{"id":153223,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153223","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/2c978e04ca5e1331f06c3fa0580477d4de1b7f2d659cc489333bc5d453e1b195ff9dbc3ffde695e85ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"牛煦庭","委員發言時間":"09:36:24 - 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這 個 部 分 就 表 示 說 未 來 我 們 會 加 匯 到 1 0 0 萬 戶 的 年 輕 或 是 弱 勢 族 群 那 以 過 去 8 年 的 進 度 到 今 年 年 底 的 時 候 呢 中 央 跟 地 方 政 府 加 在 一 起 的 直 接 興 建 是 1 2 萬 戶 左 右\n\n4\n00:01:29,714 --> 00:01:29,734\n〔 記 者 訪 問 〕\n\n5\n00:01:53,968 --> 00:02:22,641\n這 是 本 席 今 天 要 跟 你 討 論 也 就 是 我 們 為 了 要 達 成 社 宅 進 度 順 利 達 標 這 樣 一 個 狀 況 其 實 中 央 跟 地 方 關 係 是 非 常 重 要 的 我 想 要 了 解 未 來 因 為 過 去 這 8 年 基 本 上 社 會 住 宅 等 於 是 有 的 是 地 方 興 建 有 的 是 中 央 興 建 然 後 它 其 實 出 現 了 步 調 不 見 得 一 致 的 一 個 情 況 那 我 想 請 問 經 過 這 8 年 的 經 驗 未 來 政 府 在 處 理 社 會 住 宅 建 設 的 問 題 上 是 由 中 央 全 面 來 主 導 還 是 由 內 政 部 釋 出 資 源 來 補 助 地 方 大 概 是 走 哪 一 種 模 式\n\n6\n00:02:22,941 --> 00:02:24,463\n所 以 基 本 上 都 不 會 否 定 對 不 對 ? 都 不 會 否 定\n\n7\n00:02:39,720 --> 00:03:01,445\n沒 有 沒 有 靈 活 調 整 不 清 楚 你 的 主 從 是 什 麼 意 思 就 是 說 你 要 以 中 央 為 主 嘛 因 為 你 規 劃 政 策 的 時 候 你 要 投 入 資 源 嘛 對 不 對 如 果 你 說 中 央 主 導 興 建 那 相 對 來 講 他 可 能 就 是 中 央 主 導 但 是 地 方 如 果 他 願 意 興 建 的 話 對 於 地 方 人 民 的 這 個 呃 帶 來 的 福 利 也 相 當 的 多 你 也 會 鼓 勵 嘛 這 本 議 只 要 做 兩 點 提 醒 啦 第 一 個 你 如 果 是 要 用 中 央 主 導 興 建 這 樣 子 的 一 個 模 式 的 話\n\n8\n00:03:02,105 --> 00:03:02,505\n市 長 市 長 市 長 市 長\n\n9\n00:03:23,314 --> 00:03:24,476\n主 席 主 席 主 席 主 席\n\n10\n00:03:44,918 --> 00:04:03,730\n那 我 就 希 望 內 政 部 該 下 的 資 源 就 要 下 以 過 去 幾 年 本 席 從 基 層 出 身 這 個 從 中 央 得 到 的 資 源 還 是 不 夠 的 地 方 建 設 設 宅 其 實 未 來 都 會 變 成 財 務 負 擔 所 以 說 中 央 要 隨 時 檢 討 然 後 釋 出 更 多 的 資 源 給 地 方 這 樣 子 我 們 才 中 央 地 方 合 作 才 能 夠 讓 社 會 住 宅 的 建 設 進 度 可 以 順 利 來 達 標\n\n11\n00:04:04,872 --> 00:04:05,633\n謝 謝 指 導 我 們 來 努 力\n\n12\n00:04:16,363 --> 00:04:38,998\n那 是 不 是 有 這 個 機 會 在 新 的 政 府 領 導 之 下 大 家 把 它 改 成 所 謂 的 輪 候 制 啊 也 就 是 說 大 家 有 一 個 積 分 的 算 法 因 為 我 有 些 大 家 需 求 的 程 度 其 實 是 可 以 做 一 個 基 本 量 化 的 嘛 那 就 按 照 這 個 量 化 成 本 來 做 一 個 排 隊 那 這 個 優 先 的 就 可 以 優 先 入 住 這 一 次 沒 有 輪 到 下 一 次 新 的 社 宅 蓋 的 時 候 它 的 優 先 區 是 提 升 的 這 樣 子 我 覺 得 才 符 合 真 正 公 平 正 義 的 原 則 請 問 內 政 部 針 對 社 會 住 宅 輪 候 制 現 在 有 規 劃 的 進 度 嗎\n\n13\n00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:54,899\n其 實 有 我 可 以 請 這 個 署 長 來 跟 您 回 應 一 下 其 實 我 們 現 行 的 制 度 裡 面 就 有 留 著 輪 候 制 那 其 實 在 未 來 的 這 個 社 宅 經 營 裡 面 輪 候 制 也 會 是 一 個 很 重 要 的 制 度\n\n14\n00:04:55,768 --> 00:05:23,644\n那 有 沒 有 具 體 上 路 的 時 間 比 他 更 明 確 的 一 點 因 為 我 們 在 新 的 全 面 在 從 大 概 明 年 開 始 我 們 會 有 比 較 大 量 的 社 宅 會 進 入 到 中 央 的 這 個 開 始 開 始 正 式 經 營 的 時 候 藉 由 輪 候 制 本 來 就 是 我 們 在 規 劃 裡 面 很 重 要 的 一 個 制 度 所 以 明 年 初 嘛 沒 關 係 你 這 會 後 你 先 內 部 的 書 面 報 告 先 提 供 給 我 們 好 不 好 好 第 三 個 是 租 屋 市 場 透 明 化 這 個 本 期 未 來 有 提 修 法 的 一 些 相 關 方 案 希 望 內 政 部 妥 善 引 引 也 就 是 說 現 在 只 有 包 租 的\n\n15\n00:05:24,304 --> 00:05:41,634\n的 業 者 來 做 所 謂 的 實 價 登 錄 那 先 從 政 府 掌 握 市 場 狀 況 開 始 然 後 逐 步 逐 步 的 來 做 透 明 代 管 的 數 量 其 實 比 包 租 多 很 多 所 以 這 部 分 應 該 要 逐 步 來 處 理 那 最 後 包 含 租 屋 補 貼 其 實 都 應 該 要 納 入 我 們 政 府 投 入 了 這 麼 多 的 資 源 去 處 理 這 個 事 情\n\n16\n00:05:42,054 --> 00:05:56,050\n如 果 沒 有 辦 法 讓 這 個 市 場 從 黑 市 裡 面 走 出 來 那 我 想 這 些 資 源 其 實 都 是 會 變 成 浪 費 所 以 這 個 也 是 本 席 非 常 要 求 也 會 持 續 來 監 督 這 個 政 府 對 於 租 屋 市 場 透 明 的 進 度 希 望 內 政 部 一 樣 你 會 後 提 供 一 個 資 料 做 一 個 通 盤 的 規 劃 可 以 嗎\n\n17\n00:05:57,011 --> 00:06:25,793\n好 我 很 簡 單 講 齁 轉 租 的 部 分 已 經 納 入 實 價 的 登 錄 齁 但 是 包 租 代 管 的 租 賃 契 約 資 訊 要 改 為 即 時 提 供 的 話 我 們 還 需 要 再 跟 業 者 來 溝 通 那 溝 通 好 了 會 跟 牛 委 員 報 告 就 一 個 相 關 的 一 個 規 劃 期 程 啦 我 們 一 步 一 步 往 前 走 好 謝 謝 好 這 是 居 住 證 益 部 分 第 二 個 時 間 實 在 很 有 限 沒 關 係 但 我 們 簡 單 點 一 下 本 系 也 非 常 關 心 公 寓 大 廈 管 理 齁 這 件 事 情 其 實 非 常 重 要 越 來 越 多 的 台 灣 人 民 居 住 在 公 寓 大 廈 裡 面 但 是 始 終 不 管 在 地 方 政 府 也 好 在 中 央 政 府 也 好 你 都 很 難 找 到 一 個 負 責 的 專 責 單 位\n\n18\n00:06:27,074 --> 00:06:53,269\n那 我 們 希 望 未 來 的 公 益 大 廈 管 理 可 以 再 做 調 整 我 們 不 要 每 次 都 只 是 像 城 中 城 大 火 之 後 然 後 每 次 都 只 是 針 對 安 全 的 部 分 來 處 理 本 期 重 視 的 是 軟 體 也 就 是 怎 麼 樣 建 立 一 個 健 康 的 管 理 環 境 包 含 政 府 端 你 能 不 能 夠 簡 化 行 政 程 序 讓 公 益 大 廈 管 理 變 成 一 些 相 對 輕 鬆 的 事 讓 這 些 擔 任 管 理 委 員 會 主 委 跟 管 理 委 員 的 這 些 住 戶 不 要 有 這 麼 大 的 負 擔 從 廠 商 的 角 度 我 怎 麼 樣 輔 導 社 區 讓 他 可 以 找 到 經 過 分 級 篩 選\n\n19\n00:06:55,230 --> 00:06:55,310\n： 牛 煦 庭\n\n20\n00:07:18,297 --> 00:07:19,158\n那 這 次 今 天 我 們 開 個 頭 相 關 詳 細 的 問 題 跟 建 議 我 們 會 用 書 面 的 方 式 提 供 給 內 政 部 希 望 內 政 部 也 針 對 這 件 事 情 好 好 來 做 一 個 規 劃\n\n21\n00:07:28,823 --> 00:07:54,256\n最 後 一 個 是 本 期 非 常 重 要 的 一 個 政 見 是 行 政 區 劃 法 也 是 現 在 賴 總 統 過 去 做 行 政 院 長 的 時 候 曾 經 提 出 的 院 版 的 方 案 這 個 我 們 已 經 一 路 都 有 在 做 研 究 本 期 的 選 區 生 活 圈 非 常 破 碎 有 很 多 這 樣 的 行 政 區 劃 重 新 調 整 的 必 要 性 我 們 會 提 出 相 關 的 草 案 我 也 希 望 院 裡 面 也 要 有 一 套 自 己 的 說 法 我 們 再 來 做 詳 細 的 討 論 第 一 建 立 遊 戲 規 則 第 二 我 們 的 版 本 會 要 求 人 民 的 表 達\n\n22\n00:07:55,296 --> 00:07:55,977\n主 席 主 席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n4281\t30260\t好 部長 喝口水沒關係好 優委員早好 謝謝主席 部長早安這個內政部業務報告真的是事情很多那我們就挑一些比較重要的東西今天先跟部長做一下政策對話是首先第一個問題這個本席要跟那個部長討論的是有關於居住正義的問題居住正義大概分成本席關心的題目大概分成幾個面向第一個有 電腦在哪裡\n39204\t61769\t第一個剛剛很多委員也關心我們社會住宅建設的進度能不能順利達標因為當然我們都知道政府在規劃我們有幾年幾百萬戶相關一些政策的時候其實喊都一定要喊高一點但實際上在執行的時候其實會遇到很多的困難跟障礙那我想請問部長大家有多少把握你們剛剛聽起來是8年後要100萬戶全部加起來100萬戶你有幾成的信心可以達標\n62709\t86914\t跟委員報告其實我剛剛已經有跟委員報告過所謂的百萬戶的目標就是25萬戶是直接興建那50萬戶的話就是包租貸款然後25萬戶的話就是屬於租金補貼那這個部分就表示說未來我們會加匯到100萬戶的年輕或是弱勢族群那以過去8年的進度到今年年底的時候呢中央跟地方政府加在一起的直接興建是12萬戶左右\n89714\t89734\t〔記者訪問〕\n113968\t142641\t這是本席今天要跟你討論也就是我們為了要達成社宅進度順利達標這樣一個狀況其實中央跟地方關係是非常重要的我想要了解未來因為過去這8年基本上社會住宅等於是有的是地方興建有的是中央興建然後它其實出現了步調不見得一致的一個情況那我想請問經過這8年的經驗未來政府在處理社會住宅建設的問題上是由中央全面來主導還是由內政部釋出資源來補助地方大概是走哪一種模式\n142941\t144463\t所以基本上都不會否定對不對?都不會否定\n159720\t181445\t沒有沒有 靈活調整不清楚你的主從是什麼意思就是說你要以中央為主嘛因為你規劃政策的時候你要投入資源嘛對不對如果你說中央主導興建那相對來講他可能就是中央主導但是地方如果他願意興建的話對於地方人民的這個呃帶來的福利也相當的多你也會鼓勵嘛這本議只要做兩點提醒啦第一個你如果是要用中央主導興建這樣子的一個模式的話\n182105\t182505\t市長市長市長市長\n203314\t204476\t主席主席主席主席\n224918\t243730\t那我就希望內政部該下的資源就要下以過去幾年本席從基層出身這個從中央得到的資源還是不夠的地方建設設宅其實未來都會變成財務負擔所以說中央要隨時檢討然後釋出更多的資源給地方這樣子我們才中央地方合作才能夠讓社會住宅的建設進度可以順利來達標\n244872\t245633\t謝謝指導 我們來努力\n256363\t278998\t那是不是有這個機會在新的政府領導之下大家把它改成所謂的輪候制啊也就是說大家有一個積分的算法因為我有些大家需求的程度其實是可以做一個基本量化的嘛那就按照這個量化成本來做一個排隊那這個優先的就可以優先入住這一次沒有輪到下一次新的社宅蓋的時候它的優先區是提升的這樣子我覺得才符合真正公平正義的原則請問內政部針對社會住宅輪候制現在有規劃的進度嗎\n282560\t294899\t其實有 我可以請這個署長來跟您回應一下其實我們現行的制度裡面就有留著輪候制那其實在未來的這個社宅經營裡面輪候制也會是一個很重要的制度\n295768\t323644\t那有沒有具體上路的時間比他更明確的一點因為我們在新的全面在從大概明年開始我們會有比較大量的社宅會進入到中央的這個開始開始正式經營的時候藉由輪候制本來就是我們在規劃裡面很重要的一個制度所以明年初嘛沒關係你這會後你先內部的書面報告先提供給我們好不好好第三個是租屋市場透明化這個本期未來有提修法的一些相關方案希望內政部妥善引引也就是說現在只有包租的\n324304\t341634\t的業者來做所謂的實價登錄那先從政府掌握市場狀況開始然後逐步逐步的來做透明代管的數量其實比包租多很多所以這部分應該要逐步來處理那最後包含租屋補貼其實都應該要納入我們政府投入了這麼多的資源去處理這個事情\n342054\t356050\t如果沒有辦法讓這個市場從黑市裡面走出來那我想這些資源其實都是會變成浪費所以這個也是本席非常要求也會持續來監督這個政府對於租屋市場透明的進度希望內政部一樣你會後提供一個資料做一個通盤的規劃可以嗎\n357011\t385793\t好我很簡單講齁轉租的部分已經納入實價的登錄齁但是包租代管的租賃契約資訊要改為即時提供的話我們還需要再跟業者來溝通那溝通好了會跟牛委員報告就一個相關的一個規劃期程啦我們一步一步往前走好謝謝好這是居住證益部分第二個時間實在很有限沒關係但我們簡單點一下本系也非常關心公寓大廈管理齁這件事情其實非常重要越來越多的台灣人民居住在公寓大廈裡面但是始終不管在地方政府也好在中央政府也好你都很難找到一個負責的專責單位\n387074\t413269\t那我們希望未來的公益大廈管理可以再做調整我們不要每次都只是像城中城大火之後然後每次都只是針對安全的部分來處理本期重視的是軟體也就是怎麼樣建立一個健康的管理環境包含政府端你能不能夠簡化行政程序讓公益大廈管理變成一些相對輕鬆的事讓這些擔任管理委員會主委跟管理委員的這些住戶不要有這麼大的負擔從廠商的角度我怎麼樣輔導社區讓他可以找到經過分級篩選\n415230\t415310\t：牛煦庭\n438297\t439158\t那這次今天我們開個頭相關詳細的問題跟建議我們會用書面的方式提供給內政部希望內政部也針對這件事情好好來做一個規劃\n448823\t474256\t最後一個是本期非常重要的一個政見是行政區劃法也是現在賴總統過去做行政院長的時候曾經提出的院版的方案這個我們已經一路都有在做研究本期的選區生活圈非常破碎有很多這樣的行政區劃重新調整的必要性我們會提出相關的草案我也希望院裡面也要有一套自己的說法我們再來做詳細的討論第一建立遊戲規則第二我們的版本會要求人民的表達\n475296\t475977\t主席主席\n","txt":"好 部長 喝口水沒關係好 優委員早好 謝謝主席 部長早安這個內政部業務報告真的是事情很多那我們就挑一些比較重要的東西今天先跟部長做一下政策對話是首先第一個問題這個本席要跟那個部長討論的是有關於居住正義的問題居住正義大概分成本席關心的題目大概分成幾個面向第一個有 電腦在哪裡\n第一個剛剛很多委員也關心我們社會住宅建設的進度能不能順利達標因為當然我們都知道政府在規劃我們有幾年幾百萬戶相關一些政策的時候其實喊都一定要喊高一點但實際上在執行的時候其實會遇到很多的困難跟障礙那我想請問部長大家有多少把握你們剛剛聽起來是8年後要100萬戶全部加起來100萬戶你有幾成的信心可以達標\n跟委員報告其實我剛剛已經有跟委員報告過所謂的百萬戶的目標就是25萬戶是直接興建那50萬戶的話就是包租貸款然後25萬戶的話就是屬於租金補貼那這個部分就表示說未來我們會加匯到100萬戶的年輕或是弱勢族群那以過去8年的進度到今年年底的時候呢中央跟地方政府加在一起的直接興建是12萬戶左右\n〔記者訪問〕\n這是本席今天要跟你討論也就是我們為了要達成社宅進度順利達標這樣一個狀況其實中央跟地方關係是非常重要的我想要了解未來因為過去這8年基本上社會住宅等於是有的是地方興建有的是中央興建然後它其實出現了步調不見得一致的一個情況那我想請問經過這8年的經驗未來政府在處理社會住宅建設的問題上是由中央全面來主導還是由內政部釋出資源來補助地方大概是走哪一種模式\n所以基本上都不會否定對不對?都不會否定\n沒有沒有 靈活調整不清楚你的主從是什麼意思就是說你要以中央為主嘛因為你規劃政策的時候你要投入資源嘛對不對如果你說中央主導興建那相對來講他可能就是中央主導但是地方如果他願意興建的話對於地方人民的這個呃帶來的福利也相當的多你也會鼓勵嘛這本議只要做兩點提醒啦第一個你如果是要用中央主導興建這樣子的一個模式的話\n市長市長市長市長\n主席主席主席主席\n那我就希望內政部該下的資源就要下以過去幾年本席從基層出身這個從中央得到的資源還是不夠的地方建設設宅其實未來都會變成財務負擔所以說中央要隨時檢討然後釋出更多的資源給地方這樣子我們才中央地方合作才能夠讓社會住宅的建設進度可以順利來達標\n謝謝指導 我們來努力\n那是不是有這個機會在新的政府領導之下大家把它改成所謂的輪候制啊也就是說大家有一個積分的算法因為我有些大家需求的程度其實是可以做一個基本量化的嘛那就按照這個量化成本來做一個排隊那這個優先的就可以優先入住這一次沒有輪到下一次新的社宅蓋的時候它的優先區是提升的這樣子我覺得才符合真正公平正義的原則請問內政部針對社會住宅輪候制現在有規劃的進度嗎\n其實有 我可以請這個署長來跟您回應一下其實我們現行的制度裡面就有留著輪候制那其實在未來的這個社宅經營裡面輪候制也會是一個很重要的制度\n那有沒有具體上路的時間比他更明確的一點因為我們在新的全面在從大概明年開始我們會有比較大量的社宅會進入到中央的這個開始開始正式經營的時候藉由輪候制本來就是我們在規劃裡面很重要的一個制度所以明年初嘛沒關係你這會後你先內部的書面報告先提供給我們好不好好第三個是租屋市場透明化這個本期未來有提修法的一些相關方案希望內政部妥善引引也就是說現在只有包租的\n的業者來做所謂的實價登錄那先從政府掌握市場狀況開始然後逐步逐步的來做透明代管的數量其實比包租多很多所以這部分應該要逐步來處理那最後包含租屋補貼其實都應該要納入我們政府投入了這麼多的資源去處理這個事情\n如果沒有辦法讓這個市場從黑市裡面走出來那我想這些資源其實都是會變成浪費所以這個也是本席非常要求也會持續來監督這個政府對於租屋市場透明的進度希望內政部一樣你會後提供一個資料做一個通盤的規劃可以嗎\n好我很簡單講齁轉租的部分已經納入實價的登錄齁但是包租代管的租賃契約資訊要改為即時提供的話我們還需要再跟業者來溝通那溝通好了會跟牛委員報告就一個相關的一個規劃期程啦我們一步一步往前走好謝謝好這是居住證益部分第二個時間實在很有限沒關係但我們簡單點一下本系也非常關心公寓大廈管理齁這件事情其實非常重要越來越多的台灣人民居住在公寓大廈裡面但是始終不管在地方政府也好在中央政府也好你都很難找到一個負責的專責單位\n那我們希望未來的公益大廈管理可以再做調整我們不要每次都只是像城中城大火之後然後每次都只是針對安全的部分來處理本期重視的是軟體也就是怎麼樣建立一個健康的管理環境包含政府端你能不能夠簡化行政程序讓公益大廈管理變成一些相對輕鬆的事讓這些擔任管理委員會主委跟管理委員的這些住戶不要有這麼大的負擔從廠商的角度我怎麼樣輔導社區讓他可以找到經過分級篩選\n：牛煦庭\n那這次今天我們開個頭相關詳細的問題跟建議我們會用書面的方式提供給內政部希望內政部也針對這件事情好好來做一個規劃\n最後一個是本期非常重要的一個政見是行政區劃法也是現在賴總統過去做行政院長的時候曾經提出的院版的方案這個我們已經一路都有在做研究本期的選區生活圈非常破碎有很多這樣的行政區劃重新調整的必要性我們會提出相關的草案我也希望院裡面也要有一套自己的說法我們再來做詳細的討論第一建立遊戲規則第二我們的版本會要求人民的表達\n主席主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:04.281 --> 00:30.260\n好 部 長 喝 口 水 沒 關 係 好 優 委 員 早 好 謝 謝 主 席 部 長 早 安 這 個 內 政 部 業 務 報 告 真 的 是 事 情 很 多 那 我 們 就 挑 一 些 比 較 重 要 的 東 西 今 天 先 跟 部 長 做 一 下 政 策 對 話 是 首 先 第 一 個 問 題 這 個 本 席 要 跟 那 個 部 長 討 論 的 是 有 關 於 居 住 正 義 的 問 題 居 住 正 義 大 概 分 成 本 席 關 心 的 題 目 大 概 分 成 幾 個 面 向 第 一 個 有 電 腦 在 哪 裡\n\n00:39.204 --> 01:01.769\n第 一 個 剛 剛 很 多 委 員 也 關 心 我 們 社 會 住 宅 建 設 的 進 度 能 不 能 順 利 達 標 因 為 當 然 我 們 都 知 道 政 府 在 規 劃 我 們 有 幾 年 幾 百 萬 戶 相 關 一 些 政 策 的 時 候 其 實 喊 都 一 定 要 喊 高 一 點 但 實 際 上 在 執 行 的 時 候 其 實 會 遇 到 很 多 的 困 難 跟 障 礙 那 我 想 請 問 部 長 大 家 有 多 少 把 握 你 們 剛 剛 聽 起 來 是 8 年 後 要 1 0 0 萬 戶 全 部 加 起 來 1 0 0 萬 戶 你 有 幾 成 的 信 心 可 以 達 標\n\n01:02.709 --> 01:26.914\n跟 委 員 報 告 其 實 我 剛 剛 已 經 有 跟 委 員 報 告 過 所 謂 的 百 萬 戶 的 目 標 就 是 2 5 萬 戶 是 直 接 興 建 那 5 0 萬 戶 的 話 就 是 包 租 貸 款 然 後 2 5 萬 戶 的 話 就 是 屬 於 租 金 補 貼 那 這 個 部 分 就 表 示 說 未 來 我 們 會 加 匯 到 1 0 0 萬 戶 的 年 輕 或 是 弱 勢 族 群 那 以 過 去 8 年 的 進 度 到 今 年 年 底 的 時 候 呢 中 央 跟 地 方 政 府 加 在 一 起 的 直 接 興 建 是 1 2 萬 戶 左 右\n\n01:29.714 --> 01:29.734\n〔 記 者 訪 問 〕\n\n01:53.968 --> 02:22.641\n這 是 本 席 今 天 要 跟 你 討 論 也 就 是 我 們 為 了 要 達 成 社 宅 進 度 順 利 達 標 這 樣 一 個 狀 況 其 實 中 央 跟 地 方 關 係 是 非 常 重 要 的 我 想 要 了 解 未 來 因 為 過 去 這 8 年 基 本 上 社 會 住 宅 等 於 是 有 的 是 地 方 興 建 有 的 是 中 央 興 建 然 後 它 其 實 出 現 了 步 調 不 見 得 一 致 的 一 個 情 況 那 我 想 請 問 經 過 這 8 年 的 經 驗 未 來 政 府 在 處 理 社 會 住 宅 建 設 的 問 題 上 是 由 中 央 全 面 來 主 導 還 是 由 內 政 部 釋 出 資 源 來 補 助 地 方 大 概 是 走 哪 一 種 模 式\n\n02:22.941 --> 02:24.463\n所 以 基 本 上 都 不 會 否 定 對 不 對 ? 都 不 會 否 定\n\n02:39.720 --> 03:01.445\n沒 有 沒 有 靈 活 調 整 不 清 楚 你 的 主 從 是 什 麼 意 思 就 是 說 你 要 以 中 央 為 主 嘛 因 為 你 規 劃 政 策 的 時 候 你 要 投 入 資 源 嘛 對 不 對 如 果 你 說 中 央 主 導 興 建 那 相 對 來 講 他 可 能 就 是 中 央 主 導 但 是 地 方 如 果 他 願 意 興 建 的 話 對 於 地 方 人 民 的 這 個 呃 帶 來 的 福 利 也 相 當 的 多 你 也 會 鼓 勵 嘛 這 本 議 只 要 做 兩 點 提 醒 啦 第 一 個 你 如 果 是 要 用 中 央 主 導 興 建 這 樣 子 的 一 個 模 式 的 話\n\n03:02.105 --> 03:02.505\n市 長 市 長 市 長 市 長\n\n03:23.314 --> 03:24.476\n主 席 主 席 主 席 主 席\n\n03:44.918 --> 04:03.730\n那 我 就 希 望 內 政 部 該 下 的 資 源 就 要 下 以 過 去 幾 年 本 席 從 基 層 出 身 這 個 從 中 央 得 到 的 資 源 還 是 不 夠 的 地 方 建 設 設 宅 其 實 未 來 都 會 變 成 財 務 負 擔 所 以 說 中 央 要 隨 時 檢 討 然 後 釋 出 更 多 的 資 源 給 地 方 這 樣 子 我 們 才 中 央 地 方 合 作 才 能 夠 讓 社 會 住 宅 的 建 設 進 度 可 以 順 利 來 達 標\n\n04:04.872 --> 04:05.633\n謝 謝 指 導 我 們 來 努 力\n\n04:16.363 --> 04:38.998\n那 是 不 是 有 這 個 機 會 在 新 的 政 府 領 導 之 下 大 家 把 它 改 成 所 謂 的 輪 候 制 啊 也 就 是 說 大 家 有 一 個 積 分 的 算 法 因 為 我 有 些 大 家 需 求 的 程 度 其 實 是 可 以 做 一 個 基 本 量 化 的 嘛 那 就 按 照 這 個 量 化 成 本 來 做 一 個 排 隊 那 這 個 優 先 的 就 可 以 優 先 入 住 這 一 次 沒 有 輪 到 下 一 次 新 的 社 宅 蓋 的 時 候 它 的 優 先 區 是 提 升 的 這 樣 子 我 覺 得 才 符 合 真 正 公 平 正 義 的 原 則 請 問 內 政 部 針 對 社 會 住 宅 輪 候 制 現 在 有 規 劃 的 進 度 嗎\n\n04:42.560 --> 04:54.899\n其 實 有 我 可 以 請 這 個 署 長 來 跟 您 回 應 一 下 其 實 我 們 現 行 的 制 度 裡 面 就 有 留 著 輪 候 制 那 其 實 在 未 來 的 這 個 社 宅 經 營 裡 面 輪 候 制 也 會 是 一 個 很 重 要 的 制 度\n\n04:55.768 --> 05:23.644\n那 有 沒 有 具 體 上 路 的 時 間 比 他 更 明 確 的 一 點 因 為 我 們 在 新 的 全 面 在 從 大 概 明 年 開 始 我 們 會 有 比 較 大 量 的 社 宅 會 進 入 到 中 央 的 這 個 開 始 開 始 正 式 經 營 的 時 候 藉 由 輪 候 制 本 來 就 是 我 們 在 規 劃 裡 面 很 重 要 的 一 個 制 度 所 以 明 年 初 嘛 沒 關 係 你 這 會 後 你 先 內 部 的 書 面 報 告 先 提 供 給 我 們 好 不 好 好 第 三 個 是 租 屋 市 場 透 明 化 這 個 本 期 未 來 有 提 修 法 的 一 些 相 關 方 案 希 望 內 政 部 妥 善 引 引 也 就 是 說 現 在 只 有 包 租 的\n\n05:24.304 --> 05:41.634\n的 業 者 來 做 所 謂 的 實 價 登 錄 那 先 從 政 府 掌 握 市 場 狀 況 開 始 然 後 逐 步 逐 步 的 來 做 透 明 代 管 的 數 量 其 實 比 包 租 多 很 多 所 以 這 部 分 應 該 要 逐 步 來 處 理 那 最 後 包 含 租 屋 補 貼 其 實 都 應 該 要 納 入 我 們 政 府 投 入 了 這 麼 多 的 資 源 去 處 理 這 個 事 情\n\n05:42.054 --> 05:56.050\n如 果 沒 有 辦 法 讓 這 個 市 場 從 黑 市 裡 面 走 出 來 那 我 想 這 些 資 源 其 實 都 是 會 變 成 浪 費 所 以 這 個 也 是 本 席 非 常 要 求 也 會 持 續 來 監 督 這 個 政 府 對 於 租 屋 市 場 透 明 的 進 度 希 望 內 政 部 一 樣 你 會 後 提 供 一 個 資 料 做 一 個 通 盤 的 規 劃 可 以 嗎\n\n05:57.011 --> 06:25.793\n好 我 很 簡 單 講 齁 轉 租 的 部 分 已 經 納 入 實 價 的 登 錄 齁 但 是 包 租 代 管 的 租 賃 契 約 資 訊 要 改 為 即 時 提 供 的 話 我 們 還 需 要 再 跟 業 者 來 溝 通 那 溝 通 好 了 會 跟 牛 委 員 報 告 就 一 個 相 關 的 一 個 規 劃 期 程 啦 我 們 一 步 一 步 往 前 走 好 謝 謝 好 這 是 居 住 證 益 部 分 第 二 個 時 間 實 在 很 有 限 沒 關 係 但 我 們 簡 單 點 一 下 本 系 也 非 常 關 心 公 寓 大 廈 管 理 齁 這 件 事 情 其 實 非 常 重 要 越 來 越 多 的 台 灣 人 民 居 住 在 公 寓 大 廈 裡 面 但 是 始 終 不 管 在 地 方 政 府 也 好 在 中 央 政 府 也 好 你 都 很 難 找 到 一 個 負 責 的 專 責 單 位\n\n06:27.074 --> 06:53.269\n那 我 們 希 望 未 來 的 公 益 大 廈 管 理 可 以 再 做 調 整 我 們 不 要 每 次 都 只 是 像 城 中 城 大 火 之 後 然 後 每 次 都 只 是 針 對 安 全 的 部 分 來 處 理 本 期 重 視 的 是 軟 體 也 就 是 怎 麼 樣 建 立 一 個 健 康 的 管 理 環 境 包 含 政 府 端 你 能 不 能 夠 簡 化 行 政 程 序 讓 公 益 大 廈 管 理 變 成 一 些 相 對 輕 鬆 的 事 讓 這 些 擔 任 管 理 委 員 會 主 委 跟 管 理 委 員 的 這 些 住 戶 不 要 有 這 麼 大 的 負 擔 從 廠 商 的 角 度 我 怎 麼 樣 輔 導 社 區 讓 他 可 以 找 到 經 過 分 級 篩 選\n\n06:55.230 --> 06:55.310\n： 牛 煦 庭\n\n07:18.297 --> 07:19.158\n那 這 次 今 天 我 們 開 個 頭 相 關 詳 細 的 問 題 跟 建 議 我 們 會 用 書 面 的 方 式 提 供 給 內 政 部 希 望 內 政 部 也 針 對 這 件 事 情 好 好 來 做 一 個 規 劃\n\n07:28.823 --> 07:54.256\n最 後 一 個 是 本 期 非 常 重 要 的 一 個 政 見 是 行 政 區 劃 法 也 是 現 在 賴 總 統 過 去 做 行 政 院 長 的 時 候 曾 經 提 出 的 院 版 的 方 案 這 個 我 們 已 經 一 路 都 有 在 做 研 究 本 期 的 選 區 生 活 圈 非 常 破 碎 有 很 多 這 樣 的 行 政 區 劃 重 新 調 整 的 必 要 性 我 們 會 提 出 相 關 的 草 案 我 也 希 望 院 裡 面 也 要 有 一 套 自 己 的 說 法 我 們 再 來 做 詳 細 的 討 論 第 一 建 立 遊 戲 規 則 第 二 我 們 的 版 本 會 要 求 人 民 的 表 達\n\n07:55.296 --> 07:55.977\n主 席 主 席\n\n","segments":[{"start":4.281,"end":30.26,"text":"好 部長 喝口水沒關係好 優委員早好 謝謝主席 部長早安這個內政部業務報告真的是事情很多那我們就挑一些比較重要的東西今天先跟部長做一下政策對話是首先第一個問題這個本席要跟那個部長討論的是有關於居住正義的問題居住正義大概分成本席關心的題目大概分成幾個面向第一個有 電腦在哪裡"},{"start":39.204,"end":61.769,"text":"第一個剛剛很多委員也關心我們社會住宅建設的進度能不能順利達標因為當然我們都知道政府在規劃我們有幾年幾百萬戶相關一些政策的時候其實喊都一定要喊高一點但實際上在執行的時候其實會遇到很多的困難跟障礙那我想請問部長大家有多少把握你們剛剛聽起來是8年後要100萬戶全部加起來100萬戶你有幾成的信心可以達標"},{"start":62.709,"end":86.914,"text":"跟委員報告其實我剛剛已經有跟委員報告過所謂的百萬戶的目標就是25萬戶是直接興建那50萬戶的話就是包租貸款然後25萬戶的話就是屬於租金補貼那這個部分就表示說未來我們會加匯到100萬戶的年輕或是弱勢族群那以過去8年的進度到今年年底的時候呢中央跟地方政府加在一起的直接興建是12萬戶左右"},{"start":89.714,"end":89.734,"text":"〔記者訪問〕"},{"start":113.968,"end":142.641,"text":"這是本席今天要跟你討論也就是我們為了要達成社宅進度順利達標這樣一個狀況其實中央跟地方關係是非常重要的我想要了解未來因為過去這8年基本上社會住宅等於是有的是地方興建有的是中央興建然後它其實出現了步調不見得一致的一個情況那我想請問經過這8年的經驗未來政府在處理社會住宅建設的問題上是由中央全面來主導還是由內政部釋出資源來補助地方大概是走哪一種模式"},{"start":142.941,"end":144.463,"text":"所以基本上都不會否定對不對?都不會否定"},{"start":159.72,"end":181.445,"text":"沒有沒有 靈活調整不清楚你的主從是什麼意思就是說你要以中央為主嘛因為你規劃政策的時候你要投入資源嘛對不對如果你說中央主導興建那相對來講他可能就是中央主導但是地方如果他願意興建的話對於地方人民的這個呃帶來的福利也相當的多你也會鼓勵嘛這本議只要做兩點提醒啦第一個你如果是要用中央主導興建這樣子的一個模式的話"},{"start":182.105,"end":182.505,"text":"市長市長市長市長"},{"start":203.314,"end":204.476,"text":"主席主席主席主席"},{"start":224.918,"end":243.73,"text":"那我就希望內政部該下的資源就要下以過去幾年本席從基層出身這個從中央得到的資源還是不夠的地方建設設宅其實未來都會變成財務負擔所以說中央要隨時檢討然後釋出更多的資源給地方這樣子我們才中央地方合作才能夠讓社會住宅的建設進度可以順利來達標"},{"start":244.872,"end":245.633,"text":"謝謝指導 我們來努力"},{"start":256.363,"end":278.998,"text":"那是不是有這個機會在新的政府領導之下大家把它改成所謂的輪候制啊也就是說大家有一個積分的算法因為我有些大家需求的程度其實是可以做一個基本量化的嘛那就按照這個量化成本來做一個排隊那這個優先的就可以優先入住這一次沒有輪到下一次新的社宅蓋的時候它的優先區是提升的這樣子我覺得才符合真正公平正義的原則請問內政部針對社會住宅輪候制現在有規劃的進度嗎"},{"start":282.56,"end":294.899,"text":"其實有 我可以請這個署長來跟您回應一下其實我們現行的制度裡面就有留著輪候制那其實在未來的這個社宅經營裡面輪候制也會是一個很重要的制度"},{"start":295.768,"end":323.644,"text":"那有沒有具體上路的時間比他更明確的一點因為我們在新的全面在從大概明年開始我們會有比較大量的社宅會進入到中央的這個開始開始正式經營的時候藉由輪候制本來就是我們在規劃裡面很重要的一個制度所以明年初嘛沒關係你這會後你先內部的書面報告先提供給我們好不好好第三個是租屋市場透明化這個本期未來有提修法的一些相關方案希望內政部妥善引引也就是說現在只有包租的"},{"start":324.304,"end":341.634,"text":"的業者來做所謂的實價登錄那先從政府掌握市場狀況開始然後逐步逐步的來做透明代管的數量其實比包租多很多所以這部分應該要逐步來處理那最後包含租屋補貼其實都應該要納入我們政府投入了這麼多的資源去處理這個事情"},{"start":342.054,"end":356.05,"text":"如果沒有辦法讓這個市場從黑市裡面走出來那我想這些資源其實都是會變成浪費所以這個也是本席非常要求也會持續來監督這個政府對於租屋市場透明的進度希望內政部一樣你會後提供一個資料做一個通盤的規劃可以嗎"},{"start":357.011,"end":385.793,"text":"好我很簡單講齁轉租的部分已經納入實價的登錄齁但是包租代管的租賃契約資訊要改為即時提供的話我們還需要再跟業者來溝通那溝通好了會跟牛委員報告就一個相關的一個規劃期程啦我們一步一步往前走好謝謝好這是居住證益部分第二個時間實在很有限沒關係但我們簡單點一下本系也非常關心公寓大廈管理齁這件事情其實非常重要越來越多的台灣人民居住在公寓大廈裡面但是始終不管在地方政府也好在中央政府也好你都很難找到一個負責的專責單位"},{"start":387.074,"end":413.269,"text":"那我們希望未來的公益大廈管理可以再做調整我們不要每次都只是像城中城大火之後然後每次都只是針對安全的部分來處理本期重視的是軟體也就是怎麼樣建立一個健康的管理環境包含政府端你能不能夠簡化行政程序讓公益大廈管理變成一些相對輕鬆的事讓這些擔任管理委員會主委跟管理委員的這些住戶不要有這麼大的負擔從廠商的角度我怎麼樣輔導社區讓他可以找到經過分級篩選"},{"start":415.23,"end":415.31,"text":"：牛煦庭"},{"start":438.297,"end":439.158,"text":"那這次今天我們開個頭相關詳細的問題跟建議我們會用書面的方式提供給內政部希望內政部也針對這件事情好好來做一個規劃"},{"start":448.823,"end":474.256,"text":"最後一個是本期非常重要的一個政見是行政區劃法也是現在賴總統過去做行政院長的時候曾經提出的院版的方案這個我們已經一路都有在做研究本期的選區生活圈非常破碎有很多這樣的行政區劃重新調整的必要性我們會提出相關的草案我也希望院裡面也要有一套自己的說法我們再來做詳細的討論第一建立遊戲規則第二我們的版本會要求人民的表達"},{"start":475.296,"end":475.977,"text":"主席主席"}]}}}}