{"id":153444,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153444","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/2dd358c888e2c7071fefc2cbd26c788bb263bafebededa07eb068d4dbfff0b0c32efae0385dc65035ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"李坤城","委員發言時間":"09:46:50 - 09:57:26","影片長度":"00:10:36","會議時間":"2024-06-03T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第16次全體委員會議（事由：一、繼續審查「財政收支劃分法」14案：（繼續詢答）\n(一)\t本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「財政收支劃分法修正草案」案。\n(二)\t本院國民黨黨團、委員羅明才等23人、委員林思銘等20人、委員許宇甄等16人、委員洪孟楷等22人分別擬具「財政收支劃分法部分條文修正草案」等5案。\n(三)\t本院委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等17人擬具「財政收支劃分法第三條條文修正草案」案。\n(四)\t本院委員陳玉珍等24人擬具「財政收支劃分法第八條條文修正草案」案。\n(五)\t本院委員王鴻薇等24人擬具「財政收支劃分法第八條、第十二條及第三十條條文修正草案」案。\n(六)\t本院委員陳超明等17人擬具「財政收支劃分法第八條、第十二條及第十六條之一條文修正草案」案。\n(七)\t本院委員賴瑞隆等16人、委員蔡易餘等16人分別擬具「財政收支劃分法第十六條之一條文修正草案」等2案。\n(八)\t本院委員賴士葆等29人擬具「財政收支劃分法第十六條之二、第三十七條之二及第三十八條之二條文修正草案」案。\n(九)\t本院委員賴士葆等22人擬具「財政收支劃分法第三十八條之一條文修正草案」案。\n二、審查「財政收支劃分法」3案：（繼續詢答）\n(一)\t本院委員丁學忠等17人擬具「財政收支劃分法部分條文修正草案」案。\n(二)\t本院委員黃健豪等21人擬具「財政收支劃分法第八條及第十二條條文修正草案」案。\n(三)\t本院委員邱鎮軍等19人擬具「財政收支劃分法第八條、第十二條及第十六條之一條文修正草案」案。\n【6月3日及6日二天一次會】）","date":"2024-06-03","start_time":"2024-06-03T09:46:50+08:00","end_time":"2024-06-03T09:57:26+08:00","duration":636,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期財政委員會第16次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":16,"committees":[20],"id":"委員會-11-1-20-16"},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"type":"Clip","gazette":{"lineno":262,"blocks":[["李委員坤城：（9時46分）謝謝主席，請莊部長。"],["主席：請莊部長。"],["莊部長翠雲：委員好。"],["李委員坤城：部長好。今天在討論財劃法，其實是有兩個命題啦！第一個命題就是，財劃法要不要修？第二個命題是，財劃法要怎麼修，對不對？那麼請問一下第一個命題，財劃法要不要修？"],["莊部長翠雲：我想各地方政府都有提出要修法的訴求，財政部也提出了一個修法的方向，所以目前來說，我們已經徵詢各地方政府對於分配公式裡面的指標來提出意見，那麼經過各地方政府提出以後，相關的指標因為定義也不是很清楚，不具有普遍性跟客觀性，所以這個部分我們請他們再釐清每一個指標的定義。"],["李委員坤城：部長的回答就是說……"],["莊部長翠雲：我們也會在這個月召請地方政府再來說明，我們希望就是，大家能夠把他們的意見反映出來，然後我們把差距縮小，凝聚一個最大的共識，因為大家都很在乎這個分配，這個分配的部分……"],["李委員坤城：我知道，部長已經把我兩個命題的答案都說出來了，第一個，財劃法要修對不對？第二個，要怎麼修？就是說垂直分配要怎麼去分配？水平分配就是各縣市對那一個公式、那個原則要怎麼修？大家還要再凝聚共識嘛！所以禮拜三會召開公聽會，公聽會結束之後，再根據公聽會的結果，大家再研議把有交疊共識越大的部分，按照這個共識再來修法嘛，對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：是，我覺得共識是非常重要，因為過去也曾經5度提出修法的版本，但是也因為沒有共識，所以沒有能夠完成整個修法的程序，這個部分我們其實大家都理解。"],["李委員坤城：好，來請部長看幾個數字，根據111年中央給地方統籌分配款的數額，大概有4,000億左右啦！然後再加上如果按照國民黨黨團的版本，還要再釋出百分之十五的稅收，大概5,000億左右，合起來大概要9,000億的規模，那這樣子對我們的財政有沒有影響？"],["莊部長翠雲：第一個，我們在垂直分配的時候要考慮，當然地方的財政需求要顧慮，但是中央也必須要有一定的財政韌性來因應不時之需，像國際政經情勢的變化。"],["李委員坤城：對，這個我知道。"],["莊部長翠雲：氣候變遷、天災等等，所以必須要有這樣的一個思考……"],["李委員坤城：來，再看下一個數字……"],["莊部長翠雲：對於5,777億要釋出的話，對中央財政的影響到多大？我想主計長在這邊，他應該非常清楚，因為主計是分配相關資源的部分，會衝擊到中央財政的一個程度。"],["李委員坤城：我們再看112年地方政府稅收決算數是快1兆4,000億，補助及協助收入的依存度（占歲出比率）是36.25%，換算金額大概也是5,000億左右啦！如果按照國民黨黨團的版本再增加5,000億，這個增加5,000億等於是說，在112年度我們給地方政府的所有補助了，也等於是說，如果再增加5,000億，中央幾乎沒有能力再給予地方政府的任何協助了嘛！因為我們已經給了他們大概5,000億左右了啦！如果按照國民黨版本，還要多增加5,000億，這樣子我們的中央受得了嗎？"],["莊部長翠雲：中央統籌分配稅款加上一般性的補助款，在113年的規模來說，已經達到六千三百多億了，如果再……"],["李委員坤城：好，如果按照112年補助的比例來看，我們占他們歲出的比例已經快接近4成了，等於是中央跟地方稅收的比例已經是6比4差不多了嘛！對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：對，如果加上還有計畫型補助款的話，幾乎就是6比4。"],["李委員坤城：就是6比4了嘛！"],["莊部長翠雲：中央就是……"],["李委員坤城：我看國民黨現在又要求說，中央跟地方的稅收比例要6比4，我看到112年度的決算，大概已經是6比4的比例了啦！"],["莊部長翠雲：我們算過這個跟全國歲入淨額來比的話，我們對地方相關的一些補助等等，其實已經到了非常大的比例。"],["李委員坤城：大概有6比4這個比例了嘛！"],["莊部長翠雲：對，地方的收入占全國歲入淨額的話，達到6比4了。"],["李委員坤城：好，我們民進黨執政以來，中央統籌分配款占地方歲入的比例，從105年的23.54%到112年的27.68%；中央一般補助占地方歲入的比例，從105年的28.01%上升到112年的36.25%。就是說，民進黨執政以來，不論是中央的統籌分配款，還有一般性的補助比例都是增加的嘛，對不對？雖然比例是增加的，但是造成地方自籌財源占歲入比例從48.41%降到了37.48%，就是我們中央給的是越來越多，但是地方的自籌財源是越來越少。那麼我剛剛有個數字──縣市政府的補助依存度平均是36.25%，可是按照我們在91年11月有通過一個「地方稅法通則」，地方政府可以自訂自治條例徵收特別稅，然實施22年以來只有10個縣市徵收，總稅收合計只有169億。我所要講的意思就是說，地方政府仰賴中央給予統籌分配款也好、一般性補助款也好，是不是也造成了地方極度地仰賴中央？地方有這個權力也可以去收地方的稅收啊！但是通過了「地方稅法通則」之後，22年來10個縣市只收了169億，這也是造成另外一個地方依賴中央的情況啊！"],["莊部長翠雲：跟委員報告，確實我們各地方政府、各縣市的人口面積，還有自然條件跟工商發展條件的不同，當然它的稅源會有不同，但是因為財劃法有一個調劑盈虛很重要的目的，然後均衡區域的發展，那為什麼地方相關歲入占它總歲入的比例越來越低？因為事實上就是等於我們的中央統籌分配稅款跟補助款都加入那個分母，也就是說給它的多，相對地它那個分子如果沒有增長的話，分母成長多，以至於比例會下降。"],["李委員坤城：對啊！分子沒有增加。"],["莊部長翠雲：對，所以我們未來在分配公式上，也要有財政努力這一個指標，因為大家都要一起努力嘛，對不對？地方也要努力、中央也要努力。"],["李委員坤城：就是不能你一方面希望中央能夠多給一點，但是地方政府也不努力。"],["莊部長翠雲：也不能不努力，那麼財政的努力應該給予激勵，所以這個部分未來我們在分配公式上，我們也希望能夠有這樣的一個指標進來。"],["李委員坤城：好，那麼看這個水平分配的原則來講，我這邊有新北市政府建議中央統籌分配款的一個分配公式指標，當然財政努力有啦！包含人口數、區域面積、公共運輸、圖書館、國民運動中心，這個是新北市他們希望的一個分配公式指標嘛，對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：是的。"],["李委員坤城：我看啊，光是這個指標就跟其他縣市可能要的指標又不太一樣了，對不對？"],["莊部長翠雲：沒有錯，這就是差距的所在，對。"],["李委員坤城：這個就是說，我是新北市我當然站在新北市的立場，我也希望新北市多一點嘛！"],["莊部長翠雲：是。"],["李委員坤城：我剛才看到李彥秀委員說臺北市這個首都條款一定要保留、一定要給。我就覺得為什麼一定要給臺北市3%保留的款項？"],["莊部長翠雲：是。"],["李委員坤城：對啊！就吵架了嘛！"],["莊部長翠雲：對，就是不一致，大家都為自己的……"],["李委員坤城：為什麼臺北市要3%？我新北市要5%，因為我們的人口最多，地方最大，可不可以？"],["莊部長翠雲：當然委員為自己的選區爭取……"],["李委員坤城：沒有，我的意思是，如果每個都像這樣子吵的話，這個共識怎麼達成？"],["莊部長翠雲：這個就是歧異所在。"],["李委員坤城：對，我的意思是，今天看到新北市很明顯，因為新北市是六都之一，光是新北市搞不好又跟臺南、高雄不太一樣，更不用說新北市跟旁邊的基隆市也會有很大的差距。"],["莊部長翠雲：沒有錯。"],["李委員坤城：總的來說，我們都贊成財劃法要修，現在財劃法要修，第一個，統籌分配款如果按照現在國民黨的版本，它要多收5,000億，等於占了目前中央給地方的統籌分配款。不然這樣子好了，以後只有統籌分配款，都不要有一般性補助款。"],["莊部長翠雲：如果你把中央統籌分配稅款這樣子做，事權沒有調整……因為錢跟事權一定是相對應的，事權要不要同樣調整？這個也是要考慮的事情。"],["李委員坤城：對，我的意思是……"],["莊部長翠雲：中央沒有財政韌性，將來面臨緊急需要的時候要怎麼因應？"],["李委員坤城：修財劃法沒有這麼簡單，如果這麼簡單的話，上一屆就修過了，輪不到國民黨現在以地方包圍中央來修。禮拜三各個縣市政府……我也不知道，可能財政相關單位會過來，每個地方政府的意見至少要先溝通，中央當然是……地方上的意見、直轄市的意見、非直轄市的意見，一定會有歧異，我們能做的就是儘量將歧異縮小，就是水平分配的原則這一方面。當然另外一個是垂直分配，就是統籌分配款的餅可以有多大？你們自己也要考慮一下，因為這也影響到未來臺灣中央財政的韌性。你不曉得會遇到什麼樣的情況，中央還是要保有財政的自主性，才能因應一些意外的情況發生。"],["莊部長翠雲：是，委員說的是。"],["李委員坤城：謝謝。"],["莊部長翠雲：謝謝委員。"],["主席：謝謝。","接著請郭國文召委。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":228,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-20-16","speakers":["羅明才","黃珊珊","黃國昌","李彥秀","李坤城","郭國文","王鴻薇","伍麗華Saidhai‧Tahovecahe","張智倫","鄭正鈐","牛煦庭","萬美玲","邱鎮軍","羅廷瑋","廖先翔","鍾佳濱","邱若華"],"page_start":47,"meetingDate":["2024-06-03"],"gazette_id":"1135801","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1135801_00003"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期財政委員會第16次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、繼續審查「財政收支劃分法」14案：（繼續詢答）(一)本院台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「財政收支\n劃分法修正草案」案、(二)本院國民黨黨團、委員羅明才等23人、委員林思銘等20人、委員許宇\n甄等16人、委員洪孟楷等22人分別擬具「財政收支劃分法部分條文修正草案」等 5案、(三)本院\n委員伍麗華 Saidhai Tahovecahe 等17人擬具「財政收支劃分法第三條條文修正草案」案、(四)\n本院委員陳玉珍等24人擬具「財政收支劃分法第八條條文修正草案」案、(五)本院委員王鴻薇等\n24人擬具「財政收支劃分法第八條、第十二條及第三十條條文修正草案」案、(六)本院委員陳超\n明等17人擬具「財政收支劃分法第八條、第十二條及第十六條之一條文修正草案」案、(七)本院\n委員賴瑞隆等16人、委員蔡易餘等16人分別擬具「財政收支劃分法第十六條之一條文修正草案」\n等2案、(八)本院委員賴士葆等29人擬具「財政收支劃分法第十六條之二、第三十七條之二及第\n三十八條之二條文修正草案」案、(九)本院委員賴士葆等22人擬具「財政收支劃分法第三十八條\n之一條文修正草案」案；二、審查「財政收支劃分法」3案：（繼續詢答）(一)本院委員丁學忠\n等17人擬具「財政收支劃分法部分條文修正草案」案、(二)本院委員黃健豪等21人擬具「財政收\n支劃分法第八條及第十二條條文修正草案」案、(三)本院委員邱鎮軍等19人擬具「財政收支劃分\n法第八條、第十二條及第十六條之一條文修正草案」案","agenda_id":"1135801_00002"}},"transcript":{"id":"153444","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153444","tool":"pyannote","id":"153444-pyannote"},"job_id":"Hpv11PBHJSSsCN5a","queued_at":"2024-06-03 15:08:26","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2024-06-03 15:10:05","msg":"downloading https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153444"},{"time":"2024-06-03 15:10:06","msg":"downloading 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00:00:36,655\n收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法\n\n3\n00:00:47,099 --> 00:00:47,719\n財政收支劃分法修正草案\n\n4\n00:01:08,100 --> 00:01:11,702\n財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續擬具\n\n5\n00:01:31,756 --> 00:01:44,667\n我覺得共識是非常重要因為過去也曾經五度提出修法的版本但是也因為沒有共識所以沒有能夠完成整個修法的一個程序這個部分我們其實大家都理解來請部長看幾個數字根據這個111年這個中央給這個地方的這個統籌分配款的這個數額大概有4000億左右\n\n6\n00:01:57,057 --> 00:01:57,617\n收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續詢答．一、繼續擬具:「財政\n\n7\n00:02:16,343 --> 00:02:17,003\n財政收支劃分法修正草案案。\n\n8\n00:02:31,673 --> 00:02:32,553\n收支劃分法修正草案．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．�\n\n9\n00:02:59,443 --> 00:03:01,444\n收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政\n\n10\n00:03:24,136 --> 00:03:31,554\n我們已經給了他們大概5000億左右啦那如果按照國民黨版本還要多增加5000億這樣子我們的中央受得了嗎?\n\n11\n00:03:33,544 --> 00:03:45,287\n收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃\n\n12\n00:04:02,932 --> 00:04:25,824\n6比4,就是6比4了嗎?我看國民黨現在又要求說中央跟地方的稅收比例要6比4,我看到112年度的這個決算大概已經是6比4的這個比例了啊。對,我們算過這個跟全國的淨稅率的一個金額來比的話,我們對地方的相關的一些補助等等其實已經到了非常大的比例了。大概有6比4這個比例了嗎?\n\n13\n00:04:26,890 --> 00:04:41,227\n對,地方的收入,地方的收入占全國稅率的淨額的話,達到6比4了。好,那這個我們民進黨執政以來齁,中央統籌分配款占地方的稅率的比例呢,從105年的23.54到112年的27.68。\n\n14\n00:04:45,411 --> 00:05:01,918\n中央一般補助政地方稅率的比例從105年的28.01然後上升到112年的36.25其實說民進黨執政以來我們的這個稅不論是中央的統籌分配款還有一般性的補助比例都是增加的對不對\n\n15\n00:05:03,118 --> 00:05:22,885\n收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第2會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第3會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第4會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第5會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第6會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第7會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第8會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第9會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第10會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第11會期財政收支劃分法．立法\n\n16\n00:05:26,286 --> 00:05:28,708\n財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法\n\n17\n00:05:46,321 --> 00:06:14,728\n這個地方政府仰賴中央給予這個統籌分配款也好或一般性補助款也好那是不是也造成了這個地方極度的仰賴中央地方他有這個權利他也可以去收這個地方的稅收啊但是這通過了這個地方稅法通責之後22年來10個縣市只收了169億這也是造成了另外一個地方造成這個依賴這個中央的一個情況啊\n\n18\n00:06:18,079 --> 00:06:36,663\n報告確實我們各地方政府各縣市他的人口面積還有自然條件跟公山發展條件的不同當然他的稅源會有不同但是因為所以財化法有一個條件營需很重要的一個目的然後均衡區域的發展那為什麼地方的相關的稅率佔的他的稅\n\n19\n00:06:39,644 --> 00:07:06,874\n總稅率的比例越來越低,因為事實上就是等於我們的中央統籌分配稅款跟補助款都加入那個分母,也就是說給他的多,所以他相對的他那個分子如果沒有成長的話,分母成長多,以至於比例會下降。對,分子沒有增加。對,所以我們未來在分配公式上也要有財政努力這一個指標,因為大家都要一起努力嘛,對不對,財政地方也要努力,中央也要努力。對,就是不能你一方面就是說希望中央能夠多給一點,\n\n20\n00:07:07,654 --> 00:07:30,975\n收支劃分法但地方政府也不努力。那財政的努力應該給予激勵,所以這個部分未來我們在分配公式上我們也希望能夠有這樣的一個指標進來。好,那看這個水平的分配的原則來講,我這邊有這個新北市政府建議中央統籌分配款的一個分配公式的指標。當然財政努力有啦。\n\n21\n00:07:31,696 --> 00:07:41,763\n收支劃分法包括人口數、區域面積、公共運輸、圖書館、國民運動中心。這個是新北市他們希望的分配公式指標。對不對?\n\n22\n00:07:44,318 --> 00:07:50,202\n收支劃分法：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法、委員羅明才等23人、委員許宇甄等22人分別擬具\n\n23\n00:08:06,272 --> 00:08:25,132\n收支劃分法修正草案必須保留﹑必須提供﹑那我就覺得說那為什麼一定要給台北市3%的這個保留的這一個款項勒?對啊就吵架了嘛對就是不一致吧大家都為自己的那為什麼台北市要3%我新北市有5%我人口最多我地方最大可不可以?\n\n24\n00:08:26,852 --> 00:08:38,797\n財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第13會期財政收支劃\n\n25\n00:08:51,963 --> 00:08:54,644\n財政收支劃分法修正草案案\n\n26\n00:09:16,721 --> 00:09:45,382\n當然他會如果你把中央統籌分配稅款這樣子的做而事權沒有做調整因為錢跟事權是一定是相對應的那事權要不要同樣做調整這個就是也要考慮的事情那你中央沒有財政韌性那將來面臨緊急的需要的時候要怎麼因應這個修財劃法沒有這麼簡單啦如果這麼簡單的話在上一屆就會修過了啦就也輪不到說國民黨現在這個地方要包圍中央來修啦\n\n27\n00:09:46,443 --> 00:10:09,426\n各個我們禮拜三各個縣市政府那我也不知道可能這個財政相關單位會過來每個地方政府他們的意見至少要先溝通那我們中央當然是說地方上面的意見直轄市的意見、非直轄市的意見一定會有那個歧義那我們當然做就是說盡量把那個歧義把它縮小就是這個水平分配的原則這一方面\n\n28\n00:10:09,946 --> 00:10:12,047\n財政收支劃分法修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n416\t26771\t財政部長你好部長好今天在討論財化法其實是有兩個命題第一個命題就是說財化法要不要修第二個命題是說財化法要怎麼修對不對請問一下第一個命題財化法要不要修我想各地方政府都有提出要修的訴求財政部也提出了一個修法的方向\n27211\t36655\t收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法\n47099\t47719\t財政收支劃分法修正草案\n68100\t71702\t財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續擬具\n91756\t104667\t我覺得共識是非常重要因為過去也曾經五度提出修法的版本但是也因為沒有共識所以沒有能夠完成整個修法的一個程序這個部分我們其實大家都理解來請部長看幾個數字根據這個111年這個中央給這個地方的這個統籌分配款的這個數額大概有4000億左右\n117057\t117617\t收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續詢答．一、繼續擬具:「財政\n136343\t137003\t財政收支劃分法修正草案案。\n151673\t152553\t收支劃分法修正草案．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．�\n179443\t181444\t收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政\n204136\t211554\t我們已經給了他們大概5000億左右啦那如果按照國民黨版本還要多增加5000億這樣子我們的中央受得了嗎?\n213544\t225287\t收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃\n242932\t265824\t6比4,就是6比4了嗎?我看國民黨現在又要求說中央跟地方的稅收比例要6比4,我看到112年度的這個決算大概已經是6比4的這個比例了啊。對,我們算過這個跟全國的淨稅率的一個金額來比的話,我們對地方的相關的一些補助等等其實已經到了非常大的比例了。大概有6比4這個比例了嗎?\n266890\t281227\t對,地方的收入,地方的收入占全國稅率的淨額的話,達到6比4了。好,那這個我們民進黨執政以來齁,中央統籌分配款占地方的稅率的比例呢,從105年的23.54到112年的27.68。\n285411\t301918\t中央一般補助政地方稅率的比例從105年的28.01然後上升到112年的36.25其實說民進黨執政以來我們的這個稅不論是中央的統籌分配款還有一般性的補助比例都是增加的對不對\n303118\t322885\t收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第2會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第3會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第4會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第5會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第6會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第7會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第8會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第9會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第10會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第11會期財政收支劃分法．立法\n326286\t328708\t財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法\n346321\t374728\t這個地方政府仰賴中央給予這個統籌分配款也好或一般性補助款也好那是不是也造成了這個地方極度的仰賴中央地方他有這個權利他也可以去收這個地方的稅收啊但是這通過了這個地方稅法通責之後22年來10個縣市只收了169億這也是造成了另外一個地方造成這個依賴這個中央的一個情況啊\n378079\t396663\t報告確實我們各地方政府各縣市他的人口面積還有自然條件跟公山發展條件的不同當然他的稅源會有不同但是因為所以財化法有一個條件營需很重要的一個目的然後均衡區域的發展那為什麼地方的相關的稅率佔的他的稅\n399644\t426874\t總稅率的比例越來越低,因為事實上就是等於我們的中央統籌分配稅款跟補助款都加入那個分母,也就是說給他的多,所以他相對的他那個分子如果沒有成長的話,分母成長多,以至於比例會下降。對,分子沒有增加。對,所以我們未來在分配公式上也要有財政努力這一個指標,因為大家都要一起努力嘛,對不對,財政地方也要努力,中央也要努力。對,就是不能你一方面就是說希望中央能夠多給一點,\n427654\t450975\t收支劃分法 但地方政府也不努力。那財政的努力應該給予激勵,所以這個部分未來我們在分配公式上我們也希望能夠有這樣的一個指標進來。好,那看這個水平的分配的原則來講,我這邊有這個新北市政府建議中央統籌分配款的一個分配公式的指標。當然財政努力有啦。\n451696\t461763\t收支劃分法 包括人口數、區域面積、公共運輸、圖書館、國民運動中心。這個是新北市他們希望的分配公式指標。對不對?\n464318\t470202\t收支劃分法：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法、委員羅明才等23人、委員許宇甄等22人分別擬具\n486272\t505132\t收支劃分法修正草案 必須保留﹑必須提供﹑那我就覺得說那為什麼一定要給台北市3%的這個保留的這一個款項勒?對啊就吵架了嘛對就是不一致吧大家都為自己的那為什麼台北市要3%我新北市有5%我人口最多我地方最大可不可以?\n506852\t518797\t財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第13會期財政收支劃\n531963\t534644\t財政收支劃分法修正草案案\n556721\t585382\t當然他會如果你把中央統籌分配稅款這樣子的做而事權沒有做調整因為錢跟事權是一定是相對應的那事權要不要同樣做調整這個就是也要考慮的事情那你中央沒有財政韌性那將來面臨緊急的需要的時候要怎麼因應這個修財劃法沒有這麼簡單啦如果這麼簡單的話在上一屆就會修過了啦就也輪不到說國民黨現在這個地方要包圍中央來修啦\n586443\t609426\t各個我們禮拜三各個縣市政府那我也不知道可能這個財政相關單位會過來每個地方政府他們的意見至少要先溝通那我們中央當然是說地方上面的意見直轄市的意見、非直轄市的意見一定會有那個歧義那我們當然做就是說盡量把那個歧義把它縮小就是這個水平分配的原則這一方面\n609946\t612047\t財政收支劃分法修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法\n","txt":"財政部長你好部長好今天在討論財化法其實是有兩個命題第一個命題就是說財化法要不要修第二個命題是說財化法要怎麼修對不對請問一下第一個命題財化法要不要修我想各地方政府都有提出要修的訴求財政部也提出了一個修法的方向\n收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法\n財政收支劃分法修正草案\n財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續擬具\n我覺得共識是非常重要因為過去也曾經五度提出修法的版本但是也因為沒有共識所以沒有能夠完成整個修法的一個程序這個部分我們其實大家都理解來請部長看幾個數字根據這個111年這個中央給這個地方的這個統籌分配款的這個數額大概有4000億左右\n收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續詢答．一、繼續擬具:「財政\n財政收支劃分法修正草案案。\n收支劃分法修正草案．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．�\n收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政\n我們已經給了他們大概5000億左右啦那如果按照國民黨版本還要多增加5000億這樣子我們的中央受得了嗎?\n收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃\n6比4,就是6比4了嗎?我看國民黨現在又要求說中央跟地方的稅收比例要6比4,我看到112年度的這個決算大概已經是6比4的這個比例了啊。對,我們算過這個跟全國的淨稅率的一個金額來比的話,我們對地方的相關的一些補助等等其實已經到了非常大的比例了。大概有6比4這個比例了嗎?\n對,地方的收入,地方的收入占全國稅率的淨額的話,達到6比4了。好,那這個我們民進黨執政以來齁,中央統籌分配款占地方的稅率的比例呢,從105年的23.54到112年的27.68。\n中央一般補助政地方稅率的比例從105年的28.01然後上升到112年的36.25其實說民進黨執政以來我們的這個稅不論是中央的統籌分配款還有一般性的補助比例都是增加的對不對\n收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第2會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第3會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第4會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第5會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第6會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第7會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第8會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第9會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第10會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第11會期財政收支劃分法．立法\n財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法\n這個地方政府仰賴中央給予這個統籌分配款也好或一般性補助款也好那是不是也造成了這個地方極度的仰賴中央地方他有這個權利他也可以去收這個地方的稅收啊但是這通過了這個地方稅法通責之後22年來10個縣市只收了169億這也是造成了另外一個地方造成這個依賴這個中央的一個情況啊\n報告確實我們各地方政府各縣市他的人口面積還有自然條件跟公山發展條件的不同當然他的稅源會有不同但是因為所以財化法有一個條件營需很重要的一個目的然後均衡區域的發展那為什麼地方的相關的稅率佔的他的稅\n總稅率的比例越來越低,因為事實上就是等於我們的中央統籌分配稅款跟補助款都加入那個分母,也就是說給他的多,所以他相對的他那個分子如果沒有成長的話,分母成長多,以至於比例會下降。對,分子沒有增加。對,所以我們未來在分配公式上也要有財政努力這一個指標,因為大家都要一起努力嘛,對不對,財政地方也要努力,中央也要努力。對,就是不能你一方面就是說希望中央能夠多給一點,\n收支劃分法 但地方政府也不努力。那財政的努力應該給予激勵,所以這個部分未來我們在分配公式上我們也希望能夠有這樣的一個指標進來。好,那看這個水平的分配的原則來講,我這邊有這個新北市政府建議中央統籌分配款的一個分配公式的指標。當然財政努力有啦。\n收支劃分法 包括人口數、區域面積、公共運輸、圖書館、國民運動中心。這個是新北市他們希望的分配公式指標。對不對?\n收支劃分法：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法、委員羅明才等23人、委員許宇甄等22人分別擬具\n收支劃分法修正草案 必須保留﹑必須提供﹑那我就覺得說那為什麼一定要給台北市3%的這個保留的這一個款項勒?對啊就吵架了嘛對就是不一致吧大家都為自己的那為什麼台北市要3%我新北市有5%我人口最多我地方最大可不可以?\n財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第13會期財政收支劃\n財政收支劃分法修正草案案\n當然他會如果你把中央統籌分配稅款這樣子的做而事權沒有做調整因為錢跟事權是一定是相對應的那事權要不要同樣做調整這個就是也要考慮的事情那你中央沒有財政韌性那將來面臨緊急的需要的時候要怎麼因應這個修財劃法沒有這麼簡單啦如果這麼簡單的話在上一屆就會修過了啦就也輪不到說國民黨現在這個地方要包圍中央來修啦\n各個我們禮拜三各個縣市政府那我也不知道可能這個財政相關單位會過來每個地方政府他們的意見至少要先溝通那我們中央當然是說地方上面的意見直轄市的意見、非直轄市的意見一定會有那個歧義那我們當然做就是說盡量把那個歧義把它縮小就是這個水平分配的原則這一方面\n財政收支劃分法修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.416 --> 00:26.771\n財政部長你好部長好今天在討論財化法其實是有兩個命題第一個命題就是說財化法要不要修第二個命題是說財化法要怎麼修對不對請問一下第一個命題財化法要不要修我想各地方政府都有提出要修的訴求財政部也提出了一個修法的方向\n\n00:27.211 --> 00:36.655\n收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法\n\n00:47.099 --> 00:47.719\n財政收支劃分法修正草案\n\n01:08.100 --> 01:11.702\n財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續擬具\n\n01:31.756 --> 01:44.667\n我覺得共識是非常重要因為過去也曾經五度提出修法的版本但是也因為沒有共識所以沒有能夠完成整個修法的一個程序這個部分我們其實大家都理解來請部長看幾個數字根據這個111年這個中央給這個地方的這個統籌分配款的這個數額大概有4000億左右\n\n01:57.057 --> 01:57.617\n收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續詢答．一、繼續擬具:「財政\n\n02:16.343 --> 02:17.003\n財政收支劃分法修正草案案。\n\n02:31.673 --> 02:32.553\n收支劃分法修正草案．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．�\n\n02:59.443 --> 03:01.444\n收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政\n\n03:24.136 --> 03:31.554\n我們已經給了他們大概5000億左右啦那如果按照國民黨版本還要多增加5000億這樣子我們的中央受得了嗎?\n\n03:33.544 --> 03:45.287\n收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃\n\n04:02.932 --> 04:25.824\n6比4,就是6比4了嗎?我看國民黨現在又要求說中央跟地方的稅收比例要6比4,我看到112年度的這個決算大概已經是6比4的這個比例了啊。對,我們算過這個跟全國的淨稅率的一個金額來比的話,我們對地方的相關的一些補助等等其實已經到了非常大的比例了。大概有6比4這個比例了嗎?\n\n04:26.890 --> 04:41.227\n對,地方的收入,地方的收入占全國稅率的淨額的話,達到6比4了。好,那這個我們民進黨執政以來齁,中央統籌分配款占地方的稅率的比例呢,從105年的23.54到112年的27.68。\n\n04:45.411 --> 05:01.918\n中央一般補助政地方稅率的比例從105年的28.01然後上升到112年的36.25其實說民進黨執政以來我們的這個稅不論是中央的統籌分配款還有一般性的補助比例都是增加的對不對\n\n05:03.118 --> 05:22.885\n收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第2會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第3會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第4會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第5會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第6會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第7會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第8會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第9會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第10會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第11會期財政收支劃分法．立法\n\n05:26.286 --> 05:28.708\n財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法\n\n05:46.321 --> 06:14.728\n這個地方政府仰賴中央給予這個統籌分配款也好或一般性補助款也好那是不是也造成了這個地方極度的仰賴中央地方他有這個權利他也可以去收這個地方的稅收啊但是這通過了這個地方稅法通責之後22年來10個縣市只收了169億這也是造成了另外一個地方造成這個依賴這個中央的一個情況啊\n\n06:18.079 --> 06:36.663\n報告確實我們各地方政府各縣市他的人口面積還有自然條件跟公山發展條件的不同當然他的稅源會有不同但是因為所以財化法有一個條件營需很重要的一個目的然後均衡區域的發展那為什麼地方的相關的稅率佔的他的稅\n\n06:39.644 --> 07:06.874\n總稅率的比例越來越低,因為事實上就是等於我們的中央統籌分配稅款跟補助款都加入那個分母,也就是說給他的多,所以他相對的他那個分子如果沒有成長的話,分母成長多,以至於比例會下降。對,分子沒有增加。對,所以我們未來在分配公式上也要有財政努力這一個指標,因為大家都要一起努力嘛,對不對,財政地方也要努力,中央也要努力。對,就是不能你一方面就是說希望中央能夠多給一點,\n\n07:07.654 --> 07:30.975\n收支劃分法但地方政府也不努力。那財政的努力應該給予激勵,所以這個部分未來我們在分配公式上我們也希望能夠有這樣的一個指標進來。好,那看這個水平的分配的原則來講,我這邊有這個新北市政府建議中央統籌分配款的一個分配公式的指標。當然財政努力有啦。\n\n07:31.696 --> 07:41.763\n收支劃分法包括人口數、區域面積、公共運輸、圖書館、國民運動中心。這個是新北市他們希望的分配公式指標。對不對?\n\n07:44.318 --> 07:50.202\n收支劃分法：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法、委員羅明才等23人、委員許宇甄等22人分別擬具\n\n08:06.272 --> 08:25.132\n收支劃分法修正草案必須保留﹑必須提供﹑那我就覺得說那為什麼一定要給台北市3%的這個保留的這一個款項勒?對啊就吵架了嘛對就是不一致吧大家都為自己的那為什麼台北市要3%我新北市有5%我人口最多我地方最大可不可以?\n\n08:26.852 --> 08:38.797\n財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第13會期財政收支劃\n\n08:51.963 --> 08:54.644\n財政收支劃分法修正草案案\n\n09:16.721 --> 09:45.382\n當然他會如果你把中央統籌分配稅款這樣子的做而事權沒有做調整因為錢跟事權是一定是相對應的那事權要不要同樣做調整這個就是也要考慮的事情那你中央沒有財政韌性那將來面臨緊急的需要的時候要怎麼因應這個修財劃法沒有這麼簡單啦如果這麼簡單的話在上一屆就會修過了啦就也輪不到說國民黨現在這個地方要包圍中央來修啦\n\n09:46.443 --> 10:09.426\n各個我們禮拜三各個縣市政府那我也不知道可能這個財政相關單位會過來每個地方政府他們的意見至少要先溝通那我們中央當然是說地方上面的意見直轄市的意見、非直轄市的意見一定會有那個歧義那我們當然做就是說盡量把那個歧義把它縮小就是這個水平分配的原則這一方面\n\n10:09.946 --> 10:12.047\n財政收支劃分法修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.416,"end":26.771,"text":"財政部長你好部長好今天在討論財化法其實是有兩個命題第一個命題就是說財化法要不要修第二個命題是說財化法要怎麼修對不對請問一下第一個命題財化法要不要修我想各地方政府都有提出要修的訴求財政部也提出了一個修法的方向"},{"start":27.211,"end":36.655,"text":"收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法"},{"start":47.099,"end":47.719,"text":"財政收支劃分法修正草案"},{"start":68.1,"end":71.702,"text":"財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法修正草案．一、繼續擬具"},{"start":91.756,"end":104.667,"text":"我覺得共識是非常重要因為過去也曾經五度提出修法的版本但是也因為沒有共識所以沒有能夠完成整個修法的一個程序這個部分我們其實大家都理解來請部長看幾個數字根據這個111年這個中央給這個地方的這個統籌分配款的這個數額大概有4000億左右"},{"start":117.057,"end":117.617,"text":"收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續詢答．一、繼續擬具:「財政"},{"start":136.343,"end":137.003,"text":"財政收支劃分法修正草案案。"},{"start":151.673,"end":152.553,"text":"收支劃分法修正草案．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．．�"},{"start":179.443,"end":181.444,"text":"收支劃分法：一、繼續審查:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政收支劃分法．一、繼續擬具:「財政"},{"start":204.136,"end":211.554,"text":"我們已經給了他們大概5000億左右啦那如果按照國民黨版本還要多增加5000億這樣子我們的中央受得了嗎?"},{"start":213.544,"end":225.287,"text":"收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法修正草案：立法院第12會期財政收支劃"},{"start":242.932,"end":265.824,"text":"6比4,就是6比4了嗎?我看國民黨現在又要求說中央跟地方的稅收比例要6比4,我看到112年度的這個決算大概已經是6比4的這個比例了啊。對,我們算過這個跟全國的淨稅率的一個金額來比的話,我們對地方的相關的一些補助等等其實已經到了非常大的比例了。大概有6比4這個比例了嗎?"},{"start":266.89,"end":281.227,"text":"對,地方的收入,地方的收入占全國稅率的淨額的話,達到6比4了。好,那這個我們民進黨執政以來齁,中央統籌分配款占地方的稅率的比例呢,從105年的23.54到112年的27.68。"},{"start":285.411,"end":301.918,"text":"中央一般補助政地方稅率的比例從105年的28.01然後上升到112年的36.25其實說民進黨執政以來我們的這個稅不論是中央的統籌分配款還有一般性的補助比例都是增加的對不對"},{"start":303.118,"end":322.885,"text":"收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第2會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第3會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第4會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第5會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第6會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第7會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第8會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第9會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第10會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第11會期財政收支劃分法．立法"},{"start":326.286,"end":328.708,"text":"財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法"},{"start":346.321,"end":374.728,"text":"這個地方政府仰賴中央給予這個統籌分配款也好或一般性補助款也好那是不是也造成了這個地方極度的仰賴中央地方他有這個權利他也可以去收這個地方的稅收啊但是這通過了這個地方稅法通責之後22年來10個縣市只收了169億這也是造成了另外一個地方造成這個依賴這個中央的一個情況啊"},{"start":378.079,"end":396.663,"text":"報告確實我們各地方政府各縣市他的人口面積還有自然條件跟公山發展條件的不同當然他的稅源會有不同但是因為所以財化法有一個條件營需很重要的一個目的然後均衡區域的發展那為什麼地方的相關的稅率佔的他的稅"},{"start":399.644,"end":426.874,"text":"總稅率的比例越來越低,因為事實上就是等於我們的中央統籌分配稅款跟補助款都加入那個分母,也就是說給他的多,所以他相對的他那個分子如果沒有成長的話,分母成長多,以至於比例會下降。對,分子沒有增加。對,所以我們未來在分配公式上也要有財政努力這一個指標,因為大家都要一起努力嘛,對不對,財政地方也要努力,中央也要努力。對,就是不能你一方面就是說希望中央能夠多給一點,"},{"start":427.654,"end":450.975,"text":"收支劃分法 但地方政府也不努力。那財政的努力應該給予激勵,所以這個部分未來我們在分配公式上我們也希望能夠有這樣的一個指標進來。好,那看這個水平的分配的原則來講,我這邊有這個新北市政府建議中央統籌分配款的一個分配公式的指標。當然財政努力有啦。"},{"start":451.696,"end":461.763,"text":"收支劃分法 包括人口數、區域面積、公共運輸、圖書館、國民運動中心。這個是新北市他們希望的分配公式指標。對不對?"},{"start":464.318,"end":470.202,"text":"收支劃分法：立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法、委員羅明才等23人、委員許宇甄等22人分別擬具"},{"start":486.272,"end":505.132,"text":"收支劃分法修正草案 必須保留﹑必須提供﹑那我就覺得說那為什麼一定要給台北市3%的這個保留的這一個款項勒?對啊就吵架了嘛對就是不一致吧大家都為自己的那為什麼台北市要3%我新北市有5%我人口最多我地方最大可不可以?"},{"start":506.852,"end":518.797,"text":"財政收支劃分法．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12屆第1會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第12會期財政收支劃分法．立法院第13會期財政收支劃"},{"start":531.963,"end":534.644,"text":"財政收支劃分法修正草案案"},{"start":556.721,"end":585.382,"text":"當然他會如果你把中央統籌分配稅款這樣子的做而事權沒有做調整因為錢跟事權是一定是相對應的那事權要不要同樣做調整這個就是也要考慮的事情那你中央沒有財政韌性那將來面臨緊急的需要的時候要怎麼因應這個修財劃法沒有這麼簡單啦如果這麼簡單的話在上一屆就會修過了啦就也輪不到說國民黨現在這個地方要包圍中央來修啦"},{"start":586.443,"end":609.426,"text":"各個我們禮拜三各個縣市政府那我也不知道可能這個財政相關單位會過來每個地方政府他們的意見至少要先溝通那我們中央當然是說地方上面的意見直轄市的意見、非直轄市的意見一定會有那個歧義那我們當然做就是說盡量把那個歧義把它縮小就是這個水平分配的原則這一方面"},{"start":609.946,"end":612.047,"text":"財政收支劃分法修正草案．立法院第11屆第1會期財政收支劃分法"}]}}}}