{"id":153286,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153286","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/2c978e04ca5e1331944f07e23753e46b243e47098157e4f6711abfcd1df00fefdf1ef548a9eaff685ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"徐欣瑩","委員發言時間":"12:48:01 - 12:55:40","影片長度":"00:07:39","會議時間":"2024-05-29T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第14次全體委員會議（事由：邀請農業部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。【5月27日、5月29日及5月30日三天一次會】）","date":"2024-05-29","duration":459,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第14次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":14,"committees":[19],"id":"委員會-11-1-19-14"},"end_time":"2024-05-29T12:55:40+08:00","start_time":"2024-05-29T12:48:01+08:00","features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":1132,"blocks":[["徐委員欣瑩：（12時48分）謝謝主席，本席請部長。"],["主席：再請陳部長。"],["陳部長駿季：委員好。"],["徐委員欣瑩：部長，本席就接著剛剛何委員在講的國土計畫法，其實您剛剛的答詢大概也表達出你知道現在整個落差很大。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：甚至我們地方上都覺得國土計畫法的規劃跟實施不要像教改，你知道教改是怎麼樣嗎？理論跟實際的情形沒有契合。本席是新竹縣第一選區選出來的區域立委，我們地方上非常的憂心，第一個就是，我們的這個國土計畫法在劃的時候到底有沒有瞭解實際的情況？千萬不要天龍國思維，不要只坐在冷氣房裡。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：我們地方反映，特農區的土地應該是良田，但是特農卻沒有水可以灌溉，或已經有蓋建築物的你劃為特農區，接著你劃一個山坡地保育區，但其實那邊全部是平地，你把它列為森林保護區，我們地方上都這種情形，所以你們一定要召開跟地方的，不只是溝通協調，你們要到第一線去瞭解情況。","再來，地方的反映就是我們農地法規已經很嚴格規範了，國土計畫法實施下來只是圖利財團，地方的聲音就是這樣，一直跟我們反映啊！然後第四個，真正想要務農的農民，他的土地不一定被劃為農地，所以地方非常憂心。以上這幾點，我做這樣的反映，我們希望部長能夠積極作為，對於我們地方的這些疑慮，還有這種不符合的，就是你的想法、你的計畫跟現實脫節的，你一定要想辦法改進。"],["陳部長駿季：我可不可以回答？"],["徐委員欣瑩：我的時間有限，我看你用書面回答好了，好不好？好。","再來，本席想要請益的就是，新竹沿海很多人養魚嘛，但我們現在新竹沿海變成什麼，你知道嗎？魚的墳場！為什麼變成魚的墳場，部長，你要不要猜看看？"],["陳部長駿季：這個我不是非常瞭解，我是不是可以請漁業署署長來說明。"],["徐委員欣瑩：好，署長有沒有瞭解？應該非常豐沛的魚群，結果全部變魚的墳場，你知道什麼原因嗎？"],["張署長致盛：可能要請委員說明的更清楚是指哪一個部分。"],["徐委員欣瑩：就我們的漁場啊，應該是漁場的，結果變成魚的墳場，因為我們有太多的魚礁，漁網被魚礁卡住，然後沒有清理，當然本席知道我們漁業署有經費，海保署也有，漁業署的部分，今天農業部在這裡，我要特別講，我們地方漁民的反映就是，都只是清表面的，就是做個意思意思、表面功夫、敷衍，多年下來漁網被魚礁整個困住，結果這些漁網就把魚全部弄死了，所以漁場變魚的墳場，對於這個情況，我要為新竹縣沿海新豐、竹北這裡請命，是不是可以請漁業署來協助？"],["陳部長駿季：我想整個你剛才講的墳場的部分，我現在的瞭解就是說，很多魚礁因為其他這些海洋垃圾，包括漁網這個東西，你如果沒有順利清除的時候，會讓漁業的資源越來越少。"],["徐委員欣瑩：對、對、對。"],["陳部長駿季：相對的，漁業署每年都有編一些經費去處理，如果不夠的地方，針對這個部分，我想也請漁業署這邊專案去瞭解，如果經費不夠的地方，我想我們要清除就應該要儘快啦！"],["徐委員欣瑩：對！而且不要每年做一點、做一點，等於沒清。"],["陳部長駿季：是。"],["徐委員欣瑩：而那些魚，你看這麼多年下來，我們豐沛的海洋生態，整個就被我們人為這樣破壞了。"],["陳部長駿季：對。另外一個重點就是，現在新的刺網實名制……"],["徐委員欣瑩：對、對、對，這個有在實施。"],["陳部長駿季：這個部分在做了以後，相對的，如果有實名制的時候，很容易抓到。"],["徐委員欣瑩：對、對、對。"],["陳部長駿季：所以源頭減少是一件事情，已經存在的，我們會努力去處理。"],["徐委員欣瑩：好。主席，不好意思，最後再30秒。我們也要肯定農業部剛剛修正了農業天然災害救助辦法，因為養蜂的產業，我相信我們的農民都是靠天吃飯，當然不只養蜂產業，但是我今天特別要講的就是蜂蜜、養蜂的蜂農，他們也是因為氣候，該冷的時候不冷，該有雨水的時候沒有雨水，所以他們也很辛苦，我們瞭解到這次好像是一箱補助他們450元，是不是？"],["陳部長駿季：跟委員說明，過去天然災害沒有這一項，但是這次我們把……"],["徐委員欣瑩：對，但是那是過去的疏失，不是代表沒有就應該。"],["陳部長駿季：對，我知道，所以我們該改進我們就改進，就是說當蜜蜂沒有蜜源的時候，這其實就是一種間接性的天然災害，所以我們已經納入我們的天然災害救助辦法，今天正在開專案會議，如果專案會議通過的話，我們就會正式公告為受災的一個情況。"],["徐委員欣瑩：本席想請命的是，為我們民眾、蜂農請命的是，你一箱補助450元，這根本還是不到他們成本的三分之一啊！其實他們也是受害者啦！所以這一塊有沒有可能再加強？"],["陳部長駿季：這個費用的部分，其實我們在內部討論有邀請這些蜂農的協會，他們大概對這個一箱的價格是認同的。"],["徐委員欣瑩：這樣子啊！"],["陳部長駿季：因為天然災害救助本身是救助他的成本的20%，不是說他的營業損失。"],["徐委員欣瑩：當然、當然、當然。"],["陳部長駿季：所以這個價格其實我們有透過這些蜜蜂的相關協會，他們覺得這是合理的。"],["徐委員欣瑩：關於這一塊，我們站在農民……因為之前我在當第8屆立委的時候，像柑橘也是落果嘛！這也是天然災害，這個我們還是要想辦法給農民……因為農民生活真的滿辛苦的，好不好？"],["陳部長駿季：我瞭解、我瞭解、我瞭解。"],["徐委員欣瑩：所以這部分如果可以的話，我們多幫農民啦！"],["陳部長駿季：對啦！我們有一個機制，然後相關的這些補助、救助的金額，我們也會先讓蜂農他們那邊產業，特別是協會這邊，他們如果認同，基本上大概比較不會有問題。"],["徐委員欣瑩：好、OK，謝謝部長、謝謝主席。"],["陳部長駿季：謝謝您。"],["主席：所以我們農業的挑戰很大，誰也沒有想到蜜蜂採不到蜜，因為它沒有辦法開花，所以這個連貫的，樹是可以補助，蜜則沒辦法，所以這個就是要請部長做韌性農業全體的一個調整，謝謝。","接下來我們請陳秀寳委員、陳秀寳、陳秀寳委員。","我們請洪孟楷委員、洪孟楷、洪孟楷委員。","我們請林德福委員、林德福、林德福委員。","我們請王美惠委員、王美惠、王美惠委員。","我們請林楚茵委員、林楚茵、林楚茵委員。","我們請羅智強委員、羅智強、羅智強委員。","我們請羅明才委員、羅明才、羅明才委員。","我們請陳冠廷委員、陳冠廷、陳冠廷委員。","我們請游顥委員、游顥、游顥委員。","我們請李柏毅委員、李柏毅、李柏毅委員。","登記發言的委員除了不在場之外，其餘的都已經發言完畢，詢答結束。我們有林國成委員、劉建國委員、林俊憲委員、陳冠廷委員所提書面質詢列入紀錄，刊登公報。書面質詢以及未及答復的部分請相關單位於1週之內以書面答復並副知本會。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":346,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-19-14","speakers":["楊瓊瓔","陳亭妃","林岱樺","張啓楷","邱議瑩","鄭正鈐","鄭天財Sra 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的 答 詢 大 概 也 表 達 也 知 道 現 在 整 個 落 差 很 大 甚 至 我 們 地 方 上 都 覺 得 你 這 國 土 計 劃 法 的 規 劃 跟 實 施 不 要 像 教 改 你 知 道 教 改 是 怎 麼 樣 嗎\n\n3\n00:00:42,808 --> 00:01:06,562\n理 論 跟 實 際 的 情 形 沒 有 契 合 本 席 在 這 裡 本 席 是 新 竹 縣 第 一 選 區 選 出 來 的 區 域 的 立 委 我 們 地 方 上 非 常 的 憂 心 第 一 個 就 是 說 我 們 在 國 土 計 畫 法 你 在 畫 的 時 候 到 底 有 沒 有 瞭 解 實 際 的 情 況 千 萬 不 要 天 龍 國 思 維 不 要 坐 在 冷 氣 房 裡\n\n4\n00:01:07,623 --> 00:01:31,332\n我 們 地 方 就 反 映 特 農 區 特 農 應 該 是 糧 田 但 是 呢 特 農 他 卻 沒 有 水 可 以 灌 溉 或 已 經 有 蓋 建 築 物 你 化 為 特 農 區 那 你 接 著 你 化 一 個 山 坡 地 保 育 區 其 實 那 邊 全 部 是 平 地 你 把 它 列 為 森 林 保 護 區 我 們 地 方 上 這 個 都 這 種 情 形 一 定 要\n\n5\n00:01:32,492 --> 00:01:32,752\n徐 欣 瑩 ．\n\n6\n00:01:50,960 --> 00:02:04,870\n實 施 下 來 只 是 徒 立 財 團 地 方 聲 音 就 是 這 樣 一 直 跟 我 們 反 映 第 4 個 真 正 想 要 務 農 的 農 民 他 的 土 地 不 一 定 被 劃 為 農 地 所 以 地 方 非 常 憂 心\n\n7\n00:02:05,851 --> 00:02:24,176\n所 以 這 幾 點 我 們 這 樣 子 來 反 映 我 們 希 望 部 長 您 能 夠 積 極 的 來 作 為 然 後 讓 我 們 地 方 這 些 的 疑 慮 還 有 這 些 這 種 不 符 合 你 的 想 法 、 你 的 計 畫 跟 現 實 脫 節 的 你 一 定 要 想 辦 法 改 進\n\n8\n00:02:28,816 --> 00:02:47,431\n我 的 時 間 我 看 你 書 面 回 答 好 了 好 不 好 那 再 來 就 是 本 席 想 要 請 議 就 是 我 們 新 竹 沿 海 很 多 的 這 個 養 魚 嘛 就 沿 海 很 多 的 養 魚 結 果 我 們 現 在 新 竹 沿 海 變 成 什 麼 魚 的 墳 場 為 什 麼 變 成 魚 的 墳 場 部 長 你 要 不 要 猜 看 看\n\n9\n00:02:56,798 --> 00:03:09,835\n數 長 可 不 可 以 了 解 我 應 該 是 非 常 豐 沛 的 這 個 魚 群 結 果 全 部 變 魚 的 墳 場 你 知 道 什 麼 原 因 嗎 可 能 要 請 委 員 說 明 的 更 清 楚 是 指 哪 一 個 部 分\n\n10\n00:03:10,716 --> 00:03:35,730\n就 我 們 的 漁 場 啊 應 該 是 漁 場 結 果 都 是 魚 的 墳 場 因 為 我 們 有 太 多 的 漁 礁 把 漁 網 被 漁 礁 卡 住 然 後 呢 沒 有 請 當 然 本 席 知 道 我 們 漁 業 署 有 經 費 但 是 那 個 叫 海 保 署 他 們 也 有 那 漁 業 署 的 部 分 所 以 我 今 天 農 業 部 在 這 我 要 特 別 講\n\n11\n00:03:37,527 --> 00:04:00,101\n我 們 地 方 漁 民 的 反 應 就 是 都 是 清 表 面 的 就 是 做 個 意 思 意 思 表 面 功 夫 敷 衍 多 年 下 來 漁 網 被 漁 就 是 漁 礁 整 個 困 住 結 果 這 些 漁 網 呢 就 把 魚 全 部 弄 死 了 所 以 漁 場 變 漁 的 墳 場 這 個 情 況 我 為 新 竹 縣 我 們 的 沿 海 、 新 峰\n\n12\n00:04:22,196 --> 00:04:22,296\n對 ﹖ 而 且\n\n13\n00:04:40,803 --> 00:04:41,003\n對 , 對 , 對 , 這 個 有 在 實 施 。\n\n14\n00:05:08,714 --> 00:05:35,010\n主 席 不 好 意 思 我 們 最 後 再 3 0 秒 就 是 有 關 我 想 這 個 我 們 也 要 肯 定 我 們 農 業 部 剛 修 正 了 這 個 農 業 天 然 災 害 救 助 辦 法 因 為 養 蜂 養 蜂 的 產 業 我 相 信 我 們 的 農 民 都 是 靠 天 吃 飯 當 然 不 只 養 蜂 產 業 但 是 我 今 天 特 別 講 的 就 是 蜂 蜜 養 蜂 的 蜂 農 他 們 也 是 因 為 氣 候 該 冷 的 時 候 不 冷\n\n15\n00:05:36,791 --> 00:06:05,317\n該 有 雨 水 的 時 候 沒 有 雨 水 所 以 他 們 也 很 辛 苦 那 我 們 了 解 到 這 一 次 好 像 是 一 箱 是 補 助 他 們 4 5 0 元 是 不 是 ? 那 我 可 以 說 明 過 去 天 然 災 害 沒 有 這 一 項 但 是 這 一 次 我 們 把 那 是 過 去 的 疏 失 不 是 代 表 沒 有 就 應 該 所 以 我 們 該 改 進 我 們 就 改 進 了 就 是 說 當 蜜 蜂 沒 有 蜜 園 的 時 候 它 其 實 就 是 一 種 間 接 性 的 天 然 災 害 所 以 我 們 已 經 納 入 我 們 的 天 然 災 害 救 助 辦 法\n\n16\n00:06:05,757 --> 00:06:20,165\n那 今 天 正 在 開 專 案 會 議 是 如 果 專 案 會 議 通 過 的 話 我 們 就 會 公 告 正 式 公 告 為 受 災 的 一 個 情 況 那 本 席 想 請 命 的 就 是 為 我 們 民 眾 蜂 擁 請 命 就 是 你 一 箱 4 5 0 元 他 們 根 本 還 是\n\n17\n00:06:22,947 --> 00:06:26,608\n這 個 費 用 的 部 分 其 實 我 們 在 內 部 討 論 其 實 有 邀 請 的 這 些 蜂 農 的 協 會 他 們 大 概 對 這 個 的 一 項 的 這 個 價 格 他 們 覺 得 是 認 同 的\n\n18\n00:06:43,478 --> 00:07:01,172\n因 為 天 然 災 害 救 助 本 身 他 是 救 助 他 的 一 個 成 本 的 2 0 % 不 是 說 他 的 營 業 損 失 當 然 當 然 所 以 這 個 價 格 其 實 我 們 有 透 過 這 些 蜜 蜂 的 相 關 的 那 個 協 會 他 們 覺 得 說 這 是 一 個 合 理 的\n\n19\n00:07:01,852 --> 00:07:02,653\n我 了 解 我 了 解\n\n20\n00:07:18,148 --> 00:07:18,248\n謝 謝 部 長 、 謝 謝 主 席\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n163\t18540\t委員請做宣達。謝謝主席。本席請部長。我們再請陳部長。委員好。\n19782\t41748\t部長本席就接著剛剛何委員的在講這個國土計劃法其實您剛剛的答詢大概也表達也知道現在整個落差很大甚至我們地方上都覺得你這國土計劃法的規劃跟實施不要像教改你知道教改是怎麼樣嗎\n42808\t66562\t理論跟實際的情形沒有契合本席在這裡本席是新竹縣第一選區選出來的區域的立委我們地方上非常的憂心第一個就是說我們在國土計畫法你在畫的時候到底有沒有瞭解實際的情況千萬不要天龍國思維不要坐在冷氣房裡\n67623\t91332\t我們地方就反映特農區特農應該是糧田但是呢特農他卻沒有水可以灌溉或已經有蓋建築物你化為特農區那你接著你化一個山坡地保育區其實那邊全部是平地你把它列為森林保護區我們地方上這個都這種情形一定要\n92492\t92752\t徐欣瑩．\n110960\t124870\t實施下來只是徒立財團地方聲音就是這樣一直跟我們反映第4個真正想要務農的農民他的土地不一定被劃為農地所以地方非常憂心\n125851\t144176\t所以這幾點我們這樣子來反映我們希望部長您能夠積極的來作為然後讓我們地方這些的疑慮還有這些這種不符合你的想法、你的計畫跟現實脫節的你一定要想辦法改進\n148816\t167431\t我的時間我看你書面回答好了好不好那再來就是本席想要請議就是我們新竹沿海很多的這個養魚嘛就沿海很多的養魚結果我們現在新竹沿海變成什麼魚的墳場為什麼變成魚的墳場部長你要不要猜看看\n176798\t189835\t數長可不可以了解我應該是非常豐沛的這個魚群結果全部變魚的墳場你知道什麼原因嗎可能要請委員說明的更清楚是指哪一個部分\n190716\t215730\t就我們的漁場啊應該是漁場結果都是魚的墳場因為我們有太多的漁礁把漁網被漁礁卡住然後呢沒有請當然本席知道我們漁業署有經費但是那個叫海保署他們也有那漁業署的部分所以我今天農業部在這我要特別講\n217527\t240101\t我們地方漁民的反應就是都是清表面的就是做個意思意思表面功夫敷衍多年下來漁網被漁就是漁礁整個困住結果這些漁網呢就把魚全部弄死了所以漁場變漁的墳場這個情況我為新竹縣我們的沿海、新峰\n246425\t262176\t對﹖\n262196\t262296\t對﹖而且\n280803\t281003\t對,對,對,這個有在實施。\n308714\t335010\t主席不好意思我們最後再30秒就是有關我想這個我們也要肯定我們農業部剛修正了這個農業天然災害救助辦法因為養蜂養蜂的產業我相信我們的農民都是靠天吃飯當然不只養蜂產業但是我今天特別講的就是蜂蜜養蜂的蜂農他們也是因為氣候該冷的時候不冷\n336791\t365317\t該有雨水的時候沒有雨水所以他們也很辛苦那我們了解到這一次好像是一箱是補助他們450元是不是?那我可以說明過去天然災害沒有這一項但是這一次我們把那是過去的疏失不是代表沒有就應該所以我們該改進我們就改進了就是說當蜜蜂沒有蜜園的時候它其實就是一種間接性的天然災害所以我們已經納入我們的天然災害救助辦法\n365757\t380165\t那今天正在開專案會議 是如果專案會議通過的話我們就會公告正式公告為受災的一個情況那本席想請命的就是為我們民眾蜂擁請命就是你一箱450元他們根本還是\n382947\t386608\t這個費用的部分其實我們在內部討論其實有邀請的這些蜂農的協會他們大概對這個的一項的這個價格他們覺得是認同的\n403478\t421172\t因為天然災害救助本身他是救助他的一個成本的20%不是說他的營業損失當然當然所以這個價格其實我們有透過這些蜜蜂的相關的那個協會他們覺得說這是一個合理的\n421852\t422653\t我了解我了解\n438148\t438248\t謝謝部長、謝謝主席\n","txt":"委員請做宣達。謝謝主席。本席請部長。我們再請陳部長。委員好。\n部長本席就接著剛剛何委員的在講這個國土計劃法其實您剛剛的答詢大概也表達也知道現在整個落差很大甚至我們地方上都覺得你這國土計劃法的規劃跟實施不要像教改你知道教改是怎麼樣嗎\n理論跟實際的情形沒有契合本席在這裡本席是新竹縣第一選區選出來的區域的立委我們地方上非常的憂心第一個就是說我們在國土計畫法你在畫的時候到底有沒有瞭解實際的情況千萬不要天龍國思維不要坐在冷氣房裡\n我們地方就反映特農區特農應該是糧田但是呢特農他卻沒有水可以灌溉或已經有蓋建築物你化為特農區那你接著你化一個山坡地保育區其實那邊全部是平地你把它列為森林保護區我們地方上這個都這種情形一定要\n徐欣瑩．\n實施下來只是徒立財團地方聲音就是這樣一直跟我們反映第4個真正想要務農的農民他的土地不一定被劃為農地所以地方非常憂心\n所以這幾點我們這樣子來反映我們希望部長您能夠積極的來作為然後讓我們地方這些的疑慮還有這些這種不符合你的想法、你的計畫跟現實脫節的你一定要想辦法改進\n我的時間我看你書面回答好了好不好那再來就是本席想要請議就是我們新竹沿海很多的這個養魚嘛就沿海很多的養魚結果我們現在新竹沿海變成什麼魚的墳場為什麼變成魚的墳場部長你要不要猜看看\n數長可不可以了解我應該是非常豐沛的這個魚群結果全部變魚的墳場你知道什麼原因嗎可能要請委員說明的更清楚是指哪一個部分\n就我們的漁場啊應該是漁場結果都是魚的墳場因為我們有太多的漁礁把漁網被漁礁卡住然後呢沒有請當然本席知道我們漁業署有經費但是那個叫海保署他們也有那漁業署的部分所以我今天農業部在這我要特別講\n我們地方漁民的反應就是都是清表面的就是做個意思意思表面功夫敷衍多年下來漁網被漁就是漁礁整個困住結果這些漁網呢就把魚全部弄死了所以漁場變漁的墳場這個情況我為新竹縣我們的沿海、新峰\n對﹖\n對﹖而且\n對,對,對,這個有在實施。\n主席不好意思我們最後再30秒就是有關我想這個我們也要肯定我們農業部剛修正了這個農業天然災害救助辦法因為養蜂養蜂的產業我相信我們的農民都是靠天吃飯當然不只養蜂產業但是我今天特別講的就是蜂蜜養蜂的蜂農他們也是因為氣候該冷的時候不冷\n該有雨水的時候沒有雨水所以他們也很辛苦那我們了解到這一次好像是一箱是補助他們450元是不是?那我可以說明過去天然災害沒有這一項但是這一次我們把那是過去的疏失不是代表沒有就應該所以我們該改進我們就改進了就是說當蜜蜂沒有蜜園的時候它其實就是一種間接性的天然災害所以我們已經納入我們的天然災害救助辦法\n那今天正在開專案會議 是如果專案會議通過的話我們就會公告正式公告為受災的一個情況那本席想請命的就是為我們民眾蜂擁請命就是你一箱450元他們根本還是\n這個費用的部分其實我們在內部討論其實有邀請的這些蜂農的協會他們大概對這個的一項的這個價格他們覺得是認同的\n因為天然災害救助本身他是救助他的一個成本的20%不是說他的營業損失當然當然所以這個價格其實我們有透過這些蜜蜂的相關的那個協會他們覺得說這是一個合理的\n我了解我了解\n謝謝部長、謝謝主席\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.163 --> 00:18.540\n委 員 請 做 宣 達 。 謝 謝 主 席 。 本 席 請 部 長 。 我 們 再 請 陳 部 長 。 委 員 好 。\n\n00:19.782 --> 00:41.748\n部 長 本 席 就 接 著 剛 剛 何 委 員 的 在 講 這 個 國 土 計 劃 法 其 實 您 剛 剛 的 答 詢 大 概 也 表 達 也 知 道 現 在 整 個 落 差 很 大 甚 至 我 們 地 方 上 都 覺 得 你 這 國 土 計 劃 法 的 規 劃 跟 實 施 不 要 像 教 改 你 知 道 教 改 是 怎 麼 樣 嗎\n\n00:42.808 --> 01:06.562\n理 論 跟 實 際 的 情 形 沒 有 契 合 本 席 在 這 裡 本 席 是 新 竹 縣 第 一 選 區 選 出 來 的 區 域 的 立 委 我 們 地 方 上 非 常 的 憂 心 第 一 個 就 是 說 我 們 在 國 土 計 畫 法 你 在 畫 的 時 候 到 底 有 沒 有 瞭 解 實 際 的 情 況 千 萬 不 要 天 龍 國 思 維 不 要 坐 在 冷 氣 房 裡\n\n01:07.623 --> 01:31.332\n我 們 地 方 就 反 映 特 農 區 特 農 應 該 是 糧 田 但 是 呢 特 農 他 卻 沒 有 水 可 以 灌 溉 或 已 經 有 蓋 建 築 物 你 化 為 特 農 區 那 你 接 著 你 化 一 個 山 坡 地 保 育 區 其 實 那 邊 全 部 是 平 地 你 把 它 列 為 森 林 保 護 區 我 們 地 方 上 這 個 都 這 種 情 形 一 定 要\n\n01:32.492 --> 01:32.752\n徐 欣 瑩 ．\n\n01:50.960 --> 02:04.870\n實 施 下 來 只 是 徒 立 財 團 地 方 聲 音 就 是 這 樣 一 直 跟 我 們 反 映 第 4 個 真 正 想 要 務 農 的 農 民 他 的 土 地 不 一 定 被 劃 為 農 地 所 以 地 方 非 常 憂 心\n\n02:05.851 --> 02:24.176\n所 以 這 幾 點 我 們 這 樣 子 來 反 映 我 們 希 望 部 長 您 能 夠 積 極 的 來 作 為 然 後 讓 我 們 地 方 這 些 的 疑 慮 還 有 這 些 這 種 不 符 合 你 的 想 法 、 你 的 計 畫 跟 現 實 脫 節 的 你 一 定 要 想 辦 法 改 進\n\n02:28.816 --> 02:47.431\n我 的 時 間 我 看 你 書 面 回 答 好 了 好 不 好 那 再 來 就 是 本 席 想 要 請 議 就 是 我 們 新 竹 沿 海 很 多 的 這 個 養 魚 嘛 就 沿 海 很 多 的 養 魚 結 果 我 們 現 在 新 竹 沿 海 變 成 什 麼 魚 的 墳 場 為 什 麼 變 成 魚 的 墳 場 部 長 你 要 不 要 猜 看 看\n\n02:56.798 --> 03:09.835\n數 長 可 不 可 以 了 解 我 應 該 是 非 常 豐 沛 的 這 個 魚 群 結 果 全 部 變 魚 的 墳 場 你 知 道 什 麼 原 因 嗎 可 能 要 請 委 員 說 明 的 更 清 楚 是 指 哪 一 個 部 分\n\n03:10.716 --> 03:35.730\n就 我 們 的 漁 場 啊 應 該 是 漁 場 結 果 都 是 魚 的 墳 場 因 為 我 們 有 太 多 的 漁 礁 把 漁 網 被 漁 礁 卡 住 然 後 呢 沒 有 請 當 然 本 席 知 道 我 們 漁 業 署 有 經 費 但 是 那 個 叫 海 保 署 他 們 也 有 那 漁 業 署 的 部 分 所 以 我 今 天 農 業 部 在 這 我 要 特 別 講\n\n03:37.527 --> 04:00.101\n我 們 地 方 漁 民 的 反 應 就 是 都 是 清 表 面 的 就 是 做 個 意 思 意 思 表 面 功 夫 敷 衍 多 年 下 來 漁 網 被 漁 就 是 漁 礁 整 個 困 住 結 果 這 些 漁 網 呢 就 把 魚 全 部 弄 死 了 所 以 漁 場 變 漁 的 墳 場 這 個 情 況 我 為 新 竹 縣 我 們 的 沿 海 、 新 峰\n\n04:22.196 --> 04:22.296\n對 ﹖ 而 且\n\n04:40.803 --> 04:41.003\n對 , 對 , 對 , 這 個 有 在 實 施 。\n\n05:08.714 --> 05:35.010\n主 席 不 好 意 思 我 們 最 後 再 3 0 秒 就 是 有 關 我 想 這 個 我 們 也 要 肯 定 我 們 農 業 部 剛 修 正 了 這 個 農 業 天 然 災 害 救 助 辦 法 因 為 養 蜂 養 蜂 的 產 業 我 相 信 我 們 的 農 民 都 是 靠 天 吃 飯 當 然 不 只 養 蜂 產 業 但 是 我 今 天 特 別 講 的 就 是 蜂 蜜 養 蜂 的 蜂 農 他 們 也 是 因 為 氣 候 該 冷 的 時 候 不 冷\n\n05:36.791 --> 06:05.317\n該 有 雨 水 的 時 候 沒 有 雨 水 所 以 他 們 也 很 辛 苦 那 我 們 了 解 到 這 一 次 好 像 是 一 箱 是 補 助 他 們 4 5 0 元 是 不 是 ? 那 我 可 以 說 明 過 去 天 然 災 害 沒 有 這 一 項 但 是 這 一 次 我 們 把 那 是 過 去 的 疏 失 不 是 代 表 沒 有 就 應 該 所 以 我 們 該 改 進 我 們 就 改 進 了 就 是 說 當 蜜 蜂 沒 有 蜜 園 的 時 候 它 其 實 就 是 一 種 間 接 性 的 天 然 災 害 所 以 我 們 已 經 納 入 我 們 的 天 然 災 害 救 助 辦 法\n\n06:05.757 --> 06:20.165\n那 今 天 正 在 開 專 案 會 議 是 如 果 專 案 會 議 通 過 的 話 我 們 就 會 公 告 正 式 公 告 為 受 災 的 一 個 情 況 那 本 席 想 請 命 的 就 是 為 我 們 民 眾 蜂 擁 請 命 就 是 你 一 箱 4 5 0 元 他 們 根 本 還 是\n\n06:22.947 --> 06:26.608\n這 個 費 用 的 部 分 其 實 我 們 在 內 部 討 論 其 實 有 邀 請 的 這 些 蜂 農 的 協 會 他 們 大 概 對 這 個 的 一 項 的 這 個 價 格 他 們 覺 得 是 認 同 的\n\n06:43.478 --> 07:01.172\n因 為 天 然 災 害 救 助 本 身 他 是 救 助 他 的 一 個 成 本 的 2 0 % 不 是 說 他 的 營 業 損 失 當 然 當 然 所 以 這 個 價 格 其 實 我 們 有 透 過 這 些 蜜 蜂 的 相 關 的 那 個 協 會 他 們 覺 得 說 這 是 一 個 合 理 的\n\n07:01.852 --> 07:02.653\n我 了 解 我 了 解\n\n07:18.148 --> 07:18.248\n謝 謝 部 長 、 謝 謝 主 席\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.163,"end":18.54,"text":"委員請做宣達。謝謝主席。本席請部長。我們再請陳部長。委員好。"},{"start":19.782,"end":41.748,"text":"部長本席就接著剛剛何委員的在講這個國土計劃法其實您剛剛的答詢大概也表達也知道現在整個落差很大甚至我們地方上都覺得你這國土計劃法的規劃跟實施不要像教改你知道教改是怎麼樣嗎"},{"start":42.808,"end":66.562,"text":"理論跟實際的情形沒有契合本席在這裡本席是新竹縣第一選區選出來的區域的立委我們地方上非常的憂心第一個就是說我們在國土計畫法你在畫的時候到底有沒有瞭解實際的情況千萬不要天龍國思維不要坐在冷氣房裡"},{"start":67.623,"end":91.332,"text":"我們地方就反映特農區特農應該是糧田但是呢特農他卻沒有水可以灌溉或已經有蓋建築物你化為特農區那你接著你化一個山坡地保育區其實那邊全部是平地你把它列為森林保護區我們地方上這個都這種情形一定要"},{"start":92.492,"end":92.752,"text":"徐欣瑩．"},{"start":110.96,"end":124.87,"text":"實施下來只是徒立財團地方聲音就是這樣一直跟我們反映第4個真正想要務農的農民他的土地不一定被劃為農地所以地方非常憂心"},{"start":125.851,"end":144.176,"text":"所以這幾點我們這樣子來反映我們希望部長您能夠積極的來作為然後讓我們地方這些的疑慮還有這些這種不符合你的想法、你的計畫跟現實脫節的你一定要想辦法改進"},{"start":148.816,"end":167.431,"text":"我的時間我看你書面回答好了好不好那再來就是本席想要請議就是我們新竹沿海很多的這個養魚嘛就沿海很多的養魚結果我們現在新竹沿海變成什麼魚的墳場為什麼變成魚的墳場部長你要不要猜看看"},{"start":176.798,"end":189.835,"text":"數長可不可以了解我應該是非常豐沛的這個魚群結果全部變魚的墳場你知道什麼原因嗎可能要請委員說明的更清楚是指哪一個部分"},{"start":190.716,"end":215.73,"text":"就我們的漁場啊應該是漁場結果都是魚的墳場因為我們有太多的漁礁把漁網被漁礁卡住然後呢沒有請當然本席知道我們漁業署有經費但是那個叫海保署他們也有那漁業署的部分所以我今天農業部在這我要特別講"},{"start":217.527,"end":240.101,"text":"我們地方漁民的反應就是都是清表面的就是做個意思意思表面功夫敷衍多年下來漁網被漁就是漁礁整個困住結果這些漁網呢就把魚全部弄死了所以漁場變漁的墳場這個情況我為新竹縣我們的沿海、新峰"},{"start":246.425,"end":262.176,"text":"對﹖"},{"start":262.196,"end":262.296,"text":"對﹖而且"},{"start":280.803,"end":281.003,"text":"對,對,對,這個有在實施。"},{"start":308.714,"end":335.01,"text":"主席不好意思我們最後再30秒就是有關我想這個我們也要肯定我們農業部剛修正了這個農業天然災害救助辦法因為養蜂養蜂的產業我相信我們的農民都是靠天吃飯當然不只養蜂產業但是我今天特別講的就是蜂蜜養蜂的蜂農他們也是因為氣候該冷的時候不冷"},{"start":336.791,"end":365.317,"text":"該有雨水的時候沒有雨水所以他們也很辛苦那我們了解到這一次好像是一箱是補助他們450元是不是?那我可以說明過去天然災害沒有這一項但是這一次我們把那是過去的疏失不是代表沒有就應該所以我們該改進我們就改進了就是說當蜜蜂沒有蜜園的時候它其實就是一種間接性的天然災害所以我們已經納入我們的天然災害救助辦法"},{"start":365.757,"end":380.165,"text":"那今天正在開專案會議 是如果專案會議通過的話我們就會公告正式公告為受災的一個情況那本席想請命的就是為我們民眾蜂擁請命就是你一箱450元他們根本還是"},{"start":382.947,"end":386.608,"text":"這個費用的部分其實我們在內部討論其實有邀請的這些蜂農的協會他們大概對這個的一項的這個價格他們覺得是認同的"},{"start":403.478,"end":421.172,"text":"因為天然災害救助本身他是救助他的一個成本的20%不是說他的營業損失當然當然所以這個價格其實我們有透過這些蜜蜂的相關的那個協會他們覺得說這是一個合理的"},{"start":421.852,"end":422.653,"text":"我了解我了解"},{"start":438.148,"end":438.248,"text":"謝謝部長、謝謝主席"}]}}}}