{"id":152926,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/152926","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/d339c8d1909fa45300a47862eaf9ce6f9f2fcaa3dc194f73d34e896d657c5e831200d471be25e1f15ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"林國成","委員發言時間":"12:27:07 - 12:34:44","影片長度":"00:07:37","會議時間":"2024-05-23T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。\n【5月22日、23日二天一次會】）","date":"2024-05-23","duration":457,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第17次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":17,"committees":[26],"id":"委員會-11-1-26-17"},"end_time":"2024-05-23T12:34:44+08:00","start_time":"2024-05-23T12:27:07+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":1151,"blocks":[["林委員國成：（12時27分）主席，請部長。"],["主席：請何部長。"],["林委員國成：另外還有勞保局白局長。"],["主席：請白麗真局長。"],["林委員國成：部長，看到你從早上答詢到現在，其實立法院一直在藐視國會，看起來這個法一點用都沒有，為什麼？立法委員尊重部長，部長尊重立法委員，基本上都是在談理，所以藐視國會的問題根本就不存在，所以我們蠻期待部長跟立法委員彼此之間針對問題要相敬如賓，我想沒有任何可以吵的，因為部長在為老百姓做事，立法委員也是為老百姓在做事。我第一個還是要恭喜何部長，大家都知道你過去確確實實對於勞工事務多少有參與，當然看到你被發布，我們很高興，一個是恭喜，另外一個就是不忍心看到你跳入火坑來為勞工做事，我在想這兩者之間都是為勞工，所以首先恭喜，雖然也有一點不忍，但是最後還是要共同為勞工做事。"],["何部長佩珊：謝謝委員。"],["林委員國成：我今天要談的有兩個問題，第一個問題我要請教部長，新人有新政，過去不管是陳菊也好，不管是許銘春也好，確確實實對勞工都是基於尊重跟照顧，我也要聽聽何部長對於這個新職你最想推動跟最想做的事，能不能用我的發言時間，讓你跟全國的勞工說明未來最重要、要推動的是什麼事？"],["何部長佩珊：委員，其實我早上在業務報告也有呈現，對我來講，真的很榮幸有這個機會可以為全國廣大勞工朋友盡一分心力，這也是我當年從事勞工運動的初衷，到現在一如往昔不會變的。跟委員的討論其實一直有提到所謂勞保年改的問題，我也期待透過我的努力能讓全國的勞工朋友放心，勞保絕對不會倒，勞保絕對不會破產，目前的勞保是相關穩健的，我們跟委員都有討論過，也是全國的勞工朋友最大的期待。"],["林委員國成：好。其實勞工真的要的不多，以現在的制度來講，真的勞工還是體恤政府，但是我們勞工就是一點點保障就心滿意足，以現在的情況來講，勞工基本上是求個安穩，不希望重大的改變，這一點提供給何部長做政治判斷的參考。","我現在要來談，任何一個政策作成決定的時候，要很瞭解前因後果，這樣才不會誤判。當然，前一段時間一直在講勞工每天工作、按時繳錢，到最後一天到晚報章雜誌就說勞保什麼時候要倒，我記得好像十幾年前就要倒，到現在還是沒有倒，這個是什麼？危言聳聽，對勞工一點保障都沒有，我是這樣覺得。我要請教真正虧損的部分，在臺灣省政府、臺閩地區的勞保局交給中央政府的時候，也就是84年4月1日健保開始開辦，把醫療撥給健保局的時候，部長，我要提供一個資訊，根本84年以後勞保是不虧損的，希望你回去、白局長你們自己去把原因找出來，真正虧損的地方是臺灣省政府費率5.5，一張保單可以住院、可以保障，這裡是真正虧損最多，因為部長不曉得，我要問問白局長，到底臺灣省政府交給中央政府的時候，你們那個時候有沒有盤點、有沒有精算？"],["白局長麗真：委員好。跟委員做報告，在85年6月勞保局改制的時候，勞保基金餘額是一千七百多億，當時的確有精算，因為費率像委員……"],["林委員國成：我不是指你們精算，是臺灣省政府交給中央的時候有沒有精算，有沒有？"],["白局長麗真：跟委員做報告，當時勞保財務裡面針對勞保局本身的資產及基金都有做精算。"],["林委員國成：沒有，局長，你也是最後才接的。我坦白跟你講，根本沒有精算！虧損多少錢，你們完全不知道，所以那個時候的執政，現在國民黨也要負責任，你們現在當了政府以後，你們當然要概括承受，責任都不能推，但是我可以告訴你一個問題，根本沒有精算，虧多少錢都不知道！所以到84年健保撥出去以後，你們那個時候的虧損黑洞是非常大的，你們要把這個前因後果講清楚。所以就這個部分，我想各黨執政過的都一定要負責任，也不能說完全民進黨……現在民進黨是執政黨，你要概括承受，但是無論怎麼樣去交接、怎麼樣去做決策，勞工的權益是不能受到損害的，這一點我要給何部長一個鼓勵……"],["何部長佩珊：是，謝謝。"],["林委員國成：也要把真相告訴你，請你查得清清楚楚。我坦白講，我這個人講話憑良心，黑洞也不是民進黨造成的，是經年累月累積勞保照顧勞工而造成的，可是要把問題找出來，不能讓勞工覺得自己每天繳費，你們又要我們繳多領少，過去是繳少領多，所以造成這個問題，你們要分析出來，這樣才不會讓勞工產生錯覺，覺得自己有乖乖地繳錢，但是你們卻不乖乖地給付，這一點希望何部長一定要跟院長講這些事實的真相。"],["何部長佩珊：好。"],["林委員國成：我要代替勞工拜託何部長，這個部分的真相一定要釐清，好不好？"],["何部長佩珊：謝謝委員，這很寶貴。"],["林委員國成：好，謝謝。"],["主席：謝謝林國成委員發言。","接下來請鍾佳濱委員、鍾佳濱委員、鍾佳濱委員不在。","接下來請林岱樺委員、林岱樺委員、林岱樺委員不在。","接下來請鄭正鈐委員、鄭正鈐委員、鄭正鈐委員不在。","接下來請陳瑩委員發言。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":464,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-26-17","speakers":["黃秀芳","陳昭姿","林月琴","陳菁徽","盧縣一","蘇清泉","王育敏","涂權吉","林淑芬","王正旭","鄭天財Sra 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\"委\", \"start\": 432.632, \"end\": 432.652, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"zh\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:06,972 --> 00:00:21,198\n主席請部長請何部長還有另外老保及白局長來有沒有來有有有請白立正局長好部長是\n\n2\n00:00:22,728 --> 00:00:50,301\n真的看到你早上在打醒到現在其實立法院一直在藐視國會我看起來一點這個法一點用都沒有為什麼大家立法委員尊重部長部長尊重立法委員基本上都是在談理所以根本藐視國會的問題就沒有不存在的所以我們蠻期待啦我們蠻期待這個真的部長\n\n3\n00:00:51,121 --> 00:01:11,640\n跟立法委員彼此之間針對問題要相敬如賓我想沒有任何可以吵的因為部長也為老百姓做事立法委員也是為老百姓在做事所以我第一個還是要恭喜何部長因為我們大家知道你過去\n\n4\n00:01:12,581 --> 00:01:12,601\n獲獎獎項目\n\n5\n00:01:33,345 --> 00:02:00,675\n我在想都是為勞工都是為勞工所以首先恭喜也有一點不忍但是最後還是要共同為勞工做事謝謝委員我今天要談有兩個問題第一個問題我要請教部長新人有新政那當然過去不管是陳菊也好不管是喜民村也好確確實實對勞工基於第一個尊重跟照顧\n\n6\n00:02:01,775 --> 00:02:19,034\n好他照顧那我也要聽聽我們何部長對於這個新職你最想推動跟最想做的事能不能用我的時間讓你跟全國的勞工說明你未來最重要要推動的什麼事\n\n7\n00:02:20,781 --> 00:02:39,415\n當然我其實早上也在業務報告有呈現當然對我來講真的很有榮幸有這個機會然後來為全國廣大的勞工朋友來盡一份心力那這也是我當年從事勞工運動的初衷到現在一如往昔不會變的\n\n8\n00:02:40,496 --> 00:02:54,450\n那跟委員的討論其實一直有提到我們這個所謂的勞保年改的問題那麼我也期待說透過我的努力我能讓全國的勞工朋友放心勞保絕對不會倒勞保絕對不會破產\n\n9\n00:02:57,814 --> 00:03:19,313\n目前的勞保是相對穩健的那麼這個我是跟委員我想我們都有討論過然後也是我想是全國的勞工朋友最大的期待其實勞工真的要的不多以現在制度來講真的勞工還是體系政府但是我們勞工就是\n\n10\n00:03:20,174 --> 00:03:38,969\n一點點保障他就心滿意足以現在的情況來講勞工基本上是求個安穩不希望重大的改變這點我提供給我們何部長做一個政治判斷的一個參考\n\n11\n00:03:39,670 --> 00:04:08,598\n那我現在要來談任何一個政策他要做成決定的時候要把前因後果要很了解這樣才不會誤判才不會誤判所以當然前一段時間一直在講這個勞工非常每天工作按時繳錢到最後一天到晚報章雜誌就說勞保什麼時候要倒了我記得好像十幾年前就要倒到現在還是沒有倒\n\n12\n00:04:09,358 --> 00:04:26,490\n那這個是什麼?違言聳聽對勞工一點保障都沒有這一點我是覺得那我要請教我要請教到底真正虧損的部分是在台灣省政府臺民地區的勞保局\n\n13\n00:04:27,287 --> 00:04:48,323\n那交給中央政府的時候在84年4月1號健保開始開辦把醫療包給健保局的時候部長我要提供一個自信根本84年以後勞保是不虧損的希望你回去白執行你們去把這個原因找出來\n\n14\n00:04:48,863 --> 00:05:11,682\n真正虧損的地方是臺灣省政府匯率5.5一張保單可以住院可以保障這裡是真正虧損最多那這裡當然因為部長不曉得我要問問白局長到底臺灣省政府交給中央政府的時候你們那個時候有沒有盤點有沒有精算\n\n15\n00:05:14,384 --> 00:05:34,344\n委員好,跟委員這邊來做報告在85年的6月的時候那時候勞保局改制的時候當時的勞保基金餘額是1700多億那當時的確有精算那因為費率像我...精算我不是說你們精算是臺灣省政府交給中央的時候有沒有精算有沒有\n\n16\n00:05:35,164 --> 00:05:56,099\n跟委員做報告當時因為勞保財務裡面有針對勞保局的整個資產跟基金都有做精算沒有啦你們局長你也最後再接的啦我坦白跟你講根本沒有精算虧損多少錢你們完全不知道所以那個時候的執政當然現在國民黨也要負責任啦\n\n17\n00:05:57,080 --> 00:06:18,360\n你們現在當了政府以後你們當然要概括承受所以這一點當然責任都不能推但是我可以告訴你一個問題根本沒有精算虧多少錢都不知道所以到84年健保播出去以後你們那個時候的虧損的黑洞是非常大的\n\n18\n00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:47,655\n所以你們要把這個前因後果把它講清楚所以這個部分我想各黨執政過的都一定要負責任也不能說完全民進黨你現在你是執政黨你要來概括承受但是怎麼樣去交接怎麼樣去做決策勞工的權利是不能去損害的所以這點我要給何部長一個鼓勵也要把真相告訴你把這個查得清清楚楚黑洞\n\n19\n00:06:48,255 --> 00:07:11,952\n我坦白講我這個人講話憑良心也不是民進黨造成啦是日月累積勞保照顧勞工而造成可是要把問題找出來不能讓勞工覺得說我每天繳會啊你們又要叫我繳多要領少那過去是領少那個繳少領多所以造成這個問題把它分析出來\n\n20\n00:07:12,532 --> 00:07:12,652\n謝謝林國成委員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n6972\t21198\t主席請部長請何部長還有另外老保及白局長來有沒有來有有有請白立正局長好部長是\n22728\t50301\t真的看到你早上在打醒到現在其實立法院一直在藐視國會我看起來一點這個法一點用都沒有為什麼大家立法委員尊重部長部長尊重立法委員基本上都是在談理所以根本藐視國會的問題就沒有不存在的所以我們蠻期待啦我們蠻期待這個真的部長\n51121\t71640\t跟立法委員彼此之間針對問題要相敬如賓我想沒有任何可以吵的因為部長也為老百姓做事立法委員也是為老百姓在做事所以我第一個還是要恭喜何部長因為我們大家知道你過去\n72581\t72601\t獲獎獎項目\n93345\t120675\t我在想都是為勞工都是為勞工所以首先恭喜也有一點不忍但是最後還是要共同為勞工做事謝謝委員我今天要談有兩個問題第一個問題我要請教部長新人有新政那當然過去不管是陳菊也好不管是喜民村也好確確實實對勞工基於第一個尊重跟照顧\n121775\t139034\t好他照顧那我也要聽聽我們何部長對於這個新職你最想推動跟最想做的事能不能用我的時間讓你跟全國的勞工說明你未來最重要要推動的什麼事\n140781\t159415\t當然我其實早上也在業務報告有呈現當然對我來講真的很有榮幸有這個機會然後來為全國廣大的勞工朋友來盡一份心力那這也是我當年從事勞工運動的初衷到現在一如往昔不會變的\n160496\t174450\t那跟委員的討論其實一直有提到我們這個所謂的勞保年改的問題那麼我也期待說透過我的努力我能讓全國的勞工朋友放心勞保絕對不會倒勞保絕對不會破產\n177814\t199313\t目前的勞保是相對穩健的那麼這個我是跟委員我想我們都有討論過然後也是我想是全國的勞工朋友最大的期待其實勞工真的要的不多以現在制度來講真的勞工還是體系政府但是我們勞工就是\n200174\t218969\t一點點保障他就心滿意足以現在的情況來講勞工基本上是求個安穩不希望重大的改變這點我提供給我們何部長做一個政治判斷的一個參考\n219670\t248598\t那我現在要來談任何一個政策他要做成決定的時候要把前因後果要很了解這樣才不會誤判才不會誤判所以當然前一段時間一直在講這個勞工非常每天工作按時繳錢到最後一天到晚報章雜誌就說勞保什麼時候要倒了我記得好像十幾年前就要倒到現在還是沒有倒\n249358\t266490\t那這個是什麼?違言聳聽對勞工一點保障都沒有這一點我是覺得那我要請教我要請教到底真正虧損的部分是在台灣省政府臺民地區的勞保局\n267287\t288323\t那交給中央政府的時候在84年4月1號健保開始開辦把醫療包給健保局的時候部長我要提供一個自信根本84年以後勞保是不虧損的希望你回去白執行你們去把這個原因找出來\n288863\t311682\t真正虧損的地方是臺灣省政府匯率5.5一張保單可以住院可以保障這裡是真正虧損最多那這裡當然因為部長不曉得我要問問白局長到底臺灣省政府交給中央政府的時候你們那個時候有沒有盤點有沒有精算\n314384\t334344\t委員好,跟委員這邊來做報告在85年的6月的時候那時候勞保局改制的時候當時的勞保基金餘額是1700多億那當時的確有精算那因為費率像我...精算我不是說你們精算是臺灣省政府交給中央的時候有沒有精算有沒有\n335164\t356099\t跟委員做報告當時因為勞保財務裡面有針對勞保局的整個資產跟基金都有做精算沒有啦你們局長你也最後再接的啦我坦白跟你講根本沒有精算虧損多少錢你們完全不知道所以那個時候的執政當然現在國民黨也要負責任啦\n357080\t378360\t你們現在當了政府以後你們當然要概括承受所以這一點當然責任都不能推但是我可以告訴你一個問題根本沒有精算虧多少錢都不知道所以到84年健保播出去以後你們那個時候的虧損的黑洞是非常大的\n378800\t407655\t所以你們要把這個前因後果把它講清楚所以這個部分我想各黨執政過的都一定要負責任也不能說完全民進黨你現在你是執政黨你要來概括承受但是怎麼樣去交接怎麼樣去做決策勞工的權利是不能去損害的所以這點我要給何部長一個鼓勵也要把真相告訴你把這個查得清清楚楚黑洞\n408255\t431952\t我坦白講我這個人講話憑良心也不是民進黨造成啦是日月累積勞保照顧勞工而造成可是要把問題找出來不能讓勞工覺得說我每天繳會啊你們又要叫我繳多要領少那過去是領少那個繳少領多所以造成這個問題把它分析出來\n432532\t432652\t謝謝林國成委員\n","txt":"主席請部長請何部長還有另外老保及白局長來有沒有來有有有請白立正局長好部長是\n真的看到你早上在打醒到現在其實立法院一直在藐視國會我看起來一點這個法一點用都沒有為什麼大家立法委員尊重部長部長尊重立法委員基本上都是在談理所以根本藐視國會的問題就沒有不存在的所以我們蠻期待啦我們蠻期待這個真的部長\n跟立法委員彼此之間針對問題要相敬如賓我想沒有任何可以吵的因為部長也為老百姓做事立法委員也是為老百姓在做事所以我第一個還是要恭喜何部長因為我們大家知道你過去\n獲獎獎項目\n我在想都是為勞工都是為勞工所以首先恭喜也有一點不忍但是最後還是要共同為勞工做事謝謝委員我今天要談有兩個問題第一個問題我要請教部長新人有新政那當然過去不管是陳菊也好不管是喜民村也好確確實實對勞工基於第一個尊重跟照顧\n好他照顧那我也要聽聽我們何部長對於這個新職你最想推動跟最想做的事能不能用我的時間讓你跟全國的勞工說明你未來最重要要推動的什麼事\n當然我其實早上也在業務報告有呈現當然對我來講真的很有榮幸有這個機會然後來為全國廣大的勞工朋友來盡一份心力那這也是我當年從事勞工運動的初衷到現在一如往昔不會變的\n那跟委員的討論其實一直有提到我們這個所謂的勞保年改的問題那麼我也期待說透過我的努力我能讓全國的勞工朋友放心勞保絕對不會倒勞保絕對不會破產\n目前的勞保是相對穩健的那麼這個我是跟委員我想我們都有討論過然後也是我想是全國的勞工朋友最大的期待其實勞工真的要的不多以現在制度來講真的勞工還是體系政府但是我們勞工就是\n一點點保障他就心滿意足以現在的情況來講勞工基本上是求個安穩不希望重大的改變這點我提供給我們何部長做一個政治判斷的一個參考\n那我現在要來談任何一個政策他要做成決定的時候要把前因後果要很了解這樣才不會誤判才不會誤判所以當然前一段時間一直在講這個勞工非常每天工作按時繳錢到最後一天到晚報章雜誌就說勞保什麼時候要倒了我記得好像十幾年前就要倒到現在還是沒有倒\n那這個是什麼?違言聳聽對勞工一點保障都沒有這一點我是覺得那我要請教我要請教到底真正虧損的部分是在台灣省政府臺民地區的勞保局\n那交給中央政府的時候在84年4月1號健保開始開辦把醫療包給健保局的時候部長我要提供一個自信根本84年以後勞保是不虧損的希望你回去白執行你們去把這個原因找出來\n真正虧損的地方是臺灣省政府匯率5.5一張保單可以住院可以保障這裡是真正虧損最多那這裡當然因為部長不曉得我要問問白局長到底臺灣省政府交給中央政府的時候你們那個時候有沒有盤點有沒有精算\n委員好,跟委員這邊來做報告在85年的6月的時候那時候勞保局改制的時候當時的勞保基金餘額是1700多億那當時的確有精算那因為費率像我...精算我不是說你們精算是臺灣省政府交給中央的時候有沒有精算有沒有\n跟委員做報告當時因為勞保財務裡面有針對勞保局的整個資產跟基金都有做精算沒有啦你們局長你也最後再接的啦我坦白跟你講根本沒有精算虧損多少錢你們完全不知道所以那個時候的執政當然現在國民黨也要負責任啦\n你們現在當了政府以後你們當然要概括承受所以這一點當然責任都不能推但是我可以告訴你一個問題根本沒有精算虧多少錢都不知道所以到84年健保播出去以後你們那個時候的虧損的黑洞是非常大的\n所以你們要把這個前因後果把它講清楚所以這個部分我想各黨執政過的都一定要負責任也不能說完全民進黨你現在你是執政黨你要來概括承受但是怎麼樣去交接怎麼樣去做決策勞工的權利是不能去損害的所以這點我要給何部長一個鼓勵也要把真相告訴你把這個查得清清楚楚黑洞\n我坦白講我這個人講話憑良心也不是民進黨造成啦是日月累積勞保照顧勞工而造成可是要把問題找出來不能讓勞工覺得說我每天繳會啊你們又要叫我繳多要領少那過去是領少那個繳少領多所以造成這個問題把它分析出來\n謝謝林國成委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:06.972 --> 00:21.198\n主席請部長請何部長還有另外老保及白局長來有沒有來有有有請白立正局長好部長是\n\n00:22.728 --> 00:50.301\n真的看到你早上在打醒到現在其實立法院一直在藐視國會我看起來一點這個法一點用都沒有為什麼大家立法委員尊重部長部長尊重立法委員基本上都是在談理所以根本藐視國會的問題就沒有不存在的所以我們蠻期待啦我們蠻期待這個真的部長\n\n00:51.121 --> 01:11.640\n跟立法委員彼此之間針對問題要相敬如賓我想沒有任何可以吵的因為部長也為老百姓做事立法委員也是為老百姓在做事所以我第一個還是要恭喜何部長因為我們大家知道你過去\n\n01:12.581 --> 01:12.601\n獲獎獎項目\n\n01:33.345 --> 02:00.675\n我在想都是為勞工都是為勞工所以首先恭喜也有一點不忍但是最後還是要共同為勞工做事謝謝委員我今天要談有兩個問題第一個問題我要請教部長新人有新政那當然過去不管是陳菊也好不管是喜民村也好確確實實對勞工基於第一個尊重跟照顧\n\n02:01.775 --> 02:19.034\n好他照顧那我也要聽聽我們何部長對於這個新職你最想推動跟最想做的事能不能用我的時間讓你跟全國的勞工說明你未來最重要要推動的什麼事\n\n02:20.781 --> 02:39.415\n當然我其實早上也在業務報告有呈現當然對我來講真的很有榮幸有這個機會然後來為全國廣大的勞工朋友來盡一份心力那這也是我當年從事勞工運動的初衷到現在一如往昔不會變的\n\n02:40.496 --> 02:54.450\n那跟委員的討論其實一直有提到我們這個所謂的勞保年改的問題那麼我也期待說透過我的努力我能讓全國的勞工朋友放心勞保絕對不會倒勞保絕對不會破產\n\n02:57.814 --> 03:19.313\n目前的勞保是相對穩健的那麼這個我是跟委員我想我們都有討論過然後也是我想是全國的勞工朋友最大的期待其實勞工真的要的不多以現在制度來講真的勞工還是體系政府但是我們勞工就是\n\n03:20.174 --> 03:38.969\n一點點保障他就心滿意足以現在的情況來講勞工基本上是求個安穩不希望重大的改變這點我提供給我們何部長做一個政治判斷的一個參考\n\n03:39.670 --> 04:08.598\n那我現在要來談任何一個政策他要做成決定的時候要把前因後果要很了解這樣才不會誤判才不會誤判所以當然前一段時間一直在講這個勞工非常每天工作按時繳錢到最後一天到晚報章雜誌就說勞保什麼時候要倒了我記得好像十幾年前就要倒到現在還是沒有倒\n\n04:09.358 --> 04:26.490\n那這個是什麼?違言聳聽對勞工一點保障都沒有這一點我是覺得那我要請教我要請教到底真正虧損的部分是在台灣省政府臺民地區的勞保局\n\n04:27.287 --> 04:48.323\n那交給中央政府的時候在84年4月1號健保開始開辦把醫療包給健保局的時候部長我要提供一個自信根本84年以後勞保是不虧損的希望你回去白執行你們去把這個原因找出來\n\n04:48.863 --> 05:11.682\n真正虧損的地方是臺灣省政府匯率5.5一張保單可以住院可以保障這裡是真正虧損最多那這裡當然因為部長不曉得我要問問白局長到底臺灣省政府交給中央政府的時候你們那個時候有沒有盤點有沒有精算\n\n05:14.384 --> 05:34.344\n委員好,跟委員這邊來做報告在85年的6月的時候那時候勞保局改制的時候當時的勞保基金餘額是1700多億那當時的確有精算那因為費率像我...精算我不是說你們精算是臺灣省政府交給中央的時候有沒有精算有沒有\n\n05:35.164 --> 05:56.099\n跟委員做報告當時因為勞保財務裡面有針對勞保局的整個資產跟基金都有做精算沒有啦你們局長你也最後再接的啦我坦白跟你講根本沒有精算虧損多少錢你們完全不知道所以那個時候的執政當然現在國民黨也要負責任啦\n\n05:57.080 --> 06:18.360\n你們現在當了政府以後你們當然要概括承受所以這一點當然責任都不能推但是我可以告訴你一個問題根本沒有精算虧多少錢都不知道所以到84年健保播出去以後你們那個時候的虧損的黑洞是非常大的\n\n06:18.800 --> 06:47.655\n所以你們要把這個前因後果把它講清楚所以這個部分我想各黨執政過的都一定要負責任也不能說完全民進黨你現在你是執政黨你要來概括承受但是怎麼樣去交接怎麼樣去做決策勞工的權利是不能去損害的所以這點我要給何部長一個鼓勵也要把真相告訴你把這個查得清清楚楚黑洞\n\n06:48.255 --> 07:11.952\n我坦白講我這個人講話憑良心也不是民進黨造成啦是日月累積勞保照顧勞工而造成可是要把問題找出來不能讓勞工覺得說我每天繳會啊你們又要叫我繳多要領少那過去是領少那個繳少領多所以造成這個問題把它分析出來\n\n07:12.532 --> 07:12.652\n謝謝林國成委員\n\n","segments":[{"start":6.972,"end":21.198,"text":"主席請部長請何部長還有另外老保及白局長來有沒有來有有有請白立正局長好部長是"},{"start":22.728,"end":50.301,"text":"真的看到你早上在打醒到現在其實立法院一直在藐視國會我看起來一點這個法一點用都沒有為什麼大家立法委員尊重部長部長尊重立法委員基本上都是在談理所以根本藐視國會的問題就沒有不存在的所以我們蠻期待啦我們蠻期待這個真的部長"},{"start":51.121,"end":71.64,"text":"跟立法委員彼此之間針對問題要相敬如賓我想沒有任何可以吵的因為部長也為老百姓做事立法委員也是為老百姓在做事所以我第一個還是要恭喜何部長因為我們大家知道你過去"},{"start":72.581,"end":72.601,"text":"獲獎獎項目"},{"start":93.345,"end":120.675,"text":"我在想都是為勞工都是為勞工所以首先恭喜也有一點不忍但是最後還是要共同為勞工做事謝謝委員我今天要談有兩個問題第一個問題我要請教部長新人有新政那當然過去不管是陳菊也好不管是喜民村也好確確實實對勞工基於第一個尊重跟照顧"},{"start":121.775,"end":139.034,"text":"好他照顧那我也要聽聽我們何部長對於這個新職你最想推動跟最想做的事能不能用我的時間讓你跟全國的勞工說明你未來最重要要推動的什麼事"},{"start":140.781,"end":159.415,"text":"當然我其實早上也在業務報告有呈現當然對我來講真的很有榮幸有這個機會然後來為全國廣大的勞工朋友來盡一份心力那這也是我當年從事勞工運動的初衷到現在一如往昔不會變的"},{"start":160.496,"end":174.45,"text":"那跟委員的討論其實一直有提到我們這個所謂的勞保年改的問題那麼我也期待說透過我的努力我能讓全國的勞工朋友放心勞保絕對不會倒勞保絕對不會破產"},{"start":177.814,"end":199.313,"text":"目前的勞保是相對穩健的那麼這個我是跟委員我想我們都有討論過然後也是我想是全國的勞工朋友最大的期待其實勞工真的要的不多以現在制度來講真的勞工還是體系政府但是我們勞工就是"},{"start":200.174,"end":218.969,"text":"一點點保障他就心滿意足以現在的情況來講勞工基本上是求個安穩不希望重大的改變這點我提供給我們何部長做一個政治判斷的一個參考"},{"start":219.67,"end":248.598,"text":"那我現在要來談任何一個政策他要做成決定的時候要把前因後果要很了解這樣才不會誤判才不會誤判所以當然前一段時間一直在講這個勞工非常每天工作按時繳錢到最後一天到晚報章雜誌就說勞保什麼時候要倒了我記得好像十幾年前就要倒到現在還是沒有倒"},{"start":249.358,"end":266.49,"text":"那這個是什麼?違言聳聽對勞工一點保障都沒有這一點我是覺得那我要請教我要請教到底真正虧損的部分是在台灣省政府臺民地區的勞保局"},{"start":267.287,"end":288.323,"text":"那交給中央政府的時候在84年4月1號健保開始開辦把醫療包給健保局的時候部長我要提供一個自信根本84年以後勞保是不虧損的希望你回去白執行你們去把這個原因找出來"},{"start":288.863,"end":311.682,"text":"真正虧損的地方是臺灣省政府匯率5.5一張保單可以住院可以保障這裡是真正虧損最多那這裡當然因為部長不曉得我要問問白局長到底臺灣省政府交給中央政府的時候你們那個時候有沒有盤點有沒有精算"},{"start":314.384,"end":334.344,"text":"委員好,跟委員這邊來做報告在85年的6月的時候那時候勞保局改制的時候當時的勞保基金餘額是1700多億那當時的確有精算那因為費率像我...精算我不是說你們精算是臺灣省政府交給中央的時候有沒有精算有沒有"},{"start":335.164,"end":356.099,"text":"跟委員做報告當時因為勞保財務裡面有針對勞保局的整個資產跟基金都有做精算沒有啦你們局長你也最後再接的啦我坦白跟你講根本沒有精算虧損多少錢你們完全不知道所以那個時候的執政當然現在國民黨也要負責任啦"},{"start":357.08,"end":378.36,"text":"你們現在當了政府以後你們當然要概括承受所以這一點當然責任都不能推但是我可以告訴你一個問題根本沒有精算虧多少錢都不知道所以到84年健保播出去以後你們那個時候的虧損的黑洞是非常大的"},{"start":378.8,"end":407.655,"text":"所以你們要把這個前因後果把它講清楚所以這個部分我想各黨執政過的都一定要負責任也不能說完全民進黨你現在你是執政黨你要來概括承受但是怎麼樣去交接怎麼樣去做決策勞工的權利是不能去損害的所以這點我要給何部長一個鼓勵也要把真相告訴你把這個查得清清楚楚黑洞"},{"start":408.255,"end":431.952,"text":"我坦白講我這個人講話憑良心也不是民進黨造成啦是日月累積勞保照顧勞工而造成可是要把問題找出來不能讓勞工覺得說我每天繳會啊你們又要叫我繳多要領少那過去是領少那個繳少領多所以造成這個問題把它分析出來"},{"start":432.532,"end":432.652,"text":"謝謝林國成委員"}]}}}}