{"id":153597,"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153597","video_url":"https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/18e54f584c581c98e7724dbe6e4e2561155b271690f57e8e11da973c502cee62eaddc1a3b53412295ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8","委員名稱":"黃捷","委員發言時間":"10:33:19 - 10:41:10","影片長度":"00:07:51","會議時間":"2024-06-05T09:00:00+08:00","會議名稱":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政委員會第22次全體委員會議（事由：一、「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」：(一)審查行政院函請審議「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案。(二)審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案。(三)審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案。【第(二)案、第(三)案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書則不予審查。】二、「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例」：(一)審查委員張嘉郡等21人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。(二)審查委員吳琪銘等19人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。(三)審查委員王美惠等17人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。(四)審查委員林岱樺等18人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。(五)審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。【第(二)案至第(五)案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書則不予審查。】三、「海洋保育法草案」：(一)繼續審查行政院函請審議「海洋保育法草案」案。(二)繼續審查委員楊瓊瓔等20人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(三)繼續審查委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等16人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(四)繼續審查委員王美惠等17人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(五)繼續審查委員黃捷等18人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(六)繼續審查委員羅廷瑋等18人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(七)繼續審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(八)繼續審查委員蘇巧慧等16人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(九)繼續審查委員羅美玲等17人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十)繼續審查委員許宇甄等20人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十一)繼續審查委員莊瑞雄等20人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十二)繼續審查委員洪申翰等16人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十三)繼續審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十四)繼續審查委員賴瑞隆等18人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十五)繼續審查委員高金素梅等22人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十六)繼續審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十七)繼續審查委員蔡易餘等19人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十八)繼續審查委員吳琪銘等18人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。）","type":"Clip","date":"2024-06-05","start_time":"2024-06-05T10:33:19+08:00","end_time":"2024-06-05T10:41:10+08:00","duration":471,"meet":{"tmpMeeting":null,"title":"第11屆第1會期內政委員會第22次全體委員會議","term":11,"type":"委員會","sessionPeriod":1,"sessionTimes":22,"committees":[15],"id":"委員會-11-1-15-22"},"features":["ai-transcript","gazette"],"gazette":{"lineno":721,"blocks":[["黃委員捷：（10時33分）謝謝主席，我們請部長。"],["主席：請部長。"],["劉部長世芳：黃委員好。"],["黃委員捷：部長好，請教一下，今天我們這個反詐條例，大家都非常關心，因為對於詐騙大家都深惡痛絕，請教一下，現在詐騙的前三名大概是什麼樣的類型？"],["劉部長世芳：類型部分，我們請警政署來回應一下。"],["張署長榮興：現在最多是假投資，再來就是解除分期付款，再來就是網路的詐騙，這前三樣是最多的。"],["黃委員捷：其實我這邊也是看到現在第一名大概就是投資詐騙，其實我們立院有同事的家人，就是涉及這種詐騙的類型──投資詐騙；再來第二種就是分期付款，第三種就是網路的買賣嘛。這三種確實是現在我們最關心的，因為很多人，像剛剛巧慧委員也有提到，他看到那個一頁式廣告，也會差點要點進去。","就這一次我們修法的內容，針對這一些犯罪的類型，還有大家受騙的類型，有沒有一些你們接下來即將可以處理的？可不可以用非常白話的方式讓大家知道，我們接下來是有辦法透過這個反詐專法來處理這些大家會遇到的，包括投資詐騙、網路買賣，或者是解除分期付款，這一些非常有可能遇到的詐騙類型。"],["張署長榮興：這個簡單來講就有三大任務，第一個就是從源頭那邊，也就是將這些訊息絕阻，而且是可以去追來源，他要去投放這個廣告，要有相關身分的證明，甚至在國外的話，在國內也要有法律代理人，這樣就可以追得到誰去投放這個廣告啦，讓這個廣告的訊息沒辦法讓民眾去接觸到，就是不會接觸到這個，這個當然會在我們，未來就是在數發、金管，或者通傳這個區塊，各部會會去協調、聯繫。","再來，講的比較白一點的就是，對於未來已經接觸到了這個訊息時，我們希望讓民眾不會去相信，我們會加強來做宣導，也就是說，現在這些高好發的詐騙手法，我們會精準地針對分齡、分眾的去做宣導，讓他們知道這個是詐騙。","第三個部分，關於被害人保護的部分，剛剛委員也有提到，就是說，有很多人被詐騙後被騙的錢要不回來，我們現在有一個返還的機制，將擴大沒收這些不法的所得。另外，有一些圈存的，會有一些簡化返還的程序。內政部警政署的部分，一定會負責全力去做查緝的作為，我們會從下游到上游，從下游的車手，車手的領款、面交，或者是金融方面的阻詐，或者是上源這些詐欺的水房、車房，會全力來做查緝。"],["黃委員捷：謝謝署長，部長跟署長先請回。","再來，我要請教一下NCC，因為我覺得接下來的重點確實像剛剛署長有講到源頭的阻斷，以及接下來這些底下的車手，或是一些人頭帳戶到底要怎麼去阻斷它。請教一下NCC，我們現在的這個內容，是不是因為過去把它分為第一類電信、第二類電信，然後現在是針對過去的這些第二類電信沒有辦法處理的，也要求他要實名制？"],["黃主任秘書文哲：不是，我們在號碼管理辦法裡面已經處理掉大部分的問題了，目前這個法律裡面只在處理一個，就是有些電信服務不需要號碼，所以在補這一塊。另外一塊是我們在講的黑莓卡這一塊，因為黑莓卡是境外電信服務。"],["黃委員捷：沒錯。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：另外一塊是我們在講的移工卡這一塊，因為移工卡這一塊在將來我們會寫在號碼管理辦法裡面，同時也確實是有所謂沒有使用電話號碼這一塊，所以我這邊也在處理移工卡，等於是除了以電信處理法為主，這部分打詐條例裡面的電信章主要是補充電信管理辦法裡面所沒有的。"],["黃委員捷：好，謝謝補充，這就是我想請教的。我想問接下來這些電信業者是不是也應該要負一定的責任？畢竟他們其實就是提供這些國際漫遊服務的電信商嘛。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：是。事實上，3家電信業者都是上市公司，如果我們要求他們要做哪一些、課予他們什麼樣的義務，最好是要有法律的依據……"],["黃委員捷：當然。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：因為我們現在的制度跟以前的特許制度其實不太一樣了，所以在這邊於法有據，就能請業者配合辦理。"],["黃委員捷：這個也是我希望等一下進入逐條的時候我們可以討論的部分，三大電信業者其實在中間扮演非常重要協助通訊的角色，但是並沒有課予他們一定的義務及責任。"],["黃主任秘書文哲：是，這部分我們會處理、加強。"],["黃委員捷：對，也要請他們加強，謝謝NCC。","最後我請教一下數發部，就問一個問題，現在這些廣告上架到底有沒有辦法更有效、積極地阻斷？明明很明顯就是詐騙，可是因為受害人沒有主動地去檢舉或者跟你們報案，變成你們都沒有辦法主動地下架這些一頁式的詐騙廣告，當然不一定是一頁式，其實網路廣告漫天飛，非常多的詐騙訊息都是這樣來的，數發部在當中的角色到底是什麼？"],["林次長宜敬：報告委員，第一個，我們要知道有哪些詐騙的廣告，接下來我們會有兩種作為：第一個是我們資安院每天會利用AI的技術去掃描網路上所有可能的詐騙廣告，這樣每天大概可以查到5,000個左右，然後我們會把這些訊息立即地轉送跨國的網路廣告平臺，要求他們下架，但是他們現在下架的速度比較慢，因為他們堅持他們的法務一定要做一些什麼確認。我們希望這個法律通過以後，我們就可以要求這些跨國網路平臺，像LINE、facebook，用更快的速度去進行下架。當然，政府這邊也會善盡一些義務，做一些確認，譬如當廣告名人的身分被仿冒的時候，其實他本身往往不是受害者，受害者是那些被騙的民眾。"],["黃委員捷：沒錯。"],["林次長宜敬：所以這個地方我們就希望由政府跟這些名人取得一定的默契，能趕快把這些事情告知這些跨國網路平臺。"],["黃委員捷：其實我覺得到時候真的一一通知名人也太慢了，因為你還要跟所有被冒用、被冒名者取得聯繫，我覺得最重要的責任還是在於平臺的業者。"],["林次長宜敬：是。"],["黃委員捷：所以我也希望等一下審查的時候，包括第三十條裡面平臺業者制訂的防詐計畫，以及平臺業者的防詐責任，應該是平臺也要一起過來負擔的。"],["林次長宜敬：是。"],["黃委員捷：所以我也希望接下來在審查的時候，我們也有一定的機制要求這些社群平臺的業者，不管是LINE、Meta，還是所有的社群平臺業者，也應該要負起一定篩選內容的責任。它當然不是去限制大家的言論自由，而是很明顯內容是犯罪的，但是平臺業者好像都與它無關，這是最大的問題。"],["林次長宜敬：是。"],["黃委員捷：這個要拜託數發部門再努力一下。"],["林次長宜敬：謝謝委員，也請委員多支持，謝謝。"],["黃委員捷：謝謝次長。"],["主席（高金委員素梅代）：謝謝黃捷委員的質詢。","繼續請召委吳琪銘質詢，謝謝。"]],"agenda":{"page_end":302,"meet_id":"委員會-11-1-15-22","speakers":["吳琪銘","黃珊珊","王美惠","陳亭妃","蘇巧慧","張宏陸","牛煦庭","麥玉珍","黃建賓","許宇甄","黃捷","高金素梅","張智倫","丁學忠","徐欣瑩","李坤城","王鴻薇","鄭天財Sra Kacaw","洪孟楷","羅廷瑋","沈伯洋","黃秀芳","楊瓊瓔","黃國昌","鍾佳濱","李柏毅","羅智強"],"page_start":1,"meetingDate":["2024-06-05"],"gazette_id":"1135901","agenda_lcidc_ids":["1135901_00002"],"meet_name":"立法院第11屆第1會期內政委員會第22次全體委員會議紀錄","content":"一、「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」：(一)審查行政院函請審議「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」\n案、(二)審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案、(三)審查委員陳亭妃等16\n人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案；二、「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條\n例」：(一)審查委員張嘉郡等21人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條\n條文修正草案」案、(二)審查委員吳琪銘等19人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫\n行條例第五條條文修正草案」案、(三)審查委員王美惠等17人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記\n不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案、(四)審查委員林岱樺等18人擬具「宗教團體以自\n然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案、 ( 五) 審查委員陳亭妃等16 人擬具\n「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案（後接第二冊）","agenda_id":"1135901_00001"}},"transcript":{"id":"153597","pyannote":{"name":"ronny","tool":"pyannote","data":{"url":"https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153597","tool":"pyannote","id":"153597-pyannote"},"job_id":"CZEOkMFsIwqrmniH","queued_at":"2024-06-05 11:27:58","status":"done","log":[{"time":"2024-06-05 11:28:01","msg":"downloading 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00:00:04,932\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具、「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案\n\n2\n00:00:22,295 --> 00:00:41,766\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草\n\n3\n00:00:51,951 --> 00:01:14,687\n對那這三種確實是現在我們最關心的因為很多人像剛剛巧慧委員也提到他看到那個一頁式廣告也會插點要點進去那就這一次我們修法的內容針對這一些犯罪的類型還有大家受騙的類型有沒有一些你們接下來即將可以處理的可不可以用非常白話的方式讓大家知道說我們接下來是有辦法透過這個反詐的專法來處理這些大家會遇到的包括投資詐騙\n\n4\n00:01:21,672 --> 00:01:26,347\n網路買賣或者是解除分期付款這一些非常有可能遇到的詐騙類型。\n\n5\n00:01:29,219 --> 00:01:49,054\n好這個簡單來講就有三大任務第一個就是從源頭那邊也就是這些訊息截止而且是有可以去追來源他要去投放這個廣告要有這些身份的證明甚至有在國外的話在國內就是要有法律代人也都可以追得到誰去投放這個廣告啦讓這個廣告的訊息沒辦法讓民眾去接觸到\n\n6\n00:01:54,448 --> 00:01:54,528\n審查委員長\n\n7\n00:02:10,365 --> 00:02:25,075\n接觸到的這些這個訊息我們希望就是民眾不會讓他去相信那我們會加強來做做宣討也就是說現在高高號發的這些詐騙的這些的手法我們會做精準的去做\n\n8\n00:02:25,956 --> 00:02:30,579\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、\n\n9\n00:03:17,569 --> 00:03:45,266\n好謝謝署長那我再來謝謝我們部長跟署長先請回再來我請教一下NCC因為我覺得接下來的重點確實像剛剛署長有講到源頭的阻斷以及接下來的這些底下的車手或是這些人頭賬戶到底要怎麼去阻斷他請教一下NCC我們現在的這個內容是不是因為過去把它分為第一類電信第二類電信然後現在是針對過去的這些第二類電信沒有辦法處理的也要求他要實名制不是\n\n10\n00:03:45,686 --> 00:04:05,160\n不是,因為這個我們在號碼關聯辦法裡面已經處理到一大部分的問題了目前這個法律裡面只有只在處理一個就是因為有些電信服務它不需要號碼所以我要補這一塊那另外一塊呢是我們在講的黑美卡這一塊因為黑美卡是境外電信服務那另外一塊是我們在講的那個移工卡這一塊\n\n11\n00:04:05,740 --> 00:04:20,635\n二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、\n\n12\n00:04:26,906 --> 00:04:27,646\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人\n\n13\n00:04:47,776 --> 00:04:48,177\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人\n\n14\n00:04:59,241 --> 00:05:20,824\n好那這個也是我希望等一下進入主條的時候我們可以討論的部分針對三大電信業者他們其實在中間扮演非常重要的協助通訊的角色但是他們並沒有予以他們一定的義務跟責任所以我也希望說他們也要對也要請他們加強好謝謝NCC最後我請教一下述發部就問一個問題喔\n\n15\n00:05:22,105 --> 00:05:47,020\n就是說現在我們這一些廣告上架到底有沒有辦法你們有更有效積極的去阻斷這一些明明很明顯都是詐騙可是因為受害人沒有主動的去檢舉或者是跟你們報案變成說你們都沒有辦法去主動的下架這些一夜市的詐騙廣告當然不一定一夜市啦其實網路廣告漫天飛非常多的詐騙訊息都是這樣來的那書發部在當中的角色到底是什麼\n\n16\n00:05:48,181 --> 00:06:12,803\n審查委員關於這個第一個我們要知道說有哪些詐騙的廣告接下來我們會做有兩種作為第一個是我們在資安院每天會利用AI的技術去掃描網路上所有可能的詐騙廣告那這樣子每天大概可以查到大概5000個左右然後我們把這些訊息立即的轉送去給那些跨國的網路廣告平台要求他們下架\n\n17\n00:06:13,183 --> 00:06:19,905\n二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、九、十、九、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、九、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、\n\n18\n00:06:43,933 --> 00:07:07,134\n所以這個地方我們就希望說由我們政府跟這些名人取得一定的默契能趕快把這些事情把他報告跟告知這些跨國網路平台其實我覺得到時候真的一一的通知名人也太慢啦因為你還要跟所有被冒用的冒名者去跟他取得聯繫我覺得最重要的責任其實還是在於平台的業者\n\n19\n00:07:07,674 --> 00:07:34,002\n所以我也希望說等一下審查的時候包括在第30條裡面平台業者制定的防詐計畫以及平台業者的防詐的責任這應該是平台也要一起過來負擔的所以這我也希望說接下來在審查的時候我們也有一定的機制要求這一些社群平台的業者不管是LINE、不管是META還是所有的社群的業者也應該要負起一定的篩選內容的責任\n\n20\n00:07:35,683 --> 00:07:50,792\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、\n\n","tsv":"start\tend\ttext\n950\t4932\t審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具、「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案\n22295\t41766\t審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案 案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草\n51951\t74687\t對 那這三種確實是現在我們最關心的因為很多人像剛剛巧慧委員也提到他看到那個一頁式廣告也會插點要點進去那就這一次我們修法的內容針對這一些犯罪的類型還有大家受騙的類型有沒有一些你們接下來即將可以處理的可不可以用非常白話的方式讓大家知道說我們接下來是有辦法透過這個反詐的專法來處理這些大家會遇到的包括投資詐騙\n81672\t86347\t網路買賣或者是解除分期付款這一些非常有可能遇到的詐騙類型。\n89219\t109054\t好 這個簡單來講就有三大任務第一個就是從源頭那邊也就是這些訊息截止而且是有可以去追來源他要去投放這個廣告要有這些身份的證明甚至有在國外的話在國內就是要有法律代人也都可以追得到誰去投放這個廣告啦讓這個廣告的訊息沒辦法讓民眾去接觸到\n114448\t114528\t審查委員長\n130365\t145075\t接觸到的這些這個訊息我們希望就是民眾不會讓他去相信那我們會加強來做做宣討也就是說現在高高號發的這些詐騙的這些的手法我們會做精準的去做\n145956\t150579\t審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、\n170794\t197329\t懲罰懲罰懲罰懲罰懲罰\n197569\t225266\t好 謝謝署長那我再來謝謝我們部長跟署長先請回再來我請教一下NCC因為我覺得接下來的重點確實像剛剛署長有講到源頭的阻斷以及接下來的這些底下的車手或是這些人頭賬戶到底要怎麼去阻斷他請教一下NCC我們現在的這個內容是不是因為過去把它分為第一類電信第二類電信然後現在是針對過去的這些第二類電信沒有辦法處理的也要求他要實名制不是\n225686\t245160\t不是,因為這個我們在號碼關聯辦法裡面已經處理到一大部分的問題了目前這個法律裡面只有只在處理一個就是因為有些電信服務它不需要號碼所以我要補這一塊那另外一塊呢是我們在講的黑美卡這一塊因為黑美卡是境外電信服務那另外一塊是我們在講的那個移工卡這一塊\n245740\t260635\t二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、\n266906\t267646\t審查委員陳亭妃等16人\n287776\t288177\t審查委員陳亭妃等16人\n299241\t320824\t好 那這個也是我希望等一下進入主條的時候我們可以討論的部分針對三大電信業者他們其實在中間扮演非常重要的協助通訊的角色但是他們並沒有予以他們一定的義務跟責任所以我也希望說他們也要對 也要請他們加強好 謝謝NCC最後我請教一下述發部就問一個問題喔\n322105\t347020\t就是說現在我們這一些廣告上架到底有沒有辦法你們有更有效積極的去阻斷這一些明明很明顯都是詐騙可是因為受害人沒有主動的去檢舉或者是跟你們報案變成說你們都沒有辦法去主動的下架這些一夜市的詐騙廣告當然不一定一夜市啦其實網路廣告漫天飛非常多的詐騙訊息都是這樣來的那書發部在當中的角色到底是什麼\n348181\t372803\t審查委員關於這個第一個我們要知道說有哪些詐騙的廣告接下來我們會做有兩種作為第一個是我們在資安院每天會利用AI的技術去掃描網路上所有可能的詐騙廣告那這樣子每天大概可以查到大概5000個左右然後我們把這些訊息立即的轉送去給那些跨國的網路廣告平台要求他們下架\n373183\t379905\t二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、九、十、九、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、九、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、\n403933\t427134\t所以這個地方我們就希望說由我們政府跟這些名人取得一定的默契能趕快把這些事情把他報告跟告知這些跨國網路平台其實我覺得到時候真的一一的通知名人也太慢啦因為你還要跟所有被冒用的冒名者去跟他取得聯繫我覺得最重要的責任其實還是在於平台的業者\n427674\t454002\t所以我也希望說等一下審查的時候包括在第30條裡面平台業者制定的防詐計畫以及平台業者的防詐的責任這應該是平台也要一起過來負擔的所以這我也希望說接下來在審查的時候我們也有一定的機制要求這一些社群平台的業者不管是LINE、不管是META還是所有的社群的業者也應該要負起一定的篩選內容的責任\n455683\t470792\t審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、\n","txt":"審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具、「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案 案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草\n對 那這三種確實是現在我們最關心的因為很多人像剛剛巧慧委員也提到他看到那個一頁式廣告也會插點要點進去那就這一次我們修法的內容針對這一些犯罪的類型還有大家受騙的類型有沒有一些你們接下來即將可以處理的可不可以用非常白話的方式讓大家知道說我們接下來是有辦法透過這個反詐的專法來處理這些大家會遇到的包括投資詐騙\n網路買賣或者是解除分期付款這一些非常有可能遇到的詐騙類型。\n好 這個簡單來講就有三大任務第一個就是從源頭那邊也就是這些訊息截止而且是有可以去追來源他要去投放這個廣告要有這些身份的證明甚至有在國外的話在國內就是要有法律代人也都可以追得到誰去投放這個廣告啦讓這個廣告的訊息沒辦法讓民眾去接觸到\n審查委員長\n接觸到的這些這個訊息我們希望就是民眾不會讓他去相信那我們會加強來做做宣討也就是說現在高高號發的這些詐騙的這些的手法我們會做精準的去做\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、\n懲罰懲罰懲罰懲罰懲罰\n好 謝謝署長那我再來謝謝我們部長跟署長先請回再來我請教一下NCC因為我覺得接下來的重點確實像剛剛署長有講到源頭的阻斷以及接下來的這些底下的車手或是這些人頭賬戶到底要怎麼去阻斷他請教一下NCC我們現在的這個內容是不是因為過去把它分為第一類電信第二類電信然後現在是針對過去的這些第二類電信沒有辦法處理的也要求他要實名制不是\n不是,因為這個我們在號碼關聯辦法裡面已經處理到一大部分的問題了目前這個法律裡面只有只在處理一個就是因為有些電信服務它不需要號碼所以我要補這一塊那另外一塊呢是我們在講的黑美卡這一塊因為黑美卡是境外電信服務那另外一塊是我們在講的那個移工卡這一塊\n二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人\n好 那這個也是我希望等一下進入主條的時候我們可以討論的部分針對三大電信業者他們其實在中間扮演非常重要的協助通訊的角色但是他們並沒有予以他們一定的義務跟責任所以我也希望說他們也要對 也要請他們加強好 謝謝NCC最後我請教一下述發部就問一個問題喔\n就是說現在我們這一些廣告上架到底有沒有辦法你們有更有效積極的去阻斷這一些明明很明顯都是詐騙可是因為受害人沒有主動的去檢舉或者是跟你們報案變成說你們都沒有辦法去主動的下架這些一夜市的詐騙廣告當然不一定一夜市啦其實網路廣告漫天飛非常多的詐騙訊息都是這樣來的那書發部在當中的角色到底是什麼\n審查委員關於這個第一個我們要知道說有哪些詐騙的廣告接下來我們會做有兩種作為第一個是我們在資安院每天會利用AI的技術去掃描網路上所有可能的詐騙廣告那這樣子每天大概可以查到大概5000個左右然後我們把這些訊息立即的轉送去給那些跨國的網路廣告平台要求他們下架\n二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、九、十、九、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、九、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、\n所以這個地方我們就希望說由我們政府跟這些名人取得一定的默契能趕快把這些事情把他報告跟告知這些跨國網路平台其實我覺得到時候真的一一的通知名人也太慢啦因為你還要跟所有被冒用的冒名者去跟他取得聯繫我覺得最重要的責任其實還是在於平台的業者\n所以我也希望說等一下審查的時候包括在第30條裡面平台業者制定的防詐計畫以及平台業者的防詐的責任這應該是平台也要一起過來負擔的所以這我也希望說接下來在審查的時候我們也有一定的機制要求這一些社群平台的業者不管是LINE、不管是META還是所有的社群的業者也應該要負起一定的篩選內容的責任\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、\n","vtt":"WEBVTT\n\n00:00.950 --> 00:04.932\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具、「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案\n\n00:22.295 --> 00:41.766\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草\n\n00:51.951 --> 01:14.687\n對那這三種確實是現在我們最關心的因為很多人像剛剛巧慧委員也提到他看到那個一頁式廣告也會插點要點進去那就這一次我們修法的內容針對這一些犯罪的類型還有大家受騙的類型有沒有一些你們接下來即將可以處理的可不可以用非常白話的方式讓大家知道說我們接下來是有辦法透過這個反詐的專法來處理這些大家會遇到的包括投資詐騙\n\n01:21.672 --> 01:26.347\n網路買賣或者是解除分期付款這一些非常有可能遇到的詐騙類型。\n\n01:29.219 --> 01:49.054\n好這個簡單來講就有三大任務第一個就是從源頭那邊也就是這些訊息截止而且是有可以去追來源他要去投放這個廣告要有這些身份的證明甚至有在國外的話在國內就是要有法律代人也都可以追得到誰去投放這個廣告啦讓這個廣告的訊息沒辦法讓民眾去接觸到\n\n01:54.448 --> 01:54.528\n審查委員長\n\n02:10.365 --> 02:25.075\n接觸到的這些這個訊息我們希望就是民眾不會讓他去相信那我們會加強來做做宣討也就是說現在高高號發的這些詐騙的這些的手法我們會做精準的去做\n\n02:25.956 --> 02:30.579\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、\n\n03:17.569 --> 03:45.266\n好謝謝署長那我再來謝謝我們部長跟署長先請回再來我請教一下NCC因為我覺得接下來的重點確實像剛剛署長有講到源頭的阻斷以及接下來的這些底下的車手或是這些人頭賬戶到底要怎麼去阻斷他請教一下NCC我們現在的這個內容是不是因為過去把它分為第一類電信第二類電信然後現在是針對過去的這些第二類電信沒有辦法處理的也要求他要實名制不是\n\n03:45.686 --> 04:05.160\n不是,因為這個我們在號碼關聯辦法裡面已經處理到一大部分的問題了目前這個法律裡面只有只在處理一個就是因為有些電信服務它不需要號碼所以我要補這一塊那另外一塊呢是我們在講的黑美卡這一塊因為黑美卡是境外電信服務那另外一塊是我們在講的那個移工卡這一塊\n\n04:05.740 --> 04:20.635\n二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、\n\n04:26.906 --> 04:27.646\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人\n\n04:47.776 --> 04:48.177\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人\n\n04:59.241 --> 05:20.824\n好那這個也是我希望等一下進入主條的時候我們可以討論的部分針對三大電信業者他們其實在中間扮演非常重要的協助通訊的角色但是他們並沒有予以他們一定的義務跟責任所以我也希望說他們也要對也要請他們加強好謝謝NCC最後我請教一下述發部就問一個問題喔\n\n05:22.105 --> 05:47.020\n就是說現在我們這一些廣告上架到底有沒有辦法你們有更有效積極的去阻斷這一些明明很明顯都是詐騙可是因為受害人沒有主動的去檢舉或者是跟你們報案變成說你們都沒有辦法去主動的下架這些一夜市的詐騙廣告當然不一定一夜市啦其實網路廣告漫天飛非常多的詐騙訊息都是這樣來的那書發部在當中的角色到底是什麼\n\n05:48.181 --> 06:12.803\n審查委員關於這個第一個我們要知道說有哪些詐騙的廣告接下來我們會做有兩種作為第一個是我們在資安院每天會利用AI的技術去掃描網路上所有可能的詐騙廣告那這樣子每天大概可以查到大概5000個左右然後我們把這些訊息立即的轉送去給那些跨國的網路廣告平台要求他們下架\n\n06:13.183 --> 06:19.905\n二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、九、十、九、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、九、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、\n\n06:43.933 --> 07:07.134\n所以這個地方我們就希望說由我們政府跟這些名人取得一定的默契能趕快把這些事情把他報告跟告知這些跨國網路平台其實我覺得到時候真的一一的通知名人也太慢啦因為你還要跟所有被冒用的冒名者去跟他取得聯繫我覺得最重要的責任其實還是在於平台的業者\n\n07:07.674 --> 07:34.002\n所以我也希望說等一下審查的時候包括在第30條裡面平台業者制定的防詐計畫以及平台業者的防詐的責任這應該是平台也要一起過來負擔的所以這我也希望說接下來在審查的時候我們也有一定的機制要求這一些社群平台的業者不管是LINE、不管是META還是所有的社群的業者也應該要負起一定的篩選內容的責任\n\n07:35.683 --> 07:50.792\n審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、\n\n","segments":[{"start":0.95,"end":4.932,"text":"審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具、「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案案"},{"start":22.295,"end":41.766,"text":"審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案 案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件 、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草"},{"start":51.951,"end":74.687,"text":"對 那這三種確實是現在我們最關心的因為很多人像剛剛巧慧委員也提到他看到那個一頁式廣告也會插點要點進去那就這一次我們修法的內容針對這一些犯罪的類型還有大家受騙的類型有沒有一些你們接下來即將可以處理的可不可以用非常白話的方式讓大家知道說我們接下來是有辦法透過這個反詐的專法來處理這些大家會遇到的包括投資詐騙"},{"start":81.672,"end":86.347,"text":"網路買賣或者是解除分期付款這一些非常有可能遇到的詐騙類型。"},{"start":89.219,"end":109.054,"text":"好 這個簡單來講就有三大任務第一個就是從源頭那邊也就是這些訊息截止而且是有可以去追來源他要去投放這個廣告要有這些身份的證明甚至有在國外的話在國內就是要有法律代人也都可以追得到誰去投放這個廣告啦讓這個廣告的訊息沒辦法讓民眾去接觸到"},{"start":114.448,"end":114.528,"text":"審查委員長"},{"start":130.365,"end":145.075,"text":"接觸到的這些這個訊息我們希望就是民眾不會讓他去相信那我們會加強來做做宣討也就是說現在高高號發的這些詐騙的這些的手法我們會做精準的去做"},{"start":145.956,"end":150.579,"text":"審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、"},{"start":170.794,"end":197.329,"text":"懲罰懲罰懲罰懲罰懲罰"},{"start":197.569,"end":225.266,"text":"好 謝謝署長那我再來謝謝我們部長跟署長先請回再來我請教一下NCC因為我覺得接下來的重點確實像剛剛署長有講到源頭的阻斷以及接下來的這些底下的車手或是這些人頭賬戶到底要怎麼去阻斷他請教一下NCC我們現在的這個內容是不是因為過去把它分為第一類電信第二類電信然後現在是針對過去的這些第二類電信沒有辦法處理的也要求他要實名制不是"},{"start":225.686,"end":245.16,"text":"不是,因為這個我們在號碼關聯辦法裡面已經處理到一大部分的問題了目前這個法律裡面只有只在處理一個就是因為有些電信服務它不需要號碼所以我要補這一塊那另外一塊呢是我們在講的黑美卡這一塊因為黑美卡是境外電信服務那另外一塊是我們在講的那個移工卡這一塊"},{"start":245.74,"end":260.635,"text":"二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、八、九、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、三、四、五、十、一、二、"},{"start":266.906,"end":267.646,"text":"審查委員陳亭妃等16人"},{"start":287.776,"end":288.177,"text":"審查委員陳亭妃等16人"},{"start":299.241,"end":320.824,"text":"好 那這個也是我希望等一下進入主條的時候我們可以討論的部分針對三大電信業者他們其實在中間扮演非常重要的協助通訊的角色但是他們並沒有予以他們一定的義務跟責任所以我也希望說他們也要對 也要請他們加強好 謝謝NCC最後我請教一下述發部就問一個問題喔"},{"start":322.105,"end":347.02,"text":"就是說現在我們這一些廣告上架到底有沒有辦法你們有更有效積極的去阻斷這一些明明很明顯都是詐騙可是因為受害人沒有主動的去檢舉或者是跟你們報案變成說你們都沒有辦法去主動的下架這些一夜市的詐騙廣告當然不一定一夜市啦其實網路廣告漫天飛非常多的詐騙訊息都是這樣來的那書發部在當中的角色到底是什麼"},{"start":348.181,"end":372.803,"text":"審查委員關於這個第一個我們要知道說有哪些詐騙的廣告接下來我們會做有兩種作為第一個是我們在資安院每天會利用AI的技術去掃描網路上所有可能的詐騙廣告那這樣子每天大概可以查到大概5000個左右然後我們把這些訊息立即的轉送去給那些跨國的網路廣告平台要求他們下架"},{"start":373.183,"end":379.905,"text":"二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、九、十、九、一、二、三、四、五、六、七、九、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、二、一、"},{"start":403.933,"end":427.134,"text":"所以這個地方我們就希望說由我們政府跟這些名人取得一定的默契能趕快把這些事情把他報告跟告知這些跨國網路平台其實我覺得到時候真的一一的通知名人也太慢啦因為你還要跟所有被冒用的冒名者去跟他取得聯繫我覺得最重要的責任其實還是在於平台的業者"},{"start":427.674,"end":454.002,"text":"所以我也希望說等一下審查的時候包括在第30條裡面平台業者制定的防詐計畫以及平台業者的防詐的責任這應該是平台也要一起過來負擔的所以這我也希望說接下來在審查的時候我們也有一定的機制要求這一些社群平台的業者不管是LINE、不管是META還是所有的社群的業者也應該要負起一定的篩選內容的責任"},{"start":455.683,"end":470.792,"text":"審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、詐欺犯罪案件、"}]}}}}