{"id":153229,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153229","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/2c978e04ca5e133180ef07242ec06f85de1b7f2d659cc489333bc5d453e1b1958fc881b9a350622d5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"黃捷","委員發言時間":"10:30:44 - 10:39:25","影片長度":"00:08:41","會議時間":"2024-05-29T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政委員會第20次全體委員會議（事由：邀請內政部部長率同所屬列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。）","date":"2024-05-29","duration":521,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期內政委員會第20次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":20,"committees":[15],"id":"委員會-11-1-15-20"},"end_time":"2024-05-29T10:39:25+08:00","start_time":"2024-05-29T10:30:44+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":500,"blocks":[["黃委員捷：（10時30分）謝謝主席。部長就不用下去了……"],["主席：有請部長。"],["黃委員捷：沒關係，謝謝部長。我今天看了一下，今天來的很多委員都穿球鞋跟牛仔褲，這樣其實是符合我們韓院長藐視國會的定義喔！所以好險我今天沒有穿球鞋。好，謝謝部長，我來跟您請教一下，現在藐視國會罪通過了，您會緊張嗎？"],["劉部長世芳：我想我們就是知之為知之，不知為不知，應該是我職權行使範圍內的話，我就儘量跟委員來做回應跟回答。"],["黃委員捷：是啦！我還是希望因為今天很多新的部會首長都上任了，也是安慰大家、鼓勵大家一下，因為現在這個法通過了，公務員真的人人自危，希望大家在位子上都可以安心地做這個工作，我還是會努力做大家的後盾。","先請教一下軟腳蝦建築，因為這個其實是在4月3號花蓮地震之後，很多人都有關心的後續就是上面有一些黃單建築的部分，當時我也有問前部長現在這個軟腳蝦建築的強化耐震規範，我們通知相關民眾的機制是什麼？當時他們是跟我們說108年到110年有大概盤點出來，可是到現在其實數字還不是很明確，我想要請教一下部長及署長，現在手上有沒有相關的資訊了？全國大概有多少棟軟腳蝦建築呢？"],["劉部長世芳：是不是請署長先跟您回應一下？"],["黃委員捷：好。"],["主席：請吳署長，謝謝。"],["吳署長欣修：跟委員報告，我們當時是篩了三萬六千多件，其中大概有一萬兩千多件是屬於我們認為在結構認定上是有疑慮的，所以當時就把這些資料通知各縣市政府，請它代為通知這些大樓的管委會或所有權人，讓他們可以知道自己大樓本身存在的結構疑慮，是這個意思。"],["黃委員捷：三萬六千多件然後你們通知了一萬兩千多件，現在已經請各縣市政府要通知相關的住戶，可是到底有幾棟主動來申請耐震評估，然後也完成耐震補強的呢？"],["吳署長欣修：跟委員報告，大概不到100棟。"],["黃委員捷：不到100棟，這個就是我現在最擔心的，就是通知歸通知啦！但是真的願意自己做耐震補強的大樓或是公寓，或是相關的建築，其實非常少、非常少，我不知道現在國土署針對這樣的情形有沒有一些再去加強，或者是還可以怎麼進一步鼓勵民眾申請，或者是說他們自己趕快針對自己住的環境做更安全的加強呢？"],["吳署長欣修：跟委員報告，其實我們大概分兩個面向：第一個，當然今年我們還是會重新再盤點過去快篩的成果與他們現在執行的方向，如果沒有的話，第一個，我們當然還是會持續請地方政府要通知他們，因為政府有提供初、詳評的補助，其實他們只要自己做了初、詳評，自己就可以來做決定要不要往下一階段做耐震補強，或者是拆除重建，今年我們還是會做這件事情。第二個，其實它在相關的公安上會有這樣的疑慮，所以我們現在也請建管組這邊來研究，未來公安檢查的部分是不是針對這一些可能有結構疑慮的，要不要加強針對其公安的部分來進行增加項目的檢查，也就是說，尤其是八層樓以上的建築物，就可以先開始慢慢來增強對公安的要求，把它納進去的話，對於住戶來講是有更強的提醒作用。"],["黃委員捷：是的，當然我也不希望變成我們在擾民啦，但是因為這個其實都是大家自己居住環境的安全問題，所以怎麼樣可以官民合作，然後讓大家的整體環境變得更安全，這個是我非常關心的，我也知道內政部本來有規定1999年以前的旅館、醫院、商場等用途的房屋要強制辦理耐震能力評估，可是因為現在我們看到軟腳蝦建築都是一般住宅，所以我相信這還是現在最大的問題，我也希望我們持續地趕快再研擬一些相關措施來協助。"],["吳署長欣修：好。"],["黃委員捷：部長跟署長可以先回座。接下來我要請教一下消防署署長。"],["主席：有請消防署署長。"],["黃委員捷：最後一點時間，我來請教一下新竹的這個案子，因為這一案大家看完會覺得有點困惑，覺得比較多的爭點，到目前為止調查原因還尚待釐清，因為起火點是在地下室，可是到最後是在高層樓，沒錯，所以這個起火的原因你們現在有沒有協助地方，就是協助新竹消防局來進行相關調查？如果有需要，現在地方上有任何向你們請求支援的狀況嗎？"],["蕭署長煥章：感謝委員關心新竹火災，在第一時間我們的火調人員跟災調會人員都已經到現場開始啟動調查作業，火災的原因，事實上，剛才委員有提到，它火災的地方只有地下一樓的電纜線間，然後往上，往上延燒的範圍也不是很大，就是在管道間，沒有對外延燒，整個大樓充滿了因為電纜線起火而產生的黑煙跟積碳，這是目前的狀況。起火處所我們現在是確定在地下一樓的電纜線間，至於起火的原因，我們在第一時間已經跟新竹市做協助，第一天我們也將電線短路的痕跡狀況採回消防署做一個鑑定，今天還是在現場進行接續調查，調查報告會由新竹市來製作，我們來做鑑定報告書的提列，以上跟委員報告，謝謝。"],["黃委員捷：謝謝署長的說明，當然，這個火調還是由地方消防局去進行啦，我覺得調查是一個，但我覺得最重要的還是消防員本身的安全，因為我們真的很不想看到消防員再殉職了。我想要問的是，因為現在大家都在討論消防員要不要組工會，我認為在組工會之外有另外一個很重要的就是，消防員可不可以直接適用職安條例、適用職安專章？我不知道現在消防署對於這個部分的看法是什麼？"],["蕭署長煥章：是，跟委員回報，5月15號衛環委員會在審查工會法的時候有做決議，要行政院在一個月把消防法納入職安專章的條文報到立法院來審議，這個條文我們在4月30號已經報到行政院，行政院預計會依照立法院的決議，在消防法裡面把職安專章的條文列進去。除了職安專章以外，事實上我們也提列後續職安的5年中程計畫，也就不是光只有法律，而是在執行面，我們怎麼參考甚至跟這個計畫的配合，有專業團隊來協助地方政府強化地方人員的安全，當然這個強化不是只有臺灣本身的強化，事實上，我們的職安署、勞研所、美國、日本的經驗都融入，當成一個推動的重要項目，以上跟委員回報，至於詳細情形，如果委員有需要，我們再跟委員做回報，謝謝。"],["黃委員捷：這些資料也麻煩提供給我，因為520新政府上任，我希望之前你們的這些承諾都還是會繼續推動。"],["蕭署長煥章：是。"],["黃委員捷：最後我再次強調，消防員的資訊權、退避權，還有現在的這些職安的權利，拜託消防署成為消防員最大的後盾，謝謝。"],["蕭署長煥章：感謝委員。"],["主席：非常謝謝黃捷委員的質詢，也謝謝蕭署長，謝謝。","繼續我們請黃建賓委員質詢，質詢後休息5分鐘。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":334,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-15-20","speakers":["高金素梅","蘇巧慧","許宇甄","牛煦庭","張宏陸","王美惠","李柏毅","麥玉珍","黃捷","黃建賓","張智倫","丁學忠","徐欣瑩","吳琪銘","鄭天財Sra 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427.422, \"end\": 427.442, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"條\"}, {\"word\": \"例\", \"start\": 427.442, \"end\": 427.462, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"?\"}]}, {\"start\": 437.307, \"end\": 456.164, \"text\": \"是用職安專章那這個我不知道現在我們消防署的看法是什麼是跟委員回報5月15號未完委會在審查公會法的時候有做決議是要消防署現在銜證員在一個月把消防法列入職安專章的條文報到立法院來審議\", \"words\": [{\"word\": \"是\", \"start\": 437.307, \"end\": 437.487, \"score\": 0.987}, {\"word\": \"用\", \"start\": 437.487, \"end\": 437.908, \"score\": 0.869}, {\"word\": \"職\"}, {\"word\": \"安\", \"start\": 437.908, \"end\": 438.388, \"score\": 0.899}, {\"word\": \"專\"}, {\"word\": \"章\", \"start\": 438.388, \"end\": 439.269, \"score\": 0.956}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 439.269, \"end\": 440.07, \"score\": 0.822}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 440.07, \"end\": 440.17, \"score\": 0.797}, {\"word\": \"不\", \"start\": 440.17, \"end\": 440.19, \"score\": 0.695}, {\"word\": \"知\", \"start\": 440.19, \"end\": 440.27, \"score\": 0.75}, {\"word\": \"道\", 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{\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 497.009, \"end\": 497.369, \"score\": 0.82}, {\"word\": \"項\"}, {\"word\": \"目\", \"start\": 497.369, \"end\": 497.729, \"score\": 0.985}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 497.729, \"end\": 497.83, \"score\": 0.543}, {\"word\": \"想\", \"start\": 497.83, \"end\": 498.15, \"score\": 0.833}, {\"word\": \"這\"}, {\"word\": \"個\"}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 498.15, \"end\": 498.29, \"score\": 0.848}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 498.29, \"end\": 498.51, \"score\": 0.877}, {\"word\": \"員\"}, {\"word\": \"回\", \"start\": 498.51, \"end\": 499.071, \"score\": 0.913}, {\"word\": \"報\"}, {\"word\": \"那\", \"start\": 499.071, \"end\": 499.351, \"score\": 0.902}, {\"word\": \"詳\"}, {\"word\": \"細\"}, {\"word\": \"情\", \"start\": 499.351, \"end\": 499.451, \"score\": 0.8}, {\"word\": \"形\", \"start\": 499.451, \"end\": 499.651, \"score\": 0.89}, {\"word\": \"如\", \"start\": 499.651, \"end\": 499.791, \"score\": 0.905}, {\"word\": \"果\", \"start\": 499.791, \"end\": 500.152, \"score\": 0.939}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 500.152, \"end\": 500.312, \"score\": 0.872}, {\"word\": \"需\", \"start\": 500.312, \"end\": 500.472, \"score\": 0.994}, {\"word\": \"要\", \"start\": 500.472, \"end\": 500.532, \"score\": 0.897}, {\"word\": \"的\", \"start\": 500.532, \"end\": 500.632, \"score\": 0.79}, {\"word\": \"話\"}, {\"word\": \"我\", \"start\": 500.632, \"end\": 500.832, \"score\": 0.784}, {\"word\": \"們\"}, {\"word\": \"再\", \"start\": 500.832, \"end\": 500.952, \"score\": 0.83}, {\"word\": \"跟\", \"start\": 500.952, \"end\": 501.053, \"score\": 0.798}, {\"word\": \"著\", \"start\": 501.053, \"end\": 501.073, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"黃\"}, {\"word\": \"捷\", \"start\": 501.813, \"end\": 501.893, \"score\": 0.749}, {\"word\": \"委\", \"start\": 501.893, \"end\": 501.913, \"score\": 0.0}, {\"word\": \"員\"}], \"language\": \"en\"}","srt":"1\n00:00:05,117 --> 00:00:28,538\n好 謝 謝 主 席 欸 部 長 就 沒 有 下 去 了 哈 哈 哈 好 有 請 部 長 沒 關 係 謝 謝 部 長 好 我 今 天 看 了 一 下 跟 今 天 來 的 很 多 委 員 都 穿 球 鞋 跟 牛 仔 褲 這 樣 其 實 是 符 合 我 們 韓 院 長 藐 視 國 會 的 定 義 喔 所 以 好 險 我 今 天 沒 有 穿 球 鞋 好 謝 謝 部 長 我 來 跟 您 請 教 一 下 您 現 在 就 是 這 個 藐 視 國 會 最 通 過 的 您 會 緊 張 嗎\n\n2\n00:00:32,001 --> 00:00:59,284\n我 還 是 希 望 因 為 今 天 很 多 新 的 部 會 首 長 都 上 任 了 也 是 安 慰 大 家 鼓 勵 大 家 一 下 因 為 現 在 這 個 法 通 過 了 公 務 員 真 的 人 人 自 危 希 望 大 家 在 位 子 上 都 可 以 安 心 的 做 這 個 工 作 還 是 會 努 力 的 做 大 家 的 後 盾\n\n3\n00:00:59,904 --> 00:01:25,127\n好 那 先 請 教 一 下 這 個 軟 腳 蝦 建 築 因 為 這 個 其 實 在 4 月 3 號 花 蓮 地 震 之 後 其 實 很 多 人 都 有 關 心 的 後 續 就 是 上 面 有 一 些 就 是 黃 丹 建 築 的 部 分 那 當 時 我 有 問 到 就 是 當 時 的 部 長 就 是 現 在 這 個 軟 腳 蝦 建 築 的 強 化 耐 震 的 規 範 現 在 我 們 通 知 相 關 民 眾 的 機 制 是 什 麼\n\n4\n00:01:25,948 --> 00:01:43,333\n那 當 時 我 問 這 個 前 部 長 他 們 是 跟 我 們 說 1 0 8 年 到 1 1 0 年 有 大 概 的 盤 點 出 來 可 是 到 現 在 其 實 數 字 還 是 不 是 很 明 確 我 想 要 請 教 一 下 部 長 跟 我 們 署 長 現 在 手 上 有 沒 有 相 關 的 資 訊 了 全 國 大 概 有 多 少 棟 的 軟 腳 蝦 建 築 呢 請 署 長 來 先 跟 您 回 應 一 下\n\n5\n00:01:52,359 --> 00:02:17,470\n跟 委 員 報 告 我 們 當 時 是 篩 了 三 萬 六 千 多 件 那 大 概 其 中 有 大 概 一 萬 兩 千 多 件 是 屬 於 我 們 大 概 認 定 在 在 結 構 上 是 認 為 是 有 疑 慮 的 那 所 以 當 時 就 把 這 些 資 料 就 通 知 各 縣 市 政 府 請 他 代 為 通 知 這 些 大 樓 的 管 委 會 或 所 有 全 人 讓 他 們 可 以 知 道 說 他 自 己 的 大 樓 本 身 存 在 的 結 構 疑 慮 是 這 個 意 思\n\n6\n00:02:19,070 --> 00:02:19,750\n更 穩 報 告 大 概 不 到 1 0 0 棟\n\n7\n00:02:38,990 --> 00:03:01,486\n這 就 是 我 現 在 最 擔 心 的 就 是 通 知 歸 通 知 啦 但 是 真 的 願 意 自 己 去 做 內 政 補 強 的 大 樓 或 是 公 寓 或 是 相 關 的 這 個 建 築 其 實 非 常 少 非 常 少 那 我 不 知 道 現 在 國 土 署 有 沒 有 針 對 這 樣 的 情 形 有 沒 有 一 些 再 去 加 強 或 者 是 我 們 還 可 以 怎 麼 進 一 步 的 來\n\n8\n00:03:03,027 --> 00:03:27,666\n鼓 勵 民 眾 來 申 請 然 後 或 者 是 說 他 們 自 己 趕 快 針 對 自 己 住 的 環 境 來 做 更 安 全 的 加 強 呢 跟 委 員 報 告 其 實 我 們 大 概 分 兩 個 面 向 第 一 個 當 然 我 們 在 今 年 以 後 我 們 還 是 會 重 新 再 盤 點 把 過 去 快 篩 的 成 果 跟 他 們 現 在 在 執 行 的 方 向 那 如 果 沒 有 的 話 第 一 個 我 們 當 然 還 是 會 持 續\n\n9\n00:03:28,767 --> 00:03:47,499\n請 地 方 政 府 要 通 知 他 們 因 為 政 府 有 提 供 補 助 是 出 產 品 的 補 助 是 那 其 實 他 們 只 要 自 己 做 了 出 產 品 自 己 就 可 以 來 做 決 定 要 不 要 往 下 一 階 段 的 耐 震 補 強 或 是 這 個 採 取 重 建 要 去 再 做 我 想 這 一 今 年 我 們 還 是 要 來 做 這 件 事 情 第 二 個 呢 其 實 他 會 跟 這 一 個\n\n10\n00:03:49,981 --> 00:03:50,161\n李 卓 人 議 員\n\n11\n00:04:11,719 --> 00:04:12,220\n李 卓 人 議 員\n\n12\n00:04:24,557 --> 00:04:24,617\n內 政 部 部 長\n\n13\n00:04:43,423 --> 00:05:09,841\n強 制 規 定 說 1 9 9 9 年 以 前 的 旅 館 醫 院 商 場 等 用 途 的 房 屋 強 制 要 進 行 耐 震 評 估 那 可 是 因 為 現 在 其 實 我 們 看 到 亂 角 蝦 建 築 的 都 是 一 般 住 宅 所 以 我 相 信 這 還 是 現 在 最 大 的 問 題 那 我 也 希 望 說 我 們 持 續 的 趕 快 再 研 擬 一 些 相 關 的 措 施 來 協 助 好 那 我 們 部 長 跟 署 長 可 以 先 回 座 我 還 是 請 教 一 下 我 們 消 防 署 的 署 長\n\n14\n00:05:12,111 --> 00:05:34,222\n最 後 一 點 時 間 我 來 請 教 一 下 這 個 新 竹 的 這 一 案 因 為 這 一 案 其 實 大 家 看 完 會 覺 得 說 有 點 困 惑 然 後 有 點 覺 得 說 比 較 比 較 多 爭 點 到 目 前 這 個 調 查 的 原 因 還 尚 待 釐 清 包 括 說 因 為 他 的 起 火 點 是 在 地 下 室 可 是 到 最 後 是 在 高 層 樓\n\n15\n00:05:35,603 --> 00:05:35,783\n請 求 支 援\n\n16\n00:05:53,001 --> 00:06:16,128\n感 謝 委 員 關 心 新 竹 火 災 我 們 在 第 一 時 間 我 們 的 火 調 人 員 跟 災 調 會 人 員 都 已 經 到 現 場 開 始 啟 動 調 查 作 業 那 火 災 的 原 因 事 實 上 剛 才 委 員 他 的 火 災 的 地 方 只 有 地 下 一 樓 的 電 纜 線 間 然 後 往 上 那 往 上 延 燒 的 範 圍 也 不 是 很 大 就 是 在 管 道 間 沒 有 對 外 的 延 燒 整 個 是 整 個 大 樓 充 滿 因 為 電 纜 線\n\n17\n00:06:19,469 --> 00:06:21,411\n今 天 還 是 在 現 場 做 接 續 的 一 個 調 查\n\n18\n00:06:53,493 --> 00:07:05,439\n那 當 然 這 個 火 調 還 是 由 地 方 的 消 防 局 去 進 行 啦 我 覺 得 調 查 是 一 個 但 我 覺 得 最 重 要 的 還 是 消 防 員 本 身 的 安 全 因 為 我 們 真 的 很 不 想 看 到 消 防 員 再 殉 職 了\n\n19\n00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:07,462\n消 防 員 可 不 可 以 直 接 適 用 職 安 條 例 ?\n\n20\n00:07:17,307 --> 00:07:36,164\n是 用 職 安 專 章 那 這 個 我 不 知 道 現 在 我 們 消 防 署 的 看 法 是 什 麼 是 跟 委 員 回 報 5 月 1 5 號 未 完 委 會 在 審 查 公 會 法 的 時 候 有 做 決 議 是 要 消 防 署 現 在 銜 證 員 在 一 個 月 把 消 防 法 列 入 職 安 專 章 的 條 文 報 到 立 法 院 來 審 議\n\n21\n00:07:37,245 --> 00:08:00,874\n那 這 個 條 文 我 們 在 4 月 3 0 號 已 經 報 到 行 政 院 那 曾 經 預 計 會 在 立 法 院 的 決 議 把 消 防 法 裡 面 有 治 安 專 章 的 條 文 列 進 去 那 除 了 治 安 專 章 以 外 呢 事 實 上 我 們 也 提 列 後 續 治 安 的 5 年 的 中 程 計 畫 也 就 不 是 光 是 只 有 法 律 而 是 在 執 行 面 我 們 怎 麼 參 考 深 耕 計 畫 的 配 合\n\n22\n00:08:01,554 --> 00:08:21,073\n有 專 業 團 隊 來 協 助 地 方 政 府 來 強 化 地 方 人 員 的 安 全 當 然 這 個 強 化 不 是 只 有 臺 灣 本 身 的 強 化 事 實 上 我 們 職 安 署 勞 研 所 美 國 日 本 的 經 驗 我 們 都 融 入 當 成 一 個 推 動 的 一 個 重 點 重 要 項 目 我 想 這 個 跟 委 員 回 報 那 詳 細 情 形 如 果 委 需 要 的 話 我 們 再 跟 著\n\n23\n00:08:21,813 --> 00:08:21,913\n黃 捷 委 員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n5117\t28538\t好 謝謝主席 欸 部長就沒有下去了 哈哈哈好 有請部長沒關係 謝謝部長好 我今天看了一下 跟今天來的很多委員都穿球鞋跟牛仔褲這樣其實是符合我們韓院長藐視國會的定義喔所以 好險我今天沒有穿球鞋好 謝謝部長 我來跟您請教一下您現在就是這個藐視國會最通過的 您會緊張嗎\n32001\t59284\t我還是希望因為今天很多新的部會首長都上任了也是安慰大家鼓勵大家一下因為現在這個法通過了公務員真的人人自危希望大家在位子上都可以安心的做這個工作還是會努力的做大家的後盾\n59904\t85127\t好那先請教一下這個軟腳蝦建築因為這個其實在4月3號花蓮地震之後其實很多人都有關心的後續就是上面有一些就是黃丹建築的部分那當時我有問到就是當時的部長就是現在這個軟腳蝦建築的強化耐震的規範現在我們通知相關民眾的機制是什麼\n85948\t103333\t那當時我問這個前部長他們是跟我們說108年到110年有大概的盤點出來可是到現在其實數字還是不是很明確我想要請教一下部長跟我們署長現在手上有沒有相關的資訊了全國大概有多少棟的軟腳蝦建築呢請署長來先跟您回應一下\n112359\t137470\t跟委員報告我們當時是篩了三萬六千多件那大概其中有大概一萬兩千多件是屬於我們大概認定在在結構上是認為是有疑慮的那所以當時就把這些資料就通知各縣市政府請他代為通知這些大樓的管委會或所有全人讓他們可以知道說他自己的大樓本身存在的結構疑慮是這個意思\n139070\t139750\t更穩報告大概不到100棟\n158990\t181486\t這就是我現在最擔心的就是通知歸通知啦但是真的願意自己去做內政補強的大樓或是公寓或是相關的這個建築其實非常少非常少那我不知道現在國土署有沒有針對這樣的情形有沒有一些再去加強或者是我們還可以怎麼進一步的來\n183027\t207666\t鼓勵民眾來申請然後或者是說他們自己趕快針對自己住的環境來做更安全的加強呢跟委員報告其實我們大概分兩個面向第一個當然我們在今年以後我們還是會重新再盤點把過去快篩的成果跟他們現在在執行的方向那如果沒有的話第一個我們當然還是會持續\n208767\t227499\t請地方政府要通知他們因為政府有提供補助是出產品的補助是那其實他們只要自己做了出產品自己就可以來做決定要不要往下一階段的耐震補強或是這個採取重建要去再做我想這一今年我們還是要來做這件事情第二個呢其實他會跟這一個\n229981\t230161\t李卓人議員\n251719\t252220\t李卓人議員\n264557\t264617\t內政部部長\n283423\t309841\t強制規定說1999年以前的旅館醫院商場等用途的房屋強制要進行耐震評估那可是因為現在其實我們看到亂角蝦建築的都是一般住宅所以我相信這還是現在最大的問題那我也希望說我們持續的趕快再研擬一些相關的措施來協助好那我們部長跟署長可以先回座我還是請教一下我們消防署的署長\n312111\t334222\t最後一點時間我來請教一下這個新竹的這一案因為這一案其實大家看完會覺得說有點困惑然後有點覺得說比較比較多爭點到目前這個調查的原因還尚待釐清包括說因為他的起火點是在地下室可是到最後是在高層樓\n335603\t335783\t請求支援\n353001\t376128\t感謝委員關心新竹火災我們在第一時間我們的火調人員跟災調會人員都已經到現場開始啟動調查作業那火災的原因事實上剛才委員他的火災的地方只有地下一樓的電纜線間然後往上那往上延燒的範圍也不是很大就是在管道間沒有對外的延燒整個是整個大樓充滿因為電纜線\n379469\t381411\t今天還是在現場做接續的一個調查\n413493\t425439\t那當然這個火調還是由地方的消防局去進行啦我覺得調查是一個但我覺得最重要的還是消防員本身的安全因為我們真的很不想看到消防員再殉職了\n426320\t427462\t消防員可不可以直接適用職安條例?\n437307\t456164\t是用職安專章那這個我不知道現在我們消防署的看法是什麼是跟委員回報5月15號未完委會在審查公會法的時候有做決議是要消防署現在銜證員在一個月把消防法列入職安專章的條文報到立法院來審議\n457245\t480874\t那這個條文我們在4月30號已經報到行政院那曾經預計會在立法院的決議把消防法裡面有治安專章的條文列進去那除了治安專章以外呢事實上我們也提列後續治安的5年的中程計畫也就不是光是只有法律而是在執行面我們怎麼參考深耕計畫的配合\n481554\t501073\t有專業團隊來協助地方政府來強化地方人員的安全當然這個強化不是只有臺灣本身的強化事實上我們職安署勞研所美國日本的經驗我們都融入當成一個推動的一個重點重要項目我想這個跟委員回報那詳細情形如果委需要的話我們再跟著\n501813\t501913\t黃捷委員\n","txt":"好 謝謝主席 欸 部長就沒有下去了 哈哈哈好 有請部長沒關係 謝謝部長好 我今天看了一下 跟今天來的很多委員都穿球鞋跟牛仔褲這樣其實是符合我們韓院長藐視國會的定義喔所以 好險我今天沒有穿球鞋好 謝謝部長 我來跟您請教一下您現在就是這個藐視國會最通過的 您會緊張嗎\n我還是希望因為今天很多新的部會首長都上任了也是安慰大家鼓勵大家一下因為現在這個法通過了公務員真的人人自危希望大家在位子上都可以安心的做這個工作還是會努力的做大家的後盾\n好那先請教一下這個軟腳蝦建築因為這個其實在4月3號花蓮地震之後其實很多人都有關心的後續就是上面有一些就是黃丹建築的部分那當時我有問到就是當時的部長就是現在這個軟腳蝦建築的強化耐震的規範現在我們通知相關民眾的機制是什麼\n那當時我問這個前部長他們是跟我們說108年到110年有大概的盤點出來可是到現在其實數字還是不是很明確我想要請教一下部長跟我們署長現在手上有沒有相關的資訊了全國大概有多少棟的軟腳蝦建築呢請署長來先跟您回應一下\n跟委員報告我們當時是篩了三萬六千多件那大概其中有大概一萬兩千多件是屬於我們大概認定在在結構上是認為是有疑慮的那所以當時就把這些資料就通知各縣市政府請他代為通知這些大樓的管委會或所有全人讓他們可以知道說他自己的大樓本身存在的結構疑慮是這個意思\n更穩報告大概不到100棟\n這就是我現在最擔心的就是通知歸通知啦但是真的願意自己去做內政補強的大樓或是公寓或是相關的這個建築其實非常少非常少那我不知道現在國土署有沒有針對這樣的情形有沒有一些再去加強或者是我們還可以怎麼進一步的來\n鼓勵民眾來申請然後或者是說他們自己趕快針對自己住的環境來做更安全的加強呢跟委員報告其實我們大概分兩個面向第一個當然我們在今年以後我們還是會重新再盤點把過去快篩的成果跟他們現在在執行的方向那如果沒有的話第一個我們當然還是會持續\n請地方政府要通知他們因為政府有提供補助是出產品的補助是那其實他們只要自己做了出產品自己就可以來做決定要不要往下一階段的耐震補強或是這個採取重建要去再做我想這一今年我們還是要來做這件事情第二個呢其實他會跟這一個\n李卓人議員\n李卓人議員\n內政部部長\n強制規定說1999年以前的旅館醫院商場等用途的房屋強制要進行耐震評估那可是因為現在其實我們看到亂角蝦建築的都是一般住宅所以我相信這還是現在最大的問題那我也希望說我們持續的趕快再研擬一些相關的措施來協助好那我們部長跟署長可以先回座我還是請教一下我們消防署的署長\n最後一點時間我來請教一下這個新竹的這一案因為這一案其實大家看完會覺得說有點困惑然後有點覺得說比較比較多爭點到目前這個調查的原因還尚待釐清包括說因為他的起火點是在地下室可是到最後是在高層樓\n請求支援\n感謝委員關心新竹火災我們在第一時間我們的火調人員跟災調會人員都已經到現場開始啟動調查作業那火災的原因事實上剛才委員他的火災的地方只有地下一樓的電纜線間然後往上那往上延燒的範圍也不是很大就是在管道間沒有對外的延燒整個是整個大樓充滿因為電纜線\n今天還是在現場做接續的一個調查\n那當然這個火調還是由地方的消防局去進行啦我覺得調查是一個但我覺得最重要的還是消防員本身的安全因為我們真的很不想看到消防員再殉職了\n消防員可不可以直接適用職安條例?\n是用職安專章那這個我不知道現在我們消防署的看法是什麼是跟委員回報5月15號未完委會在審查公會法的時候有做決議是要消防署現在銜證員在一個月把消防法列入職安專章的條文報到立法院來審議\n那這個條文我們在4月30號已經報到行政院那曾經預計會在立法院的決議把消防法裡面有治安專章的條文列進去那除了治安專章以外呢事實上我們也提列後續治安的5年的中程計畫也就不是光是只有法律而是在執行面我們怎麼參考深耕計畫的配合\n有專業團隊來協助地方政府來強化地方人員的安全當然這個強化不是只有臺灣本身的強化事實上我們職安署勞研所美國日本的經驗我們都融入當成一個推動的一個重點重要項目我想這個跟委員回報那詳細情形如果委需要的話我們再跟著\n黃捷委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:05.117 --> 00:28.538\n好 謝 謝 主 席 欸 部 長 就 沒 有 下 去 了 哈 哈 哈 好 有 請 部 長 沒 關 係 謝 謝 部 長 好 我 今 天 看 了 一 下 跟 今 天 來 的 很 多 委 員 都 穿 球 鞋 跟 牛 仔 褲 這 樣 其 實 是 符 合 我 們 韓 院 長 藐 視 國 會 的 定 義 喔 所 以 好 險 我 今 天 沒 有 穿 球 鞋 好 謝 謝 部 長 我 來 跟 您 請 教 一 下 您 現 在 就 是 這 個 藐 視 國 會 最 通 過 的 您 會 緊 張 嗎\n\n00:32.001 --> 00:59.284\n我 還 是 希 望 因 為 今 天 很 多 新 的 部 會 首 長 都 上 任 了 也 是 安 慰 大 家 鼓 勵 大 家 一 下 因 為 現 在 這 個 法 通 過 了 公 務 員 真 的 人 人 自 危 希 望 大 家 在 位 子 上 都 可 以 安 心 的 做 這 個 工 作 還 是 會 努 力 的 做 大 家 的 後 盾\n\n00:59.904 --> 01:25.127\n好 那 先 請 教 一 下 這 個 軟 腳 蝦 建 築 因 為 這 個 其 實 在 4 月 3 號 花 蓮 地 震 之 後 其 實 很 多 人 都 有 關 心 的 後 續 就 是 上 面 有 一 些 就 是 黃 丹 建 築 的 部 分 那 當 時 我 有 問 到 就 是 當 時 的 部 長 就 是 現 在 這 個 軟 腳 蝦 建 築 的 強 化 耐 震 的 規 範 現 在 我 們 通 知 相 關 民 眾 的 機 制 是 什 麼\n\n01:25.948 --> 01:43.333\n那 當 時 我 問 這 個 前 部 長 他 們 是 跟 我 們 說 1 0 8 年 到 1 1 0 年 有 大 概 的 盤 點 出 來 可 是 到 現 在 其 實 數 字 還 是 不 是 很 明 確 我 想 要 請 教 一 下 部 長 跟 我 們 署 長 現 在 手 上 有 沒 有 相 關 的 資 訊 了 全 國 大 概 有 多 少 棟 的 軟 腳 蝦 建 築 呢 請 署 長 來 先 跟 您 回 應 一 下\n\n01:52.359 --> 02:17.470\n跟 委 員 報 告 我 們 當 時 是 篩 了 三 萬 六 千 多 件 那 大 概 其 中 有 大 概 一 萬 兩 千 多 件 是 屬 於 我 們 大 概 認 定 在 在 結 構 上 是 認 為 是 有 疑 慮 的 那 所 以 當 時 就 把 這 些 資 料 就 通 知 各 縣 市 政 府 請 他 代 為 通 知 這 些 大 樓 的 管 委 會 或 所 有 全 人 讓 他 們 可 以 知 道 說 他 自 己 的 大 樓 本 身 存 在 的 結 構 疑 慮 是 這 個 意 思\n\n02:19.070 --> 02:19.750\n更 穩 報 告 大 概 不 到 1 0 0 棟\n\n02:38.990 --> 03:01.486\n這 就 是 我 現 在 最 擔 心 的 就 是 通 知 歸 通 知 啦 但 是 真 的 願 意 自 己 去 做 內 政 補 強 的 大 樓 或 是 公 寓 或 是 相 關 的 這 個 建 築 其 實 非 常 少 非 常 少 那 我 不 知 道 現 在 國 土 署 有 沒 有 針 對 這 樣 的 情 形 有 沒 有 一 些 再 去 加 強 或 者 是 我 們 還 可 以 怎 麼 進 一 步 的 來\n\n03:03.027 --> 03:27.666\n鼓 勵 民 眾 來 申 請 然 後 或 者 是 說 他 們 自 己 趕 快 針 對 自 己 住 的 環 境 來 做 更 安 全 的 加 強 呢 跟 委 員 報 告 其 實 我 們 大 概 分 兩 個 面 向 第 一 個 當 然 我 們 在 今 年 以 後 我 們 還 是 會 重 新 再 盤 點 把 過 去 快 篩 的 成 果 跟 他 們 現 在 在 執 行 的 方 向 那 如 果 沒 有 的 話 第 一 個 我 們 當 然 還 是 會 持 續\n\n03:28.767 --> 03:47.499\n請 地 方 政 府 要 通 知 他 們 因 為 政 府 有 提 供 補 助 是 出 產 品 的 補 助 是 那 其 實 他 們 只 要 自 己 做 了 出 產 品 自 己 就 可 以 來 做 決 定 要 不 要 往 下 一 階 段 的 耐 震 補 強 或 是 這 個 採 取 重 建 要 去 再 做 我 想 這 一 今 年 我 們 還 是 要 來 做 這 件 事 情 第 二 個 呢 其 實 他 會 跟 這 一 個\n\n03:49.981 --> 03:50.161\n李 卓 人 議 員\n\n04:11.719 --> 04:12.220\n李 卓 人 議 員\n\n04:24.557 --> 04:24.617\n內 政 部 部 長\n\n04:43.423 --> 05:09.841\n強 制 規 定 說 1 9 9 9 年 以 前 的 旅 館 醫 院 商 場 等 用 途 的 房 屋 強 制 要 進 行 耐 震 評 估 那 可 是 因 為 現 在 其 實 我 們 看 到 亂 角 蝦 建 築 的 都 是 一 般 住 宅 所 以 我 相 信 這 還 是 現 在 最 大 的 問 題 那 我 也 希 望 說 我 們 持 續 的 趕 快 再 研 擬 一 些 相 關 的 措 施 來 協 助 好 那 我 們 部 長 跟 署 長 可 以 先 回 座 我 還 是 請 教 一 下 我 們 消 防 署 的 署 長\n\n05:12.111 --> 05:34.222\n最 後 一 點 時 間 我 來 請 教 一 下 這 個 新 竹 的 這 一 案 因 為 這 一 案 其 實 大 家 看 完 會 覺 得 說 有 點 困 惑 然 後 有 點 覺 得 說 比 較 比 較 多 爭 點 到 目 前 這 個 調 查 的 原 因 還 尚 待 釐 清 包 括 說 因 為 他 的 起 火 點 是 在 地 下 室 可 是 到 最 後 是 在 高 層 樓\n\n05:35.603 --> 05:35.783\n請 求 支 援\n\n05:53.001 --> 06:16.128\n感 謝 委 員 關 心 新 竹 火 災 我 們 在 第 一 時 間 我 們 的 火 調 人 員 跟 災 調 會 人 員 都 已 經 到 現 場 開 始 啟 動 調 查 作 業 那 火 災 的 原 因 事 實 上 剛 才 委 員 他 的 火 災 的 地 方 只 有 地 下 一 樓 的 電 纜 線 間 然 後 往 上 那 往 上 延 燒 的 範 圍 也 不 是 很 大 就 是 在 管 道 間 沒 有 對 外 的 延 燒 整 個 是 整 個 大 樓 充 滿 因 為 電 纜 線\n\n06:19.469 --> 06:21.411\n今 天 還 是 在 現 場 做 接 續 的 一 個 調 查\n\n06:53.493 --> 07:05.439\n那 當 然 這 個 火 調 還 是 由 地 方 的 消 防 局 去 進 行 啦 我 覺 得 調 查 是 一 個 但 我 覺 得 最 重 要 的 還 是 消 防 員 本 身 的 安 全 因 為 我 們 真 的 很 不 想 看 到 消 防 員 再 殉 職 了\n\n07:06.320 --> 07:07.462\n消 防 員 可 不 可 以 直 接 適 用 職 安 條 例 ?\n\n07:17.307 --> 07:36.164\n是 用 職 安 專 章 那 這 個 我 不 知 道 現 在 我 們 消 防 署 的 看 法 是 什 麼 是 跟 委 員 回 報 5 月 1 5 號 未 完 委 會 在 審 查 公 會 法 的 時 候 有 做 決 議 是 要 消 防 署 現 在 銜 證 員 在 一 個 月 把 消 防 法 列 入 職 安 專 章 的 條 文 報 到 立 法 院 來 審 議\n\n07:37.245 --> 08:00.874\n那 這 個 條 文 我 們 在 4 月 3 0 號 已 經 報 到 行 政 院 那 曾 經 預 計 會 在 立 法 院 的 決 議 把 消 防 法 裡 面 有 治 安 專 章 的 條 文 列 進 去 那 除 了 治 安 專 章 以 外 呢 事 實 上 我 們 也 提 列 後 續 治 安 的 5 年 的 中 程 計 畫 也 就 不 是 光 是 只 有 法 律 而 是 在 執 行 面 我 們 怎 麼 參 考 深 耕 計 畫 的 配 合\n\n08:01.554 --> 08:21.073\n有 專 業 團 隊 來 協 助 地 方 政 府 來 強 化 地 方 人 員 的 安 全 當 然 這 個 強 化 不 是 只 有 臺 灣 本 身 的 強 化 事 實 上 我 們 職 安 署 勞 研 所 美 國 日 本 的 經 驗 我 們 都 融 入 當 成 一 個 推 動 的 一 個 重 點 重 要 項 目 我 想 這 個 跟 委 員 回 報 那 詳 細 情 形 如 果 委 需 要 的 話 我 們 再 跟 著\n\n08:21.813 --> 08:21.913\n黃 捷 委 員\n\n","segments":[{"start":5.117,"end":28.538,"text":"好 謝謝主席 欸 部長就沒有下去了 哈哈哈好 有請部長沒關係 謝謝部長好 我今天看了一下 跟今天來的很多委員都穿球鞋跟牛仔褲這樣其實是符合我們韓院長藐視國會的定義喔所以 好險我今天沒有穿球鞋好 謝謝部長 我來跟您請教一下您現在就是這個藐視國會最通過的 您會緊張嗎"},{"start":32.001,"end":59.284,"text":"我還是希望因為今天很多新的部會首長都上任了也是安慰大家鼓勵大家一下因為現在這個法通過了公務員真的人人自危希望大家在位子上都可以安心的做這個工作還是會努力的做大家的後盾"},{"start":59.904,"end":85.127,"text":"好那先請教一下這個軟腳蝦建築因為這個其實在4月3號花蓮地震之後其實很多人都有關心的後續就是上面有一些就是黃丹建築的部分那當時我有問到就是當時的部長就是現在這個軟腳蝦建築的強化耐震的規範現在我們通知相關民眾的機制是什麼"},{"start":85.948,"end":103.333,"text":"那當時我問這個前部長他們是跟我們說108年到110年有大概的盤點出來可是到現在其實數字還是不是很明確我想要請教一下部長跟我們署長現在手上有沒有相關的資訊了全國大概有多少棟的軟腳蝦建築呢請署長來先跟您回應一下"},{"start":112.359,"end":137.47,"text":"跟委員報告我們當時是篩了三萬六千多件那大概其中有大概一萬兩千多件是屬於我們大概認定在在結構上是認為是有疑慮的那所以當時就把這些資料就通知各縣市政府請他代為通知這些大樓的管委會或所有全人讓他們可以知道說他自己的大樓本身存在的結構疑慮是這個意思"},{"start":139.07,"end":139.75,"text":"更穩報告大概不到100棟"},{"start":158.99,"end":181.486,"text":"這就是我現在最擔心的就是通知歸通知啦但是真的願意自己去做內政補強的大樓或是公寓或是相關的這個建築其實非常少非常少那我不知道現在國土署有沒有針對這樣的情形有沒有一些再去加強或者是我們還可以怎麼進一步的來"},{"start":183.027,"end":207.666,"text":"鼓勵民眾來申請然後或者是說他們自己趕快針對自己住的環境來做更安全的加強呢跟委員報告其實我們大概分兩個面向第一個當然我們在今年以後我們還是會重新再盤點把過去快篩的成果跟他們現在在執行的方向那如果沒有的話第一個我們當然還是會持續"},{"start":208.767,"end":227.499,"text":"請地方政府要通知他們因為政府有提供補助是出產品的補助是那其實他們只要自己做了出產品自己就可以來做決定要不要往下一階段的耐震補強或是這個採取重建要去再做我想這一今年我們還是要來做這件事情第二個呢其實他會跟這一個"},{"start":229.981,"end":230.161,"text":"李卓人議員"},{"start":251.719,"end":252.22,"text":"李卓人議員"},{"start":264.557,"end":264.617,"text":"內政部部長"},{"start":283.423,"end":309.841,"text":"強制規定說1999年以前的旅館醫院商場等用途的房屋強制要進行耐震評估那可是因為現在其實我們看到亂角蝦建築的都是一般住宅所以我相信這還是現在最大的問題那我也希望說我們持續的趕快再研擬一些相關的措施來協助好那我們部長跟署長可以先回座我還是請教一下我們消防署的署長"},{"start":312.111,"end":334.222,"text":"最後一點時間我來請教一下這個新竹的這一案因為這一案其實大家看完會覺得說有點困惑然後有點覺得說比較比較多爭點到目前這個調查的原因還尚待釐清包括說因為他的起火點是在地下室可是到最後是在高層樓"},{"start":335.603,"end":335.783,"text":"請求支援"},{"start":353.001,"end":376.128,"text":"感謝委員關心新竹火災我們在第一時間我們的火調人員跟災調會人員都已經到現場開始啟動調查作業那火災的原因事實上剛才委員他的火災的地方只有地下一樓的電纜線間然後往上那往上延燒的範圍也不是很大就是在管道間沒有對外的延燒整個是整個大樓充滿因為電纜線"},{"start":379.469,"end":381.411,"text":"今天還是在現場做接續的一個調查"},{"start":413.493,"end":425.439,"text":"那當然這個火調還是由地方的消防局去進行啦我覺得調查是一個但我覺得最重要的還是消防員本身的安全因為我們真的很不想看到消防員再殉職了"},{"start":426.32,"end":427.462,"text":"消防員可不可以直接適用職安條例?"},{"start":437.307,"end":456.164,"text":"是用職安專章那這個我不知道現在我們消防署的看法是什麼是跟委員回報5月15號未完委會在審查公會法的時候有做決議是要消防署現在銜證員在一個月把消防法列入職安專章的條文報到立法院來審議"},{"start":457.245,"end":480.874,"text":"那這個條文我們在4月30號已經報到行政院那曾經預計會在立法院的決議把消防法裡面有治安專章的條文列進去那除了治安專章以外呢事實上我們也提列後續治安的5年的中程計畫也就不是光是只有法律而是在執行面我們怎麼參考深耕計畫的配合"},{"start":481.554,"end":501.073,"text":"有專業團隊來協助地方政府來強化地方人員的安全當然這個強化不是只有臺灣本身的強化事實上我們職安署勞研所美國日本的經驗我們都融入當成一個推動的一個重點重要項目我想這個跟委員回報那詳細情形如果委需要的話我們再跟著"},{"start":501.813,"end":501.913,"text":"黃捷委員"}]}}}}