{"id":152910,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/152910","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/d339c8d1909fa453866b5c31bfe14ee49f2fcaa3dc194f73d34e896d657c5e83c103fba9c3d2f6a55ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"牛煦庭","委員發言時間":"11:20:15 - 11:27:01","影片長度":"00:06:46","會議時間":"2024-05-23T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。\n【5月22日、23日二天一次會】）","date":"2024-05-23","duration":406,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":17,"committees":[26],"id":"委員會-11-1-26-17"},"end_time":"2024-05-23T11:27:01+08:00","start_time":"2024-05-23T11:20:15+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":754,"blocks":[["牛委員煦庭：（11時20分）謝謝主席，何部長，有請。"],["主席：請何部長。"],["何部長佩珊：委員好。"],["牛委員煦庭：部長早安，辛苦了，今天第一天來備詢喔！"],["何部長佩珊：謝謝。"],["牛委員煦庭：我們也做了一些功課，您過去年輕的時候在勞工運動裡面應該算是有一定的歷練，本席第一次的質詢要跟您討論一下勞工的一些政策，希望您不忘初衷，可以幫我們的勞工朋友一起來講話。"],["何部長佩珊：好。"],["牛委員煦庭：我們就直接單刀直入主題，第一個是今天剛剛的新聞，今年的第一號颱風即將生成，每一次颱風來襲時要不要放假，都是大家，尤其是基層勞工，其實都非常期待可以多放一天颱風假，因為大家都說臺灣的過勞狀況其實很嚴重。目前大部分的人對於颱風假，有些人是當成小確幸，有些人是當成喘口氣的一個機會，但本席會關心颱風假背後的政策細節，所以要跟部長來做一下討論。照理來講，我們會放颱風假不應該是因為小確幸啦，其實應該是注重勞工的安全嘛，對不對？也就是說，不要因為颱風的天災，在通勤或者是工作的時候有職業安全的一些危險，所以我們要有一個放假的機制，部長同意我這樣的說法嗎？"],["何部長佩珊：是。"],["牛委員煦庭：應該沒有錯嘛，對不對？既然是為了勞工生命安全的安全措施，那麼請看螢幕上的這張表格，你可以看到勞動部現在的規定及實務現況，除了颱風假的成立方式都是由政府來宣布之外，其實真正的關鍵是發不發工資，按照現行的條件來計算，勞動部鼓勵企業即便放了颱風假，還是要給勞工應有的工資，但是僅能做到建議跟建議加發，所謂的建議是如果放颱風假且勞工沒有出勤，那就是希望雇主做做功德發個薪水；如果放颱風假而勞工依然出勤，就做做功德多發一點，但是只是建議性質。我想問一下，以目前勞動部的瞭解，全臺灣這麼多的企業，從大財團到中小企業到微型企業，真的有按照勞動部的建議去發工資或者是加發工資的企業有哪些？"],["何部長佩珊：大型企業有喔。"],["牛委員煦庭：可不可以舉幾個例子？"],["何部長佩珊：我請司長來說明。"],["黃司長維琛：我們跟工商團體在討論的時候他們有提到，比較大型的企業是不扣薪，他們會替員工來體諒這個事情。"],["何部長佩珊：比如？"],["黃司長維琛：事業單位名稱就比較不方便去講。"],["牛委員煦庭：沒關係，今天我們只做政策討論，好不好？"],["何部長佩珊：好。"],["牛委員煦庭：因為這個問題我們有認真的在思考要不要乾脆就讓它入法，既然要保障勞工，應該讓它到位，這個請勞動部先做一下思考，好不好？我理解啦，如果以經濟部的角度來說，我們要發展經濟，這樣做會墊高成本，但政府施政就是這樣嘛，我希望部長可以守住勞動部的本位，就是站在勞工立場當然要這樣子強力主張，有機會往前進的時候，從建議變成應該，我們應該要做嘗試，來做溝通。今天的第一步我希望你先做統整，剛剛講到有些大型企業有做，現在只有最大型的、相對優渥的企業有條件可以發這個東西，可是我想部長應該非常瞭解，臺灣是以中小企業為主，微型企其實是最多的，這件事有沒有機會做突破？又怎麼來做突破？給一些小建議，比如說建議加發工資，我剛剛為什麼要請你們舉例，至少我們要鼓勵願意配合勞動部政策方向的企業，總該標舉一下、獎勵一下吧，對不對？隱惡揚善，從揚善開始嘛，然後逐步往前推，本席是接受用一步一步的方式讓勞權進步的，但是至少要看到進步的方向跟進步的成果。所以第一個，我們希望未來有關颱風假的部分，剛剛我們也講了，這個是為了安全的考量，不純然只是單純的說他今天沒有上班、沒有對價這個問題，希望勞動部針對這件事情有一個檢討跟推動方向，好不好？這是第一個。"],["何部長佩珊：好。"],["牛委員煦庭：第二個，剛剛有滿多人在質詢的時候跟您討論有關薪資的問題，其實依據主計總處的統計，我們的實質薪資開始出現負成長的一個狀況。當然你可以講說這是因為是通貨膨脹或怎麼樣，但是大家要生活、要面對的當然就是要用實質薪資來做計算，這樣才比較貼近真實的狀況。5月17號可能大家都在關注立法院的衝突，但是勞工團體在5月17號有召開記者會，他們有提出了一部分的訴求，我們在今天的質詢過程中跟部長來做個政策對話。其實滿重要的，就是大家希望加班費的費率可以做有效的調漲，現在對於平日加班費費率的規定是，如果延長工作時間2小時就是1.33，再延長2小時就是1.66，如果在一例一休的休息日加班，那就分別是2.33跟2.66，這個有沒有機會再往上調？部長，有沒有接到這樣的訴求？勞動部有沒有這樣的規劃？"],["何部長佩珊：委員，這個牽涉到勞基法的修法啦！"],["牛委員煦庭：對、對。"],["何部長佩珊：勞基法的修法就是修一法動全身，這是大工程，我們……"],["牛委員煦庭：我同意嘛，所以先做……"],["何部長佩珊：我們來審慎研議，好不好？"],["牛委員煦庭：好，我們先做政策的對話，好不好？但是我希望可以，我想很多的勞工團體也希望看到部長的態度啦，勞動部有沒有打算往這個方向來推動，再給勞工朋友多一點的溫暖，好不好？"],["何部長佩珊：好。"],["牛委員煦庭：部長，第一個是加班費費率提升的問題，我們希望知道勞動部的態度。第二個是加班補休的比例問題，您可以看到這個表格寫得非常清楚，平日加班費1比1.33，休息日加班費是1比2.33，但是加班換補休就是1比1嘛，但是1比1的時候，實務上當勞資雙方在談判的時候，勞方處於弱勢，所以就各種實務的操作、軟硬兼施，就會要求變成加班換補休，勞工本來拿加班費可以拿到1.33、1.66，可是換補休的時候就被迫1比1，那其實是不對的嘛！既然是超時出勤，應該連補休也要比照1.33或1.66，對不對？比如說連續加班3天換4天補休，這樣子比較合理嘛，應該要跟加班費的比例一致嘛，這個同樣牽涉到勞基法的修正，對不對？部長？"],["何部長佩珊：對。"],["牛委員煦庭：所以這件事情，加班費率的提升跟補休比例的正義，希望勞動部做個政策研討，提出具體的方向，可以嗎？"],["何部長佩珊：好，謝謝。"],["牛委員煦庭：好，今天時間有限，有關試用期的部分，我們用書面的方式提出，也請勞動部提供修法意見，好不好？"],["何部長佩珊：好，謝謝。"],["牛委員煦庭：好，部長辛苦了，謝謝。"],["何部長佩珊：謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝牛煦庭委員的發言。","接下來請麥玉珍委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":464,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-26-17","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","盧縣一","蘇清泉","王育敏","涂權吉","林淑芬","王正旭","鄭天財Sra 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53.046, \"end\": 53.126, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"多\", \"start\": 53.126, \"end\": 53.286, \"score\": 0.892}, {\"word\": \"放\", \"start\": 53.286, \"end\": 53.407, \"score\": 0.849}, {\"word\": \"一\", \"start\": 53.407, \"end\": 53.467, \"score\": 0.66}, {\"word\": \"天\", \"start\": 53.467, \"end\": 53.567, \"score\": 0.988}, {\"word\": \"颱\"}, {\"word\": \"風\"}, {\"word\": \"假\", \"start\": 53.567, \"end\": 53.587, \"score\": 0.0}]}, {\"start\": 54.568, \"end\": 76.045, \"text\": \"大家都說台灣的這個過勞狀況其實很嚴重那目前大部分的人都把颱風架有些當成小確幸有些當成喘口氣的這樣的一個機會但北京關心颱風架背後的一個政策的一個細節要跟部長來做一下討論這個照理來講我們會放颱風架不應該是因為小確幸啦其實是應該是注重勞工的安全嘛\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"大\", \"start\": 54.568, \"end\": 54.708, \"score\": 0.996}, {\"word\": \"家\", \"start\": 54.708, \"end\": 54.768, \"score\": 0.368}, {\"word\": \"都\", \"start\": 54.768, \"end\": 55.089, \"score\": 0.791}, {\"word\": \"說\"}, {\"word\": \"台\", \"start\": 55.089, \"end\": 55.329, \"score\": 0.9}, {\"word\": \"灣\"}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 55.329, 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\"score\": 0.819}, {\"word\": \"理\", \"start\": 69.079, \"end\": 69.7, \"score\": 0.827}, {\"word\": \"來\"}, {\"word\": \"講\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 69.7, \"end\": 70.24, \"score\": 0.883}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"會\"}, {\"word\": \"放\", \"start\": 70.24, \"end\": 70.881, \"score\": 0.912}, {\"word\": \"颱\"}, {\"word\": \"風\"}, {\"word\": \"架\", \"start\": 70.881, \"end\": 71.101, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 71.101, \"end\": 71.501, \"score\": 0.852}, {\"word\": \"應\"}, {\"word\": \"該\"}, {\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 71.501, \"end\": 71.601, \"score\": 0.968}, {\"word\": \"因\", \"start\": 71.601, \"end\": 72.162, \"score\": 0.93}, {\"word\": \"為\"}, {\"word\": \"小\", \"start\": 72.162, \"end\": 72.622, \"score\": 0.901}, {\"word\": \"確\"}, {\"word\": \"幸\", \"start\": 72.622, \"end\": 72.802, \"score\": 0.812}, {\"word\": \"啦\", \"start\": 72.802, \"end\": 73.203, \"score\": 0.928}, {\"word\": \"其\", \"start\": 73.203, \"end\": 73.383, \"score\": 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{\"word\": \"方\", \"start\": 393.977, \"end\": 394.137, \"score\": 0.995}, {\"word\": \"向\", \"start\": 394.137, \"end\": 394.337, \"score\": 0.992}, {\"word\": \"可\", \"start\": 394.337, \"end\": 394.417, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"以\", \"start\": 394.417, \"end\": 394.437, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"嗎\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"謝\"}, {\"word\": \"牛\", \"start\": 396.22, \"end\": 396.32, \"score\": 0.768}, {\"word\": \"煦\"}, {\"word\": \"庭\", \"start\": 396.32, \"end\": 396.48, \"score\": 0.828}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 396.48, \"end\": 396.5, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:00,109 --> 00:00:11,845\n委員發言好謝謝主席這個何部長有請請何部長\n\n2\n00:00:17,979 --> 00:00:37,886\n部長早安辛苦了今天第一天來備詢這個我們也做了一些功課您過去年輕的時候其實有在勞工運動裡面應該算是有一定的歷練那這個本席這個第一次的質詢跟您討論一下勞工的一些政策希望您不忘初衷可以幫我們的勞工朋友一起來講話我們就直接單刀直入主題\n\n3\n00:00:38,846 --> 00:00:53,587\n第一個是這個今天這個剛剛的新聞今年的第一號颱風即將生成那麼每一次颱風假要不要放假其實都是一個滿大大家都很多尤其是我們基層的勞工其實都非常期待可以多放一天颱風假\n\n4\n00:00:54,568 --> 00:01:16,045\n大家都說台灣的這個過勞狀況其實很嚴重那目前大部分的人都把颱風架有些當成小確幸有些當成喘口氣的這樣的一個機會但北京關心颱風架背後的一個政策的一個細節要跟部長來做一下討論這個照理來講我們會放颱風架不應該是因為小確幸啦其實是應該是注重勞工的安全嘛\n\n5\n00:01:16,826 --> 00:01:32,625\n對嗎?也就是說我不要因為颱風的天災在通勤或者是工作的時候有職業安全的一些危險所以我們要有一個放假的機制部長同意我這樣的說法嗎?應該沒有錯嘛對不對那他既然是勞工為了生命安全的安全措施齁那\n\n6\n00:01:33,866 --> 00:01:50,143\n難道現行的這樣子的一個按照這個表格你可以看到勞動部現在的規定這個除了成立的方式由政府來宣布之外其實真正的關鍵是發不發工資按照現行的條件來計算勞動部鼓勵這個企業即便放了颱風架還是要給這個勞工應有的工資但是\n\n7\n00:01:53,426 --> 00:02:16,398\n只能做到建議跟建議加發所謂的建議就是說如果颱風假這個勞工沒有出勤那就是希望你這個做做工的發個薪水如果颱風假勞工依然出勤就做做工的多發一點但是只是建議性質那我想問一下以目前勞動部的瞭解全台灣這麼多的企業從大財團到中小企業到微型企業\n\n8\n00:02:17,558 --> 00:02:42,428\n真的有按照勞動部的建議去發工資或者是加發工資的企業有哪些?大型企業有喔。各位舉幾個例子。在我們那個跟工商團體他們在討論的時候,那他們有提到說比較大型的企業他們會不扣薪,他們會去替員工來體諒這個事情。\n\n9\n00:02:45,203 --> 00:02:58,481\n事業單位名稱就比較不方便去講沒關係今天我們只是做政策討論好不好因為這個我們認真的在思考要不要讓他乾脆入法就既然要保障勞工應該讓他到位這個請勞動部先做一下思考好不好\n\n10\n00:03:15,495 --> 00:03:35,667\n來做溝通那今天的第一步我希望你先做統整剛剛有講有些大型現在只有最大型的相對優渥的企業有條件可以發這個東西可是台灣其實我想部長應該非常了解啦中小企業為主微型企業其實是最多的那這件事有沒有機會做突破那怎麼來做突破給一點小建議比如說建議加大工資我剛剛為什麼要問舉例\n\n11\n00:03:37,128 --> 00:04:00,058\n至少我要從鼓勵願意配合勞動部政策方向的企業我總該標舉一下、獎勵一下吧。對不對?迎賀揚善從揚善開始然後逐步往前推本期是接受用一步一步的方式讓勞權進步的但是至少要看到進步的方向跟進步的成果所以第一個我們希望未來這個颱風降因為我們也講了這個是為了安全的考量\n\n12\n00:04:00,618 --> 00:04:12,342\n這不純然只是單純說他今天沒有上班沒有對價這個問題希望勞動部針對這件事情有一個檢討跟推動的方向好不好這是第一個第二個這個剛剛有蠻多人今天在質詢的時候跟您討論這個有關薪資的問題那麼其實主計總署的統計其實我們的實質薪資啊實質薪資開始出現負成長的一個狀況當然你可以講說因為是通貨膨脹或怎麼樣\n\n13\n00:04:24,005 --> 00:04:38,504\n但是其實大家要生活要面對的其實當然就是用實質薪資來做計算才是貼近真實狀況的一個狀況的一個比較貼近一個真實的一個狀況那麼5月17雖然大家都關注立法院的這個衝突但是其實勞工團體在5月17有召開記者會的\n\n14\n00:04:40,667 --> 00:05:05,597\n他們有提出了一部分的訴求我們今天在這個質詢的過程中跟部長來做個政策對話其實蠻重要的就是大家希望說這個加班費的費率可以做有效的調漲現在講平日的加班費就是延長工作時間1.33再延長之後就1.66如果在一例休息日加班就是2.33跟2.66有沒有機會再往上調?這個部長有沒有接到這樣的訴求?保安部有沒有這樣的規劃?\n\n15\n00:05:07,669 --> 00:05:26,117\n委員這個好牽涉到勞基法的修法就勞基法的修法就修一法動全身這是大工程我同意嘛先做我們先做政策對話好不好但是我希望可以我想很多的勞工團體也希望看到部長的態度啦\n\n16\n00:05:26,898 --> 00:05:48,360\n勞動部有沒有打算往這方向來推動再給勞工朋友多一點的溫暖好不好這部長第一個是加班費費率的提升問題我們希望知道勞動部的態度第二個是加班補休的比例問題啊您可以看到這個表格寫得非常清楚平時加班費1比1.33休息日加班是1比2.33但是加班換補休啊當然就是1比1嘛\n\n17\n00:05:48,920 --> 00:06:08,689\n那1比1的時候其實很多實務上這個在做勞資雙方在談判的時候勞方處於弱勢所以就各種實務的操作軟硬兼施就要求變成說加班換補休啊那我本來拿加班費我可以拿1.33拿1.66可是我補休的時候被迫1比1啊那其實是不對的嘛\n\n18\n00:06:09,028 --> 00:06:34,437\n既然他是要超時出勤應該連補休也應該比照1.33或1.66對不對比如說這個連續加班3天換4天補休這樣子比較合理嘛要跟加班費的比例要一次嘛這個同樣牽涉到勞基法的修正對不對部長所以這件事情加班費率的提升跟補休比例的這個正義希望勞動部做個政策研討提出具體的方向可以嗎\n\n19\n00:06:36,220 --> 00:06:36,500\n謝謝牛煦庭委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n109\t11845\t委員發言好謝謝主席這個何部長有請請何部長\n17979\t37886\t部長早安辛苦了今天第一天來備詢這個我們也做了一些功課您過去年輕的時候其實有在勞工運動裡面應該算是有一定的歷練那這個本席這個第一次的質詢跟您討論一下勞工的一些政策希望您不忘初衷可以幫我們的勞工朋友一起來講話我們就直接單刀直入主題\n38846\t53587\t第一個是這個今天這個剛剛的新聞今年的第一號颱風即將生成那麼每一次颱風假要不要放假其實都是一個滿大大家都很多尤其是我們基層的勞工其實都非常期待可以多放一天颱風假\n54568\t76045\t大家都說台灣的這個過勞狀況其實很嚴重那目前大部分的人都把颱風架有些當成小確幸有些當成喘口氣的這樣的一個機會但北京關心颱風架背後的一個政策的一個細節要跟部長來做一下討論這個照理來講我們會放颱風架不應該是因為小確幸啦其實是應該是注重勞工的安全嘛\n76826\t92625\t對嗎?也就是說我不要因為颱風的天災在通勤或者是工作的時候有職業安全的一些危險所以我們要有一個放假的機制部長同意我這樣的說法嗎?應該沒有錯嘛對不對那他既然是勞工為了生命安全的安全措施齁那\n93866\t110143\t難道現行的這樣子的一個按照這個表格你可以看到勞動部現在的規定這個除了成立的方式由政府來宣布之外其實真正的關鍵是發不發工資按照現行的條件來計算勞動部鼓勵這個企業即便放了颱風架還是要給這個勞工應有的工資但是\n113426\t136398\t只能做到建議跟建議加發所謂的建議就是說如果颱風假這個勞工沒有出勤那就是希望你這個做做工的發個薪水如果颱風假勞工依然出勤就做做工的多發一點但是只是建議性質那我想問一下以目前勞動部的瞭解全台灣這麼多的企業從大財團到中小企業到微型企業\n137558\t162428\t真的有按照勞動部的建議去發工資或者是加發工資的企業有哪些?大型企業有喔。各位舉幾個例子。在我們那個跟工商團體他們在討論的時候,那他們有提到說比較大型的企業他們會不扣薪,他們會去替員工來體諒這個事情。\n165203\t178481\t事業單位名稱就比較不方便去講沒關係今天我們只是做政策討論好不好因為這個我們認真的在思考要不要讓他乾脆入法就既然要保障勞工應該讓他到位這個請勞動部先做一下思考好不好\n179462\t194855\t﹚\n195495\t215667\t來做溝通那今天的第一步我希望你先做統整剛剛有講有些大型現在只有最大型的相對優渥的企業有條件可以發這個東西可是台灣其實我想部長應該非常了解啦中小企業為主微型企業其實是最多的那這件事有沒有機會做突破那怎麼來做突破給一點小建議比如說建議加大工資我剛剛為什麼要問舉例\n217128\t240058\t至少我要從鼓勵願意配合勞動部政策方向的企業我總該標舉一下、獎勵一下吧。對不對?迎賀揚善從揚善開始然後逐步往前推本期是接受用一步一步的方式讓勞權進步的但是至少要看到進步的方向跟進步的成果所以第一個我們希望未來這個颱風降因為我們也講了這個是為了安全的考量\n240618\t252342\t這不純然只是單純說他今天沒有上班沒有對價這個問題希望勞動部針對這件事情有一個檢討跟推動的方向好不好這是第一個第二個這個剛剛有蠻多人今天在質詢的時候跟您討論這個有關薪資的問題那麼其實主計總署的統計其實我們的實質薪資啊實質薪資開始出現負成長的一個狀況當然你可以講說因為是通貨膨脹或怎麼樣\n264005\t278504\t但是其實大家要生活要面對的其實當然就是用實質薪資來做計算才是貼近真實狀況的一個狀況的一個比較貼近一個真實的一個狀況那麼5月17雖然大家都關注立法院的這個衝突但是其實勞工團體在5月17有召開記者會的\n280667\t305597\t他們有提出了一部分的訴求我們今天在這個質詢的過程中跟部長來做個政策對話其實蠻重要的就是大家希望說這個加班費的費率可以做有效的調漲現在講平日的加班費就是延長工作時間1.33再延長之後就1.66如果在一例休息日加班就是2.33跟2.66有沒有機會再往上調?這個部長有沒有接到這樣的訴求?保安部有沒有這樣的規劃?\n307669\t326117\t委員這個好牽涉到勞基法的修法就勞基法的修法就修一法動全身這是大工程我同意嘛先做我們先做政策對話好不好但是我希望可以我想很多的勞工團體也希望看到部長的態度啦\n326898\t348360\t勞動部有沒有打算往這方向來推動再給勞工朋友多一點的溫暖好不好這部長第一個是加班費費率的提升問題我們希望知道勞動部的態度第二個是加班補休的比例問題啊您可以看到這個表格寫得非常清楚平時加班費1比1.33休息日加班是1比2.33但是加班換補休啊當然就是1比1嘛\n348920\t368689\t那1比1的時候其實很多實務上這個在做勞資雙方在談判的時候勞方處於弱勢所以就各種實務的操作軟硬兼施就要求變成說加班換補休啊那我本來拿加班費我可以拿1.33拿1.66可是我補休的時候被迫1比1啊那其實是不對的嘛\n369028\t394437\t既然他是要超時出勤應該連補休也應該比照1.33或1.66對不對比如說這個連續加班3天換4天補休這樣子比較合理嘛要跟加班費的比例要一次嘛這個同樣牽涉到勞基法的修正對不對部長所以這件事情加班費率的提升跟補休比例的這個正義希望勞動部做個政策研討提出具體的方向可以嗎\n396220\t396500\t謝謝牛煦庭委員\n","txt":"委員發言好謝謝主席這個何部長有請請何部長\n部長早安辛苦了今天第一天來備詢這個我們也做了一些功課您過去年輕的時候其實有在勞工運動裡面應該算是有一定的歷練那這個本席這個第一次的質詢跟您討論一下勞工的一些政策希望您不忘初衷可以幫我們的勞工朋友一起來講話我們就直接單刀直入主題\n第一個是這個今天這個剛剛的新聞今年的第一號颱風即將生成那麼每一次颱風假要不要放假其實都是一個滿大大家都很多尤其是我們基層的勞工其實都非常期待可以多放一天颱風假\n大家都說台灣的這個過勞狀況其實很嚴重那目前大部分的人都把颱風架有些當成小確幸有些當成喘口氣的這樣的一個機會但北京關心颱風架背後的一個政策的一個細節要跟部長來做一下討論這個照理來講我們會放颱風架不應該是因為小確幸啦其實是應該是注重勞工的安全嘛\n對嗎?也就是說我不要因為颱風的天災在通勤或者是工作的時候有職業安全的一些危險所以我們要有一個放假的機制部長同意我這樣的說法嗎?應該沒有錯嘛對不對那他既然是勞工為了生命安全的安全措施齁那\n難道現行的這樣子的一個按照這個表格你可以看到勞動部現在的規定這個除了成立的方式由政府來宣布之外其實真正的關鍵是發不發工資按照現行的條件來計算勞動部鼓勵這個企業即便放了颱風架還是要給這個勞工應有的工資但是\n只能做到建議跟建議加發所謂的建議就是說如果颱風假這個勞工沒有出勤那就是希望你這個做做工的發個薪水如果颱風假勞工依然出勤就做做工的多發一點但是只是建議性質那我想問一下以目前勞動部的瞭解全台灣這麼多的企業從大財團到中小企業到微型企業\n真的有按照勞動部的建議去發工資或者是加發工資的企業有哪些?大型企業有喔。各位舉幾個例子。在我們那個跟工商團體他們在討論的時候,那他們有提到說比較大型的企業他們會不扣薪,他們會去替員工來體諒這個事情。\n事業單位名稱就比較不方便去講沒關係今天我們只是做政策討論好不好因為這個我們認真的在思考要不要讓他乾脆入法就既然要保障勞工應該讓他到位這個請勞動部先做一下思考好不好\n﹚\n來做溝通那今天的第一步我希望你先做統整剛剛有講有些大型現在只有最大型的相對優渥的企業有條件可以發這個東西可是台灣其實我想部長應該非常了解啦中小企業為主微型企業其實是最多的那這件事有沒有機會做突破那怎麼來做突破給一點小建議比如說建議加大工資我剛剛為什麼要問舉例\n至少我要從鼓勵願意配合勞動部政策方向的企業我總該標舉一下、獎勵一下吧。對不對?迎賀揚善從揚善開始然後逐步往前推本期是接受用一步一步的方式讓勞權進步的但是至少要看到進步的方向跟進步的成果所以第一個我們希望未來這個颱風降因為我們也講了這個是為了安全的考量\n這不純然只是單純說他今天沒有上班沒有對價這個問題希望勞動部針對這件事情有一個檢討跟推動的方向好不好這是第一個第二個這個剛剛有蠻多人今天在質詢的時候跟您討論這個有關薪資的問題那麼其實主計總署的統計其實我們的實質薪資啊實質薪資開始出現負成長的一個狀況當然你可以講說因為是通貨膨脹或怎麼樣\n但是其實大家要生活要面對的其實當然就是用實質薪資來做計算才是貼近真實狀況的一個狀況的一個比較貼近一個真實的一個狀況那麼5月17雖然大家都關注立法院的這個衝突但是其實勞工團體在5月17有召開記者會的\n他們有提出了一部分的訴求我們今天在這個質詢的過程中跟部長來做個政策對話其實蠻重要的就是大家希望說這個加班費的費率可以做有效的調漲現在講平日的加班費就是延長工作時間1.33再延長之後就1.66如果在一例休息日加班就是2.33跟2.66有沒有機會再往上調?這個部長有沒有接到這樣的訴求?保安部有沒有這樣的規劃?\n委員這個好牽涉到勞基法的修法就勞基法的修法就修一法動全身這是大工程我同意嘛先做我們先做政策對話好不好但是我希望可以我想很多的勞工團體也希望看到部長的態度啦\n勞動部有沒有打算往這方向來推動再給勞工朋友多一點的溫暖好不好這部長第一個是加班費費率的提升問題我們希望知道勞動部的態度第二個是加班補休的比例問題啊您可以看到這個表格寫得非常清楚平時加班費1比1.33休息日加班是1比2.33但是加班換補休啊當然就是1比1嘛\n那1比1的時候其實很多實務上這個在做勞資雙方在談判的時候勞方處於弱勢所以就各種實務的操作軟硬兼施就要求變成說加班換補休啊那我本來拿加班費我可以拿1.33拿1.66可是我補休的時候被迫1比1啊那其實是不對的嘛\n既然他是要超時出勤應該連補休也應該比照1.33或1.66對不對比如說這個連續加班3天換4天補休這樣子比較合理嘛要跟加班費的比例要一次嘛這個同樣牽涉到勞基法的修正對不對部長所以這件事情加班費率的提升跟補休比例的這個正義希望勞動部做個政策研討提出具體的方向可以嗎\n謝謝牛煦庭委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.109 --> 00:11.845\n委員發言好謝謝主席這個何部長有請請何部長\n\n00:17.979 --> 00:37.886\n部長早安辛苦了今天第一天來備詢這個我們也做了一些功課您過去年輕的時候其實有在勞工運動裡面應該算是有一定的歷練那這個本席這個第一次的質詢跟您討論一下勞工的一些政策希望您不忘初衷可以幫我們的勞工朋友一起來講話我們就直接單刀直入主題\n\n00:38.846 --> 00:53.587\n第一個是這個今天這個剛剛的新聞今年的第一號颱風即將生成那麼每一次颱風假要不要放假其實都是一個滿大大家都很多尤其是我們基層的勞工其實都非常期待可以多放一天颱風假\n\n00:54.568 --> 01:16.045\n大家都說台灣的這個過勞狀況其實很嚴重那目前大部分的人都把颱風架有些當成小確幸有些當成喘口氣的這樣的一個機會但北京關心颱風架背後的一個政策的一個細節要跟部長來做一下討論這個照理來講我們會放颱風架不應該是因為小確幸啦其實是應該是注重勞工的安全嘛\n\n01:16.826 --> 01:32.625\n對嗎?也就是說我不要因為颱風的天災在通勤或者是工作的時候有職業安全的一些危險所以我們要有一個放假的機制部長同意我這樣的說法嗎?應該沒有錯嘛對不對那他既然是勞工為了生命安全的安全措施齁那\n\n01:33.866 --> 01:50.143\n難道現行的這樣子的一個按照這個表格你可以看到勞動部現在的規定這個除了成立的方式由政府來宣布之外其實真正的關鍵是發不發工資按照現行的條件來計算勞動部鼓勵這個企業即便放了颱風架還是要給這個勞工應有的工資但是\n\n01:53.426 --> 02:16.398\n只能做到建議跟建議加發所謂的建議就是說如果颱風假這個勞工沒有出勤那就是希望你這個做做工的發個薪水如果颱風假勞工依然出勤就做做工的多發一點但是只是建議性質那我想問一下以目前勞動部的瞭解全台灣這麼多的企業從大財團到中小企業到微型企業\n\n02:17.558 --> 02:42.428\n真的有按照勞動部的建議去發工資或者是加發工資的企業有哪些?大型企業有喔。各位舉幾個例子。在我們那個跟工商團體他們在討論的時候,那他們有提到說比較大型的企業他們會不扣薪,他們會去替員工來體諒這個事情。\n\n02:45.203 --> 02:58.481\n事業單位名稱就比較不方便去講沒關係今天我們只是做政策討論好不好因為這個我們認真的在思考要不要讓他乾脆入法就既然要保障勞工應該讓他到位這個請勞動部先做一下思考好不好\n\n03:15.495 --> 03:35.667\n來做溝通那今天的第一步我希望你先做統整剛剛有講有些大型現在只有最大型的相對優渥的企業有條件可以發這個東西可是台灣其實我想部長應該非常了解啦中小企業為主微型企業其實是最多的那這件事有沒有機會做突破那怎麼來做突破給一點小建議比如說建議加大工資我剛剛為什麼要問舉例\n\n03:37.128 --> 04:00.058\n至少我要從鼓勵願意配合勞動部政策方向的企業我總該標舉一下、獎勵一下吧。對不對?迎賀揚善從揚善開始然後逐步往前推本期是接受用一步一步的方式讓勞權進步的但是至少要看到進步的方向跟進步的成果所以第一個我們希望未來這個颱風降因為我們也講了這個是為了安全的考量\n\n04:00.618 --> 04:12.342\n這不純然只是單純說他今天沒有上班沒有對價這個問題希望勞動部針對這件事情有一個檢討跟推動的方向好不好這是第一個第二個這個剛剛有蠻多人今天在質詢的時候跟您討論這個有關薪資的問題那麼其實主計總署的統計其實我們的實質薪資啊實質薪資開始出現負成長的一個狀況當然你可以講說因為是通貨膨脹或怎麼樣\n\n04:24.005 --> 04:38.504\n但是其實大家要生活要面對的其實當然就是用實質薪資來做計算才是貼近真實狀況的一個狀況的一個比較貼近一個真實的一個狀況那麼5月17雖然大家都關注立法院的這個衝突但是其實勞工團體在5月17有召開記者會的\n\n04:40.667 --> 05:05.597\n他們有提出了一部分的訴求我們今天在這個質詢的過程中跟部長來做個政策對話其實蠻重要的就是大家希望說這個加班費的費率可以做有效的調漲現在講平日的加班費就是延長工作時間1.33再延長之後就1.66如果在一例休息日加班就是2.33跟2.66有沒有機會再往上調?這個部長有沒有接到這樣的訴求?保安部有沒有這樣的規劃?\n\n05:07.669 --> 05:26.117\n委員這個好牽涉到勞基法的修法就勞基法的修法就修一法動全身這是大工程我同意嘛先做我們先做政策對話好不好但是我希望可以我想很多的勞工團體也希望看到部長的態度啦\n\n05:26.898 --> 05:48.360\n勞動部有沒有打算往這方向來推動再給勞工朋友多一點的溫暖好不好這部長第一個是加班費費率的提升問題我們希望知道勞動部的態度第二個是加班補休的比例問題啊您可以看到這個表格寫得非常清楚平時加班費1比1.33休息日加班是1比2.33但是加班換補休啊當然就是1比1嘛\n\n05:48.920 --> 06:08.689\n那1比1的時候其實很多實務上這個在做勞資雙方在談判的時候勞方處於弱勢所以就各種實務的操作軟硬兼施就要求變成說加班換補休啊那我本來拿加班費我可以拿1.33拿1.66可是我補休的時候被迫1比1啊那其實是不對的嘛\n\n06:09.028 --> 06:34.437\n既然他是要超時出勤應該連補休也應該比照1.33或1.66對不對比如說這個連續加班3天換4天補休這樣子比較合理嘛要跟加班費的比例要一次嘛這個同樣牽涉到勞基法的修正對不對部長所以這件事情加班費率的提升跟補休比例的這個正義希望勞動部做個政策研討提出具體的方向可以嗎\n\n06:36.220 --> 06:36.500\n謝謝牛煦庭委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.109,"end":11.845,"text":"委員發言好謝謝主席這個何部長有請請何部長"},{"start":17.979,"end":37.886,"text":"部長早安辛苦了今天第一天來備詢這個我們也做了一些功課您過去年輕的時候其實有在勞工運動裡面應該算是有一定的歷練那這個本席這個第一次的質詢跟您討論一下勞工的一些政策希望您不忘初衷可以幫我們的勞工朋友一起來講話我們就直接單刀直入主題"},{"start":38.846,"end":53.587,"text":"第一個是這個今天這個剛剛的新聞今年的第一號颱風即將生成那麼每一次颱風假要不要放假其實都是一個滿大大家都很多尤其是我們基層的勞工其實都非常期待可以多放一天颱風假"},{"start":54.568,"end":76.045,"text":"大家都說台灣的這個過勞狀況其實很嚴重那目前大部分的人都把颱風架有些當成小確幸有些當成喘口氣的這樣的一個機會但北京關心颱風架背後的一個政策的一個細節要跟部長來做一下討論這個照理來講我們會放颱風架不應該是因為小確幸啦其實是應該是注重勞工的安全嘛"},{"start":76.826,"end":92.625,"text":"對嗎?也就是說我不要因為颱風的天災在通勤或者是工作的時候有職業安全的一些危險所以我們要有一個放假的機制部長同意我這樣的說法嗎?應該沒有錯嘛對不對那他既然是勞工為了生命安全的安全措施齁那"},{"start":93.866,"end":110.143,"text":"難道現行的這樣子的一個按照這個表格你可以看到勞動部現在的規定這個除了成立的方式由政府來宣布之外其實真正的關鍵是發不發工資按照現行的條件來計算勞動部鼓勵這個企業即便放了颱風架還是要給這個勞工應有的工資但是"},{"start":113.426,"end":136.398,"text":"只能做到建議跟建議加發所謂的建議就是說如果颱風假這個勞工沒有出勤那就是希望你這個做做工的發個薪水如果颱風假勞工依然出勤就做做工的多發一點但是只是建議性質那我想問一下以目前勞動部的瞭解全台灣這麼多的企業從大財團到中小企業到微型企業"},{"start":137.558,"end":162.428,"text":"真的有按照勞動部的建議去發工資或者是加發工資的企業有哪些?大型企業有喔。各位舉幾個例子。在我們那個跟工商團體他們在討論的時候,那他們有提到說比較大型的企業他們會不扣薪,他們會去替員工來體諒這個事情。"},{"start":165.203,"end":178.481,"text":"事業單位名稱就比較不方便去講沒關係今天我們只是做政策討論好不好因為這個我們認真的在思考要不要讓他乾脆入法就既然要保障勞工應該讓他到位這個請勞動部先做一下思考好不好"},{"start":179.462,"end":194.855,"text":"﹚"},{"start":195.495,"end":215.667,"text":"來做溝通那今天的第一步我希望你先做統整剛剛有講有些大型現在只有最大型的相對優渥的企業有條件可以發這個東西可是台灣其實我想部長應該非常了解啦中小企業為主微型企業其實是最多的那這件事有沒有機會做突破那怎麼來做突破給一點小建議比如說建議加大工資我剛剛為什麼要問舉例"},{"start":217.128,"end":240.058,"text":"至少我要從鼓勵願意配合勞動部政策方向的企業我總該標舉一下、獎勵一下吧。對不對?迎賀揚善從揚善開始然後逐步往前推本期是接受用一步一步的方式讓勞權進步的但是至少要看到進步的方向跟進步的成果所以第一個我們希望未來這個颱風降因為我們也講了這個是為了安全的考量"},{"start":240.618,"end":252.342,"text":"這不純然只是單純說他今天沒有上班沒有對價這個問題希望勞動部針對這件事情有一個檢討跟推動的方向好不好這是第一個第二個這個剛剛有蠻多人今天在質詢的時候跟您討論這個有關薪資的問題那麼其實主計總署的統計其實我們的實質薪資啊實質薪資開始出現負成長的一個狀況當然你可以講說因為是通貨膨脹或怎麼樣"},{"start":264.005,"end":278.504,"text":"但是其實大家要生活要面對的其實當然就是用實質薪資來做計算才是貼近真實狀況的一個狀況的一個比較貼近一個真實的一個狀況那麼5月17雖然大家都關注立法院的這個衝突但是其實勞工團體在5月17有召開記者會的"},{"start":280.667,"end":305.597,"text":"他們有提出了一部分的訴求我們今天在這個質詢的過程中跟部長來做個政策對話其實蠻重要的就是大家希望說這個加班費的費率可以做有效的調漲現在講平日的加班費就是延長工作時間1.33再延長之後就1.66如果在一例休息日加班就是2.33跟2.66有沒有機會再往上調?這個部長有沒有接到這樣的訴求?保安部有沒有這樣的規劃?"},{"start":307.669,"end":326.117,"text":"委員這個好牽涉到勞基法的修法就勞基法的修法就修一法動全身這是大工程我同意嘛先做我們先做政策對話好不好但是我希望可以我想很多的勞工團體也希望看到部長的態度啦"},{"start":326.898,"end":348.36,"text":"勞動部有沒有打算往這方向來推動再給勞工朋友多一點的溫暖好不好這部長第一個是加班費費率的提升問題我們希望知道勞動部的態度第二個是加班補休的比例問題啊您可以看到這個表格寫得非常清楚平時加班費1比1.33休息日加班是1比2.33但是加班換補休啊當然就是1比1嘛"},{"start":348.92,"end":368.689,"text":"那1比1的時候其實很多實務上這個在做勞資雙方在談判的時候勞方處於弱勢所以就各種實務的操作軟硬兼施就要求變成說加班換補休啊那我本來拿加班費我可以拿1.33拿1.66可是我補休的時候被迫1比1啊那其實是不對的嘛"},{"start":369.028,"end":394.437,"text":"既然他是要超時出勤應該連補休也應該比照1.33或1.66對不對比如說這個連續加班3天換4天補休這樣子比較合理嘛要跟加班費的比例要一次嘛這個同樣牽涉到勞基法的修正對不對部長所以這件事情加班費率的提升跟補休比例的這個正義希望勞動部做個政策研討提出具體的方向可以嗎"},{"start":396.22,"end":396.5,"text":"謝謝牛煦庭委員"}]}}}}