{"id":153375,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153375","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/bbbc431469b8aebaed9db607d2729fbf4622ddde1e3527b9446d6a815e91374468c8e8e800dff9935ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"李彥秀","委員發言時間":"10:52:51 - 11:03:46","影片長度":"00:10:55","會議時間":"2024-05-30T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第15次全體委員會議（事由：邀請財政部莊部長翠雲、金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆率所屬相關單位就「如何精進ESG制度評鑑、永續報告書及公司治理評鑑制度，並導引金融機構落實放貸及貸後管理工作」進行專題報告，並備質詢。）","date":"2024-05-30","start_time":"2024-05-30T10:52:51+08:00","end_time":"2024-05-30T11:03:46+08:00","duration":655,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第15次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":15,"committees":[20],"id":"委員會-11-1-20-15"},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":559,"blocks":[["李委員彥秀：（10時52分）感謝召委，我可不可以邀請主委跟莊部長。"],["主席：有請彭主委、莊部長。"],["李委員彥秀：今天兩位都在，非常好，我先延續一下剛才李委員的問題，有關三商美邦跟新壽的部分。剛才主委的態度也說明得很清楚，這兩家都在這個月送出他們的財務改善計畫了，那我想請問一下彭主委，財務改善計畫送出來之後，接下來如果他們努力了，但是仍舊沒有辦法達到適足率RBC百分之兩百的話，那你們的作法會是什麼？您的作法會是什麼？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我們現在所有的步驟都是根據保險法裡面對於資本不足分級管理的步驟來做，我們不預期未來它的結果如何，我們就按照這樣的階段，其實我們過去已經有非常明確的步驟來做這件事情。"],["李委員彥秀：我知道過去黃主委有非常清楚的步驟在處理，那後續它努力了，你會再給一些時間嗎？後續包括金控合併的部分，因為最近您上任之前這段時間，金控也非常的熱鬧，一下子傳哪一個金控跟哪一個金控合併，這兩天新聞都好多，所以金控合併跟改善體質這兩件事情，您的立場是什麼？"],["彭主任委員金隆：根據保險法的規定，我們依法請它提出各種改善計畫，這本來就是各家公司的……"],["李委員彥秀：那如果藉由合併改善體質，你的態度呢？"],["彭主任委員金隆：我剛才提到過，合併不會立刻改善它的情況，因為合併只會把……"],["李委員彥秀：那你會同意合併嗎？藉由合併來達到RBC百分之兩百的目標嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：合併這部分我們尊重市場機制，但是合併它一定會仔細分析其利弊得失，我們在做……"],["李委員彥秀：我清楚，它也會跟你們溝通。那如果在第一個階段沒有辦法達到的話，你們會給予更多的監理寬容嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：監理寬容是一致性的啦，不會針對各家公司而做。"],["李委員彥秀：我知道，我問的就是這兩家，你會給更多的監理寬容？因為他們現在已經提出他們的改善計畫，可能沒有辦法一步到位，後續你們的態度是什麼，你的態度是什麼？"],["彭主任委員金隆：跟委員報告一下，比如說，我們依法請他們在一定時限內提供所謂的改善計畫，這是法律定的，這並不是寬容措施，這個就是我們過去……"],["李委員彥秀：我知道，要達到。如果他們提後續包括金控合併來改善壽險體質的方法，您支持嗎？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這要看具體的計畫，我們才能決定。"],["李委員彥秀：好，所以你也不反對，要看到它送出的計畫。好，謝謝。","我還是要問一下部長，這一段時間外界非常關心的除了當沖降稅之外，還有另外一個就是金融營業稅調降的問題，請問部長，你有收到金管會的建議函了嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：金管會的建議函─事實上在年初已經給我們，就是表達他們的意見，他們的意見最主要就是說，金融特別準備金裡面的錢，希望還是能夠留存在那邊。至於……"],["李委員彥秀：好，2,100億的部分可以留存在這個準備金裡面，在存保裡頭。"],["莊部長翠雲：對，在準備金裡面，不去動它。至於未來所收的金融營業稅是否要進入金融準備金的部分，他沒有意見；至於稅率怎麼樣調整……"],["李委員彥秀：2%還是3%，你們有討論過了嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：這個部分，對於金融營業稅未來要怎麼調整，就是今年屆滿以後要怎麼調整，我們跟金管會也有充分地討論跟溝通。"],["李委員彥秀：方向是什麼？我知道你們有充分討論過了、有共識了，有共識了嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：第一個，我們就整個金融業的金融營業稅過往的歷史怎麼樣演變，以及歷次調整的原因是什麼，我們先去做了一個探討；第二個，金融營業稅對於整個金融業的國際競爭力，以及未來的發展，我們都做討論……"],["李委員彥秀：部長，這個我都清楚，沒關係，你、我都清楚，你只要告訴我答案就好，因為我等一下還要問ESG相關問題。"],["莊部長翠雲：這個部分，我們還是在繼續討論當中。"],["李委員彥秀：你會支持金管會建議書的意見嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：金融建議書裡面對於我們要放在金融準備金的部分，我們基本上是支持的，因為留存……"],["李委員彥秀：就是2,100億還是會放在存保裡面，到底降到2%還是3%，有共識了嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：2%、3%或者是百分之幾，這個部分我們還在討論，以及做相關的試算。"],["李委員彥秀：也在試算當中，所以還在磨合當中就對了？"],["莊部長翠雲：對，我們在討論當中。"],["李委員彥秀：有機會、有共識，不是2%就是3%，但是不知道是百分之幾？"],["莊部長翠雲：也沒這麼說，我沒有，我只是說調降為百分之幾，我們還在討論。"],["李委員彥秀：那你什麼時候會對外公布？"],["莊部長翠雲：這個部分也跟法律的修正會有關係，所以我們必須要完成相關的一定程序。"],["李委員彥秀：我知道，大概是什麼時候？總是有一個時程表吧！"],["莊部長翠雲：如果要修正的話，我們一定會依照法律做預告。"],["李委員彥秀：因為年底到期嘛，所以大概是什麼時候？因為是法律修正案，這個會期到7月中，大概是什麼時候？"],["莊部長翠雲：因為整個金融營業稅的部分是到年底，所以我們在年底之前一定會有一個結果。"],["李委員彥秀：年底之前，下個會期一開始就會送？"],["莊部長翠雲：預估應該會在下個會期。"],["李委員彥秀：一開始就會送？"],["莊部長翠雲：因為這個會期到7月15號嘛，那預告都還要60天。"],["李委員彥秀：OK，所以下個會期就一定會送。"],["莊部長翠雲：是，下個會期。"],["李委員彥秀：一開議就會送？"],["莊部長翠雲：對，就會有結果。"],["李委員彥秀：好，部長你請回。"],["莊部長翠雲：謝謝。"],["李委員彥秀：我請主委，主委，接下來我還是要問一下ESG制度的評鑑策略。昨天您到我辦公室，我們第一次見面溝通的時候，我有跟您提到ESG的部分，我們目前著重的部分都在環境保護，ESG的部分跟公司治理的部分，但在社會責任的部分，我覺得有更多加強的地方，昨天我們有討論到，當然我覺得ESG隨著環境的變化、需求，可以有一些調整的空間。我昨天也跟你提到，當然政府的職能有限，預算也有限，您過去從學校、校園出來，你非常知道公部門的預算有限，所以有沒有機會在評鑑的部分……好比說在我的選區裡面，過去的潭美國小就是一個在工業區裡面的學校，校舍很破舊，環境也不好，當然經過大家的努力，現在環境好一些。所以我一直在思考，在企業的社會責任裡面，有沒有機會在我們的公務預算、政府職能或預算不足的部分，再加一個評鑑的項目在裡頭？"],["彭主任委員金隆：這個我們有兩個方向，剛才跟委員也報告過，我們有一個公司治理評鑑，另外一個是永續金融評鑑。剛才提的應該是公司治理評鑑，未來我們要轉型做ESG，這部分我們的指標是隨時滾動調整的。"],["李委員彥秀：所以主委，這部分有沒有機會納入滾動式，機動調整來支持這樣的一個項目？"],["彭主任委員金隆：對，所有有助於推動的部分，我覺得他們在執行評鑑時都可以納入他們的委員會去討論，這部分他們有一個指標的檢討。"],["李委員彥秀：所以主委你支不支持？你個人支不支持這件事情？政府的職能有限，對於公立的……"],["彭主任委員金隆：我當然是持支持的態度。"],["李委員彥秀：謝謝主委。"],["彭主任委員金隆：因為它是ESG裡面的一塊。"],["李委員彥秀：感謝主委的回應。我接下來還是要請問一下，剛才也有其他委員提到，包括金融機構防漂綠參考指引的部分，現在大家都在做這些永續的經營，但是我們有一些指標其實是非常清楚的，我們對於很多財報裡面的要求，事實上是非常嚴格的，我請問一下部長，對於這些我們現在的指引是屬於柔性的勸導，未來如果違反的話，管理的作為會是柔性的勸導，還是未來我們會做開罰的動作？因為這牽涉到的刑罰還是罰款都罰得很重，包括公開發行公司的公司治理裡面也要做永續的申報書，它也要揭露氣候相關的一些資訊跟資料，這部分當然有一些永續報告書可能避重就輕、有一些隱惡揚善的部分，如果在財報跟業務文件裡面是虛偽的記載，我們擔心這涉及到刑罰跟裁罰，非常的嚴重，所以我才請教部長對於現在的要求，你們到底是柔性的勸導還是未來就要開始執行？"],["彭主任委員金隆：謝謝委員。剛剛提到的指引，現在我們是叫做指引，我們會施行一個階段，按照我們過去的步驟再考慮是不是納入自律規範，逐步來看，因為剛開始做可能需要一些調適跟調整。再來，剛才委員提到這到底有沒有涉及到所謂的刑責，其實我們剛剛也有報告過，比如我們現在的永續報告書是交易所提供的，這樣的要求還沒有納入我們剛剛所謂的法律規定文件裡面，但假設它納入年報的話，大概就有這樣的一個效力，有分階段的。"],["李委員彥秀：是，謝謝主委您的回應。因為我關注到司法院前院長賴英照之前有寫一篇文章，他說永續報告書所揭露的資訊必須真實無欺，如果內容造假，自然就應當負法律責任，最重可能還達到十年的刑罰，所以我才會問金管會的態度到底是什麼，我也支持有一段時間必須是宣導，柔性的勸導以瞭解大家的想法是怎麼樣，在執行一段時間之後，我們再來看指引有沒有調整的必要性，調整的必要性除了我們要配合氣候變遷相關的一些資訊，符合國際潮流之外，我們也要看看到底大家能不能達到這樣的目標，謝謝主委您的回應，謝謝。"],["彭主任委員金隆：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝李彥秀委員的質詢。","接著我們請黃珊珊委員質詢。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":274,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-20-15","speakers":["郭國文","林德福","吳秉叡","賴士葆","王鴻薇","顏寬恒","賴惠員","李坤城","李彥秀","黃珊珊","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","王世堅","羅明才","陳玉珍","黃國昌","鍾佳濱","林楚茵","邱志偉","張智倫","楊瓊瓔","蔡易餘"],"page_start":209,"meetingDate":["2024-05-30"],"gazette_id":"1135401","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1135401_00009"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第15次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"邀請財政部莊部長翠雲、金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆率所屬相關單位就「如何精進 ESG\n制度評鑑，並導引金融機構落實放貸及貸後管理工作」進行專題報告，並備質詢","agenda_id":"1135401_00010"}},"transcript":{"id":"153375","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153375","tool":"pyannote","id":"153375-pyannote"},"job_id":"i9Eux2GoZ4eN0u6K","queued_at":"2024-05-30 12:05:24","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2024-05-30 12:07:05","msg":"downloading https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153375"},{"time":"2024-05-30 12:07:06","msg":"downloading https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/bbbc431469b8aebaed9db607d2729fbf4622ddde1e3527b9446d6a815e91374454ed8f2ce0dbea445ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8"},{"time":"2024-05-30 12:07:27","msg":"converting mp4 to wav"},{"time":"2024-05-30 12:07:29","msg":"running pyannote"},{"time":"2024-05-30 12:07:40","msg":"status: 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00:01:23,531\n黃 主 委 有 非 常 清 楚 的 步 驟 在 處 理 那 後 續 他 努 力 了 你 會 再 給 一 些 時 間 嗎 那 包 括 後 續 包 括 金 共 合 併 跟 金 共 合 併 的 部 分 如 果 有 金 共 因 為 最 近 您 上 任 之 前 這 段 時 間 金 共 也 非 常 的 熱 鬧 一 下 子 傳 哪 一 個 金 共 跟 哪 一 個 金 共 合 併 這 樣 連 新 聞 都 好 多 所 以 金 共 合 併 跟 改 善 體 質 這 兩 件 事 情 您 的 立 場 是 什 麼\n\n5\n00:01:27,421 --> 00:01:44,981\n其 實 根 據 我 們 保 險 法 的 規 定 我 們 在 依 法 請 他 提 供 提 出 各 種 的 改 善 計 畫 這 本 來 就 是 各 家 公 司 的 決 定 那 如 果 藉 由 合 併 改 善 其 實 你 的 態 度 呢 我 剛 才 提 到 過 合 併 不 會 立 刻 改 善 他 的 情 況 那 你 會 同 意 合 併 嗎\n\n6\n00:01:47,745 --> 00:02:05,203\n合 併 我 們 尊 重 市 場 機 制 但 是 合 併 他 一 定 會 仔 細 分 析 過 他 們 的 利 弊 得 失 我 清 楚 他 也 會 跟 你 們 溝 通 那 如 果 在 第 一 個 階 段 沒 有 辦 法 達 到 的 話 你 們 會 給 予 更 多 的 監 理 寬 容 嗎\n\n7\n00:02:06,892 --> 00:02:35,746\n關 融 是 一 致 性 的 不 會 針 對 各 家 公 司 而 做 我 知 道 我 問 的 就 是 這 兩 家 你 會 給 更 多 的 監 理 看 因 為 他 們 現 在 已 經 提 出 他 們 的 改 善 計 畫 那 可 能 沒 有 辦 法 一 步 到 位 你 後 續 你 們 的 態 度 是 什 麼 這 跟 委 員 報 告 一 下 像 比 如 說 我 們 根 據 依 法 請 他 們 在 一 定 時 限 內 提 供 所 謂 的 改 善 計 畫 這 是 法 律 定 的 這 個 並 不 是 個 寬 容 措 施 這 個 就 是 我 們 過 去 我 知 道 要 達 到 那 如 果 他 們 提\n\n8\n00:02:36,326 --> 00:02:37,526\n請 問 部 長 你 有 收 到 今 晚 會 的 建 議 函 了 嗎 ?\n\n9\n00:03:06,409 --> 00:03:22,364\n金 管 會 的 建 議 事 實 上 在 年 初 已 經 給 我 們 表 達 他 們 的 意 見 他 們 的 意 見 最 主 要 就 是 說 對 於 在 金 融 特 別 準 備 金 裡 面 的 錢 希 望 能 夠 留 存 還 是 在 那 邊 2 1 0 0 億 的 部 分 可 以 留 存 在 準 備 金 裡 面 在 存 保 裡 頭\n\n10\n00:03:27,469 --> 00:03:35,656\n那 至 於 未 來 所 收 的 金 融 業 稅 是 否 要 進 入 金 融 準 備 金 額 的 部 分 他 沒 有 意 見 那 至 於 稅 率 怎 麼 樣 調 整 也 沒 有 意 見 這 個 部 分 對 於 金 融 業 稅 未 來 要 做 就 是 說 要 不 要 怎 麼 調 整 就 是 今 年 借 滿 以 後 要 不 要 怎 麼 調 整 我 們 跟 金 管 會 也 有 充 分 的 討 論 跟 溝 通 那 方 向 是 什 麼 我 知 道 你 們 有 充 分 討 論 過 了\n\n11\n00:03:51,129 --> 00:04:11,097\n有 共 識 了 嗎 ? 第 一 個 我 們 就 整 個 金 融 業 的 一 個 金 融 營 業 稅 過 往 的 一 個 歷 史 怎 麼 樣 的 演 變 以 及 歷 次 的 調 整 的 原 因 是 什 麼 我 們 先 去 做 了 一 個 探 討 那 第 二 個 金 融 業 稅 對 於 整 個 我 們 金 融 業 的 國 際 競 爭 力 以 及 未 來 的 發 展 我 們 都 做 討 論 沒 關 係 你 我 都 清 楚 你 只 要 告 訴 我 答 案 就 好 因 為 我 等 一 下 要 問 E S G 這 個 部 分 我 們 還 是 在 繼 續 討 論 當 中\n\n12\n00:04:18,800 --> 00:04:28,790\n有 沒 有 支 持 金 融 委 員 會 的 建 議 書 的 意 見 嗎 ? 金 融 建 議 書 裡 面 對 於 我 們 要 放 在 金 融 準 備 金 的 部 分 我 們 基 本 上 是 支 持 的 還 是 會 放 在 2 1 0 0 還 是 放 在 存 保 裡 頭 ? 那 到 底 降 到 2 % 、 3 % ? 有 共 識 了 嗎 ? 我 們 2 % 或 3 % 或 者 是 幾 % 我 們 這 個 部 分 我 們 已 經 還 在 討 論 以 及 做 相 關 的 試 算\n\n13\n00:04:39,600 --> 00:05:06,202\n也 在 試 算 當 中 所 以 還 在 磨 合 當 中 就 對 了 有 機 會 有 共 識 不 是 2 % 就 是 3 % 但 是 不 知 道 是 幾 % 也 沒 這 麼 說 我 只 是 說 調 降 為 幾 % 那 你 什 麼 時 候 會 對 外 公 布 這 個 部 分 也 跟 法 律 的 修 正 會 有 關 係 所 以 我 們 必 須 要 完 成 相 關 的 一 定 程 序 我 知 道 大 概 是 什 麼 時 候 總 是 有 一 個 時 程 表 如 果 要 修 正 的 話 我 們 一 定 會 依 照 法 律 我 們 會 做 預 告 的\n\n14\n00:05:06,542 --> 00:05:31,657\n因 為 年 底 到 期 嘛 , 所 以 大 概 是 什 麼 時 候 ? 因 為 法 律 修 正 案 這 個 會 期 7 月 中 , 大 概 是 什 麼 時 候 ? 對 , 那 因 為 整 個 要 到 金 融 業 , 所 以 這 個 部 分 是 到 年 底 , 那 所 以 我 們 會 應 該 會 在 年 底 之 前 一 定 會 有 一 個 結 果 。 年 底 之 前 ? 一 定 會 有 結 果 。 下 個 會 期 , 下 個 會 期 一 開 始 就 會 送 ? 預 估 , 預 估 應 該 會 在 下 個 會 期 。 是 , 是 。 一 開 始 就 會 送 ? 因 為 這 個 會 期 到 7 月 1 5 號 嘛 , 那 預 告 都 還 要 6 0 天 啊 。\n\n15\n00:05:33,358 --> 00:06:02,053\nO K , 所 以 下 個 會 期 就 一 定 會 送 ? 就 下 個 會 一 開 一 就 會 送 ? 就 會 有 結 果 , 對 對 對 好 , 部 長 你 請 回 謝 謝 我 請 主 委 主 委 接 下 來 我 還 是 要 問 一 下 E S G 的 制 度 的 評 鑑 的 策 略 昨 天 您 到 我 辦 公 室 我 們 第 一 次 見 面 溝 通 的 時 候 我 有 跟 您 提 到 E S G 的 部 分 就 是 說 我 們 目 前 在 著 重 的 部 分 都 在 環 境 保 護 在 E S G 的 部 分 跟 公 司 治 理 的 部 分 在 社 會 責 任 的 部 分\n\n16\n00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:28,662\n我 覺 得 有 更 多 加 強 的 地 方 昨 天 我 們 有 討 論 到 那 當 然 我 覺 得 這 個 E S G 會 可 以 隨 著 環 境 的 變 化 需 求 可 以 有 一 些 調 整 的 空 間 那 我 昨 天 也 跟 你 提 到 就 是 說 當 然 政 府 的 職 能 有 限 預 算 也 有 限 譬 如 說 在 我 選 區 裡 面 您 過 去 從 學 校 校 園 出 來 你 非 常 知 道 公 部 門 的 預 算 有 限 所 以\n\n17\n00:06:29,162 --> 00:06:55,359\n有 沒 有 機 會 在 評 鑑 的 部 分 好 比 說 在 我 的 選 區 裡 面 過 去 的 小 學 臺 美 國 小 它 就 是 一 個 在 工 業 區 裡 面 的 學 校 校 舍 很 破 舊 環 境 也 不 好 那 當 然 經 過 大 家 的 努 力 現 在 環 境 好 一 些 所 以 我 一 直 在 思 考 說 在 企 業 的 社 會 責 任 裡 面 有 沒 有 機 會 在 我 們 的 這 個 公 務 的 預 算 政 府 職 能 或 預 算 不 足 的 部 分 再 加 一 個 評 鑑 的 項 目 在 裡 頭\n\n18\n00:06:59,271 --> 00:07:19,584\n這 個 我 們 有 兩 個 方 向 剛 才 跟 委 員 也 包 括 我 們 有 一 個 就 是 公 司 治 理 評 鑑 另 外 一 個 永 續 這 個 金 融 評 鑑 那 剛 才 提 的 應 該 是 公 司 治 理 評 鑑 現 在 我 們 在 做 未 來 轉 型 做 E S G 那 這 部 分 的 話 我 想 我 們 的 指 標 是 隨 時 滾 動 的 啦 隨 時 滾 動 調 整 所 以 主 委 這 個 部 分 有 沒 有 機 會 納 入 滾 動 式 機 動 的 調 整 來 支 持 這 樣 的 一 個 項 目\n\n19\n00:07:24,787 --> 00:07:25,127\n主 委 支 持 這 件 事 嗎 ?\n\n20\n00:07:39,728 --> 00:08:01,439\n政 府 的 職 能 有 限 對 於 公 立 的 我 當 然 是 持 支 持 的 態 度 因 為 它 是 E S G 裡 面 的 一 塊 感 謝 主 委 你 的 回 應 主 委 我 接 下 來 還 是 要 請 問 一 下 就 是 剛 才 委 員 有 提 到 其 他 委 員 有 提 到 包 括 金 融 機 構 房 票 率 的 參 與 指 標 的 部 分 當 然 我 們 現 在 對 於 大 家 都 在 做 這 些\n\n21\n00:08:03,100 --> 00:08:03,160\n李 彥 秀\n\n22\n00:08:26,309 --> 00:08:47,438\n會 不 會 管 理 的 作 為 會 是 柔 性 的 勸 導 還 是 未 來 我 們 會 做 開 罰 的 動 作 因 為 這 牽 涉 到 包 括 刑 罰 也 好 還 是 罰 款 都 罰 得 很 重 但 是 包 括 在 公 司 治 理 公 開 發 行 的 公 司 裡 面 他 也 要 做 永 續 的 申 報 書 包 括 他 也 要 揭 露 氣 候 的 相 關 的 一 些 資 訊 跟 資 料\n\n23\n00:08:49,018 --> 00:09:13,194\n那 在 這 個 部 分 當 然 有 一 些 永 續 報 告 書 它 有 可 能 避 重 就 輕 那 有 一 些 引 惡 扬 善 的 部 分 所 以 在 這 個 財 報 跟 煙 霧 文 件 裡 面 如 果 是 虛 偽 的 記 載 我 們 就 擔 心 說 這 個 是 涉 及 到 刑 罰 跟 財 罰 非 常 的 嚴 重 所 以 我 才 請 教 部 長 對 於 現 在 的 要 求 你 們 到 底 是 柔 性 的 勸 導 還 是 未 來 就 要 開 始 執 行\n\n24\n00:09:17,378 --> 00:09:33,037\n指 引 指 引 我 們 會 試 行 一 個 階 段 然 後 我 們 再 考 慮 按 照 我 們 過 去 的 步 驟 大 概 是 不 是 納 入 治 理 規 範 逐 步 而 來 看 因 為 剛 開 始 做 可 能 需 要 一 些 調 適 跟 調 整\n\n25\n00:09:34,238 --> 00:09:55,724\n好 那 再 來 剛 才 委 員 有 提 到 說 這 到 底 有 沒 有 涉 及 到 所 謂 的 刑 責 其 實 我 們 剛 剛 也 有 報 告 過 我 們 現 在 的 比 如 說 這 永 續 報 告 書 是 交 易 所 他 提 供 的 這 樣 的 要 求 他 還 沒 有 納 入 到 我 們 剛 剛 這 裡 面 這 所 謂 的 那 個 文 件 就 法 律 規 定 的 文 件 裡 面 當 然 假 設 他 納 入 年 報 的 話 那 個 大 概 就 是 有 這 樣 的 一 個 效 力\n\n26\n00:09:58,244 --> 00:10:20,209\n謝 謝 主 委 您 的 回 應 因 為 我 關 注 到 司 法 院 副 院 長 賴 英 兆 其 實 之 前 就 有 寫 了 一 篇 文 章 他 說 永 續 報 告 書 所 揭 露 的 資 訊 必 須 真 實 無 期 如 果 內 容 造 假 自 然 就 應 當 負 法 律 責 任 那 最 重 的 可 能 還 要 達 到 1 0 年 的 刑 罰 所 以 金 管 會 我 才 問 金 管 會 這 邊 您 的 態 度 到 底 是 什 麼\n\n27\n00:10:20,489 --> 00:10:20,869\n黃 珊 珊 委 員\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n370\t1032\t請彭志偉、有請莊部長\n4744\t32465\t今天兩位都在其實非常好我先延續一下剛才李委員的問題三商美邦跟新壽的部分其實剛才主委的態度也說明得很清楚他們這兩家其實都在這個月有送出他們財務的改善計畫那我想請問一下彭主委就是說財務改善計畫送出來之後接下來如果他們沒有辦法達到\n33226\t35307\t我們過去已經有非常明確的步驟來做這件事情\n60696\t83531\t黃主委有非常清楚的步驟在處理那後續他努力了你會再給一些時間嗎那包括後續包括金共合併跟金共合併的部分如果有金共因為最近您上任之前這段時間金共也非常的熱鬧一下子傳哪一個金共跟哪一個金共合併這樣連新聞都好多所以金共合併跟改善體質這兩件事情您的立場是什麼\n87421\t104981\t其實根據我們保險法的規定我們在依法請他提供提出各種的改善計畫這本來就是各家公司的決定那如果藉由合併改善其實你的態度呢我剛才提到過合併不會立刻改善他的情況那你會同意合併嗎\n107745\t125203\t合併我們尊重市場機制但是合併他一定會仔細分析過他們的利弊得失我清楚他也會跟你們溝通那如果在第一個階段沒有辦法達到的話你們會給予更多的監理寬容嗎\n126892\t155746\t關融是一致性的不會針對各家公司而做我知道我問的就是這兩家你會給更多的監理看因為他們現在已經提出他們的改善計畫那可能沒有辦法一步到位你後續你們的態度是什麼這跟委員報告一下像比如說我們根據依法請他們在一定時限內提供所謂的改善計畫這是法律定的這個並不是個寬容措施這個就是我們過去我知道要達到那如果他們提\n156326\t157526\t請問部長你有收到今晚會的建議函了嗎?\n186409\t202364\t金管會的建議事實上在年初已經給我們表達他們的意見他們的意見最主要就是說對於在金融特別準備金裡面的錢希望能夠留存還是在那邊2100億的部分可以留存在準備金裡面在存保裡頭\n207469\t215656\t那至於未來所收的金融業稅是否要進入金融準備金額的部分他沒有意見那至於稅率怎麼樣調整也沒有意見這個部分對於金融業稅未來要做就是說要不要怎麼調整就是今年借滿以後要不要怎麼調整我們跟金管會也有充分的討論跟溝通那方向是什麼我知道你們有充分討論過了\n231129\t251097\t有共識了嗎?第一個我們就整個金融業的一個金融營業稅過往的一個歷史怎麼樣的演變以及歷次的調整的原因是什麼我們先去做了一個探討那第二個金融業稅對於整個我們金融業的國際競爭力以及未來的發展我們都做討論沒關係你我都清楚你只要告訴我答案就好因為我等一下要問ESG這個部分我們還是在繼續討論當中\n258800\t268790\t有沒有支持金融委員會的建議書的意見嗎?金融建議書裡面對於我們要放在金融準備金的部分我們基本上是支持的還是會放在2100還是放在存保裡頭?那到底降到2%、3%?有共識了嗎?我們2%或3%或者是幾%我們這個部分我們已經還在討論以及做相關的試算\n279600\t306202\t也在試算當中所以還在磨合當中就對了有機會有共識不是2%就是3%但是不知道是幾%也沒這麼說我只是說調降為幾%那你什麼時候會對外公布這個部分也跟法律的修正會有關係所以我們必須要完成相關的一定程序我知道大概是什麼時候總是有一個時程表如果要修正的話我們一定會依照法律我們會做預告的\n306542\t331657\t因為年底到期嘛,所以大概是什麼時候?因為法律修正案這個會期7月中,大概是什麼時候?對,那因為整個要到金融業,所以這個部分是到年底,那所以我們會應該會在年底之前一定會有一個結果。年底之前?一定會有結果。下個會期,下個會期一開始就會送?預估,預估應該會在下個會期。是,是。一開始就會送?因為這個會期到7月15號嘛,那預告都還要60天啊。\n333358\t362053\tOK,所以下個會期就一定會送?就下個會一開一就會送?就會有結果,對對對好,部長你請回謝謝我請主委主委接下來我還是要問一下ESG的制度的評鑑的策略昨天您到我辦公室我們第一次見面溝通的時候我有跟您提到ESG的部分就是說我們目前在著重的部分都在環境保護在ESG的部分跟公司治理的部分在社會責任的部分\n363240\t388662\t我覺得有更多加強的地方昨天我們有討論到那當然我覺得這個ESG會可以隨著環境的變化需求可以有一些調整的空間那我昨天也跟你提到就是說當然政府的職能有限預算也有限譬如說在我選區裡面您過去從學校校園出來你非常知道公部門的預算有限所以\n389162\t415359\t有沒有機會在評鑑的部分好比說在我的選區裡面過去的小學臺美國小它就是一個在工業區裡面的學校校舍很破舊環境也不好那當然經過大家的努力現在環境好一些所以我一直在思考說在企業的社會責任裡面有沒有機會在我們的這個公務的預算政府職能或預算不足的部分再加一個評鑑的項目在裡頭\n419271\t439584\t這個我們有兩個方向剛才跟委員也包括我們有一個就是公司治理評鑑另外一個永續這個金融評鑑那剛才提的應該是公司治理評鑑現在我們在做未來轉型做ESG那這部分的話我想我們的指標是隨時滾動的啦隨時滾動調整所以主委這個部分有沒有機會納入滾動式機動的調整來支持這樣的一個項目\n444787\t445127\t主委支持這件事嗎?\n459728\t481439\t政府的職能有限對於公立的我當然是持支持的態度因為它是ESG裡面的一塊感謝主委你的回應主委我接下來還是要請問一下就是剛才委員有提到其他委員有提到包括金融機構房票率的參與指標的部分當然我們現在對於大家都在做這些\n483100\t483160\t李彥秀\n506309\t527438\t會不會管理的作為會是柔性的勸導還是未來我們會做開罰的動作因為這牽涉到包括刑罰也好還是罰款都罰得很重但是包括在公司治理公開發行的公司裡面他也要做永續的申報書包括他也要揭露氣候的相關的一些資訊跟資料\n529018\t553194\t那在這個部分當然有一些永續報告書它有可能避重就輕那有一些引惡扬善的部分所以在這個財報跟煙霧文件裡面如果是虛偽的記載我們就擔心說這個是涉及到刑罰跟財罰非常的嚴重所以我才請教部長對於現在的要求你們到底是柔性的勸導還是未來就要開始執行\n557378\t573037\t指引指引我們會試行一個階段然後我們再考慮按照我們過去的步驟大概是不是納入治理規範逐步而來看因為剛開始做可能需要一些調適跟調整\n574238\t595724\t好那再來剛才委員有提到說這到底有沒有涉及到所謂的刑責其實我們剛剛也有報告過我們現在的比如說這永續報告書是交易所他提供的這樣的要求他還沒有納入到我們剛剛這裡面這所謂的那個文件就法律規定的文件裡面當然假設他納入年報的話那個大概就是有這樣的一個效力\n598244\t620209\t謝謝主委您的回應因為我關注到司法院副院長賴英兆其實之前就有寫了一篇文章他說永續報告書所揭露的資訊必須真實無期如果內容造假自然就應當負法律責任那最重的可能還要達到10年的刑罰所以金管會我才問金管會這邊您的態度到底是什麼\n620489\t620869\t黃珊珊委員\n","txt":"請彭志偉、有請莊部長\n今天兩位都在其實非常好我先延續一下剛才李委員的問題三商美邦跟新壽的部分其實剛才主委的態度也說明得很清楚他們這兩家其實都在這個月有送出他們財務的改善計畫那我想請問一下彭主委就是說財務改善計畫送出來之後接下來如果他們沒有辦法達到\n我們過去已經有非常明確的步驟來做這件事情\n黃主委有非常清楚的步驟在處理那後續他努力了你會再給一些時間嗎那包括後續包括金共合併跟金共合併的部分如果有金共因為最近您上任之前這段時間金共也非常的熱鬧一下子傳哪一個金共跟哪一個金共合併這樣連新聞都好多所以金共合併跟改善體質這兩件事情您的立場是什麼\n其實根據我們保險法的規定我們在依法請他提供提出各種的改善計畫這本來就是各家公司的決定那如果藉由合併改善其實你的態度呢我剛才提到過合併不會立刻改善他的情況那你會同意合併嗎\n合併我們尊重市場機制但是合併他一定會仔細分析過他們的利弊得失我清楚他也會跟你們溝通那如果在第一個階段沒有辦法達到的話你們會給予更多的監理寬容嗎\n關融是一致性的不會針對各家公司而做我知道我問的就是這兩家你會給更多的監理看因為他們現在已經提出他們的改善計畫那可能沒有辦法一步到位你後續你們的態度是什麼這跟委員報告一下像比如說我們根據依法請他們在一定時限內提供所謂的改善計畫這是法律定的這個並不是個寬容措施這個就是我們過去我知道要達到那如果他們提\n請問部長你有收到今晚會的建議函了嗎?\n金管會的建議事實上在年初已經給我們表達他們的意見他們的意見最主要就是說對於在金融特別準備金裡面的錢希望能夠留存還是在那邊2100億的部分可以留存在準備金裡面在存保裡頭\n那至於未來所收的金融業稅是否要進入金融準備金額的部分他沒有意見那至於稅率怎麼樣調整也沒有意見這個部分對於金融業稅未來要做就是說要不要怎麼調整就是今年借滿以後要不要怎麼調整我們跟金管會也有充分的討論跟溝通那方向是什麼我知道你們有充分討論過了\n有共識了嗎?第一個我們就整個金融業的一個金融營業稅過往的一個歷史怎麼樣的演變以及歷次的調整的原因是什麼我們先去做了一個探討那第二個金融業稅對於整個我們金融業的國際競爭力以及未來的發展我們都做討論沒關係你我都清楚你只要告訴我答案就好因為我等一下要問ESG這個部分我們還是在繼續討論當中\n有沒有支持金融委員會的建議書的意見嗎?金融建議書裡面對於我們要放在金融準備金的部分我們基本上是支持的還是會放在2100還是放在存保裡頭?那到底降到2%、3%?有共識了嗎?我們2%或3%或者是幾%我們這個部分我們已經還在討論以及做相關的試算\n也在試算當中所以還在磨合當中就對了有機會有共識不是2%就是3%但是不知道是幾%也沒這麼說我只是說調降為幾%那你什麼時候會對外公布這個部分也跟法律的修正會有關係所以我們必須要完成相關的一定程序我知道大概是什麼時候總是有一個時程表如果要修正的話我們一定會依照法律我們會做預告的\n因為年底到期嘛,所以大概是什麼時候?因為法律修正案這個會期7月中,大概是什麼時候?對,那因為整個要到金融業,所以這個部分是到年底,那所以我們會應該會在年底之前一定會有一個結果。年底之前?一定會有結果。下個會期,下個會期一開始就會送?預估,預估應該會在下個會期。是,是。一開始就會送?因為這個會期到7月15號嘛,那預告都還要60天啊。\nOK,所以下個會期就一定會送?就下個會一開一就會送?就會有結果,對對對好,部長你請回謝謝我請主委主委接下來我還是要問一下ESG的制度的評鑑的策略昨天您到我辦公室我們第一次見面溝通的時候我有跟您提到ESG的部分就是說我們目前在著重的部分都在環境保護在ESG的部分跟公司治理的部分在社會責任的部分\n我覺得有更多加強的地方昨天我們有討論到那當然我覺得這個ESG會可以隨著環境的變化需求可以有一些調整的空間那我昨天也跟你提到就是說當然政府的職能有限預算也有限譬如說在我選區裡面您過去從學校校園出來你非常知道公部門的預算有限所以\n有沒有機會在評鑑的部分好比說在我的選區裡面過去的小學臺美國小它就是一個在工業區裡面的學校校舍很破舊環境也不好那當然經過大家的努力現在環境好一些所以我一直在思考說在企業的社會責任裡面有沒有機會在我們的這個公務的預算政府職能或預算不足的部分再加一個評鑑的項目在裡頭\n這個我們有兩個方向剛才跟委員也包括我們有一個就是公司治理評鑑另外一個永續這個金融評鑑那剛才提的應該是公司治理評鑑現在我們在做未來轉型做ESG那這部分的話我想我們的指標是隨時滾動的啦隨時滾動調整所以主委這個部分有沒有機會納入滾動式機動的調整來支持這樣的一個項目\n主委支持這件事嗎?\n政府的職能有限對於公立的我當然是持支持的態度因為它是ESG裡面的一塊感謝主委你的回應主委我接下來還是要請問一下就是剛才委員有提到其他委員有提到包括金融機構房票率的參與指標的部分當然我們現在對於大家都在做這些\n李彥秀\n會不會管理的作為會是柔性的勸導還是未來我們會做開罰的動作因為這牽涉到包括刑罰也好還是罰款都罰得很重但是包括在公司治理公開發行的公司裡面他也要做永續的申報書包括他也要揭露氣候的相關的一些資訊跟資料\n那在這個部分當然有一些永續報告書它有可能避重就輕那有一些引惡扬善的部分所以在這個財報跟煙霧文件裡面如果是虛偽的記載我們就擔心說這個是涉及到刑罰跟財罰非常的嚴重所以我才請教部長對於現在的要求你們到底是柔性的勸導還是未來就要開始執行\n指引指引我們會試行一個階段然後我們再考慮按照我們過去的步驟大概是不是納入治理規範逐步而來看因為剛開始做可能需要一些調適跟調整\n好那再來剛才委員有提到說這到底有沒有涉及到所謂的刑責其實我們剛剛也有報告過我們現在的比如說這永續報告書是交易所他提供的這樣的要求他還沒有納入到我們剛剛這裡面這所謂的那個文件就法律規定的文件裡面當然假設他納入年報的話那個大概就是有這樣的一個效力\n謝謝主委您的回應因為我關注到司法院副院長賴英兆其實之前就有寫了一篇文章他說永續報告書所揭露的資訊必須真實無期如果內容造假自然就應當負法律責任那最重的可能還要達到10年的刑罰所以金管會我才問金管會這邊您的態度到底是什麼\n黃珊珊委員\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.370 --> 00:01.032\n請 彭 志 偉 、 有 請 莊 部 長\n\n00:04.744 --> 00:32.465\n今 天 兩 位 都 在 其 實 非 常 好 我 先 延 續 一 下 剛 才 李 委 員 的 問 題 三 商 美 邦 跟 新 壽 的 部 分 其 實 剛 才 主 委 的 態 度 也 說 明 得 很 清 楚 他 們 這 兩 家 其 實 都 在 這 個 月 有 送 出 他 們 財 務 的 改 善 計 畫 那 我 想 請 問 一 下 彭 主 委 就 是 說 財 務 改 善 計 畫 送 出 來 之 後 接 下 來 如 果 他 們 沒 有 辦 法 達 到\n\n00:33.226 --> 00:35.307\n我 們 過 去 已 經 有 非 常 明 確 的 步 驟 來 做 這 件 事 情\n\n01:00.696 --> 01:23.531\n黃 主 委 有 非 常 清 楚 的 步 驟 在 處 理 那 後 續 他 努 力 了 你 會 再 給 一 些 時 間 嗎 那 包 括 後 續 包 括 金 共 合 併 跟 金 共 合 併 的 部 分 如 果 有 金 共 因 為 最 近 您 上 任 之 前 這 段 時 間 金 共 也 非 常 的 熱 鬧 一 下 子 傳 哪 一 個 金 共 跟 哪 一 個 金 共 合 併 這 樣 連 新 聞 都 好 多 所 以 金 共 合 併 跟 改 善 體 質 這 兩 件 事 情 您 的 立 場 是 什 麼\n\n01:27.421 --> 01:44.981\n其 實 根 據 我 們 保 險 法 的 規 定 我 們 在 依 法 請 他 提 供 提 出 各 種 的 改 善 計 畫 這 本 來 就 是 各 家 公 司 的 決 定 那 如 果 藉 由 合 併 改 善 其 實 你 的 態 度 呢 我 剛 才 提 到 過 合 併 不 會 立 刻 改 善 他 的 情 況 那 你 會 同 意 合 併 嗎\n\n01:47.745 --> 02:05.203\n合 併 我 們 尊 重 市 場 機 制 但 是 合 併 他 一 定 會 仔 細 分 析 過 他 們 的 利 弊 得 失 我 清 楚 他 也 會 跟 你 們 溝 通 那 如 果 在 第 一 個 階 段 沒 有 辦 法 達 到 的 話 你 們 會 給 予 更 多 的 監 理 寬 容 嗎\n\n02:06.892 --> 02:35.746\n關 融 是 一 致 性 的 不 會 針 對 各 家 公 司 而 做 我 知 道 我 問 的 就 是 這 兩 家 你 會 給 更 多 的 監 理 看 因 為 他 們 現 在 已 經 提 出 他 們 的 改 善 計 畫 那 可 能 沒 有 辦 法 一 步 到 位 你 後 續 你 們 的 態 度 是 什 麼 這 跟 委 員 報 告 一 下 像 比 如 說 我 們 根 據 依 法 請 他 們 在 一 定 時 限 內 提 供 所 謂 的 改 善 計 畫 這 是 法 律 定 的 這 個 並 不 是 個 寬 容 措 施 這 個 就 是 我 們 過 去 我 知 道 要 達 到 那 如 果 他 們 提\n\n02:36.326 --> 02:37.526\n請 問 部 長 你 有 收 到 今 晚 會 的 建 議 函 了 嗎 ?\n\n03:06.409 --> 03:22.364\n金 管 會 的 建 議 事 實 上 在 年 初 已 經 給 我 們 表 達 他 們 的 意 見 他 們 的 意 見 最 主 要 就 是 說 對 於 在 金 融 特 別 準 備 金 裡 面 的 錢 希 望 能 夠 留 存 還 是 在 那 邊 2 1 0 0 億 的 部 分 可 以 留 存 在 準 備 金 裡 面 在 存 保 裡 頭\n\n03:27.469 --> 03:35.656\n那 至 於 未 來 所 收 的 金 融 業 稅 是 否 要 進 入 金 融 準 備 金 額 的 部 分 他 沒 有 意 見 那 至 於 稅 率 怎 麼 樣 調 整 也 沒 有 意 見 這 個 部 分 對 於 金 融 業 稅 未 來 要 做 就 是 說 要 不 要 怎 麼 調 整 就 是 今 年 借 滿 以 後 要 不 要 怎 麼 調 整 我 們 跟 金 管 會 也 有 充 分 的 討 論 跟 溝 通 那 方 向 是 什 麼 我 知 道 你 們 有 充 分 討 論 過 了\n\n03:51.129 --> 04:11.097\n有 共 識 了 嗎 ? 第 一 個 我 們 就 整 個 金 融 業 的 一 個 金 融 營 業 稅 過 往 的 一 個 歷 史 怎 麼 樣 的 演 變 以 及 歷 次 的 調 整 的 原 因 是 什 麼 我 們 先 去 做 了 一 個 探 討 那 第 二 個 金 融 業 稅 對 於 整 個 我 們 金 融 業 的 國 際 競 爭 力 以 及 未 來 的 發 展 我 們 都 做 討 論 沒 關 係 你 我 都 清 楚 你 只 要 告 訴 我 答 案 就 好 因 為 我 等 一 下 要 問 E S G 這 個 部 分 我 們 還 是 在 繼 續 討 論 當 中\n\n04:18.800 --> 04:28.790\n有 沒 有 支 持 金 融 委 員 會 的 建 議 書 的 意 見 嗎 ? 金 融 建 議 書 裡 面 對 於 我 們 要 放 在 金 融 準 備 金 的 部 分 我 們 基 本 上 是 支 持 的 還 是 會 放 在 2 1 0 0 還 是 放 在 存 保 裡 頭 ? 那 到 底 降 到 2 % 、 3 % ? 有 共 識 了 嗎 ? 我 們 2 % 或 3 % 或 者 是 幾 % 我 們 這 個 部 分 我 們 已 經 還 在 討 論 以 及 做 相 關 的 試 算\n\n04:39.600 --> 05:06.202\n也 在 試 算 當 中 所 以 還 在 磨 合 當 中 就 對 了 有 機 會 有 共 識 不 是 2 % 就 是 3 % 但 是 不 知 道 是 幾 % 也 沒 這 麼 說 我 只 是 說 調 降 為 幾 % 那 你 什 麼 時 候 會 對 外 公 布 這 個 部 分 也 跟 法 律 的 修 正 會 有 關 係 所 以 我 們 必 須 要 完 成 相 關 的 一 定 程 序 我 知 道 大 概 是 什 麼 時 候 總 是 有 一 個 時 程 表 如 果 要 修 正 的 話 我 們 一 定 會 依 照 法 律 我 們 會 做 預 告 的\n\n05:06.542 --> 05:31.657\n因 為 年 底 到 期 嘛 , 所 以 大 概 是 什 麼 時 候 ? 因 為 法 律 修 正 案 這 個 會 期 7 月 中 , 大 概 是 什 麼 時 候 ? 對 , 那 因 為 整 個 要 到 金 融 業 , 所 以 這 個 部 分 是 到 年 底 , 那 所 以 我 們 會 應 該 會 在 年 底 之 前 一 定 會 有 一 個 結 果 。 年 底 之 前 ? 一 定 會 有 結 果 。 下 個 會 期 , 下 個 會 期 一 開 始 就 會 送 ? 預 估 , 預 估 應 該 會 在 下 個 會 期 。 是 , 是 。 一 開 始 就 會 送 ? 因 為 這 個 會 期 到 7 月 1 5 號 嘛 , 那 預 告 都 還 要 6 0 天 啊 。\n\n05:33.358 --> 06:02.053\nO K , 所 以 下 個 會 期 就 一 定 會 送 ? 就 下 個 會 一 開 一 就 會 送 ? 就 會 有 結 果 , 對 對 對 好 , 部 長 你 請 回 謝 謝 我 請 主 委 主 委 接 下 來 我 還 是 要 問 一 下 E S G 的 制 度 的 評 鑑 的 策 略 昨 天 您 到 我 辦 公 室 我 們 第 一 次 見 面 溝 通 的 時 候 我 有 跟 您 提 到 E S G 的 部 分 就 是 說 我 們 目 前 在 著 重 的 部 分 都 在 環 境 保 護 在 E S G 的 部 分 跟 公 司 治 理 的 部 分 在 社 會 責 任 的 部 分\n\n06:03.240 --> 06:28.662\n我 覺 得 有 更 多 加 強 的 地 方 昨 天 我 們 有 討 論 到 那 當 然 我 覺 得 這 個 E S G 會 可 以 隨 著 環 境 的 變 化 需 求 可 以 有 一 些 調 整 的 空 間 那 我 昨 天 也 跟 你 提 到 就 是 說 當 然 政 府 的 職 能 有 限 預 算 也 有 限 譬 如 說 在 我 選 區 裡 面 您 過 去 從 學 校 校 園 出 來 你 非 常 知 道 公 部 門 的 預 算 有 限 所 以\n\n06:29.162 --> 06:55.359\n有 沒 有 機 會 在 評 鑑 的 部 分 好 比 說 在 我 的 選 區 裡 面 過 去 的 小 學 臺 美 國 小 它 就 是 一 個 在 工 業 區 裡 面 的 學 校 校 舍 很 破 舊 環 境 也 不 好 那 當 然 經 過 大 家 的 努 力 現 在 環 境 好 一 些 所 以 我 一 直 在 思 考 說 在 企 業 的 社 會 責 任 裡 面 有 沒 有 機 會 在 我 們 的 這 個 公 務 的 預 算 政 府 職 能 或 預 算 不 足 的 部 分 再 加 一 個 評 鑑 的 項 目 在 裡 頭\n\n06:59.271 --> 07:19.584\n這 個 我 們 有 兩 個 方 向 剛 才 跟 委 員 也 包 括 我 們 有 一 個 就 是 公 司 治 理 評 鑑 另 外 一 個 永 續 這 個 金 融 評 鑑 那 剛 才 提 的 應 該 是 公 司 治 理 評 鑑 現 在 我 們 在 做 未 來 轉 型 做 E S G 那 這 部 分 的 話 我 想 我 們 的 指 標 是 隨 時 滾 動 的 啦 隨 時 滾 動 調 整 所 以 主 委 這 個 部 分 有 沒 有 機 會 納 入 滾 動 式 機 動 的 調 整 來 支 持 這 樣 的 一 個 項 目\n\n07:24.787 --> 07:25.127\n主 委 支 持 這 件 事 嗎 ?\n\n07:39.728 --> 08:01.439\n政 府 的 職 能 有 限 對 於 公 立 的 我 當 然 是 持 支 持 的 態 度 因 為 它 是 E S G 裡 面 的 一 塊 感 謝 主 委 你 的 回 應 主 委 我 接 下 來 還 是 要 請 問 一 下 就 是 剛 才 委 員 有 提 到 其 他 委 員 有 提 到 包 括 金 融 機 構 房 票 率 的 參 與 指 標 的 部 分 當 然 我 們 現 在 對 於 大 家 都 在 做 這 些\n\n08:03.100 --> 08:03.160\n李 彥 秀\n\n08:26.309 --> 08:47.438\n會 不 會 管 理 的 作 為 會 是 柔 性 的 勸 導 還 是 未 來 我 們 會 做 開 罰 的 動 作 因 為 這 牽 涉 到 包 括 刑 罰 也 好 還 是 罰 款 都 罰 得 很 重 但 是 包 括 在 公 司 治 理 公 開 發 行 的 公 司 裡 面 他 也 要 做 永 續 的 申 報 書 包 括 他 也 要 揭 露 氣 候 的 相 關 的 一 些 資 訊 跟 資 料\n\n08:49.018 --> 09:13.194\n那 在 這 個 部 分 當 然 有 一 些 永 續 報 告 書 它 有 可 能 避 重 就 輕 那 有 一 些 引 惡 扬 善 的 部 分 所 以 在 這 個 財 報 跟 煙 霧 文 件 裡 面 如 果 是 虛 偽 的 記 載 我 們 就 擔 心 說 這 個 是 涉 及 到 刑 罰 跟 財 罰 非 常 的 嚴 重 所 以 我 才 請 教 部 長 對 於 現 在 的 要 求 你 們 到 底 是 柔 性 的 勸 導 還 是 未 來 就 要 開 始 執 行\n\n09:17.378 --> 09:33.037\n指 引 指 引 我 們 會 試 行 一 個 階 段 然 後 我 們 再 考 慮 按 照 我 們 過 去 的 步 驟 大 概 是 不 是 納 入 治 理 規 範 逐 步 而 來 看 因 為 剛 開 始 做 可 能 需 要 一 些 調 適 跟 調 整\n\n09:34.238 --> 09:55.724\n好 那 再 來 剛 才 委 員 有 提 到 說 這 到 底 有 沒 有 涉 及 到 所 謂 的 刑 責 其 實 我 們 剛 剛 也 有 報 告 過 我 們 現 在 的 比 如 說 這 永 續 報 告 書 是 交 易 所 他 提 供 的 這 樣 的 要 求 他 還 沒 有 納 入 到 我 們 剛 剛 這 裡 面 這 所 謂 的 那 個 文 件 就 法 律 規 定 的 文 件 裡 面 當 然 假 設 他 納 入 年 報 的 話 那 個 大 概 就 是 有 這 樣 的 一 個 效 力\n\n09:58.244 --> 10:20.209\n謝 謝 主 委 您 的 回 應 因 為 我 關 注 到 司 法 院 副 院 長 賴 英 兆 其 實 之 前 就 有 寫 了 一 篇 文 章 他 說 永 續 報 告 書 所 揭 露 的 資 訊 必 須 真 實 無 期 如 果 內 容 造 假 自 然 就 應 當 負 法 律 責 任 那 最 重 的 可 能 還 要 達 到 1 0 年 的 刑 罰 所 以 金 管 會 我 才 問 金 管 會 這 邊 您 的 態 度 到 底 是 什 麼\n\n10:20.489 --> 10:20.869\n黃 珊 珊 委 員\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.37,"end":1.032,"text":"請彭志偉、有請莊部長"},{"start":4.744,"end":32.465,"text":"今天兩位都在其實非常好我先延續一下剛才李委員的問題三商美邦跟新壽的部分其實剛才主委的態度也說明得很清楚他們這兩家其實都在這個月有送出他們財務的改善計畫那我想請問一下彭主委就是說財務改善計畫送出來之後接下來如果他們沒有辦法達到"},{"start":33.226,"end":35.307,"text":"我們過去已經有非常明確的步驟來做這件事情"},{"start":60.696,"end":83.531,"text":"黃主委有非常清楚的步驟在處理那後續他努力了你會再給一些時間嗎那包括後續包括金共合併跟金共合併的部分如果有金共因為最近您上任之前這段時間金共也非常的熱鬧一下子傳哪一個金共跟哪一個金共合併這樣連新聞都好多所以金共合併跟改善體質這兩件事情您的立場是什麼"},{"start":87.421,"end":104.981,"text":"其實根據我們保險法的規定我們在依法請他提供提出各種的改善計畫這本來就是各家公司的決定那如果藉由合併改善其實你的態度呢我剛才提到過合併不會立刻改善他的情況那你會同意合併嗎"},{"start":107.745,"end":125.203,"text":"合併我們尊重市場機制但是合併他一定會仔細分析過他們的利弊得失我清楚他也會跟你們溝通那如果在第一個階段沒有辦法達到的話你們會給予更多的監理寬容嗎"},{"start":126.892,"end":155.746,"text":"關融是一致性的不會針對各家公司而做我知道我問的就是這兩家你會給更多的監理看因為他們現在已經提出他們的改善計畫那可能沒有辦法一步到位你後續你們的態度是什麼這跟委員報告一下像比如說我們根據依法請他們在一定時限內提供所謂的改善計畫這是法律定的這個並不是個寬容措施這個就是我們過去我知道要達到那如果他們提"},{"start":156.326,"end":157.526,"text":"請問部長你有收到今晚會的建議函了嗎?"},{"start":186.409,"end":202.364,"text":"金管會的建議事實上在年初已經給我們表達他們的意見他們的意見最主要就是說對於在金融特別準備金裡面的錢希望能夠留存還是在那邊2100億的部分可以留存在準備金裡面在存保裡頭"},{"start":207.469,"end":215.656,"text":"那至於未來所收的金融業稅是否要進入金融準備金額的部分他沒有意見那至於稅率怎麼樣調整也沒有意見這個部分對於金融業稅未來要做就是說要不要怎麼調整就是今年借滿以後要不要怎麼調整我們跟金管會也有充分的討論跟溝通那方向是什麼我知道你們有充分討論過了"},{"start":231.129,"end":251.097,"text":"有共識了嗎?第一個我們就整個金融業的一個金融營業稅過往的一個歷史怎麼樣的演變以及歷次的調整的原因是什麼我們先去做了一個探討那第二個金融業稅對於整個我們金融業的國際競爭力以及未來的發展我們都做討論沒關係你我都清楚你只要告訴我答案就好因為我等一下要問ESG這個部分我們還是在繼續討論當中"},{"start":258.8,"end":268.79,"text":"有沒有支持金融委員會的建議書的意見嗎?金融建議書裡面對於我們要放在金融準備金的部分我們基本上是支持的還是會放在2100還是放在存保裡頭?那到底降到2%、3%?有共識了嗎?我們2%或3%或者是幾%我們這個部分我們已經還在討論以及做相關的試算"},{"start":279.6,"end":306.202,"text":"也在試算當中所以還在磨合當中就對了有機會有共識不是2%就是3%但是不知道是幾%也沒這麼說我只是說調降為幾%那你什麼時候會對外公布這個部分也跟法律的修正會有關係所以我們必須要完成相關的一定程序我知道大概是什麼時候總是有一個時程表如果要修正的話我們一定會依照法律我們會做預告的"},{"start":306.542,"end":331.657,"text":"因為年底到期嘛,所以大概是什麼時候?因為法律修正案這個會期7月中,大概是什麼時候?對,那因為整個要到金融業,所以這個部分是到年底,那所以我們會應該會在年底之前一定會有一個結果。年底之前?一定會有結果。下個會期,下個會期一開始就會送?預估,預估應該會在下個會期。是,是。一開始就會送?因為這個會期到7月15號嘛,那預告都還要60天啊。"},{"start":333.358,"end":362.053,"text":"OK,所以下個會期就一定會送?就下個會一開一就會送?就會有結果,對對對好,部長你請回謝謝我請主委主委接下來我還是要問一下ESG的制度的評鑑的策略昨天您到我辦公室我們第一次見面溝通的時候我有跟您提到ESG的部分就是說我們目前在著重的部分都在環境保護在ESG的部分跟公司治理的部分在社會責任的部分"},{"start":363.24,"end":388.662,"text":"我覺得有更多加強的地方昨天我們有討論到那當然我覺得這個ESG會可以隨著環境的變化需求可以有一些調整的空間那我昨天也跟你提到就是說當然政府的職能有限預算也有限譬如說在我選區裡面您過去從學校校園出來你非常知道公部門的預算有限所以"},{"start":389.162,"end":415.359,"text":"有沒有機會在評鑑的部分好比說在我的選區裡面過去的小學臺美國小它就是一個在工業區裡面的學校校舍很破舊環境也不好那當然經過大家的努力現在環境好一些所以我一直在思考說在企業的社會責任裡面有沒有機會在我們的這個公務的預算政府職能或預算不足的部分再加一個評鑑的項目在裡頭"},{"start":419.271,"end":439.584,"text":"這個我們有兩個方向剛才跟委員也包括我們有一個就是公司治理評鑑另外一個永續這個金融評鑑那剛才提的應該是公司治理評鑑現在我們在做未來轉型做ESG那這部分的話我想我們的指標是隨時滾動的啦隨時滾動調整所以主委這個部分有沒有機會納入滾動式機動的調整來支持這樣的一個項目"},{"start":444.787,"end":445.127,"text":"主委支持這件事嗎?"},{"start":459.728,"end":481.439,"text":"政府的職能有限對於公立的我當然是持支持的態度因為它是ESG裡面的一塊感謝主委你的回應主委我接下來還是要請問一下就是剛才委員有提到其他委員有提到包括金融機構房票率的參與指標的部分當然我們現在對於大家都在做這些"},{"start":483.1,"end":483.16,"text":"李彥秀"},{"start":506.309,"end":527.438,"text":"會不會管理的作為會是柔性的勸導還是未來我們會做開罰的動作因為這牽涉到包括刑罰也好還是罰款都罰得很重但是包括在公司治理公開發行的公司裡面他也要做永續的申報書包括他也要揭露氣候的相關的一些資訊跟資料"},{"start":529.018,"end":553.194,"text":"那在這個部分當然有一些永續報告書它有可能避重就輕那有一些引惡扬善的部分所以在這個財報跟煙霧文件裡面如果是虛偽的記載我們就擔心說這個是涉及到刑罰跟財罰非常的嚴重所以我才請教部長對於現在的要求你們到底是柔性的勸導還是未來就要開始執行"},{"start":557.378,"end":573.037,"text":"指引指引我們會試行一個階段然後我們再考慮按照我們過去的步驟大概是不是納入治理規範逐步而來看因為剛開始做可能需要一些調適跟調整"},{"start":574.238,"end":595.724,"text":"好那再來剛才委員有提到說這到底有沒有涉及到所謂的刑責其實我們剛剛也有報告過我們現在的比如說這永續報告書是交易所他提供的這樣的要求他還沒有納入到我們剛剛這裡面這所謂的那個文件就法律規定的文件裡面當然假設他納入年報的話那個大概就是有這樣的一個效力"},{"start":598.244,"end":620.209,"text":"謝謝主委您的回應因為我關注到司法院副院長賴英兆其實之前就有寫了一篇文章他說永續報告書所揭露的資訊必須真實無期如果內容造假自然就應當負法律責任那最重的可能還要達到10年的刑罰所以金管會我才問金管會這邊您的態度到底是什麼"},{"start":620.489,"end":620.869,"text":"黃珊珊委員"}]}}}}