:55,581\n轉型正義的意義也是這樣\n\n34\n00:12:37,694 --> 00:12:37,894\n林宜瑾議員\n\n35\n00:12:59,757 --> 00:13:04,981\n拜託再考慮一下這是一個轉型正義很重要意義的表徵那好那我想再借一點點時間就是說我想跟談到剛剛提到就是所謂的這個語言的問題因為\n\n36\n00:13:15,789 --> 00:13:37,880\n總統賴慶德也有揭示文化的永續和語言的保存是非常重要當然剛剛也有委員提到現在因為語言我們有課委會我們有原民會包括課與原民會我們都有專責中央部會也有對應的專法那台語它散落在包括各個部會包括教育部跟文化部\n\n37\n00:13:38,220 --> 00:14:03,918\n可是文化部又是所謂國家語言發展法組織的單位所以在台語的推廣上面我覺得這個部分這個文化部責無旁貸那不曉得部長你有什麼樣的想法在台語的部分我想很多人都期待文化部扮演一個比較推廣台語的那個角色我想這一點是無庸置疑的而且我來我來上任前已經很多單位來找我也強調台語的傳承的重要我個人在成長經驗中\n\n38\n00:14:08,576 --> 00:14:09,176\n﹚林宜瑾\n\n39\n00:14:33,582 --> 00:14:35,043\n謝謝李展昭委部長請回座\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n89\t6293\t提請召委質詢。謝謝主席。謝謝主席。有請部長。請李部長。部長好。你好。\n14578\t38612\t嗯,迫不及待安排您今天就來這個委員會備詢基本上是很多的這個委員都迫不及待的想看見您平常都在電視上或在報章早上看見您那所以我想今天你來擔任這個文化部長當然也任重道遠所以我想開門進商我就有一些問題想要跟您請教\n40013\t54323\t布長你在2006年時任華視總經理那時候你批評過公共電視文化事業基金會處處干預華視導致華視非工非商那\n56136\t81149\t就是不像啦那時候你也不惜這個辭職捍衛華視的權益那想要請教部長為了改善這個華視的經營問題你現在還有那麼那一股衝勁嗎那如果說第一步是要處理民股買回當然你又有說可能要協調修法等等那到底具體而言該怎麼做才能改善這個華視目前的狀況\n84073\t100493\t好謝謝你問這個問題讓我有機會稍微更正一下其實我當初我覺得我們都沒有人有經驗是怎麼樣把華視捐給公視華視是35年公視是8年從來沒有人做過一個公款集團所以我必須承認我當時有一直批評\n101454\t126417\t然後我也後來跟這個當時的公視總經理現在在場的這個胡英威總經理道歉因為我的語言非常粗暴所以我最後是跟他道歉完做完醫院才下來的我並沒有用辭職來抗議那事隔18年齁我們回頭看這個華視跟公視的關係第一個公安局又變得更大然後又多了一個華視新聞頻道然後本身\n127503\t127703\t﹚林宜瑾\n150908\t172454\t第二 既然公安廣播集團已經這麼有力量的話我會希望用各種方式支持這個公安集團協助華視壯大但是華視面臨的兩個問題都是一個非常困難的問題一個就是民股買回就在我去的那一年就發生問題因為在法律上面民股要買回這件事情\n173314\t173634\t林宜瑾議員\n193897\t194257\t﹚林宜瑾\n217264\t217504\t﹚林宜瑾\n232544\t233344\t目前華視是商業電視台還是公共化無線電視事業?\n255476\t283354\t當初捐給公共電視的時候是希望他能夠自力更生他還是可以有商業廣告然後有商業廣告收入但是又受到某種限制就是說他跟一般的商業台又不太一樣他不能有政論節目也不能有宗教節目也不能有這個政治的廣告對他具備了公共性質的商業台是是是所以他本身就是一個在界定上有一點模糊的然後我對他的期待就是\n284773\t284853\t部長講到重點了\n303226\t306689\t就說我們如果依這個公股處理條例第11條 主管單位機關本來就得這個編列這個負負擔捐贈給這個所謂的戰股 超過50%的這個公共化的無線電視事業所以嘛 您剛剛有提到負負擔捐贈的問題 那當然過去我們都沒有每年編列負負擔捐贈給\n326447\t349262\t華氏那您剛剛也提到過去有一些的預算的補助給華氏有點像等同於負負擔捐贈的這樣概念可是他還是沒有每年去編列負負擔捐贈這是這樣的一個動作所以我想說未來您當部長之後未來您會不會來每年持續編列負負擔捐贈給華氏\n350723\t350883\t林宜瑾議員\n369910\t390976\t提出一個很好的解決方式在院會上爭取行政院的支持瞭解好那另外想跟你討論就是說賴清德總統就職演說中他有提到兩個很大的跟文化部相關的工作面向第一個我想你應該也聽得很清楚\n391476\t391536\t委員會主席\n410490\t411591\t關於中正紀念堂的轉型 文化部到底做還是不做\n426200\t452338\t剛剛柯思恩召委也有提到這個問題可是他當然也沒有問得很詳細那我想再跟你進一步討論說當然這個問題是複雜的那當然我也不是只有現在才問您在李永德部長的時代在史哲的部長時代我每一個部長都問過那當然我是非常關心這個事情那李永德部長其實當初他的回答是讓我覺得\n454699\t477272\t和我的新友七七煙他認為中正紀念堂百分之百是威權他的一磚一瓦都是在紀念蔣介石所以如果面對這樣子的概念的話那他的轉型正義當然轉型正義不是一觸可擊所以我們要怎麼樣逐步來轉型正義那當然由國家帶頭崇拜這個獨裁者\n480234\t480974\t我具體建議就是說我們是不是在這個所謂的三軍一隊在堂體的三軍一隊\n502424\t517808\t是不是可以來先移到所謂的升降騎台那裡因為我們知道現在中正堂就如同您剛講的現在很多的觀光啊那休閒啊這是一個提供很好的場域那很多觀光客其實也常來到中正堂那其實三軍儀隊這些展演也是很多觀光客愛看的\n523590\t546615\t可是我們的象徵意義很清楚就是說他在堂體他就是好像還在這個這個保護或這個擁護這個所謂的威權那他如果來到升降騎台在這個廣場中那是不是就是會轉移這個這個這樣的一個意義的象徵所以我想請教部長您怎麼看這個問題\n547984\t564493\t我想國安部其實我們這個事情要跟國安部來溝通他們已經對外表達說他那個儀隊是一種儀式而不是表演所以他已經表達說要麽就撤要麽就不撤他已經不堅持不撤他把這問題對給我們那這個問題其實我應該這樣講我覺得中正紀念堂從當時蓋了中正紀念堂之後\n575778\t602104\t陳水扁總統上任之後就好像把他降級了然後就把那個儀隊撤掉然後把大中資政改成自由廣場可是8年後馬英九總統上任後又把總統新常升級然後再把三軍儀隊全部回復你不覺得我覺得三軍儀隊好像工具一般的被大家搬來搬去從我比較人道立場來講他不是一個讓大家\n603044\t603284\t李宜瑾\n627267\t653673\t已經對外徵求了所有人去想像中中正經驗堂應該變成什麼樣子那那個展覽我看了很多遍因為我家就住在隔壁我連中正經驗堂原來沒有鴿子到後來有九隻鴿子到現在鴿子 鴿孫我都陪伴小孩長大甚至我還寫過童話就是中正經驗堂的鴿子我覺得它的演變是很自然的演變就像鴿子從九隻變一大堆一樣本來有一條山樹林\n655134\t682586\t大家都不能進去的後來民眾去踩一踩踩一踩那個山樹林就被人解除了禁令民眾都可以散步每天早上九點半都會有一個人站在那邊開始講白色恐怖是怎麼發生的九點半講到十點半然後他講完之後離開你會很好奇他在白色恐怖裡面扮演什麼角色他其實認為自己是一個被害者那事實上從別人眼光看他是一個加害者\n683766\t706774\t一切的一切在我們生活中都發生還是恐怖這件事情那可是我覺得台灣現在需要的是一種在一個有共識下往下做當然因為我覺得以目前這個政治生態我不想用很強迫的方式用我覺得對的方式往下做我有我個人的想法是我的家族裡面有\n707748\t712946\t我舅舅有四個裡面有三個是白色恐怖但是我不會用我個人的理由去面對這個事情\n715281\t715581\t轉型正義的意義也是這樣\n739565\t757654\t﹗\n757694\t757894\t林宜瑾議員\n779757\t784981\t拜託再考慮一下這是一個轉型正義很重要意義的表徵那好那我想再借一點點時間就是說我想跟談到剛剛提到就是所謂的這個語言的問題因為\n795789\t817880\t總統賴慶德也有揭示文化的永續和語言的保存是非常重要當然剛剛也有委員提到現在因為語言我們有課委會我們有原民會包括課與原民會我們都有專責中央部會也有對應的專法那台語它散落在包括各個部會包括教育部跟文化部\n818220\t843918\t可是文化部又是所謂國家語言發展法組織的單位所以在台語的推廣上面我覺得這個部分這個文化部責無旁貸那不曉得部長你有什麼樣的想法在台語的部分我想很多人都期待文化部扮演一個比較推廣台語的那個角色我想這一點是無庸置疑的而且我來我來上任前已經很多單位來找我也強調台語的傳承的重要我個人在成長經驗中\n848576\t849176\t﹚林宜瑾\n873582\t875043\t謝謝李展昭委部長請回座\n","txt":"提請召委質詢。謝謝主席。謝謝主席。有請部長。請李部長。部長好。你好。\n嗯,迫不及待安排您今天就來這個委員會備詢基本上是很多的這個委員都迫不及待的想看見您平常都在電視上或在報章早上看見您那所以我想今天你來擔任這個文化部長當然也任重道遠所以我想開門進商我就有一些問題想要跟您請教\n布長你在2006年時任華視總經理那時候你批評過公共電視文化事業基金會處處干預華視導致華視非工非商那\n就是不像啦那時候你也不惜這個辭職捍衛華視的權益那想要請教部長為了改善這個華視的經營問題你現在還有那麼那一股衝勁嗎那如果說第一步是要處理民股買回當然你又有說可能要協調修法等等那到底具體而言該怎麼做才能改善這個華視目前的狀況\n好謝謝你問這個問題讓我有機會稍微更正一下其實我當初我覺得我們都沒有人有經驗是怎麼樣把華視捐給公視華視是35年公視是8年從來沒有人做過一個公款集團所以我必須承認我當時有一直批評\n然後我也後來跟這個當時的公視總經理現在在場的這個胡英威總經理道歉因為我的語言非常粗暴所以我最後是跟他道歉完做完醫院才下來的我並沒有用辭職來抗議那事隔18年齁我們回頭看這個華視跟公視的關係第一個公安局又變得更大然後又多了一個華視新聞頻道然後本身\n﹚林宜瑾\n第二 既然公安廣播集團已經這麼有力量的話我會希望用各種方式支持這個公安集團協助華視壯大但是華視面臨的兩個問題都是一個非常困難的問題一個就是民股買回就在我去的那一年就發生問題因為在法律上面民股要買回這件事情\n林宜瑾議員\n﹚林宜瑾\n﹚林宜瑾\n目前華視是商業電視台還是公共化無線電視事業?\n當初捐給公共電視的時候是希望他能夠自力更生他還是可以有商業廣告然後有商業廣告收入但是又受到某種限制就是說他跟一般的商業台又不太一樣他不能有政論節目也不能有宗教節目也不能有這個政治的廣告對他具備了公共性質的商業台是是是所以他本身就是一個在界定上有一點模糊的然後我對他的期待就是\n部長講到重點了\n就說我們如果依這個公股處理條例第11條 主管單位機關本來就得這個編列這個負負擔捐贈給這個所謂的戰股 超過50%的這個公共化的無線電視事業所以嘛 您剛剛有提到負負擔捐贈的問題 那當然過去我們都沒有每年編列負負擔捐贈給\n華氏那您剛剛也提到過去有一些的預算的補助給華氏有點像等同於負負擔捐贈的這樣概念可是他還是沒有每年去編列負負擔捐贈這是這樣的一個動作所以我想說未來您當部長之後未來您會不會來每年持續編列負負擔捐贈給華氏\n林宜瑾議員\n提出一個很好的解決方式在院會上爭取行政院的支持瞭解好那另外想跟你討論就是說賴清德總統就職演說中他有提到兩個很大的跟文化部相關的工作面向第一個我想你應該也聽得很清楚\n委員會主席\n關於中正紀念堂的轉型 文化部到底做還是不做\n剛剛柯思恩召委也有提到這個問題可是他當然也沒有問得很詳細那我想再跟你進一步討論說當然這個問題是複雜的那當然我也不是只有現在才問您在李永德部長的時代在史哲的部長時代我每一個部長都問過那當然我是非常關心這個事情那李永德部長其實當初他的回答是讓我覺得\n和我的新友七七煙他認為中正紀念堂百分之百是威權他的一磚一瓦都是在紀念蔣介石所以如果面對這樣子的概念的話那他的轉型正義當然轉型正義不是一觸可擊所以我們要怎麼樣逐步來轉型正義那當然由國家帶頭崇拜這個獨裁者\n我具體建議就是說我們是不是在這個所謂的三軍一隊在堂體的三軍一隊\n是不是可以來先移到所謂的升降騎台那裡因為我們知道現在中正堂就如同您剛講的現在很多的觀光啊那休閒啊這是一個提供很好的場域那很多觀光客其實也常來到中正堂那其實三軍儀隊這些展演也是很多觀光客愛看的\n可是我們的象徵意義很清楚就是說他在堂體他就是好像還在這個這個保護或這個擁護這個所謂的威權那他如果來到升降騎台在這個廣場中那是不是就是會轉移這個這個這樣的一個意義的象徵所以我想請教部長您怎麼看這個問題\n我想國安部其實我們這個事情要跟國安部來溝通他們已經對外表達說他那個儀隊是一種儀式而不是表演所以他已經表達說要麽就撤要麽就不撤他已經不堅持不撤他把這問題對給我們那這個問題其實我應該這樣講我覺得中正紀念堂從當時蓋了中正紀念堂之後\n陳水扁總統上任之後就好像把他降級了然後就把那個儀隊撤掉然後把大中資政改成自由廣場可是8年後馬英九總統上任後又把總統新常升級然後再把三軍儀隊全部回復你不覺得我覺得三軍儀隊好像工具一般的被大家搬來搬去從我比較人道立場來講他不是一個讓大家\n李宜瑾\n已經對外徵求了所有人去想像中中正經驗堂應該變成什麼樣子那那個展覽我看了很多遍因為我家就住在隔壁我連中正經驗堂原來沒有鴿子到後來有九隻鴿子到現在鴿子 鴿孫我都陪伴小孩長大甚至我還寫過童話就是中正經驗堂的鴿子我覺得它的演變是很自然的演變就像鴿子從九隻變一大堆一樣本來有一條山樹林\n大家都不能進去的後來民眾去踩一踩踩一踩那個山樹林就被人解除了禁令民眾都可以散步每天早上九點半都會有一個人站在那邊開始講白色恐怖是怎麼發生的九點半講到十點半然後他講完之後離開你會很好奇他在白色恐怖裡面扮演什麼角色他其實認為自己是一個被害者那事實上從別人眼光看他是一個加害者\n一切的一切在我們生活中都發生還是恐怖這件事情那可是我覺得台灣現在需要的是一種在一個有共識下往下做當然因為我覺得以目前這個政治生態我不想用很強迫的方式用我覺得對的方式往下做我有我個人的想法是我的家族裡面有\n我舅舅有四個裡面有三個是白色恐怖但是我不會用我個人的理由去面對這個事情\n轉型正義的意義也是這樣\n﹗\n林宜瑾議員\n拜託再考慮一下這是一個轉型正義很重要意義的表徵那好那我想再借一點點時間就是說我想跟談到剛剛提到就是所謂的這個語言的問題因為\n總統賴慶德也有揭示文化的永續和語言的保存是非常重要當然剛剛也有委員提到現在因為語言我們有課委會我們有原民會包括課與原民會我們都有專責中央部會也有對應的專法那台語它散落在包括各個部會包括教育部跟文化部\n可是文化部又是所謂國家語言發展法組織的單位所以在台語的推廣上面我覺得這個部分這個文化部責無旁貸那不曉得部長你有什麼樣的想法在台語的部分我想很多人都期待文化部扮演一個比較推廣台語的那個角色我想這一點是無庸置疑的而且我來我來上任前已經很多單位來找我也強調台語的傳承的重要我個人在成長經驗中\n﹚林宜瑾\n謝謝李展昭委部長請回座\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.089 --> 00:06.293\n提請召委質詢。謝謝主席。謝謝主席。有請部長。請李部長。部長好。你好。\n\n00:14.578 --> 00:38.612\n嗯,迫不及待安排您今天就來這個委員會備詢基本上是很多的這個委員都迫不及待的想看見您平常都在電視上或在報章早上看見您那所以我想今天你來擔任這個文化部長當然也任重道遠所以我想開門進商我就有一些問題想要跟您請教\n\n00:40.013 --> 00:54.323\n布長你在2006年時任華視總經理那時候你批評過公共電視文化事業基金會處處干預華視導致華視非工非商那\n\n00:56.136 --> 01:21.149\n就是不像啦那時候你也不惜這個辭職捍衛華視的權益那想要請教部長為了改善這個華視的經營問題你現在還有那麼那一股衝勁嗎那如果說第一步是要處理民股買回當然你又有說可能要協調修法等等那到底具體而言該怎麼做才能改善這個華視目前的狀況\n\n01:24.073 --> 01:40.493\n好謝謝你問這個問題讓我有機會稍微更正一下其實我當初我覺得我們都沒有人有經驗是怎麼樣把華視捐給公視華視是35年公視是8年從來沒有人做過一個公款集團所以我必須承認我當時有一直批評\n\n01:41.454 --> 02:06.417\n然後我也後來跟這個當時的公視總經理現在在場的這個胡英威總經理道歉因為我的語言非常粗暴所以我最後是跟他道歉完做完醫院才下來的我並沒有用辭職來抗議那事隔18年齁我們回頭看這個華視跟公視的關係第一個公安局又變得更大然後又多了一個華視新聞頻道然後本身\n\n02:07.503 --> 02:07.703\n﹚林宜瑾\n\n02:30.908 --> 02:52.454\n第二既然公安廣播集團已經這麼有力量的話我會希望用各種方式支持這個公安集團協助華視壯大但是華視面臨的兩個問題都是一個非常困難的問題一個就是民股買回就在我去的那一年就發生問題因為在法律上面民股要買回這件事情\n\n02:53.314 --> 02:53.634\n林宜瑾議員\n\n03:13.897 --> 03:14.257\n﹚林宜瑾\n\n03:37.264 --> 03:37.504\n﹚林宜瑾\n\n03:52.544 --> 03:53.344\n目前華視是商業電視台還是公共化無線電視事業?\n\n04:15.476 --> 04:43.354\n當初捐給公共電視的時候是希望他能夠自力更生他還是可以有商業廣告然後有商業廣告收入但是又受到某種限制就是說他跟一般的商業台又不太一樣他不能有政論節目也不能有宗教節目也不能有這個政治的廣告對他具備了公共性質的商業台是是是所以他本身就是一個在界定上有一點模糊的然後我對他的期待就是\n\n04:44.773 --> 04:44.853\n部長講到重點了\n\n05:03.226 --> 05:06.689\n就說我們如果依這個公股處理條例第11條主管單位機關本來就得這個編列這個負負擔捐贈給這個所謂的戰股超過50%的這個公共化的無線電視事業所以嘛您剛剛有提到負負擔捐贈的問題那當然過去我們都沒有每年編列負負擔捐贈給\n\n05:26.447 --> 05:49.262\n華氏那您剛剛也提到過去有一些的預算的補助給華氏有點像等同於負負擔捐贈的這樣概念可是他還是沒有每年去編列負負擔捐贈這是這樣的一個動作所以我想說未來您當部長之後未來您會不會來每年持續編列負負擔捐贈給華氏\n\n05:50.723 --> 05:50.883\n林宜瑾議員\n\n06:09.910 --> 06:30.976\n提出一個很好的解決方式在院會上爭取行政院的支持瞭解好那另外想跟你討論就是說賴清德總統就職演說中他有提到兩個很大的跟文化部相關的工作面向第一個我想你應該也聽得很清楚\n\n06:31.476 --> 06:31.536\n委員會主席\n\n06:50.490 --> 06:51.591\n關於中正紀念堂的轉型文化部到底做還是不做\n\n07:06.200 --> 07:32.338\n剛剛柯思恩召委也有提到這個問題可是他當然也沒有問得很詳細那我想再跟你進一步討論說當然這個問題是複雜的那當然我也不是只有現在才問您在李永德部長的時代在史哲的部長時代我每一個部長都問過那當然我是非常關心這個事情那李永德部長其實當初他的回答是讓我覺得\n\n07:34.699 --> 07:57.272\n和我的新友七七煙他認為中正紀念堂百分之百是威權他的一磚一瓦都是在紀念蔣介石所以如果面對這樣子的概念的話那他的轉型正義當然轉型正義不是一觸可擊所以我們要怎麼樣逐步來轉型正義那當然由國家帶頭崇拜這個獨裁者\n\n08:00.234 --> 08:00.974\n我具體建議就是說我們是不是在這個所謂的三軍一隊在堂體的三軍一隊\n\n08:22.424 --> 08:37.808\n是不是可以來先移到所謂的升降騎台那裡因為我們知道現在中正堂就如同您剛講的現在很多的觀光啊那休閒啊這是一個提供很好的場域那很多觀光客其實也常來到中正堂那其實三軍儀隊這些展演也是很多觀光客愛看的\n\n08:43.590 --> 09:06.615\n可是我們的象徵意義很清楚就是說他在堂體他就是好像還在這個這個保護或這個擁護這個所謂的威權那他如果來到升降騎台在這個廣場中那是不是就是會轉移這個這個這樣的一個意義的象徵所以我想請教部長您怎麼看這個問題\n\n09:07.984 --> 09:24.493\n我想國安部其實我們這個事情要跟國安部來溝通他們已經對外表達說他那個儀隊是一種儀式而不是表演所以他已經表達說要麽就撤要麽就不撤他已經不堅持不撤他把這問題對給我們那這個問題其實我應該這樣講我覺得中正紀念堂從當時蓋了中正紀念堂之後\n\n09:35.778 --> 10:02.104\n陳水扁總統上任之後就好像把他降級了然後就把那個儀隊撤掉然後把大中資政改成自由廣場可是8年後馬英九總統上任後又把總統新常升級然後再把三軍儀隊全部回復你不覺得我覺得三軍儀隊好像工具一般的被大家搬來搬去從我比較人道立場來講他不是一個讓大家\n\n10:03.044 --> 10:03.284\n李宜瑾\n\n10:27.267 --> 10:53.673\n已經對外徵求了所有人去想像中中正經驗堂應該變成什麼樣子那那個展覽我看了很多遍因為我家就住在隔壁我連中正經驗堂原來沒有鴿子到後來有九隻鴿子到現在鴿子鴿孫我都陪伴小孩長大甚至我還寫過童話就是中正經驗堂的鴿子我覺得它的演變是很自然的演變就像鴿子從九隻變一大堆一樣本來有一條山樹林\n\n10:55.134 --> 11:22.586\n大家都不能進去的後來民眾去踩一踩踩一踩那個山樹林就被人解除了禁令民眾都可以散步每天早上九點半都會有一個人站在那邊開始講白色恐怖是怎麼發生的九點半講到十點半然後他講完之後離開你會很好奇他在白色恐怖裡面扮演什麼角色他其實認為自己是一個被害者那事實上從別人眼光看他是一個加害者\n\n11:23.766 --> 11:46.774\n一切的一切在我們生活中都發生還是恐怖這件事情那可是我覺得台灣現在需要的是一種在一個有共識下往下做當然因為我覺得以目前這個政治生態我不想用很強迫的方式用我覺得對的方式往下做我有我個人的想法是我的家族裡面有\n\n11:47.748 --> 11:52.946\n我舅舅有四個裡面有三個是白色恐怖但是我不會用我個人的理由去面對這個事情\n\n11:55.281 --> 11:55.581\n轉型正義的意義也是這樣\n\n12:37.694 --> 12:37.894\n林宜瑾議員\n\n12:59.757 --> 13:04.981\n拜託再考慮一下這是一個轉型正義很重要意義的表徵那好那我想再借一點點時間就是說我想跟談到剛剛提到就是所謂的這個語言的問題因為\n\n13:15.789 --> 13:37.880\n總統賴慶德也有揭示文化的永續和語言的保存是非常重要當然剛剛也有委員提到現在因為語言我們有課委會我們有原民會包括課與原民會我們都有專責中央部會也有對應的專法那台語它散落在包括各個部會包括教育部跟文化部\n\n13:38.220 --> 14:03.918\n可是文化部又是所謂國家語言發展法組織的單位所以在台語的推廣上面我覺得這個部分這個文化部責無旁貸那不曉得部長你有什麼樣的想法在台語的部分我想很多人都期待文化部扮演一個比較推廣台語的那個角色我想這一點是無庸置疑的而且我來我來上任前已經很多單位來找我也強調台語的傳承的重要我個人在成長經驗中\n\n14:08.576 --> 14:09.176\n﹚林宜瑾\n\n14:33.582 --> 14:35.043\n謝謝李展昭委部長請回座\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.089,"end":6.293,"text":"提請召委質詢。謝謝主席。謝謝主席。有請部長。請李部長。部長好。你好。"},{"start":14.578,"end":38.612,"text":"嗯,迫不及待安排您今天就來這個委員會備詢基本上是很多的這個委員都迫不及待的想看見您平常都在電視上或在報章早上看見您那所以我想今天你來擔任這個文化部長當然也任重道遠所以我想開門進商我就有一些問題想要跟您請教"},{"start":40.013,"end":54.323,"text":"布長你在2006年時任華視總經理那時候你批評過公共電視文化事業基金會處處干預華視導致華視非工非商那"},{"start":56.136,"end":81.149,"text":"就是不像啦那時候你也不惜這個辭職捍衛華視的權益那想要請教部長為了改善這個華視的經營問題你現在還有那麼那一股衝勁嗎那如果說第一步是要處理民股買回當然你又有說可能要協調修法等等那到底具體而言該怎麼做才能改善這個華視目前的狀況"},{"start":84.073,"end":100.493,"text":"好謝謝你問這個問題讓我有機會稍微更正一下其實我當初我覺得我們都沒有人有經驗是怎麼樣把華視捐給公視華視是35年公視是8年從來沒有人做過一個公款集團所以我必須承認我當時有一直批評"},{"start":101.454,"end":126.417,"text":"然後我也後來跟這個當時的公視總經理現在在場的這個胡英威總經理道歉因為我的語言非常粗暴所以我最後是跟他道歉完做完醫院才下來的我並沒有用辭職來抗議那事隔18年齁我們回頭看這個華視跟公視的關係第一個公安局又變得更大然後又多了一個華視新聞頻道然後本身"},{"start":127.503,"end":127.703,"text":"﹚林宜瑾"},{"start":150.908,"end":172.454,"text":"第二 既然公安廣播集團已經這麼有力量的話我會希望用各種方式支持這個公安集團協助華視壯大但是華視面臨的兩個問題都是一個非常困難的問題一個就是民股買回就在我去的那一年就發生問題因為在法律上面民股要買回這件事情"},{"start":173.314,"end":173.634,"text":"林宜瑾議員"},{"start":193.897,"end":194.257,"text":"﹚林宜瑾"},{"start":217.264,"end":217.504,"text":"﹚林宜瑾"},{"start":232.544,"end":233.344,"text":"目前華視是商業電視台還是公共化無線電視事業?"},{"start":255.476,"end":283.354,"text":"當初捐給公共電視的時候是希望他能夠自力更生他還是可以有商業廣告然後有商業廣告收入但是又受到某種限制就是說他跟一般的商業台又不太一樣他不能有政論節目也不能有宗教節目也不能有這個政治的廣告對他具備了公共性質的商業台是是是所以他本身就是一個在界定上有一點模糊的然後我對他的期待就是"},{"start":284.773,"end":284.853,"text":"部長講到重點了"},{"start":303.226,"end":306.689,"text":"就說我們如果依這個公股處理條例第11條 主管單位機關本來就得這個編列這個負負擔捐贈給這個所謂的戰股 超過50%的這個公共化的無線電視事業所以嘛 您剛剛有提到負負擔捐贈的問題 那當然過去我們都沒有每年編列負負擔捐贈給"},{"start":326.447,"end":349.262,"text":"華氏那您剛剛也提到過去有一些的預算的補助給華氏有點像等同於負負擔捐贈的這樣概念可是他還是沒有每年去編列負負擔捐贈這是這樣的一個動作所以我想說未來您當部長之後未來您會不會來每年持續編列負負擔捐贈給華氏"},{"start":350.723,"end":350.883,"text":"林宜瑾議員"},{"start":369.91,"end":390.976,"text":"提出一個很好的解決方式在院會上爭取行政院的支持瞭解好那另外想跟你討論就是說賴清德總統就職演說中他有提到兩個很大的跟文化部相關的工作面向第一個我想你應該也聽得很清楚"},{"start":391.476,"end":391.536,"text":"委員會主席"},{"start":410.49,"end":411.591,"text":"關於中正紀念堂的轉型 文化部到底做還是不做"},{"start":426.2,"end":452.338,"text":"剛剛柯思恩召委也有提到這個問題可是他當然也沒有問得很詳細那我想再跟你進一步討論說當然這個問題是複雜的那當然我也不是只有現在才問您在李永德部長的時代在史哲的部長時代我每一個部長都問過那當然我是非常關心這個事情那李永德部長其實當初他的回答是讓我覺得"},{"start":454.699,"end":477.272,"text":"和我的新友七七煙他認為中正紀念堂百分之百是威權他的一磚一瓦都是在紀念蔣介石所以如果面對這樣子的概念的話那他的轉型正義當然轉型正義不是一觸可擊所以我們要怎麼樣逐步來轉型正義那當然由國家帶頭崇拜這個獨裁者"},{"start":480.234,"end":480.974,"text":"我具體建議就是說我們是不是在這個所謂的三軍一隊在堂體的三軍一隊"},{"start":502.424,"end":517.808,"text":"是不是可以來先移到所謂的升降騎台那裡因為我們知道現在中正堂就如同您剛講的現在很多的觀光啊那休閒啊這是一個提供很好的場域那很多觀光客其實也常來到中正堂那其實三軍儀隊這些展演也是很多觀光客愛看的"},{"start":523.59,"end":546.615,"text":"可是我們的象徵意義很清楚就是說他在堂體他就是好像還在這個這個保護或這個擁護這個所謂的威權那他如果來到升降騎台在這個廣場中那是不是就是會轉移這個這個這樣的一個意義的象徵所以我想請教部長您怎麼看這個問題"},{"start":547.984,"end":564.493,"text":"我想國安部其實我們這個事情要跟國安部來溝通他們已經對外表達說他那個儀隊是一種儀式而不是表演所以他已經表達說要麽就撤要麽就不撤他已經不堅持不撤他把這問題對給我們那這個問題其實我應該這樣講我覺得中正紀念堂從當時蓋了中正紀念堂之後"},{"start":575.778,"end":602.104,"text":"陳水扁總統上任之後就好像把他降級了然後就把那個儀隊撤掉然後把大中資政改成自由廣場可是8年後馬英九總統上任後又把總統新常升級然後再把三軍儀隊全部回復你不覺得我覺得三軍儀隊好像工具一般的被大家搬來搬去從我比較人道立場來講他不是一個讓大家"},{"start":603.044,"end":603.284,"text":"李宜瑾"},{"start":627.267,"end":653.673,"text":"已經對外徵求了所有人去想像中中正經驗堂應該變成什麼樣子那那個展覽我看了很多遍因為我家就住在隔壁我連中正經驗堂原來沒有鴿子到後來有九隻鴿子到現在鴿子 鴿孫我都陪伴小孩長大甚至我還寫過童話就是中正經驗堂的鴿子我覺得它的演變是很自然的演變就像鴿子從九隻變一大堆一樣本來有一條山樹林"},{"start":655.134,"end":682.586,"text":"大家都不能進去的後來民眾去踩一踩踩一踩那個山樹林就被人解除了禁令民眾都可以散步每天早上九點半都會有一個人站在那邊開始講白色恐怖是怎麼發生的九點半講到十點半然後他講完之後離開你會很好奇他在白色恐怖裡面扮演什麼角色他其實認為自己是一個被害者那事實上從別人眼光看他是一個加害者"},{"start":683.766,"end":706.774,"text":"一切的一切在我們生活中都發生還是恐怖這件事情那可是我覺得台灣現在需要的是一種在一個有共識下往下做當然因為我覺得以目前這個政治生態我不想用很強迫的方式用我覺得對的方式往下做我有我個人的想法是我的家族裡面有"},{"start":707.748,"end":712.946,"text":"我舅舅有四個裡面有三個是白色恐怖但是我不會用我個人的理由去面對這個事情"},{"start":715.281,"end":715.581,"text":"轉型正義的意義也是這樣"},{"start":739.565,"end":757.654,"text":"﹗"},{"start":757.694,"end":757.894,"text":"林宜瑾議員"},{"start":779.757,"end":784.981,"text":"拜託再考慮一下這是一個轉型正義很重要意義的表徵那好那我想再借一點點時間就是說我想跟談到剛剛提到就是所謂的這個語言的問題因為"},{"start":795.789,"end":817.88,"text":"總統賴慶德也有揭示文化的永續和語言的保存是非常重要當然剛剛也有委員提到現在因為語言我們有課委會我們有原民會包括課與原民會我們都有專責中央部會也有對應的專法那台語它散落在包括各個部會包括教育部跟文化部"},{"start":818.22,"end":843.918,"text":"可是文化部又是所謂國家語言發展法組織的單位所以在台語的推廣上面我覺得這個部分這個文化部責無旁貸那不曉得部長你有什麼樣的想法在台語的部分我想很多人都期待文化部扮演一個比較推廣台語的那個角色我想這一點是無庸置疑的而且我來我來上任前已經很多單位來找我也強調台語的傳承的重要我個人在成長經驗中"},{"start":848.576,"end":849.176,"text":"﹚林宜瑾"},{"start":873.582,"end":875.043,"text":"謝謝李展昭委部長請回座"}]}}}}